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McCain and Palin Are Trying to Take Political Lying to the Next Dimension

Started by NicholeW., September 15, 2008, 08:01:26 AM

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NicholeW.

McCain and Palin Are Trying to Take Political Lying to the Next Dimension
By Robert Parry, Consortium News. Posted September 15, 2008.

McCain and Palin reach a new level of campaign dishonesty as they tell lies about their records and their opponent. But will they pay a price?


http://www.alternet.org/election08/98764/?page=entire

Despite all the chatter about how "historic" Campaign 2008 has been, it is the McCain-Palin ticket that it is truly testing the limits, not of race or gender politics, but whether the United States is ready to enter into a new dimension of political lying.

Until two weeks ago, it would have been hard to believe that any political figure would have had the audacity to step into the national spotlight by telling the bald-faced lies that Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin has. Yet, many Americans have embraced her enthusiastically and don't want to hear anything negative about her.

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debbie j

 its i dont think they are trying to take lying to the next dimension . but more like it is takeing lying to the next

dimension. and so far half the stuff i seen so far . its pretty much clear and so open . its just very frusterating. i gues thats why

i feel more indapendedet more  then  anything now a days  ::) ::)
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lisagurl

The voters rather watch a soap opera than think about the issues. Fantasy does not require serious thinking, and marketing has convinced the public that thinking is not happiness.
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deviousxen

"putting lipstick on a pig."

... Ah...

Kudos if that was actually said.
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debbie j

Quote from: lisagurl on September 15, 2008, 09:34:54 AM
The voters rather watch a soap opera than think about the issues. Fantasy does not require serious thinking, and marketing has convinced the public that thinking is not happiness.

i agree with you on this lisa . and its a shame to see it happen.   :( hopefuly it will change again for the better
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Keira

The funny thing is that Obama's getting the same thing that haunted Hillary's early
primary campaign, flash over substance for the barely vetted "new guy"
(tm) and momentum campaigning. She's taken Obama's role, except she seems to be
a more aggressive campaigner than him, ultimate irony that the shiny democrat penny
gets upstage another one...

I'll say it again, the democrats gaffed heavily when they choose Obama.
He's not an aggressive enough campaigner for a presidential race.

He doesn't connect well with middle america and that will come to bite him and
the party HARD.

The only thing that may save Obama is the US economy going further down the tube.
And... Considering people are still ready to vote republican considering the mess they've
created, I'm not even sure that would be enough!

But rellying on a total economic meltdown to get elected is kind of lame for someone who thought
he was such a hot stuff.
Profanity removed and other words substituted. -- Nichole

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Kaitlyn

I guess people prefer a fairy tale that comforts them, rather than facts that burn.

The bigger problem is that people aren't qualified to choose the president in the first place.
"The mind is not a vessel to be filled but a fire to be kindled."
— Plutarch
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lisagurl

QuoteAnd... Considering people are still ready to vote republican considering the mess they've
created, I'm not even sure that would be enough!

I take you had a bad day. I am not even going to look. We have been through this many times in the past. Part of it is natural adjustment, part is fear which this administration likes as a tool, and part is lack of ethical morals and control which the gate keepers seem to be in bed with the greedy. Still the media has a responsibility to prioritize things by importance not by entertainment value. But then the paying public wants entertainment and not serious reporting. The paying public has very little self understanding as to what life is about they rather be told by marketing. The economy and money are only as good as one believes. Happiness is another story.
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NicholeW.

The "gatekeepers," if you are talking about the Washington Press Corp and the orgs they work for, ARE "the greedy." If not for money, then status and reputation & power. They know the tropes and they know absolutely what they have been doing.

I don't expect a change in reportage from the major players, then they will hail the return of "Maverick" as if James Garner were still 25.

Nichole

As for Obama "being out-of-touch with the middle-class." I suppose that depends on the "middle-class" we are talking about. If that means the "middle-class" that are losing their homes or selling them for 50% of what they paid for them, then prolly he's not as much out of touch as McCain and his nine mansions are.

OTH, if we are talking the "white middle class" then I would presume he's been out of their touch to a great extent since before his birth. I hate to say it, but I suspect many Americans don't really want to vote for a "black man" and will find whatever reasons they are given not to do so. *sigh*

A bridge too far? I really hope not. I really hope not. Because they have already had eight years of corruption of both the "market" and the constitution. Another four will devastate the country and prolly consolidate the effort to make "conservatism" permanent as an economic system in this country and forever silence any opposition by making things so precarious and edgy that what follows will probably look very much like the "great American paradigm:" Rome.

