Ok, for the last few years Ive been keeping my hair long, and my go-to hair salon accepted that for a long time, however this week I was put with a new guy who, after I told him I was growing it, said 'yes' and proceeded to cut almost all of my hair off save my fringe. It spiked my dysphoria massively and I was still expected to pay full price with no apology. I have written them a stern letter that it is unreasonable after I protested to him and the dresser continued to chop off my hair. I was given a pathetic excuse of an apology and they were adement I don't even get a discount.
I have had it corrected as best as possible at a Toni and Guy that has opened nearby (still short, but its a pixie cut now, so at least it looks more feminine. Since this place did a good job of it and is nearer my house, I am considering going there. Only thing I will say is, when I mentioned I was growing it, they seemed to be wanting to push me to men's styles.
Now I don't know if it's a smart idea to bring up my gender stuff with them so they understand for the future points, but the stylist I had didn't seem to get it when I said I prefer longer, less masculine styles. Is it worth it?
There is no reason to disclose your trans history. They are hairdressers not doctors.
Finding one that does as they are told is difficult. My cis-women friends constantly complain about it. My advice to you is ask some women you trust who they use and get the stylist's name as well as the salon's name.
Sorry this has happened to you.
I've always found that hairdressers tend to go by their own assumptions of what they think will suit a client's face. This is actually part of their training: they're trained to take the client's wishes into account but to customise the requested haircut for what they think will suit the client's face shape and hair - and perceived gender. This is because everyone & their dog goes into the salon wanting the latest trendy cut... but it only suits a small minority of people so the stylist will have to adapt it or give you something else that they think is better. This means that your wishes are only part of their mental processes when they decide how they're going to customise the cut.
You don't have to outright tell them about your gender issues if you don't want to... but when I was early in my transition I found it helpful to very clearly specify that I wanted my hair cut in a masculine style, and that I didn't want them to customise a masculine-looking cut into a feminine version because they might think I'd want a female version of it. Perhaps you might want to start by insisting that your hair is to be cut in a feminine style and must not be customised to look more masculine?
I also found it quite handy that there are quite a few gay hairdressers around. I found a few good ones and asked to speak to them privately before the cut. I'd then explain that I'm undergoing transition so although my face looked feminine I needed my hair cut in a masculine style. That always worked a treat and I got some great hairstyles that way.
Ahh, that sounds so frustrating! I'm sorry to hear that jaybutterfly, I'd hate for something like that to happen to me and it's pretty much why I cut my own hair. You don't need to disclose any of that. Just tell them it's what you prefer and that's how you like it. Try be more specific with them and tell them exactly what you want done. I hope I helped! :)
Same thing happened to me - rogue hairstylist went nuts with the scissors even after I told her I wanted to keep my hair long. And it's the worst feeling in the world: you can see it happening right in front of you, but you're too polite to speak up at the first sign of trouble.
I'm planning on disclosing to my next hairstylist. I see no other way of guaranteeing that she sees/treats me as female when it comes to my hair. Sure, I shouldn't have to disclose that fact because in a perfect world hairstylists would follow my directions like I ask them to, but I'm tired of the constant mistakes and miscommunication.
If haircut mistakes are an issue you'd really want to avoid, then you've got to give the stylist the information they need to serve you properly. If you want a girl's haircut, you've gotta tell them. They have far better things to do with their time than gossip to one another about a transgirl's hair, and they've probably seen clients like you a thousand times before and it's no big deal. :)
Quote from: Brenda E on July 17, 2014, 06:55:59 AM
Same thing happened to me - rogue hairstylist went nuts with the scissors even after I told her I wanted to keep my hair long. And it's the worst feeling in the world: you can see it happening right in front of you, but you're too polite to speak up at the first sign of trouble.
I'm planning on disclosing to my next hairstylist. I see no other way of guaranteeing that she sees/treats me as female when it comes to my hair. Sure, I shouldn't have to disclose that fact because in a perfect world hairstylists would follow my directions like I ask them to, but I'm tired of the constant mistakes and miscommunication.
If haircut mistakes are an issue you'd really want to avoid, then you've got to give the stylist the information they need to serve you properly. If you want a girl's haircut, you've gotta tell them. They have far better things to do with their time than gossip to one another about a transgirl's hair, and they've probably seen clients like you a thousand times before and it's no big deal. :)
The worst part of it was I did insist he stop, he didnt. It was later made apparent the stylist doesn't actually speak much English if at all, so how he's working in England without someone to at least translate for him is beyond me.
