Am I the only one? I am only semi-passable. I get clocked 50/50. And their stares are really annoying and worse when they start bullying calling bullcraps as: 'This is man, what is this, what is this thing, what's this creature, yuck' etc... I get seriously fed up and I never go out on the streets anymore, just forcibly to go to grocery to buy food and to pay my bills. I wanna go and live life, I wanna go to parks, cinema, shopping malls, hang out with friends(even my friends are embarassed to walk with me cos I attract to many stares), nightclubs. I can't do any of those cos all people always spoil my mood with their effing stares and never-ending insults. I don't feel like living until I get FULL FFS & SRS. For now I'm just like a pupa in its cocoon waiting impatiently to be a butterfly one day. And concerning work, I work at home. I'm scared I fail to never have FFS & SRS, my entire life will be ruined and all this transition wouldn't make sense by the end and worse I can't even backtrack, I've reached too far to and middle way now. How many of you don't go out just cos you're unpassable and how to you deal with this sh*t.
Everyday really , I normally look like a really feminine guy , and tie hair and wear a hat or a hoodie. I'm waiting on money for ffs, or hormones to work a bit better. That's not to say I am afraid of being who I am and bla bla bla, because I walked down a main street in a capital city in a dress with no makeup in busiest hour and just didn't give a ->-bleeped-<- what people thought. Walked with held high and just brushed it off. I saw all the stares ,had people laughing , had people not sure on how to react to me , I didn't really care to be honest. I personally though have always been really sensitive so that would get to me everyday, I'm also very introverted so I kinda hate when the spotlight is on me. . Hence why I'm waiting which really doesn't bother me , cause my entire family/friends know anyway , and I don't feel like I'm physically female for the world to see what I see. I don't know people are so visual and only take in what they can see. People always assume I'm 16 or something and don't bother me at all.
also not getting invited out because i'm trans , made me realize who my friends truely are, my dad/brothers don't care being seen with me so why should 2 cisgender girls be embarassed? sigh. One day old friend put on facebook anyone want to come out , and I replied , even my sister said that I would come. She totally brushed it off, i got ready , got in a white shirt , tied hair , put on jeans , i was trying to look as masculine as possible. Only to ring her up at the time and ask her where she was and she was like "oh sorry I didn't think you were comming" such a load of crap. I cried to sister saying ,"i think she thinks i was going to cross dress or something" my sister just said she's not a real friend.
Pretty much, but for slightly different reasons. Over the past thirty years I've dipped my toe into the waters and been a variety of places. I tend to wait about a year until I've got over the last time I went out. Then I'll go out a few times and generally things are fine, I don't get looks and I think everything is going fine, but then I'll get one stare/comment and I come crashing back to earth. As long as I don't interact with people I can live in my deluded fantasy world.
I'm now 16 months into my latest attempt at HRT and things are going pretty well with facial changes. I dress for the one hour drive to work every morning and just this morning I needed diesel on the way. I thought for a long time whether it was time to put myself to the test (again), but didn't.
I'm not scared of the reactions, I'm scared of the misery it induces in me when it happens.
I'll admit, I do have to tighten down my loose screws prior to going anywhere other than known safe areas (such as work, grocery store, etc). Generally my fears are never actually realized...and I've only had one incident of "You are a man!" in the past couple of years.
At my core, I don't really care what others think, but there are loose "parts" of me that tremble at being called out...I just try to calm them down, to assure them it won't be as bad as they make it out to be.
Just imagine what cis-women go through if they're "unattractive" (in the Hollywood sense) or severely overweight...
*hugs* to everyone who's been bullied. Best way to stop them though is to develop an inner strength that won't buckle under their pressure. (Yes, easier said than done...but it MUST be done)
My wife is no supermodel, and she told me a few weeks ago that every now and then she gets some incredibly insulting comments from kids who think it's funny to belittle people.
I didn't pass for many months, and to compensate overused makeup to the point I looked freakish a few times. So there was a period where I wore androgynous clothes to look like an old and ragged butch lesbian. That was actually o.k. for me at the time, and as HRT did it's work I look more feminine, but still not very good. After refining a makeup routine I'm comfortable, and don't even think about how I look. Every few months there's a few hideously obscene slurs from bigoted A-Holes, but I brush them off now and don't worry about it.
I wish we could all pass the first time we step out the door. But it doesn't happen for 90% of us. It's not easy hun, and it takes time. If you're uncomfortable with your look, discover something more andro that makes you comfortable for a while. Let the look grow as time goes by, and one day it's gonna be ok. Maybe not fantastic, but you'll be happy.
Hugs.
A lot of us suffer from an anxiety disorder, and gender dysphoria can exacerbate it. Issues of passing or not passing, and any negative reactions or ill treatment we perceive, can become strong triggers for social anxiety, general anxiety, agoraphobia, panic attacks, etc.
I can attest that anxiety disorders are very treatable, even if antianxiety medications aren't an option, like my case.
I once had crippling social and generalized anxiety, with severe panic attacks. But after two years of therapy and lots of desensitization (practice!) I am free of social anxiety and almost free of non-social sensitivity to panic and anxiety altogether.
If I have time I will share the techniques I've learned, but my point is that once the anxiety is alleviated, the confidence that lets us project who we are and makes us immune to bullying is in reach. Regardless of our individual "passing" wishes or challenges. In fact, when we are comfortable in our own skin, bullies pass us over for more vulnerable prey.
-Maddie
Nearly anxiety free since very recently
Hugs, E.B. I can imagine how humiliating and daunting it must be.
Can you imagine a shield around you and that comments from fools just bounce off it?
If anyone threatens you physically, look into what local law enforcement can do for you. The police don't always protect our rights, but it is their job (regardless of who we are) and I'm always on the side of demanding that they do it.
I hope things get better for you.
It is a terrible thing to happen to you. One time with me it was kind of funny. It was cold out and I had my men's coat on because I didn't have a woman's coat. I had a nice dress and make up . This was all pre transition. Some guy was walking towards me from the other direction and yelled out ->-bleeped-<-. I couldn't quite figure what exactly he thought I was male because of the mans coat or female because of the dress.
If you were to lump all the people that fall into the transgender spectrum you would find that the overwhelming majority stay at home and never leave the house.
Why is that? Perhaps there are 1000 answers to this question. On the other hand if you are someone that is going to transition at some point ya have to bite the bullet and do what you have to do. I should point out that there are a lot of women that came before you and we survived. We fought tooth and nail to carve a place in society for ourselves. In hindsight perhaps that's why so few leave the house.... they simply aren't willing to do the work to achieve such a hard goal. If there is one thing I learned in life it would be that nothing worth a crap comes easy!
Katie
I don't dress in a feminine manner, but there are very few places I would not go. I'd avoid cowboy or biker bars or any sort of place where there is fighting.
I go to water aerobics class, where there are typically a dozen women and one or two men. I used to worry about my boobs until an older man with boobs that drooped nearly to his waist joined the class.
My summer attire of khaki shorts and polo shirt is pretty androgynous.
I've even gotten comments from college age girls calling me out as an FTM, when I'm MTF. One girl in a group shouted "He's a Lesbian!" That made me happy. It was as if she acknowledge that I was a woman, if a bit butch, under my androgynous clothes.
Randi
Quote from: Katie on December 05, 2013, 11:27:25 AM
If you were to lump all the people that fall into the transgender spectrum you would find that the overwhelming majority stay at home and never leave the house.
Why is that? Perhaps there are 1000 answers to this question. On the other hand if you are someone that is going to transition at some point ya have to bite the bullet and do what you have to do. I should point out that there are a lot of women that came before you and we survived. We fought tooth and nail to carve a place in society for ourselves. In hindsight perhaps that's why so few leave the house.... they simply aren't willing to do the work to achieve such a hard goal. If there is one thing I learned in life it would be that nothing worth a crap comes easy!
Katie
I couldn't agree more Katie your not going to get anywhere by worrying about what other people are saying or thinking. I'm glad I started going out prior to hrt and passing it makes me grateful for everything I have now. Transitioning like everything that's worth something in life is a risk and yes you could have somebody make fun of you but it's not the end of the world to be laughed at. I could have stayed at home and worried about what people would think about me. But I didn't and I am the woman I am today because I left the house and was willing to put up with some stares and some laughter. ;)
Quote from: Heather on December 05, 2013, 12:26:23 PM
I am the woman I am today because I left the house and was willing to put up with some stares and some laughter. ;)
My experience was similar. No one laughed but there was a lot of staring, smirking and scowling. (Also a lot of people gave me compliments out of the blue).
This gave me courage. I realized I could deal with all and that whether or not I was passable, I'd be able to handle living full time.
I don't give a rat's ass about haters.I go where I feel like though I avoid bars and war zones if possible.Someone says something bad to me 9 times out of 10 I ignore it,otherwise it's a **** you from me.
I started dressing when I was a little kid. By the time I got to my twenties I had to get out or go insane.
I do not pass. Why does that matter to me? Why can't I just ignore it and know that I'm a woman anyway? Why don't I just do what I feel? Here's why:
I'm already doing what I feel. I'm being myself. I feel I have no choice in that regardless of how I look or how people address me. I do know that I'm a woman, but I know other people don't see me that way. I don't use clothing or voice or social roles to define myself, and I don't feel any satisfaction from people electing to accept me as something -- as though I were proposing a suggestion, and they subsequently decide if they want to participate. It makes me feel as if I'm offering someone a portion of a candy bar and they can either partake or reject. My womanhood is not analogous to a candy bar, and I'd rather avoid experiencing that situation altogether.