This is the end of the triumvirate and the ascension of the Julians.

N~
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Laura91

Quote from: Nichole on September 15, 2008, 05:37:19 PM
I hate to say it, but I suspect many Americans don't really want to vote for a "black man" and will find whatever reasons they are given not to do so. *sigh*

N~

I have been saying this same thing since Obama become the democratic nominee for president. This country has always had an undercurrent of racism no matter how much certain people deny it. They are going to let that racist attitude destroy this country and then they will whine and moan once it happens.


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andy6432668

When it comes to Obama and Biden you can say dumb and dumber Joe Biden is a gift that keeps on giving. :laugh:
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lisagurl

QuoteThe "gatekeepers," if you are talking about the Washington Press Corp and the orgs they work for, ARE "the greedy."

Then there are the accounting firms, the leaders of the stock exchange, the Federal District Attorneys, The Attorney Generals Office, The Inspector General, The General Accounting Office, The Law makers themselves, The other Federal departments that have political appointed leaders. Fund raising is rewarded by a high paying and powerful Federal jobs, no experience necessary the the willingness to obey commands.
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NicholeW.

Couldn't agree with you more. And the more you lie, perform criminal activities (The Lincoln Savings and Loan) and generally act like the good ole white boy who always is on the side of the "poor put upon middle-class" in order to get and maintain nine mansions and you cultivate the press so that rather than commeon criminal they call you Maverick ... well, let's just say you do good!!

USA is a criminal enterprise. No doubt about it. I suspect even Alexander Hamilton never had dreams that would encompass whta we got here today.

N~
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fae_reborn

QuoteWhether the United States is ready to enter into a new dimension of political lying.

You mean, if the United States is ready to enter into a new dimension of Empire, whereby the corrupt authorities strip away our liberties and rights, and shred the constitution in the name of preserving "freedom" and "democracy."  Seriously, if McCain/Palin win it will be the end of women's rights (abortion will become illegal).  We will lose all hope of gaining equality (especially for LTBG individuals).  There will be an increase in war (with Iran, N. Korea, perhaps Russia even).  Funding for nearly all domestic issues will be slashed to provide for the military-industrial complex, as we turn from a democratic republic into a warmongering empire hellbent on "saving" the rest of the world from itself.  Feel free to insert your own nightmarish scenarios as well.

I really hope this country wakes up and chooses Obama/Biden, because at least then there's a chance of fixing the problems we're in now.  If McCain/Palin win, get ready to hold onto your [expletive] hats!

Quote from: Nichole on September 15, 2008, 05:37:19 PM
Another four will devastate the country and prolly consolidate the effort to make "conservatism" permanent as an economic system in this country and forever silence any opposition by making things so precarious and edgy that what follows will probably look very much like the "great American paradigm:" Rome.

This is the end of the triumvirate and the ascension of the Julians.

N~

Exactly.  The end of democracy and the beginning of dictatorship.

Jenn
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Shana A

Quote from: fae_reborn on September 15, 2008, 09:21:21 PM

Exactly.  The end of democracy and the beginning of dictatorship.

Jenn

Hmmmm, I thought any semblance of democracy ended a few years ago... and was replaced by corporate fascism. Certainly, if mcsame/palin get elected, things will get even worse than they already are.

Z
"Be yourself; everyone else is already taken." Oscar Wilde


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Kaitlyn

Things are going to get worse regardless of who wins the election.  Obama can't fix the damage done through 8 years of cronyism, warfare, borrowing, credit expansion, and curtailment of human liberty.  The economic effects we're seeing now are just the beginning.  If Obama thinks he's the shining knight who's going to ride in and clean up this mess, he's in for a shock.  He's just the sap who'll be left holding the bag when we hit the Greatest Depression.

All he can do is to let the disease run it's course - but it looks like he favors bleeding the patient.  Of course, death by Obama is still better than death by McCain - being beaten until we get over it (or die), since it's all in our heads.
"The mind is not a vessel to be filled but a fire to be kindled."
— Plutarch
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fae_reborn

Quote from: Zythyra on September 15, 2008, 10:13:18 PM
Hmmmm, I thought any semblance of democracy ended a few years ago... and was replaced by corporate fascism.

It did...and was, it just hasn't become as visible to everyone yet.

