Maybe I should just give up.

[alexx]

I have long-ish hair for a boy (a little past my jaw), I fanboy over my favorite things like a girl, I look too feminine to even pass as a flamboyant gay guy, and while I love to be feminine, I just can't live as a girl.

I don't feel like I'll ever look or act enough like a boy to pass.

I have a few of stereotypical guy-ish traits - like the fact that I love watching wrestling and I'm extremely competitive and love violence and gore, however, for the most part, I'm kind of feminine; I love shopping and fashion and such.

I mean, why can't I just get over it and live as a girl? Of course, I know that if I do that I'll end up killing myself. But I mean - I can't seem to be the guy I'm meant to be AND pass completely. You know? I just look too....feminine. I hang out with so many bio guys and they just make me feel even more feminine even though they say they think of me as a guy. And I've been trying to gain muscle by working out because I want to look more like a guy, but it's so difficult and it isn't working.

I sometimes feel like...what's the point, you know? What's the point if I can't be who I want to be? Even around my parents I can't b e myself because I can't tell them I'm really a guy or they'll hate me so that's why I'm going to a therapist and I feel like my therapist won't take me seriously because I act too much like...I don't know, a girl.

Sorry. This was more or less a sad rant. I'm done now. 

[Octavianus]

Think of it this way, is there any logic or reason behind the tought that the love for shopping and fashion is something reserved exclusively for girls?
There are many "masculine" women and as much "feminine" men. In this world culture dictates how men and women should behave and clothe. Girls in pink, boys in blue. Girls wear skirts, boys wear pants. et cetera. But there is simply no reason behind these unwritten laws. It is just something culture came up with.
Loving fashion does not make you any less of a guy.
An example from my own life: One of my female friends has a thing for putting her feet in her mouth and biting of her toenails while she gives you the "what?" look. When on vacation she threathened not to shave herself if we didn't shave. And just this week I found myself crying while watching a movie.

What I am trying to say is to just be yourself and don't worry about being too "feminine" for a guy.

Edit:

"Real men" by Joe Jackson just passed my playlist. A song appropriate for this subject.

[jmaxley]

I've had thoughts like these.  I too love fashion and shopping.  I feel like I have more license to be creative with clothes as a female.  But I hate having a female body.  I've tried liking being female and it hasn't worked.  I wonder sometimes if maybe I tried harder.    I can ignore being female, and sometimes can somewhat tolerate it, but I just don't think I will ever like it.  I'm just a really flamboyant guy.  I will probably need to move somewhere less conservative to be able to express that side of me after transition.

[JennaLee]

Alexx

Hope you don't mind my responding but your post sort of hit home.  I feel exactly the same way, only in reverse.  Hormones really helped my dysphoria.  Even though I don't think I could ever pass, it makes me feel like I'm moving in the right direction.

Perhaps T would do the same for you?  You have to try that before killing yourself, the other way round doesn't work!

[Mr. Fox]

Oh, if any guy would be effeminate enough to be fine with being a girl, it would be me, and since I'm here it obviously hasn't worked out.  I am incredibly flamboyant, on par with the school crossdresser (I say that like I wear men's clothes and he doesn't), and I'm even holding back a little to help me pass (for example, no skirts in public; I might even get a haircut soon).  But, not all cismen are manly either (ex. the school crossdresser), and people don't tell THEM they should live as girls and be happy with it.  Really, you just have to strike the balance you're comfortable with between being yourself and passing until you've been on hormones a while, and also be sure to focus on things that make you happy personally AND help you pass (ex: binding).  You can't help caring about passing, but the less you worry, the happier you feel, in my experience.

I worry about it in therapy a little.  Hell, my therapist commented on my not THAT feminine at the time hair.  But she doesn't actually care too much about such things, luckily.  Still, I'm glad that I have not been wearing nail polish any of the times I've seen her.

[Xren]

Don't.  Seriously.  Don't give up on what you know in your heart just because of half-baked status quo constructs.  Living in a world with so many artificial standards can get confusing or disheartening, I know, I've been there, but you can't let it stand in the way of finding satisfaction in life.  Too many people fall into denial because all the incoming messages tell them what they can and can't do/believe/enjoy/etc...and it's not pretty.

