I have some questions and concerns for folks who would be so kind as to maybe help me out here. I have been on MTF hormones for just over a year, but I still do not "pass." I get sir'd all the time and it's heartbreaking, and part of that is my fault because I do not dress particularly feminine out of fear of being harassed or assaulted. I would dress if I saw in my face one who could pass, but sadly I do not.
ONE YEAR: That long and I still don't pass. If after a year I do not pass is it all pretty much just a pipe dream? One year seems to be what everyone goes by. Is there anyone out there who ended up passing, but took longer than a year to do it (barring ffs)?
One concern I have is for the first few months of that year I was on low doses of hormones as my endo was pretty careful ramping me up too quickly, so do I count those first few months of low dose?
I have recently been moved to injections (from pills) once per week, will one see more feminine physical characteristics emerge while on injections?
I often hear that confidence plays a big role in passing. What are some good examples of this?
My apologies if this comes off as an interrogation, but I have a lot of concerns and appreciate the help.
Every cis woman can pass either so you're not alone baby girl
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
I am also at the one year mark and in the same boat you are. Unless I put extra effort in (makeup, dress) I rarely pass. I have noticed that a more feminine presentation certainly helps. The more gender clues I can give, the better people are about getting it right. But even that is no guarantee: A few weeks ago I stood in a deli in skirt, makeup and boots and still have been addressed as Sir.
I am less worried about people I have known for a long time. It is a tough change, I get it. But day to day I was hoping for more.
There are many days where I am strong enough to say I am a woman and I don't care. I do celebrate the unexpected passing. Besides that it means waiting a bit longer. If I still do not pass better at my two year mark, then I'll have to look into FFS.
Overall, passing has gotten better over time.
I know part of my problem is that I am on a medication which counteracts Estrogen, so my levels are generally on the lower end. Age plays another role.
I have not switched how I take Estradiol so I cannot comment on the effect of injections. In general you should see increased levels of Estrogen.
Do not give up! Give the injections some time. See if you can change your presentation to be more feminine:-)
One year is not enough for everyone sweetie. I was full time before a year and did not pass all the time. Soooooo much goes into this and hormones is just a part of it.
How's your voice?
Done any hair removal yet?
How is your presentation?
This is work for most of us. It is no longer work for me but I've put in a lot of time to make sure that all of the little things as well as the big say female.
Three years and my physical appearance is still changing, it's not over for you yet. Patience. 😁
Quote from: sarah1972 on December 28, 2017, 03:24:13 PM
I am also at the one year mark and in the same boat you are. Unless I put extra effort in (makeup, dress) I rarely pass. I have noticed that a more feminine presentation certainly helps. The more gender clues I can give, the better people are about getting it right. But even that is no guarantee: A few weeks ago I stood in a deli in skirt, makeup and boots and still have been addressed as Sir.
I am less worried about people I have known for a long time. It is a tough change, I get it. But day to day I was hoping for more.
There are many days where I am strong enough to say I am a woman and I don't care. I do celebrate the unexpected passing. Besides that it means waiting a bit longer. If I still do not pass better at my two year mark, then I'll have to look into FFS.
Overall, passing has gotten better over time.
I know part of my problem is that I am on a medication which counteracts Estrogen, so my levels are generally on the lower end. Age plays another role.
I have not switched how I take Estradiol so I cannot comment on the effect of injections. In general you should see increased levels of Estrogen.
Do not give up! Give the injections some time. See if you can change your presentation to be more feminine:-)
I can sorta relate. I am 35 and started hormones at 34 years old. That feels so old for this because it feels like I have just missed out on so much. Plus I am tall, 6' on the money. I don't know what to do. Gender dysphoria has messed me up so much that even at this age I have never held a job for over six months, ever. Never once. I am on SSI and everything. I actually still live at home and never was able to live on my own. I just feel lost and not passing feels like just another
Sorry for being just another sad trans girl, but I just like don't know.
What can someone like me do to make a living? I live near a big, liberal city but I have no degree, no experience, and no real skills. Even a lot of progressive people will look at me, a tall, non-passable trans woman with an adam's apple and turn me away.
I try so hard to stay positive, but then it's like reality slaps me in the face.
Passing is about more than the changes that hormones can make. Passing is about, yes, the physical changes, but also about your dress, grooming, voice, walk, and mannerisms.
There are lots of cis women who are uglier than me, who have smaller boobs than me, but who pass effortlessly, because they have all the other characteristics perfectly. So if I don't pass, I can't blame the HRT. I don't pass on close scrutiny - my voice is certainly clockable - but in a crowd, I don't attract any attention. I am just another woman who won't make the cover of a beauty magazine.
Yes, I think passing is all about confidence. I am not at all self-conscious about being trans. Which is interesting for me, because I was never self-confident as a man. But I am happy with who I am. I dress well, I wear a nice wig, I don't usually wear makeup because I think women my age (63) tend to look better without it, I make an effort with my voice to sound plausible, and I walk into stores and restaurants like I belong there, which I do. The self-confidence is almost like, "I dare you to clock me."
Where did the confidence come from? It came from doing it. I spent one day as myself in a city where I am not known, just being me, "faking it till I made it." That day was life-changing for me.
Quote from: FinallyMichelle on December 28, 2017, 03:45:33 PM
One year is not enough for everyone sweetie. I was full time before a year and did not pass all the time. Soooooo much goes into this and hormones is just a part of it.
How's your voice?
Done any hair removal yet?
How is your presentation?
This is work for most of us. It is no longer work for me but I've put in a lot of time to make sure that all of the little things as well as the big say female.
Three years and my physical appearance is still changing, it's not over for you yet. Patience. 😁
You wrote that as I was writing my previous response. Sorry I missed you.
My voice is "okay." The problem there is that it's hard for me to maintain it for any length of time. Like more than 10-15 minutes and I get hoarse. Moreover, I cannot laugh, whisper or yell with a good feminine voice.
I am doing laser. I am a twoc and have been using "Candela Gentle Yag." I have been to four treatments and am getting my fifth early next month. I never had much facial hair to begin with, but I still need a few treatments. I plan to move top electro eventually but don't know of any good places that are friendly to trans women.
My presentation is such that people just think I am a gay man. It's kinda funny in a way, but in a way it really bears down on me. I guess sometimes I just try to laugh away the stress.
Thanks for the kind words.
By the way, SHadowSister, I notice that you are new here.
Welcome to Susan's!
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Quote from: KathyLauren on December 28, 2017, 04:00:50 PM
Passing is about more than the changes that hormones can make. Passing is about, yes, the physical changes, but also about your dress, grooming, voice, walk, and mannerisms.
