Shredding pictures, discarding ALL cloths, discarding pre-transition friends, family, acquaintances, documents with our former names... well the list goes on.
As far as pictures go I personally got rid of loads, but now there are still these pre-teen, baby, in my teens, and in my twenties pictures... hum... and then some.
Once our ID/passports are changed can we actually start to dump old utility bills, bank records, doctors bills, and on.
I have just what I can see from where it sit, some 36 ring-folders (A4) full of paper-stuff. From my first qualifications back in the 60s even some 50s to practically now.
If ever I had the idea of not coming out to a more intimate partner, a sleep over :) - what then. There be no way to have this stuff just lying about in date-order in my study, yes?
I guess you got my drift... what about you?
Axélle
I'll start off by saying that I do like the idea of living in stealth. I'm a few weeks away from being full-time so I haven't been able to action all of this fully yet.
- Clothes - yes I will discard every last stitch
- Documents - ideally it will only be my birth certificate left. Paper docs don't mean much these days so I'll shred those. I'll ask my university to reissue my degree certificate as I do like that one. If I find anything else that's important I'll ask for a reissue. I use paperless bills and setups wherever possible which helps there.
- Pictures - I avoided cameras whilst growing up so this one is ok for me. I have kept hold of a few old pictures as the 'before and after' comparisons are interesting but I will delete them soon. I like to remember my experiences of travelling and the such like, so I'll keep photos of the places, but I'd rather remember them through my mind's eye and not be reminded of my appearance at the time.
- People - I'll always keep my close family and close friends in my life, but I will confess that the thought of emigrating has it's appeal to me. Also I won't be changing my job anytime soon so further stealth won't be possible until I do so. Definitely the most complicated one this!
Quote from: Axélle-Michélle on April 15, 2012, 09:54:35 AM
If ever I had the idea of not coming out to a more intimate partner, a sleep over :) - what then. There be no way to have this stuff just lying about in date-order in my study, yes?
I think I'll nick that concept, as it's a good test for whether I've covered everything :)
I know a lot of people find it hard to throw things away. Luckily I'm a minimalist at heart so I don't hoard much and I find doing this type of thing relatively easy - plus I find it helps me to feel consistent day to day by not having these types of reminders kicking around.
I will keep my yearbooks but other than that I have no intention of taking any other pictures with me when I move out to transition. I will probably keep some of my clothes because some are gender neutral. I may just donate the rest. I may keep a few documents with my original name in case I ever have to pull them out.
As far as people are concerned, I have no intentions of keeping up with the people I go to church with. I don't want to get rid of my family but I have a feeling that I will have to. I have cut most access off from my high school friends. It just seems easier to start from scratch.
I won't disagree with anyone who chooses to do that. But I always feel that, trying to run away from your past is silly.
The past is for learning. Our past is who we are, how we got to where we are.
Quote from: spacial on April 15, 2012, 06:44:47 PM
I won't disagree with anyone who chooses to do that. But I always feel that, trying to run away from your past is silly.
The past is for learning. Our past is who we are, how we got to where we are.
That's just it... how CAN we leave our past actually "behind" ... particular in the way, call it philosophically speaking: "
Our past is who we are, how we got to where we are."
Of course not everyone will agree... does it mean once more fooling ourselves, trying to hide just in a "new box" just a different one, once again?
I am really not sure about that. I guess only time will tell
Axélle
I suppose people have different attachments to their past and whether pics include loved ones they may not have many pics of. I have some old pics and the pics that my dad had, I don't plan on discarding those as the pics meant a bit to him. Heck, there is even a pic of my dad, my two brothers and I in tuxes for one of my brothers wedding that is on a wall in the house, I see no need in taking it down. As for people, while there were a few I would have liked to just shred, I wrote off pretty much all extended family and have only my immediate family in my life. A lot of others, I have kept in my life, after all I do still live in the same place as I did for years before transitioning. And clothes wise, the only things I kept were tshirts and a couple of jackets, everything else went.
A lot also would depend on whether someone wants to go completely stealth or is ok with living openly trans, I would imagine. I would just hate to imagine the stress worrying about someone from your past coming back to haunt you or something. Or the damage that could be done to your life if people reacted badly to finding out, especially any partners or spouses that weren't aware of it.
