Post-op & still Pre-orgasmic (*Explict & Frustrated*)

[AllyKat]

Okay...

I caved to the idea of asking for help. HELP!! I am just another typical redhead, geeky, lesbian, XY woman in her twenties. Back in December 2009, I happily went through the experience of GRS (ironically introducing me to a well known author) thanks to Dr. Brassard. I am completely frustrated about my sexual experience following surgery. I have been pre-orgasmic since surgery. I could filter this topic to make it all age appropriate but that is not my intent. I want to restore my state of being orgasmic. I do not want to have to have a discussion with another woman about how its not her doing things wrong. Its embarassing as many of you can understand.

I have been single since surgery. Up until earlier this year, I was living in a large city and accustomed to being a member of sexually positive community while experiencing the kink community. I am a sexual creature and have been told that I live up to the stereo-type about redheads. Believe me when I say, I feel awkward about being unable to reach orgasm. Prior to surgery, the frequency of orgasms for me decreased to non-existant. Unfortunately, due to a combination of being fully function while on Hormone Therapy right up until surgery mixed with constant "tucking", I rended myself virtually in capable orgasm. (For those pre-op or about to start on hormones, I should clarify as a head's up factor: the old expression "stop making silly faces or your face will stick that way" is based upon truth. Skin tissue will adapt to long term shifts. The tucking downwards created a downward pull on the tissue down there. This resulted in a pull that literally prevented me from getting it up. Since I was fully functional, the two pulls in direction caused a painful sensation as I started to get aroused. The pain would overwhelm the arousal and break the stimulation.) Between my 7-15 months on hormones (surgery for me was at the 15th month mark of hormone therapy), I had maybe two orgasms. An occurance that was unusal for myself. Although after the event of being with a woman I became extremely depressed before transitioning, I was easily able to become lost in being with another woman because it meshed with my own sexual orientation. I am now at the point where I cannot remember what orgams feel like.

Everything is functional in vagina town, I am naturally a little wetter than most XY women from what my transition doctor tells me (benefits of a Transsexual-specialing GP having previous experience as a Gynecologist). I was basically advised that I am in the category of "heavier" volume in terms of natural wetness. Lube is not always necessary for me depending upon the type of play but never ignored because of that factor. I basically had to stop buying white panties after surgery to compensate for staining. While aroused, I do become wet and wetter. The thing that has changed from what I remember is the orgasmic build up. In the few experiences ("what some might call sex") that I have had so far with women, I have not felt the build up of orgasmic energies or a release or orgasmic energies. I think I might have had an orgasm as a result of sex a week before my one year post-op due to a feeling of being slightly dizzy and an increase in being energetic. Nonetheless, I did not feel anything orgasmic-like.

Currently, attempts at masturbation only serve to disappoint me. I cannot seem to arouse myself. I cannot seem to find any kind of pattern of touching myself that provokes euphoric. When I am being aroused by other women, I experience waves of build up in stimulation which without warning can and almost always disappear at random. I cannot establish can link in between what feels good because somethings only seem to work as a result of a chain of actions. It is upsetting me to no end.

It has almost been a year and a half since surgery and I am still without orgasm. So, its been like two years for me. I need help and advise. Pretty please with sugar on top. Do not worrying about censoring responses, I am used to hearing at length and in high detail about the sex lifes of my friends (most of whom I have seen naked.)


~ Ally

[girl_ashley]

It irks me every time when someone labels their type of posts like this as "*Explicit*" or "*Possible TMI*" or something similar.  Come on folks, we are talking about our bodies, can't we just be frank about these kinds of subjects without the fear of the moderators?

To answer your question, I think this is just something you are just going to have to try and experiment with and try to further explore your sexuality to try and reach orgasm.  While the technique to make us orgasm capable has gotten a whole lot better than a decade ago, it's still not perfect and unfortunately some trans women come out of surgery and are unable to attain orgasm.  This is the risk we take when we go into surgery.  Also compounding the issue is that you were not experiencing orgasms while you were on HRT before surgery.  The best way to be orgasmic after surgery is to keep your nerves exercised by continuing to have orgasms.

I hope that you are able to find your way to experiencing orgasms again.

[Kristyn]

Unfortunately, due to a combination of being fully function while on Hormone Therapy right up until surgery mixed with constant "tucking", I rended myself virtually in capable orgasm. (For those pre-op or about to start on hormones, I should clarify as a head's up factor: the old expression "stop making silly faces or your face will stick that way" is based upon truth. Skin tissue will adapt to long term shifts. The tucking downwards created a downward pull on the tissue down there. This resulted in a pull that literally prevented me from getting it up. Since I was fully functional, the two pulls in direction caused a painful sensation as I started to get aroused.