There are lots of cis women who are uglier than me, who have smaller boobs than me, but who pass effortlessly, because they have all the other characteristics perfectly. So if I don't pass, I can't blame the HRT. I don't pass on close scrutiny - my voice is certainly clockable - but in a crowd, I don't attract any attention. I am just another woman who won't make the cover of a beauty magazine.
Yes, I think passing is all about confidence. I am not at all self-conscious about being trans. Which is interesting for me, because I was never self-confident as a man. But I am happy with who I am. I dress well, I wear a nice wig, I don't usually wear makeup because I think women my age (63) tend to look better without it, I make an effort with my voice to sound plausible, and I walk into stores and restaurants like I belong there, which I do. The self-confidence is almost like, "I dare you to clock me."
Where did the confidence come from? It came from doing it. I spent one day as myself in a city where I am not known, just being me, "faking it till I made it." That day was life-changing for me.
I wish so much that I could just dress but it's hard for me. Here's why:
First and foremost I am really afraid of being hurt in public. I mean that more than physically because I have heard stories of people being spit at, ridiculed, cigarettes flicked their way or otherwise verbally abused.
I will admit something that I can only with the anonymity of the internet: I am not at all a strong person. I am weak. I have no one here to help me become stronger.
I live in a house with some old, conservative "Christians" and I am passively-aggressively attacked. For instance my father, who takes care of me, accepts my trans status and claims he wont kick me out. Heck he's even been to my gender therapist and endo with me and asks me "friendly" questions, but at the same time he says things like "People wont see that you're 'turning into a woman,' will they?" Dammit, I cannot even paint my nails here.
I am not suicidal, but holy hell, I can see why many are.
I have nowhere to go, I am broke. I have no respectable amount of money and so like many poor people I am oppressed. It's like I am a slave and so remaining confident or gaining it is like one of the hardest things to do.
Sorry to whine, but I just wanna vent a bit.
Also Thank You KathyLauren for the introduction.
Well dang... Your question is difficult to answer. I started at 35 and I am 5' 11". 2 years later and I get the occasional ma'am while out in men's clothing. I get quite a few Sir's in women's clothing. I don't believe that I look feminine in the least. However, everyone that I talk to say that I'm extremely pretty. So It's difficult to say... I have seen my face for 37 years and have always seen myself as very masculine. From what I was told at the doctor's office, I have extremely feminine features... and a weak chin. ::) So it's all a matter of perspective. 35 years of seeing your reflection and saying male will skew anyone's perspective. I got turned down for facial feminization surgery. The surgeon said he wouldn't touch my face. So you might not be as far off as you think.
That being said, changes are slower in general for older transitioners. I am still getting slow and steady changes after 2 years. I wouldn't hold any stock in that 1-year wives tale. It is bunk... You can see changes for at least the next few years. Some of the girls here are still getting changes after 6 and 8 years.
I totally get the whole conservative aggravation. My family is that way and they still call me Joshua. They have no interest in knowing my preferred name. Nor am I allowed to be around them with nail polish, makeup, or women's clothing (god forbid!). Speaking in a trained voice is just too much for them as well. There is not much you can do other than just be yourself. Be willing to flex on things that you care less about and stay firm and immovable on what you know in your heart to be important to you. Some compromise on both your parts will go a long way.
If you're in the states Medicaid offers FFS, Breast Augmentation, Gender Reassignment, etc... I'm certain there is a way to finagle what you need out of the system... Where there's a will there's a way! There are even foundations that will fund the essentials. Don't be so quick to discount anything as being out of reach. Stay positive! You've come this far... :)
Quote from: Harley Quinn on December 28, 2017, 05:16:22 PM
Well dang... Your question is difficult to answer. I started at 35 and I am 5' 11". 2 years later and I get the occasional ma'am while out in men's clothing. I get quite a few Sir's in women's clothing. I don't believe that I look feminine in the least. However, everyone that I talk to say that I'm extremely pretty. So It's difficult to say... I have seen my face for 37 years and have always seen myself as very masculine. From what I was told at the doctor's office, I have extremely feminine features... and a weak chin. ::) So it's all a matter of perspective. 35 years of seeing your reflection and saying male will skew anyone's perspective. I got turned down for facial feminization surgery. The surgeon said he wouldn't touch my face. So you might not be as far off as you think.
That being said, changes are slower in general for older transitioners. I am still getting slow and steady changes after 2 years. I wouldn't hold any stock in that 1-year wives tale. It is bunk... You can see changes for at least the next few years. Some of the girls here are still getting changes after 6 and 8 years.
I totally get the whole conservative aggravation. My family is that way and they still call me Joshua. They have no interest in knowing my preferred name. Nor am I allowed to be around them with nail polish, makeup, or women's clothing (god forbid!). Speaking in a trained voice is just too much for them as well. There is not much you can do other than just be yourself. Be willing to flex on things that you care less about and stay firm and immovable on what you know in your heart to be important to you. Some compromise on both your parts will go a long way.
If you're in the states Medicaid offers FFS, Breast Augmentation, Gender Reassignment, etc... I'm certain there is a way to finagle what you need out of the system... Where there's a will there's a way! There are even foundations that will fund the essentials. Don't be so quick to discount anything as being out of reach. Stay positive! You've come this far... :)
Thank you for that awesome response.
I am on Medicaid and have insurance through my state (sorry to not be too detailed, I'd rather retain some privacy because someone lurking on could have bad intentions). They have a person who works with their transgender members and she went ahead and let me know what my plan covers. I learned from her that they cover bottom surgery (vaginoplasty), adam's apple reduction (tracheal shave), and top surgery (aka "boob job" I forget the technical name hehe) but sadly they do not cover ffs. I tell you, how I wish they did. I'd probably give up all the others to have a passable face as then I'd be able to better function. I went to a focus group once and explained that to them. Anyhow, I researched the doctor they used, her name is Kathy Rumer, and found that she is generally not well-received in the trans community *gulp*. They used to use Meltzer, who is supposedly one of the best but sadly I missed that train.
It feels good to know that there can still be changes after the one year mark. I looked at some timelines and saw people who after a year had amazing results but was discouraged when looking in the mirror that I didn't see anything even close to approaching that.
I Thank You for you post as reading it helped me to feel better and gave me some hope that as I continue to laboriously work through my transition that there is still room for things to improve.
Hello ShawdowSister!
Welcome aboard sister!... I'm sorry you are feeling a bit discouraged right now with this part of the journey...