If I were to wear women's clothing, I would do it because I like what I choose to wear. But if wearing what I like means that I have to constantly go through the candy bar checkpoint, I would personally not have the capacity to enjoy what I am wearing. As a result, for the time being, I am reclusive because I both do not want to become exhausted via candy bar logistics, and neither do I identify as a male or have any desire to involve myself in life under that pretext of identity -- for the record, when I do go out, I dress as androgynous as possible and have a femininely groomed appearance (plucked eyebrows, enhance eyebrows with makeup, long, shiny, wavy hair, so on and so forth), I really cannot stand carrying a masculine persona.
It has nothing to do with my wanting to tough it out or work hard. I already work hard toward my transition. I could definitely "bite the bullet," but I wouldn't be any happier. I'd just be a girl in flats who constantly feels horrible, because she can't stop being distracted by wondering about how many people see her as a guy in flats. I'm completely content for the women who do feel happy meeting the transition challenge headstrong, but it is simply not for me; this is all despite the fact that my friends are proactively supportive of me, my co-workers are aware and have proactively expressed support for whenever I decide to move along, and much of my family supports me; the people I know easily see me as feminine. A big part of it for me is how grossly uncomfortable I feel in my skin, not just my clothing.
Our individuality isn't only an extension of personality but of our inner selves. My individuality (and that of many other trans people) states that it is not comfortable "forcing" a presentation.
Hhhhm, for me its kinda different...I ve been out as a girl a couple of times an even though I didnt expect it I wasnt nervous or anything,no one said anything and I feel like the stares were only a few , even my friends dont mind...
But the thing is that I mind, I know that under the make up and clothing I still have a mans body and thats whats bother me, Im not afraid of what people will say , but I still feel this frustration with my self and I believe that is the reason I dont go out as a girl that much...
I just want hormones to change me a bit so I can finally feel at ease.
It is true though that most people wont react to you no matter if you pass or not,sadly there are still are some bad people out there,if it happens to meet one just ignore...
One time when I was passing the androgynous state there was some teens bullying me out in the streets , and I remember that when they tried to hit me immediately some other pedestrians came to help me , that gave me hope and made me realize that as long as good people exist we will be able to live , its up too you.
This isnt meant to sound harsh but, transitioning socially is hard.
I consider myself incredibly lucky because I've never once been the subject of any bullying, no one has ever called anything transphobic out to me, I've never been stared at. However, and its a big however, I transitioned very slowly because I knew, I couldn't take the stress of being abused..
I took hormones and presented as male, I did this until people assumed I was female regardless of what I did. I then, very slowly began to alter my dress sense. I didn't just throw a dress on a skip down the streets...
I'm not saying people shouldn't just dress how they want whenever they want, and I'm not excusing the horrid behaviour of disgusting people who abuse others. What I am saying is, If you're struggling to cope with the fact that you don't pass, maybe just continue with hrt and slowly present as more androgynous.
i know when i first started i didn't want to go outside let alone to school. i got beaten up alot in 8th grade because the guys thought i was gay. and also in 7tth grade so i said the heck with it. i just had to learn hot to run fast. but as the hormones did their work the guys did not feel comfortable beating me up anymore plus their girlfriends all made them stop. i say even when you cant pass you can at least try.
Quote from: Isabelle on December 06, 2013, 01:11:55 AM
This isnt meant to sound harsh but, transitioning socially is hard.
I consider myself incredibly lucky because I've never once been the subject of any bullying, no one has ever called anything transphobic out to me, I've never been stared at. However, and its a big however, I transitioned very slowly because I knew, I couldn't take the stress of being abused..
I took hormones and presented as male, I did this until people assumed I was female regardless of what I did. I then, very slowly began to alter my dress sense. I didn't just throw a dress on a skip down the streets...
I'm not saying people shouldn't just dress how they want whenever they want, and I'm not excusing the horrid behaviour of disgusting people who abuse others. What I am saying is, If you're struggling to cope with the fact that you don't pass, maybe just continue with hrt and slowly present as more androgynous.
I know exactly what you mean.
I've always wondered why more girls don't just wait it out on hrt and save money for surgeries before diving feet first into full time. Some people sadly don't naturally pass before hrt & surge. To me it all goes back to planing and being 100% honest with yourself before just putting yourself out there with the wolves. We all know what we look like and that should always be taken into account beforehand. I know many girls who waited till things were further enough along before going full time. I think it's better to ease into things gradually. Getting clocked is the lest of any girls worries if you ask me. I tend to look at things from a safety point. It's just not safe to jump out there prematurely.
It may not be fun waiting but nothing worth having/doing is ever easy. Why set yourself up for what could be easily avoided?
Reading through this thread has initiated a minor crisis of confidence for me :o
I don't pass. I'm still learning to cover up my beard shadow.
I'm lucky too in that I haven't really been bullied for this.
I've been out to eat twice and while no one gave me funny looks or openly laughed at me, I have a feeling they knew I was not CIS female. Where I love people are very polite and there's little chance of violence on the streets, so I'm lucky there again.
I was ok with funny looks because I know that HRT and laser will eventually make my face less obviously masculine.
That was until I read through this thread :D
Then I got a grip. If I can deal with it looking like I am now then I can certainly deal with it further down the line when I appear more in line with my mental gender.
This is the time when I grow a slightly thicker skin :)
Quote from: Isabelle on December 06, 2013, 01:11:55 AM
This isnt meant to sound harsh but, transitioning socially is hard.
I consider myself incredibly lucky because I've never once been the subject of any bullying, no one has ever called anything transphobic out to me, I've never been stared at. However, and its a big however, I transitioned very slowly because I knew, I couldn't take the stress of being abused..
I took hormones and presented as male, I did this until people assumed I was female regardless of what I did. I then, very slowly began to alter my dress sense. I didn't just throw a dress on a skip down the streets...
I'm not saying people shouldn't just dress how they want whenever they want, and I'm not excusing the horrid behaviour of disgusting people who abuse others. What I am saying is, If you're struggling to cope with the fact that you don't pass, maybe just continue with hrt and slowly present as more androgynous.
I'm kind of in the same situation as you, except now every time I open my mouth, people get shocked, or something. (Long hair and a little more fat on the face does a lot. Even with a visible adams.) Something that makes me feel somewhat uncomfortable about having to meet new people and ordering food at a restaurant. This is all no makeup, wearing guy clothes. But that doesn't stop me. We all need friends (whether or not they know NOW) and I have to eat. Apparently not too healthy of food, though, since *most* healthy food isn't something you order, it's something you make yourself ;) I haven't yet (in the last 4 months) met someone who said they knew I was a guy from first glance. They ALL said something like, Oh, I thought you were a girl. *Intermal smile*
Anyway, I have no choice but to go out. I live 40 mins walking distance from my work, so I can either walk or take the bus, both of which I will be in the vicinity of many people of all ages. My doctor is 1.5 hours away by subway, so, can't avoid the public there either. Weekends, I will not stay inside. I just can't.
Having said all that, I do try to time my bathroom occurrences to match when I might have to go to being home/in a privat-er bathroom (at a small restaurant).
QuoteI'm kind of in the same situation as you, except now every time I open my mouth, people get shocked,
Yeah, I remember those looks.. That's when I knew I needed to master my voice. I haven't presented as male in 2 years or so now and pass as cis. ( I'm sure I get clocked occasionally though)
Quote from: Janae on December 06, 2013, 02:10:13 AM
I know exactly what you mean.
I've always wondered why more girls don't just wait it out on hrt and save money for surgeries before diving feet first into full time. Some people sadly don't naturally pass before hrt & surge. To me it all goes back to planing and being 100% honest with yourself before just putting yourself out there with the wolves. We all know what we look like and that should always be taken into account beforehand. I know many girls who waited till things were further enough along before going full time. I think it's better to ease into things gradually. Getting clocked is the lest of any girls worries if you ask me. I tend to look at things from a safety point. It's just not safe to jump out there prematurely.
It may not be fun waiting but nothing worth having/doing is ever easy. Why set yourself up for what could be easily avoided?
You are very right on one sense but be aware many of us begin transition VERY late and some like me were never sure whether we'd even have the money for surgeries. And we can't wait indefinitely, youth is something that doesn't last forever. Dysphoria was and is still VERY high. I couldn't bare living a single day more as a guy. I said f*** it even if I'm unpassable but I need to wear a female dress, make up and high heels or I'd get sick mentally. But there's a big price to pay and I am paying it right now.
This one's a tricky topic for me. I really only go out to buy groceries, and I have severe enough general and social anxiety to no be able to work and I have to live on help from disability. That part of things feels crappy, but I don't plan on being so cut off from the outside world forever. That said though, for me... I've gone out a few times more feminine looking than others. I have cute earrings I got as a coming-out symbol and honestly I always wear them, everywhere. (I do need more earrings though, lol.)
Right now my strong dislike of attention, in a general way from being very introverted and shy as just a person, is a bit jumbled into my worries when I go out with, say, makeup on. I try to not separate the issues and just think of it as people liking me as a person or not, and actually, so far anyway, the more comfortable and confident I am, the less trouble I have. One thing that helped me go clothes shopping was thinking to myself, "Acting all nervous and scared is what's the most suspicious. I should act like I belong where I'm at, just doing what I want like everyone else." For me it worked, and there I was, shopping for clothes at a huge store, with nobody giving a care, just like me. I overheard a woman telling a sales rep that she was worried about a "creepy man in the women's section" and they weren't talking about me, and that made me smile.
Isabelle's got a great point. I'm taking that route - I went from the guy look (and doing a poor job I might add), to androgynous, to androgynous with some femininity, where I'm at now. Funny thing is that I've only seen people smile at me more and talk to me more, the more I ease into it. I'm a tomboy and I like to wear things like t-shirts and jeans and what not, so I'm not out in dresses (no offense to anyone, it's just my own style :) ). I really like just easing in to my outward presentation changes, and little by little, I get more comfortable with myself.
