FtMs and their Girlfriends

[alexkidd]

So I am starting T in October and although my gf already refers to me in the male sense she is heaps worried about how me starting T is going to affect our relationship. She wants to stay together and understands why I need to take T, but worried about how that will affect her. She is like a die-hard femmey lesbian, and loves the lesbain/gay lifestyle and culture and likes to let pppl know she is gay, her major worry is that when she talks about me or introdcues me in the "he" sense that ppl will assume she is straight, which has big issues for her. She is more then happy that I am tranisioning and being the person I want to be and we both think our relationship will be ok, but the being gay thing is a a big issue for her.

Some of you other ftms must have lesbian/gay girlfriends. How do they deal with this sort of thing? In the gay scene I think she'll be fine, but like at work they know she is gay, how can she take her "boyfriend" Alex to the work get togethers without them thinking she is straight or bi.

Is this something we should even be worries about? I want to take her concerns into account and address them properly so there is no major dramas between us, but is she maybe over anyalising things to much?

[Nero]

Yep, she's overanalyzing. She's not gay, she's bi and shouldn't be ashamed of it.

[alexkidd]

No dude, she is not bi. She is 36 and has been a lesbian her whole life.

She is not bi at all.

She feel in love with me as a girl, we've been together for four years now that I am transioning she can't just fall out of love with me, our relationship is too powerful for that. But she needs to know how to deal with being a lesbian but having a trans/guy partner.

[Osiris]

I'm thinking this is something she's been struggling with for a while and she's being more vocal about it because she's getting closer to needing to make a decision. Choose you, or the lifestyle she's happy living.

Unfortunately I don't think there's really anything you can do except be ready for the possibly that you may be going your own way.

[alexkidd]

We both fully understand that we might have to go "our seperate ways"

But there must be other ways to cope and deal with issues together.

I mean MfF sometimes stay with there wives, how does the wife maintain the fact she is straight? even though she is now with a woman?

[Nero]

No dude, she is not bi. She is 36 and has been a lesbian her whole life.

She is not bi at all.

She feel in love with me as a girl, we've been together for four years now that I am transioning she can't just fall out of love with me, our relationship is too powerful for that. But she needs to know how to deal with being a lesbian but having a trans/guy partner.

Oh ok. Well I imagine that that would be hard then. Buuuut, doesn't insisting she's a lesbian kind of disrespect you?

Posted on: September 16, 2008, 12:09:50 AMnevermind, that wasn't exactly helpful. it's just what i would be thinking.

[Osiris]

I see what you're saying, but it's going to be difficult for someone who puts so much emphasis on her sexuality to adjust, not everyone can do this. For anyone staying with a transitioning person they have to be ready and willing to at least someway identify as the opposite sexual orientation, or they're just lying to you and themselves.

If your girlfriend isn't ready to do this then there's going to be some issues.

[trapthavok]

If your girlfriend isn't ready to do this then there's going to be some issues.

I'm sorry bro but I'm going to have to agree.

Being an out and proud lesbian is a big part of who she is I suppose, so it will be hard for her to let that go if she thinks that's what she has to do to stay with you. That's what it sounds like. Lines blur for us, we're just people who want to be with other people, but sometimes we get with people like this who feel lesbian is who they are and having the world see them as anything but makes them worry.

I'm not going to give an ultimatum and say some garbage like "if she really cared about you she wouldn't care what you were" because I understand that lesbian is WHO she is. If that's the way she feels, she's going to have to take a step back and examine her priorities before she can go any further with you. It is evident that you still care for each other greatly but this may present a problem. SHE has to work things out bro.

It's great that you care about how she feels and you want to help. So offer your help in whatever ways you can. But mostly this sounds like something she's going to have to figure out for herself.

[alexkidd]

has anyone whos been in this situtation out there got any ideas? Surely Im not the only FtM with a lesbian partner?

Or even if your MtF I'ld like to hear you view on how and if your partner coped ok?

[NicholeW.]

I see what you're saying, but it's going to be difficult for someone who puts so much emphasis on her sexuality to adjust, not everyone can do this. For anyone staying with a transitioning person they have to be ready and willing to at least someway identify as the opposite sexual orientation, or they're just lying to you and themselves.

This seems to me as if it's a very concise assessment of any relationship that pairs transitioning people with those who have identified themselves strongly as either gay or straight. Bi would probably not have the associated perceptual problems.