I am planning on writing extensively on the subject of "passing" in the near future... Not "how to" stuff but, rather, our perspectives on it and the weight we give it in relation to our overall happiness and satisfaction during and post transition... I have seen so much anguish and suffering over the years that is unneeded, caused when passing becomes the focus above all else...
There are perspectives to all things dear sister!...You seem to be attaching a lot of fears right now to this part of the process and I would like you to read these thoughts on the role of fear in all this... There may be some new perspectives you haven't yet considered
https://www.susans.org/forums/index.php/topic,230730.0.html
Most of us go into the process of transition hoping and believing we will come to a point where most of the people we encounter will see us as female... it is a fine goal that most of us share
Passing to some, means 100% of the people we encounter will see us as a cis-woman 100% of the time... That is a very high bar indeed and often a recipe for misery if you see that as your only chance for happiness... Most of us have shortfalls of one kind or another that make hitting that mark difficult but, we find during the process, that we are happy, satisfied and complete without hitting the precise goals we went into transition with...
My definition of passing has come to mean... That most people I encounter see me as female... The cis-female part matters not... Although this is my definition of it... The weight that I assign passing, to my overall level of happiness is far less than I had originally envisioned.... For the most part I have thrown it out the window and there is liberation and freedom in that for me...
We can never control how other see us and trying to is a losing game... One hole in our presentation can be the source of utter misery to us, or...just what it is... Something about ourself we would like to be a little different than it is and nothing more...
The place I am at now, in my mind, may be quite different from where many chose to be and want for themselves but, at this point... If people I encounter see me as a cis-woman...Great!...
( but I won't lie to achieve that).... If they see me as a female transwoman ( my truth)... Great!!!!.... And, If they see me as a pathetic middle aged, surgically mutilated man in women's clothes... Not quite as great but nothing I can't deal with because my happiness and sense of self is mine... I do not give the power to control those things to them...
BTW... I am 56 and 4+ years in to HRT... still seeing positive changes all the time!
All will be well little sister!!! 😀
Onward we go!!!
Ashley 😀❤️🌻
A few thoughts:
First, while it feels good to be gendered by others in a way that matches your identity, few people pass in the sense of not being recognized as trans. I am usually (90+% of the time) referred to with feminine pronouns, but I think I can fairly easy be recognized that I am trans if the observer is observant. Many people are not observant, others, seeing how I present myself (dress, hair, makeup, nails, etc) gender me female because it is rather obvious that this is what I want, and most people are kind. There are people who are so convincingly female in their appearance and expression that they are not even recognizably trans. Some of this owes to effort on their part, but relatively more owes to genetics and age at the time of transition. Passing in that sense is a privilege, not an expected outcome.
The worst part about being concerned about passing is that you allow someone else's reaction to define you. If I get called sir because I'm presenting in very masculine attire, that's really my own fault. If I get called sir by someone who made an honest mistake, it doesn't feel good, but I ought to be able to get past that. If I get called sir by someone who definitely knows better, I ought to recognize that person as a troll, and not give them power over my life. If, instead of fixating on passing, I focus on self-acceptance, I value myself regardless of public reaction.
I think that's the better goal. Welcome to Susan's.
Quote from: tgirlamc on December 28, 2017, 06:07:19 PM
Hello ShawdowSister!
Welcome aboard sister!... I'm sorry you are feeling a bit discouraged right now with this part of the journey...
I am planning on writing extensively on the subject of "passing" in the near future... Not "how to" stuff but, rather, our perspectives on it and the weight we give it in relation to our overall happiness and satisfaction during and post transition... I have seen so much anguish and suffering over the years that is unneeded, caused when passing becomes the focus above all else...
There are perspectives to all things dear sister!...You seem to be attaching a lot of fears right now to this part of the process and I would like you to read these thoughts on the role of fear in all this... There may be some new perspectives you haven't yet considered
https://www.susans.org/forums/index.php/topic,230730.0.html
Most of us go into the process of transition hoping and believing we will come to a point where most of the people we encounter will see us as female... it is a fine goal that most of us share
Passing to some, means 100% of the people we encounter will see us as a cis-woman 100% of the time... That is a very high bar indeed and often a recipe for misery if you see that as your only chance for happiness... Most of us have shortfalls of one kind or another that make hitting that mark difficult but, we find during the process, that we are happy, satisfied and complete without hitting the precise goals we went into transition with...
My definition of passing has come to mean... That most people I encounter see me as female... The cis-female part matters not... Although this is my definition of it... The weight that I assign passing, to my overall level of happiness is far less than I had originally envisioned.... For the most part I have thrown it out the window and there is liberation and freedom in that for me...
We can never control how other see us and trying to is a losing game... One hole in our presentation can be the source of utter misery or just what it is... Something about ourself we would like to be a little different than it is and nothing more...
The place I am at now, in my mind, may be quite different from where many chose to be and want for themselves but, at this point... If people I encounter see me as a cis-woman...Great!...
( but I won't lie to achieve that).... If they see me as a female transwoman ( my truth)... Great!!!!.... And, If they see me as a pathetic middle aged, surgically mutilated man in women's clothes... Not quite as great but nothing I can't deal with because my happiness and sense of self is mine... I do not give the power to control those things to them...
BTW... I am 56 and 4+ years in to HRT... still seeing positive changes all the time!
All will be well little sister!!! 😀
Onward we go!!!
Ashley 😀❤️🌻
Thank You very much.
Fear is a big thing for me and admittedly I am ruled by it. I'll write about it here.
Above all I fear being killed. I don't do any kind of partying or sex work and I am not on the dating scene, but I do still have to sometimes go outside and I am really worried about someone shooting or stabbing me. Not to take anything away from anyone else here because oppression is something that strikes deeply at most, if not all of us, yet when I hear of another murdered trans woman I can almost bet my bottom dollar when I look at her she will be a Black or Latina woman just like me. I read some much about how all trans men and trans women suffer at the hands of oppressors, but then almost without fail see "...and trans women of color get it the worst." It's so crushing on the mind, body, and soul. I am literally scared to get a boob job because I worry if I get shot or stabbed my implant(s) will deflate and I'll be laughed at even more. I wish people who hated us and who fueled that hate through their "non politically correct" "jokes" and whatnot would just for a moment let something like that sink in: I am as prepared for death as a soldier deployed in Afghanistan or Iraq, and from what I hear it's no exaggeration as the mortality rate of folks like is not so far off from those on such deployments. These people, give them but a day in the trans woman's shoes and they'll emerge from that experience with fear on their face, for this experience is like a battle.
