Hi.
I have been looked around the forum for a while, and it has truly inspired me to change and deal with the big issue in my life. However I have a nagging doubt that at 48 I have simply left it to late? My height at over 6 feet does not help, nor my weight at 225lb (albeit that is droopy rapidly down from 245 at new year). The before and after thread is truly inspirational but are these just exceptional changes. Won't I just end up looking like a freak?
Hi Paula, welcome to Susan's.
In a word No. It is not too late and you will not look like a freak. Many older than you have done very well.
I'm glad you found us. There is a lot of information in these pages including what it was like for older transitioners like you.feel free to read around, ask questions or even join in the frivolity of the games threads.
Hi Paula
I'm 45 and 6'1". I struggled with exactly the same worries as you. To some extent I still do, but I've decided that I have to give a shot or what else is there?
Welcome to Susan's and good luck on your journey :)
Hi Paula :icon_wave:
Welcome to Susan's :) Glad to have you here
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Hugs
V M
Joan,
Thanks, that's how I reached my decision, I had little choice, but having made it lost 22lb and started laser I have a crisis of confidence. How has it progressed for you, how far along are you? If you don't mind me asking. On plus side I have full head if hair ( almost)
I'm 52, been living full time since June, and loving it. Wish I'd done it at 48...
Suzi is further alongside than I am so she can probably give your more pointers.
For what it's worth I've gone from about 210lbs to 180 in 9 months and started laser like you 3 months ago. I found a therapist early in December and started hormone therapy early in January. I don't plan on being full time for a while yet. I have a receding hairline, so I have to wear a wig.
Like you I went through a 'what on earth am I doing?' period and managed to get through it and out the other side with more confidence than before. I started going out as Joan in November, and though I stand out the majority of people are much too wrapped up in their own lives to care that much about mine. Realising this was a pretty big step and quite a weight off the shoulders.
I don't know...moving forward with this wasn't something I could avoid, and at first I wanted to be perfect and passable, and then I realised this was going to be difficult so I lowered expectations and it felt easier. It also all became a lot more fun, and life is more fulfilling than it has ever been before.
I expect more bumps and crashes along the way, but on the whole I'm happy with where I am and where I'm going to.
I hope that helps :)
Started at 55 after cutting weight for a year, from 178 to 138. Not too late. Good shrink is important to help with the journey, and we have to be very careful medically, at least I did.
Wish I would have started earlier, but I started in my mid 40's also :) I'm 52 now
It's never too late
Hugs
I thought 47 was the deadline...
Is that a joke?
Joan thanks again.
Not been out yet he're (UK) although it's cold and that does provide the opportunity to cover up and hide a bit. I thought I would start with tackling weight issues and laser. I have lost that 22lb since Jan 1st 2014. Not started hormones yet because:
1 harder to get here in UK than us ( I think)
2 want to get hold of weight issue first, I am told this is a better plan, reckon I can get down to 180lb by summer, then start on hormones hopefully
I hate explaining my jokes...
(Tori kicks a rock...)
Well I am nearly 48 so that makes me under the wire ;-)
OK!
Now, what was your question?
.
Quote from: Tori on February 03, 2014, 06:04:42 AM
I thought 47 was the deadline...
No it's 97 or even later. Supposedly some of the physical results can be different such as less boob, but I would contend the huge emotional boost from Estrogen plus knowing your body is starting to be in sinc with your self perception makes that acceptable.
For my with my dysphoria I am ok as long as I am comfortable in my own skin and wiring. And that means transition even if hidden from the worlds views. I know whats under the hood. I love whats under the hood. And I have solid A's and if percentages mean anything I could get some gorgeous B's out of this. My issues are with my skeleton. Shoulders are too big.
Easier for me I don't have to try to pass. I admire anyone with the guts to do it
Will I just end up looking like a freak?
Do I?
Vanity?
Really?
No!
I started at 47 years old and went Full Time after only 5 months. You can do it and be successful baby! :)
Quote from: Paula white on February 03, 2014, 06:22:24 AM
Will I just end up looking like a freak?
You are a woman. All women are beautiful. Even those who don't pass. I know several non-passing trans women who are very beautiful.
I'm 5'11". I assumed that, my MPB, male features for which I probably won't get FFS, and general lack of grace would make it impossible for me ever to pass.
Now I pass everywhere I go. Straight men flirt with me because they don't have a clue about me.
I started transitioning at 50. Weight can be lost with diet and exercise, and there are lots of very attractive tall women around these days. Hormones don't quite have the same effects on us mature transitioners that they do for the younger transitioners, but they still do a good enough job.
So come on in, the water is fine!
Hi Paula:
I was 61 when I started "Legal" HRT in July 2012, and I won't lie about how difficult it was to see the woman in the mirror. But a woman finally emerged several months later and before the year was up I was full time, happy, and out to the world. It was really hard to pass for many months after going FT, but there came a day when I didn't even think about it.
So what's your alternative? You'll wake up every morning from now until you're 60 wanting to change your life, and you'll feel like crap. And you'll make everyone else feel like crap because you're constantly unhappy. Or worse, you'll do what I did and start looking for hormones and dangerous over the counter drugs anywhere you can get them. Then when you turn 60 you'll kick yourself in the ass for not starting earlier, and dream of how you life could have been so much different had you done something right at 50.
But on the other hand you can call and make an appointment with a gender therapist today. And in a couple months begin a new life. Gender disphoria doesn't go away, it only gets worse, so either way you'll be dealing with this every day
I was 6 feet tall and 270 lbs at 50. By the time I began transition at 61 I was around 5'-11' and my weight was hitting 275 when I ate too much. I'm now 198 and trying to loose more weight, but unfortunately as I've aged I'm getting shorter, and my health is not quite the way it was, so I'm only 5'-10".
Take care Paula, and make that call for an appointment.
Hi Paula,
In answer to your questions. NO! 48 is not too late to start transition. It's never too late.
It's too late when you're in a pine box having been driving there from the regret of not having tried.
The Before and After threads are not the exceptionals. They are the ones who have tried. AND you won't look like a freak.
Huggs
Catherine
I suppose I jjust want to feel normal= happy and content. I have kinda got the ball rolling as things I have done so far at the end of last year and this are
1 told my wife (not easy nor did that go to well. She switches between " I will support you, and you need to do this because you are unhappy and miserable" To yelling at me ans wanting nothing to do with me or my " problem" as she calls it.
