Susan's Place Transgender Resources

Hello all,

This is a sensitive topic, so leave the thread if you think it will be too triggering for you.

I'm sorry for a controversial and triggering topic, but I really need some advice.  Even though I am trans and know there is nothing wrong with that, I can't help but feel ashamed and disgusted for it.  Let's be honest, most people hate us or think we are freaks.  While there are people who are understanding or totally accepting of the us, they are few and far between.  Even some peoplle that are trans themselves dislike and judge other trans people.  It's just the way of the world.  On here, I'm just a screen name and avatar, not a person with my own individual experience and feelings.  And in the world, I will eventually just be a "->-bleeped-<-" (forgive me for the term, but this is how some people see us) without any distinctions about who I am as a person and how I behave in the world. This kills me.  It makes me hate myself for being something I have no control over.  If I could have avoided this, I would have.  Simple enough. However, I don't feel I can.  It will always be part of who I am, no matter how much I try to erase it.  And that's why I put so much stock into passing.  Because if I don't pass 100 percent and someone knows I'm trans, I know they will think terrible things about me without even knowing who I am and my actions in my life.  This is really painful.  Yet it goes beyond that too.  Even if I do pass and no one thinks of me as trans but a normal woman, I'll have to know that deep in my heart those very people hate and despise who I am.  They will have an image of me based on omission of fact.  If they knew, they will judge and hate.  And because I really require approval and validation from others, I will hate myself in turn.  Of course, hiding this fact makes it easier to cope by allowing me to live as me without being judged every second; however, knowing that others can't stand what I am and think terrible things really really upsets me.  This kind of thing makes me even afraid to socialize with other trans people and admit that I am trans in a supportive environment.  Seriously, I even panic in support groups.  It's hard for me to deal with it.  I just want to erase it.  Like transition and then go stealth and forget it ever was a part of me.  Yet, I realize this a problem I need to overcome.  Therefore, I really would like to ask people here for some help and suggestions.  Was there anything that helped you get over your inner transphobia and self hatred?  To someone in my situation, what would you recommend to help them get over this?  I go to therapy, been trying to go to support groups, and actively participate here, but it hasn't gone away.  I'm at a loss, so any suggestions would be appreciated. 

And sorry for any triggering or hurtful impact this thread could have had on others.  I may hate the fact that I am trans and feel ashamed, but that doesn't mean anyone should feel the same way. 

I had this very same issue. Before I recognized my own transgender, I thought transwomen were pathetic and pitiable. Perhaps that was partially due to the fact that I knew deep down why they would do it, and I had a "there but for the grace..." reaction. I.e. if I ever lost control of my desires to be a woman, I'll end up looking like them.

This is really hard.

It helps me to focus on what I've gained:
* I've done something very hard: To become a woman after being a man for more than 50 years.
* I understand the differences between the sexes in ways that no one does who hasn't transitioned.
* There are thousands less fortunate than I. Who don't have the confidence or financial resources to have a smooth transition the way I have. Or who live in areas where hate makes transitioning problematic (or dangerous). I can help them by getting involved in outreach and social change.
* I'm D*mn hot. Don't have much of a face, but love my body.
* Also helps to think about Lana Wachowski, Lynn Conway, Jennifer Finney Boylan, Susan Larson, Billy Tipton, Kristin Beck, and other accomplished, intelligent, and impressive trans people.

All of these helps me like myself a bit better. Good luck. I hope this helps.

I got over trying to get over it. I'm never going to like being trans and once I think I can I'm probably gonna try to be a boy again. Maybe you are just in denial. I always tried to tell myself positive things about trans stuff but fundamentally I just don't and can't want to be this. It's a prison..and being stealth is even more so... I have always been stealth IRL and never having the experience of being publicly trans, never clocked or outed or discriminated against made it that much more terrifying, like you can lose your whole life if you get outed. Like I had to get a sorta invasive medical test yesterday and I sat there angsting over whether or not I was gonna have to out myself to a Dr or nurse or office staff, how much clothing I was gonna have to remove, would we get into a conversation about my gender in front of a busy waiting room etc. Angsting over all these forms that didnt have a place for my specific issues. Like with lab Corp I had to spell out my birth name in earshot of everyone. People can't usually comprehend that I am trans so I am lucky with that but the possibilities are still torture. In the end I just put F on my papers again and covered everything up like always. Its so freaking stupid to live like this. Being a femme cis boy would be soo much better if I could pass. Transition isn't the only option. Being young with no history, dependent, suffering from emotional disorders all while trans is such a ridiculous subhuman status. Nothing is worth it ....

I understand where you're coming from. I used to worry about what other people thought, even if it was just me doing the "thinking" for them. Thing is, you can't really know what someone is thinking unless they tell you...and to be honest, often not even then because they either don't really know or can't say.

At a guess you're spot on about your inner transphobia, you appear to be suffering shame about being who you are and are presuming everyone thinks exactly the same and that it's all focused like a laser beam on you when the only person doing that to you is you. Sure there are haters out there, people who think transgender people are "mentally ill", "abominations" or "possessed by demons" and other such rubbish, personally I regard them as the ones with mental health issues. The one thing that really helped me stop my own internalised transphobia was to acknowledge I had it. It's amazing how much better I felt about myself and other trans people when I decided to reject it.

Have you ever had someone accuse you of thinking something that was furtherest from your mind? It's pretty disconcerting - how did they reach that conclusion? I don't like it when it's done to me so I try to avoid pushing it on to other people, believing I know what people think based on a look, a facial expression, a gesture, a comment when in reality I have no idea. I had no business poking around in other people's minds and even less right to be making up their thoughts for them. I'm still guilty of it but nowhere near as much as I used to be and, combined with dropping the internalised transphobia, it means I'm burning up less mental energy making up negative stories about myself to stick inside their "thoughts".

As for worrying about what other people think - I was once told it was none of my business what other people thought about me. It was a disconcerting statement but I realised if I considered it true that it was nobody's business what I thought, then clearly the reverse was true too. It was more liberating than you can imagine.

Hugs, Grace :)

I have learned to accept that I am unlike most of the people I meet in life and that many of them would find me somewhat creepy (see vid at end) because I'm trans. Being born in the 1950s didn't help matters much; that, and having grown up in a small industrial town...
I went through a period of self-loathing. Eventually, I got over it. I connected with Ellie and began the process of putting the guy whose body I occupy to sleep. I had to. It's a paradoxical dichotomy- I hate being trans, I love being Ellie. Go figure :) Anyways, as I let Ellie out more (the person, the spirit, not Mr. Dressup) and grew to love her, the self-hatred diminished. The past year has been especially good. I still have negative feelings about myself, but it's not because I'm trans, it's because I still feel the need to conceal that fact. I'm out only to a handful of people. That circle will be widening :)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9C4uTEEOJlM (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9C4uTEEOJlM)

Quote from: learningtolive on February 21, 2014, 01:17:58 PM
Let's be honest, most people hate us or think we are freaks.  While there are people who are understanding or totally accepting of the us, they are few and far between.

Respectfully, I disagree. I realize there are many out there who vehemently oppose who we are and what we stand for, but I think there's easily just as many if not more out there who respect one's right to forge their own path towards personal happiness.

QuoteEven some peoplle that are trans themselves dislike and judge other trans people.  It's just the way of the world.

Yes, unfortunately I think that the need to judge one another or comparing oneself against another is often hard-wired into us. It can be overcome though and I think most people try to correct their behavior when they realize when they've made an unfair or hurtful judgement.

QuoteOn here, I'm just a screen name and avatar, not a person with my own individual experience and feelings.  And in the world, I will eventually just be a "->-bleeped-<-" (forgive me for the term, but this is how some people see us) without any distinctions about who I am as a person and how I behave in the world.

I don't think anyone here is so callous as to reduce the others here to screen names and avatars. I've always felt like I've been treated as a real person here. But as for your fears about how the world will see you. I've shared those fears at times. I think a part of me still does. But the most vocal part of me is saying "Who gives a #&@$ what others think?!" If they want to shame and hate me for who I am then that's a problem reflecting on their character. And that hate and shame belongs to them, I don't have to carry it with me. I will choose to surround myself with people who get it, and who are supportive of who I am, which is so much more than just being trans*. I know these people exist because I already have some of them in my life. I think if you look around you will realize you do too.

QuoteThis kills me.  It makes me hate myself for being something I have no control over.  If I could have avoided this, I would have.  Simple enough. However, I don't feel I can.  It will always be part of who I am, no matter how much I try to erase it.  And that's why I put so much stock into passing.  Because if I don't pass 100 percent and someone knows I'm trans, I know they will think terrible things about me without even knowing who I am and my actions in my life.  This is really painful.  Yet it goes beyond that too.  Even if I do pass and no one thinks of me as trans but a normal woman, I'll have to know that deep in my heart those very people hate and despise who I am.  They will have an image of me based on omission of fact.  If they knew, they will judge and hate.  And because I really require approval and validation from others, I will hate myself in turn.

I get this. I too hope to pass, I probably even have an unrealistic expectation of how I want to turn out. I can't decide if this is to satiate my own sarcissistic desires or if it's because I just don't want to deal with crap snap judgements from total strangers. You are right though, being trans or not is something you have no control over. It is very painful, it sucks beyond all suckitude. I almost wish everyone in the world had to know what it was like to be trans without having a practical knowledge that comes from actually being trans. I'm sure there would be a lot more empathy for us out there in such a case. But that is a fantasy. You can't force others to be understanding and be accepting.

I think not passing is a plausible future that one must plan for if they want to transition. They need to take steps dealing with it emotionally first and coming to terms with and accepting it as that may be their reality.

Quote...I really would like to ask people here for some help and suggestions.  Was there anything that helped you get over your inner transphobia and self hatred?  To someone in my situation, what would you recommend to help them get over this?  I go to therapy, been trying to go to support groups, and actively participate here, but it hasn't gone away.  I'm at a loss, so any suggestions would be appreciated.

Well, in response I would say that I think one must first analyze where that inner transphobia and hatred stems from. For me, a lot of it stemmed from the belief system I was raised into (Mormon). I had spent the better part of 38 years fighting who I am because I believed it was morally wrong and shameful. In my situation freedom from my inner transphobia came from freedom from the hurtful beliefs I had held for so long. It was a painful process questioning my religion, especially when I realized I no longer believed in it. To have my entire belief system come crashing down at the same time I learned to accept myself for being transgender and that I wanted to transition... it was all a bit much.

Fortunately I have a great therapist that has helped me decompress and sort through all those jumbled feelings. The good thing about having my belief system come crashing down is that I can now rebuild it. I still have many of the same values I held dear before. Love, compassion, being non-judgmental (funny how I thought I was this way before), etc. I can also clearly see that the shame I'd felt for so many years was not my own. That shame belonged to the belief system I was held captive by, and to those that would perpetuate the belief that one should be ashamed for being anything that conflicted with what was their perception of 'normal'. For most of my life that shame fueled my transphobia. And having let go of it has also released me from the bonds of my inner hatred.


I'm not sure if any of this is helpful for you. But I do hope you find a resolution to these feelings you are struggling with. *hugs*

Wow, so, I'm going to give you a little bit of tough love here.

Get over yourself.

Sure, there are some people out there that hate and fear trans* folks of all stripes. There are anti-LGBT bigots out there in the world. There are people that think that dancing is the gateway to hell. There are people who still think that anything that isn't white is below human.

The rest (99.9999% of the world you're likely to encounter) doesn't give a crap.

Most of what you've done is decided that being trans is awful. Sure it's not the best thing on earth but then again neither is Down's Syndrome (less common), Parkinsons (also less common), MS, etc. etc. etc. You've decided that everyone you'll meet thinks that you're a freak. This isn't the case. You're different and if they know that you're trans*, they'll know that. Most people are curious. Most people are compassionate. Most women watch Oprah (no, really) and they've seen the array of all kinds of trans chicks.

You'll find if you actually take the steps to be yourself out in the world that most people don't care. That said, if you want an easier time of it, presentation and presentability is probably going to grease the skids, such as it were, but if not, you'll just be odd. Provided that you're not leering at the other chicks in the restroom, making passes at every half-way-decent looking person who you find attractive, or being creepy™, you'll just be different. If you don't want to be different, please go back to my original point to see where I stand on that issue.

The best advice I've ever gotten from anyone is to 'assume positive intent'. This means, that, unless someone actually comes out and says "WOW, YOU ARE SUCH A FREAK!!!", assume that the words coming out of their mouth are the truth. It's pretty arrogant to think that you've got the sort of omniscience that allows you to know what everyone is thinking. Try some perspective and humility with a good dose of trust. If you run into someone who treats you poorly, make a note of that person and DON'T APPLY THE EXPERIENCE TO ANYONE ELSE.

You know what they say about ASSumptions, don't you?

Also, generalizations (everyone thinks trans people are...) are the mother of all ****ups.

Peace out.

P.S. - I could say more about self-empowerment, realizing that you're a unique snowflake, or just trying to get you in the "I'm right and the hell with everyone else" mindset that you've got to develop being openly trans like myself but, after almost 3,000 comments and no real progress in your self-confidence, I'll just point out that these things are there and that you really need to focus on living life instead of running from it because of being afraid of everything.

But, in my experience, most people I know are accepting of trans* people. I know many straight males who are totally secure with their sexuality who like me as a friend even though they know I'm going to transition. In fact, I know a few straight guys who have called me beautiful or gorgeous and said they would date me if I was a girl, based off a badly photoshopped picture of me with a wig on, so yeah. Personality is truly what makes a person as well. Sure, for a lot of people its weird, but it's always a nice surprise when I come out to people as transgendered (when I express myself online as female) and they tell me that they don't mind, or that they're bi, or that they still love me and will learn to accept it. That's a huge step over thinking I'm a freak.

I don't mean to sound like I'm bragging, but from what people have told me and my own confidence in how I do and will look, feel and act...I will have no trouble passing and probably won't ever be mistaken for a male after my transition, so I doubt people will ever consider me a freak because I'll go stealth. I don't think I'll have to deal with much hate or doubt.

However, society is becoming increasingly more tolerant and accepting. More and more people are coming out of their 'straight' shells to identify with their true sexualities and genders, and love is slowly, slowly becoming more fluid. So the future for everyone is bright because at this point, there's almost always somebody for everybody who wants to love, and can love themselves.

Also, we're lucky the Internet exists. This generation and future generations are becoming desensitized to life because of the amount of variety the world has to offer. Before the Internet, a lot of people were oblivious to things, and some still are, but allowing people to learn through online-based research and just incidental findings is amazing and has helped the trans* community a lot, I'd say. I wouldn't have found a quarter of the information I got from this website alone from a book or a TV show, which happened to be the biggest things before the Internet, so if anything at least I can attest to the world becoming increasingly better. At least in my own knowledge, experience and opinion.

The future is beautiful and not as bleak as you think it is.

One of the best days of my life came about a year ago, when I was finally able to stop caring about what other people might think of me.   Yes, there are haters out there.  Am I going to allow them to wreck my day or make me want to stay home?  Hell no.  I refuse to let the dregs of humanity win.

