Hello,
here is a question for our beautful ladies: How does it feel to be pretty?
I mean, changed prettiness or attractivity something in your live? Do you feel better or have more quality of living. Does it make som things in your day or generally easier? What about your body dysphoria - is it easier to handle if you are attractive?
Its only my interest. I cant imagine how people live who are pretty.
Regards
Galaxy
It makes sense, sure and i know exactly what you want to say - but there is a objective attractivity in women too. I dont want to discuss what makes your as a human pretty. I want to know how does it feel if you are (objective) pretty. I think a lot of self-esteem could come from attractivity. I mean, i know a woman from the supermarket - shes really nice, good-humored, a nice person - but shes not attractive or pretty. In no way! We shouldnt mix up these things so much.
Um, I hear you.
I guess it is like any other thing, it has advantages and disadvantages. This is very subjective and I think all people will have different perceptions of where they fall in the beauty scale. I believe I have a cute face, but I am used too look at it everyday so even if I was stunning it would just become a regular thing. Beauty can be certainly both a gift and a curse because the more pride you take in your looks, the more depressed you will be when they start vanishing.
Though not saying I am ashamed of who I am, I think I would trade prettiness for cis privilege anytime.
It's okay. I guess. I have to find ways not to lead men on because I don't want to have to tell them that I'm transsexual...
Well from someone who is stunningly gorgeous, life is great. But I may be the only person in the world who thinks I .
And I'm the only opinion that matters to me :laugh:
Quote from: Cindy on July 17, 2014, 09:11:40 AM
Well from someone who is stunningly gorgeous, life is great. But I may be the only person in the world who thinks I .
And I'm the only opinion that matters to me :laugh:
For me it is what is on the inside and not my outward appearance that I am concerned about. Sure I would love to be drop dead gorgeous, but in the end I just want the out side to match the inside and have to put the vanity aside. I think being pretty start in your mind and the rest is a work in progress. Like Cindy says. "I'm the only opinion that matters to me". That is really important, as if we judge ourselves by what others think were truly not being who we truly are.
Veronica
PS. Cindy you are stunningly gorgeous... You go girl...
I'm super pretty and probably the most gorgeous person on Earth. NOT!! But you are wayyyyy too hard on yourself. I've only seen one other person on here as hard on themselves as you. There's always going to be someone prettier than you. You can either wallow in self-doubt or get over it and live your life like a lot of people do.
If you're that concerned about yourself as your posts indicate, start saving money and get surgery if nothing else is working for you.
Quote from: galaxy on July 17, 2014, 07:10:12 AM
It makes sense, sure and i know exactly what you want to say - but there is a objective attractivity in women too. I dont want to discuss what makes your as a human pretty. I want to know how does it feel if you are (objective) pretty. I think a lot of self-esteem could come from attractivity. I mean, i know a woman from the supermarket - shes really nice, good-humored, a nice person - but shes not attractive or pretty. In no way! We shouldnt mix up these things so much.
This is gonna be a hard question for someone to answer as you wish, for anyone who does will seem pretty vain. Personally, I think all women are beautiful whether your cis or trans, large or small, and everything in between. Femininity in itself is a thing of beauty.Quote from: AnnaCannibal on July 17, 2014, 10:40:34 AM
I'm super pretty and probably the most gorgeous person on Earth. NOT!! But you are wayyyyy too hard on yourself. I've only seen one other person on here as hard on themselves as you. There's always going to be someone prettier than you. You can either wallow in self-doubt or get over it and live your life like a lot of people do.
If you're that concerned about yourself as your posts indicate, start saving money and get surgery if nothing else is working for you.
+1, Agreed. If your that unsatisfied with your results, after the 2 year mark on hrt you might want to consider surgery.
Best wishes :icon_bunch:
Allie :icon_flower:
P.S: Oh, Anna, how's that fork working out for ya?, lol!
Quote from: galaxy on July 17, 2014, 06:31:15 AM
How does it feel to be pretty?
* Always having to keep up with what clothes and looks are fashionable. Don't want to be caught in last year's fashions.
* Always checking hair, makeup, and clothing to make sure nothing is out of place.
* Foregoing comfortable clothes and shoes for those that make a good impression.
* Wind and rain are threats to your hairstyle.
* Carrying lots of extra makeup in purse. Never know when a touch-up is needed.
* Really attention to detail. A crumb on the face can ruin the whole looks.
In short, it's a burden.
I wouldn't know. I'm always told that I'm good looking but looking it and feeling it are two dif things. I had this discussion with my therapist today actually.
Gosh, interesting question. Part of me hopes I turn out stunning- part of me dreads the idea of having to deal with guys all the time- exactly what Alaina said.
Vanity would be an interesting new thing to deal with. Having the mirror as a friend would be a nice change.
I will probably never know, but that wasn't the point of transitioning.
I just wanted to live and be happy. Everything else is just gravy.
It's pretty darn good gravy, though.
Being gorgeous would mean lots of stares... and the question would be are they staring cause I don't pass, something is wrong... or because they fancy me. It would drive me nuts as I started going out.
Uhg.
Mind you... I am married to a girl- that's always gonna bring on the stares.
From experience a person becomes more beautiful the more you get to know them ;)
I spend way too much time in front of the mirror. Being pretty is time consuming lololol
Quote from: suzifrommd on July 17, 2014, 01:14:28 PM
* Always having to keep up with what clothes and looks are fashionable. Don't want to be caught in last year's fashions.
* Always checking hair, makeup, and clothing to make sure nothing is out of place.
* Foregoing comfortable clothes and shoes for those that make a good impression.
* Wind and rain are threats to your hairstyle.
* Carrying lots of extra makeup in purse. Never know when a touch-up is needed.
* Really attention to detail. A crumb on the face can ruin the whole looks.
In short, it's a burden.
I'll admit that I thought long and hard about whether to respond to this question or not; I don't want to appear as vain as I am. (Oops, did I say that out loud?)
There's a lot of truth to what Suzi says. I wouldn't say I'm as far gone as all that, but the amount of time that I put into hair, makeup and clothes everyday would freak a lot of people out. Seriously, you do not want to know how long I spend getting ready for work every morning... and I have for many years.
But I have to say, it is no burden for me. It is an absolute labor of love! It takes me hours (that's right, hours) to get ready for work because I LOVE it! I have so much fun playing with makeup and dreaming up fun crazy ways to style my hair. I love that the girls at the office look forward to seeing me every morning just to see what I'm wearing and how I did my hair.
I feel so blessed to be married to a woman who is obsessed with Barbie Dolls. My partner has a collection of 50 or more Barbies, and she enjoys thinking of me as her living Barbie Doll. She enjoys watching me have fun getting dressed; she enjoys finding super cute clothes for me to wear; she adores watching heads turn when we walk into a room; she likes that men and women alike check me out everywhere we go; and she beams with pride every time she introduces me as her wife. She's always introducing me as her "trophy wife".