2 seen a general councillor who has recommended I see a gender specialist ( appointment Thursday yikes) paying private so far.
3 told my Doctor
3 Gone on a diet started exercise and have lost quite a bit of weight
4 started laser on face.
So in my mind perhaps I have started the journey already?
Quote from: Paula white on February 03, 2014, 08:16:45 AM
So in my mind perhaps I have started the journey already?
Yes, you have DEFINITELY started, and you have taken some awesome steps there my dear 8)
Quote from: Paula white on February 03, 2014, 02:45:07 AM
Hi.
I have been looked around the forum for a while, and it has truly inspired me to change and deal with the big issue in my life. However I have a nagging doubt that at 48 I have simply left it to late? My height at over 6 feet does not help, nor my weight at 225lb (albeit that is droopy rapidly down from 245 at new year). The before and after thread is truly inspirational but are these just exceptional changes. Won't I just end up looking like a freak?
I think you asked the question of the ages, if I do this how will I turn out? The answer is, you only get out what you put in. If all you do is pop hormones then I would say not much more than boobs. But the physical changes are in my mind only the tip of the iceberg. It's the social aspect that is really much harder. You have a long history and it's hard to unravel all of that a make a new person. Important to note I did not say impossible, just hard.
But you know what? What matters to me may not matter to you? What you consider as a great outcome, might to me seem lousy. But thats me not you. When I did my transition I shot for the stars. I didn't want to leave anything to chance. I wanted to blend into a crowd and just disappear. I was willing to spend whatever it took to blend in. What I found is that blending in is only part of the picture. I still need to interact with people, to buy a coffee, get groceries, go to work, socialize after work, etc. all of the things that non trans people take for granted and many of us cringe at the thought of having to do. A good voice goes so far but social skills are the key to blending in, and the only way to get there is with the passage of time. There is no other option.
I guess what I am trying to say is that each thing you do to improve yourself increases ones passing percentage. It will never be 100% even if you transition at the age of 10. This transitioning while young stuff sounds great but in the long haul over the passage of years and years, I think it will be interesting to see how many revert back after many years living in a certain gender role. Only time will tell on that one. I hope I'm wrong. The only thing transitioning when young does is one needs less energy (and money) to make the change. An older person needs more energy and thus money to make the change. If you have the money to spend on a good transition you can successfully cross the street and blend in. With all of the right tools the more you socialize the more you blend in.
I really hope it's not to late. I am 49 and just starting stuff. No hrt or anything yet
Quote from: Tori on February 03, 2014, 06:13:36 AM
I hate explaining my jokes...
silly me...I thought jokes were supposed to be funny?
Is 48 too late? No. When is it too late? When you're dead. I'm 59 and a month into HRT. It's not too late. ;)
Quote from: Paula white on February 03, 2014, 08:16:45 AM
1 told my wife (not easy nor did that go to well. She switches between " I will support you, and you need to do this because you are unhappy and miserable" To yelling at me ans wanting nothing to do with me or my " problem" as she calls it.
Well, maybe it isn't too late for your wife to escape...think of it, you're a woman, middle aged, married for decades and then find your self hugely disappointed when your husband turns out to be a woman.
Think of the huge crisis you're inflicting on her....and you didn't even mention her in your opening post!
So no, it's not too late for you to start and it's not too late for her to escape and build a new life...without having it and her own sexuality, emotions, personality, etc disappearing into a gaping black hole...leaving only a shell of her former self.
there is an ancient saying by Confucius or someone that if your older than 12 best to think of rebirth because you'll probably need to think about it again.
I have come to accept that my wife would be better off if we parted. There is no doubt that this is s selfish thing to do ( transition) but I do not think I can continue anymore with my charade. My wife admits suspecting for years. :-( >:(
"It's never too late to be who you might have been."
I am 49 and started about five months ago. I struggled with some of the same issues but finally came to the conclusion that regardless of how I turn out, I'd rather be an ugly woman than an unhappy/fake man. It's a long road, and an expensive one, but I've never felt more determined and happier in my whole life (except today, I have the flu today).
The big thing? For the first time I can be myself AND look others in the eye. I've not been able to do that before.
Jane
I'm 50.
I can remember confiding in a classmate that I wanted to be a girl .. I was in the 4th grade.
I've waited a long time. I've spend my life pleasing others and doing what others thought was "right" - it's been a disaster.
2014 was the year I decided "no mas".
It scares me too.
Danielle
Quote from: JordanBlue on February 03, 2014, 09:55:53 AM
silly me...I thought jokes were supposed to be funny?
Is 48 too late? No. When is it too late? When you're dead. I'm 59 and a month into HRT. It's not too late. ;)
So sorry Jordan, I do my best to stay offline after I take my night meds, but sometimes I fail. It is a semi-frequent embarrassment. Just part of being me. Again, sorry.
Of course it is never too late.
It is never too late to be yourself and be happy! It's scary at first, but once the ball gets rolling there is no stopping you and no regrets! Let that girl out!!! I wish you the best!
I started at 32 and was convinced I'd be far too old...
And give your wife a chance. You know her better than we do, of course, but I oftentimes felt that my wife would be better off without me - and these days she gets VERY upset when I say stuff like that. (Yes, we stayed together through transition. There are horror stories out there, but some couples do get the happy ending. I know I'm very lucky, but it happens.)
Never too late.
Started HRT at 55. I feel better. Bottom line.
Its incredibly rough on the wives, and mine did not know, she thought I gave it up at 25. She also doesn't know I purged about 50 times, then had the choice to lose my mind or lose my self deception.
Good GID therapist should be helpful, mine was and was part of saving my marrage. But I'm lucky, I am stage 4 and can live in both worlds, so its a different scenario.
Hang in there. Small sacrifices are worth it to the wives. And the Dysphoria is relentless so examining the selfish part is best done in therapy.
The more I read these posts, the more I feel unbelievable lucky.
No way i am 49.9 and full speed ahead .GO GIRLS we have rest of our girly lifes to enjoy !!
I started HRT 3 days before my 51st birthday.
