The LDS "church" & Transsexualism

[Witch of Hope]

What is antisemitism?
fear and hate against jews.
And what is the christian reason for this: Christ was killed by jews (he, he was a jew, and it wasn't jews to kill him)

Antisemitism in the Roman Catholic Church: http://www.religioustolerance.org/vat_hol11.htm

Catholic Church and Holocaust: http://www.religioustolerance.org/vat_hol1.htm
http://www.religioustolerance.org/vat_hol12.htm

I found this at the internet by a little google search. Maybe it is enough proofes to you?

[Cindi Jones]

I was brought up in the Mormon church and had a baseball bat applied squarely across my brow when the subject of "my" problem came to light.  I was excommunicated as soon as I used an unused "Women's" restroom on an unused floor of an office building.  That was the arrangement I had made at work.  In the words of "my" bishop "as soon as they start using the women's restroom, there's no turning back."  So, for relieving myself in the wrong room, I became a "son of perdition, relegated to spend all eternity with Lucifer and his angels."

Here's the deal.  I can blow the veracity/truth of the Mormon church out of the water in a few paragraphs.  I could probably do the same about Christianity with a sit down conversation.  But I won't. Nothing is accomplished. I've found my peace in the world my own way without the need of an organized church.  YOU need to find a place where you feel comfortable.  YOU need to find a place where you feel love and companionship.  YOU need your beliefs cradled and held dear.  You will not find it in the LDS faith.  Perhaps in one locality (highly doubtful), but if you move you're screwed.

There are thousands of Christian sects where I'm sure you can find a home. I do believe that there are more that are accepting LGBT people all the time here in the USAyee... as well as around the world. I won't give up on them. Don't torture yourself by attempting to align yourself where you will never belong.

Cindi

[Tammy Hope]

What is antisemitism?
fear and hate against jews.
And what is the christian reason for this: Christ was killed by jews (he, he was a jew, and it wasn't jews to kill him)

Antisemitism in the Roman Catholic Church: http://www.religioustolerance.org/vat_hol11.htm

Catholic Church and Holocaust: http://www.religioustolerance.org/vat_hol1.htm
http://www.religioustolerance.org/vat_hol12.htm

I found this at the internet by a little google search. Maybe it is enough proofes to you?

*sigh*

Proving (some) Christians have been very anti-semetic doesn't at all prove that Christians originated anti-semietism.

Perhaps we're having a language problem here...

[Witch of Hope]

@ Cindi Jones,

I was brought up in the Mormon church and had a baseball bat applied squarely across my brow when the subject of "my" problem came to light.  I was excommunicated as soon as I used an unused "Women's" restroom on an unused floor of an office building.  That was the arrangement I had made at work.  In the words of "my" bishop "as soon as they start using the women's restroom, there's no turning back."  So, for relieving myself in the wrong room, I became a "son of perdition, relegated to spend all eternity with Lucifer and his angels."

This seems to me everything so familiar. When I was excommunicated at that time (this was in 1992, on the 2nd of February), the same was said to me. At that time I was sad, and didn't want to see that my bishop tried to manipulate me. He used even my former woman, my children, and the temple sealing certificate to move me to the return. but when he saw that his rotten tricks didn't have an effect with me, he changed the tactics. From then on,  NO member was allowed tohas any kind of contact with me,even by written, telephone or personal contact. I was slandered, and to me was said that I served from now on the devil because I would have become a "son of perdition". I had survived my father and his brother, has the prison and my service survived, and this tiny bishop meant, I would let before fear my knees shake?

YOU need to find a place where you feel comfortable.  YOU need to find a place where you feel love and companionship.  YOU need your beliefs cradled and held dear.  You will not find it in the LDS faith.  Perhaps in one locality (highly doubtful), but if you move you're screwed.

I had find such a place in 1998, and it is NOT Christian.

There are thousands of Christian sects where I'm sure you can find a home. I do believe that there are more that are accepting LGBT people all the time here in the USAyee... as well as around the world. I won't give up on them. Don't torture yourself by attempting to align yourself where you will never belong.

I'm a witch, and follow the Dianic path of the Goddess. In this I'm accepted also as a woman with transexual past,
I don't need the LDS cult any more.
But it is very difficult to separate internally from a group which one loves, also if this group was to a whole peace of >-bleeped-<. There are many homosexual and transgendered youngsters in the LDS, and they all require our love and support. They need to hear that also God loves them, because their cult doesn't do it. Their cult can only destroy  people and families. I think of future generations who wouldn't have to suffer if the LDS changed their mind.

Be Blessed

Linda

[tekla]

Not to change the topic, but if I ever start a biker club I'm going to call it The Sons of Perdition, I'm surprised that's never been used.

[Witch of Hope]

Proving (some) Christians have been very anti-semetic doesn't at all prove that Christians originated anti-semietism.
Perhaps we're having a language problem here...