The new place I did specify feminine haircuts and they handed me a list of men's style references, so I think I might need to bring it up if it happens again, but only as something the staff should make a note of, discreetly.
You're like me Brenda, I'm too scared and polite to say anything so I try to avoid situations like that most of the time. That sort of reminds me of this time I went to get a haircut with my brother. This dude was just chopping away with the scissors at my brother's hair and I was just sitting there with a big smirk on my face combined with something like o.0. I can only imagine something like that happening to me, I don't know what I'd do except freak out inside haha. Brenda makes a good point though, I've had that happen to me several times where mistakes and miscommunication were made. It's really up to you to disclose any of that information just be cautious about it.
Quote from: Brenda E on July 17, 2014, 06:55:59 AM
And it's the worst feeling in the world: you can see it happening right in front of you, but you're too polite to speak up at the first sign of trouble.
??? Polite?
You have to live with this "mistake" for months, so it is worth making a fuss. A piece of advice I was given is "Just stand up". If you get out of the chair they will stop. Then you can tell them what is wrong.
There are chairs in the salons, there are magazines, there are pictures on the wall, pick one that you want, point to it, and say "this is what I want".
I told my hairdresser directly, (after a deep breath), "I am going thru a change, and I need a feminine cut". She understood perfectly. I got the color and cut advice I needed, and she had been doing my hair for almost a year before I told her this. So even tho she had been cutting my hair short (think military cut), she did exactly what I expected of her.
Hairdressers are not mind readers. You MUST tell them exactly what you have in mind. If you can't, point at a picture and say, "that". If they come at you with a hedge trimmer, stab them in the heart with their own scissors. (I'm kidding, but you know what I mean)
Quote from: Paula Christine on July 17, 2014, 08:14:26 AM
There are chairs in the salons, there are magazines, there are pictures on the wall, pick one that you want, point to it, and say "this is what I want".
I told my hairdresser directly, (after a deep breath), "I am going thru a change, and I need a feminine cut". She understood perfectly. I got the color and cut advice I needed, and she had been doing my hair for almost a year before I told her this. So even tho she had been cutting my hair short (think military cut), she did exactly what I expected of her.
Hairdressers are not mind readers. You MUST tell them exactly what you have in mind. If you can't, point at a picture and say, "that". If they come at you with a hedge trimmer, stab them in the heart with their own scissors. (I'm kidding, but you know what I mean)
if we are talking about my first one: Please refer to the post where I stated it came out he doesnt understand english and went rogue on me.
Otherwise, refer to the same post, the part where I mentioned prefering feminine styles and was then asked to pick a style for guys.
Yes, I did read that his English was non translatable... And he went on merrily snipping away.. Read my part about stabbing him in the heart with his own shears.
If you don't give the male styles card or recommends back to them and tell them -exactly- what you want, then how do you expect them to know?
You order a salad and the waiter brings a burger.. Would you pay for that? Send it back, or just eat it? Seems like you're just going to ask for mustard and ketchup to me..
Point and say "I want this!" How hard is that?
Quote from: jaybutterfly on July 17, 2014, 08:18:14 AM
Please refer to the post where I stated it came out he doesnt understand english and went rogue on me.
I would not accept a stylist I cannot talk to.
Perhaps part of the problem is that women and men expect different things from hairdressers?
When I used to use a barber, I did not want talk. I expected him tidy was was on my head and charge me a few quid for the work.
Nowadays I expect tea (or coffee) whilst I wait, my hair to be washed and conditioned and then a chat while she works both about what she is doing to my head and her life and mine. That is generally what women want from their hairdressers. Now a cut'n'blow costs £25, not £5
It came as a shock to me. I was fortunate that I went with two cis-women and saw how they interacted. Not being able to talk to the stylist would be a BIG issue. Being previously socialised as a male did not prepare me for the difference.
I use a lot of metaphors. so ...
If you hire a painter to paint your house brown and he begins to slap on red paint, do you let him finish or stop and get a different painter?
You said the salon kept giving you male styles to choose.. point and say "no, I want this one" or walk out. Doesn't matter if you're in the UK, US or USSR.. if you sat there and let them -give- you -their- choice then why are you complaining? Why did you even pay the first place? (Non English speaking), why stay at the second one?
You walked in wanting a Ferrari, and walked out with an Opel.