And if a therapist doesn't take you seriously, they're a cruddy therapist.

[Quicksand]

Don't worry too much about this, alexx.  Once I got on hormones, I found that a lot of my insecurities around these issues were projections of my physical insecurities onto what I perceived as social manifestations of my femininity.  As you progress in your transition, it will honestly become a non-issue.  Testosterone's some cool stuff, and I have never seen a picture of a transman who had been on it for a decent amount of time and did not look completely male.  I have faith that one day you will be a happy, confident, and completely passable man, and if your therapist does not take you seriously, you owe it to yourself to find one who does and will help you work on these issues in a way that does not compromise or hide your unique identity.  You can't live as a girl because you're not one, so please don't give up on your transition!  The trans community needs more success stories like you!

[Lukas-H]

Alexx, let me tell you what, I know how you feel about this, but there is NOTHING wrong with being a 'flamboyant' or 'feminine' guy. I get really sad when so many transguys deny who they really are and opt for the hyper-masculine mask because they're afraid of not passing. It might help them at first, but I'd rather everyone be who they truly are than live under -another- guise that isn't true.

Some love shopping, some hate, some are indifferent. There ain't nothing wrong with fanboying either (I get that way about a few things myself ) As for the muscle thing, T will probably help you in that area, when you are able to take it. I agree with quicksand, T will probably help you feel a lot more confident when you're able to have it.

It's not as easy as saying 'why can't I just accept being a female and learn to live like that' My ex used to ask me that, because he just didn't understand my situation. I sometimes thought about that too, and a very few are able to do such a thing (likely with great difficulty) but please try not to put that on yourself. Just be who you are and maybe come up with some ways you can up your confidence level

[valyn_faer]

I too am in kind of a similar situation but in reverse. It's not so much that I have a problem with not being feminine enough, it's that it irritates me that people expect me to fit a stereotype of femininity in order to be a "real trans person" or a "real woman." I honestly, don't like the idea of changing my voice. I would get the bottom surgery tomorrow if I could afford it. I seriously hate having male genitalia. It drives me nuts. No pun intended. But I really don't have any interest in altering my voice or speech patterns to make myself sound more feminine. It irritates me that people look at me and see a "man" in women's clothes, or a "man" in make-up, or a "man" with nail polish. But there's not much I can do at the moment to make my body appear more feminine. Although, what I've noticed, and what further irritates me, is that women discriminate against me less if I act overtly effeminate or wear my rainbow wristband. I think they assume I'm a gay man and therefore "safe." I now try to wear my wristband whenever I go clothes shopping, and when a woman sees me in the women's clothing section, I smile and push up my glasses a little with the hand I'm wearing the wristband on. It's kind of messed up, like I have to prove I'm not dangerous.

[Shang]

Alexx, I have felt the same way you do numerous times, but I'm slowly deciding I don't care what people think.  As long as I know I'm male and as long as I can become more masculine looking with T, then I'm fine. 

Hell, if you wind up looking like a very pretty boy that's all good--lots of girls (and guys, me included) love pretty guys who look pretty feminine. 

Just don't give up and keep on trucking!

[Cameron James]

Alexx,

Don't give up, dude.

In all honesty it sounds like you're so hung up on boy v. girl you've missed out on the possibility of a middle. Boys don't have to fit the masculine stereotypes, girls don't have to fit the feminine stereotypes, and FTMs come in all sorts.

Mix and match your masculine and feminine traits. That way you can love violence and gore and shopping and fashion too.

I myself fall onto the feminine side of the masculine spectrum. I identify as a FTM-Androgyne with a androgynous-masculine presentation - not quite manly enough to be a man, not quite feminine enough to be a girl.  Sometimes I get "he" and sometimes I get "she" - it happens and I'm pretty comfortable with with it.

Just remember that the only person who should matter to you is you. Or as Dr. Seuss once said "Those who matter don't mind, and those who mind don't matter." If someone doesn't think you pass, ignore them. As long as you're comfortable with you.

And a therapist should have no issues taking you seriously - especially if you're just being true to yourself.

[zombiesarepeaceful]

As my best friend said to me while were having a conversation over my passing effecting every moment of my life, "passing isn't everything". Regardless of if you pass 100 percent or 5, you're still a man inside. Nothing can change that. Living a lie and not transitioning will only bring more pain. I also said I'd kill myself if I hadn't transitioned. I'm glad I did.