We don't have a linguistic/language problem, but, we value facts differently. These were no simple members who said such a thing or acted in such a way, but they were people with power. The leaders whom others had to follow. Not to forget church teacher, popes, and, cardinals, they all were involved in it. They were the opinion doers of the Catholics. Theirr words and actions had far-reaching consequences for many people.

[Lachlann]

I was brought up in the Mormon church and had a baseball bat applied squarely across my brow when the subject of "my" problem came to light.  I was excommunicated as soon as I used an unused "Women's" restroom on an unused floor of an office building.  That was the arrangement I had made at work.  In the words of "my" bishop "as soon as they start using the women's restroom, there's no turning back."  So, for relieving myself in the wrong room, I became a "son of perdition, relegated to spend all eternity with Lucifer and his angels."

Here's the deal.  I can blow the veracity/truth of the Mormon church out of the water in a few paragraphs.  I could probably do the same about Christianity with a sit down conversation.  But I won't. Nothing is accomplished. I've found my peace in the world my own way without the need of an organized church.  YOU need to find a place where you feel comfortable.  YOU need to find a place where you feel love and companionship.  YOU need your beliefs cradled and held dear.  You will not find it in the LDS faith.  Perhaps in one locality (highly doubtful), but if you move you're screwed.

There are thousands of Christian sects where I'm sure you can find a home. I do believe that there are more that are accepting LGBT people all the time here in the USAyee... as well as around the world. I won't give up on them. Don't torture yourself by attempting to align yourself where you will never belong.

Cindi

It is harder to get excommunicated from the church now.

I often find people who try to find things wrong with the church often use dated information. The LDS church actually progresses. You can transition in the church and not be excommunicated because shock and horror, things have changed.

[Cindi Jones]

It is harder to get excommunicated from the church now.

I often find people who try to find things wrong with the church often use dated information. The LDS church actually progresses. You can transition in the church and not be excommunicated because shock and horror, things have changed.

Monty,

So, the prophet who talks to the infallible and unchanging God has changed his mind? Is this the same church in Utah that decided that gays in California couldn't be married anymore?  You mean the one that wanted to actually take away rights that had been granted to them and DID? Cool. I'm so glad that they are a more loving and caring people now.  It is truly amazing what changes have been made in 8 months.

The last time I checked the official rule book, if you dismember yourself, you are cut off.   That was only a couple years ago.  I was also told that my "sin" was second only to murder (even worse than a child molester.... can you believe?). It matters little to me now.  I've made a new life and have a new family.   I left the cult behind over two decades ago.  It took many years to realign my beliefs with reality however.  It's difficult to hate yourself and still be successful.  But passing time helps. 

Witch,

Listen sweety, just let it go.  Hate has no useful place in your heart.  If you can let go of the hate, the pain will follow. I'm glad that you've found something to take its place. 

Cindi

[Lachlann]

Monty,

So, the prophet who talks to the infallible and unchanging God has changed his mind? Is this the same church in Utah that decided that gays in California couldn't be married anymore?  You mean the one that wanted to actually take away rights that had been granted to them and DID? Cool. I'm so glad that they are a more loving and caring people now.  It is truly amazing what changes have been made in 8 months.

The last time I checked the official rule book, if you dismember yourself, you are cut off.   That was only a couple years ago.  I was also told that my "sin" was second only to murder (even worse than a child molester.... can you believe?). It matters little to me now.  I've made a new life and have a new family.   I left the cult behind over two decades ago.  It took many years to realign my beliefs with reality however.  It's difficult to hate yourself and still be successful.  But passing time helps. 

I think you'll note that there have been changes to rules throughout the Bible(Old testament and New testament) and in the Mormon church itself over the years. It's not that they see it as God changing his mind, they see it as him waiting for the perfect timing to put forth action.

It depends entirely on your bishop if they excommunicate you or not, but the stance changed to sympathetic before Prop 8. Having a specific definition on how they view marriage doesn't mean they are less compassionate and that's an entirely different case. I'm not happy they did that, but I feel a lot of scape goats are going around in reaction to it and not enough common sense.

[Witch of Hope]

Witch,

Listen sweety, just let it go.  Hate has no useful place in your heart.  If you can let go of the hate, the pain will follow. I'm glad that you've found something to take its place. 

Cindi, I don't "hate" the LDS! But I don't love them also any more. For it this "church" has done too much bad to other people and me. It is also not right that somebody, who is a member of this "church", and make a transition, isn't excluded. To me cases from the USA, Hong Kong and also Germany are known (the last case it happened in 2007) where members were excommunicated so.

PS: I'm not your sweety.We didn't know each other, and I'm not fall in love (or you are?) 

[Cindi Jones]

Witch,

"Sweety" is used commonly here in the US as a casual endearing and friendly term. It's a simple way to reach out without risk.  I'm sorry that it got lost in your translation.  Other casual terms are "hon", "honey", "doll", etc.

