So lately for some reason I'm getting "sir" and "him" (in the 3rd person) a lot lately. Not just when I'm in guy mode (which is pretty much only work lately) but today I went out in girl mode (at least I think I did). I'm not sure but I think even my therapist accidentally misgendered me which is when you know it's bad.
I mean I don't expect to fully pass since I'm only 2 months on full HRT and I don't wear makeup. But damn it really makes me feel like jumping off a bridge sometimes. I used to get ma'am and miss a lot. Not these days.
One of my old girlfriends who I came out to told me that yes I look "man-ish."
So just what is it?
I have a few theories.
One - my voice. Fixing that with some training and I'm going to Yeson in a few months.
Two - my stupid beard shadow. I did laser last week and the hair on my face is dark, even with shaving. I wonder just when it will fall out?
Three - glasses. Oh god they are awful. I need to scrape up some cash to get new ones.
Even pictriev is 100% male now! Uggghh! I used to get anywhere from 40% to 98% female.
Strange thing is in passing nobody gives me weird looks or prevents me from using the women's bathrooms. But people I interact with results in a train wreck of misgendering. And I really don't correct them either which is bad.
Anyway this is how I looked today:
(https://www.susans.org/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi1188.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fz403%2Frjairam%2FE5DEFD7E-4649-4D1A-919C-860E29B29808_zpscyekdxs3.jpg&hash=4cbc64f84c293c6eb6bdc46e89b3f08158e74a86) (http://s1188.photobucket.com/user/rjairam/media/E5DEFD7E-4649-4D1A-919C-860E29B29808_zpscyekdxs3.jpg.html)
Yeah I look like a f'ing dude and I hate it.
And with the glasses
(https://www.susans.org/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi1188.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fz403%2Frjairam%2FFB7BF223-C42A-4F21-87EC-5ED3207C266E_zpskbfrhdkm.jpg&hash=daffaa9442a32caf9b99845968513d8b44558d1d) (http://s1188.photobucket.com/user/rjairam/media/FB7BF223-C42A-4F21-87EC-5ED3207C266E_zpskbfrhdkm.jpg.html)
I see the problem right now, you've got winterface! It's the complete lack of anything resembling a smile! Show us one with those pearly whites! ;D
Hugs, Devlyn
I feel your pain babe, I really do.
Just keep that chin high and lightly beat that face with some powder, mascara and lipstick or lip balm and you should look alright.
Also, use some styling products on your hair to keep that gorgeous mane in place.
Chin up, you are a woman.
April
Yeah April I know right?
I really want to do my makeup but I didn't get to go to sephora or Mac and get it done. It's a catch 22 with me. I'm not out at work and the kids school so I can't go during the week and on the weekends I never leave the house and go to the mall because I have 10 billion things to do. And if I do, my wife will get passive aggressive about how I'm taking time to do stuff for myself and she doesn't get any time for her own stuff.
Every DIY makeup I've done has been a disaster. My wife said she'd show me but that was when she was talking about alternatives to me transitioning. So I kinda don't approach her about this stuff because we will just argue.
I don't even have the slightest clue where to start even. I watch YouTube videos but could never do it how these girls do. I've watched for every complexion and face, cis, trans, and I just can't do it.
I mean yeah I'm a woman but today I don't feel like it. I feel like I just want to curl up and die.
Quote from: Devlyn Marie on February 07, 2015, 06:59:14 PM
I see the problem right now, you've got winterface! It's the complete lack of anything resembling a smile! Show us one with those pearly whites! ;D
Hugs, Devlyn
Lol! It actually looks worse but thanks though.
Honest opinion, the beard shadow is probably the issue. I don't trust pictriev, its very gimmicky ... try rekog, it has much better algorithms and is used by serious people, like airport security, casino security, retail advertisers, NSA uses it too I heard... https://rekognition.com/index.php/demo/face.
pictriev says I look like a cross between Ozzy Osbourne and Emma Watson... so um yeah ::) Also, try the same picture different times and get different results... pictriev gets a total F- in terms of programming and accuracy.
Rekog rated you female in both these pictures, but it also shows a small percent in the beard/mustache fields.
Once that hair is gone for good you should have no issues.
And like Devlyn said, smile some there winter face! lol you got to glow. I have seen some older photos of you and you glowed more in them ;D
-Jade
:-*
I think when you have your beard removed you will not run into so many of these problems.
I wish i didnt try that Rekogntion software now, it said I look 43 years old :'( NOOOOOO!!!
I really do think it's the shadow. I just took this. Damn! It screams guy. Well apart from my boobs and hips but the shadow...
(https://www.susans.org/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi1188.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fz403%2Frjairam%2FD065E9F3-6F55-4854-A25C-EDDDABBD3B7D_zpsb9lodo1u.jpg&hash=848faaf4aafa0c552aed7069f64408b9f3a0fb13) (http://s1188.photobucket.com/user/rjairam/media/D065E9F3-6F55-4854-A25C-EDDDABBD3B7D_zpsb9lodo1u.jpg.html)
Quote from: Joanne Feliz on February 07, 2015, 07:55:43 PM
I think when you have your beard removed you will not run into so many of these problems.