I will say this. I don't think that I'm particularly pretty per se. What I am is very glamorous. I put in great time and effort to make sure my eye makeup is dramatic and perfect. My lips are always colorful and vibrant; some of my favorite lip colors are hot pink with black or blue liner, various shades of blue, sometimes green, or the brightest red you can imagine.
I'm always in heels, often wear corsets, like my tattoos big and bold.
What's it like to stand out in a crowd? I love it! It's just fun to me. I like that people approach me in grocery stores and malls to tell me they love my hair or my makeup or my shoes. I don't mind at all being objectified; many people think I should mind it, but I don't. I like the attention of the men in pool halls. I like that people sometimes tell me I look just like a Barbie Doll. It's just for the fun it. It's fun to me. That's the only reason that I put in all the time and effort. I'm having a great time dolling myself up every day and maximizing every feminine asset I have going for me for as long as my youth holds out. I guess I'm just built this way. This is just who I am.
I won't lie, I do sometimes draw negative attention. Especially from other women who seem to not appreciate my sense of style. I've actually had other women get catty with me during large pool tournaments when there's money at stake and I'm moving up in the ranks. And that's okay; it's just a minor blip in an otherwise fun aspect of who I am.
Am I a little bit embarrassed to post this over long message? Maybe. Meh. I'll post it anyway.
Don't hate me because I'm beautiful! (Though maybe because I'm vain.)
Having transitioned almost four months ago I'm curious (but not surprised) at how often my looks come up in general conversation with other women (cis and trans). I say "not surprised" because we live in a society obsessed about looks, especially female looks. Apparently, so I'm told, I'm reasonably attractive as a woman (now that is the surprise) whereas I never rated a comment as a guy (MPB will do that to you I guess). I felt ugly as a man so I do enjoy "looking good", it does help with self esteem but really, if I was relying on looks alone to feel good about myself I would be on thin ice. I'm 48, the HRT has knocked a few years off, but even so it's not going to last.
Also, I've had some unwanted attention (from men (of course)) and that was baffling and unpleasant. I know from cis females it was an unrelenting feature growing up, especially from adolescence onwards. It can actually be crippling for self esteem when one's appearance is always a topic of conversation and focus of attention.
Quote
P.S: Oh, Anna, how's that fork working out for ya?, lol!
It's working surprisingly well! After I cook the meat of course. Though I've had to incorporate a steak knife for the more tough bits. :)
I'm sure if your gorgeous and just want a nice quiet drink in a bar it's not going to happen
Quote from: Emmaline on July 17, 2014, 01:40:00 PM
Being gorgeous would mean lots of stares... and the question would be are they staring cause I don't pass, something is wrong... or because they fancy me. It would drive me nuts as I started going out.
This this this!!
Maharu Barbie and Suzifrommd are actually both correct, it is both a labor of love and a burden, after spending nearly 2 hours in a hair salon getting my hair styled, colored and highlighted, then the threat of bad weather ruining all the hard work, or wearing a pair of gorgeous heels that match my latest dress, but murder on my poor feet, I slip them off under the table giving my feet some relief and nobody notices, it takes hubby about 10 mins to get ready, then sits down looking at TV and waits for me to get ready, he knows it takes me just under 2 hours to get ready, just rolls his eyes WOMEN!!
I'II choose an outfit, then change my mind, my bag or maybe a small purse has to be in tune with my dress and shoes, hubby has 3 pairs of shoes, Iv about 50, Iv lost count. I take my time doing my hair and makeup, that takes about 30mins, doing my lipstick and gloss last, then a final check in the mirror, what I put myself thru all for the sake of vanity and fashion, its hard work, 1 final check in the mirror, not a hair out of place, check my lips with my tiny hand mirror, now I'm finally ready, its a burden, but then a labor of love when I see my husband's reaction, ''gosh Pauline sweetie, you look pretty, you look a million dollars'' its a great feeling, thats how it feels to be pretty, a burden and a labor of love, but well worth it, the end result does wonders for my self esteem and self confidence as a woman.
PS I forgot to mention, after all the hard work, serveral visits to a ladies room on a night out is required for touching up and hair fixing, a face touch up foundation stick, powder and lippy to maintain the look and staying pretty.
Quote from: AnnaCannibal on July 17, 2014, 03:42:22 PM
It's working surprisingly well! After I cook the meat of course. Though I've had to incorporate a steak knife for the more tough bits. :)
Lmao he, he, he, he ha ha ha ha he, he, heeee! Yea I heard we're full of gristle, and of course, we older ones..........Lol!
On a serious note: I wasn't going to answer this question because I don't see myself as being that pretty, and, I'm really not vain. However, because I do get a lot of unwanted attention these days that continues to get worse, coupled with a few things I've heard my cis girlfriends say about me when they thought I wasn't around, plus the fact I do care very much how I look, I'll do my best to describe how I cope which in short is, you just take the good with the bad and move on.....
On average I spend about an hour each morning on makeup and hair whether I'm going anywhere that day or not. I'm not as fussy as a few younger girls I know, but let's face it. My nightclubbing days are over given I'm pushing 50. Though, on a rare occasion when I do go out at night it can sometimes take me an hour and a half just to choose an outfit. I never have enough shoes, and I doubt if I ever will -same goes for purses/bags, and as many here have said getting caught in one rainstorm can ruin all my hard work. Also like others have said I keep smaller versions of whatever makeup I'm wearing in my purse on any given day, and check to see if a touch up is needed when going to the restroom.
By far the most uncomfortable thing is the unwanted attention, which I'll get with or without makeup and it's just too hot where I live to wear unnecessary clothes. So there's no avoiding it. I do my best to be polite and move on about my business. I must confess it is flattering though so you take the good with the bad.
That's about really all I can say on the subject. The only thing that worries me is getting caught out at night by myself by a few unsavory characters. In this case there's not much a 5-5 118 lb. woman can do but hope you can get a call off to 911 in time. Which is why for the most part, my nightclubbing days are over, and I tend to be in before dark whenever possible.
Best wishes! :icon_bunch:
Allie :icon_flower:
I never really would consider myself pretty but I've been in group therapy for the past two months and have been called pretty many times. For me it's kind of a nice and pleasant warm feeling that comes from the pit of your stomach that makes you think "ok, maybe this is really working out and I'll be happy when I'm done." I don't know if that really answers the question but that's what feeling pretty is like for me. I don't have a lot of high confidence moments so it's nice when I do.
I have no idea what it's like. But, I have noticed that since transitioning, I am a little more confidant. I am not afraid to looks someone in the eye if they are staring.
It actually doesn't matter, because no matter what happens or how beautiful you become/ are, there will always be someone prettier than you, and you will judge yourself against them. Just let it go, spending too much time worrying about it is not healthy. It's the same for cis-girls as well, in your own eyes you may never be pretty, so its best to try to accept that and move on :P
Its nice to feel attractive of course, but the question is always will they still feel the same way if they knew you are trans? And alot of women are beautiful and pretty, so it really isn't big of a deal. It doesnt really mean anything in the end.
