She's A Boy I Knew

[Padma]

I watched this Canadian documentary film yeterday - made by Gwen Haworth, who is the subject of the film. I'm very grateful for her honesty, and that of her friends, family, and ex-wife (who is gorgeous too! - just had to say it...)

It was helpful for me to see the documented transition of someone who wanted to be female, but wasn't going for a stereotypical feminine hetero look - if I do end up going through this process myself, I expect to end up as a dungarees'n'boots purple-haired kind of gal who still sings bass (which I'm realising is only 'androgynous' from the limited perspective of "men should look like this, women should look like that"). It's been bugging me that the other forum I've been visiting is very handbags-and-hairstyles oriented - I'm glad there's a lot more diversity on this site, it's so easy to self-pigeonhole, and so easy to feel under pressure to fit in somewhere.

I'm noticing a subtle pattern among my friends whom I've talked to about this stuff lately: I get more affirmation if I talk up the caution aspect "Of course I'm not making any decisions yet, except the decision not to make any decisions yet..." as opposed to the change aspect "I may well go through with all of this: electrolyis, HRT, surgery. It's possible that's what I'm going to do." It seems to me that they're all hoping this is just going to blow over! And I can feel in myself a corresponding urge to emphasise the caution, because I need affirmation! And then of course here, I feel the urge to emphasise the change part, so as not to be thought of as a weekend transperson .

Pff. It's both. I'm feeling a strong urge to change, and a strong urge to be cautious. good, that's got that said. Meanwhile, the hunt continueth for decent dungarees for someone with a 32" inside leg .

[lancem27]

There's a girl on youtube I should find for you, she is quite andro and still passes well, she's awesome. *make a mental note to find her tomorrow*

Of course I'm not making any decisions yet, except the decision not to make any decisions yet..." as opposed to the change aspect "I may well go through with all of this: electrolyis, HRT, surgery. It's possible that's what I'm going to do."

Thank God I'm not the only one! See, they tell me it's all about my age but this pretty much says it's not about age, it's about that they have preconceived beliefs about being trans. I could be your age and people would likely still say it to me as well!

People are dumb.

[Padma]

Or people are scared . I know I am, and I'm the one who remotely knows what's going on, so no wonder other people are freaked out (if they are).

Plus I have a bit of a reputation for getting "into" things overenthusiastically. But the folk who've known me for a long time know that this gender issue has been cropping up for me since my 20's anyway, so it's not so much of a surprise - they're just waiting to see if it fades out again or not (as am I).

[Colleen Ireland]

Or people are scared . I know I am, and I'm the one who remotely knows what's going on, so no wonder other people are freaked out (if they are).

Plus I have a bit of a reputation for getting "into" things overenthusiastically. But the folk who've known me for a long time know that this gender issue has been cropping up for me since my 20's anyway, so it's not so much of a surprise - they're just waiting to see if it fades out again or not (as am I).

Yes, it's a scary thing.  People are scared.  I was afraid my parents and siblings would write me off completely, but I was wrong.  Their biggest reaction was concern for me, that I was doing "the right thing", that I "knew what I was getting into" and had "considered all the ramifications".  And I appreciate their concern, it's a heck of a lot better than "Have a nice life...".  And the more they see of what I'm doing and how I'm going about it, the more onside they are.  My parents apparently said to one of my sisters, "We've done enough research to know that once the diagnosis is made, it's usually correct."  And, of course, there are all the delays built into the process, so by the time you get down to irrevocable actions, you really KNOW this is what you want.  Glad to see you're questioning, challenging assumptions, and really searching yourself.  That is very necessary with this journey.

Edit:  The part about being known for "getting into things" over-enthusiastically, and having things "blow over"?  That's me.  But if this is a "phase", it's a heck of a long phase... 

[Padma]

Thanks, Colleen. there's a lot to consider - for me, overlaying the whole issue of what my root gender(s) really is(are), there's been a painful layer of homophobia (mine and others') in relation to me being polysexual since forever, and a more painful layer of confusion brought about by being used for sex by my parents as a child.

I've just been sussing out that each time this gender issue has come up for me over the last 30 years, it's come up at a time when I've peeled back and engaged with one of those other layers. The first time was when I came out as bi; the second was when I acknowledged what my father did to me; and the third was when I acknowledged what my mother had done to me too. This time it's come up (I think) because I've been going through a kind of synthesis of all of the above, and been accepting myself with a love I didn't have capacity for before.