Self hatred and inner transphobia are something you actually have control over, and they are unfortunately a by-product of you allowing the ignorami of the world to do damage your psyche.

You are uniquely you, and you don't need to conform to someone else's rules just to appease the mouth breathers.  Never make excuses or apologize for who you truly are inside.   You have a limited time in this lifetime to pack in as much happiness as you can before you assume room temperature, so please forget about what the lower life forms might think.  You weren't going to hang out with them anyway.

I am 100% in the same situation as you. To cope with this is only PASSABILITY and be on SUPER DUPER STEALTH MODE. Nothing more nothing less.

I dont think people hate trans, they think trans people are misunderstood and thats why they hate us. Because what does it means to be transgender, it could mean different things to different people.

Quote from: Ms Grace on February 21, 2014, 02:18:15 PM
I understand where you're coming from. I used to worry about what other people thought, even if it was just me doing the "thinking" for them. Thing is, you can't really know what someone is thinking unless they tell you...and to be honest, often not even then because they either don't really know or can't say.

At a guess you're spot on about your inner transphobia, you appear to be suffering shame about being who you are and are presuming everyone thinks exactly the same and that it's all focused like a laser beam on you when the only person doing that to you is you. Sure there are haters out there, people who think transgender people are "mentally ill", "abominations" or "possessed by demons" and other such rubbish, personally I regard them as the ones with mental health issues. The one thing that really helped me stop my own internalised transphobia was to acknowledge I had it. It's amazing how much better I felt about myself and other trans people when I decided to reject it.

Have you ever had someone accuse you of thinking something that was furtherest from your mind? It's pretty disconcerting - how did they reach that conclusion? I don't like it when it's done to me so I try to avoid pushing it on to other people, believing I know what people think based on a look, a facial expression, a gesture, a comment when in reality I have no idea. I had no business poking around in other people's minds and even less right to be making up their thoughts for them. I'm still guilty of it but nowhere near as much as I used to be and, combined with dropping the internalised transphobia, it means I'm burning up less mental energy making up negative stories about myself to stick inside their "thoughts".

As for worrying about what other people think - I was once told it was none of my business what other people thought about me. It was a disconcerting statement but I realised if I considered it true that it was nobody's business what I thought, then clearly the reverse was true too. It was more liberating than you can imagine.

Hugs, Grace :)

People do this all the time and I realise that it takes confidence not to worry what other people think. LIke all the time i used to worry what I said or what other people think of me. I know it sounds a bit antisocial. But i think too its the only way to get over being trans. Not everyone will agree what we do.

Quote from: suzifrommd on February 21, 2014, 01:45:30 PM
I had this very same issue. Before I recognized my own transgender, I thought transwomen were pathetic and pitiable. Perhaps that was partially due to the fact that I knew deep down why they would do it, and I had a "there but for the grace..." reaction. I.e. if I ever lost control of my desires to be a woman, I'll end up looking like them.

This is really hard.

It helps me to focus on what I've gained:
* I've done something very hard: To become a woman after being a man for more than 50 years.
* I understand the differences between the sexes in ways that no one does who hasn't transitioned.
* There are thousands less fortunate than I. Who don't have the confidence or financial resources to have a smooth transition the way I have. Or who live in areas where hate makes transitioning problematic (or dangerous). I can help them by getting involved in outreach and social change.
* I'm D*mn hot. Don't have much of a face, but love my body.
* Also helps to think about Lana Wachowski, Lynn Conway, Jennifer Finney Boylan, Susan Larson, Billy Tipton, Kristin Beck, and other accomplished, intelligent, and impressive trans people.

All of these helps me like myself a bit better. Good luck. I hope this helps.

Yeah, I have very little self confidence which is probably my big issue.  While it's a bit sad, I feel like I am pretty much damaged goods and trying to get over internal drama which been taking it's toll on me and left me with a broken self esteem.  Plus, I have very little real life support to help me through everything, more opposition than anything.  A lot of you are very strong and independent people.  You guys know how to believe in yourself.  This is something that's a bit foreign to me, but I want it to become just that. Now, I am overcoming some of this to a degree and I've come a long way from where I started, but it's still hard.  This is why my therapist has me working on becoming self reliant on an emotional basis and learning to not care about others.  So, it's not like I'm not trying to develop some confidence and self esteem.  I am..... it's just difficult.

Any tips on how you got to that confident point?

Then there is still the financial problem which has left me in limbo waiting on a particular potential job and searching for a new one in the event that it doesn't pan out. And without money coming in, it's hard, though I saved up enough to make it through May-June while I am job hunting.

Quote from: Ms Grace on February 21, 2014, 02:18:15 PM
I understand where you're coming from. I used to worry about what other people thought, even if it was just me doing the "thinking" for them. Thing is, you can't really know what someone is thinking unless they tell you...and to be honest, often not even then because they either don't really know or can't say.

At a guess you're spot on about your inner transphobia, you appear to be suffering shame about being who you are and are presuming everyone thinks exactly the same and that it's all focused like a laser beam on you when the only person doing that to you is you. Sure there are haters out there, people who think transgender people are "mentally ill", "abominations" or "possessed by demons" and other such rubbish, personally I regard them as the ones with mental health issues. The one thing that really helped me stop my own internalised transphobia was to acknowledge I had it. It's amazing how much better I felt about myself and other trans people when I decided to reject it.

Have you ever had someone accuse you of thinking something that was furtherest from your mind? It's pretty disconcerting - how did they reach that conclusion? I don't like it when it's done to me so I try to avoid pushing it on to other people, believing I know what people think based on a look, a facial expression, a gesture, a comment when in reality I have no idea. I had no business poking around in other people's minds and even less right to be making up their thoughts for them. I'm still guilty of it but nowhere near as much as I used to be and, combined with dropping the internalised transphobia, it means I'm burning up less mental energy making up negative stories about myself to stick inside their "thoughts".

As for worrying about what other people think - I was once told it was none of my business what other people thought about me. It was a disconcerting statement but I realised if I considered it true that it was nobody's business what I thought, then clearly the reverse was true too. It was more liberating than you can imagine.

Hugs, Grace :)

See, I really want to believe this, but I can't connect with it as much as I wish I could. It seems to me that most people that don't pass are judged.  Maybe those who are right in their face won't say anything, but my fear is that they will laugh at them behind their backs. I've seen it before happen to other trans people.  I knew someone that was under the illusion that people either didn't know or care and behind her back people were saying things and calling her by the opposite pronouns, by the way, this is a wonderful person who didn't deserve that crap.  That's why I feel so bad about it because other people are so judgemental.  We all want to believe people like us and accept it, but that isn't always the reality.

Though you are right that we can never really know what people think and maybe my thought structure is the problem.  I usually always jump to the negative conclusion and often I find that negative assumption was wrong.  Perhaps all I need to do is ignore my instincts and stop thinking I know what's happening when I really don't. 

Quote from: sad panda on February 21, 2014, 02:11:44 PM
I got over trying to get over it. I'm never going to like being trans and once I think I can I'm probably gonna try to be a boy again. Maybe you are just in denial. I always tried to tell myself positive things about trans stuff but fundamentally I just don't and can't want to be this. It's a prison..and being stealth is even more so... I have always been stealth IRL and never having the experience of being publicly trans, never clocked or outed or discriminated against made it that much more terrifying, like you can lose your whole life if you get outed. Like I had to get a sorta invasive medical test yesterday and I sat there angsting over whether or not I was gonna have to out myself to a Dr or nurse or office staff, how much clothing I was gonna have to remove, would we get into a conversation about my gender in front of a busy waiting room etc. Angsting over all these forms that didnt have a place for my specific issues. Like with lab Corp I had to spell out my birth name in earshot of everyone. People can't usually comprehend that I am trans so I am lucky with that but the possibilities are still torture. In the end I just put F on my papers again and covered everything up like always. Its so freaking stupid to live like this. Being a femme cis boy would be soo much better if I could pass. Transition isn't the only option. Being young with no history, dependent, suffering from emotional disorders all while trans is such a ridiculous subhuman status. Nothing is worth it ....

I'm very sorry you are going through this.  In my case, it's that I don't want to go through this or be trans, yet I know I am.  In reality, being a gay cis boy would be easier for me in some respect, but it's not who I am even though I've lived it.  That feels like a prison for me.  However, I sympathize with your inner struggle about going stealth.  While I am not there, I imagine I'll be under the same constant fear once I make that attempt.  Mainly because I don't have much love for what I am and know that's true for others.  While I know there is nothing wrong with being trans, I have so much inner transphobia which makes me struggle with liking the fact that I am.  And knowing that I will always be constantly hated isn't very comforting.  I guess the solution is to stop caring.

Quote from: ♡ Emily ♡ on February 21, 2014, 02:23:27 PM
Not sure about demonic possession or mental illness, but I would be fine with "abomination". There are many sorts of them, for sure, so I can could be "cute and fluffy abomination". It is a dirty job, but somebody has to do it!

Yeah, the abomination thing sort of gets to me.  I grew up in a very catholic house and my mothers boyfriend might as well dress like the pope.  Originally when I came out my mother wanted me to talk to the church and go through some sort of conversion therapy.  I don't even want to know what her boyfriend will think once he finds out, though he's totally blind to this stuff as he has yet to figure it out. 

Quote from: EllieM on February 21, 2014, 02:51:59 PM

I have learned to accept that I am unlike most of the people I meet in life and that many of them would find me somewhat creepy (see vid at end) because I'm trans. Being born in the 1950s didn't help matters much; that, and having grown up in a small industrial town...
I went through a period of self-loathing. Eventually, I got over it. I connected with Ellie and began the process of putting the guy whose body I occupy to sleep. I had to. It's a paradoxical dichotomy- I hate being trans, I love being Ellie. Go figure :) Anyways, as I let Ellie out more (the person, the spirit, not Mr. Dressup) and grew to love her, the self-hatred diminished. The past year has been especially good. I still have negative feelings about myself, but it's not because I'm trans, it's because I still feel the need to conceal that fact. I'm out only to a handful of people. That circle will be widening :)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9C4uTEEOJlM (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9C4uTEEOJlM)

I suppose the lesson in this is that experience will cause the feelings to diminish and confidence to grow.  My therapist keeps telling me that I need to start exposing myself to more supportive environments and taking baby steps in supportive areas to develop some inner strength.  Maybe she is right and the more I do that the less bad I will feel.  I've been going to support groups and I'm still struggling but feeliing less bad about being trans.  Maybe I just need to do more of that and allow it to help me grow.

I'm only out to a few people, though it feels like a lot of people know or have guessed it.

@ Alaia

I do have some supportive people in my life, but not many. Obvously the rational choice would be to not care, but it's something that I'm still learning to handle and overcome.  My transphobia comes more from others, so the solution is to get over them.  All over you see people criticizing us or thinking we are freaks in some form.  If there was more of a positive social view, it wouldn't matter as much to me.  It's like being gay.  Like now that the world is more accepting, more gay people are willing to come forward; however, in the past, many preferred repressing or hiding.  I guess the logical choice would be to stop caring what others think and develop a more positive thought structure, but this takes time and work.  I'm in the process of getting there and have made progress, but sometimes it cripples me and reduces me to tears.

Quote from: Victoria Mitchell on February 21, 2014, 04:24:37 PM
Wow, so, I'm going to give you a little bit of tough love here.

Get over yourself.

Sure, there are some people out there that hate and fear trans* folks of all stripes. There are anti-LGBT bigots out there in the world. There are people that think that dancing is the gateway to hell. There are people who still think that anything that isn't white is below human.

The rest (99.9999% of the world you're likely to encounter) doesn't give a crap.

Most of what you've done is decided that being trans is awful. Sure it's not the best thing on earth but then again neither is Down's Syndrome (less common), Parkinsons (also less common), MS, etc. etc. etc. You've decided that everyone you'll meet thinks that you're a freak. This isn't the case. You're different and if they know that you're trans*, they'll know that. Most people are curious. Most people are compassionate. Most women watch Oprah (no, really) and they've seen the array of all kinds of trans chicks.

You'll find if you actually take the steps to be yourself out in the world that most people don't care. That said, if you want an easier time of it, presentation and presentability is probably going to grease the skids, such as it were, but if not, you'll just be odd. Provided that you're not leering at the other chicks in the restroom, making passes at every half-way-decent looking person who you find attractive, or being creepy™, you'll just be different. If you don't want to be different, please go back to my original point to see where I stand on that issue.

The best advice I've ever gotten from anyone is to 'assume positive intent'. This means, that, unless someone actually comes out and says "WOW, YOU ARE SUCH A FREAK!!!", assume that the words coming out of their mouth are the truth. It's pretty arrogant to think that you've got the sort of omniscience that allows you to know what everyone is thinking. Try some perspective and humility with a good dose of trust. If you run into someone who treats you poorly, make a note of that person and DON'T APPLY THE EXPERIENCE TO ANYONE ELSE.

You know what they say about ASSumptions, don't you?

Also, generalizations (everyone thinks trans people are...) are the mother of all ****ups.

Peace out.

P.S. - I could say more about self-empowerment, realizing that you're a unique snowflake, or just trying to get you in the "I'm right and the hell with everyone else" mindset that you've got to develop being openly trans like myself but, after almost 3,000 comments and no real progress in your self-confidence, I'll just point out that these things are there and that you really need to focus on living life instead of running from it because of being afraid of everything.

I don't mind tough love, I'm probably in need of it. Although, while it's true that I am a unique snow flake, I wouldn't say there has been no progress.  I've come out to my family and friends, some co-workers and had developed a positive work environment at the time (may be back next month). Most people have been nice, except family. I've also have been making a lot of changes to my appearance and have been on hormones for a while which is making many people wonder.  what's making me regress a bit here is that I'm coming close to the point where I would like to go full time.  I've set that point by June, but I may go for it in May if I have the resources.  This is what scares me because it's so soon and I don't know how well I will pass at that point and what that will mean for me. I know it shouldn't matter at all what others are thinking and you can't assume, but for some reason I do care.  And while it's true most assumptions can lead to faulty reasoning, I can't help but read all the anti trans things on the internet.  It's all over and it's quite prominent.  What I'm trying to do is to learn not to care that this is the case, but I can't ignore that this is how a large portion of people think.  Being stealth at least shields us from that hate.  Still, you are right that I need to develop a "who gives" attitude and that not everyone feels badly about us.  May I ask, what worked for you?  Seriously, is there any tips you would give to someone coming close to full time.

@Everyone,

If you have any suggestions on how to work on self esteem problems and develop inner confidence I really am open to it.  Believe me, I don't want to feel so damn scared all the time.

I'll get to the other posts but this one has become too long.

It is true most people are accepting, but these are the ones I fear the most! The ones that are demeaning and unaccepting, you already know how they feel, the ones who are accepting you don't know how they feel in certain situations!

This is why I prefer to be stealth....just an example at work today, they were talking about a charity event going on and joked that one of the male volunteers should wear a dress or tutu...everyone laughed and thought he should...including myself. Now take this same situation...with the fact everyone knows I am trans....would they even mention it, and if they did would it be as funny and worse yet would they all look at me when laughing....and this is among many that I know are supportive of gays and probably even trans for that matter.

