Every single day, almost all day, I want to be a girl. It depresses me. I think my mind is a girl's mind. I prefer the company of women and want to immerse myself in their world. I love everything about women. I don't feel I fit in with men. It seems like I am "acting". I want to remove the hair from my hands with electrolysis, and probably my face too. Many times I wish I had breasts. I've tried herbal hormones before and sometimes want real hormones.
But, then this also exists. I want to be a girl, but not just any girl. I want to be cute. I want to look 100% like a woman. I don't want to ever be seen as trans post-op. I also have a high sex drive and rich fantasy life. I am the woman during any sexual fantasy, or I am a man submissive to women. All the usual famtasies - forced fem, etc.
I would call myself a fetish crossdresser if it wasn't for my feelings in the first paragraph. I even tried masturbating as much as possible to get rid of feeling fem. It only works for a short time, and the feelings come back within an hour or so.
Could all of this be some complicated fetish? I have some trans feelings but those may not be "real" trans feelings, just a continuation of how my brain has sexualized this. Maybe I'm like those who wish to remain "->-bleeped-<-s"? A third gender?
Honestly, from that description, in my lay opinion you sound like a person definitely under the transgender umbrella, very likely on the binary, that is, seeking a transition to a fully female role.
The sex drive can confuse a person into thinking that it's 'just a fetish', but it really sounds like your seeking sexual release is not WHY you dress, but is incidental to relieving the psychological pressures you feel. That also strikes me as being more of transgender thing than a fetish.
Your best bet would be to sit down with a therapist and have a conversation about these issues. A good therapist will help you clarify your thinking on what's going on, and may be able to point you to some useful solutions you might want to investigate.
When I met with a gender therapist that's the very first question I asked. Is this a fetish, or is this much more and not just a fetish. After spending that first hour digging into details the therapist told me: in her opinion, definitely not a fetish. I am not saying I have your answer as we are all unique, but I did ask exactly the same question.
Three years before my first therapist meeting I had already completed full laser and electrolysis everywhere (yes, everywhere). One of my good childhood memories was spending time with the girls down the street. Although we were in a secluded tree house we didn't play doctor, we were baking cookies with their Easy-Bake oven. I never tried anyone else's clothes without their knowledge - instead, when I was an early teenager I made my own bikini top & bottom from an old set of jeans and gardening twine. Several decades thinking I might have a fetish but it was so much more. It is who I am.
I agree with Michelle - find a really good therapist, and ask them. I am glad I did.
My two childhood transwomen friends were confusing to me, and to themselves, in their way of mixing seemingly fetish with transgender behaviors, such as getting sexually stimulated wearing or touching female underwear, wanting to masturbate while stroking women's clothes, relating exaggerated sexual fantasies, insisting on wearing ultra revealing, sex worker-type clothing with 5-inch spike high heels despite being in their 60s.
I felt embarrassed, but nothing I said persuaded them to dress or behave like ciswomen.
I finally gave up, thinking that things would sort themselves out over the years.
But this forum shows that this sort of over the top sexualized behavior is common even in genuine transwomen.
I agree with Michelle: it sounds to me like you are probably transgender. It is not uncommon for trans people, before they come out to themselves, to fetishize their feelings.
When you think about it, it kind of makes sense. On the one hand, you have these obsessive thoughts about being a woman, because your female brain is calling out to you. On the other hand, you have all that testosterone in your system, and your male parts are going to do what they do when you think about women.
It would definitely be worthwhile to see a gender therapist to help sort out your feelings.
I am very much attracted to women, and love having what I think of as "lesbian" sex with my wife. (I don't like to penetrate her because it reminds me of the male anatomy that I have that I don't like. I always think of myself as a woman when I am in this position with her. I used to have fantasies about women "forcing" me to dress, but I rarely do now. I think these have diminished as I have accepted that it is "okay" for me to want to be feminine--I think the wish to be "forced" was a wish for "permission" from women to be "one of them." I still see "womanhood" as an exclusive club that I do not quite qualify for...if only I had breasts, if only I had..., etc.