You don't have to tell them you are trans unless you want to, but tell them you want a specific cut, and hairdresser. You are paying for it, not them.
No. You don't have to mention anything about your gender status. You are paying them to provide you with what you want, I would not have paid. Actually when he would have kept butchering my hair after I told him to stop I think a lot of four letter words would have been said from me. Not speaking english is no excuse. The word No, shaking your head, raising your hand to stop him or just pushing his arm away to get the shears away from your hair are universal that you are not satisified and to stop. Ain't no way I would have been polite and let him go on.
But.. it seems the other salon honored your wishes so I would stick with them.
I don't believe you need to tell, unless you feel good about telling it.
Just make it clear you don't want it cut because you are growing it.
Yesterday I went to a salon too, and I called one girl and said to her "hey, I've been growing my hair for a time now, but it is still too short here and here and I would like a way to fix it and cover this bald spots, perhaps a hair straightening"
She told me to go to another girl to have my hair washed and the girl there asked if I was going to have it cut...I replied a huge "nooooo!"
But after that, no problems! Actually, perhaps the girl could read my mind and she made the straightening and left my hair with a very feminine appearance! I couldn't even believe! =D
Natalia, only thing is, if you do not tell them the style, or more pointedly, the reason for the style, they will continue to fall back to "looks like a boy, it's all I know how to cut" type thinking, they will fall back on that.. If you say "I want a fem cut" then I believe they will now have a proper frame of mind, from which to draw
Paula's line of simply saying "I am going thru a change, and I need a feminine cut" seems perfect. You don't have to go though a long history. The stylist just needs to know what kind of style you want.
The most important thing, I think, is shopping for a good stylist rather than a good salon. Most salons these days want to be able to just assign every walk-in with the next stylist available, but the unspoken secret is you don't have to go along with that. It's perfectly acceptable to ask for a particular stylist every time. I suggest that once you find a stylist you like, find out her/his hours & days and, if possible, even make appointments. If the stylist leaves the salon, follow her/him to the new salon. Do this and you'll never have this sort of problem again. Don't and you'll have to go through this every time you go in.
Quote from: Jess42 on July 17, 2014, 09:34:51 AM
But.. it seems the other salon honored your wishes so I would stick with them.
Jess, that's not how I read it (but then, I was a math major).. They listened, but kept giving recommendations for a masculine style..
The new place I did specify feminine haircuts and they handed me a list of men's style references, so I think I might need to bring it up if it happens again, but only as something the staff should make a note of, discreetly.Time to tell them adios because they were not listening.
Quote from: Paula Christine on July 17, 2014, 02:28:04 PM
Jess, that's not how I read it (but then, I was a math major).. They listened, but kept giving recommendations for a masculine style..
The new place I did specify feminine haircuts and they handed me a list of men's style references, so I think I might need to bring it up if it happens again, but only as something the staff should make a note of, discreetly.
Time to tell them adios because they were not listening.
Your right Paula, I missed that part. But at least in the end though. Best thing just let it grow and you can trim the ends fairly easy yourself. Once it gets to a certain length then people will see that you actually want it left long and actually take the hint. Best thing is to find a really small shop that may actually listen to what you want instead of making assumptions.
I don't have this problem, I started cutting my own hair since I was 14 because going to a salon made me more dyphoric as my mom ordered them to buzz cut all of my hair, while on my own I could leave something there to make it a pixie cut at least... So yeah even when I cut my own hair I like to google picture, and such... and sometimes when I cut my sister hairs she tells me how to make it very clearly... Don't be shy, and yell at them if it's not what you want! XD I know it's hard to do because I'm very shy too....
Quote from: Paula Christine on July 17, 2014, 09:21:07 AM
I use a lot of metaphors. so ...
If you hire a painter to paint your house brown and he begins to slap on red paint, do you let him finish or stop and get a different painter?
You said the salon kept giving you male styles to choose.. point and say "no, I want this one" or walk out. Doesn't matter if you're in the UK, US or USSR.. if you sat there and let them -give- you -their- choice then why are you complaining? Why did you even pay the first place? (Non English speaking), why stay at the second one?
You walked in wanting a Ferrari, and walked out with an Opel.
You don't have to tell them you are trans unless you want to, but tell them you want a specific cut, and hairdresser. You are paying for it, not them.