I eat extremely healthy and HRT has had some great results so far. I will know more as the years pass. I know one thing a 51 year old can grow breasts well :)
uh, no. Heck, I know a girls who started in their 60's! I will admit, the cutoff point is probably somewhere around 80-90. I guess the reality is if you want to spend the next 20, 30, 40 years or more living the wrong life.
I am 47 in may with mpb 6-2 and I weigh 170 to 190 depending on the scale. Next time I'm at the doctors I will get an actual weight. I was about 220 And I went vegetarian about a year ago. And I just had my first therapist appointment today. So I don't think its to late. And yes I asked the same questions. And it does come to mind sometimes. But what are you going to do. I am the happiest I've been my whole life.
I am 45 5'8" and 180 pounds. A year ago I weighed 245.
It is never too late to start, and if you are not happy with your weight there is always diet and exercise. Speaking from my experience, diet and exercise became easier to me when I stopped hating myself... that is when I started to transition. When I began HRT I actually started craving healthier food, an unexpected but welcome side effect.
Quote from: Dahlia on February 03, 2014, 11:35:27 AM
Well, maybe it isn't too late for your wife to escape...think of it, you're a woman, middle aged, married for decades and then find your self hugely disappointed when your husband turns out to be a woman.
Think of the huge crisis you're inflicting on her....and you didn't even mention her in your opening post!
So no, it's not too late for you to start and it's not too late for her to escape and build a new life...without having it and her own sexuality, emotions, personality, etc disappearing into a gaping black hole...leaving only a shell of her former self.
This is the biggest pile of ignorant bitchery I have read in a long time, but it seems to be a theme with you.
Many of our older TG/TS members did not have access to the resources you have today. "Gender identity" was not a widely understood concept for many of us. I saw a psychiatrist at the age of 19 (1970s), trying to figure things out, and was told I was just bisexual and not to worry about how I felt.
I wish I had known then what I know now. As it was, I entered into a relationship with a beautiful and understanding woman, raised a family, and did my best to meet the gender expectations of society. Only in the last few years has the dysphoria reached the point where I had to do something about it.
It coincided with stress-related cardio-vascular disease that took its toll over time. I was slowly killing myself trying to be something I really was not. When you are in a close, loving relationship with someone for over 30 years, they recognize some things. In 30 years time, the mask occasionally falls off. The label for it might be new, but the transperson does not fundamentally change inside.
I very sincerely doubt those of my generation went out of their way to be deceitful. We have learned to roll with the punches as they come. Some of us were fortunate to find out about gender therapy and afford surgeries. Even then, the standards and protocols for transition, were so strict, many of us would have failed. Some of us died trying.
Count yourself lucky, Dahlia, that you are relatively young. Too bad you do not have the wisdom that comes with age and experience.
Dahlia/ Jamie
Whilst I do not want to get involved in an argument ( Christ I have enough issues going on already!) as the OP I would just like to make 1 points:
1. Given the choice I do not believe anybody would choose to be transgendered.
1. We are all children of our times.
Let me elaborate on the above. I truly consider that being transgender is not an option anybody would elect to have bestowed upon them, it's to much of a tough hand. So we are all, in my view victims of a cruel birth error.
How we choose to deal ( or not deal!) with that error is a matter of personal choice. Personal choice is to a large extent dictated by our attitudes and personalities. To a significant extent our attitudes and personalities are framed and formed by the attitudes and expectations of the society in which we grew up and spent our formative years.
So our attitudes and personalities, which significantly effect our decisions in life are framed by the attitudes ofthe society and the era in which we grew up.
I grew up in the UK in the 70's. Let me tell you the culture then was very very different to now. Minorities got a hard time, women were very much second class citizens. If you do not believe me Google some of the comedy of that time. Programmes such as " love thy neighbour" and " rising damp" tell us a lot about the thinking of the culture at the time.
Men were men and had to get on with it. Christ back then in the UK being Gay was taboo, let alone being a transexual!
So I, rightly or wrongly did what was expected of me. I got on with being a man and put those feelings and desires to the back of my head, locked in a metaphorical vice burried in the sand at the bottom of the deepest ocean I could find in my mind.
Lets not forget we did not live in a world of free and easy information as we do now. There was no internet, Jesus we did not have mobile phones. I remember going to the library to look up what was " wrong" with me as a teenager. I found nothing! As far as I was concerned I was the ONLY person who has ever experienced these thoughts or feelings.
So I did what was expected of me, played soccer, did boys stuff. Was that wrong. Possibly,
Quote from: Paula white on February 05, 2014, 07:22:44 AM
Dahlia/ Jamie
Whilst I do not want to get involved in an argument ( Christ I have enough issues going on already!) as the OP I would just like to make 1 points:
1. Given the choice I do not believe anybody would choose to be transgendered.
1. We are all children of our times.
Let me elaborate on the above. I truly consider that being transgender is not an option anybody would elect to have bestowed upon them, it's to much of a tough hand. So we are all, in my view victims of a cruel birth error.
<snipped for brevity>
So I dis what was expected of me, played soccer, did boys stuff. Was that wrong. Possibly,
Well said. I couldn't have said it better myself. I grew up in the states during the 70s and ditto, ditto, ditto.
I envy you for hanging in there for thirty years. The most I could make it in a marriage was five.
Jane
I would argue it is probably easier in some ways to be an older transwoman.
Ciswomen's voices naturally deepen as they age, and the measuring stick for beauty has changed as well.
Though I can see why older transwomen are hesitant on transitioning, decades of havoc testosterone has on a body can be. . .off putting.
I look at it like this, we all age, it is something we all have to come to terms with. You are 48, you could potentially live into your 80's and 90s'. Do you want to spend the next 40+ years living a lie or do you want to embrace what you've known to be true your entire life?
At the end of the day we all grow on a personal level from the moment we are born until the day we die.
Do not let your past be your prison, and do not let fear be your jailor. Let it all go, because when it's all said and done critics won't matter; you'll be free. Being honest with oneself, being who you are, and living the life you want is a beautiful thing, and no one, not I, not any critic, any doctor, or anyone else can ever take that away from you.
-AM
Quote from: Jamie de la Rosa on February 05, 2014, 12:50:43 AM
This is the biggest pile of ignorant bitchery I have read in a long time, but it seems to be a theme with you.