Thanks Jaime, nice post, I can relate...
Axélle
I don't have any intention of trying to dispose of my past. My past had served me well, I got 23 years of marriage and two wonderful kids. I live openly trans; it's what works for me.
I did get rid of many old clothes, this weekend in fact. But, it's because I don't see myself using them ever again. The charities that my ex-wife works for could always use clothes, especially clothes good enough for folks to wear to job interviews. My old ties I gave to my daughter, as she loves wearing ties.
Pictures, I'm going to keep. David is as much a part of Connie as Connie had always been a part of David. He is my past, and she is my present and future.
I like boy clothes. I kept whatever stuff was still of use/fits.
I've never owned a picture. And I've been pretty intensely phobic of having my picture taken... since I was like 12. The few that exist are in my parents' possession. I asked them not to display them, but otherwise I don't care what they do with 'em. The younger pics... you'd be hard pressed to tell the gender of the person, especially given I still have that tomboy style going, so it really doesn't matter.
I don't have many paper documents. Those that I do are in the correct name/gender. There is stuff on my computer that could out me. It's locked and I never really let anyone touch it. It's got my life in it.
Things have never really meant much to me. They have a function, or I throw them out. The exception being my books; I love my books.
I don't discard people. If that ends up outing me, so be it. I am moving cities, but that's more of a job thing than a privacy thing.
Honestly, I don't really have much of a past to discard - my family, one close friend, a terminated two-year relationship, a couple university degrees and a lot of pain. That's about it for the first 26 years of my life.
I don't think it's a very good idea to go and destroy everything to ensure stealth. Just hide obvious stuff with the wrong name on it. If someone has access to those things, either you've not hidden them well enough, either that person is close enough to you for you to tell them.
I feel that going paranoid and getting rid of everything is a huge hassle, a huge amount of stress and could even be a hindrance to stealth and whatnot: the absence of all those things could become suspicious. And then, if you really want to keep your cover, you have to lie. And as soon as you start wrapping your life in lies, chances are that you won't be happy in the long run.
If you want a minimum of discretion/a normal life, it's normal to have a few little precautions, but if you ask me, as soon as it involves lying about significant things, especially to people close to you, it begins to be unhealthy.
Yes, different people have different attachments. I think people tend to hold-onto what is important to them and they tend to let go of things that are toxic to them or things that lack importance.
Before transition I was like an observer. I could only watch while others had lives and my only solace was that I was going to eventually kill myself. After I finally transitioned I knew what it meant to actually have something worth dying for. Because previously I was so afraid I would die if I tried to transition, I was afraid I would loose my family, my ability to support myself... I thought I would end up homeless and die in the street.
But having transitioned I finally had something worth fighting to the death to defend. Or as a friend put it, "I finally had something worth living for."
I didn't have a life before transition. I didn't create any relationships that were dependent upon my pre-transition-persona. I was alone, I had no one to bring with me from the past. I destroyed every photo and all the paperwork I could destroy and when I find something with my with the old name on it, it's a sickening feeling.
Out with the old, in with the new. In order to be able to receive the new I don't want anything old in my hands, it's all worthless to me if not even less than worthless, perhaps dangerous maybe? Looking forward to moving far away soon ^_^ and a completely new life although my life is pretty good already, especially lately. But the farther I can get from the garbage that would pull me down with it, the better, the much, much better ^_^ !
If and when I ever go full time, I'd probably get rid of my 'male' clothes (except for the unisex stuff), can't stand it anyways.. looks so blah.. lol. As for paperwork or anything important... I was thinking of getting maybe a safety deposit box and putting them in there in case I ever needed them in an emergency or something... otherwise I would start fresh. Family and friends are important to me... so I would try to take them with me... but would be prepared to loose them if I had to. I know it would be hard, but I am capable of starting new if I had to; albeit a very lonely prospect, but I could do it.
My past is and always will be part of who I am.. Sure, I got rid of all the male clothing I had - but that was more because I needed the space.. :)
When I last moved I did get rid of a bunch of stuff from my past, most of which I've been dragging around since I first moved out of my parents place and I hadn't looked at or thought about any of it, so it was well past time for it to go..