Now much of this could be my own fears but I have read and seen enough that even if you are 100% accepted as trans...it doesn't mean you are 100% accepted as the gender you are now.

I've always compared it to being on a ship....everyone on the ship knows you are trans and has treated you as the women you are and with the respect anyone else deserves. The ship hits an iceberg LOL....when it comes to loading the life boats and they call for women and children to board first, they stop and tell you you'll have to wait until the women and children board first. This is how I think many people that accept trans feel....they accept us up until a time they feel they don't need to or don't want too.

I get this same feeling from some of the people that know about my transition, they are all accepting and respect me as to who I am now, but there are times.... I have a close neighbor, one of the few I talk too, they happen to be a lesbian couple...small world...but true. Just the other day one of the girls was asking if I had a roof rake (its been a brutal winter here). I told her I did not....she then mentioned that she will need to get someone to get the snow off their roof. I told her I had to get on my roof and shovel it off myself!! She didn't ask me to do hers but I think she may have if I didn't mention that I couldn't help because I wasn't feeling good....damned near killed me to do mine! I sometimes get the feeling that they are quick to ask me to help on things that a man could do better with the attitude "hell she use to be a man"

I can only imagine how I would be treated at work if everyone knew. Even now there are few men that are lazy and refuse to help anyone...especially a woman. If they knew of my past they would just assume I don't need any help since I use to be a man...the thing is I know so many women that are much stronger than me but that wouldn't even matter.

Because I am stealth (for the most part) my life is fairly boring, its pretty much the same as it was before....still have to pick up groceries, get gas, go to work......the only difference is that I am now a women, and that is fun!!If I had to do all this as a trans women...I can say it would come with much anxiety.

One of the actors in the movie "Dallas Buyers Club" Jared Letto plays a trans women. In order to understand his character he went out in public as his character....he was very passable but I am sure very apprehensive. Because of that he was noticed more as a trans women than a cis....he mentioned that he couldn't imagine getting looked at like this constantly.....to tell you the truth either could I....and for the most part most trans don't get looked at like he did, they just blend in!!!

Quote from: Just Shelly on February 21, 2014, 05:52:08 PM
It is true most people are accepting, but these are the ones I fear the most! The ones that are demeaning and unaccepting, you already know how they feel, the ones who are accepting you don't know how they feel in certain situations!

This is why I prefer to be stealth....just an example at work today, they were talking about a charity event going on and joked that one of the male volunteers should wear a dress or tutu...everyone laughed and thought he should...including myself. Now take this same situation...with the fact everyone knows I am trans....would they even mention it, and if they did would it be as funny and worse yet would they all look at me when laughing....and this is among many that I know are supportive of gays and probably even trans for that matter.

Now much of this could be my own fears but I have read and seen enough that even if you are 100% accepted as trans...it doesn't mean you are 100% accepted as the gender you are now.

I've always compared it to being on a ship....everyone on the ship knows you are trans and has treated you as the women you are and with the respect anyone else deserves. The ship hits an iceberg LOL....when it comes to loading the life boats and they call for women and children to board first, they stop and tell you you'll have to wait until the women and children board first. This is how I think many people that accept trans feel....they accept us up until a time they feel they don't need to or don't want too.

I get this same feeling from some of the people that know about my transition, they are all accepting and respect me as to who I am now, but there are times.... I have a close neighbor, one of the few I talk too, they happen to be a lesbian couple...small world...but true. Just the other day one of the girls was asking if I had a roof rake (its been a brutal winter here). I told her I did not....she then mentioned that she will need to get someone to get the snow off their roof. I told her I had to get on my roof and shovel it off myself!! She didn't ask me to do hers but I think she may have if I didn't mention that I couldn't help because I wasn't feeling good....damned near killed me to do mine! I sometimes get the feeling that they are quick to ask me to help on things that a man could do better with the attitude "hell she use to be a man"

I can only imagine how I would be treated at work if everyone knew. Even now there are few men that are lazy and refuse to help anyone...especially a woman. If they knew of my past they would just assume I don't need any help since I use to be a man...the thing is I know so many women that are much stronger than me but that wouldn't even matter.

Because I am stealth (for the most part) my life is fairly boring, its pretty much the same as it was before....still have to pick up groceries, get gas, go to work......the only difference is that I am now a women, and that is fun!!If I had to do all this as a trans women...I can say it would come with much anxiety.

One of the actors in the movie "Dallas Buyers Club" Jared Letto plays a trans women. In order to understand his character he went out in public as his character....he was very passable but I am sure very apprehensive. Because of that he was noticed more as a trans women than a cis....he mentioned that he couldn't imagine getting looked at like this constantly.....to tell you the truth either could I....and for the most part most trans don't get looked at like he did, they just blend in!!!

Quote from: Chic on February 21, 2014, 04:46:06 PM

Yeah, I could see this.  Even though I am out to people, I'm still treated like a gay guy by some.  Then again, I don't yet have the full time experience.
But, in my experience, most people I know are accepting of trans* people. I know many straight males who are totally secure with their sexuality who like me as a friend even though they know I'm going to transition. In fact, I know a few straight guys who have called me beautiful or gorgeous and said they would date me if I was a girl, based off a badly photoshopped picture of me with a wig on, so yeah. Personality is truly what makes a person as well. Sure, for a lot of people its weird, but it's always a nice surprise when I come out to people as transgendered (when I express myself online as female) and they tell me that they don't mind, or that they're bi, or that they still love me and will learn to accept it. That's a huge step over thinking I'm a freak.

I don't mean to sound like I'm bragging, but from what people have told me and my own confidence in how I do and will look, feel and act...I will have no trouble passing and probably won't ever be mistaken for a male after my transition, so I doubt people will ever consider me a freak because I'll go stealth. I don't think I'll have to deal with much hate or doubt.

However, society is becoming increasingly more tolerant and accepting. More and more people are coming out of their 'straight' shells to identify with their true sexualities and genders, and love is slowly, slowly becoming more fluid. So the future for everyone is bright because at this point, there's almost always somebody for everybody who wants to love, and can love themselves.

Also, we're lucky the Internet exists. This generation and future generations are becoming desensitized to life because of the amount of variety the world has to offer. Before the Internet, a lot of people were oblivious to things, and some still are, but allowing people to learn through online-based research and just incidental findings is amazing and has helped the trans* community a lot, I'd say. I wouldn't have found a quarter of the information I got from this website alone from a book or a TV show, which happened to be the biggest things before the Internet, so if anything at least I can attest to the world becoming increasingly better. At least in my own knowledge, experience and opinion.

The future is beautiful and not as bleak as you think it is.

Yeah, it's true there are a lot of wonderful people.  Many of the people I told, besides family, were shocked that I was struggling with telling them.  Most of them thought it wasn't a big deal and very few of them were shocked.  Maybe I should just let those experiences color my perception rather than the bad ones.

Quote from: Jill F on February 21, 2014, 04:51:54 PM
One of the best days of my life came about a year ago, when I was finally able to stop caring about what other people might think of me.   Yes, there are haters out there.  Am I going to allow them to wreck my day or make me want to stay home?  Hell no.  I refuse to let the dregs of humanity win.

Self hatred and inner transphobia are something you actually have control over, and they are unfortunately a by-product of you allowing the ignorami of the world to do damage your psyche.

You are uniquely you, and you don't need to conform to someone else's rules just to appease the mouth breathers.  Never make excuses or apologize for who you truly are inside.   You have a limited time in this lifetime to pack in as much happiness as you can before you assume room temperature, so please forget about what the lower life forms might think.  You weren't going to hang out with them anyway.

May I ask you what you did to stop caring what others think? 

Quote from: Evolving Beauty on February 21, 2014, 04:57:57 PM
I am 100% in the same situation as you. To cope with this is only PASSABILITY and be on SUPER DUPER STEALTH MODE. Nothing more nothing less.

Yeah, even though passing does matter to me and is the goal, I do think others have a point.  If I only focus on that, I'll still feel this inward self hatred and lack of confidence.  Nothing wrong with stealth, but I really need to get my self esteem up and stop hiding from the fear.

Quote from: izzy on February 21, 2014, 05:48:33 PM
I dont think people hate trans, they think trans people are misunderstood and thats why they hate us. Because what does it means to be transgender, it could mean different things to different people. People do this all the time and I realise that it takes confidence not to worry what other people think. LIke all the time i used to worry what I said or what other people think of me. I know it sounds a bit antisocial. But i think too its the only way to get over being trans. Not everyone will agree what we do.

That's all true.

May I ask you what you did to stop caring what others think?

I didn't really do anything.  I simply ran out of sh%ts to give.  Worrying about something I have no control over is pointless.

Don't let the haters win by stuffing you back in your closet.  I win because if they decide to hate on me, I serve as the middle finger delivered straight to their face.  I'm here, beyond queer, and if you don't like it, the more power to me.

QuoteI'll just point out that these things are there and that you really need to focus on living life instead of running from it because of being afraid of everything.

Right on Victoria !!!!!!!


I lived in fear of what others would say or think of me my whole life. In these moments of deep introspection, I would cry and ask myself why I was born this way and why am I burdened with this. While I was in these deep depressions I would think of myself as an abomination and contemplate ending the misery. I needed to learn to love myself before I could really open up and be who I really am. That day came when I CAME OUT. I found a therapist and with the first openly honest words about myself face to face with another human being I told her that I am transgender and I needed to transition. I was deeply petrified as I never openly told anyone that before, (online does not count). She was so very compassionate and offered to help me. I have since come out to my family and belong to a trans support group focussed on transition. I feel the walls I built up around me over the years crumbling down, and the true me is finally able to show through. It is as though I was able to breath the wonderful scents, see the magical colours, and feel life for the very first time. I still question why I am trans and wish I was not, but I am so focused on living now that I don't give it as much thought.

Am I scared of my future, my career, and what others will think of me ? hell yes !! Will I let that rule my life and force me to crawl back into my hidden cave of denial ? Hell no  !!!

The only way to conquer fear is to face it.  I don't know who said that but my gosh it is sooo true.


Hugs
xxxx

I've been this way all my life. I was aware of the word transgender , but never thought about it too much . I just knew I had this total other self being dragged along. this hidden self caused so many problems with relationships because I was so afraid people would see through the cover. I don't know why I'm like this , but its such a part of me I really can't get rid of. I just came to the point of excepting it and seeing what happens.

Quote from: learningtolive on February 21, 2014, 05:51:08 PM
I don't mind tough love, I'm probably in need of it. Although, while it's true that I am a unique snow flake, I wouldn't say there has been no progress.  I've come out to my family and friends, some co-workers and had developed a positive work environment at the time (may be back next month). Most people have been nice, except family. I've also have been making a lot of changes to my appearance and have been on hormones for a while which is making many people wonder.  what's making me regress a bit here is that I'm coming close to the point where I would like to go full time.  I've set that point by June, but I may go for it in May if I have the resources.  This is what scares me because it's so soon and I don't know how well I will pass at that point and what that will mean for me. I know it shouldn't matter at all what others are thinking and you can't assume, but for some reason I do care.  And while it's true most assumptions can lead to faulty reasoning, I can't help but read all the anti trans things on the internet.  It's all over and it's quite prominent.  What I'm trying to do is to learn not to care that this is the case, but I can't ignore that this is how a large portion of people think.  Being stealth at least shields us from that hate.  Still, you are right that I need to develop a "who gives" attitude and that not everyone feels badly about us.  May I ask, what worked for you?  Seriously, is there any tips you would give to someone coming close to full time.

H'okay.

So, yay forward progress and all that but your insecurities are the main issue at hand. Internalized transphobia comes from an internalized belief that being trans is 'a bad thing'. Let's start there. Larter in your reply, you mention how you see all these horrible anti-trans things coming up over and over again in the media. I will say, without reservation, that those stories are stories because they are the outliers in today's first-world civilization (we won't talk about second and third world... they still have a long way to go before they get to anything like enlightenment).

I'll suggest that you take those cases for what they are. If the incidence of GD where the MtF transitions is even 1/3 the craziest large number out there for GD in general (1:42,000) then that's something around 3,000* MtF's who have transitioned in the US alone. That number is, of course, ridiculous but it goes to show that math is silly. So, take that into account and realize that you've got *thousands* of girls out there living their lives, making a living, and doing just fine. The cases where discrimination play out are those in which the person is vulnerable in a number of ways (poverty, lack of education, lack of family support, etc etc etc etc).

So there's a little data to brighten your day.

To your question of how I got over it? Well that's pretty simple. I forced myself through the process of getting out into the world. I pushed through the fear, uncertainty, doubt, and yes, self-loathing that came from early-stage full time and just got the f**k out there! I made friends, I screwed up, I did new things, I joined activities, I did everything that I wanted to do but was afraid of and, little by little, I built a life.

You adapt, you adjust, you move through the various stages of this crazy process but the one thing that I'll tell you is that doing it is the only way to prepare yourself for it. I've never seen a picture of you so I can't remark on your passability or not but, really, eventually you just stop caring. I'm passable 100% of the time now but when I started F/T, I wasn't even on hormones (seriously). You just make yourself as presentable as you can, be who you are, and know that anyone who gives you a weird look has issues within themselves that they need to work on, not you.

Be bold. Be daring. If this is your path, then it is what it is and you'll have to someday so why waste anymore time worrying about it?

*Note, the highest estimates of transitioning in the USA is 1:500 which is probably silly but that'd be 700,000, the other bound on that study was something like 1:2500 or 140,000 which seems actually pretty plausible.

LTL, one of the hardest things I had to do was start believing in myself. I agree with Victoria but let me put this in a bit of context for you.

Today I was at lunch with a friend (my spouse who will eventually just be my housemate but we're still married for the moment.

When we entered the restaurant, the hostess asked if "you ladies" wanted a table or booth. We chose a booth. The waiter addressed me as ma'am the entire time. He asked "Do you ladies want separate checks or one check today?" when we were ready to go. People around us were oblivious to me.

Except two guys across the way. I saw them looking at me and one was looking at me a lot and his expressions seemed to vary a lot so I don't think he was thinking "hot bod" but was having more of a WTF moment with confusion.

Finally, I looked at him while he was looking away, and when he looked back at me again, I gave him my best "come get some, baby" smile. That was the first time I've seen a man blush and look away from me so fast. I didn't notice him stealing any more glances the rest of the meal and he pointedly looked away when he got up to leave.

I couldn't stop him from thinking whatever about me. It's not my responsibility to control his thoughts so I don't worry about it. But I would not let him embarrass me simply for existing. By throwing that smile at him, I showed him that I didn't give a damn about what he thought of me and was happy and proud of myself.

I'm "passing" (how I hate that term) more and more as time goes on, but for me I've reached a place where I don't care how much I pass (and I've been told that I can pass very well when I really try) and am simply going to be me. As I shed "him" and let the real me shine more and more, I imagine that the perception of me will continue to shift as well. As HRT does its work, and eventually when I seek FFS, I'm going to look like any other woman my age, or maybe even better.

So grab it and run with it! Be yourself and don't let someone else's phobias embarrass you. Those are their problem, not yours.