Well;
Having just met Grace three days ago - seems a lifetime as I am now the other side of the Pacific Ocean, I reckon she is dead gorgeous. Mind you we both have a beautiful role model as well in Catherine. I haven't seen her in a Year and met her with Grace. I could get over what a really radiant person she is now having been in her words 1000% fulfilled. Mind you she was also absolutely deep drop gorgeous before her SRS. But now well!!!
Judith
Quote from: imissmymama on July 18, 2014, 01:35:18 AM
but the question is always will they still feel the same way if they knew you are trans?
Well every situation, personal circumstances, relationships etc are all different, Iv dated men in the past who didn't accept my history, but that's life, sometimes I disclosed, depends on the guy, some accept, some don't. My present fiancé I dated for 18 months, he had absolutely no idea, I only disclosed when he suggested we get engaged, he was a bit shocked, but accepted my situation, he never wants his family to know, that's understandable with the stereotypes thinking my husband's wife used to be a ''man''
We never discuss it, my husband and I don't see myself as trans, I'm just a woman with a history, it belongs in the past, we're now just a normal husband and wife. He looks at me the way any man looks at a woman, and treats me as a woman
There are normal straight men who do accept women like us, and women who accept men with a history too.
Quote from: Jo-is-amazing on July 18, 2014, 01:27:34 AM
It actually doesn't matter, because no matter what happens or how beautiful you become/ are, there will always be someone prettier than you, and you will judge yourself against them. Just let it go, spending too much time worrying about it is not healthy. It's the same for cis-girls as well, in your own eyes you may never be pretty, so its best to try to accept that and move on :P
Yes, it's important to find a happy medium. I enjoy looking good but having to worry about every little detail all during day is tiring, if I am 95% fine with my looks and everyday wear but would need to invest much more time and money. I'm pretty picky and things like fabric, patterns and compatibility are something I enjoy but don't want to feel obssesed over because that 1 random guy/girl I met today might have been put off by that!
If someone is specifically loooking at me gazingly with a smile and looks me right in the eyes I do feel at my prettiest, appreciated
A little bit hesitant to respond but here it goes...
I used to spend more time on my appearance but after a decade post-transition I rarely wear makeup and just walk around not really thinking about my appearance, but aware that I have attractiveness privilege. It's a reality I've learned to live with over the years and I'm still grappling with it, especially around the issue of being trans.
There's no doubt that it makes things easier. I didn't have the same kinds of adjustment problems a lot of people here talk about. I know that family and friends were more accepting of me when I transitioned because I fit into their idea of what an attractive woman is supposed to look like. I've never had a problem finding people interested in dating me, which I thought would change when I publicly disclosed, but that hasn't happened. I don't experience body dysphoria because my body as it is falls within the range of what female bodies are supposed to look like, and enough people are attracted to it as a female body that I don't think about it a lot. I've only done SRS and hormones; no other surgeries or medical intervention.
Some issues: it's harder to make friends, especially with people who are not conventionally attractive, which in practice also means a lot of trans people and that's something I'm trying really hard to deal with. I trigger insecurities, say things that are unintentionally insensitive. Like, when I talk about people randomly approaching me or having choices of people to date / sleep with, my friends who have attractiveness privilege just nod. With friends who are not in that position that can be really tricky and can produce difficult situations, and usually ends up with me not being as close to those people or them avoiding me.
Also, it's harder to know if someone likes you independent of how you look. Sometimes, you can date or be friends with someone for a long time and realize that they're just humoring you or wouldn't be interested in hanging out with you if they didn't perceive you as attractive. It's also harder for some people to take you seriously. They see thin blond woman and automatically think dumb, regardless of how smart or educated you actually are.
And yes, there's the street harassment. That's not as much of a problem now as it was in my 20's, but it's still a problem.
Quote from: mandonlym on July 18, 2014, 12:34:10 PM
Some issues: it's harder to make friends, especially with people who are not conventionally attractive, which in practice also means a lot of trans people and that's something I'm trying really hard to deal with. I trigger insecurities, say things that are unintentionally insensitive. Like, when I talk about people randomly approaching me or having choices of people to date / sleep with, my friends who have attractiveness privilege just nod. With friends who are not in that position that can be really tricky and can produce difficult situations, and usually ends up with me not being as close to those people or them avoiding me.
Also, it's harder to know if someone likes you independent of how you look. Sometimes, you can date or be friends with someone for a long time and realize that they're just humoring you or wouldn't be interested in hanging out with you if they didn't perceive you as attractive. It's also harder for some people to take you seriously. They see thin blond woman and automatically think dumb, regardless of how smart or educated you actually are.
And yes, there's the street harassment. That's not as much of a problem now as it was in my 20's, but it's still a problem.
Yes, yes, and yes. I think I'm pretty freaking hidoeus, but my BF says no, you're pretty. Sometimes more than others, which is weird, but I see guys staring you down all the time. You're right: it is a privilege. And it's good, great even. But at the same time, like you said, often I feel at odds with the trans community or say things that are insensitive or arrogant without realizing it. I only count my hormonal transition, so it's been about 15-16 months. But only nine months of actual HRT, the initial period was self-medded and the lowest does you can go while still technically taking them.
And other than my brother and dad, I'm pretty much accepted and my mom has even come around and we were just talking about hair dye and moisturizing not five minutes ago.
But the one thing that saddens me is the the person non grata vibe I feel around trans folks IRL and here. I've gotten really sesnitive about it lately and have been crying a lot because of it, cause this is the one place I feel like I should be able to connect but it's like putting an american cellphone cord into a European outlet. It's not fitting and I'm trying to force it.
The street harrsment really realyl bothers me. And yeah people could say take a compliment or accept it or this or that, but I'm 31 and most of my life I spent as a very petite andogynous femme dude who could date women but only for a couple days. Only one relationship lasted. Men. Forget it. I was too femme looking. I stopped trying. So being so wanted is shocking and often times I'm left agape without any ay to respond and just kinda like really, stop effing with me.
So I guess while it feels great and yeah I love how I look sometimes and am transfixed but at the same time, I have prolly never felt more alone, and it's destroying/destroyed my relationship with my BF, cause he just doesnt understand it or doesnt want to...i dont know. :embarrassed: :(
Abd while these may seem like first world problems, there still mine and still valid. The mustard seed and all that.
I'm not pretty. I am 40DD/F and 6'1". People talk to my breasts a lot. I have actually made faces at people during a conversation and they haven't noticed.
Jen
Quote from: JLT1 on July 18, 2014, 04:38:23 PM
I'm not pretty. I am 40DD/F and 6'1". People talk to my breasts a lot. I have actually made faces at people during a conversation and they haven't noticed.