I wish i didnt try that Rekogntion software now, it said I look 43 years old :'( NOOOOOO!!!
oh geez! sorry :(
be sure
not to use photos with light coming from above.. it adds YEARS on the rekog age stats. Use light coming from low angle like morning or afternoon light.
High noon light = OLD.
I am 40 and it thinks I am 25-30... sometimes as young as 17. Thats with lower light, with light above me it thinks I am 60+ ugh!
-Jade
:-*
Quote from: ImagineKate on February 07, 2015, 07:59:15 PM
I really do think it's the shadow. I just took this. Damn! It screams guy. Well apart from my boobs and hips but the shadow...
Yes, I think thats what it is, the shadow. Once that hair is gone you will be a happy girl again! :D
-Jade
:-*
You need to have at least 4 laser sessions to make a big difference apparently. Dont lose heart, you have a great face!
;)
Quote from: ImagineKate on February 07, 2015, 07:59:15 PM
I really do think it's the shadow. I just took this. Damn! It screams guy. Well apart from my boobs and hips but the shadow...
(https://www.susans.org/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi1188.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fz403%2Frjairam%2FD065E9F3-6F55-4854-A25C-EDDDABBD3B7D_zpsb9lodo1u.jpg&hash=848faaf4aafa0c552aed7069f64408b9f3a0fb13) (http://s1188.photobucket.com/user/rjairam/media/D065E9F3-6F55-4854-A25C-EDDDABBD3B7D_zpsb9lodo1u.jpg.html)
Even in this picture Rekog rates you 100% female.. so , Yes you have a great face! Feminine :D Nice boobs and hips too ;)
-Jade
:-*
Quote from: Joanne Feliz on February 07, 2015, 08:10:34 PM
You need to have at least 4 laser sessions to make a big difference apparently. Dont lose heart, you have a great face!
;)
True. Plus I have type IV so they use the YAG laser. Patience I guess.
Quote from: Jade_404 on February 07, 2015, 07:19:00 PM
And like Devlyn said, smile some there winter face! lol you got to glow. I have seen some older photos of you and you glowed more in them ;D
-Jade
:-*
Yeah I wish I had "glow" these days. I have lots of things bogging me down these days and sometimes I feel like just throwing the towel in on everything. Not just transition, everything and I'll become one of those 41% statistics of trans people if you know what I mean.
That's in a different thread though.
Tonight is one of these nights:
(https://www.susans.org/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi1188.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fz403%2Frjairam%2FE435E1F7-CA66-4BCD-9A93-C71C7F6B0808_zpsylloaheo.jpg&hash=52a901c4a5711b58de2d1c7cfe80474d8d24647c) (http://s1188.photobucket.com/user/rjairam/media/E435E1F7-CA66-4BCD-9A93-C71C7F6B0808_zpsylloaheo.jpg.html)
Quote from: ImagineKate on February 07, 2015, 08:31:48 PM
Yeah I wish I had "glow" these days. I have lots of things bogging me down these days and sometimes I feel like just throwing the towel in on everything. Not just transition, everything and I'll become one of those 41% statistics of trans people if you know what I mean.
That's in a different thread though.
Tonight is one of these nights:
(https://www.susans.org/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi1188.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fz403%2Frjairam%2FE435E1F7-CA66-4BCD-9A93-C71C7F6B0808_zpsylloaheo.jpg&hash=52a901c4a5711b58de2d1c7cfe80474d8d24647c) (http://s1188.photobucket.com/user/rjairam/media/E435E1F7-CA66-4BCD-9A93-C71C7F6B0808_zpsylloaheo.jpg.html)
aww , well here is a big hug for you :icon_archery: shot from across the net. Hope it didn't miss. Wish I could do more to make you feel better! Hate to see good people down. hug hug hug hug hug!!!!!
-Jade
:-*
Thanks. :) I appreciate the hugs and support.
I don't know if you noticed but I took down all my old photos and my avatar. Reason is I caught my wife browsing here. She claims she didn't know I posted here but wanted to get support in the significant others section. How did I figure it out? She posted a link on facebook by accident.
From personal experience, at the beginning of my transition (with HRT) I did seem to get "sir'd" and referred in the male pronoun more so than prior to transition. I feel it had to do more with society's penchant to dichotomize gender into only male vs female. At the start, as I moved into the androgynous phase, I think I got "sir'd" more readily because it was as if (in the public opinion) they had excitedly gotten an answer correct on a test - they had decided I was a biological XY male and were happy to say (in their mind, and voiced publicly) the correct answer to my gender. Not so much anymore - now I'm gendered about 60% female, 10% male, 30% not attempted with confused stares). Those pronoun numbers are fine for me, since my typical everyday is jeans, T-shirt, and baseball cap; footwear either beach sandals, sneakers, or cowboy boots; no makeup, just some chapstick. I still have a typical male voice - so it's funny to see their reaction when they gender me as female. Voice coaching will come soon enough...