P.S. Note to Victoria: The 1 in 2500 transitioners number originated with Lynn Conway who obtained the number of sex reassignment surgeries done by the bulk (not even all!) of the major SRS surgeons in the US over a period of several years. She then averaged that out, extrapolated, and got that figure. That figure was refined by Lynn Conway and a social scientist who worked with her later. And that's just the number of transitioners who got SRS! There are lots of non-ops (financial reasons or simply don't want it) who transition as well so that number is likely higher. By how much, I wouldn't venture to guess.

I kept everything trans hidden for 50 years. I hated my life. Major depression, shame, guilt, self loathing, and anxiety that came in waves for many years. Hurting people hurt people, and I did my best to inflict my hurt and pain on other people. I was a complete transphobic ->-bleeped-<- online. My inner turmoil was agonizing at times and I spent a lot of time crying in a fetal position. Some days I could function, some days not. This whole "woman thing" that I tried to ignore, deny and suppress my whole life snowballed on me. I finally started gender therapy on 12-2-13. I'm now almost 6 weeks into HRT and my life has changed dramatically. I love myself and my life. I feel better, my brain and mind are more clear and focused than ever before. I don't know if it's the HRT or what, but I no longer give a ->-bleeped-<- what others think. I get to become who I really was inside all those years. And that makes me very happy. And so far, I've only had ONE negative reaction. It's about doing what YOU need to do to be happy. If people don't want to understand, their loss.

Quote from: JordanBlue on February 21, 2014, 07:46:30 PM
I kept everything trans hidden for 50 years. I hated my life. Major depression, shame, guilt, self loathing, and anxiety that came in waves for many years. Hurting people hurt people, and I did my best to inflict my hurt and pain on other people. I was a complete transphobic ->-bleeped-<- online. My inner turmoil was agonizing at times and I spent a lot of time crying in a fetal position. Some days I could function, some days not. This whole "woman thing" that I tried to ignore, deny and suppress my whole life snowballed on me. I finally started gender therapy on 12-2-13. I'm now almost 6 weeks into HRT and my life has changed dramatically. I love myself and my life. I feel better, my brain and mind are more clear and focused than ever before. I don't know if it's the HRT or what, but I no longer give a ->-bleeped-<- what others think. I get to become who I really was inside all those years. And that makes me very happy. And so far, I've only had ONE negative reaction. It's about doing what YOU need to do to be happy. If people don't want to understand, their loss.

Scary.  Apart from the transphobic a*hole part, this is like reading one of my own posts. 

Quote from: Jill F on February 21, 2014, 07:53:12 PM
Scary.  Apart from the transphobic a*hole part, this is like reading one of my own posts.

We've discussed this before, Jill.  8)
So similar it's crazy.  That's why I said before, get yourself on FB, so we can chat.   8)

Quote from: learningtolive on February 21, 2014, 05:51:08 PM
It seems to me that most people that don't pass are judged.

No baby. People that don't pass well LET themselves be judged. They listen to the bile and filth as if it comes from their therapist's mouth. They take to heart bigotry and religious extremism and dwell on it thus producing trans phobia into their psyche. This in turn forms the guilt and other emotions you seem to have. I personally have been quite impressed with the tolerance level I have seen in my situation. Times are changing and things that used to be important have lost their luster. Could I have come out in 1979? Hell no! Did I come out in 2013? Most definitely because the climate is changing with regards to tolerance, acceptance and protection. You have to learn to accept yourself and love yourself because you are an individual, not a carbon copy of everyone else. You are unique, embrace it as it makes you special and distinct.

PS-You are not just an avatar to me girl. I get to know people by the way they talk and the ideas and emotions they put forth. You are a real person and I have seen the love, compassion and the truth you have as inner qualities. I look at you as a sister, not just a logo. :)

Yeah man up OP. Mental illness is not a real thing. /sarcasm

Please see a therapist about your self esteem. Not a gender therapist, one who specializes in fears and anxiety and stuff. If you find the right one for you it could really help. It takes real world interaction with a patient, empathetic person to start overturning these deep beliefs. Hugs to you and I hope you will find the strength to get help.

Quote from: sad panda on February 21, 2014, 08:22:31 PM
Yeah man up OP. Mental illness is not a real thing. /sarcasm

Say what!! Please explain that statement. Sarcasm when she is suffering and asking for help? I sure hope I misinterpreted this. If so I apologize ahead of time.

Quote from: Jessica Merriman on February 21, 2014, 08:32:12 PM
Say what!! Please explain that statement. Sarcasm when she is suffering and asking for help? I sure hope I misinterpreted this. If so I apologize ahead of time.

I said that about how so many people just tell the OP to get over it, stop whining etc which seems to be the knee jerk response here because apparently nobody believes that emotional regulation problems and anxieties are real and can be crippling. It's like telling someone with cancer to walk it off. There are actually ways of working on self esteem issues but it's so unhelpful to just tell people to get over it or just stop worrying...

Quote from: learningtolive on February 21, 2014, 01:17:58 PM
Hello all,

This is a sensitive topic, so leave the thread if you think it will be too triggering for you.

I'm sorry for a controversial and triggering topic, but I really need some advice.  Even though I am trans and know there is nothing wrong with that, I can't help but feel ashamed and disgusted for it.  Let's be honest, most people hate us or think we are freaks.  While there are people who are understanding or totally accepting of the us, they are few and far between.  Even some peoplle that are trans themselves dislike and judge other trans people.  It's just the way of the world.  On here, I'm just a screen name and avatar, not a person with my own individual experience and feelings.  And in the world, I will eventually just be a "->-bleeped-<-" (forgive me for the term, but this is how some people see us) without any distinctions about who I am as a person and how I behave in the world. This kills me.  It makes me hate myself for being something I have no control over.  If I could have avoided this, I would have.  Simple enough. However, I don't feel I can.  It will always be part of who I am, no matter how much I try to erase it.  And that's why I put so much stock into passing.  Because if I don't pass 100 percent and someone knows I'm trans, I know they will think terrible things about me without even knowing who I am and my actions in my life.  This is really painful.  Yet it goes beyond that too.  Even if I do pass and no one thinks of me as trans but a normal woman, I'll have to know that deep in my heart those very people hate and despise who I am.  They will have an image of me based on omission of fact.  If they knew, they will judge and hate.  And because I really require approval and validation from others, I will hate myself in turn.  Of course, hiding this fact makes it easier to cope by allowing me to live as me without being judged every second; however, knowing that others can't stand what I am and think terrible things really really upsets me.  This kind of thing makes me even afraid to socialize with other trans people and admit that I am trans in a supportive environment.  Seriously, I even panic in support groups.  It's hard for me to deal with it.  I just want to erase it.  Like transition and then go stealth and forget it ever was a part of me.  Yet, I realize this a problem I need to overcome.  Therefore, I really would like to ask people here for some help and suggestions.  Was there anything that helped you get over your inner transphobia and self hatred?  To someone in my situation, what would you recommend to help them get over this?  I go to therapy, been trying to go to support groups, and actively participate here, but it hasn't gone away.  I'm at a loss, so any suggestions would be appreciated. 

And sorry for any triggering or hurtful impact this thread could have had on others.  I may hate the fact that I am trans and feel ashamed, but that doesn't mean anyone should feel the same way.

For me it is even harder , as 'the science' force me to think that i am not a transexual girl but a transgender or transgenderist . As a transexual i would have many things to fight against but as a transgender it is even harder : considering yourself a girl , wanting and enjoying to be one , and then having the science telling you that you are a man . I felt really ok when i thought i was a transexual , really no guilt at all, only some sadness about my looks and the effort of transition . Now , i really feel ashamed , guilty and all that stuff . I would love to die but i am too weak to kill myself , my life is a miserable place where pain dominates everything and i honestly can't see a happy future . Being a 'male brain' who wants to be/feel like  a girl it is so much worse for me than being a trans girl . Every day i look for some validation , i even dream so often about my digit ratio changing in a feminine one , but nothing happens . Only sadness and tears for too much time now . I don't know what should i do , I even feel the guilt and pressure to inhibit my inner feelings , as i think i hurt the transexual comunity itself . The transition effort and the 'would i pass?' problems seem so easy to deal with right now , the big problem is that i hate myself ..
I am sorry that i couldn't help you and i hope i didn't make it worse , but i felt the need to share my struggle and pain .

Quote from: sad panda on February 22, 2014, 02:32:31 AM
I said that about how so many people just tell the OP to get over it, stop whining etc which seems to be the knee jerk response here because apparently nobody believes that emotional regulation problems and anxieties are real and can be crippling.

What forum have you been on. No one here would say these things and you know it. We spend a lot of time trying to understand and provide the best insight we can. I have seen our family members exercise quite a bit of tolerance, patience and understanding in trying to help others. I for one do not appreciate the above comments at all and it just seems to me you are trying to stir the pot with this type of inflammatory rhetoric.  I will not condone statements like those above from anyone here from new members to well established members without objecting and making my feelings known.

My apologies to LTL for getting off topic.

QuoteClaudia wrote:
For me it is even harder , as 'the science' force me to think that i am not a transexual girl but a transgender or transgenderist . As a transexual i would have many things to fight against but as a transgender it is even harder : considering yourself a girl , wanting and enjoying to be one , and then having the science telling you that you are a man . I felt really ok when i thought i was a transexual , really no guilt at all, only some sadness about my looks and the effort of transition . Now , i really feel ashamed , guilty and all that stuff . I would love to die but i am too weak to kill myself , my life is a miserable place where pain dominates everything and i honestly can't see a happy future . Being a 'male brain' who wants to be/feel like  a girl it is so much worse for me than being a trans girl . Every day i look for some validation , i even dream so often about my digit ratio changing in a feminine one , but nothing happens . Only sadness and tears for too much time now . I don't know what should i do , I even feel the guilt and pressure to inhibit my inner feelings , as i think i hurt the transexual comunity itself . The transition effort and the 'would i pass?' problems seem so easy to deal with right now , the big problem is that i hate myself ..
I am sorry that i couldn't help you and i hope i didn't make it worse , but i felt the need to share my struggle and pain .

oh hun, there is so much sadness and pain in your post, and not to take away from LTL, but I am not sure I understand. What do the arbitrary labels transgender or transsexual have to do with  who you are ? There is so much room for interpretation in gender science that it really depends on what your heart is truly telling you. The fact that you feel miserable as a male and knowing in your heart you are female is all that matters. As for the digit ratio, please understand  that a great number of women have digit ratios in the male quadrant and men in the women. Digit ratio is not a proven science, just as height is not an indication of gender.

How do you feel you hurt the transsexual community? By being yourself dear Claudia you can only enrich our community.

many hugs of support
 

Getting over self hatred and inner transphobia? Just get over it by accepting yourself. Yeah we all have inner guilt. First time a guy up and kissed me while drinking, I was appalled, felt guilty because I wasn't gay in the least little bit even though I wanted so much to be female. Then I realized that I enjoyed it, still felt guilty about it but enjoyed it nonetheless and besides girls kissed guys all the time. Hated myself for it? Kind of sort of but not really. I realized it didn't really matter and since I wanted to be female anyway so what. I didn't hurt anyone so there was nothing to feel guilty about or hate myself for.

As for passing dear, I see plenty of ciswomen that can't pass as female that actually look more masculine than transwomen. And yes, we would all love to be passable 100% of the time but we as a species scrutinize one another especially on the basis of looks and like I said, I've seen ciswomen that have a hard time passing for female and know for a fact they're indeed female. So don't hate yourself for that. As for inner transphobia, you are who you are. Just go with it and start accepting yourself and focus your mind more on woman instead of trans.

Quote from: Jessica Merriman on February 22, 2014, 06:27:19 AM
What forum have you been on. No one here would say these things and you know it. We spend a lot of time trying to understand and provide the best insight we can. I have seen our family members exercise quite a bit of tolerance, patience and understanding in trying to help others. I for one do not appreciate the above comments at all and it just seems to me you are trying to stir the pot with this type of inflammatory rhetoric.  I will not condone statements like those above from anyone here from new members to well established members without objecting and making my feelings known.

My apologies to LTL for getting off topic.

Jessica:
I agree - TRANSGENDER is serious business, but the OP has almost 3 thousand posts.  I was the poster child for hating myself because I'm trans.  I raged against it for a very LONG time. I wanted to die. I was the most negative person around. 
Self acceptance isn't easy, it's a long HARD road.  But, when you're faced with either accepting yourself or hating yourself, there's only one option that makes sense.   We're our own worst critics.  The biggest problem is not trans hate in our society, it's lack of education.  I have every reason to believe I'll never make a passable female.  But I now choose to make the best of my situation, stay positive, and become the best person I can become.  IMHO, that's what the OP needs to do.

Quote from: ana on February 22, 2014, 08:34:19 AM
oh hun, there is so much sadness and pain in your post, and not to take away from LTL, but I am not sure I understand. What do the arbitrary labels transgender or transsexual have to do with  who you are ? There is so much room for interpretation in gender science that it really depends on what your heart is truly telling you. The fact that you feel miserable as a male and knowing in your heart you are female is all that matters. As for the digit ratio, please understand  that a great number of women have digit ratios in the male quadrant and men in the women. Digit ratio is not a proven science, just as height is not an indication of gender.

How do you feel you hurt the transsexual community? By being yourself dear Claudia you can only enrich our community.

many hugs of support

Thanks a lot for your support , i really need it and i really appreciate it

My mind is a painful and miserable place , and i hope i am wrong in how i think , but lately i got this idea that i am not worhty of being called a (trans)girl , because apparently i have a masculinized brain . I tend to feel like an intruder , i feel like i hurt the image of the transexual comunity by being a fake-girl , and i feel really guilty and sad about all this stuff , sometimes i feel i should either end my life or try and inhibit what i feel and live as a 'boy' .
Another sister kindly reassured me too that the digit ratio isn't that accurate , but anyway , for me , it would've been better to have the female ratio .. 

Anyway , thanks again for support and i am sorry that i often tend to share here my depressive  thoughts . 

Apologies in advance if I don't know many of you well since I'm new here, but I want to give you all big hugs.

I honestly love being trans. If I had to do it over again I wouldn't trade my experience for anyone else's. I love being able to perceive from both sides of the gender divide. I love knowing I have the courage to be true to myself in the face of opposition. I love knowing that my experiences are unique, and that my perspective of the world is one that few people have. Of course it hurts when people judge me for who I am, but it also means that the feeling of being seen and loved for everything I am is all the more wonderful.

I've been fortunate to have that kind of love from family, friends, and lovers. And I know it's related to passing, and that sucks, but I also know that the people I've affected because of my transition have become strong trans allies through knowing me, and that's a good feeling. And the more of us who come out, especially the ones who people perceive as "normal," the more trans can become a non-issue in a similar way that the gay and lesbian movement has progressed. I'm extremely ambivalent about "passable" transsexuals becoming spokespeople for the whole trans movement, but unfortunately that's the way our media-driven world works.

