Christine Daniels Retransitioning Back To Mike Penner

[Shana A]

Christine Daniels Retransitioning Back To Mike Penner
by: Autumn Sandeen
Wed Oct 22, 2008 at 02:14:20 AM EDT

http://pamshouseblend.com/showDiary.do;jsessionid=1E0FD24F7582C1DBE813179465C71E01?diaryId=7701

I knew Christine Daniels, and considered Christine a friend. She faded out of my life this time last year -- I had no idea why she didn't return my calls or emails.

Well, L.A. Observed is reporting in their piece Mike Penner returns to Los Angeles Times. The gist of the story is that Christine Daniels is retransitioning back to Mike Penner. According to LA Observed's Kevin Roderick, the Los Angeles Times' sports editor Randy Harvey said this:

    We're looking forward to Mike's byline appearing in the paper and on the website with increased frequency. He continues to be a valued member of our sports staff.

[MeghanAndrews]

Wow, this is going to be big news in the LA TG community I would think. She was pretty visible, at least last year after coming out. I'm sure that decision was probably really weighing on her. I've met her a few times, she came to my support group once. It must be hard to come to that decision.

[lisagurl]

It only gives ammunition to the far right. I believe many who want transition are unstable.

[Renate]

It only gives ammunition to the far right. I believe many who want transition are unstable.

I agree generally, but many? Certainly some.

I'm always sad to hear de-transition stories. There must be a load of anguish in there somewhere.
I've only met one person who had de-transitioned, but they didn't seem particularly concerned.

I never had any unrealistic expectations from transitioning, but what I got has been tremendous.
Being a go-go girl and having tons of men fawning over me was always my dream. Just kidding!

It is unfortunate that de-transition cases just add ammunition to both right-wing wackoes and therapists alike.
It ignores the fact that most of us would rather die than de-transition.

[vanna]

Statistically though, how many transitioners actually transition back to their original state.

I suspect its low numbers but as always these type of stories are bigger headline grabbers. Transition isn't for everyone, atleast one person here this week has decided its not for them and that's part of the TS journey of discovery.

[tekla]

If people have the liberty, or right, or freedom to decide one way, I guess you have to allow them to change their minds.  I'd be very interested in the story of all this.

[lisagurl]

I'd be very interested in the story of all this.

Just what the media is setting up the entertainment.

[tekla]

I was thinking more along the lines of talking to the person.  Or reading their views.  I'm sure the story is interesting, and unlike so many others, the writing skills are there.

[Kate]

I was thinking more along the lines of talking to the person.  Or reading their views.  I'm sure the story is interesting, and unlike so many others, the writing skills are there.

I wonder which was more courageous/difficult: deciding to transition? Or admitting the "mistake" and going back?

~Kate~

[tekla]

As a general rule I found that people have a very hard time admitting mistakes for some reason.

[Kate]

As a general rule I found that people have a very hard time admitting mistakes for some reason.

I know! People are SO stubborn. Thank God I've never had to do that.

(giggle)

~Kate~

[NicholeW.]

It is unfortunate that de-transition cases just add ammunition to both right-wing wackoes and therapists alike.
It ignores the fact that most of us would rather die than de-transition.

Your comment about therapists shows a bias that also has no reality in reality. Most therapists who actually work with transgendered/transsexual people are not opposed to transition, are, in fact, all for it, it works except perhaps in cases like this where one does try to explore something more than "rush her through the door to the surgery, stat."

Sorry, de-transitioning doesn't make me sorry or sad in the least. This process, this life is not for anyone who has a whim or is unsure in any way. It's not a "funhouse ride" nor a "lark in the park" and thinking and saying it is seems to me to be highly dangerous for those who decide that they should transition when perhaps being a crossdresser or having problems that have nothing to do with gender/biological sex are the fulcrums of transition.

For most of us who do transition and never imagine "going back" or "stopping" no matter what the path itself transition is never just a lark. For someone who isn't driven and committed to do it no matter what then transition is absolutely the wrong choice to make.

The fact that whatever the personal reasons for Mike Penner/Christine Daniels to do exactly what they have done if the committment and knowledge were anything short of 100% then they made the absolute right choice.

It's bad enough that people commit suicide because they are definitely transsexual. There is no need and much wisdom in someone deciding either that they aren't transsexual or that transsexing is not for them. That avoids yet another suicide.

We can cheerlead ourselves all we want, but to cheerlead everyone with a whim is irresponsible and downright silly and dangerous: for them.

You've done what you have been driven to do, Renate: for those not so driven, discretion is the better part of valor and we need to recognize that fact and actually rejoice that they decide to try another way.

The right-wingers may try to use Penner's visibility. So, they use anyone's visibility. But tell me which would be worse: the use of a de-transition or the use of a suicide because one couldn't cope with whatever pressures and heartaches they had due to a transition that shouldn't have continued?

