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Anyone else find these settings unnerving?
What teh heck do you do when all girl discussions come up?
Examples:
"Periods"
"Who has the worst cramps"
"Other women's parenting skills"
"The children"
"Favorite XXX videos to watch with the 'boyfriend'"
And gawd forbid if a discussion about my "young woman" past comes up.
"So Evelyn, what college sorority did you belong to?" ::)
Or if a woman asks in X-rated "girl code", "Did you have fun last night? Was he sweet? ;)" o.O
And the anxiety sweating begins....
Sounds really cliche imo like out of a movie. Mostly me and my friends just watch TV or go places and they're all down to earth and edgy so our conversations are def not about babies lol. Sometimes we bitch about guys but relationships are apart if life and you're supposed to share your life with friends.
Just fine some women more your speed or just make male friends.
^^ lol! No really, I think girls really do like to talk about these 'girl issues', like they're competing, such as who has the worst periods, "Oh for me it's a breeze, they're so light I don't even notice..."
"We hate that chick!"
Quote from: Evelyn K on June 11, 2015, 11:32:32 PM
^^ lol! No really, I think girls really do like to talk about these 'girl issues', like they're competing, such as who has the worst periods, "Oh for me it's a breeze, they're so light I don't even notice..."
"We hate that chick!"
Some maybe i guess? The only time my friends bring it up is usually when they're actually on it. Its not offensive to me regardless why would it be? Its just a bodily function. Just say you're on the pill so you rarely get yours
Yeah I get that.
The thing is, newly post transition I feel like I need to take the advanced transwomen's class now, if there existed one. lol.
I have no idea where to turn except internally for experience (which I have none) and I'm only now realizing how little of the exclusively women's domain socializing I really know.
It's jarring sort of like culture shock when you're in a new foreign country.
Quote from: Evelyn K on June 11, 2015, 11:43:27 PM
Yeah I get that.
The thing is, newly post transition I feel like I need to take the advanced transwomen's class now, if there existed one. lol.
I have no idea where to turn except internally for experience (which I have none) and I'm only now realizing how little of the exclusively women's domain socializing I really know.
It's jarring sort of like culture shock when you're in a new foreign country.
Yeah see i never had male friends so that may be why im just used to it. I grew up with a lot of sisters too and i was very feminine and liked boys and just generally related better to girls.
I can see why you'd feel like a fish out of water if you spent most of your life socializing with guys.
Act like a prude that doesn't talk about any of that stuff and let them train you in how it's done.
Quote from: Evelyn K on June 11, 2015, 11:17:08 PM
"Periods"
"Who has the worst cramps"
I just kinda avoid the topic and stay silent, or I say I don't have them, but people know my status anyway. But they don't talk about this a lot, do they? I have had it come up in conversation now and again but it's not usually the focus of discussion.
Besides, I kinda do have ups and downs with my hormones so I may mention that. I also take the opportunity to talk about my journey and they find it fascinating. Being open helps.
Quote
"Other women's parenting skills"
"The children"
I have kids, so this is a non-issue. Talking about kids is my favorite topic, actually. Also, trans women can adopt kids and be parents, and not all cis women have kids. Again, non-issue.
Quote
"Favorite XXX videos to watch with the 'boyfriend'"
Um, well I don't have a boyfriend yet, but when I do, I will...
Quote
And gawd forbid if a discussion about my "young woman" past comes up.
"So Evelyn, what college sorority did you belong to?" ::)
Oh yeesh, I wasn't into greek life in college. I was a nerdy engineering student. I actually had an interesting college life and did a lot of cool things. But was never into greek life.
Quote
Or if a woman asks in X-rated "girl code", "Did you have fun last night? Was he sweet? ;)" o.O
And the anxiety sweating begins....
I guess when I reach the bridge of dating men post-op, I will figure that out, and I'll be excited to talk about it too. :)
But really girlfriend, you're overthinking it. Be natural and let it flow. I am the master of conversation with anyone and it helps that most of my close friendships have been with women. Making male friends has been and continues to be really awkward for me. The only reason I have a few male friends now is because of my LE past career and my gun club.
I don't really think its much of a problem. Just go with the flow, cramps are cramps no different. Everyone knows about periods , they bleed. boyfriends are sweet or horrible. College life is college life , breakfast , lunch diner , class , library . Then there's always the well, to be honest I happen to be transgender.
Hi Evelyn,
I understand your anxiety when talking to a group of women as this is a daily occurrence for me inside and outside of work. I say the conversation has to stay organic, if you have nothing to share just give them a smile. I believe the more you fabricate stuff i.e. giving scripted answer the more this will create unnecessary stress that you don't need.
Just live life and have fun - nothing is more valued than being authentic.
Love,
April
Quote from: iKate on June 12, 2015, 09:05:57 AM
But really girlfriend, you're overthinking it. Be natural and let it flow. I am the master of conversation with anyone and it helps that most of my close friendships have been with women.