I needed to clear out my wardrobe before I moved, so that wasn't a hard choice. Seeing as I moved interstate, I only keep in touch with friends who stood by me anyway, and am making a whole new lot.
As I seemed to be the only member of the family with an interest in the camera,I don't have all that many photo's with me in them anyway, so will keep the few I have I guess, as they have the kids also.
Karen.
Quote from: kelly_aus on April 19, 2012, 05:46:37 AM
My past is and always will be part of who I am.. Sure, I got rid of all the male clothing I had - but that was more because I needed the space.. :)
I got rid of my man clothes, and my closet is getting MORE crowded!
Quote from: Axélle-Michélle on April 15, 2012, 09:54:35 AM
discarding pre-transition friends, family, acquaintances
This is the only part I really want to say anything about. In my case family isn't applicable, but in terms of the rest - no, I wouldn't discard those I formed bonds with since, dispite any outward physical appearance, I've always been myself with people. That's something which hasn't changed, and won't change. And being male or female isn't a criteria on which I choose who to be friends with. It's more than that. It's something within the individual themselves rather than how they see me in terms of gender or, indeed, how I see them. I'm very careful choosing who to form friendships with, and the reciprocation of that is something which matters to me.
Because of that, such friendships were formed from the heart, and whatever else they are still important to me. I would hope that they could stay that way.
Quote from: Sephirah on April 19, 2012, 10:54:58 AM
This is the only part I really want to say anything about. In my case family isn't applicable, but in terms of the rest - no, I wouldn't discard those I formed bonds with since, dispite any outward physical appearance, I've always been myself with people. That's something which hasn't changed, and won't change. And being male or female isn't a criteria on which I choose who to be friends with. It's more than that. It's something within the individual themselves rather than how they see me in terms of gender or, indeed, how I see them. I'm very careful choosing who to form friendships with, and the reciprocation of that is something which matters to me.
Because of that, such friendships were formed from the heart, and whatever else they are still important to me. I would hope that they could stay that way.
Nice post I liked reading it like most all of the rest...
Thank you.
I wish, I wish, I wished it to work for me this way. I don't say it quite doesn't, - yet there is a BUT... as always?
What do we "do" with supporting friends, that either by slip of the tongue, by a bit of juicy goss, or just by a close to hostile partner, keep outing you to their acquaintances and friends?
Might as well hang sign on your neck saying "trans... ...".
Tricky.
When it happened, a number of times to me as it stands, it did make me consider to stop seeing them, sticking to the phone... only.
THEN!... they "helped" me, by not inviting me over to any "family" do's - because "we do not want to be seen mixing with strange and weird individuals. It will give us a bad critique, so let's not ask her (HIM?) over..." um.
As for those that are openly hostile (unsupportive is too mild...), well they can, and already do shoot the breeze.
Lastly, even those are not that easy to JUST discard... having spend YEARS in their company too.
And yes... now who was it, that said it was easy? :)
Axélle
Quote from: Sephirah on April 19, 2012, 10:54:58 AM
This is the only part I really want to say anything about. In my case family isn't applicable, but in terms of the rest - no, I wouldn't discard those I formed bonds with since, dispite any outward physical appearance, I've always been myself with people. That's something which hasn't changed, and won't change. And being male or female isn't a criteria on which I choose who to be friends with. It's more than that. It's something within the individual themselves rather than how they see me in terms of gender or, indeed, how I see them. I'm very careful choosing who to form friendships with, and the reciprocation of that is something which matters to me.
Because of that, such friendships were formed from the heart, and whatever else they are still important to me. I would hope that they could stay that way.
Excellent post.
True friends are just that, true friends. I've had several tell me that they suspected or that it all makes sense now. I've actually reconnected with a LOT of old friends since I transitioned because I had run away from some because I had let them see too much. My circle of friends is so much bigger and stronger now than it ever was. I think that to a degree, coming out to a close friend can only help the relationship since you have shown you love and trust them enough to share one of your deepest secrets.
Quote from: Dr. Seuss or Bernard Baruch depending on how picky you are with the EXACT wording
Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.
Not just speaking in terms of sour grapes, but if you lose a "friend" because you came out to them, then they really weren't a true friend.
The world is too small now to hide our past. No matter how careful someone will always find out. Personally I would rather be in control of how someone important found out than just chance comments or rumors.