Quote from: Evolving Beauty on December 06, 2013, 06:24:57 AM
You are very right on one sense but be aware many of us begin transition VERY late and some like me were never sure whether we'd even have the money for surgeries. And we can't wait indefinitely, youth is something that doesn't last forever.
This resonated with me as a 51 year old person that got hit with the transsexual stick late in life. Estrogen has given me a more youthful look but I know that will fade, so I'm moving forward as fast as I can to capture living as I should have been doing with the time I have left. I don't want to waste a single moment with indecision or dithering, my clock is ticking. If I pass, I pass. If I don't - well, I'm still living as the authentic me.
Sure, there are some surgeries that I'd like to have to fix a few age related things, but money is an issue. I've got two kids in college that I'm supporting and I've got lots of bills to pay, so I'll most likely not be able to ever have surgery. That's OK too, there are lots of wrinkly ladies around that are my age :)
And paying the price? Yep, there sure was a huge price for me to pay. Was it worth it? I believe so.
As with many things in life, you have to weigh what's more important to you. In cases like these, it's either your pride or your happiness.
I'm a little luckier , The worst any body ever said to me was that they couldn't tell if I was boy or girl as I passed by them. As long as your make up on properly and maybe long bangs people really aren't going to bother you. I forced my self out into the street a long time ago because I had to do it or go crazy. Most people just don't care. If you go out in day light where a lot of people are nobody's going to bother you. sun glasses help too.
I'm actually thinking of toning it down a lot. I don't think people like me as much anymore or are scared or hestitant or something. Maybe I'm just a bitch. But I think I'm going to tone it down a lot, as in no female clothes. I've never been laughed at. Only been clocked once. I'm starting to wonder if it's even worth it.
Quote from: Joanna Dark on December 06, 2013, 04:09:01 PM
I'm actually thinking of toning it down a lot. I don't think people like me as much anymore or are scared or hestitant or something. Maybe I'm just a bitch. But I think I'm going to tone it down a lot, as in no female clothes. I've never been laughed at. Only been clocked once. I'm starting to wonder if it's even worth it.
Your picture looks great though
Quote from: Alainaluvsu on December 06, 2013, 10:50:48 AM
As with many things in life, you have to weigh what's more important to you. In cases like these, it's either your pride or your happiness.
Yup. The thing is, no matter how well you pass as cis, there are always going to be people who know, family, friends etc.. they will out you. It sucks but it happens. The only way you'll ever be comfortable in your self is when you truly don't care about what other peope think. It's one thing to say it but, another to not give an actual f@$k about other peoples opinions. It takes time and confidence.
Quote from: Isabelle on December 06, 2013, 04:56:56 PM
Yup. The thing is, no matter how well you pass as cis, there are always going to be people who know, family, friends etc.. they will out you. It sucks but it happens. The only way you'll ever be comfortable in your self is when you truly don't care about what other peope think. It's one thing to say it but, another to not give an actual f@$k about other peoples opinions. It takes time and confidence.
That's so true. Which is why I kinda chuckle when people say "I'm 100% stealth". Short of transitioning at 5 and all of your family not being in contact with you whatsoever, you're not stealth.
Quote from: Sybil on December 05, 2013, 10:36:23 PM
candy bar checkpoint
I love this phrase enough to steal it.
But, it's true isn't it? The price of a female presentation is the social obligation to be eye-candy for whoever wants it. They don't like it, it becomes
your problem.
And, for the love of all things cute and fluffy, don't
ever be guilty of appearing pretty whilst presumably packing a penis. Apparently this is one of the worst things a human being is capable of.
My opinion cannot be expressed in polite language, so I'll google up and link an image macro. (http://www.keepcalm-o-matic.co.uk/p/keep-calm-and--%3E-bleeped-%3C--sexism/)
Oh, but it's everywhere: whoever put that together just had to use a Rosie character.
Quote from: Isabelle on December 06, 2013, 01:11:55 AM
This isnt meant to sound harsh but, transitioning socially is hard.
I consider myself incredibly lucky because I've never once been the subject of any bullying, no one has ever called anything transphobic out to me, I've never been stared at. However, and its a big however, I transitioned very slowly because I knew, I couldn't take the stress of being abused..
I took hormones and presented as male, I did this until people assumed I was female regardless of what I did. I then, very slowly began to alter my dress sense. I didn't just throw a dress on a skip down the streets...
I'm not saying people shouldn't just dress how they want whenever they want, and I'm not excusing the horrid behaviour of disgusting people who abuse others. What I am saying is, If you're struggling to cope with the fact that you don't pass, maybe just continue with hrt and slowly present as more androgynous.
This is exactly what I did....in fact I was having the opposite thing happening. I was being gendered female at least 70% of the time over a year before I went FT. I can only say 70% but it could of been even higher....there are many times that there is no reason to be gendered. Most times when I did find out it was very awkward times that I did not know I was being gendered female...I was like....oh crap I better make sure I act like a female now! I could tell some really interesting stories of my mis-genderings!
Many times I hear someone say that when they are out they try to dress androgynously...but when they explain what there wearing, I can understand why they may be getting weird looks. If someone is trying to dress andro.....wearing earrings, nail polish and carrying a purse will not help. These three things alone are probably the most feminine thing a women could do!
I may have been fortunate to fall within the female ranges for my physical traits....but I don't think it was just this. I feel the main reason is that I never pushed my femininity....even when going FT it was very strange to actual have it seen that I did have breasts!
I do remember getting mis-gendered and having some remarks said to me.....this was over 20 years ago when I crossed dressed and weighed considerably more. It wasn't just my size though...it was what I was wearing and how I acted. I remember going to Walmart one time with a very nice woven dress (it was winter at least) and as I walked in a mother grabbed her son or daughter away from me and said "that's a man" This is the only time I have ever had that said. Even during this same time in my life there were times I would be shopping side by side with young teens without getting a even a glance. I learned very much from my cross dressing days....even though I knew I it was much more then cross-dressing.
I can look back even further when I was 16...these were some of my first times out in public as "me" I still remember some of those times like it was yesterday. I passed pretty well back then...but I really didn't care at the time.
Quote from: musicofthenight on December 06, 2013, 09:33:46 PM
The price of a female presentation is the social obligation to be eye-candy for whoever wants it. They don't like it, it becomes your problem.
And, for the love of all things cute and fluffy, don't ever be guilty of appearing pretty whilst presumably packing a penis. Apparently this is one of the worst things a human being is capable of.
I wouldn't go that far. I think it's more a matter of environment and blending that gets the "pass" of being pretty w/ a peener. In more acceptable cities, people don't care. Also, I think the overall presentation will carry your weight for you and make you a bit more "safe" when dealing with men and their snide BS. It's only the very ignorant gutter trash that have horrible lives themselves who make fun of me and they don't have the nerve to do it to my face when they do. I have to hear about it second or third hand (like some homophobic wanna be thug twerp who unfriends me on Facebook and talks about me in other peoples threads).
Why would you do that? I'm 5'3" and fairly petite (size 5-6). It's not like I can beat your ass! Maybe it's because most people would say you're an idiot in the public sphere. If so, then it goes to help prove the point that sometimes you can chalk it up to the overall presentation and how confident you carry
yourself...
Just gonna leave that thought here... *pats the thought and sits down*
In a way, I can relate to this. While I'm out living my life, I'm still not going out as female in public. Yes, things have improved from where I started and I already get some stares, but I haven't attempted to "pass" in public. The main reason is I'm afraid about what other people will say. It's pure fear. At the same time, I feel like I'm shutting myself off from the world. To be honest, I don't know how to live a life as male and it prevents me from being myself. It's hard to socialize or relax around others when you are constantly afraid of how to act. How can you have fun around others or relax if you aren't comfortable with yourself? That's one of the reasons I don't really get out as much as I should. Things are getting better and people have guessed what's going on at this point, but I haven't been able to take that step and be the real me in public. It's scary. Soon enough, though, I will. I'm doing the right things and getting my life on track in general. I'm finally in a good place where transition is possible both emotionally and financially speaking. There is enough progress being made to make up for my current limitations. All that's left is to keep going forward at a pace that is comfortable for me.
Quote from: musicofthenight on December 06, 2013, 09:33:46 PM
I love this phrase enough to steal it.
But, it's true isn't it? The price of a female presentation is the social obligation to be eye-candy for whoever wants it. They don't like it, it becomes your problem.
And, for the love of all things cute and fluffy, don't ever be guilty of appearing pretty whilst presumably packing a penis. Apparently this is one of the worst things a human being is capable of.
My opinion cannot be expressed in polite language, so I'll google up and link an image macro. (http://www.keepcalm-o-matic.co.uk/p/keep-calm-and-<not%20allowed>-sexism/)
Oh, but it's everywhere: whoever put that together just had to use a Rosie character.
This isn't exactly what I meant by candy bar checkpoint, although I really do appreciate that you pulled something else from it.
I used the candy bar as an analogy for something insignificant that you offer another person. They can either decide to take the candy bar or reject it. As a trans person who does not pass, this is often the behavior that we endure every time we interact with other people. Other people get to decide if they want to accept us as as our gender or not, which is not the norm for most human beings; there is no acceptance or denial involved for cis people. It degenerates a fundamental part of our being into something trivial that is easily dismissed by others, such as a candy bar -- hence, candy bar checkpoint.
You are more than welcome to use the phrase however you like, though! I think it can be adopted for multiple meanings.