For me, it was the opposite.  While tucked, not only could I get aroused, I could orgasm as well

Everything is functional in vagina town, I am naturally a little wetter than most XY women from what my transition doctor tells me (benefits of a Transsexual-specialing GP having previous experience as a Gynecologist). I was basically advised that I am in the category of "heavier" volume in terms of natural wetness. Lube is not always necessary for me depending upon the type of play but never ignored because of that factor. I basically had to stop buying white panties after surgery to compensate for staining. While aroused, I do become wet and wetter. The thing that has changed from what I remember is the orgasmic build up.

Much the same with me.  I wonder if it has something to do with Brassard's technique.  I on the other hand, have no problem with orgasms.  The irony is that I could care less for them.

Currently, attempts at masturbation only serve to disappoint me. I cannot seem to arouse myself. I cannot seem to find any kind of pattern of touching myself that provokes euphoric. When I am being aroused by other women, I experience waves of build up in stimulation which without warning can and almost always disappear at random. I cannot establish can link in between what feels good because somethings only seem to work as a result of a chain of actions. It is upsetting me to no end.

To be quite honest, it sounds like you are just trying too hard.  Let it go.  Let it come naturally to you.  As for your sex partners--fake it until you can--many natal women do.

(most of whom I have seen naked.)

Not even sure why this is relevant.   

[juliekins]

Sorry to hear about your troubles, Ally.

You didn't mention dilation, or use of a vibrator. Orgasm without a vibrator is difficult for many post-op women, much less GG's.

Do you find that you are aroused while looking at pictures or video's? These may help. Have you tried different forms of stimuli and/or partners?

Another couple of possibilities would be to rule out both medical and psychological issues. Having a full physical and exam may be in order, as well as meeting with a sex specialist. Stresses in your life can inhibit orgasm, as well as a rejection in the end results of your GRS.

[juliemac]

I found the best thing was just to play, re-explore and try new tecchniques.
I also found a "bullet" quite a lot of fun.

Its probably not going to be the same in your head pre-op, but with time and practice.

Have fun!

[Ann Onymous]

CAUTION: here be graphic materials...or, if we were on the air, this is where the parental advisory gets posted that "Folks, there may be material of a graphic sexual nature."

Everything is functional in vagina town, I am naturally a little wetter than most XY women from what my transition doctor tells me (benefits of a Transsexual-specialing GP having previous experience as a Gynecologist). I was basically advised that I am in the category of "heavier" volume in terms of natural wetness. Lube is not always necessary for me depending upon the type of play but never ignored because of that factor. I basically had to stop buying white panties after surgery to compensate for staining. While aroused, I do become wet and wetter.

Brassard grad chiming in here (from one of his early classes)...but yeah, much of what you just described there falls in a 'been there, done that' category. 

The thing that has changed from what I remember is the orgasmic build up. In the few experiences ("what some might call sex") that I have had so far with women, I have not felt the build up of orgasmic energies or a release or orgasmic energies. I think I might have had an orgasm as a result of sex a week before my one year post-op due to a feeling of being slightly dizzy and an increase in being energetic. Nonetheless, I did not feel anything orgasmic-like.

Currently, attempts at masturbation only serve to disappoint me. I cannot seem to arouse myself. I cannot seem to find any kind of pattern of touching myself that provokes euphoric. When I am being aroused by other women, I experience waves of build up in stimulation which without warning can and almost always disappear at random. I cannot establish can link in between what feels good because somethings only seem to work as a result of a chain of actions. It is upsetting me to no end.

You may be focusing too much on the actual event of orgasm itself which induces the female version of performance anxiety.  It is also possible that you need more than clitoral stimulation.  That being said, dilation does not induce for me, but digital penetration can induce nirvana-like states.  Likewise, oral will get me there as well, although it takes a little longer...my partners have found that some foreplay involving some non-genital sweet spots (the back of the neck gets me all goose-bumpy) before going oral can reduce the tongue time necessary to induce.     

Everybody is different.  You may find that a few sessions with a sex therapist would actually help get over some mental blocks that could also be present.  You would not be the first person they had seen who had anxiety issues and you may not even be the first post-op they had dealt with. 

[girl_ashley]

CAUTION: here be graphic materials...or, if we were on the air, this is where the parental advisory gets posted that "Folks, there may be material of a graphic sexual nature."

Is this really necessary?  Really??