Going overboard on the metaphors I think here. I got it a few posts back :P
Ok, there seems to be a crossed wire reading this last bit. The non-english speaker was at the old place, not the new one.
as much as I like the idea, scissors around they eye (and considering the big chuck near my eye was the first thing he cut, I didnt exactly have chance with that guy until after the first part (which is the worst bit for me, I always keep the sides long because my cheekbones are them only part of my face that looks masculine when cleanshaved) I said no but he didnt stop waving the scissors, and I wasnt prepared to look like a square had been cut off my head by this point and have to walk around for a day or two looking like an embarresment. Plus they woulda called the cops on me anyway. I made it clear I was unhappy, not even a sorry off the jerkasses there, so I dont care much at this point to deal with them. If that's how they handle business, they can just carry on and run themselves dry of business. I actually found out theres been reviews of the place quite recently with similar experiences.
The new place did give me a girly pixie cut after several times of insisting, but I'm just thinking for future reference, is it worth telling them so they don't do this every time I go in? Telling them I'm having changes might work. I also considered the other day of presenting female when I go in, if it will help at all. They were at least sympathetic.
Quote from: Lyric on July 17, 2014, 11:19:47 AM
Paula's line of simply saying "I am going thru a change, and I need a feminine cut" seems perfect. You don't have to go though a long history. The stylist just needs to know what kind of style you want.
The most important thing, I think, is shopping for a good stylist rather than a good salon. Most salons these days want to be able to just assign every walk-in with the next stylist available, but the unspoken secret is you don't have to go along with that. It's perfectly acceptable to ask for a particular stylist every time. I suggest that once you find a stylist you like, find out her/his hours & days and, if possible, even make appointments. If the stylist leaves the salon, follow her/him to the new salon. Do this and you'll never have this sort of problem again. Don't and you'll have to go through this every time you go in.
Used to have a good stylist at the old place, then she moved several cities away. Shame cause she always did exactly as asked.
yeah I use a lot of metaphors it's an occupational hazard when you're an instructor. . sorry. ;)
You could go in, dressed, to some level, maybe enough to avoid being read male, should make it easier to get the proper gender cut.. its good you got it across what you wanted.
Again, sorry it happened in the the first place, and for the metaphors.. now its my turn to go get my color and cuts today!
I would present female either next time you go in or book the appointment. This way you can also gage there reaction to you and how comfortable you think you will be there. If not keep looking around because sadly as you have found out a good stylist is worth there weight in gold
And this, my friends, is why my wife cuts my hair, and has done so all but twice in the last 22 years. She knows what to do.
I always wanted my hair long and never wanted to cut it when I was a kid. My dad would give me sh*t every time it got dangerously into "Beatle" territory and my hand was always forced. During my freshman year in college I finally could let it grow out a bit. When it started to look a bit ratty, I went to get it cut, apparently didn't explain it well and ended up with a really sweet mullet. I mean, it was the late '80s and every other dude had one, but still...
On my 20th birthday, my father told me that if I didn't get my hair cut, I would be disowned. I got an extreme buzz cut that I hated with a passion. I will never forget my dad's words- "Son, you look sharp!" UGH!
A few months later, my parents moved across the country and I was able to let it grow again. When I visited for Xmas, they demanded I get another haircut and commented on how much they hated me looking "like that". (Why were these frumpy people so obsessed with my looks?) My parents told me that they weren't going to give me another penny until I cut it again. I went to this place nearby and explained how I was trying to grow it out, and not to do anything drastic. Guess what... another f***ing '80s minimullet. *barf* That was the last time for years that anyone cut my hair. I'd trim off ends and that was about it. I ended up growing it down to my waist.
My point is this- hairdressers don't read minds and some like to get "creative". If you don't give them a picture, you could be in for serious trouble. It can take a year to undo the damage, so treat all unknown quantitites with extreme suspicion.
Quote from: Paula Christine on July 18, 2014, 12:41:29 PM
yeah I use a lot of metaphors it's an occupational hazard when you're an instructor. . sorry. ;)
You could go in, dressed, to some level, maybe enough to avoid being read male, should make it easier to get the proper gender cut.. its good you got it across what you wanted.
Again, sorry it happened in the the first place, and for the metaphors.. now its my turn to go get my color and cuts today!
It's not a problem :) Hope yours goes well! Im just trying to use make up atm to soften my cheeks
Amanda always leaves me teary eyed. She did my color, and, she talked me out of a pixie cut, and I thanked her for that. She gave me just a trim, which began to shape it the way I want to go. She thinned, arched my brows a bit more. All for $29. She said I was her first trans client. She's super nice to me, talks and treats me like any cisfemale client.