The first time it emerged, I ended up deciding that what it was really about was that I thought being attracted to men meant I wasn't a proper man, so the only alternative was to be a woman (this was the mid-80's, mind you - not a great time to be coming out). So instead, I began coming to terms with my sexual orientation. The other two times, I've been seeing it as somehow tangled up with wanting to escape from my parents, or avoid being them, or something, or needing to be a woman in order to get loved, so I set it to one side and dealt with the "more immediate" stuff.

This time round, it's much more about my sense of self, overarching and containing all of that mess that's gradually being healed up. But since the important thing is what's going on under the bonnet, I have plenty of time to wait and see whether this leads me to do anything physical and irreversible about it on the outside .

[lancem27]

The part about being known for "getting into things" over-enthusiastically, and having things "blow over"?  That's me.

For me, that proves that this is the right thing because I am the same. If it wasn't the right thing, I'd be over it like other interests. True personality, true things STICK, and this has consistently stuck.

[Padma]

I think what's been puzzling me over the years was that it came in waves, and then went away again. but this time I'm seeing more the reasons why it needed to go away, as well as the reasons it arrived and why it has arrived again now. So it's not "a phase", because it's been 4 phases so far! Perhaps it's like a really long biorhythmic cycle . But seriously, I'm inclined to think it's not a cycle but a spiral - I'm getting closer to knowing what it's telling me.

[Caith]

Outcast-Films.com

There are some excellent reviews of this film on their site. 
At the very bottom of the page is a link to more thoughtful reviews.

Thanks, Yoxi.

[Padma]

I know I'm not the first person here to mention this film, I just wanted to big it up again . I hadn't read all those reviews, it's nice to know it got such positive reception, it deserved that.

It's been an interesting couple of days - I've been reading up on "the process" over here in the UK, and one of the listed conditions for presenting as someone with GID is the desire to wear the clothing of the opposite gender. Now, my clothing tastes are actually fairly genderless - baggy karate trousers, baggy tops and shirts. It's sounding to me a bit like when you take your driving test, and you have to do all this stuff for the test (like moving your head when you look in the mirror) in order to pass, that you'll never actually do in normal life. I'm going to try to line myself up with a good GID-friendly therapist once I move to Devon, and find out how all this might work for me, in that I don't want to live as a woman in the sense of "dresses and makeup", I just want to live as me, and my main urge for change is the fundamental physical/anatomic attributes - facial hair, boobs, genitals - not the outfits (though I'd like to wear even more colourful clothes than I already do).

I guess I need to talk to some local dykes about where they get their outfits .

[joshany12]

the important thing is that if you transition you stay you, not change to try be a stereotype of a gender. best of luck.

[Caith]

Unfortunately, there's still far too much expectation of stereotypical behaviour expected from trans patients. But hopefully when the DSM-5 and WPATH SoC v7 are finally ratified this will change.  The new DSM-5 allows for a much larger range of gender expression, more accurately describing the transgender spectrum.  It won't be perfect, but it will be much improved.

To give you an idea, I'll probably go in for my orchiectomy next month in full makeup, wig, and jewelry, with painted acrylic nails.  The surgeon seems to think he shouldn't remove my useless testicles if I'm not fully immersed in living my female role 24/7/365.  Well, considering I still need hair replacement surgery and many more hours of electrolysis to remove my beard, and my workplace is nowhere near ready for me to publicly transition, I can't see it as a mandatory requirement,  I see it as a personal inconvenience.  I'm willing to bear that incovenience for 2 to 4 days, if it means getting the surgery performed or not. 

Stupid stereotypes.  What percentage of modern women *ever* wear a dress or skirt, these days?

[Padma]

Exactly - and the assumed garb is very heteronormative too - like it's assumed that anyone wanting to become a woman is wanting to become a straight woman, with all that entails in terms of stereotypes.

The upcoming DMS-5 is great news for you American folk, but things move more slowly here in Blighty. I'm lining up some help and support from transgendered women in the UK who identify as lesbian/bi, to see how they handled it. Perhaps the requirement should be the ability to turn up for surgery bearing a perfect lemon drizzle cake, fer goodness' sake.