Count yourself lucky, Dahlia, that you are relatively young. Too bad you do not have the wisdom that comes with age and experience.
I have to agree with Jamie.
As a late onset transitioner that is in the process of losing a long term marriage, let me add another data point to the discussion - some of us
never even had a clue that we were trans until much, much later. In my case I thought I was just another dude that didn't fit in especially well in a dude's world. I did the usual dude things - got married, had kids, played with cars, started a company - and it was only in my mid 40s when I began to unravel who I was and why I was suddenly having female thoughts and desires, and why I never fit in with guys. Sure, there clues all along but I never pieced them together until much later. Like Jamie said the resources and ready access to information that we take for granted today for trans* people didn't exist back in the 60's and 70's.
I have a medical condition that was killing me, and I finally realized that if it I left it untreated I'd continue on my rapid journey to a place that is 6 feet under the ground. My two choices were to continue live a miserable life leading to my death, or begin a new life as the person I should have been. One of those choices is undesirable, and the other is regrettable from the standpoint of my wife. It was a Hobson's choice that I was forced to make when I was 50.
I never wished for this and I hate that it jumped on me late in life. I dang sure never had any intention of deceiving my wife about who I was when we got married.
You ask a tough question.
Let's assume the worst for a moment: that your physical transformation is less than you hope for and that you don't fully pass. The price can feel heavy at times. Some people will treat you like a freak. You will face discrimination. But here are things that I enjoy as a result of my decision.
- For the first time in my life, I feel invested in myself. I eat and drink differently. In fact, I've stopped drinking altogether. This isn't automatic. I have to work at changing my habits. But now I have a reason to make that investment: For the first time in my life, I cherish myself. And I no longer feel feel the need to self-medicate.
- At first, passing mattered a lot to me. Not just for safety. It was a matter of identity. With time, my feelings have softened a bit. I care less whether I am clocked. I care more that I am known for who and what I actually am. After a lifetime in the closet, it is so nice to be able to just be me. I may not get acceptance from everyone. But when you live in the closet, you get acceptance from no one. Now, I at least have some people who embrace me for who I am. I never experienced that before.
- Everyone assumed that my first day out at work would be nerve-racking and stressful (even though I work for a pretty supportive company). Actually, it was the most relaxing day of my life. For the first time in my life, I didn't have to edit what I said. I just got to be me! It was so much simpler.
For me, coming out as myself was like walking into daylight for the first time in my life. Yes, there are some huge obstacles to overcome. But at least I now have the advantage of sight.
Of course, you'll have to weigh the pros and cons for yourself. I've probably been pretty lucky so far. Good luck!
I agree with Jamie and the others, and I too was not trans - not just didn't realize it, but genuinely believe I WAS NOT - until I was in my 30s.
Incidentally, "supportive" or not, I read Dahlia's comment to my wife and she said it was wildly offensive and hurtful. She says she hasn't lost her own life and personality, she emphatically is not a shell of her former self, and she thinks it's absolutely horrible to suggest that the only options for a wife in this position are to leave or to stay and be destroyed as a person. I was trying to be nice in my first reply, but that was before I saw my wife get tearful and then angry at the suggestion that she's some kind of martyred nonperson just because she still loves me and is still happy in our marriage.
Oops look like I have opened a can of worms/ Pandora's box here!
Tina from the photo in your avatar you look every inch female to me!
Thanks for the ( majority) words of wisdom and support.
Quote from: Jamie de la Rosa on February 05, 2014, 12:50:43 AM
Many of our older TG/TS members did not have access to the resources you have today. "Gender identity" was not a widely understood concept for many of us.
I very sincerely doubt those of my generation went out of their way to be deceitful. We have learned to roll with the punches as they come. Some of us were fortunate to find out about gender therapy and afford surgeries. Even then, the standards and protocols for transition, were so strict, many of us would have failed. Some of us died trying.
Wow, thank you for so succinctly stating this.
I'm 61, going on 62. Even at this age, the body & mind change from male to female is like going into a much happier puberty.
There isn't going to be any surgery for me, being that I have a 6mos to 2-1/2 yrs to live diagnosis.
If I drop over 6 day or 6 mos from now, at least I will pass away having known some true joy.
"Free at last, free at last" takes on a new meaning.
Wow is this on target. Sure hope you can save the marrage. I feel the same way, but got lucky, got blessed. Divine intervention was key to it for me and for my wife, and some extremely good therapy.
Quote from: Eva Marie on February 05, 2014, 09:23:47 AM
I have to agree with Jamie.
As a late onset transitioner that is in the process of losing a long term marriage, let me add another data point to the discussion - some of us never even had a clue that we were trans until much, much later. In my case I thought I was just another dude that didn't fit in especially well in a dude's world. I did the usual dude things - got married, had kids, played with cars, started a company - and it was only in my mid 40s when I began to unravel who I was and why I was suddenly having female thoughts and desires, and why I never fit in with guys. Sure, there clues all along but I never pieced them together until much later. Like Jamie said the resources and ready access to information that we take for granted today for trans* people didn't exist back in the 60's and 70's.
I have a medical condition that was killing me, and I finally realized that if it I left it untreated I'd continue on my rapid journey to a place that is 6 feet under the ground. My two choices were to continue live a miserable life leading to my death, or begin a new life as the person I should have been. One of those choices is undesirable, and the other is regrettable from the standpoint of my wife. It was a Hobson's choice that I was forced to make when I was 50.
I never wished for this and I hate that it jumped on me late in life. I dang sure never had any intention of deceiving my wife about who I was when we got married.
I don't think it's ever too late. I wasn't sure starting HRT at 60 was a great idea, but I had to know. A couple of weeks in, I started noticing that my mental landscape was changing. By the end of the second month, I was finally feeling comfortable in my own skin, really for the first time that I can recall. There is the benefit. We can't all be Jenna Talackova, and I'm sure there are more than a few GGs who would love to look that hot, so I'll be content with whatever outward effects the girl juice bestows upon me, because inside, finally, everything matches :)
Well has the "talk" with the wife this evening after seeing therapist today.
Did not go well. She knew I was transgendered but me "fessing up" in full about how I felt inside has not gone down at all well. She wants a divorce. Can not say I really blame her if I was a woman (maybe someday?!) and I married a man that's how I would want it to stay. She claims I have " wasted both our lives". Feeling down, this is a low point, but in an odd way I am glad it is out there if you get me?
