Bad Conversation

[Squirrel698]

So it's been going pretty good for me recently.  I'm becoming more confident in my masculine presentation.  I've been introducing myself more with my real name and politely correcting pronouns.

My oldest son is autistic and tonight we went to an event for autistic children and adults.  I had a few interesting conversations while there.  These people have no filters so it's interesting.

Michelle: Hello.  What's your name.  *looks at my name tag*  Paul

Me: Hello.  What's your name?

Michelle: My name is Michelle.  Are you here with your kid?

Me: Kids.  I have three kids.

Michelle:  You look to young to have three kids.  Are you in your twenties?

Me: Something like that.

Michelle:  I'm 38.  Are you here with your wife? 

Me: No with my husband.

*pause*

Michelle: You're a girl.  *pause* And your name is Paul?

Me: No I'm a boy.

Michelle:  But you're a girl.     

Me: No I'm a boy.  *walks away*

Michelle:  *after me* So you're a tomboy.  Just kidding, just kidding.

She went over to my partner and I hear them around the corner.

Michelle: Is that your wife over there.

Greg: Yes

Michelle:  Her name is Paul. 

Greg:  Yes I suppose it is.

Michelle:  Is she a cross dresser? 

Greg: *laughs* 

For the rest of the evening I repeatedly ran into her and every time I did she said my name.  Both of us noticed that she was going out of her way to stalk us.  There was no point in getting angry.  She clearly is very autistic and extremely overweight.  It just brought me down a bit.  There was a little autistic girl I talked to as well.  She accepted that I was a man but she got very worried when I said that my kids had two Dads and no Mom.  She wanted to know where the Mom was and nothing I said could explain it to her.  This was obviously a completely new concept to her.

I realized that in a lot of people's mind I'm either going to be trans or I am going to be gay.  I can just forget about being a normal person ever again to the majority of the world.  That's a bit unsettling even though I am proud of who I am.   

[sneakersjay]

Early transition was the worst for me.  I pretty much avoided all social situations during that time.  Took me 3-4 months to pass consistently.  I hated being read as F, hated being read as a butch lesbian, hated having to explain I was trans.  It was easier just to stay home. 


Jay

[LordKAT]

I'd take gay over trans any day!

There are times I agree with this and times when I just want to say (and often do,) I am not gay! I'm a guy who likes girls. Some days I just want to give up and say, whatever.

[sneakersjay]

I'd take gay over trans any day!

Yes, this!

Gay Jay

[zombiesarepeaceful]

Early on in transition this is to be expected. It gets better. It still angers me in the rare occasion that I'm not read as male but with my voice dropping and face changing that is becoming next to none. Even when people have to see my license they seem confused...like wait..no..that's a man...and I still get sir'd. It feels great. Someday you'll get that too.

[Tozzle]

I can just forget about being a normal person ever again to the majority of the world.

It made my guts twist up and gave me shivers when I heard you say that.

How exactly are you defining normal? Is straight and born into the right body normal?  Or is this just common?  I'm lesbian and in a relationship with a tg individual - are we an abnormal couple, or just a less common one?  Having seen what the rest of the world looks like, how people behave and how they treat each other I see my community as far more balanced and compassionate than 'everyone else' - there is no-one I know who I'd ever think to call abnormal.  We all have fears, insecurities, pride and strength.  We all brush our teeth, wash our clothes, use public transport and love our children and pets - I don't see anything 'abnormal' there.  But if our gender identities, sexualities and relationship choices make us less common, then so be it -  I'd choose to be uncommon over the alternative any day.

It might seem right now that you're never going to get there, but hold on and have faith in yourself and the others who have gone down this road before you. 

[Arch]

How exactly are you defining normal?

He isn't. He's just stating his belief that most other people will not consider him to be normal.

[Tozzle]

He isn't. He's just stating his belief that most other people will not consider him to be normal.

Sorry if you've misunderstood me.  I was looking more at the global definition of normal, and how it's relative - I wasn't on the defensive, or anything else.  My reference to my guts twisting up was a reaction to the sense of despair I got from reading what Squirrel said about not being viewed as normal by the rest of the world.  My partner goes through 'everyone will think I'm a freak' moments and it upsets me that there are people in the world who are so narrow minded -this is what makes my guts twist and gives me shivers.  I wanted to reassure Squirrel that there are other people who are more compassionate.