In an ideal world, girl, I swear I'd just throw on my nice women's jeans, my Uggs, and a nice, cute coat, then do my hair and just be an obvious woman with a history of being trans, but while the people here may be "liberal" there is a very, very small but dangerous minority that makes it to where, I feel, my fear is warranted. To take the gloves off and write bluntly: I live among black people and unfortunately many of them are extremely transphobic, so it makes a situation that even though I am in a northern, liberal ("blue state") area, there are some who make it to where it can be as dangerous as parts of the Bible Belt.
Please do not think I am at all trying to discount anything you have said. I read your post and what you linked and enjoyed it. It's really good the things you say and you add a nice intellectual take on it that I can appreciate. What I write in response is expressing to you what I experience here on the ground to hopefully lend you further insight into the world of another trans woman.
Quote from: TinaVane on December 28, 2017, 03:21:24 PM
Every cis woman can pass either so you're not alone baby girl
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Sorry I missed your post! I feel bad if I cannot respond to all of them, lol. Thank You for the kind words. In a way I feel guilty for gaining some sense of comfort that there are others who are going through tough times with me but at the same time it feels good because it's like Sisters together going through a tough ordeal, like someone is with me fighting in the pits.
Quote from: rmaddy on December 28, 2017, 06:45:59 PM
A few thoughts:
First, while it feels good to be gendered by others in a way that matches your identity, few people pass in the sense of not being recognized as trans. I am usually (90+% of the time) referred to with feminine pronouns, but I think I can fairly easy be recognized that I am trans if the observer is observant. Many people are not observant, others, seeing how I present myself (dress, hair, makeup, nails, etc) gender me female because it is rather obvious that this is what I want, and most people are kind. There are people who are so convincingly female in their appearance and expression that they are not even recognizably trans. Some of this owes to effort on their part, but relatively more owes to genetics and age at the time of transition. Passing in that sense is a privilege, not an expected outcome.
The worst part about being concerned about passing is that you allow someone else's reaction to define you. If I get called sir because I'm presenting in very masculine attire, that's really my own fault. If I get called sir by someone who made an honest mistake, it doesn't feel good, but I ought to be able to get past that. If I get called sir by someone who definitely knows better, I ought to recognize that person as a troll, and not give them power over my life. If, instead of fixating on passing, I focus on self-acceptance, I value myself regardless of public reaction.
I think that's the better goal. Welcome to Susan's.
Gosh I envy you, I wish I could have confidence like that.
I will make it a new years goal to try to display confidence like yours and others here, which is in part why I'm here as the new year approaches. To get that confidence though seems so very hard to do! I just want some strong people to talk with and I am getting it here. Heck, even though my sister helps me a lot, and bless her heart, her and her hubby does not know these trans issues. My sis is so great, but she is crazy busy and it's hard for her to understand trans specific issues.
I apologize if I cannot personally respond to everyone, I did not expect so many awesome responses! Still I hope everyone does know I am reading every single word you write.
Hey Little Sister!
Geography and our immediate surroundings are indeed amongst the considerations we face... I am fortunate that here in California, the percentage of people in my immediate environment that would seek to go out of their way to do me harm is probably quite low!
For you, I will say... where there is a will there is a way... if you don't feel safe there find resources to relocate... I know your financial resources are wanting right now but find a way around it... local diversity centers may offer job prospects and training opportunities... Out here, just north in Silicon Valley there is Transcode, which helps train trans folks to do programming code... Think big to get big results... hold on to the appropriate amount of fear but don't let fear call all the shots.... Your life is for you to live and it is what you make it to be.... you have landed in a very good spot here and there are likely girls here close to you geographically... Reach out to us and let us know how to help!! I am always around and message me absolutely anytime you think I could be of help along the way!!!!
Onward we go little sister... together!
Ashley 😀❤️
Quote from: Shadowsister on December 28, 2017, 07:34:28 PM
Gosh I envy you, I wish I could have confidence like that.
It's not so much confidence as a strategy. I certainly care how I appear to the world, and I have to remind myself from time to time not to be discouraged what others think and say.
Here's another strategy that I just fell into over time. I used to stand in front of the mirror and take note of how tall I was, or how deep my eyes were set, or that my hips were missing or my arms too long. My attention was on all the ways in which I didn't feel feminine. Getting ready time became a sort of argument that I would lose with my reflection every morning. I knew that I should be kinder to myself, but I didn't know how. Eventually I just started looking myself in the eye and smiling, as if I were meeting a friend at a party. I smile and whisper, "Hey, girl." I actually, audibly say it. I watch my face express how happy I am to see her again. It sounds really strange when I describe it, but I really feel that way now.
My body has changed over time, and that is really nice, but the biggest change was on the inside. I'm not a very positive person honestly, but I know how to treat a friend. Maybe there is something in that approach that you can use.
Quote from: tgirlamc on December 28, 2017, 08:01:29 PM
Hey Little Sister!
Geography and our immediate surroundings are indeed amongst the considerations we face... I am fortunate that here in California, the percentage of people in my immediate environment that would seek to go out of their way to do me harm is probably quite low!
For you, I will say... where there is a will there is a way... if you don't feel safe there find resources to relocate... I know your financial resources are wanting right now but find a way around it... local diversity centers may offer job prospects and training opportunities... Out here, just north in Silicon Valley there is Transcode, which helps train trans folks to do programming code... Think big to get big results... hold on to the appropriate amount of fear but don't let fear call all the shots.... Your life is for you to live and it is what you make it to be.... you have landed in a very good spot here and there are likely girls here close to you geographically... Reach out to us and let us know how to help!! I am always around and message me absolutely anytime you think I could be of help along the way!!!!
Onward we go little sister... together!
Ashley 😀❤️
Wow, I can't accurately convey how much I appreciate how much you're helping me here.
I am going to be a straight shooter here and I am going to do it loud and clear in the open so that anyone else who cares to offer insight may do so and that also so there is a record of it for people who may have similar struggles to me.
Before going on, I ask a massive favor of you, or anyone really, and it is this: I know in our community we deal with so much hatred that we sometimes focus too much on what's positive and sometimes ignore what's realistic. Please, I beg the reader, do not take that as a slight against your honesty or character, for I know in such cases your intent is good. Knowing that, I ask here that you all be raw with me, give it to me straight! Give me some insight as to how this world really works in the job market and how things are out there in the world. I get out, I have some experience the world by virtue of living life, but I am mostly a shut in and I have much to learn, things that many have learned in their earlier years. I respect the knowledge and wisdom of all here. Please help with all that in mind.