I was excommunicated from the LDS faith and it was an extremely painful experience.  I even wrote a book about it which was published recently and is available through most online outlets.  In the first year after, I was suicidal.  That turned to rage and hate against the church in following years.  Then, I started to learn about the historical foundations of the church and Christianity in general.  Now I have a fuller understanding of the whole gig.  While I still feel the pangs of hurt from time to time, I've decided that I can hold no ill will towards them.  Those who refuse to understand us will die some day. The new generation is growing up in a world where LGBT issues are better understood and accepted.

I don't know the future of the LDS faith.  I don't know if they will change their doctrines. It is not all that important to me.  I am still connected through my family. I must endure endless discussions of "church stuff" while in their presence.  It isn't doctrine thrown at me.... it's just the normal "church stuff" between family members.

BTW, where are you from?  I don't want to get too personal and you don't have to answer if you don't want. But it would be nice to get to know you.

Cindi

[Tammy Hope]

We don't have a linguistic/language problem, but, we value facts differently. These were no simple members who said such a thing or acted in such a way, but they were people with power. The leaders whom others had to follow. Not to forget church teacher, popes, and, cardinals, they all were involved in it. They were the opinion doers of the Catholics. Theirr words and actions had far-reaching consequences for many people.

So your position is that no one ever hated or discriminated against the Jews because they were Jews before Christ?

[Witch of Hope]

So your position is that no one ever hated or discriminated against the Jews because they were Jews before Christ?

Not from other cultures. As far as I know, the christians are the first group with antisemitism. Other cultures hate them, but this wasn't antisemitism. They hate Jews for steal their land or killed other pagan worshipers. But this wasn't antisemitism.

PS: It would be great if we can go back to the topic, please.

[Tammy Hope]

Not from other cultures. As far as I know, the christians are the first group with antisemitism. Other cultures hate them, but this wasn't antisemitism. They hate Jews for steal their land or killed other pagan worshipers. But this wasn't antisemitism.

PS: It would be great if we can go back to the topic, please.

anti = "against"

Semite = "Jew"

Why does it matter to the use of that word what the REASON for being against them was?

Seems to me you are defining the word according to your personal definition in order to be anti-Christian.

Kind of ironic.

[tekla]

Antisemitism refers to a specific set of persecutions and legal restrictions that were brought about in the Western World in the Christian Age, otherwise called, The Dark Ages and continuing into the modern world.  They ranged from prohibitions against certain activities, segregation in living arrangements, - ghettos - regulation of families to only one son, pogroms, official and non-official mob actions, and it also included systematic torture and death under the First Crusade, the Spanish Inquisition, the expulsion from England (1290), Spain (1492), and Portugal (1497) and of course, the Holocaust.

[Tammy Hope]

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/antisemitism

an⋅ti-Sem⋅i⋅tism
  /ˌæntiˈsɛmɪˌtɪzəm, ˌæntaɪ-/ Show Spelled Pronunciation [an-tee-sem-i-tiz-uhm, an-tahy-] Show IPA
Use antisemitism in a Sentence
–noun
discrimination against or prejudice or hostility toward Jews.



^^^
Only definition listed.

[V M]

Actually, most "Mormons" are not anti semitic. They recognize Christ as a Jew and consider themselves as the children of Israel. They also consider everyone part of the same family. Descendents of Abraham. Jews, Muslims, Christians and others are all considered part of what they call the ten tribes of Israel.

Hey, I live in the middle of Mormon ville. I may not totally agree with them on some subjects. But I do let them speak their piece.

[Cindi Jones]

Actually, most "Mormons" are not anti semitic. They recognize Christ as a Jew and consider themselves as the children of Israel. They also consider everyone part of the same family. Descendents of Abraham. Jews, Muslims, Christians and others are all considered part of what they call the ten tribes of Israel.

Hey, I live in the middle of Mormon ville. I may not totally agree with them on some subjects. But I do let them speak their piece.

Mormons actually consider Jews "the chosen people" of God.  That's what it says in "their" Bible (not that it's any different than anyone else's)

Cindi

[V M]

I noticed that they have both the Bible and their own book which they say is a second witness to the Bible. Some of the stories are interesting and a fairly good read. But you do have to get past some of the boring parts. I'm still not sure about this Mormon dude that buried gold plates on a hillside or the angel with a trumpet. But most of them are generally nice to me

[Witch of Hope]

In an article which a liberal Mormon named Jörn (or Jörg) Dittberner had written in which he could prove that in Germany, at the moment of the Nazi dictatorship, many German Mormons were against Jews. They believed, Hitler would be a sort of "tools" of God. And many have betrayed Jews to the Gestapo (confidential state police of the Nazi). Others have hidden Jews. And even the American Mormons who visited Germany in this time found the Nazi pigs good, also what they made with the Jews if they talked about it at all. I will look once, maybe I find the article somewhere, then I can say further details in addition.