I personally think that the whole category of "fetishistic crossdresser" is rather demeaning and is still the medical community looking for a way to stigmatize those of us who want to dress as and identify as feminine and female. There are very complicated reasons why some males are so drawn (from an early age) to soft, silky, frilly fabrics. It goes beyond arousal and sexuality.
I agree with others who have commented that your description sounds like it fits within the transgender continuum (which doesn't mean certain feminine items don't produce some or more sexual arousal--that is conditioning and the testosterone that you do have.) Nancy
We had a friendly discussion recently on proper female attire during different activities. And I wouldn't mind to explain my position of 'skirts only' for me here. Although some tgirls I've met looked good in jeans, and I wouldn't totally discount them (would I actually transition and stop fitting male jeans), but a skirt helps me to hide lack of bottom, and screams 'female' to anyone (thus giving just one more clue to them how to address me). Modern women tend to wear minimal makeup, pants and basic t-shirts. If I do that, I'll look too much male for my liking. Besides, what's the point of the whole transition if not enjoying unparalleled freedom of skirt?
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I'm in therapy too. I wanted to run my thoughts by you as you've been there done that.
Maybe a suitable course of action is to move myself more femme over time. Lose weight, how do I feel. Electrolysis on hands, how do I feel. Shave my legs, how do I feel. Etc.
edit: Or maybe that's just cowardly.
Elkie-T
I am the one who argued that a skirt is not what ciswomen wear when they go camping and would only attract attention, but in your case you just want to feel femme.
I don't have that problem..I'm perceived as female by men despite wearing baggy androgynous male type clothing at all times, seldom combing my hair, never wearing make up or nail polish, and wearing men's slip on sandals.
Yet straight females consistently read me as male and flirt and giggle around me, often sending me love notes. My guess is that it's my bold male behavior that attracts them, even though I'm essentially asexual. Here in Thailand, almost everyone is mixed gender, and bisexual, so nobody cares.
So just do what makes YOU happy.
so much this. I've only begun realizing that it's more than a sexual fetish thing...I feel elated when I am dressed and get to present myself as femaie..which is now more and more..
Sexual fantasies of being a woman are a natural part of being transgender. Sexuality is central to a person's physiology and psychology. If you are a woman living in a man's body you are going to have female fantasies. That just how your sexuality is going to express itself. It's a pretty simple equation.
Back when I used to be a dude and had androgen coursing thru my veins I was in a way controlled/imprisoned by it. Testosterone is a very potent hormone that causes a male to be in a constant state of readiness for a sexual encounter. It is so because in millions of years of evolution the males who are able to perform 24/7 can pass on their genetic material while those who can't don't. Opportunism plays a huge role in human reproductive activity. Over millions of years this has caused human males to always have a heightened sense of libidinousness. The androgen is so strong that it builds up to the point where it requires release and the man must at some point stop what he is doing and submit to it's power. There is really no fighting it. I used to be that way back when I was a dude and after release it always left me feeling uneasy and vaguely unsatisfied and like something was off. It's because I never felt comfortable with a male sexuality. How could I?
Women on the other hand, have much lower levels of androgen which is the hormone that is central to orgasm. If you think about it, a woman has no reproductive need to have an orgasm at all. Many women have many offspring while never, ever even experiencing an orgasm. This was even more true just a couple of human generations ago. While the male reproductive aspect is quite the opposite.
I had a dream last night. In my dream, I was seeing myself like looking in a mirror. Except I was a woman after a complete transition. Not bad looking, but not cute either. I was smiling and the smile was genuine. I don't think it was prophetic, but maybe I was telling myself that my fem side is nothing to fear, whether I am trans or not.
Hi Amanda,
I'm Laurie. All I really want to say is that I could have wrote your post for you as I had lived it. It took me many years to come to the conclusion that I was more than a crossdresser and really a transwoman. Once I did I started transition. It was inevitable.
You will have to make your own decision whether you are or not of course but what you've said sure sounds like me.