What we have found in our relationship is that the quality of the relationship itself overrides whatever "people think." We've paid with family on both sides: with mine because of transition and with hers because of the lesbian relationship. Both sides saying "it's against God & we refuse to recognize what's against God."

It wasn't a huge change for either of us and our own relationship trumps for us how others perceive us. And since we were both to some extent bi before, we never had the intense "orientation" problems that so many get from partners. It simply hasn't come into our relationship because we place one another on a separate level than we place sexuality issues.

But, that is often not true for folks. Who they are perceived as being sexually can be a huge emotional issue for most or many people.

I'd say you both have some conversation to get underway about how important your sexual orientation is as it is viewed from the outside.

Nichole

[lizard]

has anyone whos been in this situtation out there got any ideas? Surely Im not the only FtM with a lesbian partner?

Or even if your MtF I'ld like to hear you view on how and if your partner coped ok?

im a mtf who is married to a female.  I dont think there is a way for her to remain 'straight' if she continues to stay with me throughout transition.  I'm pretty sure the way she has accepted this is by going with the whole "im attracted to who I am, regardless of gender"  But i do think she has had bi-sexual tendencies before I came out.
I also think that if she would insist she was straight, yet was still attracted to me, then that would just make me feel like she views me as a man.  And that would be rather sad and or insulting

I honestly think that if she insists she is a lesbian.. and you are a guy, then it probably isn't going to work out either because she IS only a lesbian so being with a guy wouldnt work for her, or because she WANTS to maintain being a lesbian, and even if she is attracted to you, then it would cause problems for you because you are a guy.  (if that made any sense at all)

now, she does seem to be attracted to you, and in that aspect she is Bi, and has to come to terms with the fact that she may not be a full on hard core lesbian.

sorry if this isnt what you were looking for, but i hope it helps

[Windrider]

Hi, Alex! I am the SO of a MtF, so I can relate a bit to what your GF feels, only I had to deal with being perceived as lesbian

Unfortunately, your GF is going to have to deal with being *perceived* as "straight", because people are going to see a guy and a girl and *think* that, even if they don't say it. I'm talking general public here, not just her co-workers. Anytime you go out as a couple, people will see a regular hetero couple, because that is what you will appear to be.

For me, I decided in the end that what people call me doesn't matter. What matters is that I'm happy and Dani is happy and we're happy together. Dani and I both know that we'll face some challenges as a lesbian couple, but we'll face them together. I found through examining my feelings on this issue that I'm probably not "straight" (although I think very few people are exclusively so - but that's another discussion ) I fall somewhere near the lesbian side of bisexual...perhaps that made it easier...but I also have a track record of not caring very much about what the 'general public' thinks.

However, since your GF seems to have made her lifestyle a statement of sorts, I can see the problem. If she suddenly starts showing up at functions with a guy, it would make her appear to be a liar and she will take a major credibility hit. There are a few ways out of this predicament I can see. She either goes by herself to business functions or doesn't go to them at all (not ideal, if she has close friends there.) She can explain how you came to be Alex (again not ideal either. :/ ) After that, I'd suggest that she not make being lesbian such public knowledge (IMHO, you really shouldn't bring your private life to work, but I do tend to be conservative in those things.) In conversations, she can always use generic pronouns such as "partner" which will allow the listener to make their own assumptions as to the gender of the partner.

Your therapist or your GF's (if she has one) may be able to offer additional suggestions.

I'm sorry I couldn't be of more help....

*hugs*

WR

[Elwood]

A lot of lesbians have asked me out. I refused to date any of them... heck, even one I liked... because they see me as a woman. We've got to be on the same page about my gender identity...

[Dennis]

Wish I could help with personal experience, but my lesbian partner dumped me 15 minutes after I told her.

I think Windrider's advice is sage. I do see a lot more lesbians very invested in lesbian identity than straight women invested in straight identity, but there is going to have to be some flex on both sides. Maybe in queer space, you can define yourselves as queer and leave it at that? I suspect your partner is not going to be the only one in the lesbian community who has problems with this. I think I've only retained two lesbian friends, and they weren't really part of the local community much anyway.

Dennis

[alexkidd]

Windrider - Thanks heaps for your input, its always good to see how the other person views things

I think Windrider's advice is sage. I do see a lot more lesbians very invested in lesbian identity than straight women invested in straight identity, but there is going to have to be some flex on both sides. Maybe in queer space, you can define yourselves as queer and leave it at that? I suspect your partner is not going to be the only one in the lesbian community who has problems with this. I think I've only retained two lesbian friends, and they weren't really part of the local community much anyway.

