Being ftm in the bear community?

[Adio]

I have a question that's been bugging me for a couple months.  Can a gay ftm successfully be accepted into the bear subculture?  Does it depend on where you live?  Or how far you've transitioned medically?  Or is it simply how masculine you actually are?

Could a community that prides itself on being masculine, accept someone who was once feminine?

First hand experience would be great, but I'll listen to any thoughts on the matter.

[LordKAT]

  Bear community?  Sorry but I'm human.

[owl]

i think he meant "bare"

[millsy]

That's a good queston! Bears seem like they are a little more genuine perhaps, not sure why, maybe its all the fuzzy fuzz lol. Why don't you rock along with a good friend and see what happens?

[TheOtherSide]

Bear community?  Sorry but I'm human.

LMAO

[Cindy]

I'm grizzly when I wake up.

Sorry, gets off thread before guys spank Cindy

[Alessandro]

i think he meant "bare"

He meant 'bear'.

Bears in the gay community are like very hairy men who like to eat a lot, work out a lot and are generally pretty nice people despite looking like a scary motorcycle gang. 

Can't actually answer the question though, bears aren't really my thing 

[kisschittybangbang]

It can happen just like it can happen with super flamming effeminate trans men. Some trans men are hairier than others! Genetics people. You've got them.

For instance, I'm bio fem and if I weren't blond I'd look extremely hairy on my arms. hypothetically, If I went on T... I'd be pretty friggin grizzly... well maybe polar... I'm very pale and naturally decently blond...

Enough of my grumbling. I think eventually I should Hibernate... >.>

Don't hit me boys! Cindy was here first! -runs and hides-

[Cindy]

It can happen just like it can happen with super flamming effeminate trans men. Some trans men are hairier than others! Genetics people. You've got them.

For instance, I'm bio fem and if I weren't blond I'd look extremely hairy on my arms. hypothetically, If I went on T... I'd be pretty friggin grizzly... well maybe polar... I'm very pale and naturally decently blond...

Enough of my grumbling. I think eventually I should Hibernate... >.>

Don't hit me boys! Cindy was here first! -runs and hides-

Same cave?  And some huggles from nice warm bears. Mmmm


Cindy

[Renate]

Um, just to get this back on track, here is a G rated link to illustrate what a bear is:
Provincetown Bears

[tekla]

If you know your history
Then you would know where you coming from
Then you wouldn't have to ask me
"Who the heck do I think I am?"
    -- Bob Marley


It seems to me that would be one of the harder groups to get within.  While there has been some acceptance (and not without some friction) within the gay/boi/leather/S&M/bootblack deal, the whole bear culture which is less focused on actions and roles, but more on just plain old body-type, Big, Hairy, and Big, did I say Big?  Like huge/fat/beer belly - guys with the hots for Santa Claus.  It also is much more physical, with lots of physical contact and lots and lots and lots of nudity (where the leather deal is far more costume/role focused).

A classic bear event would be a camping trip where all the guys were hanging out looking like Larry the Cable guy, with pretty much his mannerisms and manners too. 

It's pretty much the direct opposite to the more classic thin/hairless/very young and boy looking/nelly/effeminate gay stereotype.  It's basically guys who like other guys for just being guys.  Guys who are really hot for beer-drinking, public pissing, redneck guys who love nothing more than being out in the woods camping on a hunting trip.  They tend to the more rowdy, uncouth (as opposed again to the more classic Judy Garland and Opera gay guy acting like Carry Grant stereotype), rough-housing, 'rasselin', boxing, big assed-motorcycles and pick-up trucks image.  They ain't listening to opera or show tunes, they'd take a shotgun to any boom-box playing disco/electronics/dance.  They play hard core county and metal.  Rob Halford/Judas Priest/Metallica type classic metal when the Hank Williams and Willie Nelson classic country ain't on.

Pretty early on in the entire gay deal (early/mid 60s) the first gay motorcycle clubs the Warlocks and the Satyrs¹ (all what would come to be called 'bears' no such term existed at that time) and the Hell's Angels bonded over big bikes, overindulgence in alcohol and love of lewd, licivious and gross behavior and a very tight personal bond between Sonny Barger (the founder of the Angel's) and the founder of the Warlocks, as well as what was often a shared military background.  As a result the HAs have never been a threat to the gay community (in the way that they really went after the anti-war/anti-draft people for a long time), and in fact have helped out security wise at several prominent gay-community events including the funeral of Gwen Araujo.  Something many of our TG fellow sisters and brothers would not do out of fear of being seen with other TG people.