Best wishes,
Hugs,
Laurie
I'm doing some sessions with a therapist. I asked for two things, one, self-acceptance, and two, where am I on the gender spectrum. I accept that it's not just a fetish. I guess that means I'm transgendered (but not necessarily transsexual).
My therapist asked me if I wanted a vagina. I said no. I said no because I don't want "me" to have a vagina, the masculine me, the person I am now, no, I don't want it. Maybe not even as a female version of me. I didn't explain my answer, only said no.
I chose That Girl as my avatar because I idolized her as a child. Now, if my therapist asked if I wanted to have a vagina and look like Marlo Thomas, heck yeah, I want that.
I had another dream. I was the female version of myself when young, oh, about 18 years old. It seemed like it was what I was supposed to look like if born female.
What do you think?
Quote from: amandam on July 31, 2017, 02:12:58 AM
My therapist asked me if I wanted a vagina. I said no. ... I didn't explain my answer, only said no.
By not explaining your answer, you made your therapist's work harder. The explanation is what they are going for, not the specific answer. An explanation offers the therapist a window into your thought processes. A simple yes or no shuts down the conversation, and denies them insight that may have helped to clarify your issues.
I would really encourage people to be as open as possible with their therapists. Elaborate on answers. If a topic makes you uncomfortable, investigate why and share what you dig up with the therapist. If you don't know what you think about something, say so, and elaborate on why you have trouble coming up with a clear answer. All of that is useful for the therapist to understand what is going on for you.
A week ago at my first HRT appointment I was asked if I am planning to get GRS. I answered that's the only thing about my transition I am undecided on. (Sorry did I just call it a thing? ;)) I told the endocrinologist I know physical and mental changes will occur, so I shouldn't assume my pre-HRT answer to that particular question will remain accurate.
While I would get aroused from a young age whenever I would crossdress or think about doing so, due to religious upbringing I never masturbated until I was 26 years old(I did it for the first time subconciously in my sleep, nature finds a way).
So masturbating and orgasming was never a motive for dressing up or transitioning for me. I viewed the sexual arousal as simply a side effect. I also have never watched porn. So I am at least one example of someone who does get sexually aroused at the idea, but never used that as the reason. It just comes with the territory.
Quote from: Kendra on July 31, 2017, 07:33:20 AM
A week ago at my first HRT appointment I was asked if I am planning to get GRS. I answered that's the only thing about my transition I am undecided on. (Sorry did I just call it a thing? ;)) I told the endocrinologist I know physical and mental changes will occur, so I shouldn't assume my pre-HRT answer to that particular question will remain accurate.
Quote from: amandam on July 18, 2017, 12:20:22 AM
I'm in therapy too. I wanted to run my thoughts by you as you've been there done that.
Maybe a suitable course of action is to move myself more femme over time. Lose weight, how do I feel. Electrolysis on hands, how do I feel. Shave my legs, how do I feel. Etc.
edit: Or maybe that's just cowardly.
Amanda,
I think this is a smart approach. I went from many of the same thoughts you are having to go forth step by step as you suggest. It is logical not cowardly. One can be fooled by thinking things out in theory. If you actually experience something it will be more real. I went from a mass of doubt to fully transitioning with GCS recently. I watched each and every thing I did and it was right for me, so I went further. Now, I look back and think how tragic it would have been if I had convinced myself this was just a fetish because I had sexual feelings related to it. My current happiness would never have happened. My advice, kick down every door, question every possible misconception, find your right path. Don't let anything stop you, specifically, don't let
you stop you from being happy.
Moni
Strangely after I came to terms with being being in the transgender spectrum a lot of fetishism just melted away
I don't think it is strange, it's just part of the process. ;)
fetish = guilt
early stages of transgender = guilt
When I began to understand and accept who I am the guilt began to vanish.