Okay here it is
About employment, I used to be married and when I was those years were really crazy for me. My wife and I ended up being fools and we managed to catch a felony conviction for grand theft, which technically is known as a crime of moral terpitude. Those are very bad. Without getting too personal, we stole from the government. We stole a substantial amount of money, to be honest. Suffuce to say we were for a while making about as much as accomplished surgeons (no exaggeration, we did the math). Angered at our cleverness, the courts engineered our conviction in a way that without a pardon from the governor of this state expungement is not at all possible. I have talked to multiple lawyers on this and even some were like "Damn, they really made sure this was going to stick." And even still a pardon is not likely as since the time of the crime I have not really made much of myself, quite the contrary in fact, as I have had a divorce, been on welfare, and have not had any employment. I did not serve any prison time, and to note this all happened over 10 years ago. It was a while ago. I am so innocent now, the system actually worked on me, I reformed and won't so much as take extra fortune cookies at the Chinese restaurant, but that record will likely stick will me until I am in my grave, same for my ex. This is very shameful for me, I hope you all understand.
So sitting here I do an assessment of myself and come to the realization that I am 1) trans 2) a woman, 3) a racial minority 4) a convicted felon, and upon seeing this I can't help but sit back and think that my chances of finding gainful, fulfilling employment is but a dream that I'll never see materialize. Who in the world would hire the likes of me to do anything other than mop floors or wash dishes for an amount of money that one adult could hardly live off? I would love to program (but I am not that great in math, lol), but sometimes I wonder if striving for such things is just setting myself up for upset.
That turned into a long post and I'll end it there lest it turn into a novel!
[edits for clarity]
Quote from: rmaddy on December 28, 2017, 08:46:24 PM
It's not so much confidence as a strategy. I certainly care how I appear to the world, and I have to remind myself from time to time not to be discouraged what others think and say.
Here's another strategy that I just fell into over time. I used to stand in front of the mirror and take note of how tall I was, or how deep my eyes were set, or that my hips were missing or my arms too long. My attention was on all the ways in which I didn't feel feminine. Getting ready time became a sort of argument that I would lose with my reflection every morning. I knew that I should be kinder to myself, but I didn't know how. Eventually I just started looking myself in the eye and smiling, as if I were meeting a friend at a party. I smile and whisper, "Hey, girl." I actually, audibly say it. I watch my face express how happy I am to see her again. It sounds really strange when I describe it, but I really feel that way now.
My body has changed over time, and that is really nice, but the biggest change was on the inside. I'm not a very positive person honestly, but I know how to treat a friend. Maybe there is something in that approach that you can use.
There's a lot from that I can use.
Your post resonates with me because it's almost frightening how similar your experience is to mine when faced with my enemy, the mirror. I too have deeper set eyes, long limbs, and no hips, not to mention a large Adam's apple, so large I wonder if a trach shave will do any real justice. My big head also does not help lol.
One thing that hurt me is when I went to my endo at exactly my one year (to the day!) anniversary of starting HRT I learned that my body was struggling to get my testosterone down and so I was switched from pills to injections + finasteride in addition to the spiro I was already taking. I know I am not supposed to give exact doses, but hopefully what I just mentioned was enough. On that visit, it felt like nothing but poison, the poison that for so long has tormented me with those masculine features was burning through my veins like acid, destroying me.
Look myself in the eye and respect myself? That's some hard work, my sister. I never tried your idea but I'll give it a shot and see if it can help me gain some confidence.
Hi Shadowsister
I am 19 months on HRT and you can see from my picture that I am obviously trans. I go about my day and life like any other woman doing as I need to and I get treated just fine. I am always either gendered correctly or not gendered at all. I have been out and about fulltime now since March of this year. Someone with from this board keyed me into realising that being myself was what all this was about and it was something I was doing for me.
It took me a long time and I went through a period where I could not seem to get gendered correctly and it struck me that people just want to get on with their own lives and have very little interest in being overtly hostile or rude to anyone, but you do need to give them a few clues. Your presentation is going to change the way people react to you. Prior to going fulltime I was getting quite upset by the twisting back and forth in my presentation and decided enough was enough. Once I made my presentation clear I began to have much less anxiety about actually going to the various places I had to as part of everyday living. I also began to get gendered correctly.
I started with safe spaces like my therapist office, HRT Dr's office, Electrologist etc etc...all these people I considered safe places and dressed and presented myself as I wanted. This helped with the more difficult places like shopping malls and shops themselves.
Confidence comes when you feel you know a situation and how exactly it will all turn out. Like going to the store for a loaf of bread...you have a certain expectation of how that will go because you have done it so many times. The more you present yourself as who you are then the more confident you will become on how you appear to the world.
I am sure with all the great advice in this thread you will be fine
Hi Again Shadow!!!
You have challenges ahead to be sure! Transition can be tough... doing it in a inhospitable environment tougher still and trying to find gainful employment while doing those two without a work history... is indeed, icing on the cake but... the good part is, you amongst friends and have a lot more people on your side now ... right here!
No worries about criminal history dear sister... I had a 17 year drug history ( My attempt at slow suicide!)... 14 years as a heavy methamphetamine user and dealer... arrested several times... I made money and I also eventually found myself homeless and eating out of dumpsters... left it all behind in 1995 and became " successful" in most ways except in being me... the real me!... We all had lives before we got here!!!
You haven't mentioned the liberal city you are near... you may have sisters here that know of resources, training, housing opportunities etc there....
You could try posting a new thread mentioning where you are and that you are seeking input on those things... there are a lot of caring folks here and we have tentacles reaching all over the world!!!
Let's keep hope in our heart and keep moving forward together!!!
Btw... on the Adam's apple front... mine was huge too... trach shave was the first thing I did,
You can see it in my " before" shot here in post #1052
https://www.susans.org/forums/index.php/topic,224896.msg2060612.html#msg2060612
Onward we go girl!!!
Ashley 😀❤️🌻
Hang on there, stop pretending to be male and just dress femininely (yet conservatively and age appropriately). If your neighbors opinion matters to you - be nice to them and say hi. If there's a church everyone goes to - maybe it would be a nice idea to start attending Sunday services dressed appropriately for a women. Focus your energy on helping others and helping yourself (financially and otherwise), and stop thinking on bad things that might happen - being more vulnerable is a part of being female, so take it as a part of the package.