Every person has the right to restrict their own life, their own expressiveness, their own joy. To lock it down tight and put a lid on it. To hide their true selves from the world. To give in to fear, to anticipate others' thoughts and live a life ruled by fear of those expected thoughts (and the expected emotions they we think we would feel if someone thought those awful things about us).
However, every person also has a right to live their own life, to express themselves freely, to feel and live their own joy. To lift all restrictions (except those placed by law) and break out of all chains and locks. To overcome fear, to let other people (in all their ignorance or understanding, hatred or compassion) think their own thoughts without my caring what they think.
I can tell you, the majority of transgender people are NOT hiding away their whole lives. The reason you can't see them is because they have gone on with their lives (IN THEIR TRUE GENDER) and despite what you think you know about how transgender people look, they don't. The longer a person lives in their emotional and cognitive "skin" and is comfortable in their expressed gender and their lived gender and their internally experienced gender (which are three different things) the more you can't see them as anything but the woman or man or androgyne they are, despite any physical differences. Because there isn't any physical difference we have that isn't also shared by some of the general cis-sex population. Who you tend to notice are part timers (who aren't yet comfortable in their skin), or genderqueer (intentionally not making their gender presentation fit your expectations, 'cause that's not how they roll), or crossdressing (there is a different look to someone who, for example, feels entirely male yet likes to wear clothes that were 'made for women'). It's amazing how your feeling changes when you stop fearing being visible (those people are awesome too! get to know some! but don't remark or fixate on their gender or sex - that's lame) and start being yourself. Period. Just like they do. But don't be surprised if the more you live as yourself in the world, the more your gender spotlight dims and you just become another man or woman in the world, except for the rare person who is especially gender/sex perceptive and sensitive (like another trans person!).
Whether you are a woman with a penis, a man with a vagina, or some other variation of biology's magic rainbow, doesn't affect how you interact with other people unless you are in a venue where you need to show your genitals. Really. Tucking or packing take care of the occasional crotch gazer except in nude settings, if you are concerned about what crotch gazers think. Though I'd like to get to a world where people ONLY tuck or pack because it makes them feel better/expresses their body image/reduces dysphoria, not because it makes them safer in the world from abusive trolls.
Even in nude settings, having an other sex's or mixed sex body characteristics does not have to preclude your happiness and acceptance. You just learn to pick who you show and share your body (or viewing of your body) with. Just like everyone else must, but with a little more care because of transphobia / transmisogyny. Just make sure you are always being respected, valued, and cherished.
Quote from: MadelineB on December 07, 2013, 10:50:37 AM
It's amazing how your feeling changes when you stop fearing being visible (those people are awesome too! get to know some! but don't remark or fixate on their gender or sex - that's lame) and start being yourself. Period. Just like they do. But don't be surprised if the more you live as yourself in the world, the more your gender spotlight dims and you just become another man or woman in the world, except for the rare person who is especially gender/sex perceptive and sensitive (like another trans person!).
I think that a significant percentage of transgendered people have physical hurdles that "give them away," regardless of their mannerisms or their ability to blend in otherwise, and that readily noticing these features is not restricted to gender/sex sensitive people. Of course, these features aren't inherently a bad thing and shouldn't invalidate someone's gender, but people will be terrible and do use them to be judgmental or quietly question what is amiss anyway. I think that's the fear that many people have. Some people are comfortable with this fact and ignore the possibilities, while others are not comfortable and seek to remedy their "giveaways" before expressing themselves more fully.
I really do wish confidence and experience were enough to overcome transgender hinting for everyone, but I really do not think that is the case.
Quote from: Sybil on December 07, 2013, 11:19:24 AM
I think that a significant percentage of transgendered people have physical hurdles that "give them away," regardless of their mannerisms or their ability to blend in otherwise, and that readily noticing these features is not restricted to gender/sex sensitive people. Of course, these features aren't inherently a bad thing and shouldn't invalidate someone's gender, but people will be terrible and do use them to be judgmental or quietly question what is amiss anyway. I think that's the fear that many people have. Some people are comfortable with this fact and ignore the possibilities, while others are not comfortable and seek to remedy their "giveaways" before expressing themselves more fully.
I really do wish confidence and experience were enough to overcome transgender hinting for everyone, but I really do not think that is the case.
Very true Sybil. I am fortunate to live in a part of the world where being a woman whose looks (physical or presentationally) are very masculine does not make one not be treated as a woman. Treating someone in a way that upsets them or makes them feel less welcome and accepted is NOT acceptable in Portland.
In Portland, Oregon, as long as the way you carry yourself and dress makes it clear you want to be treated as a woman, you will be treated as a woman. People have been around enough gender variance that they don't get their boxers or panties in knots when they meet a gender non-conforming person. They might guess wrong on pronouns but will usually correct themselves if you tell them how you like to be addressed.
The only bad thing about Portland is for our trans men who have feminine physical looks, because there are so many women here who are stone butch it can be difficult to get out of the lesbian category in other people's assumptions based on appearance.
If you live in a place where people are not used to differences, I agree that it is harder, and you will be doing more educating of people in how to treat you.
And I won't invalidate the experience of anyone who needs or wants to transform themselves. We do what we feel we need to do.
I'm just pointing out that a great many of transgender people, right on this site, who are afraid to go out as themselves, are already
more passing than hundreds of thousands of us who have already gone full time and are doing just fine (but usually don't hang out on transgender support sites any more because our life issues are not gender-based any more).
No amount of physical changes can substitute for comfort and confidence, which for many of us require even lengthier processes (and treatments) to accomplish because we started out with no comfort and no confidence. People who chase comfort and confidence indirectly through changing or improving their appearance are very often disappointed. There are literally millions of passable and often beautiful cis-women/handsome cis-men who are crippled by social anxiety, general anxiety, panic disorders, and poor self-image, and it has nothing to do with their gender issues or real appearance, but they are also afraid to go out and to be themselves. If we are anxious and uncomfortable, we can work on that, and it does get better. I know.
I truly can't tell you if I get "clocked" 100 times a day or none, it is rare when someone remarks about my difference but I'm not looking for it any more, not policing people's reactions or trying to guess their perceptions, and when someone does make it obvious they think they know my transgender background, I no longer assume they are malicious or even negative. "Cool, teaching opportunity!" is a better feeling than "OMG they think I'm a guy in a dress I just want to hide what do I do.". (NOTE: there is NOTHING wrong with being a guy in a dress, it's just not how to describe how I experience being me. Once I got over that thing, my own internalized transphobia and transmisogyny, I stopped being uncomfortable around crossdressing men, and I am no longer upset if someone in their ignorance mistakes me for a guy. There is nothing wrong with being a guy, I just am not one. If someone tries to insult me for that, I correct them twice - 1. it is not an insult, a man who is confident enough to wear feminine dress is a great thing to be and if they are so upset about it maybe they need to try it themselves, and 2. by the way, I am a woman, this is me all the time buddy so don't be so rude and try to shame people for being themselves.)
Well I I'm at the point where people will question me if they so choose but that doesn't matter to me. I usually go out the way I want to to most places when I'm with people. On the other hand if I go into the city, NYC, I'll be timid to go out in girl mode tbh
personally I like the idea of doing NYC ,its so incredibly big and so many people I think it be a blast to stroll down the avenue in a nice outfit. My brother lives in new York. when I was a teen ager I took a bus there and ended up walking around manhatten at night because I only knew where he worked. I had to wait till he was at work to see him because he didn't know I was coming. It probably wasn't the best Idea ,but I had no where else to go. sorry I got a little carried away here. What I was going to say was when I was walking around I saw my first ever transsexuals going to a bar. It was interesting. New York is use to people freely walking around,
Quote from: evecrook on December 07, 2013, 02:09:53 PM
personally I like the idea of doing NYC ,its so incredibly big and so many people I think it be a blast to stroll down the avenue in a nice outfit. My brother lives in new York. when I was a teen ager I took a bus there and ended up walking around manhatten at night because I only knew where he worked. I had to wait till he was at work to see him because he didn't know I was coming. It probably wasn't the best Idea ,but I had no where else to go. sorry I got a little carried away here. What I was going to say was when I was walking around I saw my first ever transsexuals going to a bar. It was interesting. New York is use to people freely walking around,
I live in New York. It's a big state and different areas have different cultures. When it comes to dressing in public, it really depends on where you are and how safe you feel. If you go to Chelsea, yeah there should be no problems. But there are areas where you may want to exercise more caution if you fear being clocked. The good thing about certain parts of the city is that you can easily pass by people without ever having to see them again. The stranger factor may make things more easy. However, it all really depends. For some people the large volume of people may make it hard for some to present as female when they are just getting comfortable with it. Depends on how you see it. I'll probably first go out in the more tourist friendly parts of the city for my first few outings. It's easier for me knowing they are strangers even if there are many of them.
I am passable but I get bullied. If you get me. I actually think, paradoxically, that if passable AND known to be trans, it makes it harder. People react more nastily to you. I get an awful lot of abuse sadly from people who ''know''. So yes, it does make me a recluse :(
People suck.
The first few times I stepped out were not pretty, and neither was I. I had no idea what I was doing and some d-bags really let me have it. I had beard shadow, thinning long hair and basically felt like a shaven ape in a dress. My demeanor was off due to anxiety issues and my femme voice was nonexistent.
Part of me wanted to just give up presenting female publically until male fail, it that ever happened, but I never gave up and just reminded myself that it gets better every time. The world is full of haters, and we can't change that. If they keep you at home to the point of reclusiveness, they win and you lose.
Unattractive ciswomen have to face the world every day as well.