Jen
Lmao, he, he, he. I bet you get that a lot. I have a friend who's mom is a DDD and she was telling me about that happening to her a lot. She told me most of them can't help themselves, lol! I bet you got a good laugh about it afterwards with some of those faces you made.
As for me I don't think I'll have to worry too much about that happening with my little A cups.
Allie :icon_flower:
Right, I dont think I'll be considering breast enlargement now ;D
Quote from: YinYanga on July 18, 2014, 04:47:43 PM
Right, I dont think I'll be considering breast enlargement now ;D
LOL. :P *high fives*
*high fives
Well you know, perhaps less is more (mystery) afteral ;)
Even though I have already commented, I'll say this... Being pretty is not what is on the outside, even though we worry allot about it. Over all beauty come from the inside. How confident we are and how we express ourselves to others. Not to mention being comfortable with ones self. It truly does shine when you are happy and full of life.
Quote from: Veronica M on July 18, 2014, 06:07:16 PM
Even though I have already commented, I'll say this... Being pretty is not what is on the outside, even though we worry allot about it. Over all beauty come from the inside. How confident we are and how we express ourselves to others. Not to mention being comfortable with ones self. It truly does shine when you are happy and full of life.
Agree 100%!
Quote from: Veronica M on July 18, 2014, 06:07:16 PM
Even though I have already commented, I'll say this... Being pretty is not what is on the outside, even though we worry allot about it. Over all beauty come from the inside. How confident we are and how we express ourselves to others. Not to mention being comfortable with ones self. It truly does shine when you are happy and full of life.
Always good to remember. I'd rather settle for being a good person and looking just like a run-of-the-mill young woman than a conceited, vain model
The more I think about this, I come up with this thought:
I don't know how it feels to be pretty, and I wouldn't really know even if I become pretty. I think somewhere deep in my brain I am hardwired to think I am the ugliest thing to walk the earth. I can even have some confidence and vanity, but the idea that other people might like how I look is so foreign to me.
Quote from: Veronica M on July 18, 2014, 06:07:16 PM
Even though I have already commented, I'll say this... Being pretty is not what is on the outside, even though we worry allot about it. Over all beauty come from the inside. How confident we are and how we express ourselves to others. Not to mention being comfortable with ones self. It truly does shine when you are happy and full of life.
Best answer yet!
Allie :icon_flower:
Quote from: galaxy on July 17, 2014, 06:31:15 AM
Hello,
here is a question for our beautful ladies: How does it feel to be pretty?
I mean, changed prettiness or attractivity something in your live? Do you feel better or have more quality of living. Does it make som things in your day or generally easier? What about your body dysphoria - is it easier to handle if you are attractive?
Its only my interest. I cant imagine how people live who are pretty.
Regards
Galaxy
I am beautiful and I canno help, I was beautiful in my previous role, and now I am more beautiful
+++++
It is burden I alone have to bear !
Quote from: Veronica M on July 18, 2014, 06:07:16 PM
Even though I have already commented, I'll say this... Being pretty is not what is on the outside, even though we worry allot about it. Over all beauty come from the inside. How confident we are and how we express ourselves to others. Not to mention being comfortable with ones self. It truly does shine when you are happy and full of life.
I'm trying to look for an article that made what I think is an excellent point related to this. There's something that I think is actually harmful by combining the idea of being conventionally attractive and being "pretty on the inside," rather than being specific and saying that someone has good qualities. By saying that these two things are the same, we equate what someone looks like externally to who she is internally. We automatically associate someone's inner, nonvisual qualities with someone's outer, aesthetic qualities.
I think it's useful and productive to separate how a person looks on the outside and who she is on the inside, and acknowledge the differences between those two things. Making the two one and the same actually makes it harder not to associate people's inner qualities with their outer qualities, which is a major social problem.
I think I'm a nicer, kinder person now than I was ten years ago, but I am also less conventionally attractive and that's totally okay. But I'm not going to say I'm "prettier" because of this, or that one has any direct relation to the other.
Physical beauty is relative, it all depends on who you are comparing against.
Someone who is used to working with supermodels will have a significantly different opinion on who is pretty and who isn't compared to a mathematician or an engineer.
There are also so many different types of beauty, some would say Kim Kardashian and Paris Hilton are beautiful, but If you compare them to women like Charlize Theron and Natalie Portman there is a stark difference, elegance, grace, confidence and not least intelligence, a beautiful mind is in my mind a prerequisite for a beautiful person.
If asking about physical attractiveness i think from a trans perspective the attractive girls get scrutinized a lot more and therefore have a harder time passing.
They also have to deal with groping, unwanted kisses (on the mouth even), not being able to walk the streets at night when it's dark, stalkers online and in real life, envy and shunning from cis-women and guys buying drinks which isn't as great as it sounds when they expect a conversation and more. Guys also constantly feel it's necessary to tell attractive girls that they are pretty and they loose all ability to have an intelligent conversation, anything a pretty girl says is automatically discarded as nonsense.
I'm not saying it's hard for them but it's not all roses and butterflies either, on the positive side it's easier to meet people, get a job, find a partner and get drinks at the bar.
Quote from: pretty pauline on July 18, 2014, 08:29:52 AM
Well every situation, personal circumstances, relationships etc are all different, Iv dated men in the past who didn't accept my history, but that's life, sometimes I disclosed, depends on the guy, some accept, some don't. My present fiancé I dated for 18 months, he had absolutely no idea, I only disclosed when he suggested we get engaged, he was a bit shocked, but accepted my situation, he never wants his family to know, that's understandable with the stereotypes thinking my husband's wife used to be a ''man''
We never discuss it, my husband and I don't see myself as trans, I'm just a woman with a history, it belongs in the past, we're now just a normal husband and wife. He looks at me the way any man looks at a woman, and treats me as a woman
There are normal straight men who do accept women like us, and women who accept men with a history too.
Wow, you waited 18 months to tell him? I am not judging, but that's really brave of you. I could never do this. My fiancé also treats me like a woman because that's how he sees me, but I told him right up front. I cannot afford to have my heart broken after so much investment. There are men who can accept trans women of course, but its still a deal breaker for 80 percent of men , i say.
Quote from: imissmymama on July 19, 2014, 12:32:01 AM
Wow, you waited 18 months to tell him? I am not judging, but that's really brave of you.
It wasn't brave, it was just the right thing to do at the time, the relationship was going so well, why fix something that wasn't broken, then when he came out with that marriage proposal and placed that diamond engagement ring on my finger, it was time to disclose.
Quote from: imissmymama on July 19, 2014, 12:32:01 AM
but I told him right up front.
Well if I had of done that, he may have dumped the first night, we do what we think is right at the time, I just went with my gut feeling, he only ever knew me as a woman, whatever my history, I'm now completely all woman things did work out and we did eventually get married.
I didnt do this to be pretty as I know that is not possible for me but I did it to be happy and to make my body fit what my mind was telling me. Being pretty in my mind is enough.