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Hey you all Thank You so much. As a thanks I will drop this site a little donation in the coming weeks. I have never reached out to the LGBT or transgender community in my city, but will check those resources.
I still legally have my male name but I am getting it changed real soon. It's expensive and getting my name changed on all documents is time-consuming and I do procrastinate sometimes! Luckily the state where I was born and where I now live have lawmakers with their heads somewhat screwed on straight so getting all my papers changed to feminine name/gender marker is not like some epic battle royale. Also I plan to get the ball rolling on getting my bottom surgery. As precarious as my situation seems, I still do have some support here with my father, who promised to not kick me out, knock on wood, but once I get a name change and surgery it may be wise for me to move on and look at housing. I am just worried it will be in some ghetto or with people who will hurt me. I am not expecting anything upscale, but I still am concerned for my safety. Barring all that, I think it may be best to try and look for things like employment and stuff once I am full time. I want to work. I want to work full time so bad and support myself and I don't even have high aspirations because a one bedroom apt in at least a respectable neighborhood that's not some war-torn, drug infested danger zone is enough. That's what sometimes gets me... even something so simple, a simple life in a simple apartment with a simple car seems like it may as well be wanting a Malibu mansion and a Rolls.
I am curious, however, as to what type of jobs LGBT groups can get for trans women like me without experience? Does anyone out there with experience in that have any insight? Do the jobs offered just pretty much run the gamut? Let me ask like this: What are some jobs that you all think would be good for me to work towards when just getting started? My real weakness, like many others, is math. What industries are generally more liberal/accepting?
It will be a little while before I can respond back, but I am here reading everything posted and will take time to respond later. Sorry if I do not respond directly to everyone, I don't want anyone to feel like their posts to me were ignored or not appreciated.
[edits for clarity]
Women work in almost any profession these days. We rent to a women who runs a truck trailer repair business. Before that, one of the job she held was working underground maintaining the tunnel boring equipment. Women also work construction and other male dominated professions. A long shot but I saw a show once where a former inmate worked in a lock smith shop and became so skilled and trusted that the owner gave him the key to to shop.
Most states have a state employment service and that would be a good place to start. They may be able to connect you with training if needed or advice you on possible professions. I suspect you are relatively smart as running a scam requires the ability work the system without getting caught for a while. There are many jobs where a hard worker who can use their head are needed and most will train you. If you spend some time seriously looking for work in the right places, there should be a job available for you. Just remember that some of the most unlikely jobs may be good options. Walmart has supported the transition of several of our members.
Quote from: Shadowsister on December 28, 2017, 03:55:26 PM
I can sorta relate. I am 35 and started hormones at 34 years old. That feels so old for this because it feels like I have just missed out on so much. Plus I am tall, 6' on the money. I don't know what to do. Gender dysphoria has messed me up so much that even at this age I have never held a job for over six months, ever. Never once. I am on SSI and everything. I actually still live at home and never was able to live on my own. I just feel lost and not passing feels like just another
I just wanted to say I noticed this part of your posts and wanted to say...
you aren't alone at all. I am 35 and on SSI disability after spending most of my life as a shut-in. I have never lived alone, living with my mother until I was 32 and then, after she passed away from cancer in 2014, I moved in with my father where I currently reside. Never was able to make it to a job, much less hold one down. But it's important to know remember it's not hopeless! Since my mother's death I was sort of shaken awake, and have spent the past few years improving myself in so many ways I thought I never could (weight loss, working on a degree online, getting my drivers license), which is what led me to addressing being transgender a few months ago to begin with. You have shown so much courage by starting hormones, and even looking to address your fears and worries on these forums is a huge deal, don't sell yourself short!
I was sitting here thinking and if you were in my area, I know of 3 companies that are hiring if you are the right person.
1. Truck paint shop that will train but needs a hard worker to do repairs and refinishing.
2. Truck trailer repair, again hard worker to do repairs and they hire people who have records.
3. A guy just starting a medal fabrication business who will train on medal cutting machine and other fabrication equipments, welding and anything else the job requires.
All of theses business have a common problem of the people they hire just don't want to do the work. If somebody is willing to put out the effort, they would have a job for life. All of these jobs are located on a 30 acre industrial park and the first two have been hiring for a while. Also gender wouldn't be a restriction on any of these jobs.
Fear I understand. I did push going full time and I don't regret it, but I got beat up bad not long after. I didn't pass really but I was drowning and I HAD to go full time for my mental health. That was one year on hormones. I have a friend that started the same time as me and is just now presenting female and going full time. It's different for all of us. Don't be discouraged about not passing just yet, there is time.
Sorry if this is all out of order, I am having a hard time focusing.
I am 48 and I don't know how I pass but I do. I feel very lucky. The fear has not gone away though. Knowing, not guessing, knowing that laws are the ONLY thing keeping some people beating me up or killing me if they knew. My best friends boyfriend hates trans people and always looks daggers at me. He shoots cats that wander through his yard and talks about all the people who deserve to be shot. If that guy ever snapps, I don't want to be around. There is reason to be afraid BUT that should never stop us, make us cautious sure but not stop us. Every time we drive we are in mortal peril. We have to trust that all the other drivers are doing what they are supposed to be doing or we would never leave the house.
If you look at a lot of older transitioners timelines, well this is for all of us I guess, but there is a moment where you can pickit out. Like There! That is the moment when the male is gone and only the female remains. I think you will find that that point is rarely around a year, usually it is 2-3 years. Genetics and age play a part but that is a good average.
Last year's local trans pride event I saw a lot of people who changed how I view passing. Two in particular, both young, one a crossdresser and one a transsexual. To look at them they were flawless and beautiful but neither of them passed well at all because of their presentation. The one did okay on stage but the moment he stepped off it was gone the other was trying but just didn't have any experience at it. Then I saw a friend from work who was walking with a woman that I assumed was his wife, turned out to be his sister. Not in anyway standing out, just an average woman. After a few minutes talking I asked if they were there for the show, he already knew about me for a long time so he wasn't surprised I was there. Nope, his sister had recently came out as a transsexual woman and wanted some support when she went to the pride event as a girl. I was so impressed, not beautiful no glamour in any way but completely passable. She actually reminded me of my aunt so much so that I had to stop myself from calling her my aunt's name. A little gruff, smoked 2 packs of cigarettes a day since she was 16 voice and a mischievous twinkle in her eye. Presentation is so important. A beautiful woman who in every way acts and talks like a brah will not pass any more than Jay Leno wearing a dress. Presentation is a huge percentage of what makes us passable.
Anyway, this stupid headache is demanding that I take something for it and go to bed.