As for laser - as others have said - it takes a few sessions to see results; I usually saw hair evacuation around 10-14 days post-treatment. I'm five sessions in - figure I'll probably go up to eight and then electro the remaining white hairs.
So to summarize - who knows, maybe the public's perception of your androgyny is similar to mine...and if so, don't worry...they'll get it correct eventually ;)
Kate, here's virtual hug *April sits beside Kate* to let you know you are not alone my sister.
It's just one of those days. Don't let this day blind you from what great things are ahead of you.
You are beautiful. Sending all the love and positive vibes I can muster.
xoxo
April
From the bottom of my heart, thank you everyone. You all know how to make a girl feel loved. :)
Quote from: ImagineKate on February 07, 2015, 08:31:48 PMTonight is one of these nights:
(https://www.susans.org/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi1188.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fz403%2Frjairam%2FE435E1F7-CA66-4BCD-9A93-C71C7F6B0808_zpsylloaheo.jpg&hash=52a901c4a5711b58de2d1c7cfe80474d8d24647c) (http://s1188.photobucket.com/user/rjairam/media/E435E1F7-CA66-4BCD-9A93-C71C7F6B0808_zpsylloaheo.jpg.html)
I've had plenty of "Super Big Gulp size pina colada" nights - part and parcel of transition for many of us to get us through those truly terrible moments when it all seems utterly hopeless. Enjoy the booze, relax, drink plenty of water before bed, and wake up tomorrow ready to hit the ground running. Sadly, there's no way to make this a quick process. Keep plugging away - you'll get to where you need to be in the end.
Pour one for me while you're at it.
I wanted to add to the hugs and support. You are at the start of your journey and you will soften and be shiny.
Keep flying.
You are strong
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
I get "Sired" sometimes and it sucks. I work in customer service at Wholefoods and I know. Sometimes I think it's my voice, other times I think it's because the guests there knew who I was "before". Hang in there! It will get better as you progress further in your transition.
oh how i do sympathize with you i know its a pain. im the same im just starting out and i need time.im hoping to add estrogen to my hrt(dont ask its a long story) ive been waiting for my hair to grow ect. i still have to present as sort of male at times.stick with it time will help. i decided not to rush to try to avoid the want it now feeling. i will put my photo on my profile soon ive got over the fear of not looking as i want but i remind myself im at the start. personally id rather wait and let my body do some of the work when i get on full hrt then i can see how i want to be. being sir`d is annoying but i do now get it with a tinge of their not sure. remember rome wasnt built in a day it took a few years to get planning permission lol
Oh I DO get the "I'm not really sure" stuff a lot. When I open my mouth though, BAM the Sir bomb gets dropped.
Hi Kate...
I think Devlyn hit it right on it... Your picture shows disappointment etc... A lot of your pics show a very different gal... Radiant and happy :-* let your inner self shine through...
I must admit when anyone, especially me, has a stern or miserable face your whole image changes, makes you look stern or grimacey and therefore more masculine.
April also had a good point with hair (Wish I had some more than I have :-\)
Joanne (Feliz) hope Rekog rates me at 43 would be so happy with that ongoing ;)
Hugs to you honey... Pick yourself up, be strong ( fine coming from me Eh???) and be yourself...
Ooh by the way takes years of practice with makeup, it'll just click... Don't over do it is the only tip I have...
xoxoxoxo love Katy :-*
(waves)
Hi all. Long time no see. :)
Katrina makes a good point. A stern face is a more masculine face! Grin's lift and it's a feminine trait.
Check this out ;D
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3v98CPXNiSk
Quote from: Evelyn K on February 08, 2015, 07:12:30 AM
(waves)
Hi all. Long time no see. :)
Katrina makes a good point. A stern face is a more masculine face! Grin's lift and it's a feminine trait.
Check this out ;D
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3v98CPXNiSk
Lol thanks I needed that.
You'll like this one too. ;D
BTW I highly recommend her channel below. Oh and if it's any consolation, she has brow bossing as well and is CIS.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hfrIegPtey4
I notice a lot of girls have brow bossing. My mom has more than I do believe it or not.
Hugs to you girl. I have to agree with others on it being the shadow. After a few laser sessions (3-4), it will make a big huge difference.
The facial hair is a major thing, and it's going much slower than I'd like. I try to cover it with makeup but every time I try to do makeup it just doesn't look right. I did promise myself to go get it done professionally and learn but in this house I barely get to sit down and if I stay idle for a few minutes or more my wife starts to find stuff for me to do. If I go places she will start to complain about how she doesn't get to do anything.
Electrolysis zaps it but it just grows back. I got laser last week but it didn't seem to do anything other than have my face get a slight burning when I bristle the hairs. I am hoping it decides to just give up and fall out but I'm not holding my breath. I stopped Vaniqa a while back because I wanted it to be killed off by electro and laser. Vaniqa was really thinning it out but now it seems to have come back with a vengeance.