Perception of ones "prettyness" is subjective (eh. like, really really subjective...) so no way to quantify it, except perhaps by sharing real life experiences where your presence has put people in obvious attraction states. Since I'm presenting andro...
-- Average looking women may smile and blush when you are speaking to them. For instance, I've seen this with food service counter girls. Some drop their eyes in deference. Some lose their train of thought. I recently saw one DD counter gal who I'm flirty with and who knows my medium sized iced caramel late order upside down. Was presenting the best version of me that day (2 weeks after laser). When I approached she 1st acknowledged me, but then seemed to become so confused, she asked twice what I wanted just to look at me and walking back and forth from the task, also if I wanted milk or not (duh?), and then what size? (hello? med you know me) and/or splenda? (no sugar and caramel regular!) The counter guy who was taking my transaction shook his head. Yeah she was confused. Or maybe star struck? ::) Needless to say that was funny.
-- A married guy with an average looking wife who knew you as a guy and is straight as an arrow (yet doesn't know you are transitioning) may start to notice 'attractive' things. You'll catch him looking at you in your peripheral vision, then it builds up to the point where they're asking you silly technical help questions so they can have a moment to see you. Or it's the, "can I have one?" ahh the fresh slice of orange I'm holding between my manicured fingers while typing on the lappy with my other. You motion yes turning your pretty thumb and index fingers with the slice, still typing waiting and he bends down and slowly grabs it WITH HIS MOUTH. WTF? Dude, we don't do that with other "dudes!" o.O
-- Single girls at Starbucks who are like deer in headlights looking at you when waiting for orders. Girls who seem to linger around you at the condiments section pretending they are busy, spending a full minute to stir their already blended beverage ::) Maybe I should open them in conversation... (and unfortunately for me, some guys are doing these things too).
-- Friend girls who in casual social encounters (and who "don't know" yet) starting to give you 'the gaze'.
Quote from: Evelyn K on July 21, 2014, 01:13:25 AM
Perception of ones "prettyness" is subjective (eh. like, really really subjective...) so no way to quantify it, except perhaps by sharing real life experiences where your presence has put people in obvious attraction states. Since I'm presenting andro...
-- Average looking women may smile and blush when you are speaking to them. For instance, I've seen this with food service counter girls. Some drop their eyes in deference. Some lose their train of thought. I recently saw one DD counter gal who I'm flirty with and who knows my medium sized iced caramel late order upside down. Was presenting the best version of me that day (2 weeks after laser). When I approached she 1st acknowledged me, but then seemed to become so confused, she asked twice what I wanted just to look at me and walking back and forth from the task, also if I wanted milk or not (duh?), and then what size? (hello? med you know me) and/or splenda? (no sugar and caramel regular!) The counter guy who was taking my transaction shook his head. Yeah she was confused. Or maybe star struck? ::) Needless to say that was funny.
-- A married guy with an average looking wife who knew you as a guy and is straight as an arrow (yet doesn't know you are transitioning) may start to notice 'attractive' things. You'll catch him looking at you in your peripheral vision, then it builds up to the point where they're asking you silly technical help questions so they can have a moment to see you. Or it's the, "can I have one?" ahh the fresh slice of orange I'm holding between my manicured fingers while typing on the lappy with my other. You motion yes turning your pretty thumb and index fingers with the slice, still typing waiting and he bends down and slowly grabs it WITH HIS MOUTH. WTF? Dude, we don't do that with other "dudes!" o.O
-- Single girls at Starbucks who are like deer in headlights looking at you when waiting for orders. Girls who seem to linger around you at the condiments section pretending they are busy, spending a full minute to stir their already blended beverage ::) Maybe I should open them in conversation... (and unfortunately for me, some guys are doing these things too).
-- Friend girls who in casual social encounters (and who "don't know" yet) starting to give you 'the gaze'.
That is great :) however, I didn't understand whether that had to do with you being pretty or you presenting in an androgynous way. These people are probably puzzled by your looks and find your androgyny attractive!
Quote from: Alainaluvsu on July 17, 2014, 08:38:55 AM
It's okay. I guess. I have to find ways not to lead men on because I don't want to have to tell them that I'm transsexual...
Sigh. It's a never ending battle. I feel your pain. Don't wanna get too attached to this guy or that guy etc etc.
:(
Beauty really is in the eye of the beholder. It's scary how true that is.
Just look at the some of the plastic surgery people get done that in my opinion is very extreme such as very very big lips and very very small noses. I would say some people have a messed up idea of what beauty is, but that doesn't make sense really because there will be people who think I have a messed up idea of what beauty is.
Quote from: melanie maritz on July 21, 2014, 11:21:13 AM
Beauty really is in the eye of the beholder. It's scary how true that is.
Just look at the some of the plastic surgery people get done that in my opinion is very extreme such as very very big lips and very very small noses. I would say some people have a messed up idea of what beauty is, but that doesn't make sense really because there will be people who think I have a messed up idea of what beauty is.
Yes, IKR! I totally agree with you! Personally, I think when people undergo too much plastic surgery, they'll look no better than before. I would personally prefer looking naturally ugly than artificially ugly. The look people achieve with surgery can be so weird. But it also depends on the surgery you get. FFS doesn't really mean anyone will look artificial, but lip injections and nose jobs can ruin all the looks altogether.
Anyway, sure beauty is in the eye of the beholder, so there's always someone you'll find you attractive, and another who doesn't :)
Quote from: melanie maritz on July 21, 2014, 11:21:13 AM
Beauty really is in the eye of the beholder. It's scary how true that is.
Just look at the some of the plastic surgery people get done that in my opinion is very extreme such as very very big lips and very very small noses. I would say some people have a messed up idea of what beauty is, but that doesn't make sense really because there will be people who think I have a messed up idea of what beauty is.
I couldn't agree more. So many people get distracted about what's on the outside, and forget to look at who's in the inside. So many only care about looks, and who has the best body to have sex with, but they forget to see that those things aren't important. Those aren't what give true love. It's the inside of a person. Something that is only found when you take the time to get to know a person and get interested into them as a person, not as a body. That's where you find true beauty.
Quote from: Auroramarianna on July 21, 2014, 09:45:40 AM
That is great :) however, I didn't understand whether that had to do with you being pretty or you presenting in an androgynous way. These people are probably puzzled by your looks and find your androgyny attractive!
Good point. I typically wear jeans and a slim fit button up mens shirt. My hair is swept around to one side (too hot around the neck in summer) slightly tucked into the collar. 4 months of HRT is definitely showing through. I'd confidently say I'm borderline passing without wearing makeup or fem accessories and attire. A collarless unisex style top is enough to start getting me misgendered. ;D
Quote from: Sam314 on July 21, 2014, 11:39:36 AM
I couldn't agree more. So many people get distracted about what's on the outside, and forget to look at who's in the inside. So many only care about looks, and who has the best body to have sex with, but they forget to see that those things aren't important. Those aren't what give true love. It's the inside of a person. Something that is only found when you take the time to get to know a person and get interested into them as a person, not as a body. That's where you find true beauty.