Your choices and decisions, Mike Penner's choices and decisions speak absolutely NOT to me and my choices and decisions.

However your willingness to make a blanket statement about de-transition and another about those of us who do practice as therapists are entirely based on nothing factual at all. They are as atavistic and wrong-headed as any racist's commentary about Jews or Africans might be. Please come with some evidence and reason rather than off-the-top commentary.

You, or anyone else, may not enjoy being questioned and caused to actually think deeply about your approaches and motivations for transition, but if a life hangs in the balance like Mike Penner's probably did, then no amount of "o, the therapist prolly talked him out of it" can justify having him do what wasn't in his/her deepest knowledge of her/him-self to do.

This wasn't sad, it was the absolute best thing to do if there was any doubt in the person at all. (For the rest read my blog for today.)

Nichole

[tekla]

Well put Nichole.

[NicholeW.]

Thank you, tekla.

N~

[Kate]

This process, this life is not for anyone who has a whim or is unsure in any way. It's not a "funhouse ride" nor a "lark in the park"...

That's what surprises me about this. It usually takes a great deal of determination, money and effort to fully transition, so I'd *think* the process itself would weed out early on those who have motivations other than it being an absolute need.

~Kate~

[NicholeW.]

I'd agree, Kate, except for one major fact. Just take a look at what goes on here when doubts are expressed. We tend to hold those doubts without ever saying "Well, then, don't transition."

We have members here who go through extreme hell and trepidation and yet what occurs? We either hold back the "bad news" or say nothing at all and let them figure it out. Or we constantly make invidious comparisons about "crossdressers" or "transvestites" and do the exact same number on them that the Zuckers, McHughs and Blanchards and others of that ilk try to do on us.

Look-it, I simply love to see people discover themselves and if they want and know deeply that my way is something they wish to attempt or fulfill then more power to them.

But, there is absolutely NOT anything less-than or not as valid about a CD or TV or androgyne than there is invalidity for you or I. It's all down to what people know about themselves and how willing they are to go through the turmoil that's generally involved with transition, or crossdressing and our unwillingness to admit that being supportive is sometimes just saying "X, you seem to be worse now than you were as a crossdresser or androgyne. Maybe you need to stop transition and go back to a place where you were evidently more comfortable than you are where you are now."

But how often do transsexuals tell people that? How often do we allow our own sense that someone will somehow make it seem we are just "choosing" who we are and use that against us as a group?

I think Mike Penner's story is most certainly a cautionary tale. The caution being: if you are not convinced beyond any doubt in your heart-of-hearts that you are (female or male) then you have no business transitioning because you will absolutely find that it will be the sheerest hell and torment.

Now, that, imo, is being supportive toward such a person. No handwringing, simply a statement of fact and compassion. And then you darn-well make sure that you believe exactly that: that she is no less-than you and you affirm the fact that this path is not for very many.

Nichole

[Kate]

being supportive is sometimes just saying "X, you seem to be worse now than you were as a crossdresser or androgyne. Maybe you need to stop transition and go back to a place where you were evidently more comfortable than you are where you are now."

But how often do transsexuals tell people that?

People generally hear only what validates what they want to do anyway, regardless of any "truth" to the matter they know or sense. I see people heading for cliffs all the time here, but I've also found that people are so entrenched in their patterns (myself included), words and advice seldom have any effect on changing their direction. It often seems the only thing you can do is hold their hand to the edge, and be ready to patch them together when they fall.

~Kate~

[NicholeW.]

Yep, I do agree in pretty much all respects with you.

But, when someone is taking a header off a bridge in LA on a freeway and I am in PA there's really not a lot I can do to patch things.

But yes, some need to try. And hopefully see the folly in making the attempt without having the deep knowledge that what's out-of-line is their notion that hormones can solve their problems when possibly finding contentment with crossdressing or being a genderqueer is a much better way to go for them.

I'll say it again: this way is not everyone's way, but that it's not everyone's way that they should take doesn't make them less-than or make them a failure.

In point of fact not taking the transition path makes them a success.

The big question is: are you one in 7000 or one in 300,000 who need to do this? There's no glory in transition. It doesn't make anyone more or less. It simply tends to make a very few of us find our lives liveable and comfortable.

Nichole

[goingdown]

According my gendertherapist I went above the transition line as low as it is possible. And they said they had to move the line lower in my case as much as  possible. So will this mean that I am going to regret my choice?

[NicholeW.]

Therapists, other transsexulas or transgendered people, psychiatrists cannot make those sorts of predictions for you, goingdown. You may be able to do so, but even then, prediction is not a reliable science for any of us.

If you have doubts about doing a transition I do advise you or anyone else to delve into those doubts and try to find your way through them to a point where you are as sure that transitioning is for you as best you can make the determination.

No one need be in the business of trying to scare anyone out of transitioning anymore than anyone need be in the business of pushing it as the only solution.

It's your heart and mind and you are the best judge of what you can and cannot do.

Nichole