Quote from: Paula Christine on July 18, 2014, 07:07:26 PM
Amanda always leaves me teary eyed. She did my color, and, she talked me out of a pixie cut, and I thanked her for that. She gave me just a trim, which began to shape it the way I want to go. She thinned, arched my brows a bit more. All for $29. She said I was her first trans client. She's super nice to me, talks and treats me like any cisfemale client.
I would kill for that.... Thats wonderful!
You'll find your own Amanda. She treats me well, and I tip her well too.. I think.. if you find your own Amanda, and she cuts well, tip her well, she'll remember, and take good care of you too.
I am still a makeup virgin.. there is nothing I can do while at home, even ChapStick gets me a raised eyebrow from the wife (literally).. this is one thing I'm realky envious of you girls.
My wife outed me to my daughter. My daughter was really upset (17 years old). I had let my hair grow for 17 or 18 months and it was just touching my shoulders when wet but the bottom of my collar when dry. My daughter and wife ganged up and I agreed to cutting 1.5 inches.
Truth is it needed a trim to even things out. I was not happy but to keep the peace I did it.
I chose a hair stylist in the gayborhood next to my therapists office. The stylist is gay as well as the other one in the shop and the hair washer. So I was thinking this is great. I get my hair washed and then sit in the chair. I had on a thin nylon shirt and levis 511 jeans and nice black Nikes. I was wearing a sports bra and it was noticeable a bit and a bit stood out at the top od the shirt. I though should I disclose??? I did not and asked for 1.5 inched removed. I said I did not have my hair cut in 17 months and I was growing it long but wanted 1.5 inches (showed with finger the amount).
His first cut was to lop off 3 to 4 inches from the back. My eyes opened up wide but it was done. I vowed never to go back.
Next time I am asking at group where they go!
I tell them straighht up make me as pretty as you can; I how them pics on my phone when Im at my best. They love a challenge and my woman now loves me but in the past when they smirked and or gave me crap I walk right out and take my money with me.
Quote from: Paula Christine on July 18, 2014, 07:07:26 PM
Amanda always leaves me teary eyed. She did my color, and, she talked me out of a pixie cut, and I thanked her for that. She gave me just a trim, which began to shape it the way I want to go. She thinned, arched my brows a bit more. All for $29. She said I was her first trans client. She's super nice to me, talks and treats me like any cisfemale client.
What??? 29?? It costs me 80 to do my roots and get my ends trimmed.
You can sue, or just threaten to sue, the hairdresser. This happened with a friend of mine when the cut was drastically different from what was asked for. The haircut ended up being free, the suit dropped and the hairdresser was gone next visit.
It was important to me to find a hairdresser I could be up front with and transition with. I asked around to my female friends to see if they had one who they suspected personality wise would be a good fit for me. One promised me hers would be perfect, and with my permission, talked about me at her next appointment and asked the hairdresser if she would be comfortable with a client at the beginning of a transition. She was, and at my first appointment she made me feel very comfortable. The salon is a bit small, so without any prior discussion she managed to ask me my timeline and goals in a vague enough manner that no one else would get it and start to analyze me. My next appointment is in a couple weeks and it is going to include eyebrows. I don't plan on going to full time until about January, but this is going to be the appointment where I switch from asking for androgynous to asking for the feminine side of androgynous, so my trust in her is going to be put to the test.
I think it's totally worth the few awkward moments of mild embarrassment to just have it out there. I sought out a new hairdresser recently (after my previous one returned to Japan) and came right out with my intentions from the outset. We had a sit down consultation about how to best get my hair to my desired style. I answered her lingering questions about my transition, and now we just banter about whatever and I get offered female fashion mags to peruse instead of the dull as dirt male ones. I think it's just so much easier in the long run to be honest and upfront rather than trying to talk in circles around what you want. Of course, if you're worried about it getting back to people you're still in the closet to that's a different story...
I think it might be beneficial to tell them if you're comfortable- I tell people who do my hair, since I tend to go for more... alternative? Styles and I want to make absolutely sure nobody gives it a feminine spin. After my first bad experience during transition getting my hair cut (got an appointment as Alexander, went through the whole cut as normal, stylist holds a mirror up so I can see my hair and goes "there ya go, ma'am!"), I've just decided to either go full-disclosure or bring someone with me to make ABSOLUTELY SURE they know I'm a guy.