QuoteI've always wondered why more girls don't just wait it out on hrt and save money for surgeries before diving feet first into full time. Some people sadly don't naturally pass before hrt & surge. To me it all goes back to planing and being 100% honest with yourself before just putting yourself out there with the wolves. We all know what we look like and that should always be taken into account beforehand. I know many girls who waited till things were further enough along before going full time. I think it's better to ease into things gradually. Getting clocked is the lest of any girls worries if you ask me. I tend to look at things from a safety point. It's just not safe to jump out there prematurely.
It may not be fun waiting but nothing worth having/doing is ever easy. Why set yourself up for what could be easily avoided?
I very much agree with that, as sadly we live lives of compromised dreams and curtailed expectations (though, sometimes we do get lucky and life conjures up the dream!). It is very important to simulate what how you may look and how you intend to cope with being TS before embarking on the nitty-gritty involving surgery and hormones. Create some personal rules, decide the best case and worst case scenarios as well as the usual pro's and con's list.
I tend to go with expecting the worst but planning to get as best outcome as possible. I guess that's probably a pessimistic outlook, but I think with transexualism its healthy to be pessimistic, sadly. Assume that the worst will happen (you won't pass, you'll have trouble, etc etc so that you can better plan for it and prepare your mind.
As for me, I'd love to wear maxi dresses in summer and be an elegant female, but I very much doubt that'll ever be possible (especially as I'd prefer a slow and low-dose HRT regime). So I've tempered this depressing highly probable outcome by deciding that I would wear some stylish female trouser suits instead. That would be my "look". I'd much rather have more flexibility of course, but this would be a great compromise, as I could still wear female clothes yet without the issues of wearing socially inflammatory things as dresses and skirts. There aren't enough transexuals or sympathisers in the world in order to change how most people view us, so until then, we have to play the binary gender game or face the consequences.
By all means, rebel, undermine and defy gender convention & stay true to yourself as much as you can, but do it wisely so you don't make more trouble for yourself.
You can't beat the system, collective society rules.
So, instead - play the system intelligently.
You can only undermine it brick by brick, slowly and subtly. Until a day may come in decades or centuries when being transgender becomes acceptable & ordinary.
Simples! :p
Well crap I just got home from eating dinner. Now I am no expert at detecting trans women but sitting near me was what I am thinking was a trans woman. Mind you I live in red neck and thug land. I rarely every see any GLBT stuff where I live. So in any case this gal was eating dinner with some guy. Nobody was giving her a hard time....... and mind you shes as well as me are in a non Glbt place.
Quote from: boddi on December 07, 2013, 05:36:54 PM
I am passable but I get bullied. If you get me. I actually think, paradoxically, that if passable AND known to be trans, it makes it harder. People react more nastily to you. I get an awful lot of abuse sadly from people who ''know''. So yes, it does make me a recluse :(
It must be your area. Even in the intersection of thugville and redneckton (Northeast Louisiana), I never got bullied for being trans.
Hell everyone should just come to New Orleans. You can drive down Rampart / St. Claude and 4 times out of 5 you'll see somebody who isn't cisgender. Almost every time I drive down that street (which is every day after work), I see somebody that I can't tell what gender they are. Nobody messes with me here, even in St. Bernard people don't bother me. My neighbor gets crap from time to time but she doesn't really fall under the passing category, and it's really rare. However when she's in New Orleans or Metairie, nobody bothers her at all.
Heck, twice I've interacted with law enforcement in New Orleans and they've seen my ID, both times they let me off. One time I punched a cisgender woman in the face (self defense), he wrote us both a ticket but never turned them in... another time one dropped a ticket from running a stop sign to a seat belt ticket. Doctors almost always say something about how non discriminatory their office is with me, too.
Most people don't care. Even if people suspect that you're transgender, they will not say anything nor stare at you if you're just walking past. After all, there are some cisgender women who look like they're crossdressing. I can understand the fear and anxiety, however! I go through it myself, and anytime someone looks towards me, I wonder I'm being clocked. It's an awful anxiety attack like feeling the entire time, and I just need to remember to not overthink or overanalyze things.
And the people who are jerks enough to say something, would be jerks enough to say something to a cisgender woman too.
One time I was walking around my neighborhood in one of my fav dresses and heels and I crossed the street and there a was cop crossing in front of me and just looked me in my face just as if I was just another girl being look at by a cute cop. It was a memorable experience.
the only time I've really been clocked I knew bedause the guy was arguing with his friends insistung I was not a woman and they didn't believe him. But if I have to hang out with people my facial hair gives it away. Until I save money for laser I'll be known as trans. The sucky part is I can't just pass as a guy anymore either. People called me she yesterday and I butched it up and wore all guys clothes. Part of me wants to give up but part of me says just tone it down and wait, like isabelle said. I don't know what to do but I know I couldn't deal with bullying. I'm not doing this to be trans or fight for trans rights or sumthing, I'm doing this to be normal. I started growing boobs at age 11 so it is something I have never been. I have always been half jill and half jack and I hate it. Like amanda palmer said I'd do anything to get the jack part out. But maybe that's a fantasy.
I think the only way to get jack out is to medically delete all of your father's genes
To be honest I can't deal with that and I would end up imploding and probably killing someone. That's why I plan on not presenting till I can pass.
Quote from: Evolving Beauty on December 06, 2013, 06:24:57 AM
You are very right on one sense but be aware many of us begin transition VERY late and some like me were never sure whether we'd even have the money for surgeries. And we can't wait indefinitely, youth is something that doesn't last forever. Dysphoria was and is still VERY high. I couldn't bare living a single day more as a guy. I said f*** it even if I'm unpassable but I need to wear a female dress, make up and high heels or I'd get sick mentally. But there's a big price to pay and I am paying it right now.
I understand what you mean but it's all about pacing yourself. I've always been of the mind that if your going to do something do it 100% and do it right or don't do it at all. If I wasn't yet passable there's no way I'd go outside looking like a guy in a dress. And if some of us who transitioned after puberty and don't have a feminine build that's EXACTLY what were going to look like. I live in the inner city so it's no room for half stepping unless you wanna get jumped or worse. The public doesn't care about Dysphoria or our struggles.
Also it's not always about surgery. Waiting for HRT effects to kick in while working and saving up isn't that hard. Lot's of girls do it. Everyone can't just hop into woman's clothes and go skipping off to work without risking their jobs. It's nothing to present as a women part time or on the weekends on your own time. Being a woman is more than makeup wearing heels and a dress. There are plenty basic t-shirt & jean girls out there that don't wear any of that stuff. I wouldn't risk my job & safety to wear something I can wear in the safety of my own home or on the weekend with friends. I've found that rushing and stressing to be a "Woman" can set of Dysphoria more than anything. Jumping into full time prematurely can sometimes do more harm than good in the long run. But if what your doing works for you great.
Quote from: Evolving Beauty on December 05, 2013, 07:58:41 AM
I never go out on the streets anymore, just forcibly to go to grocery to buy food and to pay my bills.
I used to feel that way, lots of camouflaging, lots of time in boy mode, lots of tension and nervousness. My partner gave me a hard time about it -- she always advocated for being proud of my shape etc.
Boy mode not possible anymore, and I just walk as a person, going about my business, whoever thinks whatever they think, I do not care. Old friends, though, get some consideration, many of them shocked, others show delight, understanding.
But you just have to keep walking, EB.
If it looks like a duck,walks like a duck,quacks like a duck.... it Must be a duck! That said, hold your head up high, think like a girl, walk like a girl, talk like a girl.... Look it must be a girl ! For me the lesson was told to me like this, Confidence is everything ! If you believe, then take a deep breath and walk into that room as if you own it. It's amazing what the mind can do for the body. On another side of the coin I did a lot of research into my new "Character". Just as a Hollywood actor would. Study the subject. Then eat, sleep, and breath your role. Before you know it you're not only "passable" you're interacting and what's this you're having fun and smiling. Woo Hoo!!
Dina
I've just been doing my transition very slowly. I live in a small downtown area and I think it's making it easy for me because my changes are getting so evident
yea definitely. I am pre everything so I can go out with mild discomfort as a male but if I go presenting female I get weird looks all the time. I think lasers and hrt could make me passable though. at least I hope
I guess I am lucky, cause people here are very little informed about fact that TS/TG exist and would not be able to spot one right in front of their eyes. So, as I am also in that 50/50 crowd, I just go with the flow, dress as neutral as I can and just laugh if something annoys me. Last weekend it was like: "Mommy, why is he wearing a ponytail? (small girl in hospital), "Miss, would You and Your child like to take this seat?" (public transport) and "Miss, do You have some spare change?" (intoxicated older lady in front of liquer shop). If they simply stare, I just let them to (frankly, there is nothing I could do anyway - apart of facing them and giving a scary face) - if that gets tooo annoying, I would try to meet their gaze, but usually they (mostly guys) look away instantly. My assumption is - they dont know who I am - a man or a woman - and try to figure this out (being trans is out of equation, for reasons stated above - they dunno that such concept exists).
At 8-10 months (full time at 6) I would be stopped in the streets to be asked if was a man or a woman, be called ->-bleeped-<- or ->-bleeped-<-got... And yes, the star, specially in the metro, when people are bored or out of battery / data on the phone. I stopped giving a ->-bleeped-<- altogether a long time ago. Pretty much my awareness radar is off, so I can't know if they are staring at me since I don't pay attention to the people other than assessing if they can be dangerous.
Kids are a different problem. Because they keep staring even if you catch them. I swear that if I keep getting stared by them after FFS... Urgh.