Night, hope you feel better tomorrow.
So as you can see im no CoverGirl. I can be a lil blunt but here is a little of my success.
1. LOSE THE FEAR gain some confidence. .... its all baby steps.
2. THE VOICE TAKES ALOT OF PRACTICE. find a pitch you are comfortable with. 180 to 200 hertz and work that pitch starting at what is comfy to at least an hour a day. Listen to females, copy their inflection and intonation. talk slightly slower and use a lot of describing colorful language. study women
3. BODY LANGUAGE hold elbows close to side and "talk " with hands, eye movent and facial expression. are key to help be convincing. keep yourself small elbows in knees close or crossed
4. SMALL CONFIDENCE BUILDERS, a necklace clear nail polish are all reminders of who you are and who you wanna be its all baby steps.
5. DONT RUSH. slow and easy improvement, not perfection
6. HAIRSTYLE grow out hair or get a wig... one that frames your face
This was the start of me being afraid of leaving my house to almost 3 years rlt. Do I get treated as a woman? For the most part yes. Do I get misgendered? Not as much as before.
Just some friendly pointers hope it helps.
Grr! I forgot work!
I get it, I do. When I was looking for work I had friends that were like, why don't you do this or why don't you do that? Well, okay lemme break some things down for you. Tree service where there are all guys and I would be stuck in that stupid truck with them at least a little every day? You are joking right? While we are at it let's just scratch off ANY almost exclusive male field. Beats selling my body on the street, doubt that anyone would pay for it anyway, but not by much. Unless someone has experienced that they have no idea. Constant name calling, little pushes to outright shoves and the list goes on and on.
There are places that offer trans friendly environments even advertise it.
Retirement communities are good. Well as long as you can handle the old men grabbing at you or offering his "services". I volunteer at one and I have never had a problem. Ah hem, other than the horny old men.
Healthcare period is good, even moping the floor pays well and no one cares what you are there.
Target is a trans friendly place to work and I know two girls that are very happy there.
I now work in customer service for a cabinet manufacturer. Your voice will get awesome in no time. :)
It may seem overwhelming at first but there are jobs available.
Take care.
Ugh! Back again, sorry.
What Laurie K said. All good I would just like to add a little.
Pitch is important BUT without the right resonance your voice can still give you away. The local news weather lady`s voice is considerably lower pitched than mine but no one would ever think she is male by her voice. God, it is so warm and smooth. I have had the VA offer voice therapy recently and when I turned it down they asked, "Wouldn't you like to get your pitch higher?" My pitch is around 185-190 which is fine I think but they were convinced they could help. I had to ask them if there was any way or context that my voice would be construed as anything other than female? Um... no. Will my voice ever give me away as trans? Um... no. Does my voice sound in any way less natural than any woman you have talked to today? Well no but... don't you want to have a higher pitch? Um.... no. If it ain't broke, don't fix it. Pitch is important BUT resonance will get you passing in situations where they are in doubt much quicker than pitch.
Laurie had talked about movement. This is the perfect time of year to observe male and female movement. Everyone is wearing bulkier clothes. Except UPS drivers, what's up with that? 20 degrees and you are wearing shorts?!? Anyway it is much more difficult to differentiate between male and female, but watch the way they move. Can't you tell? Can't everyone? Even the way they change direction, men at the shoulder, women at the hips. There are movements we make that scream to anyone and everyone, this is a dude or this is a chick. The next time you find yourself walking next to someone that you can only see barely in your peripheral vision, try to determine if they are female or male by their movements. I am betting that you can.
The point is, the things that make us truly pass are not the hormones, it's the lifetime of girls imitating other girls that we have to catch up on. It takes work and TIME. Give yourself a little break. 😁
I've done a lot of stupid things I probably should have been dead but here I am. My point is life will drag us down sometimes but it's not over if you're still breathing.
I don't know about passing because I haven't given it much thought yet. I figure people will clock me and they do. It's always embarrassing when they stare, point and whisper/laugh with someone next to them.
Yeah it brings me down a bit because what they do is childish and just uneccessary. I look at myself and say what's wrong with me?
I will say it builds a sort of resentment in me because I realize "not passing" (whatever that means) is my shield to protect me from ignorant people. These strangers are a waste of my time anyway.
I know that wasn't much help with tips and advice. I'm sure that for me it'll take ffs to help me pass and even then I'm not sure
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Just a thought, but you may be able to throw in a small sum with your Medicaid covered surgeries to add in some small ffs procedures. Since they're already in there. Like fat transfer for a breast augmentation and they toss a little in your face... etc. Surgeons will generally work with you on a sliding scale.
Hey everyone, I am back. I needed some sleep.
Read everything you all wrote and will be taking a lot of the advice that has been laid out for me here, extremely hard though it may be. Sometimes it's to hard to remain positive and I need a little help. It feels bad knowing that I'll probably never have a good man, a family, and this political climate we're in can all just be so draining. Tired of being the butt of jokes, and being a political pawn and every so often it's like it overwhelms me.
Quote from: Dena on December 29, 2017, 12:07:50 AM
I was sitting here thinking and if you were in my area, I know of 3 companies that are hiring if you are the right person.
1. Truck paint shop that will train but needs a hard worker to do repairs and refinishing.
2. Truck trailer repair, again hard worker to do repairs and they hire people who have records.
3. A guy just starting a medal fabrication business who will train on medal cutting machine and other fabrication equipments, welding and anything else the job requires.
All of theses business have a common problem of the people they hire just don't want to do the work. If somebody is willing to put out the effort, they would have a job for life. All of these jobs are located on a 30 acre industrial park and the first two have been hiring for a while. Also gender wouldn't be a restriction on any of these jobs.
Hi Shadow,
Looking at the things Dena has kindly put forward here ...
Perhaps a totally new city to build a new life is just what is called for.... Please don't write off the things you want in your life.... When I decided to transition... I thought that although it was the right decision ... Relationship wise it would be a very lonely road... Happily I was wrong... I am married now to the greatest guy in the world and we celebrated our first anniversary last September...
Onward we go brave sister!!!
Ashley 😀💗🌻
Quote from: Dena on December 29, 2017, 12:07:50 AM
I was sitting here thinking and if you were in my area, I know of 3 companies that are hiring if you are the right person.
1. Truck paint shop that will train but needs a hard worker to do repairs and refinishing.
2. Truck trailer repair, again hard worker to do repairs and they hire people who have records.
3. A guy just starting a medal fabrication business who will train on medal cutting machine and other fabrication equipments, welding and anything else the job requires.