Sometimes I feel like I'm at the end of my rope... I know lots of girls have it worse but I have been bottled for over 30 years and I am just wanting to get this done and over with and live. :(
I got misgendered by my doctor's office, sir, him, his. The girl that did that was from Trinidad (I could tell from her accent). I had to remind them that I'm a trans patient. Well that one I had to grow out my facial hair for electrolysis which I was supposed to have the next day. So I kinda was expecting it. But it still knocks you down.
Almost misgendered by my therapist on Friday, she called me by my male name... she caught herself.
The last straw was yesterday really. I went to the supermarket, I figure everything going fine. I even use the ladies no problem with other ladies in it. They didn't really tell me anything.
Then the cashier, I go up to her, she scans my frequent shopper card on my phone. She asks if I found everything I wanted.
I said, "no I didn't, I wanted butternut squash." I kinda tried the voice a bit high but it came out male. Then I clicked in my mind, "oh crap, I'm gonna get clocked now."
Then she picks up the phone and said, "hey I have a customer here and HE wants butternut squash."
Well then I was like a deer in the headlights. I looked for my coupons for bottled water (the 5 gallon return tickets), could not find it. I was frantically searching my pockets.
Then she looked at me and said, "SIR are you OK?" And I just froze. I couldn't believe it. Totally clocked and misgendered. I wanted to curl up and die. I checked out my groceries and left, went home and cried and then wrote this post. I was going so well, HOW was this happening? Then I looked at my face and realized, yeah I have a big ugly beard shadow, and the voice must have clicked in her head that this is a man she's talking to.
I just felt totally disgusting... didn't feel like a woman. I felt like I was pretending. So I drove home. Then I broke out the alcohol and figured I'd drink my worries away that night. Fell asleep on the sofa, woke up with a massive headache. Rough night. :(
Kate, I hate to be candid my love but you have to schedule your make over ASAP unless you want this scenario to happen again.
It will only be an hour of make over at Sephora - I know coz I work for them part time.
I honestly learned make -up on my own. Watching youtube videos and asking my female friends. Stay with a simple routine - mine is moisturize, primer, foundation, conceal, set with powder, blush, brows and lip balm. Humility aside, I think I pass for the most part :)
Do it soon!!! Love yah!!!!
April
Quote from: ImagineKate on February 08, 2015, 07:21:51 PM
The facial hair is a major thing, and it's going much slower than I'd like. I try to cover it with makeup but every time I try to do makeup it just doesn't look right. I did promise myself to go get it done professionally and learn but in this house I barely get to sit down and if I stay idle for a few minutes or more my wife starts to find stuff for me to do. If I go places she will start to complain about how she doesn't get to do anything.
Electrolysis zaps it but it just grows back. I got laser last week but it didn't seem to do anything other than have my face get a slight burning when I bristle the hairs. I am hoping it decides to just give up and fall out but I'm not holding my breath. I stopped Vaniqa a while back because I wanted it to be killed off by electro and laser. Vaniqa was really thinning it out but now it seems to have come back with a vengeance.
Sometimes I feel like I'm at the end of my rope... I know lots of girls have it worse but I have been bottled for over 30 years and I am just wanting to get this done and over with and live. :(
I got misgendered by my doctor's office, sir, him, his. The girl that did that was from Trinidad (I could tell from her accent). I had to remind them that I'm a trans patient. Well that one I had to grow out my facial hair for electrolysis which I was supposed to have the next day. So I kinda was expecting it. But it still knocks you down.
Almost misgendered by my therapist on Friday, she called me by my male name... she caught herself.
The last straw was yesterday really. I went to the supermarket, I figure everything going fine. I even use the ladies no problem with other ladies in it. They didn't really tell me anything.
Then the cashier, I go up to her, she scans my frequent shopper card on my phone. She asks if I found everything I wanted.
I said, "no I didn't, I wanted butternut squash." I kinda tried the voice a bit high but it came out male. Then I clicked in my mind, "oh crap, I'm gonna get clocked now."
Then she picks up the phone and said, "hey I have a customer here and HE wants butternut squash."
Well then I was like a deer in the headlights. I looked for my coupons for bottled water (the 5 gallon return tickets), could not find it. I was frantically searching my pockets.
Then she looked at me and said, "SIR are you OK?" And I just froze. I couldn't believe it. Totally clocked and misgendered. I wanted to curl up and die. I checked out my groceries and left, went home and cried and then wrote this post. I was going so well, HOW was this happening? Then I looked at my face and realized, yeah I have a big ugly beard shadow, and the voice must have clicked in her head that this is a man she's talking to.
I just felt totally disgusting... didn't feel like a woman. I felt like I was pretending. So I drove home. Then I broke out the alcohol and figured I'd drink my worries away that night. Fell asleep on the sofa, woke up with a massive headache. Rough night. :(
Quote from: carmenkate on February 08, 2015, 08:18:49 PM
Kate, I hate to be candid my love but you have to schedule your make over ASAP unless you want this scenario to happen again.