Quote from: Julia (Apple-Whatever) on November 24, 2014, 04:14:35 AM
At 8-10 months (full time at 6) I would be stopped in the streets to be asked if was a man or a woman, be called ->-bleeped-<- or ->-bleeped-<-got... And yes, the star, specially in the metro, when people are bored or out of battery / data on the phone. I stopped giving a ->-bleeped-<- altogether a long time ago. Pretty much my awareness radar is off, so I can't know if they are staring at me since I don't pay attention to the people other than assessing if they can be dangerous.
Kids are a different problem. Because they keep staring even if you catch them. I swear that if I keep getting stared by them after FFS... Urgh.
kids are something else . I've been stared at while their mother is dragging them and they keep staring whether I'm in total male or total female mode
I'm pretty much getting to the point where I just don't care. Of course it wasn't always like that, but sometimes you look at yourself and say, "Shall I live in fear of others, or should I just not freaking care (to a point) and be much happier?" I just flatout IGNORE anyone who is particularly going out of their way to insult me. Just ignore them, meaning I act like they don't exist.
took me almost 2 years to be comfortable using public restrooms.
There was a period where I was going out in public and it would literally take me 10-20mins to get the courage to open my front door to walk down the driveway to my car. That was the beginning of summer this year for me.. As summer passed and I started to find my "look" and attitude/confidence it got better and better.
For the longest time (even as a guy) I could never find my inner "Don't give a f**k". I always cared what people were thinking. I have definitely found my inner DGAF now.
Coming out at work was painful. It took me from April-Oct to come out to everyone gradually. I got myself incredibly worked up and stressed out for no reason before sitting down with each person in the office individually. Every person (except 1) I told was either cool and supportive or just didn't care because it didn't affect their life. The one guy that does have a problem with it, well I didn't like him before coming out so there is no love lost there.
I am pre-HRT, pre-op, pre-anything... living FT. And honestly, I feel more comfortable and confident now in public than I ever did presenting as male. As a male I had social-anxiety, always wondering what people were when thinking they looked at me, wondering if they were judging me, etc etc...
Now, I just don't care. I go out for lunch 5 days a week with another co-worker (male) and I don't even notice if people are clocking me let alone looking at me. You can't please everyone in this world... EVER. There are 7,000,000,000+ people on this planet, are you really going to stress about or care what a few ->-bleeped-<-s think or say about you? They are a**holes for a reason. There is something in their life they are trying to compensate for by trying to make you feel like ->-bleeped-<-. They will make fun of and be-little ANYONE (cisgender or transgender) who they feel they can bully and who are not equal to them, just so they can inflate their fake egos a little bit more. Flip the script on those pricks. Confidence will take you along ways in transition.
@ Joanna; I know how you feel all too well. Sounds like you know what your doing tho as like me you've been dealing with being half and half all your life. You look very feminine in your Avatar pic tho.
As for me since I've been a member here and especially after reading through this thread it seems I've been very lucky in that physically and proportionally I appear very feminine, and always have even in childhood. I never had a "mans physique," so to speak. I'm proportionately long legged for my height of 5-5, short in the torso and I have delicate small features. Basically I pass without thinking about passing.
For a long time tho I considered myself very unlucky, as being forced by my adopted father to dress as a boy and try to act like a boy I wasn't accepted in school and was bullied constantly. However now I realize how lucky I actually was. Shame it took so long for me to realize it tho. As for what other peep's think of me? I seem to be accepted as the girl/woman I've always been but in reality to me it doesn't matter because I just don't give a flying f@@$ what other peep's think of me. Never have, never will. I'm very confident and secure in myself, my presentation and my core identity. I just don't have the time nor do I need the stress of worrying about how other peep's perceive me.
Ally ;)
Quote from: AnnaCannibal on November 24, 2014, 12:11:34 PM
I'm pretty much getting to the point where I just don't care. Of course it wasn't always like that, but sometimes you look at yourself and say, "Shall I live in fear of others, or should I just not freaking care (to a point) and be much happier?" I just flatout IGNORE anyone who is particularly going out of their way to insult me. Just ignore them, meaning I act like they don't exist.
This is where I am now. This is MY life, and I will live it.
Having said that, I do stay aware of where hostiles are, and let them know (by eye contact) that I'm aware of their existence. Sometimes I even give them a Mona Lisa smile; there's nothing of substance they can do to me, and we both know it.
I can definitely see the wisdom in both methods of transitioning. I myself have started coming into work with make up on and more or less accessorize my look to be more feminine.
However, I also get the occasional stares from men and women and it's definitely driving me to the wall and so does my friend. I am now contemplating if I should just start dressing more andro, less make up but still grow my hair longer until I confuse people LOL. I'm hitting my 3rd month on low dose HRT this 28th.
However, last friday when I stepped out in the city in full mode (with long hair and feminine clothing). I only got the looks from men checking me out sigh...so confused LOL. It seems like i'm getting more clocked with shorter hair than with a longer hair.
Oh, I forgor to tell. While if fully presenting female (make up, carefully chosen clothes etc) I blend in crowds, etc and I don't attract stares anymore, I still looked as a guy if I would not put makeup, comfortable andro clothes...
.
THat's why when I flew to Thailand I ended putting andro clothes and presenting as a guy. In the time and distance I had to make I knew my facial hair was going to grow (and I could not bring a razor), and I wasn't planning to tuck or wear makeup (much less a bra) in 20 hours of three connnected flights. So I used the male toilets and.... yeah, that moment when you pass better than you really think, and people go back to check the plaque with the gender symbol on the door.
Funniest moment was when despite my self perceived unpassability I had to take a full body scanner and gave an error. THey had set it as "female" before I entered and it was aiming between my legs as "there's something wrong here".
For the way back I will be presenting as female... There is little reason now post-FFS.
I do avoid the streets because I don't like being stared at & I have anxiety from being trans all together but over all, it doesn't stop me too much. 4 years of living like this & I've become semi-introverted but I can still manage to go to parties & chat up with guys with no anxiety at all. Being bullied isn't too much of a problem for me since I live in San Diego & I guess it's a pretty accepting area. The most people will do is stare & that doesn't bother me too much unless I'm stuck somewhere & they're staring (ex. Public transportation, while I'm sitting in a room waiting, etc.). In which case, I'll just stare back, smile, or look at my phone.
I think it's really brave if you do that. My plan is to simply not do that and present as cis male for as long as possible. I wasn't looking forward to that frustration of having to hide the part of myself that I like, but with my meds not working it looks a whole lot better than what I'm currently experiencing.
Quote from: Julia (Apple-Whatever) on November 24, 2014, 04:14:35 AM
Kids are a different problem. Because they keep staring even if you catch them.
Perhaps it wouldn't matter as much if the stares were as innocent as those of kids. Would we really care? It's the nastiness, the disgust, the bigotry that's the real problem. Why can't someone look somewhere in between the so-called gender norms? The real problem isn't us or how we transition, it's those in society that think we need to conform to their ideal view of the world. I would suggest they have a serious mental disorder.
Just a thought,
Paige :)
I am not 100% passable yet I have no fear of the streets now. Nobody has said a word to me, except when I used to dress androgynously and people would still call me "sir", "he", and "him." But I chalk that up as an honest mistake, and I wasn't trying that hard anyway. My voice didn't help much either.
Occasionally I get a glance, and sometimes a stare. But never a word. I guess this is how it is in New York? Maybe if I was in another part of the country things would be different. Kids don't really stare. In fact I've had kids sit next to me on public transportation with their parents and they didn't even look at me.
During my first year on Testosterone I stayed in my house and only went out to go to work. I didn't want people staring at me at all. Finally after being a lot more passable and growing out my facial hair, I can go out and do things without worry. The only thing I hate now is showing my ID to people because I still haven't gotten it changed.
I wish we could just mail in our doctor's letters and get our drivers license that way. I really don't want to go to the DMV, I hate it soooo damn much. When I first went to the DMV to get my name changed the woman behind the counter kept looking at me and then my ID. It was really uncomfortable but I just kept starring at her waiting to say something offensive. If she wanted to make me feel uneasy, I was going to do the same damn thing to her lol.
I have never been outside dressed. Home, support groups, and therapists office. I MIGHT go out this weekend if someone in my support groups wants to go out. Maybe.
I just don't feel like I pass at all. I'm supposed to get a new wig tomorrow and a proper makeup lesson on Monday, so we'll see if that helps my confidence.
Sent from my SM-G900T using Tapatalk
I could not give a damn. I go out in full Conchita mode these days, when I need a break from shaving.
I am very different from the old me. I am confident - but importantly - I have a happy, positive presence. People respond to *that*.
Sure, I look like a girly boy. But people can see who I am, and they seem to like what they see these days. It's never been easier to get on with life.
Quote from: amber roskamp on November 23, 2014, 10:25:58 PM
yea definitely. I am pre everything so I can go out with mild discomfort as a male but if I go presenting female I get weird looks all the time. I think lasers and hrt could make me passable though. at least I hope
Wow this was an old topic. I think it's really interesting how much different my opinion is now compared to how it was. I feel much more confident now. I don't think I pass perfectly but I know I can go out like I actually want in most situations with out getting bugged. My original post was a month before ahhh kind of transition aside from me attempting to hone presentation skills.
Quote from: Jill F on December 07, 2013, 05:53:47 PM
People suck.
The first few times I stepped out were not pretty, and neither was I. I had no idea what I was doing and some d-bags really let me have it. I had beard shadow, thinning long hair and basically felt like a shaven ape in a dress. My demeanor was off due to anxiety issues and my femme voice was nonexistent.
Part of me wanted to just give up presenting female publically until male fail, it that ever happened, but I never gave up and just reminded myself that it gets better every time. The world is full of haters, and we can't change that. If they keep you at home to the point of reclusiveness, they win and you lose.
