why am I a m2f lesbian?

[Kim6]

I think the younger a person is the easier it is to be hetero-flexible.

Also the more complete transition is, the easier it is to be heterosexual.

I could be with a woman now but why would I want to?  Then again as we become more and more modernized, women and men tend towards being equally unattractive.  I want an old-fashioned guy who is enterprising and who can treat me like a lady while acting upon my behalf as both a gentleman and a barbarian and maybe even a bit of a chauvinist once in a while.  If I need someone to talk to I can always ring up a girlfriend.  Ah well..

[SomeMTF]

I do not know. However sometimes I have thought that is more acceptable for a transwoman to be lesbian than straight.

The BBL theory mocks even more ''homosexual transsexuals'' than others.

[Alyssa M.]

This thread is starting to make my teeth grind.

Laura, I don't get how you don't get lesbians so much. Do you even accept that being lesbian is a valid female identity at all? Or if you are cisgendered and homosexual, is that just "->-bleeped-<--lite" in your view?

[Laura Eva B]

Laura, I don't get how you don't get lesbians so much. Do you even accept that being lesbian is a valid female identity at all? Or if you are cisgendered and homosexual, is that just "->-bleeped-<--lite" in your view?

Alyssa, I have no issues with gay people, but I can't identify with the concept, and I just get exasperated when women here say :

"To me, women loving women is the highest value in life"

"Really... I don't even want a guy as a close friend.  Just girls!  They're yummy and fantastic"

This strikes me as an ultimate rejection of masculine values, a rejection of the world as it works, and makes me wonder about posters motives for transitioning ?

If TS women were akin to "natal" women then at most 10% would profess to be lesbian, and way less than 20% bi ... but as stats stand you can understand people thinking that we all fit into that mis-designated "GLBT" category which I soo hate !

I'm hetero and I think its about time that other straight gals (& guys) stood up and said "we out-number you", but I guess we don't ...  ...

Laura x

[mina.magpie]

This strikes me as an ultimate rejection of masculine values, a rejection of the world as it works, and makes me wonder about posters motives for transitioning ?

Can't you simply accept that they are different from you? According to psychology, and with the studies to back it up, most of us are bi to begin with, and then lean one way or the other due to conditioning. Lesbians are no different from you except in that they are not attracted to masculinity.

Personally, I am mildly attracted to masculinity as well, though not so much as to femininity. I realise though that that probably has alot to do with how I perceive guys. (loud, aggressive, dangerous, misogynistic) I'm quite comfortable with that though, and realise that my reasons and situation need not apply to anybody else.

If TS women were akin to "natal" women then at most 10% would profess to be lesbian, and way less than 20% bi ... but as stats stand you can understand people thinking that we all fit into that mis-designated "GLBT" category which I soo hate !

As I pointed out in an earlier post, those statistics do not necessarily reflect the reality of humankind. That, along with the fact that transitioners go through a huge learning curve of self acceptance and confronting our true selves probably does make us more likely to swing both ways or be attracted to the same gender, simply because it's reality. And granted, that self evaluation focusses on gender yes, but it also spills into other areas, including sexuality. Cisgendered women, on the other hand, tend not to have that same deep self-evaluation forced on them, at least not as an entire population.

I'm hetero and I think its about time that other straight gals (& guys) stood up and said "we out-number you", but I guess we don't ...  ...

Why the "us vs. them" sweetie? My being bi or a lesbian in no way impacts on your sexuality. Why should it bother you so much?

Mina.

[TamTam]

Sure I find many women pretty ... but sexually ? ... give me the arms of a strong and attractive guy around me.  Nothing makes you feel more desireable, wanted and valued ...

Nothing makes you feel more desirable, wanted, and valued.  Your feelings are not the only ones in the universe, nor are they the 'best,' 'most valid,' 'most womanly,' or 'most feminine.'

And why do you want straight people to rise up and tell us you outnumber us?  Guess what, we already know.  Trust me, we know.  Straight people have a tendency of lording it over us, haven't you heard?  And you say you don't have a problem with gay people..

Sure, I find many men cute and/or handsome... but sexually?  Give me the arms of a strong and beautiful woman like my girlfriend around me.  Nothing would make me feel more desirable, wanted, and valued. 

If you can't understand that, that's not my problem, you don't have to understand me and my desires for them to be valid and fulfilling for me.  But I am frankly shocked and insulted that you would call into doubt someone's gender identity based on who they're attracted to and some silly statistics that have been repeatedly pointed out to you as being false.