Dennis

I know alot of lesbians dont like FtMs and such, for a open minded group they seem very closed minded on this topic. But my partner is totaly not like this, the queer thing might appeal to her. We both want our relationship to work, so hopefully we'll adjust ok

Thanks guys for your input

[TamTam]

H'mm..

Well, my situation is a bit different, as I'm a gay woman dating a mtf gay woman.. but.. we started dating before she decided to transition, sooo.. I kind of know what the idea of dating a guy is like to a gay woman.. at least, in the identity sense.

The thing is, that when someone realizes they're straight, it's no biggie.  They don't have to come out to anyone, they don't have to keep a running tally of who they are and aren't out to.. etc.  All kinds of things.  But when someone realizes they're gay.. it's a big part of their life, just because.. people have to be told eventually.  With all the stress and complications that entails.  Which may be part of the reason why we hold on to that identity more than straight people do.  It's a more important part of our lives.

So when me and her started dating, way at the beginning when I thought she wouldn't transition, I realized.. my family wouldn't get it.  At all.  And I was really terrified that they would all think I was 'only joking' when I said I was gay, or that I'd 'changed my mind,' because that would've been an absolute lie, and part of coming out is that you don't have to live the lie anymore.  And I also can't stand when someone tells me who I am instead of letting me define myself.  I didn't want to be seen as a straight woman.  After coming out to basically my whole family and all of my friends, how could I explain to them I was dating a [to outward appearances] guy?  Even the thought of going to a restaurant and not hearing "what would you ladies like?" felt strange to me.

Of course, that wasn't enough to make me choose not to date her.  Not at all. But it was definitely.. something stressing me out a little bit.  I understand why your girlfriend feels worried about it.

What I thought of, and what your girlfriend might be able to do.. is I figured, that if anyone needed/deserved an explanation, I would just tell them, "Yes, I am still gay.  I've just made an exception for him because he's so damn amazing."  How can anyone argue with that?

And.. I wanted to mention.. I have never stopped identifying myself as a gay woman, not since I came out to myself 6 years ago.  Never stopped being gay.  It's not disrespect.. it's who I am.

[icontact]

Not sure if you've figured this out yet or not but here's my advice. Sit her down, time to have a talk. Explain that even though she is very much a lesbian, she's either going to have to say she doesn't do labels but mostly prefers girls, or say she is a lesbian and immediately launch into a speech about how the brain matters more than the body. Simply saying that she's gay with a boyfriend probably won't cut it for general society. Maybe for close friends, they'd get it, but otherwise. I'm guessing those are her only options. Gluck man.

[FallenLeaves]

We both fully understand that we might have to go "our seperate ways"

But there must be other ways to cope and deal with issues together.

I mean MfF sometimes stay with there wives, how does the wife maintain the fact she is straight? even though she is now with a woman?

I've kind of been having this same thing with my girlfriend (I am an MtF). I was really worried she couldn't cope with it for awhile and prolonged our heart to heart about the issues. She kept saying things like...I don't like girls; I'm not bi; etc. She has basically come out as gay now, to me at least anyways. We are both from a highly conservative town where gay people are basically non-existent and thought very lowly of, and I think she was just scared of actually being in love with a woman. I wouldn't have kept pushing her if I didn't know it was true (too many things just did not add up with her being straight sometimes...she even asked me to set up a threesome with another girl).

So, this is just my opinion, but I think to stay together she has to be able to admit she is either straight or bi. After all, she is in love with a man.

[Jay]

she is straight, which has big issues for her.

This is strange.. at the end of the day you are male and are changing your body into male.

Is this something we should even be worries about? I want to take her concerns into account and address them properly so there is no major dramas between us, but is she maybe over anyalising things to much?

I dont think it is something you both should be worrying about at all. And I think she is over thinking about it way to much!

[flutter]

Alex-

A lot has been said in this thread that is excellent advice, so I'll keep mine short.

Ultimately, the decision is her's. She has to decide if she still loves the person inside when you go on T. After spending 4 years with you, I think she does, but no one else can answer that for her.

I think the best thing you can do is to continue to love her, be yourself, and not rush her into a decision. If you just let it evolve organically instead of forcing the issue, it's more likely she'll stay with you out of inertia and adapt, if you force the choice then deeply held convictions often hold sway, and from the little description you've provided of her, she may choose her lesbian identity over her love for you.

Also - forcing her into a decision may seem like an act of male aggression/perogative to her, and that may be exactly what she's afraid of.