[joshany12]

im completly with you on the sexuality route, its alot of what stopped me self diagnosing for years. i thought i couldnt be a woman because i was attracted to women. we need to get the ideas or sexual orientation and gender separated in the minds of those who dont see it.

[Tamaki]

A  part of the process of discovering who I am through transition is discovering that not everyone else is like me. People tend to be ego centric and see other people and their experience through their own experience. So when people express concern about you wanting to change they see it from the perspective of someone who may be content with their gender and in fact they may have never questioned their gender. Not only do they not have any experience to draw upon but they start to question how they fit into all of this. A lot of people are uncomfortable thinking about these things.

I'm feeling a strong urge to change, and a strong urge to be cautious.

This is very much how my process is going. Laser hair removal was first since I knew I wouldn't regret never having to shaving again even if I remained male. HRT was a really tough decision but I had a few months before anything permanent happened I a needed to know. Now the caution is about bigger things like various surgeries.

I think what's been puzzling me over the years was that it came in waves

I really think that this is the nature of being human. If you've ever had a chance to observe your emotions they tend to rise and fall like waves. Most things in our lives are not constant but are much more like waves.

the important thing is that if you transition you stay you, not change to try be a stereotype of a gender.

My whole life I felt like I was searching for truth. I looked outside myself and inside myself and finally came to realize the truth I was looking for was to move out of the lie that I was living and be myself. I feel that this is the core of transition.

I expect to end up as a dungarees'n'boots purple-haired kind of gal who still sings bass

At times I feel really girly and want to dress to the nines but most of the time I'm a pretty laid back person. Back in the day I loved to wear OP when it was surfer wear and now I mostly wear Carharrt in guy mode. What I realized was the Carharrt make really cute casual women's clothes too and that really fit my personality. We all have to play games and work the system to get what we need but you don't have to compromise who you are in the process.

[Padma]

yes indeed (to joshany12). This came up in the film I was posting about - her mum was admitting it was easier for her that her "son" had become in her mind "my son, who likes women, plus bumps" and that she didn't have to deal with friends' questions about "him" being gay.

I don't know many trans folk here in the UK, but oddly enough, all of them that I know identify as bisexual - even though some of them didn't until post-transition.

How all this has come up to the surface to breathe is the realisation that a great part of what I thought were sexuality/orientation issues for me have always been gender issues instead. I've always been attracted to some men and some women (and these days, some who don't identify as either). And completely separate from that, I've always partly identified as female, and suppressed it, and it's sneaked out in all sorts of cunning ways that I'm now looking back and laughing in astonishment at.

[joshany12]

oh yoxi, i see so much of myself in you/ you in myself ect 

i am currently trying to separate in my own mind the feelings i have for the female body (the desire to have the body) from romantic feelings (do i want to be with the body) which is tough but ill get there eventually XD

[Padma]

How much I'll want to play depends on where I end up living and how safe it feels. It's no coincidence that I'm about to move across country and start a new-ish life for myself, living on my own. I've got a cottage on the back of a pub in a small seaside town, and the landlord is pretty young and laid back and friendly. I'm not sure how he'll be if I start growing boobs, but I've got time to worry about that if and when. Meanwhile, I have a friend who lives a couple of hours from where I'm moving to who's going through similar issues, and we've talked about him coming to visit for a weekend so we can do girly stuff together - I'm well into toenail painting, for example, and his wife gets freaked out when he does it. So I'll have someone I know to play with .

I wasn't kidding about the "getting clothes tips from local dykes" thing - I really like some of their clothes - of course, finding it for a 32" inside leg will be entertaining!

[tekla]

Or people are scared

People in general hate, or fear, change in any way.

[MarinaM]

You simply have to get to the point where you don't feel like you should have to explain yourself anymore. I think that if you have followed my posts you may have witnessed this very difficult (and probably very fast) evolution of thought.

Of course, this mental state makes it alot more difficult to get the help we need so that we may become comfortable with our bodies (the docs want us to be screwed up!), so the process is difficult, and, as Caith mentioned, can be viewed as a major inconvenience. Some of us are more socially binary than others, this does not make one any more or less trans or cis or andro-anything.

Labels! Whatever 

[Caith]

Over twenty years ago, a lovely lady I dated in Chicago for several weeks remarked to me that I had a "very feminine sensuality".  She was absolutely correct, of course.  She just didn't know how correct she was, or why it was so pronounced.