It will only be an hour of make over at Sephora - I know coz I work for them part time.
I honestly learned make -up on my own. Watching youtube videos and asking my female friends. Stay with a simple routine - mine is moisturize, primer, foundation, conceal, set with powder, blush, brows and lip balm. Humility aside, I think I pass for the most part :)
Do it soon!!! Love yah!!!!
April
Oh I totally agree with you.
And yes you absolutely look gorgeous.
Kate, try and pick yourself up honey, press on and don't look back, it is hard, 30 years is a long time...
I guess facial hair / shadow whilst having Electro and / or Laser is, I believe a pre-req and outcome for a few days...
For me I won't go FT until I have lost the worst of it and lose / reduce all the other masculine "picking" features.
Whilst we try and make our way to true femininity we have to learn to endure and not let it get into our emotions... In any case there is a lot worse things and bigotry comments that could come out....
BTW FWIW my years in waiting are over a score and a half more :'( but there are many reasons...
So head up be strong and plan on, don't let the setbacks get to you, one day you'll look back and say 'wow I came through all of that' you'll be a stronger woman :-*
Hugs Katy
Kate,
Hang in there, some times this journey's lows seem so low. I know it really hurts. This world is much better with you in it, so don't go thinking about leaving it prematurely. I'm sending you trans-continental hugs.
-Alana
I feel like the awkward in between phase is always the hardest, because you're just beginning to shed away the male cacoon, but are not fully the butterfly yet.
That would be hard for anyone. The more you keep working on becoming the butterfly, it will definitely become easier.
One thing I learned a while ago from a YouTube vlogger, princessjoules, is that you can use a tinted foundation in the orange spectrum to mask the shadow of densely packed facial hair. Because orange is the color opposite of dark pigmented hair within fair skin which has a blue hue. The complementary color scale varies based on the hue of your skin with pigmented hair beneath it, and will be different for people with darker skin and lighter hair than my mousy brown.
There are going to be times that you are outed / clocked. If you roll your eyes and let it pass, or even just raise a quizzical eyebrow, people won't make as big of a deal about it. Even if you want to crawl into a hole and die, those around you will react to your reaction. Act calm and collected, and people who aren't jerks will let it go and attempt to not annoy you. They may even apologize sincerely afterward, and if you want to be particularly unforgiving you can huffily respond with "It's Ms. ->-bleeped-<-, thank you," before flouncing off.
I've been there though. Last time I had my teeth cleaned in preparation for my FFS, at new dental office, and after cleaning my teeth my hygienist didn't know which pronoun to use for me. There hadn't been an issue when we talked back and forth (you is genderless), only when she was referring to me to her colleague to ensure I had arranged my insurance and payment.
She apologized, but I was too busy panicking to realize I could end her confusion by telling her I was female. She was super nice, and probably would've been accepting and supportive if I had told her I was transgender, but I was busy freaking out and leaving as soon as I could. I had been presenting full-time for a few months but that hadn't cured my social anxiety issues.
Last week I was hungry enough to drive through The Hat for a grilled cheese sandwich and Diet Coke. When I pulled up to the window, the guy called me sir. I rolled my eyes so hard my fake smile bordered on bitchy. After making sure the total and my order were correct, I paid, received my food. I promptly parked nearby, enjoyed my food, and then let myself obsess about being mis-gendered.
It was most likely a confluence of my new pixie cut, my sloppy voice, and forgetting where I left my favorite earrings the previous day. Or, the drive thru acoustics were so bad it's hard to discern either way, and he was barely paying attention because of how busy they were inside. Flip a coin.
Getting mis-gendered sucks, but it's exhausting to live in fear of it. You know who you are better than anyone else. Only you can be you, and you should never be ashamed of being yourself. You are beautiful.
A wise person once said:
"And the haters gonna hate, hate, hate, hate, hate
Baby, I'm just gonna shake, shake, shake, shake, shake
I shake it off. I shake it off."
Hugs,
- Katie
I sometimes think the first step in transition is to buy shares in tissue manufacturers. We shed so many tears we may as well be paid for them!
I do remember my first bra when I was still in male mode at Target. The checkout girl announced, there is a man at aisle 7 buying a bra but there is no price code.
So many different ways that could have been said.
I wore it with pride.
My armour started. With each insult my armour grew as did my conviction and courage. I'm me, no one has the right to doubt me. No one has the right to insult me. You will see nothing but scorn on my face. I will make you wither.
And I did. I could look at a person who had insulted me and watch them crumble.
Now that my transition is over I look back and laugh. My armour? Thrown out with his other junk :laugh:
You will as well young lady :-* :-* :-*
Quote from: Cindy on February 09, 2015, 02:02:45 AM
I do remember my first bra when I was still in male mode at Target. The checkout girl announced, there is a man at aisle 7 buying a bra but there is no price code.
...wow. She couldn't have made that more embarrassing if she had tried.