I think it was what, 70% of people perceptions about you (and if they'll sleep with you or not ;D) is decided within the first 5 seconds of meeting you.
For all intents and purposes outward appearance is pretty much *everything*.
Physical attraction is KING.
I might be an odd case, but I've met attractive women I didn't feel anything for because they were so puerile and shallow as people. What a turn off. I had a girlfriend once who, while no oil painting, was a great person and as a result incredibly sexually alluring. On the other hand, I know a guy who is so led by his visual sense it overrides his common sense, he tries to bed every nutty woman he knows with big boobs and it ends up causing all sorts of trouble in his personal life because he's so focused on what they have rather than who they are.
Quote from: Ms Grace on July 21, 2014, 03:33:33 PM
I might be an odd case, but I've met attractive women I didn't feel anything for because they were so puerile and shallow as people. What a turn off. I had a girlfriend once who, while no oil painting, was a great person and as a result incredibly sexually alluring. On the other hand, I know a guy who is so led by his visual sense it overrides his common sense, he tries to bed every nutty woman he knows with big boobs and it ends up causing all sorts of trouble in his personal life because he's so focused on what they have rather than who they are.
I don't think that is odd at all, getting to know someone they can start to look really attractive....or really ugly. It all depends, I imagine most people are like that though.
All(4) my 'flings' were people who I wouldnt have fantasized over before I met them...I just melted when I listened to their voice, their ideas and the glow in their eyes. Size of their bum/bewbs/peepee or clothing wasnt really important
A number of studies have shown (sorry I don't have time to dig up right now) that external physical attractiveness in terms of mate selection is important when people are not in frequent contact, but over time, people who like each other personally become more and more attracted to each other regardless of their degree of physical attractiveness.
I noticed this when I was pre-op and it was harder for me to date, that male friends I got along with became attracted to me over time and I ended up dating a couple of them.
Post-op I've dated both people who became attracted to me upon initial meeting, and people who became attracted to me over time.
So in that sense, both outer and inner beauty are important, or at least personality-compatibility. I feel like a lot of the advantages of being externally attractive are not really about dating anyway. It's getting favors from strangers, and being more confident, which has a lot of rewards beyond dating.
Beauty is in the eye of the beholder and it may be necessary from time to time to give a stupid or misinformed beholder a black eye.
- miss p
only thing ill give beauty credit for, it makes getting clocked happen far less.
Quote from: Sam314 on July 21, 2014, 11:39:36 AM
I couldn't agree more. So many people get distracted about what's on the outside, and forget to look at who's in the inside. So many only care about looks, and who has the best body to have sex with, but they forget to see that those things aren't important. Those aren't what give true love. It's the inside of a person. Something that is only found when you take the time to get to know a person and get interested into them as a person, not as a body. That's where you find true beauty.
Well said! I myself am old fashioned and dream of that one special person to share the rest of my life with. So far she has eluded me :icon_ashamed:
Allie :icon_flower:
Well, I am gonna have to try and be attractive on the inside, because from the outside I dunno about my prospects.
It is better to be seen as attractive once someone gets to know you though, rather than just a physical thing, because I want people to really value me, my looks.
Interesting read, my opinion is this.....anyone that has to tell someone omg Im gorgeous I mean look at me, hate to say it, but your probably not.
That sort of person is to me epically sad, kind of a self induced tragedy waiting to happen.
You see, your skin fades, your boobs sag, you get a muffin top, your arse gets big, but what remains is your soul and heart. Let that shine huh, you will get further in life ;D
Quote from: Hikari on July 21, 2014, 05:58:39 PM
Well, I am gonna have to try and be attractive on the inside, because from the outside I dunno about my prospects.
It is better to be seen as attractive once someone gets to know you though, rather than just a physical thing, because I want people to really value me, my looks.
I think you're gorgeous! ;D
Quote from: Lady_Oracle on July 21, 2014, 10:38:15 PM
I think you're gorgeous! ;D
Thanks! I am however, very aware of camera angles. I don't edit my photos, but I take lots of photos and change lots of lighting till I find a pic I like. I look much worse in the mirror.
Don't forget your perception is warped- the mirror doesn't necessarily tell you what others see.
But having looked through your pics, you are a cutie. Cut yourself some slack- the goal is to bring out your beautiful female secondary characteristics - not beat that magazine airbrushed bulls $^&* we get fed all the time.
Why people post their pictures here? Why post thousand of girls pictures on facebook? Why do we take hormones and make surgeries? I mean, why do we do all these things when you say real attractivity comes from the inside? Sure, we can shut our eyes to the facts but there is a biological attractivity and its not all about your inside and charism. Girls who post pretty photos here or an facebook get a lot more likes then others - this is a perfect demonstration of what i mean. I lot things goes better.
For me its not important to be a model or damned gorgeos, but theres a wide range between (masculine) ugliness and a natural (female) attractivity and for me and my life its really important to have some natural attractivity. I think its no reason to convict someone and i also think pretty people have a easier life outthere. They have a better acceptance in the society, better chances in all areas and men are interested in having pretty women. Attractivity doesnt dictate your life, your friends, your job or something else but it open many doors. And sometime these doors will keep closed forever for people who are not attrative.
Well I've posted pictures here for 3 reasons
~I don't transition in my bedroom: I get seen and probably commented on just like everyone else if I keep going out more and more. I want to live publicly and risk is part of that
~I am not a good mirror for myself: I see a lot of conflict in the mirror which isnt strange when you've done so for the last 15 years. I can't look at myself objectively. Others are more neutral in what they see
~I admit, I like a compliment. I'm that shallow
Hikari- I've always thought you were quite beautiful as well. Your eyes are stunning and I love your womanly shape. Mirrors and cameras lie, and we are always our own worst critic. Once you feel beautiful I think something emanates from inside. An inner confidence that makes you shine. I agree that self worth and personality are what makes a person beautiful, and you are bursting at the seams with it, girl!
Galaxy- you are right, there are people that are beautiful who are able to have a much easier time with life. But personally, I think confidence has a lot to do with this. It's such a hard subject for me to think about. I don't want to say they have it easier, because I don't know their struggles. I think it is their confidence that leads them to success. Learn to love yourself and your happiness and beauty will be undeniable. I say these things, yet I have not come to accept this myself. I want to look beyond looks for myself, I want to focus solely on who I am as a person, yet I still have my insecurities. Lately, I've been trying to push my limits, allowing my body hair to grow freely and do it's thing, cus you know, I'm human. We have body hair and why try to cover this up with shaving and such? Because society tells me I should? but then I think, if I grew facial hair, would I feel the same way? It's natural, right? No- I think I'd opt for hair removal and yet again be a victim of my own vanity. I saw a documentary once on a bearded woman. She embraced being female, yet when going through puberty, she developed facial hair. She used to shave it, and her grandmother gave her a gift certificate for electrolysis, but she denied this eventually and let it grow out, because it was part of her and she shouldn't be ashamed.. but then this makes me think- why do anything? What is the point? I mean, I really think I'd rid myself of the facial hair. I wouldn't want to be seen as masculine in that way. Perhaps this just has to do with style and presentation... Should I just accept that I've been affected by what society wants of me and just conform because it makes me more comfortable? Should I push boundaries? Okay.. I'm just rambling here because this has been on my mind a lot lately... blah!