If you read gay novels like E.M. Forster's Maurice or James Baldwin's Giovanni's Room, you'll find the same sense of self-hatred that people here have been expressing. But it's because of nothing else than that the rest of society sees us as awful for being who we are, in the same way that gay people before the 1970's were. And it's up to us to change the way society perceives us, and I'm sorry to say that it's hard to do that while being stealth.

I've gone through periods of being extremely out and periods of being relatively private about being trans. Being out entails a lot of self-sacrifice, and was hard for both me and people close to me. But by being private, I also know that I'm making it more difficult for other people. So I try to be out as much as I can.

This is not to say I'm free of self- or trans-hatred. I still have a hard time interacting with other transwomen. I have a tendency to be insensitive and competitive because I know that my self-esteem as a transwoman is at least partly based on perceiving myself as attractive. I'm working on that, and I'm looking forward to being here more because I hope that we can all support each other and that I can be of help to other people here.

Edit: P.S. My digit ratio is typically male just like Michelle Obama. And no one has ever mentioned it or cared!

Thanks everyone for your thoughts.  I know there will be a point where I will just have to grin and bare it.  It's come very soon, so that's why I'm freaking out.  At this point, I feel like it's so obvious that I'm trans, even in boy mode, that I just get uncomfortable in social situations. Today I asked my sister what she thought and she said there is no way she would take me as a regular guy and doubts anyone else does.  She said it's very obvious that I'm transitioning.  I guess this explains the giggling I often hear in public and the very big smiles.  Maybe I will put up pics to get opinions.  I feel like I don't really pass as a guy anymore, but don't know if I'm far enough to go full time.  I would like to wait until Juneish so I can first tackle my job dilemma and feel stable economically speaking.  But yes gettng out there and living is important.  For what it's worth my therapist and I are talking about exposure therapy to help build up my confidence.

Quote from: sad panda on February 21, 2014, 08:22:31 PM
Yeah man up OP. Mental illness is not a real thing. /sarcasm

Please see a therapist about your self esteem. Not a gender therapist, one who specializes in fears and anxiety and stuff. If you find the right one for you it could really help. It takes real world interaction with a patient, empathetic person to start overturning these deep beliefs. Hugs to you and I hope you will find the strength to get help.

Today my therapist and I discussed my low self esteem and horrible thought patterns. She wants me to start doing self esteem work sheets.  Apparently, I do think the worst case scenario at all times which may explain why people often get frustrated with me or think I'm too paranoid.  I'm just so used to seeing the worst in everything because I have no faith in myself.   And it's true that these issues are deeply rooted into my belief system, so it would make sense to tackle them.

I don't know if I need a second therapist, though I wouldn't be opposed to the idea and my mom wants me to see one.  Maybe I'll look into it.

Quote from: Claudia_FF on February 22, 2014, 04:02:45 AM
For me it is even harder , as 'the science' force me to think that i am not a transexual girl but a transgender or transgenderist . As a transexual i would have many things to fight against but as a transgender it is even harder : considering yourself a girl , wanting and enjoying to be one , and then having the science telling you that you are a man . I felt really ok when i thought i was a transexual , really no guilt at all, only some sadness about my looks and the effort of transition . Now , i really feel ashamed , guilty and all that stuff . I would love to die but i am too weak to kill myself , my life is a miserable place where pain dominates everything and i honestly can't see a happy future . Being a 'male brain' who wants to be/feel like  a girl it is so much worse for me than being a trans girl . Every day i look for some validation , i even dream so often about my digit ratio changing in a feminine one , but nothing happens . Only sadness and tears for too much time now . I don't know what should i do , I even feel the guilt and pressure to inhibit my inner feelings , as i think i hurt the transexual comunity itself . The transition effort and the 'would i pass?' problems seem so easy to deal with right now , the big problem is that i hate myself ..
I am sorry that i couldn't help you and i hope i didn't make it worse , but i felt the need to share my struggle and pain .

You shouldn't feel ashamed for being who you are.  I know it's rich coming from me, but it's something we both need to overcome.  It's okay to be us.  Have you talked to someone about this?  It may help. 

I am not sure "self hatred" is exactly the right phrase for me. "Repression" and "denial" come closer to my own experience. On some level, I have admired transsexuals for decades, but I never wanted to admit to myself that I was one. Looking back on it, I saw that admission as sort of a defeat. In my youth, I was very much into the pop psychology / self improvement thing. I believed that I could completely control the outcome of my life, if I thought the right thoughts and did just the right things. I had these grand career ambitions. I saw any gender issues I might have as utterly incompatible with that, so I tried really hard to will them out of existence. I ran as fast and as far I could to get away from that, but I could never run away from what was inside me.     

I spent a good 50 years living with the shame and guilt about being trans. A lot of history to unlearn that I am still working on. But it is amazing how quickly it crumbles once you start really working at chipping away at it. The remnants of guilt and shame live on mainly due to what I feel are legitimate feelings of guilt over the affect this is having on my wife. Non of this really fits well into the life plans we still look forward to fulfilling.

I think a very large part of getting rid of your own transphobia starts with self acceptance. Acceptance of yourself first as a person, irregardless of gender, followed my self acceptance of transgender state. Oddly, taking ownership of being transgender helped with self acceptance in that I sort of had a scape goat. A concrete reason for why things got screwed up in my life. Acknowledging that and knowing I did not have the right tools yet or learned the right lessons encouraged me on to take the steps I needed to take... WHEN I needed to and the time was right to. About the only schedule I had and forced myself to live up to was to find some sort of support ASAP. Three months and a 90 mile drive later I found the greatest self acceptance technique for me, a fairly unique TG support group.

Before self acceptance comes just feeling comfortable. Just as it is difficult and scary at first to do things or think differently rather than beating yourself up, it is also difficult and scary to venture out into the world presenting as female. Especially right out of the gate! Face it, cis-girls spent their entire life figuring out what works for them, that they feel comfortable with. It takes us a long time too. If you wait for the day that you feel you are 100% passable before leaving the safety of the nest, you are probably going to crash and burn. Seeing some arbitrary date circled on the calendar as your deadline to flip that switch from male to female is only going to increase your angst.

My little tough love bit next.... You are NEVER EVER going to be 100% passable. Especially by your own arbitrary, possibly idealized, standard. Cis women every day get clocked as being trans. Waiting on the checkout line at the grocery store you can like find "something about" every woman there with you. What hope do stand to have. Aesthetic surgeons make a good living based on women feeling they don't live up to some ideal. Plus you have a history. Unless you go off the grid and move across the country, your history will always be there.  As others have pointed out 99.999% of the people around you don't give a rat's ass. At nearly 6ft tall w/o heels, slim, almost always in a skirt or dress I get the ocassional look as I go about my day in rural WV. Still I feel totally alive and am not being shot at. Life is great.

Unfortunately there are few ways to get over that fear. The easy way is to simply revel in the feelings of finally being out in the real world being the real and complete you. That comes with practice, not by a date on a calendar. If your goal is to be fulltime in May, You'd best be almost full-time by now. If your goal is to be as passable as possible, you'd best be approaching or past male fail by now. If you have a driving need to be full-time, you wouldn't much else stop you besides you.

Quote from: JoanneB on February 22, 2014, 01:32:18 PM
I spent a good 50 years living with the shame and guilt about being trans. A lot of history to unlearn that I am still working on. But it is amazing how quickly it crumbles once you start really working at chipping away at it. The remnants of guilt and shame live on mainly due to what I feel are legitimate feelings of guilt over the affect this is having on my wife. Non of this really fits well into the life plans we still look forward to fulfilling.

I think a very large part of getting rid of your own transphobia starts with self acceptance. Acceptance of yourself first as a person, irregardless of gender, followed my self acceptance of transgender state. Oddly, taking ownership of being transgender helped with self acceptance in that I sort of had a scape goat. A concrete reason for why things got screwed up in my life. Acknowledging that and knowing I did not have the right tools yet or learned the right lessons encouraged me on to take the steps I needed to take... WHEN I needed to and the time was right to. About the only schedule I had and forced myself to live up to was to find some sort of support ASAP. Three months and a 90 mile drive later I found the greatest self acceptance technique for me, a fairly unique TG support group.

Before self acceptance comes just feeling comfortable. Just as it is difficult and scary at first to do things or think differently rather than beating yourself up, it is also difficult and scary to venture out into the world presenting as female. Especially right out of the gate! Face it, cis-girls spent their entire life figuring out what works for them, that they feel comfortable with. It takes us a long time too. If you wait for the day that you feel you are 100% passable before leaving the safety of the nest, you are probably going to crash and burn. Seeing some arbitrary date circled on the calendar as your deadline to flip that switch from male to female is only going to increase your angst.

My little tough love bit next.... You are NEVER EVER going to be 100% passable. Especially by your own arbitrary, possibly idealized, standard. Cis women every day get clocked as being trans. Waiting on the checkout line at the grocery store you can like find "something about" every woman there with you. What hope do stand to have. Aesthetic surgeons make a good living based on women feeling they don't live up to some ideal. Plus you have a history. Unless you go off the grid and move across the country, your history will always be there.  As others have pointed out 99.999% of the people around you don't give a rat's ass. At nearly 6ft tall w/o heels, slim, almost always in a skirt or dress I get the ocassional look as I go about my day in rural WV. Still I feel totally alive and am not being shot at. Life is great.

Unfortunately there are few ways to get over that fear. The easy way is to simply revel in the feelings of finally being out in the real world being the real and complete you. That comes with practice, not by a date on a calendar. If your goal is to be fulltime in May, You'd best be almost full-time by now. If your goal is to be as passable as possible, you'd best be approaching or past male fail by now. If you have a driving need to be full-time, you wouldn't much else stop you besides you.

I'd say a very knowledgeable reply

I had a considerable degree of transphobia and it's been hard for me to change this...it is so controverse, but someway I feel better knowing that I am not the only one.

I apologize for what I am going to write. I want to be clear that this is not me anymore...but nontheless I think this is the way most people see us.

During all my life I learned to hide from my real self and, with no perspectives of changing my life, I ended hating the desires and feelings I had. I hated who I was and I hated lying to myself. I though I was a freak for crossdressing, and a liar for playing as a female on virtual worlds like Second Life. I felt I was mentally ill for desiring to be a woman and for envying them. I felt I was a pervert because I was sexual attracted to men and I wanted to be the woman on a relationship. I knew I wasn't a gay man and the idea of being some kind of gay man was unthinkable for me.

Everytime I saw a transvetite, I looked with a degree of admiration and hate. Once almost all the transvetites I could see were hardly passable, I grew disgusted of them. I thought of them as perverted and ridiculous men trying to be women. Their masculine voices were repulsive to me, as their male faces.

But the truth is that I was afraid that one day I would become one of them. Someone that could be seem as a freak and a pervert working as a prostitute. The idea of being a man on womens clothes was one of the main reasons that made me run away from all my feelings for years. I couldn't bare that. Or I pass as a woman or I'll better stay this way...or I'll kill myself (that idea was attractive to me sometimes).

Only when I realized that being transexual, or transvetite, or crossdresser or whatever...is not a choice, but a need, only then I started accepting myself.

After lot of research on the internet and after watching movies about the theme I could see that transexuals and transvetites are much more than the few transvetites I could see working as prostitutes. Most trans people are living normal lives. I didn't know that...and then I realized how terribly wrong I was. I started considering the idea of transitioning, but I was still so uncertain...I only wanted to transition if I had the possibility of passing as a female. I still don't know what I am going to do if I cannot pass....but now I know that this doesn't matter at all.

But then HRT changed my life again. It cleared my mind and helped me to see that even if I cannot pass, even if society sees me as a freak...what really matters is the way you feel with yourself. If I cannot pass, then I'd rather live hiding in my home as a woman than walking on the streets as a man.

Today I see us as beautiful beings...besides all our difficulties, we have the unique experience of being both man and woman. We are unique and special. If I could travel back to the past I would like to tell me that (and slap me on the face!!!)...and tell me to start transitioning and being truthfull to myself. This is what is moving me forward now. I am not disgusted of being a transexual, nor I am disgusted of transexuals or transvetites that can't pass...I only fear that one day I might share their problem. I want to think that I am a better person now, that I have a better understanding of life. I don't want ever again to be how I was...and I feel pity for the ones that are today as I was before.

Quote from: JoanneB on February 22, 2014, 01:32:18 PM
I spent a good 50 years living with the shame and guilt about being trans. A lot of history to unlearn that I am still working on. But it is amazing how quickly it crumbles once you start really working at chipping away at it. The remnants of guilt and shame live on mainly due to what I feel are legitimate feelings of guilt over the affect this is having on my wife. Non of this really fits well into the life plans we still look forward to fulfilling.

I think a very large part of getting rid of your own transphobia starts with self acceptance. Acceptance of yourself first as a person, irregardless of gender, followed my self acceptance of transgender state. Oddly, taking ownership of being transgender helped with self acceptance in that I sort of had a scape goat. A concrete reason for why things got screwed up in my life. Acknowledging that and knowing I did not have the right tools yet or learned the right lessons encouraged me on to take the steps I needed to take... WHEN I needed to and the time was right to. About the only schedule I had and forced myself to live up to was to find some sort of support ASAP. Three months and a 90 mile drive later I found the greatest self acceptance technique for me, a fairly unique TG support group.

Before self acceptance comes just feeling comfortable. Just as it is difficult and scary at first to do things or think differently rather than beating yourself up, it is also difficult and scary to venture out into the world presenting as female. Especially right out of the gate! Face it, cis-girls spent their entire life figuring out what works for them, that they feel comfortable with. It takes us a long time too. If you wait for the day that you feel you are 100% passable before leaving the safety of the nest, you are probably going to crash and burn. Seeing some arbitrary date circled on the calendar as your deadline to flip that switch from male to female is only going to increase your angst.

My little tough love bit next.... You are NEVER EVER going to be 100% passable. Especially by your own arbitrary, possibly idealized, standard. Cis women every day get clocked as being trans. Waiting on the checkout line at the grocery store you can like find "something about" every woman there with you. What hope do stand to have. Aesthetic surgeons make a good living based on women feeling they don't live up to some ideal. Plus you have a history. Unless you go off the grid and move across the country, your history will always be there.  As others have pointed out 99.999% of the people around you don't give a rat's ass. At nearly 6ft tall w/o heels, slim, almost always in a skirt or dress I get the ocassional look as I go about my day in rural WV. Still I feel totally alive and am not being shot at. Life is great.

Unfortunately there are few ways to get over that fear. The easy way is to simply revel in the feelings of finally being out in the real world being the real and complete you. That comes with practice, not by a date on a calendar. If your goal is to be fulltime in May, You'd best be almost full-time by now. If your goal is to be as passable as possible, you'd best be approaching or past male fail by now. If you have a driving need to be full-time, you wouldn't much else stop you besides you.