What next for me?:-( ???
I'm sorry about the wife Paula; I heard the same thing from my wife about wasting her life and now it is too late for her to start over again. You need to be selfish and put your needs first and take care of yourself. That sounds harsh but spending your energy trying to make things better for everyone else is probably a part of the reason you are in this situation.
In my case it came down to making her happy and me killing myself with alcohol, or me making the choices I needed to make in order to stay alive and accepting whatever consequences that happened.
I decided to live.
Hugs Paula,
I feel sorry the conversation did not go well. I expected the same answer a year ago. We discussed divorce New Years Eve and Day. I believe eventually over the next 2 years I will be divorced. However, I would have lost valuable time not doing what I want to do at the rate I want to do it. I am who I am and if my wife wants to be with me I would love to have her with me but only if I transition.
Quote from: Paula white on February 06, 2014, 03:25:39 PM
What next for me?:-( ???
You will feel bad for a while just like most of us did and then come to accept it. Start transition and begin a new life being the real you not being concealed or imprisoned. You will get comfortable and feel more alive than ever. Life will go on, it did for most of us an for the better. :)Your therapist will be a valuable asset to have during this period of life. Notice I said period of life and not end of life. You already have a great support family right here, use us. :)
Oh Paula, I am so sorry. If only the world were simple.
I am proud of you.
Hugs,
Tori
I'm 43. I thought at times that I was too old, but then I couldn't let any more time go by. Be happy and do what you think is right for you.
Well. If I was laying in a casket 6 feet under ground, I'd have to admit it was too late.
Quote from: Jamie de la Rosa on February 05, 2014, 12:50:43 AM
This is the biggest pile of ignorant bitchery I have read in a long time, but it seems to be a theme with you.
Many of our older TG/TS members did not have access to the resources you have today. "Gender identity" was not a widely understood concept for many of us. I saw a psychiatrist at the age of 19 (1970s), trying to figure things out, and was told I was just bisexual and not to worry about how I felt.
I wish I had known then what I know now. As it was, I entered into a relationship with a beautiful and understanding woman, raised a family, and did my best to meet the gender expectations of society. Only in the last few years has the dysphoria reached the point where I had to do something about it.
It coincided with stress-related cardio-vascular disease that took its toll over time. I was slowly killing myself trying to be something I really was not. When you are in a close, loving relationship with someone for over 30 years, they recognize some things. In 30 years time, the mask occasionally falls off. The label for it might be new, but the transperson does not fundamentally change inside.
I very sincerely doubt those of my generation went out of their way to be deceitful. We have learned to roll with the punches as they come. Some of us were fortunate to find out about gender therapy and afford surgeries. Even then, the standards and protocols for transition, were so strict, many of us would have failed. Some of us died trying.
Count yourself lucky, Dahlia, that you are relatively young. Too bad you do not have the wisdom that comes with age and experience.
I think Dahlia is right on!!
So many of us need to eventually put ourselves first in order to do what we have too....but it doesn't mean our loved ones desires, hopes and future should just be put aside!! Transitioning involves the ones you love almost as much as the one that is transitioning....and its more difficult since they are loosing someone they knew they loved and gaining someone their not sure they can love.
I read about so many people on here that have talked immensely about their transition and I never knew they were still married or had children....it seemed this was not an important factor in their transition.
I am in awe when I hear about the spouses that have stayed together after one has transitioned!! This is truly love and it can HAPPEN! children on the other hand don't have much of a choice!
I have known more than a few trans that dearly loved their wives and children and vowed they would do anything to stay together. Their spouses and children accepted them and agreed to do what was necessary to help...what ends up happening is the person transitioning ends up leaving them....usually for another man!! Ya thanks for sticking with me while I turn into a women but I don't love women anymore so goodbye!!
There's not too many here that would be overly offended if a close coworker had a difficult time with their transition and would probably give them the leeway they needed until they adjusted......but it seems many transitioners don't take this same consideration and time for the ones they love the most. These people sleep, eat, have sex, and share so much in life....isn't it considerate to give them the most slack.....for Pete's sake your changing your gender!!!!! This is not what anyone signed up for....but it doesn't mean they won't accept you.
I had only my children to consider when I transitioned....I finally did have to put my self first and say I needed to do this for me, but I still put them first by taking things slow....did I want too?? Hell NO!! I was minutes away from this step 20 years ago....and I wasn't getting any younger....I now decided to follow through but knew I could not rush this for the sake of my children. I just wish others would have the compassion for the ones that love them no matter who they are!!
Quote from: Paula white on February 06, 2014, 03:24:03 PM
Well has the "talk" with the wife this evening after seeing therapist today.
Did not go well. She knew I was transgendered but me "fessing up" in full about how I felt inside has not gone down at all well. She wants a divorce. Can not say I really blame her if I was a woman (maybe someday?!) and I married a man that's how I would want it to stay. She claims I have " wasted both our lives". Feeling down, this is a low point, but in an odd way I am glad it is out there if you get me?
Ya I totally get you. I had my first appointment with the therapist on Tuesday. And to my surprise my wife came home from work and initiated the "talk" And although mine seemed like it went better than yours I got the "I don't want to be married to a woman" you can go to my profile and read that long post. Things seem great right now. But I am worried more worried than anything I ever have been in my life. I am thinking I have until I save for FFS Because when I look like the woman I am on the inside and I can't hide it anymore she will leave me if she has not already. And it will be easy because we are only married by common law. I am so sorry it did not go well for you. I am almost in tears just thinking of the pain you and others like us have or are going to go through. Life is always unfair. But like my wife said, you have to do what you have to do to be happy. That is the most important thing.
Norma Lynne
Quote from: Paula white on February 06, 2014, 03:24:03 PM
Well has the "talk" with the wife this evening after seeing therapist today.
Did not go well. She knew I was transgendered but me "fessing up" in full about how I felt inside has not gone down at all well. She wants a divorce. Can not say I really blame her if I was a woman (maybe someday?!) and I married a man that's how I would want it to stay. She claims I have " wasted both our lives". Feeling down, this is a low point, but in an odd way I am glad it is out there if you get me?