I wonder if things would be easier if the group I'm with knew my status. But since I'm undercover, I'm realizing that not being able to confidently speak through a girl spiel life story is going to raise suspicions or make me seem distant and disconnected from the sistership.
Maybe I can be the REALLY SHY reserved type girl. But who wants to be that...!
I don't know, maybe I am thinking too much. I haven't sat in with all girl groups yet where people are more or less strangers. There where usually some males.
What I'm envisioning is groups of women I'm with who are mostly strangers, perhaps after a conference or a guided city tour. I'd assume things would be cordial with a lot of small talk, so that should be easy to navigate.
If real bonding opportunities starts to begin, and I'm trying to be stealthy, that's when the specter of actual sisterhood like conversation makes me realize I have a giant hole in that part of my life to speak fluently about.
Or I could just say, "Well guys I have to come clean. I'm trans..." but I wonder how much more damaging that could be instead of just winging it.
[snip]
QuoteMaking male friends has been and continues to be really awkward for me. The only reason I have a few male friends now is because of my LE past career and my gun club.
I haven't had a single male friend since 1995. I never felt comfortable around men. My best friends where women. But I was a guy. =\
I had a similar subject come up right after I came out to this woman. I am a geek so it's she and so once she know I asked her what she talks to normal women about, basic answer nothing really. Manure nails or current life events but ones interests and hobbies make up more of a conversation than gender.
Serena
Quote from: Valwen on June 12, 2015, 03:36:42 PM
I had a similar subject come up right after I came out to this woman. I am a geek so it's she and so once she know I asked her what she talks to normal women about, basic answer nothing really. Manure nails or current life events but ones interests and hobbies make up more of a conversation than gender.
Serena
This, my friends, is why I always wear gloves when I do my gardening. Ewwww!
(Damn you, autocorrect! LOL)
Quote from: Jill F on June 12, 2015, 04:05:37 PM
This, my friends, is why I always wear gloves when I do my gardening. Ewwww!
(Damn you, autocorrect! LOL)
...and wear rubber gloves for those 'special' bedroom activities? ;) :P
Quote from: Evelyn K on June 12, 2015, 02:52:44 PM
I wonder if things would be easier if the group I'm with knew my status. But since I'm undercover, I'm realizing that not being able to confidently speak through a girl spiel life story is going to raise suspicions or make me seem distant and disconnected from the sistership.
Maybe I can be the REALLY SHY reserved type girl. But who wants to be that...!
I don't know, maybe I am thinking too much. I haven't sat in with all girl groups yet where people are more or less strangers. There where usually some males.
What I'm envisioning is groups of women I'm with who are mostly strangers, perhaps after a conference or a guided city tour. I'd assume things would be cordial with a lot of small talk, so that should be easy to navigate.
If real bonding opportunities starts to begin, and I'm trying to be stealthy, that's when the specter of actual sisterhood like conversation makes me realize I have a giant hole in that part of my life to speak fluently about.
Or I could just say, "Well guys I have to come clean. I'm trans..." but I wonder how much more damaging that could be instead of just winging it.
[snip]
I haven't had a single male friend since 1995. I never felt comfortable around men. My best friends where women. But I was a guy. =\
I'd like to play the devils advocate >:-) and say that what if the women you were out with suspected you were trans (anything is possible), and you are telling them about your last period, or something else that we will never be able to experience, and then when you aren't there, they start talking about you, and agree that they do not have an issue with your being trans, but they just can't deal with the lying. So, just add things that are true, and there won't be any problems; you don't have to say that you are trans, and no one will ask, or may not even suspect, but just in case "honesty is the best policy"
^^ Yeah I know right?
And women aren't stupid, they can always load a question or call you out subtly somehow and try to get you to slip - if they suspect.
Trying to be stealth in conversation is a whole new ball of wax with transitioning I guess.
Well I'd say its about closeness... imo they tend to share a few things, and give the other a feeling of being understood...
concerning your past, one possibility would be to say you didn't like it... and are glad its over... and talk about current subjects...
hugs
Oh, I just talk about inappropriate things, like I always do.
I love talking about men :~) I can do that for hours.
Apart from that, I am openly trans, so that is always a conversation point. I talk with women about what we have in common. Which is a lot!
Quote from: SarahBoo on June 12, 2015, 06:00:02 PM
Oh, I just talk about inappropriate things, like I always do.
I love talking about men :~) I can do that for hours.
Apart from that, I am openly trans, so that is always a conversation point. I talk with women about what we have in common. Which is a lot!
Let me ask you, did you ever sense that their interest in your being openly trans during casual conversation had a soft-transphobia undertone in any way?
Let me explain. A friend might address you by name first, "Sarah how was your date last night?" vs "So.... Sarah how was your date last night?"