Sure, I realize there will never be 100 percent passing.  It's a false ideal.  However, my goal is to get as close to that as possible. I will say hormones have made a very big difference for me (and it's taken a while for me to find the right dose for me), as well as laser, hair growth and weight loss.  It's not a matter of everything falling to place all at once, more like finding a period where I will be in the best shape to start.  I'm sure the beginning part will be clunky, but I doubt it will be as clunky as it would hav been a few months ago. I don't really believe in part time to full time nor does my therapist feel that I need to go that route. Sure it works for some people, but honestly, if I got my hair styled the way I plan on doing for passing purposes (I feel bangs will do me a world of good), I think it would be really realy hard for me to keep up boy mode and it's already hard in it's way now.  Unfortunately, I need to keep that up until I have a job again.  That's key and my male name and work history force me into presenting that way.  Secondly, without money, building a whole new wardrobe is a bit difficult (I have female clothes but a lot of them don't fit like they used too after hormones and weight loss).  Thirdly, I need to work on my general self esteem because I'll never believe in myself if I don't find a way to improve that.  As frustrating as it may seem, I don't mind dragging out my transition if it will get me where I want to be for the rest of my life.  I have, hopefully, a long life a head of me. Accomplishing this at 25 will be a feat in itself and I don't mind that I'm making sure that it will go as right for me as it can. It's annoying to wait for me too but what's 3 or 4 months in the grand scheme of life.   Also, I should note my appearance is much more andro than it may sound (other than clothing), so it may not be what it appears.

learningtolive:
You're 25?   I had no idea. I would have thought you'd been dealing with self hate for many many years by reading your posts.  What about those of us who dealt with inner turmoil for 50+ years and have now come to self acceptance?  You're the only one who can make the choice to get past this and get on with life.  Society is not against you. 

Quote from: JordanBlue on February 22, 2014, 04:09:11 PM
learningtolive:
You're 25?   I had no idea. I would have thought you'd been dealing with self hate for many many years by reading your posts.  What about those of us who dealt with inner turmoil for 50+ years and have now come to self acceptance?  You're the only one who can make the choice to get past this and get on with life.  Society is not against you.

Well, I may only be 25, but it's been 25 years of self hate, lol.  Seriously though, I know much of what everyone says is right.  What's in my head isn't always the reality as I will readily acknowledge that I always seen the worst in every scenario.  It's just I want to get over all these negative feelings and start living a happy/productive life.  I'll get there though.  It'll happen soon enough and I'm working on getting to that point in the meantime. 

Yea no I never have self hatred or inner transphobia.
Although I have met enough trans to know the hatred some had
For me .
I don't know what your problem is with transgender. But you better
Figure it out  and also I think where you live has a lot to do
With it. America is a very phobic place for anyone  that is not
A wasp lol 
Maybe your mother never told you she loved you enough.
Maybe you worry what others think of you.
Maybe your not really trans.
I love myself immensly. I have gone through a very long recovery
Program for myself. And I have realized at the time my relationship
With myself was sick. And I fixed it

Quote from: IamNotxChristine on February 22, 2014, 05:04:39 PM
Yea no I never have self hatred or inner transphobia.
Although I have met enough trans to know the hatred some had
For me .
I don't know what your problem is with transgender. But you better
Figure it out  and also I think where you live has a lot to do
With it. America is a very phobic place for anyone  that is not
A wasp lol 
Maybe your mother never told you she loved you enough.
Maybe you worry what others think of you.
Maybe your not really trans.
I love myself immensly. I have gone through a very long recovery
Program for myself. And I have realized at the time my relationship
With myself was sick. And I fixed it

The worry what others think of me is what would do it.  Though anyone here that knows me probably thinks I have a lot of mother issues which may or may not be true.  It's not so much a problem being transgender as much as it is that I feel like everyone hates us; however, I understand that is likely an irrational feeling that I need to overcome. 

There will always be arrogant, bigoted people everywhere in the world. Whether you are trans or not. I'm sure everyone goes through a phase where they hate something or other about themselves. Being trans hardly defines who a person is though. There simply isn't enough information out there for people to come to understand trans people and their issues. So I personally take immense pride in being who I am, and I don't care who knows it. I'm happy to be different. As it's been mentioned before, being trans teaches you so much and strengthens you in a way nothing else could.

Sure people could hate me for who I am. They can be disgusted by me. They can be horrified at the very idea of me. But that matters so little at the end of the day. And hey, it helps filter out the worthless people from the good ones. You should be proud of everything that makes you different. Challenging the norm is good.

There has already been a lot of very wise things said in this thread, so I'll keep this short and just offer you something to think about.

After reading a lot of your posts, and getting to know you somewhat through them, and the feelings I get from you, I'm starting to come to the conclusion that these things you think are irrational fears... well, I'm not sure they're irrational. And that's what makes them so hard to get over. Furthermore, I'm not so sure it's entirely to do with the title of the thread, either, but has its roots in something else. A very old defense mechanism. And that may be why you're struggling with it so much - because you're looking in the wrong place.

Usually I prefer to ask questions but in this case I'm going to go out on a limb and tell you what I think, in the hopes it provides you some food for thought.

In the past you've had to deal with a lot of repercussions from what people think of you. A lot of them negative. And painful - maybe physically, mentally, or both. And almost all of them based on things you had no control over. Things that just were there, in the minds of others who were so insecure within themselves that they felt the need to punish someone. In this case - you. And that took root somewhere deep in your subconscious. The idea that what people think of you will lead to really bad things happening. So you have to work extra hard to prove yourself, or to hide yourself, or to get people's respect and validation. Not so they will like you, but so that they won't hurt you, and cause you pain.

It's a defense mechanism employed by your mind to protect yourself from harm. And in this case, it is not irrational. But it is outdated, as many defense mechanisms are. The mind doesn't grow up, as it were, it remains largely timeless, and once it lays down a thought pattern, it tends to stick to that thought pattern until something, or someone changes it.

I think this is something you might have to look at, sweetie, to make some forward progress. Self esteem is a part, but it's not the whole story. And I don't think confidence alone will do the trick. I think you have to change the thought patterns you've built up which equate people's views of you equalling putting you under duress. Break down that defense mechanism and replace it with something else.

Quote from: Sephirah on February 22, 2014, 11:54:11 PM
There has already been a lot of very wise things said in this thread, so I'll keep this short and just offer you something to think about.

After reading a lot of your posts, and getting to know you somewhat through them, and the feelings I get from you, I'm starting to come to the conclusion that these things you think are irrational fears... well, I'm not sure they're irrational. And that's what makes them so hard to get over. Furthermore, I'm not so sure it's entirely to do with the title of the thread, either, but has its roots in something else. A very old defense mechanism. And that may be why you're struggling with it so much - because you're looking in the wrong place.

Usually I prefer to ask questions but in this case I'm going to go out on a limb and tell you what I think, in the hopes it provides you some food for thought.

In the past you've had to deal with a lot of repercussions from what people think of you. A lot of them negative. And painful - maybe physically, mentally, or both. And almost all of them based on things you had no control over. Things that just were there, in the minds of others who were so insecure within themselves that they felt the need to punish someone. In this case - you. And that took root somewhere deep in your subconscious. The idea that what people think of you will lead to really bad things happening. So you have to work extra hard to prove yourself, or to hide yourself, or to get people's respect and validation. Not so they will like you, but so that they won't hurt you, and cause you pain.

It's a defense mechanism employed by your mind to protect yourself from harm. And in this case, it is not irrational. But it is outdated, as many defense mechanisms are. The mind doesn't grow up, as it were, it remains largely timeless, and once it lays down a thought pattern, it tends to stick to that thought pattern until something, or someone changes it.

I think this is something you might have to look at, sweetie, to make some forward progress. Self esteem is a part, but it's not the whole story. And I don't think confidence alone will do the trick. I think you have to change the thought patterns you've built up which equate people's views of you equalling putting you under duress. Break down that defense mechanism and replace it with something else.

very well said

Quote from: Sephirah on February 22, 2014, 11:54:11 PM
There has already been a lot of very wise things said in this thread, so I'll keep this short and just offer you something to think about.

After reading a lot of your posts, and getting to know you somewhat through them, and the feelings I get from you, I'm starting to come to the conclusion that these things you think are irrational fears... well, I'm not sure they're irrational. And that's what makes them so hard to get over. Furthermore, I'm not so sure it's entirely to do with the title of the thread, either, but has its roots in something else. A very old defense mechanism. And that may be why you're struggling with it so much - because you're looking in the wrong place.

Usually I prefer to ask questions but in this case I'm going to go out on a limb and tell you what I think, in the hopes it provides you some food for thought.

In the past you've had to deal with a lot of repercussions from what people think of you. A lot of them negative. And painful - maybe physically, mentally, or both. And almost all of them based on things you had no control over. Things that just were there, in the minds of others who were so insecure within themselves that they felt the need to punish someone. In this case - you. And that took root somewhere deep in your subconscious. The idea that what people think of you will lead to really bad things happening. So you have to work extra hard to prove yourself, or to hide yourself, or to get people's respect and validation. Not so they will like you, but so that they won't hurt you, and cause you pain.

It's a defense mechanism employed by your mind to protect yourself from harm. And in this case, it is not irrational. But it is outdated, as many defense mechanisms are. The mind doesn't grow up, as it were, it remains largely timeless, and once it lays down a thought pattern, it tends to stick to that thought pattern until something, or someone changes it.

I think this is something you might have to look at, sweetie, to make some forward progress. Self esteem is a part, but it's not the whole story. And I don't think confidence alone will do the trick. I think you have to change the thought patterns you've built up which equate people's views of you equalling putting you under duress. Break down that defense mechanism and replace it with something else.

There is a lot of truth in what you say.  It's not so much that I feel shame in being transgender, it's more I feel ashamed because people are going to think terrible things about me or cause me pain which hurts. Since I require approval and validation in order to protect myself, it hits me hard and makes me feel terrible when it doesn't happen.  And yes, this thought pattern goes way beyond me just being trans.  I don't know why, but what people think about me is more important than my own feelings and needs.  They get sidelined in the process.  I really wish I knew how to overcome this, I do, yet I've seem to have made no progress in this area.  I've considered picking up a second therapist because as much as I love my current one we usually talk about gender stuff.  It's important to me, of course, but it isn't the full story to my shattered self image.  Although, I think she's been picking up on that and steering me to the self esteem angle, so maybe I'll improve soon.  Who knows. 

Quote from: learningtolive on February 23, 2014, 10:09:00 AMI don't know why, but what people think about me is more important than my own feelings and needs.  They get sidelined in the process.  I really wish I knew how to overcome this, I do, yet I've seem to have made no progress in this area. 

It's a control issue, sweetie. Pure and simple. See the thing is, if people hurt you because of what they think about you, then they have control over you. They dictate what you feel, what you will and won't do, and how you think. And I think that, at times in your past, you've felt powerless to do anything about it. Helpless. Like there was nothing you could do and the way you were treated was dictated by how other people viewed you.

You've mentioned in previous posts that you were bullied a lot for being... different to those around you. This is a good example. In such encounters the bullies have the control. The power. And you felt helpless to do anything about it. What they thought about you was, to your mind, the reason for it. And I suspect you internalised a lot of that, and blamed yourself for it.

"If I was normal, they would have left me alone." or "If they liked me, they wouldn't have done it."

Both lead to the same defense mechanisms. You feel like you have to fit in. Totally. To blend seamlessly and give no one any reason to think anything. And the other defense mechanism of needing to be liked, needing to avoid any situation where someone feels less than admiration for you.

The first step to changing this is to understand that that isn't the case. And no matter what you try to do with regard to affecting people's views of you... ultimately it's how they feel about themselves and their world which go a long way to determining how they treat others.

If I could make a suggestion, sweetie. As well as working on your self esteem (which is never a bad thing)... maybe look into getting some assertiveness training. Assertiveness doesn't mean bossing everyone around and being generally an overbearing person. It means working out what your own boundaries are, and being able to communicate that to the point where others know where they are, and respect them. The two often go hand in hand, since it does take a certain degree of self-belief and self-confidence to be able to do that. But it most definitely is something which can be addressed and dealt with.

What you need to do is learn to take some of the control of yourself and your feelings back from everyone else. Back into your own hands. Then, when you can do that, things have a habit of falling into place. You've given other people control over how they make you feel for far too long, hon. Understandably by being in a position where you felt you couldn't fight back, or didn't see yourself as that kind of person. But as you grow into a beautiful young adult, there are ways of fighting back beyond squaring off to someone and bloodying their nose, or whatever the case may be. Learning about yourself, learning what you want, what you deserve... really learning to live. ;)

You've worked so hard to get to where you are, and you are more than capable of taking the credit for it.

Sweetie, self-image usually gets shattered when it is others who are throwing the stones. You don't have to give them that power over you.

QuoteIt's a control issue, sweetie. Pure and simple. See the thing is, if people hurt you because of what they think about you, then they have control over you. They dictate what you feel, what you will and won't do, and how you think. And I think that, at times in your past, you've felt powerless to do anything about it. Helpless. Like there was nothing you could do and the way you were treated was dictated by how other people viewed you.

You've mentioned in previous posts that you were bullied a lot for being... different to those around you. This is a good example. In such encounters the bullies have the control. The power. And you felt helpless to do anything about it. What they thought about you was, to your mind, the reason for it. And I suspect you internalised a lot of that, and blamed yourself for it.

"If I was normal, they would have left me alone." or "If they liked me, they wouldn't have done it."

Both lead to the same defense mechanisms. You feel like you have to fit in. Totally. To blend seamlessly and give no one any reason to think anything. And the other defense mechanism of needing to be liked, needing to avoid any situation where someone feels less than admiration for you.

The first step to changing this is to understand that that isn't the case. And no matter what you try to do with regard to affecting people's views of you... ultimately it's how they feel about themselves and their world which go a long way to determining how they treat others.

If I could make a suggestion, sweetie. As well as working on your self esteem (which is never a bad thing)... maybe look into getting some assertiveness training. Assertiveness doesn't mean bossing everyone around and being generally an overbearing person. It means working out what your own boundaries are, and being able to communicate that to the point where others know where they are, and respect them. The two often go hand in hand, since it does take a certain degree of self-belief and self-confidence to be able to do that. But it most definitely is something which can be addressed and dealt with.

What you need to do is learn to take some of the control of yourself and your feelings back from everyone else. Back into your own hands. Then, when you can do that, things have a habit of falling into place. You've given other people control over how they make you feel for far too long, hon. Understandably by being in a position where you felt you couldn't fight back, or didn't see yourself as that kind of person. But as you grow into a beautiful young adult, there are ways of fighting back beyond squaring off to someone and bloodying their nose, or whatever the case may be. Learning about yourself, learning what you want, what you deserve... really learning to live. ;)

You've worked so hard to get to where you are, and you are more than capable of taking the credit for it.

Sweetie, self-image usually gets shattered when it is others who are throwing the stones. You don't have to give them that power over you.

First I have to say I absolutely love your name Sephirah. :)

Gosh, while I was reading this passage it felt like it could  apply to me as well. I was bullied growing up and can totally see elements of control in play which caused me to hide my whole life. I would hate to have this happen to LTL. 

I think you are absolutely right about assertiveness training. Probably something we can all use more of. I know I can. This was extremely insightful.