Unattractive ciswomen have to face the world every day as well.
Well, I was going to say something, but I just realized this was a zombie thread and that I pretty much said it 1 1/2 years ago. I suppose I'm a tad less misanthropic than I was then, but it's funny that I was about to chime in with pretty much the same thing.
Wow my topic got bumped after years.
Anyways just to update you about me. I still haven't had FFS, only SRS but I am now somewhat passable. I did some cheek fillers with hyaluronic acid and it changed my face a lot. I've also notice since I did SRS, my aura became overall softer. In every 10 people, only 1 might know. I'm somewhere as 80%-90% passable. It's rare they clock me now but it still does happen once a blue moon.
I always thought it was my face but in fact it was a bunch of stuffs that I thought was trivial but counted a lot in passing.
1. Make up. (not to exaggerate or it becomes obvious as a drag, not wear too flashy, just gloss or brown shadows)
2. Dress code. (not to be too provocative and try to dress as a normal GG, avoid high heels, showing too much breasts or skirts too shirt)
3. Mannerism, behavior and speech. (This is the most subtle thing that many ignore but counts a lot in passing. I use to exaggerate a lot my feminity before it's when they clocked me as ->-bleeped-<-, need to go smooth and graceful and be sweet in speech and gestures specially the way you walk too)
^ this is truth.
If only I had the sensibilities to follow it ...
Quote from: Jill F on July 16, 2015, 05:22:27 PM
Well, I was going to say something, but I just realized this was a zombie thread and that I pretty much said it 1 1/2 years ago. I suppose I'm a tad less misanthropic than I was then, but it's funny that I was about to chime in with pretty much the same thing.
ie frankinstien
I was going to call this a zombie frankinstien, considering It died december 2013, was temparely revived in november 2014, and hit with the lightning this july 16.
Quote from: Evolving Beauty on July 18, 2015, 01:52:27 PM
Wow my topic got bumped after years.
Anyways just to update you about me. I still haven't had FFS, only SRS but I am now somewhat passable. I did some cheek fillers with hyaluronic acid and it changed my face a lot. I've also notice since I did SRS, my aura became overall softer. In every 10 people, only 1 might know. I'm somewhere as 80%-90% passable. It's rare they clock me now but it still does happen once a blue moon.
I always thought it was my face but in fact it was a bunch of stuffs that I thought was trivial but counted a lot in passing.
1. Make up. (not to exaggerate or it becomes obvious as a drag, not wear too flashy, just gloss or brown shadows)
2. Dress code. (not to be too provocative and try to dress as a normal GG, avoid high heels, showing too much breasts or skirts too shirt)
3. Mannerism, behavior and speech. (This is the most subtle thing that many ignore but counts a lot in passing. I use to exaggerate a lot my feminity before it's when they clocked me as ->-bleeped-<-, need to go smooth and graceful and be sweet in speech and gestures specially the way you walk too)
And Im so glad things have improved for you.
Never had this happen because I own it
Quote from: Evolving Beauty on December 05, 2013, 07:58:41 AM
...
Hugs.
Being trans isn't easy. It won't help your feelings per se, but let's start by stating that at current state of my face, I am clockable over 90% if not 100% of the time. Occasionally, I get angry stare from that Hispanic looking guy or that far Eastern guy, sounds of disgust from a black woman, excited Brit tourists pointing at me, or two Russian chicks commenting me (as if I couldn't catch word or two), ... and so on.
In other words - it sucks to be me. I still go out and don't want to miss all that entertainment outside. Dutch themselves generally won't bother me, but there are stories of people even being beaten up badly by tourists. I myself wouldn't walk past group of more than 3 Moroccans, would prefer to never go in such part of the city, and to change street if I meet a stray pack. The point I start from is that while I stay away from potentially troubled areas, nobody will risk messing up their lives by harming me.
That said, I have a lot of chance to practice
anti-clocking, that is basically shaming people for clocking you. If those seem to be normal family people, just stare back at them. Pick a face. Accusing. Poker face (wtf are you staring at me). Disgust (what a handful of bigots).
Other clockers that seem more dangerous seek confrontation. No eye contact. But you can stare at a point just near their heads. That way they are made uncomfortable because they know you see them, but there is no eye contact and that is what blocks them from initiating conversation. That situation should cause them to go back about their business -- that is, stop staring. If they don't that's bad. Have
112 /
911 /
police_nr ready.
That is my recipe that might not even hold water in LGBT hostile countries or those countries where the police is like 10 years late once called. One more thing that may matter is that I still have my T and losing muscle mass is still a TODO. I can and will fight back if necessary.
Between those encounters, I sit in a restaurant, enjoy traveling across the Netherlands, go take a ride in an entertainment park, cruise through a city for a photo session, just take a walk, go shopping, and love thoughts of the future when my face will actually pass. :D ;)
*
Quote from: Evolving Beauty on December 05, 2013, 07:58:41 AM
Am I the only one? I am only semi-passable. I get clocked 50/50. And their stares are really annoying and worse when they start bullying calling bullcraps as: 'This is man, what is this, what is this thing, what's this creature, yuck' etc... I get seriously fed up and I never go out on the streets anymore, just forcibly to go to grocery to buy food and to pay my bills. I wanna go and live life, I wanna go to parks, cinema, shopping malls, hang out with friends(even my friends are embarassed to walk with me cos I attract to many stares), nightclubs. I can't do any of those cos all people always spoil my mood with their effing stares and never-ending insults. I don't feel like living until I get FULL FFS & SRS. For now I'm just like a pupa in its cocoon waiting impatiently to be a butterfly one day. And concerning work, I work at home. I'm scared I fail to never have FFS & SRS, my entire life will be ruined and all this transition wouldn't make sense by the end and worse I can't even backtrack, I've reached too far to and middle way now. How many of you don't go out just cos you're unpassable and how to you deal with this sh*t.
It breaks my heart to here stories like yours. Makes me realize how lucky I am and how cruel and unfair nature can be. I hope things work out for you and that you can work out of your home. Just out of curiosity, what kind of work do you do out of your home?
Further to my last post, I really don't even care now. I just go out. People are friendly to me. Extremely so in fact. I have no idea why. Kids come up to me and say hi and smile. They do gender me correctly and their parents do. And I'm pretty sure I don't pass 100%. But I always get treated like a lady.
I know I wear my hair differently these days too. That helps. I wear makeup more. That helps too. And I'm forced to be silent due to the resting period from my voice surgery.
Yet I still think I'm getting FFS and body contouring (and GRS). I'm just not sure what people think and even though I don't care it still bothers me a teeny amount.
Quote from: michellemartine on July 18, 2015, 04:23:58 PM
Hugs.
Being trans isn't easy. It won't help your feelings per se, but let's start by stating that at current state of my face, I am clockable over 90% if not 100% of the time. Occasionally, I get angry stare from that Hispanic looking guy or that far Eastern guy, sounds of disgust from a black woman, excited Brit tourists pointing at me, or two Russian chicks commenting me (as if I couldn't catch word or two), ... and so on.
In other words - it sucks to be me. I still go out and don't want to miss all that entertainment outside. Dutch themselves generally won't bother me, but there are stories of people even being beaten up badly by tourists. I myself wouldn't walk past group of more than 3 Moroccans, would prefer to never go in such part of the city, and to change street if I meet a stray pack. The point I start from is that while I stay away from potentially troubled areas, nobody will risk messing up their lives by harming me.
That said, I have a lot of chance to practice anti-clocking, that is basically shaming people for clocking you. If those seem to be normal family people, just stare back at them. Pick a face. Accusing. Poker face (wtf are you staring at me). Disgust (what a handful of bigots).
Other clockers that seem more dangerous seek confrontation. No eye contact. But you can stare at a point just near their heads. That way they are made uncomfortable because they know you see them, but there is no eye contact and that is what blocks them from initiating conversation. That situation should cause them to go back about their business -- that is, stop staring. If they don't that's bad. Have 112 / 911 / police_nr ready.
That is my recipe that might not even hold water in LGBT hostile countries or those countries where the police is like 10 years late once called. One more thing that may matter is that I still have my T and losing muscle mass is still a TODO. I can and will fight back if necessary.
Between those encounters, I sit in a restaurant, enjoy traveling across the Netherlands, go take a ride in an entertainment park, cruise through a city for a photo session, just take a walk, go shopping, and love thoughts of the future when my face will actually pass. :D ;)
*
This is a very nice recipe. I wished I could use that before but I never had the guts. I become in that state only when they got physically aggressive and that's ugly to see cos once in 2009, I ended up taking out knife to stab someone and another time I slammed one inside a bus with umbrella onto his face cos he was trying to pull my wig that time. I strived to ignore the max I could but thanks god this nightmare is now over. Pfffft!
Quote from: Amy1988 on July 18, 2015, 04:57:29 PM
It breaks my heart to here stories like yours. Makes me realize how lucky I am and how cruel and unfair nature can be. I hope things work out for you and that you can work out of your home. Just out of curiosity, what kind of work do you do out of your home?
Thanks a lot sweetie but this post date since 2013. I now pass but still not perfectly but way better since thanks god, get clocked very rare once a blue moon. What work I use to do at home? Well in the country I was we don't have that luck that Western transgenders have and legal rights of anti-discrimination like in U.K for example. Inside my house I was a call girl, that's all what 99% transgenders do in my country. We didn't have job opportunity like western girls. It's only until I fled to Europe and asked for political asylum that my life started to smoothen a bit now.
Quote from: Isabelle on December 06, 2013, 01:11:55 AM
This isnt meant to sound harsh but, transitioning socially is hard.