Quote from: Axélle-Michélle on April 15, 2012, 09:54:35 AM
Shredding pictures, discarding ALL cloths, discarding pre-transition friends, family, acquaintances, documents with our former names... well the list goes on.
As far as pictures go I personally got rid of loads, but now there are still these pre-teen, baby, in my teens, and in my twenties pictures... hum... and then some.
Once our ID/passports are changed can we actually start to dump old utility bills, bank records, doctors bills, and on.
I have just what I can see from where it sit, some 36 ring-folders (A4) full of paper-stuff. From my first qualifications back in the 60s even some 50s to practically now.
If ever I had the idea of not coming out to a more intimate partner, a sleep over :) - what then. There be no way to have this stuff just lying about in date-order in my study, yes?
I guess to got my drift... what about you?
Axélle
Hell no; doing so will hurt my children and friends. Where does stop, should we make up our past too?
Not much to get rid of... a few androgynous clothes... that's about it?
Life has been on pause until now. Never had a male life.
Quote from: pretty on April 19, 2012, 04:13:25 PM
Not much to get rid of... a few androgynous clothes... that's about it?
Life has been on pause until now. Never had a male life.
Haha yeah pretty much this. I never had that male privilege either. =P
Too many really good friends to throw them all away trying to hide from everyone I am trans. I'm not ashamed of what I am today and my past is part of who I am today. I am loved and love several people from my past. That's just not even an option, love doesn't come around often and to have several people who really care about me is a blessing.
As far as the rest? Guy clothes were all gone 10 years ago. Pictures from my past etc, I'm not going to shred in an attempt to run from it. I'm not ashamed of what I was before. The problem then becomes if you throw away your past life, what do you plan to do when someone asks? Make up some past life and events that never happened to try to cover it your real past?
I've spent enough time hiding my true self from the world, being in the closet. For me being deep stealth would be jumping from one closet into another. I also want to make a statement with my life and try to make the world a better place. I feel being "The transgendered woman they know and like" is one more step closer the public accepting being transgendered is OK. When they hear transgendered people try to hide this from others, what message does that send out?
I also don't believe most people out in public read me but if they do, they accept me and treat me with respect/as a woman. I'm also very happy and don't have any fear of "being outed" either. I don't believe I would be as happy if I was worried about someone finding out my past to the point I was burning pictures and shredding documents.
I cant. 28 years of my life cant be thrown away. Even if most of those years was painful I also had a few happy moments, especially as a child! And as said before my experiences and life until now has made me who I am.
However I can understand that some find their past to painful to be reminded of and therefore get rid of those things that remind them.
I am not ashamed of who I am or what I am, if someone got a problem with it then they have to deal with it because I am done hiding. I will live my life as I want to live it and nobody can stand in my way in that regard. Ever!
I get rid of the stuff that makes me feel bad.
Hi,
Well what would you do had you been intersexed, changes the pic a bit .
the only ....things .... i gave away were my male clothes, as i hated any male clothes , that i had to wear, yet im proud of being seconded to the Navy so yes i liked those clothes as they did have meaning for me.
any day male clothes other than those are all gone ,
Some of my background, im quite happy with, some of cause im not yet even the good with the bad it is my background that has helped in my becomeing a very strong woman & with out that i would not have faired as well
My past is who i am, my present is liveing as my self a woman , my future ill continue as a woman , my past is well known by others & they know me well enough to accept i am who i am . i have lots of pics im happy with them .
as to changes i have a nice body shape similer to women, im fit , my only down fall is my facial features that have not changed much over the years in reguard to looking more female / woman like,
oh well part of being intersexed, other than that im happy with what i have,
...noeleena...
Interesting thread...
I'm wondering "Why" though?? Why delete or erase your physical past? What happens if someday someone asked about it, would you suddenly drop everything and run away again? Or will you conjure-up some mystical story, pretend you didn't know it existed? or perhaps state you had a memory lost; generally lie to your new friends??
Personally, I'm not gonna bother with running away, I'm gonna try transition where I'm currently am.. I figured they'll learn about it sonner or later, might-as-well face-up to the music... Then again, most of my friends don't seem to know am I male or female anyway - they keep asking.. lol
Quote from: Lazarus on April 25, 2012, 07:33:44 PM
Interesting thread...