Tbh friend. I too used to fetishize my feelings from about ages 15-18. And even today i still; harbour deep shame about it. There is one silver lining. I had questioned my gender and wanted to be female before age 15 and after age 18 so that realization helped me. However, those fetish feelings were intense as they helped me cope wit dysphoira and the shame of possibley being ''one of them''. Sometimes, it is a survial thing.
Quote from: markie on July 31, 2017, 09:21:34 AM
Strangely after I came to terms with being being in the transgender spectrum a lot of fetishism just melted away
I think it's too early to tell, but I have been experiencing this in the last couple of weeks. I haven't felt the urge to search for forced fem, etc. memes, porn, etc. Last Saturday I could dress for a couple of hours. I did a lot of searching on the psychology of ->-bleeped-<-, FFS before and after, electrolysis, etc. Near the end of my time, I decided to fulfill my erotic need but it was kind of an afterthought, fulfill my habit. It wasn't the main focus of my mind during my dressing period. And the forced fem, etc. eroticism has minimized somewhat and what has come to the forefront the last few times, is my imaging I'm a woman during sex. I've done that before, but it used to be the "forced" scenarios were dominant in my mind.
Amanda,
I can't say if you are similar to me or not, but this is how I experienced the place you find yourself now. I had strong feelings that I wanted to be a woman, but when I couldn't live as a woman, or present as a woman, or even tell anyone about what I thought was the true me, it was very frustrating. Add to that I had a normal male sex drive. So, what did that frustration look like. Dressing was something I was driven to do. It was pleasant and comfortable but unsatisfying and guilt producing. Why? Well, it was only a representation of what I really wanted, a paper image and not the real thing which is what I needed. This was stressful because you sit there thinking, "I am indulging in this thing that should make me happy and it doesn't. WTF?" On top of that you have the sex drive with all these fantasies that could be considered weird (back then.) One common fantasy was someone or something feminizing me forcefully. When you consider the guilt I had about all this, it makes perfect sense. After all, I got to be female and it wasn't my fault, someone did it to me. No guilt, awesome! So many crazy sexual thoughts came out of frustration at not being able to be who I needed to be. I see so many people think, "If I am truly trans, why do I have all these sexual fantasies about it? It must be a fetish!" Well, I think, many times for trans folks their normal sex drive is squeezed and distorted because of the unnatural situation of having to live a life that doesn't fit. I think this causes so much anxiety for new folks trying to figure themselves out. Maybe it helps to know that there is no ideal trans scenario. So many have these confusing thoughts. If you are or aren't trans, it is something for you to figure out. Just don't let the fact that you have sexual fantasies make you think you are not genuine. I like your idea of trying things and seeing how it makes you feel. That is so smart. If I had convinced myself I was a fetishist, I would not have found my truth. Explore.
Moni
I don't see fetish as bad and for the most part I don't feel guilt over them but then I started out pretty kinky. I'm not saying I didn't feel shame at various steps along the way but that was more about others judging me, family, friends, wife. As most here have said my dysphoria first made itself known as fetish and after many years of hiding my desires even from myself because my partner not only didn't share my interests but she felt free to castigate me for having the ones I did.
Today I'm lucky enough to live in a city that's mostly populated open minded people and so finding like minded friends isn't hard. My partner knows all of my fantasies and is glad to share in the ones she shares and to have me engage the (very few) she doesn't enjoy with others.
Hrt changed a little, mostly it's taken the edge and urgency away, leaving deeper pleasure. There is porn I am less attracted to now and I'm more inclined to enjoy lesbian scenes, but then it's hard to find any of that that's well or realistically produced given as that market is so driven by male clientele who don't enjoy seeing realistic lesbian sex.
I'm just starting on my journey of working out my gender issues, so please pardon anything I say that might seem ignorant (I have a lot to learn!).
I was reading the original post, and have seen many other posts on this forum that seem to have a focus on looking a certain way or wearing certain types of clothing.
Here is my question: if you end up transitioning completely to female and find that you don't end up looking the way you hoped for, would it crush you? The clothes you wanted to wear are really unflattering on your figure; would you be crushed? This is a serious question I have, I am not trying to make an argument with anyone. It is a question I brought up with my therapist this week when discussing different goals and expectations. I wondered out loud what if I get to where I think I want to be and it's not everything I hoped it would be? Would I want to give up or keep going?