I consider myself incredibly lucky because I've never once been the subject of any bullying, no one has ever called anything transphobic out to me, I've never been stared at. However, and its a big however, I transitioned very slowly because I knew, I couldn't take the stress of being abused..
I took hormones and presented as male, I did this until people assumed I was female regardless of what I did. I then, very slowly began to alter my dress sense. I didn't just throw a dress on a skip down the streets...
I'm not saying people shouldn't just dress how they want whenever they want, and I'm not excusing the horrid behaviour of disgusting people who abuse others. What I am saying is, If you're struggling to cope with the fact that you don't pass, maybe just continue with hrt and slowly present as more androgynous.
This is actually excellent advice. Well done.
Quote from: Evolving Beauty on July 18, 2015, 05:30:08 PM
I slammed one inside a bus with umbrella onto his face cos he was trying to pull my wig that time.
Those thoughts are horrific. Due to hair loss, I am confined to wigs. Going to a riskier walk, I'd just have spare wig in my bag, and one fail-safe bandana.
Quote from: smile_jma on December 06, 2013, 03:15:15 AM
I'm kind of in the same situation as you, except now every time I open my mouth, people get shocked, or something. (Long hair and a little more fat on the face does a lot. Even with a visible adams.) Something that makes me feel somewhat uncomfortable about having to meet new people and ordering food at a restaurant. This is all no makeup, wearing guy clothes. But that doesn't stop me. We all need friends (whether or not they know NOW) and I have to eat. Apparently not too healthy of food, though, since *most* healthy food isn't something you order, it's something you make yourself ;) I haven't yet (in the last 4 months) met someone who said they knew I was a guy from first glance. They ALL said something like, Oh, I thought you were a girl. *Intermal smile*
Anyway, I have no choice but to go out. I live 40 mins walking distance from my work, so I can either walk or take the bus, both of which I will be in the vicinity of many people of all ages. My doctor is 1.5 hours away by subway, so, can't avoid the public there either. Weekends, I will not stay inside. I just can't.
Having said all that, I do try to time my bathroom occurrences to match when I might have to go to being home/in a privat-er bathroom (at a small restaurant).
I pretent to be a mute and pass notes. It works great. I point to the scar on my throat from a trachea shave and whisper that I've had throat surgery and can't speak. That always works. Coworkers will order for me when we go out to lunch. Really sweet.
Quote from: Isabelle on December 06, 2013, 01:11:55 AM
This isnt meant to sound harsh but, transitioning socially is hard.
I consider myself incredibly lucky because I've never once been the subject of any bullying, no one has ever called anything transphobic out to me, I've never been stared at. However, and its a big however, I transitioned very slowly because I knew, I couldn't take the stress of being abused..
I took hormones and presented as male, I did this until people assumed I was female regardless of what I did. I then, very slowly began to alter my dress sense. I didn't just throw a dress on a skip down the streets...
I'm not saying people shouldn't just dress how they want whenever they want, and I'm not excusing the horrid behaviour of disgusting people who abuse others. What I am saying is, If you're struggling to cope with the fact that you don't pass, maybe just continue with hrt and slowly present as more androgynous.
I remember reading this thread but not this post. This is exactly what I've wanted to say on here for so long. This was basically how I handled my transition. I couldn't bear any emotional abuse in those early years because my mental health back then was in very fragile state, so I took my time. Now I can handle anything with no problem since I'm healthy and strong enough to be able to but it took time to build myself back up after being completely torn apart. I finally gained back my confidence within the past two years or so and that's something I'm still working on.
When I was first trying to get HRT it was a requirement to present as your true gender, whilst that has now been dropped I cannot go back to male mode without getting depressed, I hardly ever go out now which causes its own kind of depression.
Avoiding going out right now is the lesser of two evils for me until I can pass reasonably, unfortunately that will take some time.
I quite agree with what is said above. And personnally I'd just say... Uh... Be natural ? That's easy for me because I really don't care about being seen as a man. Actually I find crossdressing in male pretty fun, and really easy when you're a biological man. ;D I understand that's not everyone's case though.
When I was 17 I was really sensitive to the fact that I wanted to be seen by people as my real self. People not knowing my real self was something very annoying. The solitude of being invisible was burning me. But that's silly. People will never really grasp your true self. Even my mother, who watched and listened to me days and night couldn't. In the end, I stopped worrying about the ability for people to see me as who I was. I don't care anymore. I don't need them for me to exist. If I can get them closer to me, it's fine and fun. If not, that's life. I don't think I'm very different from most cis-people out there, on this topic. And I've dressed as a man for 10 years after that.
Funnily enough, I'm still totally trans. (but I feel a lot better than 10 years ago !) I'm more trans than I ever was. Being a woman is something that lays deep inside of me. I don't even think it's related to gender. I'm quite OK with being a boy. I think it's just something in your guts ; something in your very flesh. That's not related to clothes, in my case, but I might have thought so years ago. That was just a lie preventing me to see the real thing, and peace came with it. Once I achieved peace and happiness, I was able to see what "being a woman" real meant to me. And I started transitionning. Quite a peaceful journey, but still hard and full of pain. I don't think I'd like to have made it 10 years ago, when I was cutting myself and drinking wine early in the morning. It's a lot easier to journey now. ;)
But here again, it's only MY story. Not everyone is the same, and I don't think the "trans" word covers people with the exact same "problem". So that might not be useful for everyone. To me clothes were just a passing neurosis, but for some it can be the core of the problem. I don't want to insult you. In fact I believe there's various very different kind of "trans", and I think all of them are logical and nice. There can be different good reasons to make the same journey. People are truly different.
So if your main concern is the clothes, then maybe it's what you need right now. You most likely know that a lot better than I do. Just be aware than people on the street won't see you as a woman, but as a transperson. That might not be what you want either.
My 2 cents.
Kisses anyway. :-*
(I know this thread is outdated)
I currently pass mostly with people who have weak eyesight that are standing more than 20 feet away. It's a start.
I need long hair again and think that's true for most of us.
Anyhow, so sticking with the original point, yea.. going out and not passing is scary.
With that said, I am about to come out at work. My job involves working with many people across multiple organizations and even occasionally presenting at conferences to thousands of people. So I admit coming out and speaking at a conference makes me want to create glitter in my panties. The thing is, everybody will already know. Even if I passed completely, which I really want, my daily life will still be immersed with people that know I wasn't born female. If I was able to pass then the best I could ever get would be, "I would never have thought you were a guy."
I suppose the question is, if people don't physically harm you then how much does this matter really? Look at Martine Rothblatt or even Caitlyn Jenner who both are very much in the spotlight. They are people too just like us but with more money. If they can handle it at that scale, I am hoping that I will be able to handle it at mine.
Now I just need to get rid of that stupid little voice in my head that keeps interrupting my thoughts with, "Good luck with that!"
FYI, it isn't site policy to delete a thread because it's old. The information is useful and helpful to each new generation of members, and everyone is free to post in them. :)
Hugs, Devlyn
Quote from: Alainaluvsu on December 07, 2013, 07:37:26 PM
It must be your area. Even in the intersection of thugville and redneckton (Northeast Louisiana), I never got bullied for being trans.
Hell everyone should just come to New Orleans. You can drive down Rampart / St. Claude and 4 times out of 5 you'll see somebody who isn't cisgender. Almost every time I drive down that street (which is every day after work), I see somebody that I can't tell what gender they are. Nobody messes with me here, even in St. Bernard people don't bother me. My neighbor gets crap from time to time but she doesn't really fall under the passing category, and it's really rare. However when she's in New Orleans or Metairie, nobody bothers her at all.
Heck, twice I've interacted with law enforcement in New Orleans and they've seen my ID, both times they let me off. One time I punched a cisgender woman in the face (self defense), he wrote us both a ticket but never turned them in... another time one dropped a ticket from running a stop sign to a seat belt ticket. Doctors almost always say something about how non discriminatory their office is with me, too.
I grew up in north west Louisiana.
Quote from: stephaniec on November 24, 2014, 11:40:31 AM
kids are something else . I've been stared at while their mother is dragging them and they keep staring whether I'm in total male or total female mode
Yeah kids are the ultimate pass/fail test. I have always done well around kids. I was at the dentist a few weeks ago kids running around the waiting room not one gave me so much as a glance. I often get smiles from little girls and it always warms my heart.
im sorta confused... I thought you said in another post you had a straight boyfriend who thought you were a cis girl and were asking how to tell him the truth....I would think to do that you would need to be one hundred percent passable....????? was it an online relationship or something???
hmm I think I just answered my own question! this thread is from 2013.... so I guess you got your surgeries and things are going better I hope :)
Quote from: Annabolton on July 18, 2015, 10:03:24 PM
im sorta confused... I thought you said in another post you had a straight boyfriend who thought you were a cis girl and were asking how to tell him the truth....I would think to do that you would need to be one hundred percent passable....????? was it an online relationship or something???
It was indeed me, this post here is a very old one. And the time I met that guy I started becoming already fairly passable with face fillers but you know it happens sometimes that people who live closest with you don't clock and some others who don't know anything of you just clock you right away. I'm still not knowing whether you're talking of the guy of mid 2014 or this year 2015 around March cos it's the only 2 oops wait... 3... recently again 1st week of this July. I NEVER generally say what I am until it gets dead serious as these 3.
Quote from: Evolving Beauty on July 18, 2015, 05:30:08 PM
but thanks god this nightmare is now over. Pfffft!
Oh my, I should definitely start having look at the date of the OP. I thought I was comforting someone who is being discomfy
now. :) Glad things worked out for you. As you can see from my post, it is a hell out there for me and I still go out.