I'm wondering "Why" though?? Why delete or erase your physical past? What happens if someday someone asked about it, would you suddenly drop everything and run away again? Or will you conjure-up some mystical story, pretend you didn't know it existed? or perhaps state you had a memory lost; generally lie to your new friends??
Personally, I'm not gonna bother with running away, I'm gonna try transition where I'm currently am.. I figured they'll learn about it sonner or later, might-as-well face-up to the music... Then again, most of my friends don't seem to know am I male or female anyway - they keep asking.. lol
I think that for some people, getting rid of old things isn't deleting, erasing, or running away. I'm not stealth but I'm not going to surround myself with incongruencies either.
Interesting thread Axélle! I haven't thrown many of my old pictures away. I usually wore my hair long and looked very androgynous and the earlier pictures from my teens even more so. I did throw most of the old bills and paperwork out years ago. I started buying female clothes in 1984, so I haven't thrown many clothes away over the years, only some of the clothes that were too small or worn out.
I haven't thought about that, I'm not sure how possible it will be for me to do that because the past is important to me, even if I've had a horrible pain of feeling like I wanted to be something else, what I am now and was is always going to be important memories because of the happiness I did have.
That said I don't have any really good pictures of me I'd keep, I almost never bought my yearbooks and avoided pictures when I could until I was about 19 (This got me whipped a few times when I actively hid behind a pillar when we had our picture taken for bible school), It's funny now in retrospect looking at the photo of someone hiding their face behind a while column.
But some clothing I could never get rid of, regardless of how tied to my past it is, Like my shirt I got for my high school play.
Soon I will be able to burn all my old US tax files with that horrid old name on them ^_^ . I should go and check them tomorrow, 7 years back is all I need so maybe I can destroy the old ones already ^_^ !
Quote from: Felix on April 30, 2012, 08:24:13 AM
I think that for some people, getting rid of old things isn't deleting, erasing, or running away. I'm not stealth but I'm not going to surround myself with incongruencies either.
QFT
I just can't get rid of my stuff. And I have boxes and boxes of it in the garage and in the house. I would make a very poor Buddhist; I'm very attached to possessions from my past. I am trying though to scan everything and then get rid of it as long as I have a digital copy. I even got all the negatives to my childhood photos from my mom and I've been scanning that as well. I have no problems looking at kiddie pictures; its the puberty/teenage and adult pictures that give me lingering dysphoria. So I will probably copy those but not really look at them much. And some things, like old diaries and letters and yearbooks, I can't bear to throw out at all. They still hold a lot of sentimental value to me. Just my personality...
I have no reason to get rid of my items. I love the pictures I have and I'm not going to go stealth. I also may or may not decide to cross-dress on occasion once I get going in my transition and I have some really cute girl tops. :3 A lot of the pictures I have are very sentimental and involve family so I don't want to get rid of that.
I've been trying pretty hard to forget about the first 20 years of abuse, depression, underachieving and just general awfulness, so yes, I got rid of pretty much all my stuff. :P Actually, now that I think of it, my government ID is the only thing I have from before, and that'll be changing pretty soon. :)
I have kept in contact with one friend, a guy I've been friends with since we were 5. We're kind of drifting apart as of late, mainly because I'm not at all like I was, I just feel like we have nothing in common anymore. I told myself over and over that I wouldn't change, that I would be the same person after transitioning, but I really don't think that it's possible. A lot changes when you let go of the 'man' mentality and aren't afraid to admit to needing help, and as painful as it was I feel better for it. :)
I don't really think the things I've done in the past are really representative of where I'm headed, so I didn't see a need to keep them.
I will not when I get farther into my transition.
Granted I was handed cards that I did not want, my past is is what defines me(Both the Light and the dark parts). Everything about my past has helped shape who I am. Granted I will loose some friends and acquaintances in the process, I hope that I don't seeing how they are part of my life.
Clothes on the other hand...Nope!!! I still have clothes from when I was in Highschool ;D...Ask my wife...Granted she is trying to get rid of them..
As a guy, I never under stood the need for seasonal wardrobes. Now, I find myself thinking that way all the time! :D