[Ann Onymous]

Is this really necessary?  Really??

given the discussion about sexuality, it would appear to be necessary to at least give an illusion of maintaining compliance with Rule 17 of the ToS.  So yes, I felt it was necessary.

[Kristyn]

On the subject of vibrators.  I picked this one up:

http://en.lelo.com/index.php?collectionName=femme&groupName=LIV

It's pretty cool because it has a number of different settings, two being a pulsing action which I find to be quite a change from a steady RAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHH!.  It's also rechargeable and quiet.  Runs about a hundred bucks.  Also, you may want to try stimulation around the mons area over straight clitoris stimulation.  Sometimes that can be more effective.   

Also, I like the EXPLICIT warnings--gets me to click on the buttons!!!!! 

[AllyKat]

It irks me every time when someone labels their type of posts like this as "*Explicit*" or "*Possible TMI*" or something similar.  Come on folks, we are talking about our bodies, can't we just be frank about these kinds of subjects without the fear of the moderators?

To answer your question, I think this is just something you are just going to have to try and experiment with and try to further explore your sexuality to try and reach orgasm.  While the technique to make us orgasm capable has gotten a whole lot better than a decade ago, it's still not perfect and unfortunately some trans women come out of surgery and are unable to attain orgasm.  This is the risk we take when we go into surgery.  Also compounding the issue is that you were not experiencing orgasms while you were on HRT before surgery.  The best way to be orgasmic after surgery is to keep your nerves exercised by continuing to have orgasms.

I hope that you are able to find your way to experiencing orgasms again.

Sorry, I am new to this forum. On top of that, I witnessed it used being used in other topics. I did so not in fear of other moderators but in concern of the potential youth using this form. Past that, I cannot change the past so hindsight is not advise.

To be quite honest, it sounds like you are just trying too hard.  Let it go.  Let it come naturally to you.  As for your sex partners--fake it until you can--many natal women do.

I may fall prey to the whole trying too hard. In terms of that last point, I have never had been with a woman whose been able to fake it in front of with me and I am not comfortable with doing it to another person. I honestly felt is was about the rudest thing to be done to.

You didn't mention dilation, or use of a vibrator. Orgasm without a vibrator is difficult for many post-op women, much less GG's.

Other than healing up the dilator later at a rather fast rate, I do my single dilation a week. I have never felt any kind of stimuli during dilations.

I own a lovely Lelo Gigi. The roommate that I had got me hooked on the concept of it. So convienent not having to deal with batteries. The vibrator poses more questions than answers. I have moments of things "seeming" to work for me than it fades away. Nonetheless, it is the toy that has brought me the most pleasure so far. It is so my favorite as a result.

Do you find that you are aroused while looking at pictures or video's? These may help.

Have you tried different forms of stimuli and/or partners?

I am not sure how to address this question. It is rather vague.

Another couple of possibilities would be to rule out both medical and psychological issues. Having a full physical and exam may be in order, as well as meeting with a sex specialist. Stresses in your life can inhibit orgasm, as well as a rejection in the end results of your GRS.

I am starting to consider this. I am currently living within a smaller community for the next couple of months and am not sure that is much of an option where I currently reside.

[vanna]

I hav a different surgeon but I would just like to say my experience really is its soo much in the mind

Its like anticipation and opening up inside that allows you to get where you want to the only way I can explain really so yes remapping: )

Ohh and try a rabbit, one of those will have you begging for mercy

[vanna]

opps
Its a vibrator 

Many women end up divorcing their husbands over prefence. I joke ofc but they are verry effective in helping you along

[Kristyn]

Lol, Kristyn. Will have to remember to mark all my threads EXPLICIT.

  Don't have to, I always read yours.

[AllyKat]

What got me the hottest once was imagining what my lover was going to do to me next, while giving me oral... gosh I want a replay! too bad I broke it off with him.

I am leaning toward a theory that it may be a brain mapping issue. Since I havent had an orgasm yet, my brain hasn't made the association with the feelings leading up to it.

My imagination doesn't seem to be too supportive but I have not had a regular partner so there has been chances to think of what will happen next for a long while.

I'd like to try a vibrator.

Lelo makes amazing vibrators. How do you not own sex toys? I do not understand this concept.

I hav a different surgeon but I would just like to say my experience really is its soo much in the mind

Its like anticipation and opening up inside that allows you to get where you want to the only way I can explain really so yes remapping: )

Ohh and try a rabbit, one of those will have you begging for mercy

I had a small collection of toys so variety is not exactly the issue for me.

btw, I just ordered the Lelo Liv, yaay for me!! I cant wait, I wish it was here tomorrow.

What? No Gigi??