What did you expect? Ya made a promise you couldn't keep. I feel bad for her o.o
Quote from: sad panda on February 06, 2014, 11:27:49 PM
What did you expect? Ya made a promise you couldn't keep. I feel bad for her o.o
That is pretty harsh.
As has already been pointed out there are all kinds of pressures and cultural circumstances that have brought many of us of the same age to a similar place. To say that Paula is being selfish about this is a n oversimplification. It seems fairly obvious that she feels very deeply about her wife and would like nothing more than to not be in this impasse.
Hi Paula :D
It's never too late to be true to yourself and to be happy. There are also many girls who started hrt a lot older than you have and there are threads about them too :3 feel free to flicker through some of them :D
Good luck and all the best :3
Let's be clear, I really did not want to hurt my wife. I would give anything not to be a transexual, but in the end that is what I am. According to my therapist I have spent my entire existence running and hiding from my true self in constant denial. This has led me to a point where my bottled anxieties have become unbearable. If I had 2 magic pills in front of me now, 1 that transformed me into a stunning beautiful woman, and 1 that left me as I am but cures of my transexuallaity, I would take the cure.
I expect it is difficult for the younger girls on here to understand any of this or get how I ended up in this situation. Have I been deceitful, yes, but the person I have deceived the most is myself.
My therapist gave me this to read;
www.avitale.com/developmentalreview.htm
Apparently I am a classic "G3". I don'texpect those in "G1" to understand or be sympathetic to those in "G3" because we come at our transexualism at different angles.
I just came out this year. I'm 34.
I waited 20 years, because of my upbringing in a church.
I started having depression after high school, and welcomed death everyday
Eight months ago iI started having trouble staying happy, or if you want to call it happy.
I made the choice to start.
It's etherthis or death.
I scared as hell, but Iam happy, truly happy!
OMG the pain in here
My wife doesn't want to see me female either. She hasn't. And I wont let her. Ever. Even though transitioned I have to hide it, and it is an acceptable sacrifice for me. However, I sleep in a satin nightshirt covering some very wonderful lingerie, and she sees it, and she has felt the boobs but not seen them. We found a place of common ground and I love her dearly.
On full dose hormones, my love and attraction for her remains deep. She won't have sex (I can't anyway now) because she can't with a woman. Thats ok at my age, stuff doesn't work well anyway.
However I am not a stage 5 or 6 trans I am stage 4. I cannot imagine the pain of 5 and 6 married, and when I had the talk I was prepared to live in a studio in a dangerous place, and I was spared this. It was a terrible night, and 3 terrible months afterwards, but it finally freed me from fear and I got to rid myself of dishonesty. Now we are even closer than before.
I had expert shrink help and there was much prayer - answered prayer.
Also, you can be Christian and trans. I have had far too many experiences of Christ since transitioning to believe otherwise. Watch out for mistranslations in the Bible and see the Christianity posts we can help with that.
Oh you poor girls my heart bleeds for you. Really. I broke under the dysphoria at 55. It was insanity or acceptance.
Can you please explain this concept of stage 4, 5 and 6. One assumes there must be a stage 1-3? Where can I find this. Did not know that this could be categorized and or quantified?
There are no stages listed in SOC.
There use to be a Benjamin scale but it is no longer used and considered irrelevant.
Sorry I am confused ( there is an understatement!) about the "SOC" and stages.
I really am having trouble with this. I guess I am emerging from 40+ years of denial so self acceptance is a big difficulty issue. I hate the pain I am causing to the one person I love so dearly.
In my hearts of hearts I know I am transgender, always have been, I kinda knew but ran and ran and ran. The thing is whilst I think I would or could be happier as a female I can not see myself as one. I don't want to be a woman in the sense that somebody wants a Porsche or a new car or shoes. It is if I "need" or " have" to become one in order to aciehve any kind of self worth or fulfilment. To be " happy" whatever that is. I am not sure I even understand happiness anymore or ever have?
There are no stages. That is simple enough.
SOC stands for Standards of Care. It is a guide line for professionals who care for trans folks.
I wouldn't worry about being too confused. I'm confused and I transitioned 20 years ago. I've no idea what all these acronyms mean and I honestly believed WPATH was some dos environmental variable. I'm not sure they're that important to know.
Quote from: Paula white on February 07, 2014, 07:28:21 AM
Sorry I am confused ( there is an understatement!) about the "SOC" and stages.
I really am having trouble with this. I guess I am emerging from 40+ years of denial so self acceptance is a big diffusion issue.
In my hearts of hearts I know I am transgender, always have been, I kinda knew but ran and ran and ran. The thing is whilst I think I would or could be happier as a female I can not see myself as one. I don't want to be a woman in the sense that somebody wants a Porsche or a new car or shoes. It is if I "need" or " have" to become one in order to aciehve any kind of self worth or fulfilment. To be " happy" whatever that is. I am not sure I even understand happiness anymore or ever have?
OK, Sorry Honey, so many terms and explanations!
SOC is the Standard of care that is used as guide by psychiatrists and treating professionals to 'standardize' how gender dysphoric people should be treated. Thee is a copy here in the wiki https://www.susans.org/wiki/Standards_of_Care_for_Gender_Identity_Disorders
Over the years gender dysphoric people have been treated in a variety of ways and at one time categorisation was considered important, it no longer is. The Benjamin scale was one of the old scales that suggested how people should be treated. It is wrong and no longer used professionally.
Modern treatment involves therapy with a gender specialist, often a psychiatrist but varies from place to place. The idea of therapy is to allow you, the client, to define where you want to be in life. People can be MtF, FtM, genderfluid and all sorts of inbetweens. There is no 'right' there is no 'wrong' people with gender dysphoria are a spectra of issues. The idea of therapy is to help us find a place where we can be happy functional humans.
Now on top of this many people 'develop' as they undergo therapy, they may seek additional changes. Some (for example) MtF are content to cross dress and do not wish to go further, they may later. Therapy allows us to do that.
Never be frightened about where you fit. You are unique and beautiful.
Cindy
Quote from: Nicolette on February 07, 2014, 07:39:18 AM
I wouldn't worry about being too confused. I'm confused and I transitioned 20 years ago. I've no idea what all these acronyms mean and I honestly believed WPATH was some dos environmental variable. I'm not sure they're that important to know.