[Arch]

OK, Tozzle.

[Squirrel698]

Thanks Tozzle and Arch

What bothered me most about the conversation is not the fact that I didn't pass.  But that she didn't even sense there was something different before the gay question.  Seems homosexuals were equally foreign to her.  It just drove the point home that I really am not were I should be.  To me people of all types should be celebrated and not made to feel like they are outsiders.  However in these suburbs it's a completely different story.  It's always an unpleasant shock when I realize how uninformed so many people are. 

Frankly I've never been normal and I am okay with that.  I just wish this was a world where gay or transgender was considered normal or at least not something to stand back and gape about. 

Zombie you are so lucky to be seeing so many changes already.  I started T one week after you and I have yet to see anything definite.  I hope I do get sir'ed and not miss or anything else.  I feel it's going to take changing my name so I can get id and credit cards that will say the truth. 

That is exactly how I feel Jay.  However for my kids sake I can't hide in the house for 3 months.  I have to go out.  Some people see me the right way, many don't.  Some people are respectful and some are bewildered and rude.     

[Arch]

Squirrel, I suspect that Zombie's younger age is working in his favor.

I can't remember--exactly when did you start T?

[Squirrel698]

Could be I suppose.  I started T about 3 weeks ago.  Clearly I am the impatient type.   

[Arch]

Okay, fella, give it another month or three.

Has your voice started to change, even just a little?

[Squirrel698]

I'm not sure, maybe a bit.  I was called sir at a drive through the other day which was awesome.  I have just heard that some guys go years on T without their voice changing.  So I get worried.  Hopefully that is not to common.

[sneakersjay]

That is exactly how I feel Jay.  However for my kids sake I can't hide in the house for 3 months.  I have to go out.  Some people see me the right way, many don't.  Some people are respectful and some are bewildered and rude.   

I have kids, too.  I did things with them that didn't require a whole lot of interaction on my part with other parents and such.  We'd go to parks and museums and things like that.  A cashier getting the pronouns wrong is easier than having to explain transition to other people.  As far as parents at my kids' school stuff, I told the 1 or 2 who I interacted with, and didn't say anything to anyone else.  The ones I didn't talk to didn't really notice or care about my transition.  I also transitioned under the noses of my daughter's orthodontist, including one receptionist who knew me.  After a couple of months she didn't even recognize me any more.

Jay

[Arch]

I'm not sure, maybe a bit.  I was called sir at a drive through the other day which was awesome.  I have just heard that some guys go years on T without their voice changing.  So I get worried.  Hopefully that is not to common.

Yeah, it seems to be quite uncommon. I've only met one guy that this happened to, and I know that he went off T at some point very early in his transition. I don't how long he was on it to begin with, and I don't know if he ever went back on.

His voice is very reedy, and since I already know he's trans, I can't tell whether he sounds like a guy or not. I've met dozens of trans men, and this is the only guy I know who has had real voice problems.

[sneakersjay]

I've met dozens of trans men, and this is the only guy I know who has had real voice problems.

The only problem I have with my voice is that it isn't very loud.  So if I speak up, to me, it goes up in pitch.  Not usually a problem at work, home, or most store visits.  But when I went to a conference last week, there was a lot of background noise to overcome, and in a room full of men, I felt my voice was pathetic.

Could just be my perception, though.  I can get very deep at home, but with no volume.

Jay

[Arch]

I could sure use some projection ability. I was trying to learn not to speak from my throat...no luck. I don't know what the heck I'm supposed to do.

[noxdraconis]

I have the same problem of not being able to speak loudly.  It is absolutely impossible for me to yell or project my voice at all.  Instead of an increase in pitch though, my voice just "shuts off" when I try to go above a certain volume and no sound comes out at all.

[Arch]

I have the same problem of not being able to speak loudly.  It is absolutely impossible for me to yell or project my voice at all.  Instead of an increase in pitch though, my voice just "shuts off" when I try to go above a certain volume and no sound comes out at all.

Sounds like one of those bad dreams in which you're tied to a stake and surrounded by hungry cannibals.