Quote from: Sephirah on February 23, 2014, 12:06:18 PM
It's a control issue, sweetie. Pure and simple. See the thing is, if people hurt you because of what they think about you, then they have control over you. They dictate what you feel, what you will and won't do, and how you think. And I think that, at times in your past, you've felt powerless to do anything about it. Helpless. Like there was nothing you could do and the way you were treated was dictated by how other people viewed you.

You've mentioned in previous posts that you were bullied a lot for being... different to those around you. This is a good example. In such encounters the bullies have the control. The power. And you felt helpless to do anything about it. What they thought about you was, to your mind, the reason for it. And I suspect you internalised a lot of that, and blamed yourself for it.

"If I was normal, they would have left me alone." or "If they liked me, they wouldn't have done it."

Both lead to the same defense mechanisms. You feel like you have to fit in. Totally. To blend seamlessly and give no one any reason to think anything. And the other defense mechanism of needing to be liked, needing to avoid any situation where someone feels less than admiration for you.

The first step to changing this is to understand that that isn't the case. And no matter what you try to do with regard to affecting people's views of you... ultimately it's how they feel about themselves and their world which go a long way to determining how they treat others.

If I could make a suggestion, sweetie. As well as working on your self esteem (which is never a bad thing)... maybe look into getting some assertiveness training. Assertiveness doesn't mean bossing everyone around and being generally an overbearing person. It means working out what your own boundaries are, and being able to communicate that to the point where others know where they are, and respect them. The two often go hand in hand, since it does take a certain degree of self-belief and self-confidence to be able to do that. But it most definitely is something which can be addressed and dealt with.

What you need to do is learn to take some of the control of yourself and your feelings back from everyone else. Back into your own hands. Then, when you can do that, things have a habit of falling into place. You've given other people control over how they make you feel for far too long, hon. Understandably by being in a position where you felt you couldn't fight back, or didn't see yourself as that kind of person. But as you grow into a beautiful young adult, there are ways of fighting back beyond squaring off to someone and bloodying their nose, or whatever the case may be. Learning about yourself, learning what you want, what you deserve... really learning to live. ;)

You've worked so hard to get to where you are, and you are more than capable of taking the credit for it.

Sweetie, self-image usually gets shattered when it is others who are throwing the stones. You don't have to give them that power over you.

My college mentor, who in a way was like a second mother to me, once remarked that I needed to learn to be more assertive.  There is probably a lot of truth in that.  I just don't know how to stand up.  I'm usually the sort of person who is very quiet and very aware of the fact that every step I take could lead to me being judged.  That judgement has at times led to both physical and emotional pain.  That's why I'm so cautious.  Though that's also why I never really experienced a lot of the things I've wanted to.  Why I missed out on so much and feel stuck.  I'm afraid to take the steps to getting what I want and acting assertively in any sense.  I'm very laid back and like to hope things will fall into place because I don't feel I have the ability to reach out and go for it.  And whenever I do, it seems to back fire, so I usually just shrug my shoulders and say, what's the point.  I do feel helpless, but I don't know if I can "take the power back".  I don't think I'm capable of ever defining the world around me.  Even when I work real hard, believe in mysef, and try to make something the way I want, I totally fail, so it's like what's the point.  I've worked real hard in college to make a name for myself and worked my ass off in every job I've ever been in, where has it gotten me? Nowhere.  There is very little I can do to make the world or my life what I want it to be.  I can try hard, give my all, have some temp successes, and dream, but can I really define my own world or suceed in making life what I want it to be?  I don't think I can.  As much as I wish my life and feelings were in my hands, in a way, I fear it will always be in the hands of others.  How other people take me or judge me or my performance will always be the answer to how things go. That's why I'm so hesistant with going forward too early with full time.  If everything isn't just right and perfect, then people won't percieve me as passing.  That's going to lead to judgement/mockery and that will create pain and failure for me (maybe even worse).  I'm not strong enough for that. And out of all the failures in my life, I can't have my transition be one of them.  I NEED to do this.  I'm in so much pain not being myself, expressing who I am, and living the life I want.  If this fails, I die with it.  I'm sick of not living, yet I can't live.  It's a continuous chain that I don't know how to break.

Sorry for rambling.  There is a lot of truth in what you say.  I just don't know how to take that power back and make my life "fall into place".  I really wish I did, but I don't seem to know what it is I'm supposed to do to overcome these things. 

Quote from: learningtolive on February 23, 2014, 01:20:12 PM
My college mentor, who in a way was like a second mother to me, once remarked that I needed to learn to be more assertive.  There is probably a lot of truth in that.  I just don't know how to stand up.  I'm usually the sort of person who is very quiet and very aware of the fact that every step I take could lead to me being judged.  That judgement has at times led to both physical and emotional pain.  That's why I'm so cautious.  Though that's also why I never really experienced a lot of the things I've wanted to.  Why I missed out on so much and feel stuck.  I'm afraid to take the steps to getting what I want and acting assertively in any sense.  I'm very laid back and like to hope things will fall into place because I don't feel I have the ability to reach out and go for it.  And whenever I do, it seems to back fire, so I usually just shrug my shoulders and say, what's the point.  I do feel helpless, but I don't know if I can "take the power back".  I don't think I'm capable of ever defining the world around me.  Even when I work real hard, believe in mysef, and try to make something the way I want, I totally fail, so it's like what's the point.  I've worked real hard in college to make a name for myself and worked my ass off in every job I've ever been in, where has it gotten me? Nowhere.  There is very little I can do to make the world or my life what I want it to be.  I can try hard, give my all, have some temp successes, and dream, but can I really define my own world or suceed in making life what I want it to be?  I don't think I can.  As much as I wish my life and feelings were in my hands, in a way, I fear it will always be in the hands of others.  How other people take me or judge me or my performance will always be the answer to how things go. That's why I'm so hesistant with going forward too early with full time.  If everything isn't just right and perfect, then people won't percieve me as passing.  That's going to lead to judgement/mockery and that will create pain and failure for me (maybe even worse).  I'm not strong enough for that. And out of all the failures in my life, I can't have my transition be one of them.  I NEED to do this.  I'm in so much pain not being myself, expressing who I am, and living the life I want.  If this fails, I die with it.  I'm sick of not living, yet I can't live.  It's a continuous chain that I don't know how to break.

Sorry for rambling.  There is a lot of truth in what you say.  I just don't know how to take that power back and make my life "fall into place".  I really wish I did, but I don't seem to know what it is I'm supposed to do to overcome these things. 

First of all, don't apologise, hon. It's good that you're getting all this out. That's one step on the path to working through it.

I've emboldened some of the things that I feel have led you to where you are now. And the things you need to work on. Building up your assertiveness and self-esteem will go some way towards helping you with those. But what I would like you to do is to take a look at the emboldened text and try to work out why you feel that way. What specific examples in your life have led you to believe these things?

By identifying those, and working through them, you can start to isolate thought patterns that don't apply anymore. Things that have changed now from when you originally did the things which led to you feeling that way.

Often, low self-esteem is caused because we cling to the negatives, since they reinforce all the negative things we feel about ourselves. And we overlook the positives entirely. Almost blanking them out because they don't fit the view we have of ourselves.

So the question I have to ask is: can you think of any positive things in your life which don't fit the parts in bold? Write down a list of ten things which you're proud of. Things you did which made you feel good about yourself. Things that no one else had anything to do with, that were all you.

Quote from: ana on February 23, 2014, 12:21:43 PM
First I have to say I absolutely love your name Sephirah. :)

Gosh, while I was reading this passage it felt like it could  apply to me as well. I was bullied growing up and can totally see elements of control in play which caused me to hide my whole life. I would hate to have this happen to LTL. 

I think you are absolutely right about assertiveness training. Probably something we can all use more of. I know I can. This was extremely insightful.

*blushes* Thank you, sweetie. I really hope you get to the place you want to be, too. You deserve it and owe it to yourself. *huggles*

I certainly have to second a lot of Sephirah's feedback. I think we all cling to bad habits and behavours from our past that once kind of sort of worked. As bad as they were, they provided comfort, safety. Hence hard to let go of. I still often fall into that trap. Reverting I call it. I always repeat this affirmation

I know what doesn't work

Something I can proclaim with absolute certainty after 30 years of intense practice of those bad behaviors. I am still far from being an ascended master, yet I am far from the being hurt child I was just a few short years ago.

LTL,

I know what it is like to hate what one is while at the same time, being unable to change course.  I know hiding and fretting that people will find out the truth.  I know being alone, never smiling, never playing, never laughing and always acting.  I had a smile that was seldom real and was always looking over my shoulder to see hundreds of imagined shadows laughing, mocking and staring.  That is no life.

Do you recall why you originally started?  Do you remember the pain, the inner hurt?  HRT and progress towards being the real you dulls the pain and so memories sometime dim but to go back will only make the pain worse.  So we go forward and out of nowhere comes a point in time when in near emotional exhaustion and exasperation comes a pitiful cry from a pain wracked soul that they will no longer fear.  And in that cry, strength is born.   

I have traveled, a lot.  There are places where people have hated me because I am white, because I am tall, because I am American or because I don't talk like them.  A person cannot please everyone all the time.  Being trans adds so little to the mix in a world where any little reason is justification for hate. 

Just be yourself.  I have never met you although I would dearly love to do so.  You are kind and caring.  You are thoughtful and smart.  You can be funny and you can be real.  You are amazing. 

Hugs,

Jen

I am glad you used the phrase "inner transphobia" because that tells me you probably do have a sense of what is really going on here.  Because, to me, this looks a lot like you hurling insults at yourself from the 3rd person.  This "they" you speak of is probably a projection of your own feelings about this one aspect of yourself which you have not yet learned to embrace.  The insults are yet another projection, of your insecurities, which is what insults are--projections of insecurity.

Most people in the outside world do not view us the way you say, I mean not really.  Especially within your peer group.  Young people mostly don't care, and old people are coming around slowly, and the ones that will always hold onto their hatred won't be here forever.  They are old, after all...  There is a lot to be optimistic about for trans people these days, something that was unimaginable a couple decades ago.

There may still be some people that act awful out there, but they will be in the minority, and just remember everybody is a mirror, people look at you and see a reflection of themselves.  When they hate what they see, it's because they see in you things that remind them of what they hate about themselves.  I think insults are sad for the people that dole them out, because it is evidence of their own self loathing.  That is how I look at them anyway, and I think that helps me take back the control that Sephirah was talking about.

Until you figure out how to embrace being trans, and own it, you won't be able to love yourself, and that will always hold you back.  And by embrace it I do not mean that you need to be out and proud or see yourself as anything other than a normal woman, I just mean be okay with who you are and where you come from.  Maybe even be secretly proud of it.  I don't know exactly how you get there.  I hope you can figure it out though.

I think Sephirah is right to think of protective mechanisms, and certainly that you need to learn, somehow, to be more assertive of who you are. When I learned to work around my feelings instead of accepting them, I succeeded only in creating an unseen deadlock internally, because feelings don't change for threats or for rationalizations. Perhaps that is why you feel stuck, vulnerable, powerless. A wise friend once said to me, "You think too much." The meaning of that to me has only deepened with time. All of the rationalizing, storying telling and explaining doesn't get to the heart of the matter. It's not lack of strength that will hold you back, but lack of courage to accept yourself, no matter what that entails. The strength comes slowly, when you have the courage to build on the true foundations of who you are.

There is no good alternative to accepting yourself, including all of the feelings. Learn to listen, accept, and gently understand the feelings, to respect them and give them what they need to heal and grow toward the best of yourself, whatever you find that to be. Practice recognizing the feelings and thoughts that build you up and those the rip you apart. Grow the first and heal the second. You accept yourself in your own way, that might be bold, or shy, or mysterious, or something else; only you can know what is right for you at any moment.

Don't get caught up in the metrics and science and facts. My therapist pointed out to me that trans* is poorly understood by everyone, even those who've been working exclusively with transfolk for many many years. There is so much that is not understood about trans*; that's just the state of the world I live in. All of this fear and doubt I'd internalized wasn't about me personally - it was about the human race grappling with understanding something that I was a part of. That was a tremendous release for me, it helped me give myself permission to stop trying to make sense of all that tension, and move on to accepting myself and my feelings. It also moved my attention from doubting myself to helping grow understanding in the world, so that we can all have healthier lives.

Everyone is affected by things we don't choose about ourselves, every day, and yes, sometimes it's terribly hard to bear. Being trans adds an unusual dimension to that. You will have to choose when to show how you feel and trust people to understand, and when to keep some distance. Almost everyone has terribly sensitive spots, yours may be less common, but you have the same choices, the same hope and fears in that as everyone who's ever been deeply hurt. And we've almost all been deeply hurt - we grew up in a world that categorically denied and disbelieved core parts of who we are, even if no one took aim at us when they said and did those things.

We all must learn to respect our own physical and emotional needs and build lives that do the same. Everything is on the line and there is no alternative. This is true for us and far too many cis people as well. It gets easier every day, but that's a distraction, because we don't get to choose when we live, only whether we live and live truthfully to ourselves. Some have felt the world wasn't ready for them for many years; that's not right or wrong, it's just sad that they felt (likely justifiably) that they had to bear that. People respond very strongly to confidence (or lack thereof) in others, and it is very good to have this in your back pocket for times when you are truly in danger, but you do need to put it away and try to be yourself wherever and whenever you can, and let the a**holes out themselves so you know who isn't your friend.

I too transitioned young (21). I met little resistance from others along the way. (I owe so much to those who came before me.) I went on with my life long before I started accepting my feelings. All of the fears I kept bottled up long past transition, all of the time I spent believing I got a choice in my feelings just caused more pain for myself and those around me. And in the end, I am still who I am, an XY assigned male at birth who is happiest and healthiest IDing female, and nothing I thought or did ever changed that, never could, because feelings aren't negotiable, they just are. Trying to be someone is pointless; there is only true growth in actualizing who I already am.

I thought I might have a social anxiety disorder, yet when I went to a trans* conference and found but a scant a trace of that fear, and what was left, I could feel and understand. I had an immense amount of emotion that I'd learned to keep bottled up, and I hadn't learned to stop. Safe space helped me lower those defenses. Learning to accept being a feeling person, to rebuilding my life so that it respects my emotional needs, is a wonderful and overdue experience. If that's where you are, don't hold it back; there's a whole dimension of yourself waiting to be unfolded from the place where you've tucked it away through the storms.

Thanks again everyone for all of your positive and helpful posts! :)  Sorry I've taken a long time to respond to everything.   It's just a little much to take sometimes because of the emotional gravity of everything.  Sometimes I need to clear my head and get away from my fears.  And sometimes I feel stupid to be whining.  In all reality, there is much for me to be grateful for and I've lucked out in many ways.  I always talk about how life isn't black and white because I don't like to see things in absolutes.  Life can be both amazing and horrible.  In my case,  I've been blessed in many ways in my life and everyday I count my blessings.  My hardships shouldn't taint my entire perception of life and I'm careful to get away from those bad thoughts.  Still, I do have a dark side, if you will, or hardships in my life that I'd like to fix.  I hope that doesn't make me sound totally emo, but I want to grow as a person and right the wrongs. 