Anyways- love yourself. Love your brain and personality and I think your body will follow.
Quote from: muffinpants on July 22, 2014, 11:07:18 AM
Hikari- I've always thought you were quite beautiful as well. Your eyes are stunning and I love your womanly shape. Mirrors and cameras lie, and we are always our own worst critic. Once you feel beautiful I think something emanates from inside. An inner confidence that makes you shine. I agree that self worth and personality are what makes a person beautiful, and you are bursting at the seams with it, girl!
Galaxy- you are right, there are people that are beautiful who are able to have a much easier time with life. But personally, I think confidence has a lot to do with this. It's such a hard subject for me to think about. I don't want to say they have it easier, because I don't know their struggles. I think it is their confidence that leads them to success. Learn to love yourself and your happiness and beauty will be undeniable. I say these things, yet I have not come to accept this myself. I want to look beyond looks for myself, I want to focus solely on who I am as a person, yet I still have my insecurities. Lately, I've been trying to push my limits, allowing my body hair to grow freely and do it's thing, cus you know, I'm human. We have body hair and why try to cover this up with shaving and such? Because society tells me I should? but then I think, if I grew facial hair, would I feel the same way? It's natural, right? No- I think I'd opt for hair removal and yet again be a victim of my own vanity. I saw a documentary once on a bearded woman. She embraced being female, yet when going through puberty, she developed facial hair. She used to shave it, and her grandmother gave her a gift certificate for electrolysis, but she denied this eventually and let it grow out, because it was part of her and she shouldn't be ashamed.. but then this makes me think- why do anything? What is the point? I mean, I really think I'd rid myself of the facial hair. I wouldn't want to be seen as masculine in that way. Perhaps this just has to do with style and presentation... Should I just accept that I've been affected by what society wants of me and just conform because it makes me more comfortable? Should I push boundaries? Okay.. I'm just rambling here because this has been on my mind a lot lately... blah!
Anyways- love yourself. Love your brain and personality and I think your body will follow.
I really understand your thoughts about identity/vanity. I think its good to have both: my identity suffers if I get ridiculed and that often happens if you don't conform. It's all connected
I am not conventionally pretty/beautiful but I am trying to give it a place
If a person is really worried....
Doctors can fix almost any aspect of our body that makes us "ugly" to look at. New breasts, new nose, skin pulled here, tucked there and fat sucked under there and put up there.
But there is no way to fix a person who is ugly on the inside. Even if they are beautiful on the outside, that ugly will seep out and ruin even that.
Jen
Quote from: JLT1 on July 22, 2014, 02:28:25 PM
If a person is really worried....
Doctors can fix almost any aspect of our body that makes us "ugly" to look at. New breasts, new nose, skin pulled here, tucked there and fat sucked under there and put up there.
But there is no way to fix a person who is ugly on the inside. Even if they are beautiful on the outside, that ugly will seep out and ruin even that.
Jen
Ditto this ^^^______^^^. You can be the most gorgeous woman on the planet, but you'll never have any true friends, or for that matter, a relationship based on love if your not a nice person ie: ugly on the inside. Many actresses/models both male and female despite their good looks become fodder for the gossip rags because in real life they're not nice people.
I myself no matter what I look like to others, just try to be the best person I can, and treat others with the same respect and courtesy they give me. And sometimes, even if someone is rude to me I bite my tongue and still treat them politely and with respect. Confidence and attitude go a long way toward how you are seen in other peoples eyes, no matter how you physically look.
Allie :icon_flower:
For those who doesnt understand:
Physical attractiveness
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Physical_attractiveness
Sexual attraction
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sexual_attraction
Quote from: JLT1 on July 22, 2014, 02:28:25 PM
If a person is really worried....
Doctors can fix almost any aspect of our body that makes us "ugly" to look at. New breasts, new nose, skin pulled here, tucked there and fat sucked under there and put up there.
But there is no way to fix a person who is ugly on the inside. Even if they are beautiful on the outside, that ugly will seep out and ruin even that.
Jen
Just posted on your before and after - you truly are beautiful inside and out - seems more appropriate to say here. I am so glad to see you smile and be happy! -carrie
I may be redundant in saying that there had been multiple studies on how attractiveness does influence ones life.
It isnt a secret that attractive people do get more attention, they do get away with more, they have an advantage, but like everything else, life isnt comprised out of single quality, but a multitude of aspects of character, compassion, integrity and yes, looks as well.
I have experienced what in my mind was a horrible life being imprisoned within the avatar of genetic malfunction. I never though of my self as pretty, but rather ugly. Truth is, when I later learned others would had seen me as an attractive man, but that truly didn't matter anymore, I was already done, and my avatar had transitioned.
As I started this journey my hopes for the aesthetic presentation were rather out of the science fiction realm as I started with bodybuilders 6'1'' 227lbs frame. Nowhere near an attractive female scale, not to mention typically male face bone structure. Never the less, I never stopped dreaming, and even when it seemed impossible at best, I still dreamed the dream.
Fast forward to present, and my life is one of the fairytale, I am perceived as an attractive female, I get away with much more then I would suspect, I am aware of the power I posses being an attractive woman, the power equal if not greater then all grandeur male privilege.
I enjoy the piercing looks of inquisitive man, seeing their testosterone driven bodies affected by my presence. A little smile can bring them under my spell.
I love feeling how intimidating I can be, at 5'11'' towering over most man.
But don't think I awake and my life is a picture perfect existence. Quite the opposite. I also have fears, dislikes which are my own insecurities, the ever so vigilant though that even though I know of my self as a genuine woman, I carry the curse of once being afflicted with the dreadful reality.
Beautiful people and I do not mean those at heart but the flesh aesthetics, even though they do get a brake, they still suffer same insecurities.
Quote from: MyKa on July 17, 2014, 01:15:23 PM
I wouldn't know. I'm always told that I'm good looking but looking it and feeling it are two dif things. I had this discussion with my therapist today actually.
Pretty much this. I tend not to have to worry too much about not leading people on though (if they're even attracted in the first place) because I'm pretty sure I come off as kind of icy, just by being naturally socially anxious.
And yeah. I suuuure don't feel it XD
Quote from: suzifrommd on July 17, 2014, 01:14:28 PM
* Always having to keep up with what clothes and looks are fashionable. Don't want to be caught in last year's fashions.
* Always checking hair, makeup, and clothing to make sure nothing is out of place.