You get it? It's like, that trans conversation point is more of a conversational amusement factor for them (softly patronizing) and isn't quite a genuine heartfelt interest. As if your being trans is their entertainment, like if you're not too weird they'll carry you along, but the words fly behind your back with the other gals.
I'm pretty sensitive to these nuances and can usually tell if transphobia is lingering in someones words. It's one way to know if I'm passing or not.
Quote from: Evelyn K on June 12, 2015, 06:23:57 PM
Let me ask you, did you ever sense that their interest in your being openly trans during casual conversation had a soft-transphobia undertone in any way?
No, not at all.
If somebody takes issue with me, they are hardly going to attempt a friendly conversation.
Those who do talk with me and ask questions are genuinely interested, and I am not on guard about going there with them.
I take people at face value, and go with gut feeling. I offer people my trust, not my suspicion.
Quote from: SarahBoo on June 12, 2015, 06:58:36 PM
No, not at all.
If somebody takes issue with me, they are hardly going to attempt a friendly conversation.
Those who do talk with me and ask questions are genuinely interested, and I am not on guard about going there with them.
I take people at face value, and go with gut feeling. I offer people my trust, not my suspicion.
+1That's a good attitude to have Sarah. Heed her words everyone. :)
Well, first of all I'm a shy introvert so I like to hang out with about 2-3 people at a time. :)
And I don't date men and didn't like the sorority scene... which is partly a cop-out but also means I just have some prearranged ways of redirecting the conversation. Periods? Well, I'm in early menopause thanks to needing surgery, let me talk about hot flashes instead (totally true, btw, if I skip over which gonads were removed). That sort of thing. I'll happily admit I was a geeky sort of tomboy. Etc.
Being stealth, I used to think this was a nightmare. I was super nervous first time I went and got my nails done. That's make-or-break right there. But I passed fine, talked about school, clothes, whatever, and otherwise just listened to them and reacted.
Now it's a lot easier for me. I've gained a lot of confidence and my social skills have caught up. My boyfriend and I recently moved to a new apartment and there are sometimes some social gatherings here, largely dominated by the women that work here. But I get along with them just fine so I haven't had any issues. Periods? I get those sometimes (the hormonal aspects) so there are times were another woman and I will both gripe about feeling like crap. Parenting? I plan on having kids and otherwise I grew up with foster babies everywhere all the time so I was practically raised to be a mother and have more experience than most mothers. Non-issue for me. And as far as relationship stuff goes, I have a boyfriend and he's easy to gripe about so... plenty of material there. :P I've also had girlfriends too, which oddly enough makes me either cool with the actual lesbians or a woman with an interesting past to everyone else, lol. Only thing that kinda stresses me out anymore is tweaking my past. Like, I don't go into detail about my ex-girlfriends. I just mention 'oh yeah my ex-girlfriend and I did [whatever] one time' and don't get into how I "used to be a lesbian". Oh, and apparently I used to play softball and was in the girl scouts? News to me, but it's my new truth.. ::) One tip though... learn to talk about diet and exercise and clothes. Those are eeeasy standby topics that most women can relate to. If you can't, it's usually easy enough to feign interest in.
I've never been in a situation like portrayed in these photos. But I try to be nice to everyone and say stuff to get them talking details first. This gives you ammo for continuing the conversation.
A very interesting thread. When I transitioned the first time in mid 80's my next door neighbour , a really nice young woman aged 29 - A marketing Manager with a Software company and I became great friends and she invited me out to dinner one evening with a group of her gorl friends (5) so making me the sixth member. The thing here though was that she had told them I was trans, but that I was living full time, was on HRT and had been working by them for about 5 months as a woman. Naturally they were very curious and a lot of that first diner at a local wine bar and then our at aother of the groups houses was about me, what was it like, how was I finding transitioning, what was good, what was difficult etc etc.
But after that evening my girlfriend next for neighbour drover us both home, she said that when I was jun the toilet, all the girls said they wanted me to be part of the regular group. They met once a month as they just thought I would be great to have around and felt that they could also help me. From that moment onwards I was Judith one of the group. Theuy treated me from then on just as any other woman, although once discussing one pot the girls periods, Katie said well at least Judy yopu don't have to go thru that and they all giggled when I said no not the bleeding, but that I do seem a to get symptoms of PMS which reminds me then I need to be on my Progesterone cycle. It was just normal conversations, but as I think Aleah said how you interact with other women is quite fundamentally different as a Transwoman and somethings that you have to lean. As Magggie (my girlfriend) said - until they get to know try to be quite submissive. They will then be more relaxed with you in their coterie. It was tvery true. I only stopped going when Maggie moved to San Jose with her job from Buckinghamshire we we both lived.
Talk about the modifications to my car usually. To be honest I have never had anyone straight ask me about my period, if they did I'd just say I don't get them.
I find talking to group of girls a lot less awkward than trying to pretend I was a boy in a group of boys.