@Jen, thank you for your words.  You always know what to say.  You know, I've really got to stop assuming the worse.  While it's true that people out there don't like us, it's probably much smaller than what I'm making it.  I just can't help but read transphobic comments on the internet and assume everyone is going to think that or dislike me if they know.  Silly perhaps, but I need to grow a thicker skin and learn to not be so sensitive and assume the worst all the time.  I guess experience creates wisdom and given the fact that I'm still early in this I shouldn't assume what everything will be. It's funny but I think my therapist is right that I let my family's rejection and disproval created this false aura that no one will accept me and that all their omens will come true.  Oddly enough, most of the people that know are either really supportive or could care less.  No one has really been shocked or angry.  I guess the more my support system grows the better off I'll be.

@JLT1, thank you.  You've always looked out for me on this site, and it's really appreciated.  I don't believe I am or feel amazing, but it does feel nice to hear someone say that.  You're very sweet.  And thanks for brining up the fact that I have come far.  Sometimes I forget it. 

@PurpleAmy, thanks.  In the end, you are right that there is no alternative to accepting ourselves.  I'm just so used to repressing my feelings and trying to meet other peoples standards or expectations.  Trying to meet my own and be myself is really hard.  Yet, it's what I have to do.  Thanks for the message, it was very helpful. 

Quote from: Sephirah on February 23, 2014, 01:38:09 PM
First of all, don't apologise, hon. It's good that you're getting all this out. That's one step on the path to working through it.

I've emboldened some of the things that I feel have led you to where you are now. And the things you need to work on. Building up your assertiveness and self-esteem will go some way towards helping you with those. But what I would like you to do is to take a look at the emboldened text and try to work out why you feel that way. What specific examples in your life have led you to believe these things?

By identifying those, and working through them, you can start to isolate thought patterns that don't apply anymore. Things that have changed now from when you originally did the things which led to you feeling that way.

Often, low self-esteem is caused because we cling to the negatives, since they reinforce all the negative things we feel about ourselves. And we overlook the positives entirely. Almost blanking them out because they don't fit the view we have of ourselves.

So the question I have to ask is: can you think of any positive things in your life which don't fit the parts in bold? Write down a list of ten things which you're proud of. Things you did which made you feel good about yourself. Things that no one else had anything to do with, that were all you.

*blushes* Thank you, sweetie. I really hope you get to the place you want to be, too. You deserve it and owe it to yourself. *huggles*

Quote from: Sephirah on February 23, 2014, 01:38:09 PM
First of all, don't apologise, hon. It's good that you're getting all this out. That's one step on the path to working through it.

I've emboldened some of the things that I feel have led you to where you are now. And the things you need to work on. Building up your assertiveness and self-esteem will go some way towards helping you with those. But what I would like you to do is to take a look at the emboldened text and try to work out why you feel that way. What specific examples in your life have led you to believe these things?

By identifying those, and working through them, you can start to isolate thought patterns that don't apply anymore. Things that have changed now from when you originally did the things which led to you feeling that way.

Often, low self-esteem is caused because we cling to the negatives, since they reinforce all the negative things we feel about ourselves. And we overlook the positives entirely. Almost blanking them out because they don't fit the view we have of ourselves.

So the question I have to ask is: can you think of any positive things in your life which don't fit the parts in bold? Write down a list of ten things which you're proud of. Things you did which made you feel good about yourself. Things that no one else had anything to do with, that were all you.

*blushes* Thank you, sweetie. I really hope you get to the place you want to be, too. You deserve it and owe it to yourself. *huggles*

You always have such great insight Seph, and I'm very appreciative to have your input.  It helps and makes me think more than you may know. Because I appreciate the thought you always put into your words, I wanted to make sure I gave you an adequate response by giving your post some deep consideration; however, it awoke some painful emotions and left me a bit confused on what the complete source of it is.  To be honest, there are many things that could have created this thought pattern or contributed to it, though I must confess I really don't understand why I am the way I am.  If I had to take a shot in the dark, I would say the following things contributed to it:  bullying, difficulties in social environments and inability to connect with others,  family issues, having very controlling and abusive people make their mark on my early/formative years, inability to find decent employment , etc. I really feel like things begin with my family in some ways and have thoughts on specifics things that really left a mark on me.  Some of the things you suggested really hit closer than you may have guessed and seem to really explain why this pattern may have developed, but I don't want to blame or hurt anyone, especially, when it refers to people I love who and don't really deserve me saying anything bad.   And I'm scared to let certain things about my family out in the event that they might see it and it will create embarrassment and start up drama.   It would betray other people's privacy too which isn't right.  Beside, if some things had a negative impact, there is a lot of great things about my family and don't want to hurt anyone.  Plus,  I don't have an answer and probably am not the best person to interpret me and my life.  You know, conflict of interest and biases  In any case, I don't think it's one thing.  It was a pattern of events and occurrences that led to me thinking this way.  And honestly, things always play out the way I said above, so I don't really know if this is just a defense mechanism more than it is the reality of how things are in my life and something I need to submit to. Still, I do think you are right this isn't so much about me being trans and more about me fearing negative judgement or perception of me creating harmful consequences which explains me in a big way.   Maybe I really need to start addressing these things with another therapist.  I do love the one I see, but I think I should see somebody in addition to a gender therapist.  If I can solve the other issues, my gender issues will become easier to deal with.  Yet, I still have issues with gender that make other aspects difficult to handle, so it's not like ignoring them in favor of something else would help either.  Both need to be dealt with. 

As for the ten accomplishments, I'll share what I can, but I don't really have any major achievements outside of school, so expect a sad list.

Being inducted into multiple honor societies, proudest being Phi Beta Kappa

Winning a couple of academic awards that I worked hard to earn along with always making the deans list.

Successfully defended an honors thesis which allowed me to graduate with departmental honors as well as Summa Cum Laude. 

My whole life I've been afraid of flying, still am, but I faced my fear and traveled on a long international flight to overcome it.  I mean, I'm still afraid of flying, but at least I met my fear.  So, I sort of see that as an accomplishment.  And hey, I recently taxied around in my friends plane though there was no chance in hell that I would go up with her, lol.  It's an improvement.

I was trusted with running an important GOTV project for a campaign that I worked for.  It went really well and increased voter turnout much beyond initial expectations.  During that campaign, I gave my everything and experienced so much with my team that election day was one of the greatest moments of my life.   

Coming out and starting my transition.  This may sound silly but coming out to my family was a huge accomplishment for me.  This is something I've been terrified about forever, and I can't even tell you how hard it was for me to face.  All the denial and pain involved turned me into a miserable person.  Most of the time I felt like I was dying on the inside yet at the same time  thought I was better off dead than actually facing my fear.   The fact that I finally overcame it and let it out to my family was really big.    The fact that I'm actually doing something about this is a huge deal for me.  I give myself a lot of grief, but I am quite proud to have had the strength to take this on at a younger age.

I used to do very damaging things to my body to cope with depression, anxiety and dysphoria.  I got over those things on my own and am now living a healthy life.  I'm proud of that.

When I was a kid, I used to write music and poetry during school.  I would spend all day writing something that came to mind whether it be music or words.  Most of writing is lousy and I'll never share my creative stuff with others, but I am proud of the output I once had.  Sometimes I read some of the songs or poems and it makes me smile to remember where I came from.

Well, this might be a silly one, but learning to play some pieces on guitar has always made me feel accomplished in some way.  It takes so much time and effort, but it's rewarding when you can finally play something flawlessy (or close enough). 

Okay, another silly one.  When I was a kid beating a tough video game was always rewarding.  As you may know, my sister and I were obsessed with final fantasy 8 and it took us forever to beat it. I'll never forget us sitting there watching the ending in shock as we finally beat a game that took both of us at least 4 years to beat.  That was an amazing day for the both of us. Hey, it's funny but it was very rewarding to me. 

Yeah, the last few suck, but I really can't complete a list of 10.  Other than some of those things, I really don't feel I have "accomplishments".  There are things that I am proud of or things that I experienced that many other never will, but the word accomplishment seems weird for me.   

It seems you've done a lot to be proud of. One thing I will say though is that your family seems to have an excessive amount of power over your self image. I personally have no family so I'm totally unaffected by any others thoughts of who I am.

First of all, I could give you a big hug for really taking the time to sit down and reflect on yourself. Sweetie, wanting to understand the problems are the second step towards overcoming them. The first being identifying them.

I'm not going to go into any great detail about what it all means, because as you say, it is something that's probably best done on a face to face basis with someone who can work with you on a more personal level. What I will say, though, is I am sorry, but not surprised, that you got in touch with some painful emotions when you were thinking about this. They are a big cause of the defences we erect around ourselves. Physical bruises fade, but mental ones sometimes don't, until we examine them and allow the healing process to begin. The conscious mind is good at sticking painful situations in the "I don't want to deal with this" box, somewhere in a dusty backroom of our psyche, where it hopes we will forget about it. But then that wizened old janitor of our subconscious comes along and is all "oh, what's this? I know, I'll take this down into the deeper levels and keep it safe."

That's why we sometimes feel certain ways and act certain ways, without knowing why. Because some things may seem gone, but they're usually not forgotten. Not on an emotional level.

You said something, though, which is very important. A pattern of events and occurrences which led to you feeling that way. That's the key, hon. Because just as events and occurrences can lead to you thinking negative things, they can also lead to you thinking positive ones too. You just have to look for those glimmers of light in the darkness.

That's why I asked you to name 10 things. And honestly, those things you've mentioned show to me that you do, in fact, have the qualities you didn't think you did in the previous post, the parts I emboldened. Look at both of them and notice the way you feel, but then at what you accomplished and how that equates to the way you feel.

You said you were afraid, and that you didn't feel able to reach out and go for it. Sweetie, several of the things you mentioned involved you doing just that. And with great success. Which shows me that you do have that ability and, while you may feel fear, you have the ability to not let it rule you.

You said you felt it would always be in the hands of others, and how people judge you or perceive you... but again look at those accomplishments. Others trusted you, others believed in you, and thought you would make something successful... and sweetie, you did. That shows you have the ability, and the presence of mind.

Those are only two examples. I could go on and on but I think you can do the same, sweetie. Look at those accomplishments. NONE of them are silly, or anything like that. They are all overcoming personal barriers, doing things you didn't think you could. Look at what you wrote that you did, things that made you feel proud, made you feel capable. And then look back at the other post above it and see how much or little of the emboldened text is actually the case. I think you will find it's not as much as you thought hon.

And that's really a good thing to do to also work past this. Take some time to think about the positives. The things that, more often than not, you overlook as everything else seems designed to reinforce the negative self-talk you have.

They are out there, as you've proved. You are far more capable, determined, and courageous than you give yourself credit for, sweetie. You just need the time to see that. *big hugs*

LTL,

I don't know how much people hate us, but before I transitioned nobody on this planet could have hated me worse than I hated myself. Nobody but me tried to kill me, not once, but three times. My only real source of self anger now is "WHY DIDN'T I TRANSITION THIRTY YEARS AGO?!?!?!?!" If I did I wouldn't have had 13 knee surgeries, or broken 41 bones from trying to prove to everyone I was male. I never had ANY illusions, that's why I didn't understand why I couldn't pull the plug on my male impersonation till I was honest with myself about the main and nearly only reason. I've been a 'born again' Christian since I was 22, and although I still believe, I choose to not believe in a God of hatred and anger anymore. I've believed for the first time during the last thirty months that God loves me just as much as He loves anyone. I was truly born with a birth defect and I think every TS/TG is born, not made. Whether this was nature or God, I no longer care, but I was made this way in my mother's womb, and I know that scientifically. I had a brain MRI in 2005 and the doctor told me I have a female brain. I laughed and acted like it was a joke, but he said, "no really, you have the brain the size and symmetry of a woman's." And it all made even more sense. Still, I couldn't accept myself yet. But my story really doesn't matter, you are transgendered and the path you've taken to get here is irrelevant. You've taken the red pill and there's no going back. I only wish I would have done this at 25, instead of 57! Consider yourself lucky, you have infinitely more acceptance than when us baby boomers were your age. Now we're all not only more accepted, we're protected by law, and after seeing your photo, girl, you have NOTHING to worry about when you finally go full time. I'd say just get a pro to get those eyebrows professionally shaped and play with makeup to become as good at it as you can, and practice makes perfect. If you want to get your nose done, that's up to you, but if you don't you'll still pass. Consider yourself lucky to have done this at 25, don't look at yourself as over the hill, because you're far from it.....besides, what does that make us older ladies, lol?!?! Anyhoo, you'll do fine as soon as you totally accept who you are and what you must do to be happy. God Bless you, Mira

Quote from: Miranda Catherine on March 05, 2014, 10:36:31 AM
LTL,

I don't know how much people hate us, but before I transitioned nobody on this planet could have hated me worse than I hated myself. Nobody but me tried to kill me, not once, but three times. My only real source of self anger now is "WHY DIDN'T I TRANSITION THIRTY YEARS AGO?!?!?!?!" If I did I wouldn't have had 13 knee surgeries, or broken 41 bones from trying to prove to everyone I was male. I never had ANY illusions, that's why I didn't understand why I couldn't pull the plug on my male impersonation till I was honest with myself about the main and nearly only reason. I've been a 'born again' Christian since I was 22, and although I still believe, I choose to not believe in a God of hatred and anger anymore. I've believed for the first time during the last thirty months that God loves me just as much as He loves anyone. I was truly born with a birth defect and I think every TS/TG is born, not made. Whether this was nature or God, I no longer care, but I was made this way in my mother's womb, and I know that scientifically. I had a brain MRI in 2005 and the doctor told me I have a female brain. I laughed and acted like it was a joke, but he said, "no really, you have the brain the size and symmetry of a woman's." And it all made even more sense. Still, I couldn't accept myself yet. But my story really doesn't matter, you are transgendered and the path you've taken to get here is irrelevant. You've taken the red pill and there's no going back. I only wish I would have done this at 25, instead of 57! Consider yourself lucky, you have infinitely more acceptance than when us baby boomers were your age. Now we're all not only more accepted, we're protected by law, and after seeing your photo, girl, you have NOTHING to worry about when you finally go full time. I'd say just get a pro to get those eyebrows professionally shaped and play with makeup to become as good at it as you can, and practice makes perfect. If you want to get your nose done, that's up to you, but if you don't you'll still pass. Consider yourself lucky to have done this at 25, don't look at yourself as over the hill, because you're far from it.....besides, what does that make us older ladies, lol?!?! Anyhoo, you'll do fine as soon as you totally accept who you are and what you must do to be happy. God Bless you, Mira

Thank you Miranda.

I'm no longer feeling self hatred more than I am confused on how to proceed and scared.  To be honest, I have nothing but the upmost respect for those who transitioned at a later stage in their life.  Quite frankly, that could have easily have been me.   I know in the grand scheme of things I'm rather lucky and have much to be thankful for, but it;s still very hard.  I'm just trying very hard to take this all head on and to make sure I go about this the right way.  It's like I'm journeying cross country in a terrible car that's near empty on gas with no money.  I'll get to where I want to be and will find a way to overcome the challenges I face, but at the moment it's all very overwhelming and leaves me confused on how to overcome it all.