So true!
What may be important is that there are an increasing number of medical professionals who do care.
Yep we get criticized for being evil gatekeepers and maybe some are, but they are not the professionals who are interested in helping gender dysphoria.
Is there a level 15, I have a feeling I must be a 15
Quote from: Paula white on February 07, 2014, 05:33:56 AM
Let's be clear, I really did not want to hurt my wife. I would give anything not to be a transexual, but in the end that is what I am. According to my therapist I have spent my entire existence running and hiding from my true self in constant denial. This has led me to a point where my bottled anxieties have become unbearable. If I had 2 magic pills in front of me now, 1 that transformed me into a stunning beautiful woman, and 1 that left me as I am but cures of my transexuallaity, I would take the cure.
I expect it is difficult for the younger girls on here to understand any of this or get how I ended up in this situation. Have I been deceitful, yes, but the person I have deceived the most is myself.
My therapist gave me this to read;
www.avitale.com/developmentalreview.htm
Apparently I am a classic "G3". I don'texpect those in "G1" to understand or be sympathetic to those in "G3" because we come at our transexualism at different angles.
This was my same thought for many years....even after taking the one pill that set me free, I still had much guilt I felt for my children.
I whole heartedly believe you love your wife! I do not say what some that are unfamiliar with our situation would say. You may have or possibly will hear some say " if you loved your wife you wouldn't do this to her" That is totally unfair, they do not know how much we struggled not to do this to our loved ones.
What I get so offended of is the ones that transition and forget about reality and that each situation is different. So many will base their decisions on what a therapist says.....yes, a therapist is of great importance and for many including me they are the only one I can tell all my thoughts about and can get some understanding of who I am. But if a therapist told me to jump off a bridge would I ?? For some whatever a therapist or worse whatever is said on forums like this is taken as the gold standard of what should be done.
There is so much support for people on here to fight for their rights, but hardly any for educating others of our circumstances. There are some travesties committed in work situations and most definitely other situations and those times call for defensive action....but does this mean all situations call for the same.
Some on here may give advice to someone coming out at work to stand up for their rights and fight for who they are....nothing bad about this advice....but how is using the proper bathroom or being called your preferred name when legal documents haven't even been changed going to help your life. This is where including your employer in your transition will only do good....even if an employer respects your rights and allows decisions such as these two, why push it if one or two are offended. Does everyone need to see you as a female overnight....or even in a years time!! These people may have worked with you for years.
The one thing everyone that is transitioning needs to know is that people who know you well or especially intimately will not see you for who you are for at least a year....some a little sooner many even later. They can still see that person they knew for so long....it has NOTHING to do with passing, this doesn't mean they don't accept you! but if after even one year your wife, son, or sister call you him and you correct them quickly this is not going to help your situation. Now do the same thing in a work place....and....
Being properly pro-nouned is so much more important than one would think....you will start to cringe when being referred wrong.....but other people do not know how you feel especially within the first year....if their doing it purposely then something is wrong with them!! Some really just don't understand though....this is when you need to educate and not defend.
I had a school counselor refer to me as a he thinking this is what I wanted....even after meeting with her a couple of times. Her reasoning was because I told her I will always be my children's father, there's nothing I can or want to change about that. I told her this early on when I first met with her.....about six months later I receive a letter form another teacher referring to me as Mr Shelly **** I somewhat figured out why since this other teacher was in communication with the counselor. I called this one teacher to find out and she confirmed what I thought....telling me that the counselor referred to me as him....and she was unsure what to do, I then had a talk with the school counselor and told her that yes, I am my children's father but I do not walk around in life appearing like I do and wanting to be referred to as a "he" ....she now understood!!
I'd just like to say some thing from my perspective. this topic is probably the most difficult for me personally to understand. The situation of doing some thing about dysphoria and having a family. I've never been married ,never had children and don't have any family to speak of. Whenever this topic is discussed I have so much trouble with understanding this situation. I think my dysphoria prevented me from having a strong enough relationship that would start a marriage. In one sense I'm lucky not to have dealt with this problem because what I do only affects me. I'm truly sorry people go through this situation because it seems so terrible for everyone concerned. It's just a very difficult topic to deal with. I try to understand but it is hard. I just thought I'd give another perspective, a point from an outside observer.
Quote from: Eva Marie on February 03, 2014, 07:49:17 AM
I started transitioning at 50. Weight can be lost with diet and exercise, and there are lots of very attractive tall women around these days. Hormones don't quite have the same effects on us mature transitioners that they do for the younger transitioners, but they still do a good enough job.
So come on in, the water is fine!
50? I've seen your posts a million times and in your avatar, I never assumed you were over 25. I seriously guessed you were 19 or 20.
Quote from: Chic on February 07, 2014, 04:17:00 PM
50? I've seen your posts a million times and in your avatar, I never assumed you were over 25. I seriously guessed you were 19 or 20.
Well this just made my day! Thanks!! :)
Oh my, some of you girls are going through so much pain! :'( I haven't cried so much in my life as I have since discovering this site. Well... The Notebook got me. God, how I hated that movie, or any movie that made me cry. Would that be dysphoria?
Even though I was married for a long time we had no children. We are still best friends though. In fact she will be the first one I tell. I can shop with her now!
Paula, I can't even imagine the torment you must be going through. Or any of you girls that are married with children for that matter. It makes a difficult thing so much harder when it is hurting someone you love.
My ex is moving on and dating now, happy with her life. She said she knew it was only a matter of time before I called it quits. Someone as sexual as me still able to preform, but unable to finish. She thought I was cheating! She thought it was just her that was causing my problems. She knows better now that it has been so long and I am not with anyone or dating.
All of that is not even close to what you are going through. If you ever need someone to talk to though, vent here and I will be glad to listen and be a shoulder to cry on.
I appreciate the comments on the Stage 4 thing. It helps, and I think they just used it to help validate the hormone decision.
I'm chucking it. The great thing about therapy for me is I am comfortable with myself, although still very insecure around other people, even in here.
Thanks so much for being here and supporting us.
Quote from: Cindy on February 07, 2014, 07:40:50 AM
Never be frightened about where you fit. You are unique and beautiful.