Anyhow, just wondering if anyone experienced a reality shock at some point in or after transition and how you dealt with it.
I think you asked an excellent question, not ignorant at all. Things we can learn from you.
Right now I'm having a really hard time with my MTF voice which isn't terribly low, but - having started formal voice training I now realize just how badly my voice misses the mark. I am going to try my best to adjust, I don't tend to give up easily - but some physical limitations are difficult or impractical to overcome. Yeah I know there is VFS (and very few surgeons with consistently good results) but that isn't an automatic answer. I bet very few of us thought about our voice when we were in fetish mode.
Quote from: WhatAmI? on August 12, 2017, 12:38:24 PMwhat if I get to where I think I want to be and it's not everything I hoped it would be?
[cue Rolling Stones...] You can't always get what you want.
That's just a fact of life, for everything, not just for transitioning. The fully transitioned me may not be everything I wanted, but it will be a lot closer than the pre-transition me. That sure wasn't eveything I had hoped for.
Quote from: Kendra on August 12, 2017, 01:06:12 PM
I think you asked an excellent question, not ignorant at all. Things we can learn from you.
Right now I'm having a really hard time with my MTF voice which isn't terribly low, but - having started formal voice training I now realize just how badly my voice misses the mark. I am going to try my best to adjust, I don't tend to give up easily - but some physical limitations are difficult or impractical to overcome. Yeah I know there is VFS (and very few surgeons with consistently good results) but that isn't an automatic answer. I bet very few of us thought about our voice when we were in fetish mode.
Thank you for the reply. It's nice to hear from someone further down the road who can give real life examples. I don't think appearance or clothing rank very high on my list of concerns, but they seem to be common topics.
I have the same questions. Thank God I managed to afford removing my tattoos. I put on weight up high in the torso, don't really grow a belly. But, this makes me look more manly. I've always hated that. I stopped lifting. Next thing is to lose weight. I guess you don't know until you try.
Quote from: WhatAmI? on August 12, 2017, 12:38:24 PM
I wondered out loud what if I get to where I think I want to be and it's not everything I hoped it would be? Would I want to give up or keep going?
If you give up, what will you do with the feelings that led to you to a complete transition to begin with? Just have them fester and consume you?
Quote from: WhatAmI? on August 12, 2017, 12:38:24 PM
Here is my question: if you end up transitioning completely to female and find that you don't end up looking the way you hoped for, would it crush you? The clothes you wanted to wear are really unflattering on your figure; would you be crushed? This is a serious question I have, I am not trying to make an argument with anyone. It is a question I brought up with my therapist this week when discussing different goals and expectations. I wondered out loud what if I get to where I think I want to be and it's not everything I hoped it would be? Would I want to give up or keep going?
There's some truth to the British approach of running 2 years of life experience test without even help of hormones. You should be comfortable in your presentation as you are, hormones and FFS are supplemental, but cannot change major physical characteristics (such as height, foot and hand size, and to a lesser degree body frame and weight) and you must be comfortable navigating day to day life still having those. If you success in transition is based on being 100% stealth, you're piling odds against you big time
To me, there's various levels of wishes/desire, loss, and grieving. I don't know if I will ever give up the wish that I was born a genetic female, and I grieve that loss frequently. Similarly, I know that I will never be petite or have the feminine shape that I wish was me. And, since I've decided (for now anyway--never say never) that I am not transitioning (to save my marriage amongst other reasons), I've given up the wish of ever having real breasts or a vagina. I still wish, I still feel the loss for what I will never have. Deciding what is enough, and our own personal resolutions/compromises/sacrifices is very, very personal. No one's journey is the same as another's. I agree, though, that this question about being satisfied is extremely important! Why go through all the pain if only to still lament the result. You will still be imperfect. Even if/when we transition, we still missed growing up as girls and living much of our adult lives as women.