[Sephirah]

Alyssa, I have no issues with gay people, but I can't identify with the concept, and I just get exasperated when women here say :

"To me, women loving women is the highest value in life"

"Really... I don't even want a guy as a close friend.  Just girls!  They're yummy and fantastic"

This strikes me as an ultimate rejection of masculine values, a rejection of the world as it works, and makes me wonder about posters motives for transitioning ?

Why? And more to the point, why do you care? Why the crusade to prove that you're somehow more 'authentic' than everyone who doesn't share your outlook on life?

Are you really so insecure that you cannot accept people different to yourself and allow them to live their lives the way they choose to without judging them, in the assumption that their lives will somehow impact on yours and make you look like something less than you are?

*sigh* That's a shame... and I'm not so sure it's other people with the issues here.

If you don't identify with gay people then that's your perogative. You don't have to. All you have to do is show some respect for them and the way they live their lives, the way you would expect to be treated yourself. Is that so hard?

If TS women were akin to "natal" women then at most 10% would profess to be lesbian, and way less than 20% bi ... but as stats stand you can understand people thinking that we all fit into that mis-designated "GLBT" category which I soo hate !

That's what I thought. You think gay women make you look bad. For someone looking for acceptance as yourself... that's rather a hypocritical attitude to adopt, don't you think?

I'm hetero and I think its about time that other straight gals (& guys) stood up and said "we out-number you", but I guess we don't ...  ...

Again... why? And so what? This is verging on homophobia. I guess the reason 'other straight gals (& guys)' don't is because they have a bit more humanity, understanding, and wisdom... and don't seem to feel so threatened and inferior.

[SomeMTF]

However one reason that lesbian transwomen are so open and hetererosexual are not may be result of ''gayphobia'' in trascommunity. Hetererosexual transwomen could still be understood just very ''gay'' men.

[vanna]

Hrmmm a tad too deep this has become

whatever happened to your sexual desire and what gets you going, i can relate to anyone wanting to be straight Bi or gay.

I have never felt the need to relate my attraction to girls to transsexual expression or some such but hey we all view this journey differently.
Im a girl i like girls, define me however.

[SomeMTF]

The junk science by Michael Bailey and others divides transwomen ''homosexuals'' and ''autogynephiles''. However the both groups, ''homosexual transsexuals'' even more are seen very negatively in Book ''Men that would be queens''. Homosexual transsexual are accoding his book protitutes, petty criminals etc.  Worse than AG-group.

However hole this BBL-classification is unscientistic and made to mock transwomen dowm.

[Kim6]

I was thinking about it and I realized that I don't want to cut myself off from being able to be with a woman.  But it depends what we are talking about.  Sexual orientation is one thing and relationship dynamics are another and I think some people don't even recognize the distinction.

[TamTam]

  Sexual orientation is one thing and relationship dynamics are another and I think some people don't even recognize the distinction.

This I can agree with.  If it was all about relationship dynamics and sex was never involved, I'd probably be bi, because personality-wise I don't have a set preference for one gender over the other.  But I've known that for a long time.

[fwagodess]

I have to agree with other posters about gender and sexuality are very seperate, ive always been attracted to girls and identified as female from my earliest days. So however thats labelled.

I would have to agree with Nero.

And Alyssa's right, too.

i think it's because girls are hot. girls look good, so that naturally follows that even other girls can't keep their hands off em.

Yep. I even said to my wife she looks good all the time. My wife on the other hand, said to me back in October, "You have a very sexy lips, and have an excellent figure. I don't say that often enough."

[SarahFaceDoom]

I like both guys and girls, and can be happy with either.  I may lean slightly more to the girl side, just because growing up around boys so much, has made me slightly distrustful of them, so I think my standards with men are much higher than they are with women.  Though I'm picky with either, and thus single more often than not

[Ashley315]

Samantha,

Congrats, 'cause a majority of M2Fs here seem to be either gay (attracted to gals) or bi ...

I don't pretend to understand, but I put it down to either nurture, or autogynaphobic / fetishisistic aspects of M2F transsexuality ?

But as I say ... I just don't understand why you would go thru M2F transition to be a lesbian ?

But that doesn't deny you the right to be "you" ...

Laura x

Hmn..  I view it very differently...  I don't understand how a MtF could want to be with a male partner, but then again I'm lesbian so I'm biased for sure. 