[Kristyn]

Your such a sweetie... wait, are you sayin I'm explicit? lol

btw, I just ordered the Lelo Liv, yaay for me!! I cant wait, I wish it was here tomorrow.

No, not explicit, just interesting with a positive attitude. 

I think think you'll enjoy the Lelo     

[annette]

You need to take the time to discover yourself again.
It took some years to discover myself again, sometimes it's the mood you're in or the position you take.

In my expirience, when you do not think it's important anymore to have an orgasm, you're more relaxed and less focussed on it, than it will happen.
If you are masturbating of having sex just with the goal of having an orgasm, it won't work and it's very dissapointing.
When you do it just to have a good time, it can happen.

Remember, your biggest genitals are between your ears, not between your legs.

Relax sister, relax and it will come on a nice day.

Hugs
Annette

[rejennyrated]

I am sorry to hear of your difficulties. I am struggling to imagine what that would be like as in my experience 90% of orgasm is in the mind anyway so perhaps I don't entirely understand this, however I would comment that female orgasm does feel completely different from the male one.

I can hardly recall what the male one was like after 30 years, and having only ever had a handful, but I seem to recall that it was all fixated in one place with a lot of heavy "pumping" going on... The female one however is more of an all body/ all mind thing... and indeed can even sometimes be brought on for me by stroking other bits of my body in a sexual context.

There is no pumping. There is some spasming of the muscles deep in the vagina and a huge wash of euphoria and "heat" that passes over my entire body. Sometimes bits of my body - arms legs etc will randomly twitch - almost always my back will involuntarily arch, but the focus for the sensation which I seem to recall from male days is not there at all. Sometimes I just get a nice warm feeling and an "oh" - every time is different.

I agree with others that you may be experiencing a block based on your high focus on this. The other thing I do observe is that whereas males seem to be able to "get it up" largely based stimulation for me I have to be in the right mood - which can take maybe up to an hour of skillful foreplay by my partner, and indeed my imagination HAS to be filled with ultra sexy thoughts otherwise I could literally go on for hours with no result.

To me it sounds like you are focusing on the physical and expecting it all to just work based on physical alone. Female sexuality simply doesn't work like that - it is much more multidimensional - or at least it is for me. First you need the right setting and emotional attachment - then extended foreplay to warm up, then you need the sexy thoughts - finally you need the action and then when all these come together BING - it happens.

As a woman things do happen slower. Even masturbation takes a lot of time - I find I often have to construct and imagine in detail the build up. I have to imagine his/her taking me to dinner or film - where we went - what he/she said, the stirrings of my emotions. Then I have to imagine the feelings of excitement and anticipation as my date made their move on me... Next I have to use my own hands to simulate the foreplay and it cant be rushed. Finally I have to fill my head with sexy thoughts and fantasies as I zero in on my genitals and stimulate them gently or hard fast or slow as the mood dictates. Only then does release come - its simply not something you can rush. On average I would say it takes an hour or two... but it is always good when it happens.

I sincerely hope that in that you might be able to find something in my description which helps and I do sympathise.

[FairyGirl]

In the 10 months+ since my surgery I have had exactly 3 self-inflicted orgasms, one vaginal or g-spot and 2 clitoral.  The vaginal was an accident, the clitoral were on purpose but damn, it took a while. I do know that every one of the sexual triggers that I used to find stimulating have exactly zero effect now.  I haven't yet found exactly what my new triggers are, but they probably have something to do with big strong guys having their way with me lol.  Still, there's a lot to be said for finding the right triggers.

Also I've just recently started having sex with my boyfriend and though I've gotten close, I'm not sure if straight vaginal sex will ever be enough for me to produce the big 'O'.  Fortunately however he sees this as a challenge.

[Tammy Hope]

I thought the standard info was that post-op you should not expect to be self lubricating much, if at all (unless colon tissue was used)

How is it he's achieving a self-lubricating vagina (and is there some relationship between that and potentially being less orgasmic than patients of other surgeons or is that reading too much into it?) Do McGinn/Bowers/Thailand/etc girls have good lubrication too and i've simply been misinformed?

[FairyGirl]

Tammy, some of that is explained in a quote I posted a while ago here: https://www.susans.org/forums/index.php/topic,77703.msg699661.html#msg699661

WARNING: Some viewers may find the following material sexually explicit:

Lubrication isn't required at all for a clitoral orgasm. I'm a McGinn girl and so far have at least enough natural wetness to use my #1 dilator at full depth without any additional lubrication. I still need a little help with the larger sizes though. I can only hope it continues to improve as time goes by lol