Quote from: Nephie on September 15, 2008, 10:22:25 PM
Things are going to get worse regardless of who wins the election.  Obama can't fix the damage done through 8 years of cronyism, warfare, borrowing, credit expansion, and curtailment of human liberty.  The economic effects we're seeing now are just the beginning.  If Obama thinks he's the shining knight who's going to ride in and clean up this mess, he's in for a shock.  He's just the sap who'll be left holding the bag when we hit the Greatest Depression.

All he can do is to let the disease run it's course - but it looks like he favors bleeding the patient.  Of course, death by Obama is still better than death by McCain - being beaten until we get over it (or die), since it's all in our heads.

Obama won't fix the problems, but he'll try, and that's better than nothing.  With Obama, we might not slide as fast into that Depression as we would with McCain.

Jenn
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Kaitlyn

Actually, we need to have the depression as soon and sharp as possible.  Dragging it out just makes it worse in the long run.  I realize this is a (very small) minority viewpoint, though.

Posted on: September 15, 2008, 11:47:11 PM
Anyway, yeah... the Republicans have sunk to an all-time low with this campaign.  It inspired me to a bit of humor:
QuoteDisgrace - the Final Frontier. These are the voyages of the starship Pack of Lies.  Its eight-year mission: To abhor strange new worlds.  To stamp out new life and new civilizations.  To boldly go where Bush the Son has gone before.
"The mind is not a vessel to be filled but a fire to be kindled."
— Plutarch
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debbie j

Quote from: Nephie on September 15, 2008, 11:02:23 PM
Actually, we need to have the depression as soon and sharp as possible.  Dragging it out just makes it worse in the long run.  I realize this is a (very small) minority viewpoint, though.

Posted on: September 15, 2008, 11:47:11 PM
Anyway, yeah... the Republicans have sunk to an all-time low with this campaign.  It inspired me to a bit of humor:
QuoteDisgrace - the Final Frontier. These are the voyages of the starship Pack of Lies.  Its eight-year mission: To abhor strange new worlds.  To stamp out new life and new civilizations.  To boldly go where Bush the Son has gone before.


Nephie  i got to say that is way too much . just smiple way too much  but i love it  ;D ;D 8)
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NicholeW.

4.42 loss on the Dow today. Comparable losses on S&P and NASDAC. Lehmann entered bankruotcy, Merrill-Lynch was "bought" by Bank of America whose stock dropped afterwards and AIG dropped by about 26%. Wachovia dropped drastically as well.

I'd say some banks are about to "consolidate." Or close permanently. Investment banks are free-falling. The good side, so is oil, for the moment. Oil is under $100/barrel ($95+) for the first time since last winter but I suspect pump drops will not go below $3 where they were the last time oil was that low.

Both candidates suddenly started damning business and govt policies today and started casting blame at "The Predecessors." We shall see about Depression, but recession seems a word that definitely does apply right now.

As for democracy, USA has never been a democracy. What that has always meant here is that USA will "be safe for business," the bigger the better. As for impreial dreams we've had them at least since Aaron Burr sent Major Wilkenson on a boat down the Ohio River to steal New Spain from St. Louis to New Orleans to the Colorado foothills and in the mind before that.

By 1900 we had an Empire and the 20th century brought it to real-life. All one need do is take the persepctive of Latin America say from the Rio Grande south to Tierra del Fuego to know that. But after WWII the American Empire was a fact that everyone but those of us who got our "news" from the USA govt knew. No wonder so many Europeans, Middle Easterners and Asian citizens find us queerly moronic in our views of the world. We've been eating pablum for almost 100 years.

Actually at this point the Empire is in decline, again, much like Rome. Nothing was added post Republic until Trajan moved into Dacia around 110 CE or so, the other major attempt was during Augustus' reign when Varus went marching into Niedersachsen (or what is Niedersachsen today) and had his head handed him by Hermann and his German Confederacy in the Teutoberger Wald.

One can make the case fairly easily that USA imperial dreams dies somewhere arounf Khe Sahn in 1969 and only the final nails were removed from the raft in Iraq and Afghanistan. Most major corps will probably do pretty well. They've mined this land for about all it has to offer and will move operations elsewhere.

I suspect most Americans ideas how their children will "do better than they did" will now join those who gave theirs up the second they moved into Bed-Stuy.

Be prepared for the South-Centralizing of America. For a good look at how that looks there are a number of places in western upstate New York that will give you a pretty good idea of how that plays out in rural areas. For the rest of us we need only acquaint ourselves with some of the more burnt-over districts of most major USA cities of some size, say 1 or more million.

Jenn, I don't think you'll have to wait all that long for Peak Oil or something very like it.

Nichole
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