Cindy
I needed to hear this. I fought this dsyphoria with everything I had and it broke my mind like a twig. I resisted too long, and paid a price for that. And even after a year of good therapy - and the therapist didn't say stage 4 : I did, because I wanted hormones desperately and didn't want to do real life experience, which I think when forced is terrible - even after a year I can destabilize into a puddle of fear and uncertainty. I just did after my last post here, worrying about being stupid in the forum. I fear what progression could do to my marrage and I am still doing everything I can not to cross the threshhold that would push my wife to call it quits. So far, I can do that. I cherish every day knowing the shoe could drop and I could lose everything if I only screw up and cross the line. I'm glad I even have a line, and rules for survival here that I can accept.
So I cling to the board, the shrink, my God, and my wife. I am horrified about the stories I hear here.
I remember well breaking and having the talk. It was the most terrible thing I ever had to face in life. It also was the most freeing. My wife told me she wouldn't leave me. But she also said she can't see me transitioned and in my true self. So I sometimes have to hide a little. I'm just glad she can handle the legs, nails, lingerie, and boobs and butt, even though I don't flaunt that, but it is always there, under the surface or out in the open but played down to limit discomfort for her. But if she sees me wigged and in a nice dress, I think I'm dead. I'll take what I can get and give what I can give, and somehow right now its working.
My heart goes out to you. I was willing to pay the price and sacrifice everything I ever cared about, I could no longer fight the dysphoria, I would have utterly lost my mind if I had continued to try. And God knows that and my wife knows that too.
Quote from: Satinjoy on February 08, 2014, 11:54:26 AM
I needed to hear this. I fought this dsyphoria with everything I had and it broke my mind like a twig. I resisted too long, and paid a price for that. And even after a year of good therapy - and the therapist didn't say stage 4 : I did, because I wanted hormones desperately and didn't want to do real life experience, which I think when forced is terrible - even after a year I can destabilize into a puddle of fear and uncertainty. I just did after my last post here, worrying about being stupid in the forum. I fear what progression could do to my marrage and I am still doing everything I can not to cross the threshhold that would push my wife to call it quits. So far, I can do that. I cherish every day knowing the shoe could drop and I could lose everything if I only screw up and cross the line. I'm glad I even have a line, and rules for survival here that I can accept.
So I cling to the board, the shrink, my God, and my wife. I am horrified about the stories I hear here.
I remember well breaking and having the talk. It was the most terrible thing I ever had to face in life. It also was the most freeing. My wife told me she wouldn't leave me. But she also said she can't see me transitioned and in my true self. So I sometimes have to hide a little. I'm just glad she can handle the legs, nails, lingerie, and boobs and butt, even though I don't flaunt that, but it is always there, under the surface or out in the open but played down to limit discomfort for her. But if she sees me wigged and in a nice dress, I think I'm dead. I'll take what I can get and give what I can give, and somehow right now its working.
My heart goes out to you. I was willing to pay the price and sacrifice everything I ever cared about, I could no longer fight the dysphoria, I would have utterly lost my mind if I had continued to try. And God knows that and my wife knows that too.
SatinJoy you have all my prayers. You are a very strong woman to be able to handle things the way you have, and accept what you've accepted. You are very much stronger than I. Your post moved me a little, and let me see how lucky I am that I can go forward at my age. I wish you and your family the best.
Ally
Many thanks. :)
I have to live in God's strength, I dont have it. He sent the shrink, the wife, the endo, and His son.
My wife had a vision of Christ saying not to fear, and separately I had something similar of Him saying "trust me".
So how can I say He can't carry it through? But the fear remains from time to time, and eases other times.
Hang in there.
"SatinJoy you have all my prayers. You are a very strong woman to be able to handle things the way you have, and accept what you've accepted. You are very much stronger than I. Your post moved me a little, and let me see how lucky I am that I can go forward at my age. I wish you and your family the best.
Ally" What a beautiful post!!!!!!!!!!
Prayers answered, and the compliment is well appreciated. A whole lot of good stuff unlocked in therapy yesterday, most if not all of the fear is gone, and I am resting now in being comfortable and happy and honest, and a little sad that others cannot accept. Trans to me is something you can't really hide from yourself in outside garments, it is a state of body and mind. Regardless of how I look, even stealth, I am transwoman, I was born this way for a reason, and I want to and I do take joy in it. It sorrows me that others cannot accept it and want to remove it. But that is no longer so much of my immediate family, only one can't handle it, and she has a mental disorder that I can accomodate for her sake. Not her fault, not rigid ideas, it is a security issue for her, she can't handle the change when I've been a rock getting her through the pain of an anxiety disorder, and a bad one at that.
I finally showed my true self to one of my other daughters today, one that accepts. It was great. Her first comment - wow you look so happy. Her second - Hey you look just like the girl in the Mummy, the lead. Now that my dear is one heck of a compliment, I think she is a beautiful woman, and that makes me a beautiful transwoman.
Thank you for your prayers. I need them, fear destabilizes me, but there has been so much growth and acceptance and I get less and less fear and more and more peace and joy.
Thanks everyone for your support. It gets hard sometimes.
My daughter thinks I'm beautiful. OMG. What a way to start a day out.
No its not too late. But it takes a lot of help from very competent people to handle transitioning or even coping at all.
God Bless, hugs and encouragement to all as we try to meet both our needs and the needs of those who love us.
Satinjoy. :)
I'm happy to hear about your daughters acceptance and her compliments to you. My daughters just want me to be happy, and if that means fully transitioning (which it does) complete with SRS they are OK with it. They think I look like Penelopie Cruz. It's funny how my daughters accept my being trans and my adopted family had such a problem with it.
Good things happened for me at my new Family Doctors Monday Feb. 3rd, and it seems I'm finally on the correct road toward eventual SRS after the hormones have had the necessary time to do their thing. I finally have a trans friendly FP!
In any case I say to anyone your never too old to be happy. Since I've been on hrt I've been able to think more clearly and feel positive about my future. ;)
Great to hear, that med support is huge. Cruz, huh. Sounds like you will have fun indeed. :)
Enjoy and thanks for the postings.
That's just what my daughters say. Me, I don't see it at all. Besides, I'm Native American. I do have small features but my nose is too big. I'm way too old. I just think they were trying to make me feel good, lol!