Why go through MtF surgery to be a lesbian?  Because that is  natural for me.  I couldn't be anything but a lesbian.

There does seem to be a segregation of sorts between straight and lesbian transwomen.  Often the "straight" transwoman thinks they are more "woman" than the lesbian transwoman.  SO does that make them more "woman" than a GG lesbian?  I'm sure the GG lesbians would have something to say about that.  Ask them.

On the other side of that.  Some lesbian transwomen look down on the straight transwomen as "only being with men to try and reassure themselves that they are women". 

Why can't there be true lesbian and true straight transwomen?   There are true lesbian and true straight genetic women right?  Seems the same would be true for transwomen as well.
Post Merge: February 15, 2009, 12:48:58 AM

Alyssa, I have no issues with gay people, but I can't identify with the concept, and I just get exasperated when women here say :

"To me, women loving women is the highest value in life"

"Really... I don't even want a guy as a close friend.  Just girls!  They're yummy and fantastic"

This strikes me as an ultimate rejection of masculine values, a rejection of the world as it works, and makes me wonder about posters motives for transitioning ?

If TS women were akin to "natal" women then at most 10% would profess to be lesbian, and way less than 20% bi ... but as stats stand you can understand people thinking that we all fit into that mis-designated "GLBT" category which I soo hate !

I'm hetero and I think its about time that other straight gals (& guys) stood up and said "we out-number you", but I guess we don't ...  ...

Laura x

Very ignorant view of people.  Sickening in fact.  So how bout all those straight people stand up against you since technically by their standards you arn't straight.  You are a guy with a mutilated penis.  Good luck convincing them all otherwise.   Hope it works out well for you.

God I hope my wife (who is a GG lesbian) doesn't read this.  She would rip you a new one over your views Lara.

[imaz]

I like both guys and girls, and can be happy with either.  I may lean slightly more to the girl side, just because growing up around boys so much, has made me slightly distrustful of them, so I think my standards with men are much higher than they are with women.  Though I'm picky with either, and thus single more often than not

Very true, although maybe it's not just standards but what's on offer. Men generally appear to be more uptight around gender and sexuality issues and this makes it hard for both parties.

I fancy guys about half as much as I fancy girls but it's really all the baggage that comes along with men rather than just sexuality that puts me off most of the time.

[Jade H]

...She would rip you a new one over your views Lara.

Yeesh! Lucky Laura - No, wait, she already has a new one...!
So how much does she charge? (To rip new ones...?)

[Ashley315]

Yeesh! Lucky Laura - No, wait, she already has a new one...!
So how much does she charge? (To rip new ones...?)

Free of charge to those who make her mad.  I've seen it.. It isn't pretty.

[Marie]

Alyssa, I have no issues with gay people, but I can't identify with the concept, and I just get exasperated when women here say :

"To me, women loving women is the highest value in life"

"Really... I don't even want a guy as a close friend.  Just girls!  They're yummy and fantastic"

This strikes me as an ultimate rejection of masculine values, a rejection of the world as it works, and makes me wonder about posters motives for transitioning ?

If TS women were akin to "natal" women then at most 10% would profess to be lesbian, and way less than 20% bi ... but as stats stand you can understand people thinking that we all fit into that mis-designated "GLBT" category which I soo hate !

I'm hetero and I think its about time that other straight gals (& guys) stood up and said "we out-number you", but I guess we don't ...  ...

Laura x

Laura, I identify as Bisexual.  Try as I might I just can't limit myself to just one or other... sometimes it just depends on my mood.  I can like everything from girly guys to guyly girls and t-whatevers are of course included as well.  I don't think this has much to do with my gender but I kinda see your point about the disparity in percentages.  I try not to judge too much.. though I will admit I have a double standard thing going on... like if I'm in the mood for a Man (with a capital M) I would lose all interest if he had ever been with another man.  Somewhere in my mind I feel like one day I'll grow out of all this mess and just settle for one, but as it is I'm having too much fun.  I guess I'm just waiting for the right one to come along whoever it will be.

[Genevieve Swann]

Being attracted to a person simply because it feels right is probably best. Regardless of gender. I have a lesbian friend who was married and has two young children. She told me that she had never experienced love before she discovered her present partner. It's a difficult for them financially to support but the rewards are worth all the extra work. A person can change many things in life but that particular desire does not come on the list of options. Personally I think lesbians have more fun. Genevieve