I can't count the number of times I found myself saying, I wish I had a real dick and balls so I could just whip it out everytime someone gave me hell for not looking or acting masculine enough. Cause generally by society's standards, whatever you have is what you are. I'm a gay man. I've been told I should just not transition if I'm gonna be gay. It's not like I chose to be gay or trans, so after a long time of listening to people, I got fed up, realized that I can't live for anyone but myself, and now I do my best to ignore them.

[Mara]

I hope it's okay that I'm replying here.

My cis male brother is a high school football coach, does heavy labor, supervises convict crews, and when he was younger, he used to be (in)famous for getting in fights with two or three people at once and winning.  He also one of the best football players in the state, one of the stronger weight lifters in the region, and generally regarded by most people I know as the epitome of the masculine man.

He also owns about ten times as many clothes as I do.  Whenever we go on a family vacation (which we still get together and have), he spends a lot of his time shopping.  He's color blind, so he gets his girlfriend to identify colors for him, but he makes decisions on style and evaluates how any new purchase will augment his wardrobe.  He probably has about twenty pairs of shoes.  He also spends a lot of time on interior decorating his house, and is always excited to plant new trees and occasionally flowers.  Even when he was homophobic in the past (which he's grown out of), he used to joke that anybody who really knew him would think he was gay if he didn't have a girlfriend.  (I'm pretty sure he's not, by the way.)

Most of my straight cis male friends have some incredibly strong feminine traits as well.  Not all of them do, but most.

So, caring about shopping and style doesn't mean you have to hand in your Man Card, nor does being feminine.  I know everything is more frustrating when one is trans, because we often feel like we have to minimize every single little thing that gives us away, while cis people can blatantly defy gender norms without worrying about being misgendered.  I'm definitely not dismissing that concern.  I'm just saying that maybe your interests aren't quite as unusual as you think, and that they might not be a problem in the long run.  It's definitely possible to be feminine and still be accepted as a guy.

[insideontheoutside]

Regardless of if you pass 100 percent or 5, you're still a man inside. Nothing can change that. Living a lie and not transitioning will only bring more pain.

I agree with the first part of that but personally, not the "not transitioning will only bring more pain". If I can deal and just be myself (and not take any hormones btw) then it's in the realm of possibility for anyone to do it. I will say I was more bothered by things in my teens and twenties. 30's though? Whole different outlook on life really. I got to know myself better and was more comfortable with myself - no matter what body parts I have. I haven't "transitioned" to living life full time as a male and I'm fine with that - because I know I'm a male and nothing can actually change that. Also, I have come to find it incredibly fun to play both sides. Yes, one side I'm doing more "acting" (never did really act like a girl - but I've learned to act the part) but it's still amazing to see the world from both gender perspectives.

There was a day the other week when I went out shopping - was in total "guy mode" and then later on in the day I decided I wanted to go to Macy's and look at the jackets in the women's department. I pulled that off too. So funny how differently you get treated when people think you're a women ... and vice versa! When I'm in chick mode it's like I've snuck into the girl's locker room or their secret club. Fascinating really.

And I now have no problem with acting feminine (by society's standards) or liking certain things. I just like whatever I like and whatever makes me happy in life. I've stopped caring about society's rigid standards of male vs. female.

So don't give up. I almost gave up once and I'm really happy I did not because if I did I never would have experienced this "enlightenment" I've currently attained.

So many people get so wrapped up in "passing" that they forget to just be themselves and live life. When you're worried about passing you're letting other people's opinions of you rule your life. I know that it's important if you're in transition to have people accept you as the gender you're transitioning into, but at the end of the day you still have to believe in yourself and have confidence in yourself. I know it seems like a catch-22 that the way to feel more comfortable with yourself is to appear as the gender you feel you are and if you don't then you can't get comfortable and gain the confidence. Well, I'm proof that it actually is possible. What exactly works for me, might not exactly work for someone else but that still doesn't mean that it's impossible. Everyone just has to pick and choose and find their own path on how to get there. But if you give up, you're not going to evolve or get anywhere. Forward motion, always. Good luck.