* Foregoing comfortable clothes and shoes for those that make a good impression.
* Wind and rain are threats to your hairstyle.
* Carrying lots of extra makeup in purse. Never know when a touch-up is needed.
* Really attention to detail. A crumb on the face can ruin the whole looks.
In short, it's a burden.
#Thestruggleisreal lol...
Quote from: Hikari on July 21, 2014, 11:39:43 PM
Thanks! I am however, very aware of camera angles. I don't edit my photos, but I take lots of photos and change lots of lighting till I find a pic I like. I look much worse in the mirror.
aww, no way!! I love your eyes ;D I totally get the angle thing though. Like the further away you take a selfie, the smaller you'll appear. If I take a close up of myself I'm just like ahhh I look hideous!! I have to capture my shoulders or at least the neck to be able to feel good about my photos. Anything super close just looks really bad for me.
Quote from: Lady_Oracle on July 22, 2014, 11:59:07 PM
If I take a close up of myself I'm just like ahhh I look hideous!! I have to capture my shoulders or at least the neck to be able to feel good about my photos. Anything super close just looks really bad for me.
Wait til you get older, lol!!
Allie :icon_flower:
haha never! I shall attain eternal youth by playing rock n roll. It is the secret to staying forever young!!!! I've said too much >:-)
Meh...I'm hideous and I'm fine with that. :P
It's awesome
People throw themselves at your feet when you walk in the room
you get free things all the time
every person, male, female, trans, even the ones who aren't sure all want to be you or date you
doors are always opened
you don't even have to speak in job interviews and you get them.....
I was going out with two other girlsfriends. After sitting a while on our table the first man came to ask one of my girlfriends to have a drink, after a while another man came and ask the other girlfriend. I got no drink and i wasnt ask by a man. I was never ask by man and there is nobody opens the door for me. There's also nobody who say i'm pretty or had a good progress the last years.
I hesitated to post because my inherent sense of modesty says I am not pretty but looking back 40 years, to when I first transitioned, the evidence says otherwise. I was tall, lean, and with a modest figure and a pleasing face. What Nicole says is a pretty good summary of what life is like for a pretty girl.
I was terribly naive when I first transitioned and not equipped to handle the amount and type of attention I attracted from the opposite sex. It was very heady stuff and just wonderful for my sense of self, to go from 'freak' to popular girl, but I wasn't very considerate of men - I was enjoying "catch & release" - picking a guy I liked, have a one-night fling, and then look for another. My naivety led me into a bad situation and I ended up as a "trophy wife" to an ambitious man. That only lasted a few months until I figured out that he didn't really give a shyte about me as long as I was on his arm for public viewing. After that I became very skeptical and cynical and had a hard time trusting anyone.
I did marry a second time but he had to pursue me for months before I even accepted a first date.
That was all a long time ago, 40 years ago, and I am no longer slender. I have aged well but am no longer as attractive as I once was and certainly don't attract the same degree of interest but I look around at the really attractive younger women I know and I see them struggling with the same issues - guys see an attractive woman as a physical conquest but don't see and don't care about the PERSON inside that attractive body. It is a very superficial thing, very transitory, and singularly unfulfilling. Most of my male friends now have known me for years and are friends because they enjoy my company. IT is much nicer if the friendship comes first and the attraction second.
Would I rather have been much more plane? No, it was good for my sense of self but it wasn't without its down-side.
Quote from: crp512 on July 22, 2014, 07:29:43 PM
Just posted on your before and after - you truly are beautiful inside and out - seems more appropriate to say here. I am so glad to see you smile and be happy! -carrie
I found your posts! Welcome to Susan's.
Big Hugs,
Jen
Once again a Susan's topic has stimulated my thought processes. Thanks for starting this one, Galaxy.
While attractiveness is a very subjective perception, there are traits considered pretty that seem to be consistent throughout most of mankind. However, even the prettiest people often don't seem to feel that way themselves. I never considered myself the least bit attractive growing up, but looking back this was more due to a poor (and incorrect) self image than anything else. I'm pretty sure I've always been better than average in the looks department, though not movie star good looking. I partially base this on the number of attractive women (and sometimes men) who shown interest in me throughout my (fairly long) life. As an andro-fem person now, I occasionally receive a wolf whistle or an obviously admiring stare and I'm no spring chicken.
Misinterpreted self-perception is probably more the norm than not. I've read countless interviews with super gorgeous movie stars and models who thought they looked ordinary right up until fame made it no longer possible. Then again, I have met people who seemed to think of themselves as more attractive than I saw them.
I suppose the only way to know how it feels to be pretty is to align the following:
1. Be/make yourself reasonably attractive as seems to be perceived in your culture (or as close as possible).
2. Develop a great, but honest self image of yourself.
3. Find someone who perceives you as attractive (and there probably is, no matter what you think now).
Quote from: galaxy on July 23, 2014, 04:25:59 AM
I was going out with two other girlsfriends. After sitting a while on our table the first man came to ask one of my girlfriends to have a drink, after a while another man came and ask the other girlfriend. I got no drink and i wasnt ask by a man. I was never ask by man and there is nobody opens the door for me. There's also nobody who say i'm pretty or had a good progress the last years.
:(
You shouldn't let that discourage you.
I'm struck by how so much of the conversation is about finding people to date. It's a salient issue but the effect of physical attractiveness encompasses so much more than that. There have been books written on the topic:
http://www.amazon.com/Looks-They-Matter-More-Imagined/dp/0814480543/ref=pd_sim_b_2?ie=UTF8&refRID=0W6R9WJ1R63YBDQC9PMA
No comment ...
http://www.amazon.com/Survival-Prettiest-The-Science-Beauty/dp/0385479425/ref=pd_bxgy_b_img_y
From that book
"The idea that beauty is unimportant or a cultural construct is the real beauty myth. We have to understand beauty, or we will always be enslaved by it."
Well don't we already know that? I have no desire to 'breed' yet I know/feel beauty plays a large biological role even if you arent necessarily in it for the "Survival' aspect
Love the corset on the cover btw
That's an interesting topic for a book, but I have to side with one of the Amazon commenters in keeping the importance of beauty in perspective. While being pretty is an undeniable advantage in human survival, it's only one of several. Anyone who has walked through a crowded Wal-Mart store knows there are plenty of unattractive people who are somehow managing to be sexually appealing enough to produce a flock of offspring.
I bring this up because it seems easy for transgender people to (understandably) become a bit overly obsessed with the importance of appearance. In my own observation through life the value of how a person looks rates only about 50% of their overall appeal, the other 50% being how the are.
Beauty is relative thus subjective to every human being so what any one person thinks about me, or anyone really, has no value socially to me whether it's positive or negative. I've been told I am sexy, beautiful, gorgeous and then I've been told I am disgusting, ugly and gross. Today, however, I don't really care if someone thinks I am ugly or beautiful, just don't care.