I get aroused only by imagining in a woman making love to a man. It's very intense.
And the dysphoria never goes away on climax. I usually get a bit weepy though
Quote from: NancyBalik on August 13, 2017, 06:26:10 AM
Deciding what is enough, and our own personal resolutions/compromises/sacrifices is very, very personal. No one's journey is the same as another's. I agree, though, that this question about being satisfied is extremely important! Why go through all the pain if only to still lament the result. You will still be imperfect. Even if/when we transition, we still missed growing up as girls and living much of our adult lives as women.
So Nancy I respect the choices you have made. I can offer you the perspective from someone who has transitioned and lamented the girlhood that never was. You are right it isn't perfect. Parts can still be sad. It is hard sometimes to be satisfied with reality versus the image you have of how you should have been born. Then there is the flip side that
for me makes it all worth it. I don't live in the past. I live in the present and will live in the future (hopefully.) That life will be one where I am perceived as who I am, a female person. I pinch myself sometimes because after all theses years, it is finally real, and amazing. I don't say this to question what you are saying for yourself. I just want to say that for some it is way worth it even if not perfect.
Quote from: elkie-t on August 12, 2017, 09:46:38 PM
There's some truth to the British approach of running 2 years of life experience test without even help of hormones. You should be comfortable in your presentation as you are, hormones and FFS are supplemental, but cannot change major physical characteristics (such as height, foot and hand size, and to a lesser degree body frame and weight) and you must be comfortable navigating day to day life still having those. If you success in transition is based on being 100% stealth, you're piling odds against you big time
Elkie, transition is tough. I don't think making it as tough as possible serves any weeding out purpose. It just creates a lot of unnecessary pain. After all isn't being trans hard enough as it is? I had FFS and hormones with no idea of going stealth. You are right, we live with certain male features and that is something to come to terms with. I think whatever positive things you can find to do at any point, more power to you.
Moni
I think Moni hit the nail square on the head. It sums up quite well the shame and guilt we have about being trans. No sane person wants to be trans. A fetishistic TV is a far more comfortable place. Especially back when you had/have raging hormones.
I'm 6ft tall and a balding fat kid at 14. Still locked away in complete secrecy I was able to "escape" into that fantasy of being a pretty girl, if only briefly. Then pile on the shame and guilt. In later years after my two utter transition experiment failures the sexual element was no longer a prime motivator, just the safety relief. Followed by piling on more shame and guilt for just having T driven urges and falling back on about the only masturbation method that works.
Just as none of wanted to be trans, I doubt any of us wanted to be but-ugly and trans. Many times the choice comes down to being trans & but-ugly, or dead. More often there is the reality choice of being trans, finding greater happiness in really accepting yourself for who and what you are including the shortcomings, or keeping up the fight/insanity of hoping this time doing all the same old stuff that didn't work before will stop the GD this time.
I of course have a "Wish List" of things I'd like improved about myself and my body. As a former fatty I have many body image issues. Far less so today thanks to really taking on the Trans-Beast and HRT. I doubt a BA, some lipo, or a tummy-tuck makes me any different from the average cis-female. However, I don't need them in order to be able to take that last look in the full length mirror before leaving the house and feeling great about myself. Again not any different from the average cis-female
This whole thread. I share in this same fear still and sometimes have to talk myself down after getting riled up, worrying that I'm not a "real" trans. At least for me, almost all the fetishistic have started to go away as I've become more accepting of myself. They literally just do not interest me anymore; it was an outlet for other feelings and I didn't even realize it when I was closeted and unaccepting of myself.
Talk with someone. Or even talk with yourself. Dig deeper into your thoughts. Find the true rationale as you recognize it. Once you know your mind, someone can relate and you can figure out where to go from there.
Isn't it ironic that the very thing that makes us male, i.e. testosterone, also drives us to express our femininity in testosterone-fueled sex fantasies about wanting to be a woman, which leads us to desire to transition to female? In other words, that which makes us male also compels us to become female.