The chief problem with a FTM being a bear assuming they were physically big enough would be the nudity deal and the how many things can I do with my cock deal.  It's very cock centered.


1 - Founded in 1954 in LA by the way, Warlocks in 1960 in SF.

[Jude_]

Surprisingly, i've found that bears are THE MOST accepting out of all the different gay communities. Haha if i had a nickel for every trans bear daddy i met, i'd be rich.

All the bears i know have cis boyfriends, and had no problem being accepted into the community at all.
The bear and leather communities are really accepting of all sorts of differences. As a matter of fact, the guy who won International Mr. Leather of the Year in 2007, was an ftm.

Of course, this is all coming from my personal experience with friends and such. I actually remember seeing a documentary about bears and one of the men they followed was trans. He had no problems at other bear events.

You just gotta be hairy! It's all about the hair. There's all sorts of types of bears and different body types. Really, the only requirement is facial hair, and some body hair.

[tekla]

Yeah, the leather deal has overlaps with all the various subgroups, but it's not interchangeable with them, the Bear deal is really separate, and while a huge section of the leather community adopted some of the fashion, and even the sites (leather bars followed the Bear/Gay Biker bars, not the other way round) it would be a mistake to confuse them.

[Adio]

Many thanks everyone.  I wanted to ask here before I did elsewhere. 

Tekla-I appreciate your honesty (never thought I'd say that ).  Definitely opened my eyes a bit. 

[tekla]

It is what is is, my not telling the truth would not change it.  And I have some good pals in that bear community, and in the leather community (and all over really, I try not to judge) and they are all cool with me, they are pretty accepting and easy going, but that's not to say that they would see you as 'one of them' - which I certainly am not either.

[Turtle]

Might be worth looking at some of Patrick Califia's history. Not necessarily the S&M (unless it's your thing...), but some of his lifestyle choices and social dilemmas since coming out as Trans. Not strictly bear, but a very 'masculine' community. Just a thought.

[FTM_Daddy]

Hello;

I'm a FTM in the Bear Community -- both in the States and in England.  I previously lived in Portland Oregon and found a LOT of Bears open to my status if/when I decided to tell them.  Of course there was (and always will be) the odd genetic idiot who flips out about it but, once I established friendships the other guys were quick to support me and check the occasional one who might be rude.

I found that when I became more confident in myself and my masculinity it became easier for me to be taken seriously.  In the beginning I mistakenly tried putting on "macho" as a substitute for the masculinity I did not yet have by experiencing confidence from the world around me --  and it failed miserably.  I found that macho is MUCH different than masculinity -- It had to be generated from the real me when I felt "confident in my own skin" masculine.  That process took a while in transition – some was about being able to grow facial hair and some had to do with how confident I felt in the world around me as a HUMAN being.

Here is what Wikipedia has to say about Bears:
Bear is LGBT slang for those in the bear communities, a subculture in the gay/bisexual male communities and an emerging subset of LGBT communities with events, codes and culture-specific identity. It also describes a physical type.

Bears tend to have hairy bodies and facial hair; some are heavy-set; some project an image of working-class masculinity in their grooming and appearance, though none of these are requirements or unique indicators. Some bears place importance on presenting a hypermasculine image and may shun interaction with, and even disdain, men who exhibit effeminacy.[1] The bear concept can function as an identity, an affiliation, and an ideal to live up to, and there is ongoing debate in bear communities about what constitutes a bear, however a consensus exists that inclusion is an important part of the Bear Community.[2][3]

Bears are almost always gay or bisexual men, although increasingly transgender men (transmen) and those who shun labels for gender and sexuality are also included within bear communities.

Hope that helps =

[Al James]

I want to be a Bear. Do you have to be gay?

[lilacwoman]

of all the gay guys I see at LGBT conference and review days the only one who made me wish to be post-op and him to be straight is a cuddly hairy guy who is presumably what you call a Bear...

[Alun C]

Ahh~! I'm glad I found this! I'll ask at the next Pridefest I attend~ Promise! I too am an FTM seeking to be a Gay Bear. In my current state *as in appearence* and age, I would not be accepted. Gay bears are older MEN who are with MEN. I don't see any reason why a masculine FTM can't join as long as you've got a good packer, some sexy leather pants, and enough hair to call yourself Grizzly~ OH! And tone up! Gay bears are literally BEASTS~ XDDD I LOVE ET~~!!!

*TRUE STORY!* At the StPete *or Gaybor* Pride Fest~ I yelled at the gay bear float "I Wanna Grow up to be a Gay bear" and I do. They gave me a whirl wind of thumbs up and hoots and hollers. So I'm pretty friggin' determined.

<3 Alun