Kate, during my first attempt at transition I passed with no problem every single time I wore a dress or skirt. But never when I wore pants/jeans. It didn't sink in for many many years that even though women dress in andro mode and in jeans etc, their clothing and presentation still usually has some defining female features - style and cut, neckline, accessories, hair, make up, shoes, etc. I have no idea how that applies to you of course, but for every feminine characteristic you subtract from your andro look the more people start to look at any vestigial male characteristics (eg beard shadow). Anyway, that's just a thought. I was pretty devastated all those years ago that it seemed I'd never be able to wear jeans, I just wanted to be a casual chick so badly. When I approached transition this time I honestly thought it would be a no pants zone forever. That turned out not to be the case fortunately but I still really feel I need to weight that look with feminine extras...not a lot, but enough to do the trick.
Quote from: Evelyn K on February 08, 2015, 07:12:30 AM
(waves)
Hi all. Long time no see. :)
Katrina makes a good point. A stern face is a more masculine face! Grin's lift and it's a feminine trait.
Check this out ;D
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3v98CPXNiSk
Bwahahahaha!!! Thanks I needed this LOL! Well, we all do sometimes haha! <3 this!!
Evelyn... love the video... I certainly am very aware of my natural face, and have to think "smile/grin" all the time... duno why as a few years ago I was always referred to as smiley???? what a turnaround.... but am grinning writing this :)
Added... and the second one... and yes noticed, don't feel so bad now :-*
L Katy
I like to use a little eye shadow, to hep with my fem look. Almay has some eye colored based sets. You get a light color for the top, a medium color for the lid, and a dark color to accent the crease. My only advise is to keep it subtle and not color up to the brow, and use some light on the inside of the eye to help make the eyes look wider and more feminine. No man would be caught dead wearing eye shadow, so this will help with the "Sirs" and it's available from your local CVS/Target/Walmart, so no special trip required.
-Alana
When I went full time without any hair removal or HRT and living in an area where I was fairly well known it was torture. I was mis gendered nearly every day and because of this I feel you pain. As others have said the beard shadow won't be helping and maybe neither is unstyled hair but I honestly believe the biggest thing you can do to help yourself is work on your confidence. If you go do some people watching and concentrate on the women you may notice how many of them just exude natural rhythm and flow to everything they do. I thought long and hard like you've been doing about what I was doing wrong. Having a poor wig and bad make up wasn't helping me but the other thing I did was when I was out the house I was so concerned about who was next going to be rude or insulting that I forgot to be natural and therefore drew attention to myself. I know it's hard to be confident when things are going badly but if you can get yourself into the mindset of seeing the progress you've made and the good things that are to come I'm sure that will help.
The more you get out as Kate and practice the more confident you'll become, I think Grace also hit the nail on the head. Work on emphasising some of your better feminine features so that the first glance tells people they are interacting with a female and this too will help. I never used to leave the house in jeans or pants always a skirt or dress and I wouldn't go out without make up. As times past I have become confident enough to wear jeans and only wear make up on days when I'm going to meet someone or will be out for a long period of time. I mostly now pass I think. I became stubborn, "My passport says I'm female and so does my drivers licence so these fools can think what they want, Whatever they think they cannot alter that my name is Sorcha and I've not met many men with that name" That's what I told myself each time I was insulted and in time I managed to get better.
I hope things get better for you but at least you know you have support on here and that is better than no support at all
Hugs
Sorcha ;D
Well Kate's happy again.
First off I lost weight!
Secondly I was in Walmart. Almost had a fight with my wife after she wanted me to take my son to the men's restroom. I'm done with the men's restroom even in male mode. I use the family restroom in male mode. I can't keep switching back and forth.
Well I was barely in male mode today but whatever.
Well I was pushing my cart in their crowded valentine section, then saw a cart I pushed it aside gently. An employee came up, took the cart and said, "ma'am let me get that out of your way." Really? Cool. I think I just had a male fail.
So I'm getting happy again. I think as well with the change in meds and my hormones I may have had some moodiness and General crappy feeling because of that but it's settling down.
Quote from: ImagineKate on February 10, 2015, 07:53:46 PM
Well Kate's happy again.
Well I was pushing my cart in their crowded valentine section, then saw a cart I pushed it aside gently. An employee came up, took the cart and said, "ma'am let me get that out of your way." Really? Cool. I think I just had a male fail.
So I'm getting happy again. I think as well with the change in meds and my hormones I may have had some moodiness and General crappy feeling because of that but it's settling down.
I've never heard the term male fail before but it made me laugh :) I think meds can make us do things we normally wouldn't and it doesn't take much to make us doubt so you go with the happy thoughts :) I'm sure that will make allot of situations seem better. I'm sure having a disapproving wife isn't helping you feel great either. I had one of them once and it made an already miserable me feel a whole lot worse. manys the time I couldn't wait to get back to work especially when I had a 10 day tour to do :)
Hugs
Sorcha ;D
Yeah so I began some new meds for diabetes a couple of weeks ago and went full strength this week. I was told it could mess with my hormones a bit. I was having PMS-y type symptoms definitely sans cramps (no uterus), a massive migraine plus I was darned irritable and feeling bloated. Not to mention I was pretty much a bitch to everyone... Glad that's over with for now!
More WIN today. Shaving this morning and some of the hair was sliding out. So I guess my lasered hair is finally shedding!
I go for my makeover early next week after I get paid.
Quote from: ImagineKate on February 11, 2015, 09:04:41 AM
More WIN today. Shaving this morning and some of the hair was sliding out. So I guess my lasered hair is finally shedding!
I go for my makeover early next week after I get paid.
Yeah!! I know that you're going to <3 <3 <3 love it
-Alana
Quote from: ImagineKate on February 11, 2015, 09:04:41 AM
More WIN today. Shaving this morning and some of the hair was sliding out. So I guess my lasered hair is finally shedding!
I go for my makeover early next week after I get paid.
All right! nice ;D.. I bet it was not the laser ... it was my glow :angel: , I glowed so bright it melted your face hair off ;) And now you are glowing! :)
-Jade
:-*
YAY!!!! happy for you Kate :D hugs hugs
While you're waiting for the rest of your laser treatments, you could try using a coral or salmon colored concealer over the beard shadow and then just a tinted moisturizer over top if you don't feel like doing full-on make up. I am an SO, but I am make up obsessed and I help my wife with hers all the time. I found that treating the shadow like under eye circles worked well, since the color you're trying to cover up is pretty much the same.
What works best on her is a redness reducing BB cream, salmon concealer around the beard area and then a regular liquid foundation on top with a matte setting powder. I know that seems like a lot of steps, but it works really well. The products I use on her are Sonia Kashuk Hidden Agenda Concealer Pallette (available at Target), L'Oreal BB Cream Anti-Redness, L'Oreal True Match Liquid Foundation and NYX Matte Setting Powder. All fairly inexpensive, even though I have to get the NYX at Ulta, it's still comparable to drug-store brands in price.
Also, as far as make up tutorials go, I think Kandee Johnson (https://www.youtube.com/user/kandeejohnson) has some great videos on youTube where she explains things well and makes them easy to follow and also gives product suggestions at every price range.
Hope that helps! -Kat
Thanks Kat. Makeup is something I need to at least get down. I am horrible and when I try I end up looking like a bad version of the joker. :(
Well I did get ma'amed today but in an unusual place - in my kids school by one of the teaching assistants. It's weird because she knows me. I wasn't really presenting femme but I kind of didn't really hide much (with a sweater) as I usually do. I had to pick up my daughter. I went to the class and was tending to her then she turned to me and said, ma'am here is her book bag. Then she seemed to catch herself. Probably a lucky fluke or maybe she is dropping a hint that she knows (I've been going "Jenner style" to the school).
Whatever I will take it.
I also found that as the upper lip hair falls off it looks hugely different. Wow. I never saw this from electrolysis because it was swollen plus she only did part at a time (time constraint plus she didn't want to heat up my face too much). I'm liking laser! Just wish the hairs would all fall out already...
:laugh: Great to see its all coming together and you're back, on form Kate :-*
Love to see you happier again...
L Katy :-*
Yeah I'm definitely more upbeat now! Although I did meet a rude manager at Burger King today who was bossing around the female employees like they were little children and proceeded to give me a hard puzzled look, followed by "sir" but I was in male drag anyway. Ah well.
Quote from: ImagineKate on February 12, 2015, 10:10:45 PM
Thanks Kat. Makeup is something I need to at least get down. I am horrible and when I try I end up looking like a bad version of the joker. :(
You're welcome! Makeup has never been something that came easy to me either, even being a cis woman. My mother loathes makeup for its "sexual" connotations (she has unresolved issues, but I digress). So I didn't get any help from her growing up. I had to learn from friends at school and hide my makeup for the longest time, only putting it on when I was out of the house. Once I was on my own and had better access to the wonders of the internet, I started watching tutorial videos all the time and just kept trying different things until I found a routine and a look that worked for me.
You'll get it down, practice makes perfect! Also, good to hear you're getting Ma'amed without trying! :)
Wheeeeee
I got "clocked" today at the DMV.
I don't have my new ID yet and it's still male. Travel plans are forcing me to delay my name change.
Anyhow, I went to get one of the car registrations renewed. I went dressed up androgyne/femme but I did put on light foundation and lip gloss. Not the pink one, but a more darker red.
Went up to the receptionist, he greets me so kindly and gently unlike the guys who were ahead of me; one of whom had a suspended license. Directed me to the express lane. Genderless so far.
Clerk said, "ma'am I will take you over here." Yay!
Ok so she asks for my paperwork and DL. She looks at my DL, then looks at me. Looks again and then looks back. Then she just shakes her head in frustration, then suddenly says to herself, "oh, now I get it."
LOL.
She did not call me sir. She just printed my paperwork, I swiped my Amex and she said have a nice day.
:)
Quote from: ImagineKate on February 23, 2015, 12:55:27 PM
Wheeeeee
I got "clocked" today at the DMV.
I don't have my new ID yet and it's still male. Travel plans are forcing me to delay my name change.
Anyhow, I went to get one of the car registrations renewed. I went dressed up androgyne/femme but I did put on light foundation and lip gloss. Not the pink one, but a more darker red.
Went up to the receptionist, he greets me so kindly and gently unlike the guys who were ahead of me; one of whom had a suspended license. Directed me to the express lane. Genderless so far.
Clerk said, "ma'am I will take you over here." Yay!
Ok so she asks for my paperwork and DL. She looks at my DL, then looks at me. Looks again and then looks back. Then she just shakes her head in frustration, then suddenly says to herself, "oh, now I get it."
LOL.
She did not call me sir. She just printed my paperwork, I swiped my Amex and she said have a nice day.
:)
I would not call this "being clocked" :). It is just kinda inevitable in those situations when You have to show some officials papers - people have their own impression having set first, then they get to see Your papers and then there is that moment of confusion (I am getting this at postal office, banks, any public institution) - sometimes they just keep switching between face and ID, sometimes they ask "is this Your ID/is that You?" and then just proceed with suspicious look. I am just trying to rolling with it - it was kinda funny in the beginning, now it becomes a bit annoying and I just do some mental "roll eyes" when this happens :).
Yeah hence why I used "clocked" in quotes, lol.
It was reaffirming that she'd be confused. I used to get that a lot but something happened and it stopped. Now that I have a new look I'm getting some people confused again.
I try to avoid using credit cards for this reason. I use apple pay where I can.
Good to hear :)
Also note that sometimes when you think your clocked, your not. Sometimes people just don't pay attention. Today after taking my father in law to the doctor we stopped by Duncan Donuts for some coffee. The woman behind the counter ma'amed me. Then the guy that was making the coffee and never looked up at me, but called me sir because I'm very tall and he just guess male by height alone that he could see out of the corner of his eye. When he finally looked up at me, he had this shocked look on his face like, "my god, your a woman." This has happened to me before and they apologize with a "Oh, I'm sorry ma'am, wow your tall." This guy was speechless and turned about 4 shades of red. Someone might assume I was clocked, but in reality it was just someone not paying attention to detail.
Well I don't have that as I'm 5'6.
The real issue is the never ending shadow but laser is thinning it. I go back in a couple weeks.
And this winter is making me go through moisturizer like crazy.
I had a similar thing happen at Ross. My therapist and I missed our last meeting, so I decided on some "retail" based therapy. So, I found five nice summer dresses, and a couple of tops.
I'm wearing the dress in my Avatar, and some 3" chunky heels; total height is like 6' 4". So I get to the front and the lady asks to see my credit card. It still has my male name on it, so she asks for my drivers license, which is even worse as I've not only have the "m" in the gender but am clearly male in the photo from 3 years ago. She does a stereotypical double take then starts scanning all the tags. When she hands me the bags, she gives me the "Have a good day... 'SIR'!" My reply was a half chocked "thank you" because right at that moment my throat decided to close a little.
Everyone in the store had be nice: down to even the loss prevention and security dudes, I even had a few too many things for the dressing room, and one of those annoying tags go off on a cute Calvin Kline color block dress. Everything had been fine until then, and suddenly I am chocking on my words, stumbling in my heels, and feeling all hot and sweaty, all because she decided to denigrate me out loud. Some people are just haters. My motto is "Stay Classy" and I'm not giving that punk girl the satisfaction, so I held my head high and walked out as best I could.
So Kate, that's my wish for you. Lady, stay classy.
Hugs,
-Alana
Hi Kate
I'm glad to hear the laser is working out for you. I'm going through the same problem with my thick and dark beard shadow. It's very frustrating. But once all that hair starts to fall out, your confidence does completely change!! Just be prepared though because after it sheds, a lot of hair does regrow after a few weeks!!! I'm on my fifth treatment, and i still have a decent bit of noticeable shadow around my chin and little patches scattered around my face.
I pretty much don't bother trying to look female most of the time, unless its right after the shedding occurs, and i look mostly clear for about a week or two per month. My beard shadow gives me huge anxiety, and even more so if i'm trying to present female. Its a slow process so I think patience is the key.
Your a pretty girl Kate, and already look quite passable. The winter isn't any nicer to the skin of cis-women, so that part will get better in a month. I understand your frustration around the shadow, it causes me a lot anxiety too, and eventually it will be gone.
Thanks Rachel.
I do pass when I try (and sometimes when I don't) but there are people who knock me down. HARD.
I am a fighter but sometimes I just wish it was easier.
I am also impatient. I was born a girl. I need to look like one, like, yesterday. But I also realize that it's a marathon, not a sprint. That said I am happy to be progressing along nicely.
And I could not do it without all of you wonderful ladies!