All of theses business have a common problem of the people they hire just don't want to do the work. If somebody is willing to put out the effort, they would have a job for life. All of these jobs are located on a 30 acre industrial park and the first two have been hiring for a while. Also gender wouldn't be a restriction on any of these jobs.
I may be interested! Lol are these in arizona?
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Quote from: tgirlamc on December 29, 2017, 12:51:44 PM
Hi Shadow,
Looking at the things Dena has kindly put forward here ...
Perhaps a totally new city to build a new life is just what is called for.... Please don't write off the things you want in your life.... When I decided to transition... I thought that although it was the right decision ... Relationship wise it would be a very lonely road... Happily I was wrong... I am married now to the greatest guy in the world and we celebrated our first anniversary last September...
Onward we go brave sister!!!
Ashley 😀💗🌻
Congratulations on your first anniversary. You really do offer me a lot of hope.
What cities are good to look at? Sadly it always looks like the most friendly and open cities are the most expensive, places like San Fran, Seattle, and NY. I hear many places in New England are okay, places like Vermont. But I am not so sure since I am a racial minority, they may not be so welcoming there. Any experience with good cities/states to consider?
Quote from: Shadowsister on December 29, 2017, 02:41:19 PM
Congratulations on your first anniversary. You really do offer me a lot of hope.
What cities are good to look at? Sadly it always looks like the most friendly and open cities are the most expensive, places like San Fran, Seattle, and NY. I hear many places in New England are okay, places like Vermont. But I am not so sure since I am a racial minority, they may not be so welcoming there. Any experience with good cities/states to consider?
Hey Shadow,
It sounds like a place where an income could be secured would be a large piece of the puzzle... if you were to start exploring options in other cities, you might want to start with ones with a large University presence... The university towns are often more accepting in my experience... If the job opportunities that Dena mentioned are in the Phoenix, AZ area... I know they have a fairly good LGBTQ presence... I use to go down there quite a bit for electrolysis and met quite a few transwomen...
After my long decent into methamphetamine... I had pretty much next to zero legitimate work history... I started working for Temporary Staffing Agencies and turned down nothing offered... I quickly became a go to person to call because I was always ready to hit the ground running... it gave me a wide variety of experience to form a resume in a short time and many places were using that route to find people they liked to hire full time..I had many offers and opportunities that came along. I had a nice job for a couple years in the aviation industry doing parts production for helicopters... we were even assembling a couple for the Mexican Navy!
Anyway sister, don't be afraid to think way outside the box on this stuff and keep knocking stuff around here and some very nice things might happen!!!
Hugs and Hope that the new year brings you amazing change in your life!!!
Onward we go brave sister!!!
Ashley 😀❤️🌻
The jobs I discussed are in the phoenix area however I suspect most cities have jobs available like this. Kids coming out of school now have the attitude that they are worth $60 and hour and the job should be easy to do. As the result, there are many lower paying jobs where you have to work hard with your hands but if you are good, you will be promoted. If you have ever seen the TV show Dirty Jobs you will understand there are many jobs available out there that don't require a college education. Consider and electrician, plumber carpenter, mechanic and many other jobs. Yes you get dirty doing them but on the job training or trade school knowledge is all that's required along with the desire to work hard.
Dena speaks truth!!!... These days I think willingness to show up and do hard work puts you head and shoulders above the crowd...
I had an 18 year career in the environmental remediation industry... most of the contracts I worked on were for The Army Corp of Engineers, Navy and EPA... Pay was very good and based on local union scales... The starting place in being hired in that industry is getting 40 hour OSHA HAZWOPER training... often the employers will pay for your class if they want to hire you and I think you may be able to do the whole course online these days....often the contracts are written to address diversity in the workforce...
More food for thought my friend!
Hugs!!!
A 😀❤️🌻
Hey what do you all think of data entry? I hear it's pretty easy to find jobs doing that, and even though data entry does not pay tons of dollars, with positions like Medical Transcriber one may be able to make a decenmt living. Does anyone have any insight on those type of jobs?
Also for coding, how good at math does one really have to be? I have heard/read some people say you need to be really good at it and others say you don't need any at all.
Quote from: Shadowsister on December 29, 2017, 05:53:44 PM
Also for coding, how good at math does one really have to be? I have heard/read some people say you need to be really good at it and others say you don't need any at all.
For coding, the ability to think logically is more important than math skills. Math helps, sure, but usually you get the computer to do the serious number crunching. The coder's job is to tell it what to do.
Quote from: KathyLauren on December 29, 2017, 06:19:06 PM
For coding, the ability to think logically is more important than math skills. Math helps, sure, but usually you get the computer to do the serious number crunching. The coder's job is to tell it what to do.
That sounds great. There's a lot of resources out there for coding, so many it's overwhelming. If I wanted to get my feet wet and get a sample of what coding is, do you or anyone else have a link to anywhere where I could get some nice, accurate beginner friendly info?
Hey Shadow!... I will find the coding training group I spoke of and send you a link by PM... It is formed specifically to enable Trans folks to have a marketable skill
Btw!... I am hearing the sound of hope in your words and with hope you can make this world your own!
Hugs!!!
A 😀💗🌻
I bet you pass better than you think you do already.
Quote from: tgirlamc on December 29, 2017, 06:45:58 PM
Hey Shadow!... I will find the coding training group I spoke of and send you a link by PM... It is formed specifically to enable Trans folks to have a marketable skill
Btw!... I am hearing the sound of hope in your words and with hope you can make this world your own!
Hugs!!!
A 😀💗🌻
Thanks, I look forward to reading it all. It would be awesome if that was something I could get into. I think those really labor intensive construction type jobs are not for me. Not because of any laziness, but because I just don't think my body can handle it. I don't have the best back and knees, sometimes even doing too much yard work will become uncomfortable.
Additionally, after being on hormones for a year I have noticed that my strength and stamina are not what they used to be. It's not a super huge reduction, but just enough to make something I was already not so good at even harder.
I am within my ideal body weight and am otherwise decently healthy, but that manual labor just puts the hurting on me, literally.
Quote from: mako9802 on December 29, 2017, 07:39:06 PM
I bet you pass better than you think you do already.
It's odd. Sometimes I'll look at myself in the mirror and see a glimmer of femininity, but then the next day, or even the next hour, I'll look and see nothing but male. The odd thing is sometimes my facial features will seem ever so slightly different. I may be under the same light, but they'll still look a bit different.
I do not have really hard male features like major brow bossing, and I have a rather delicate chin, but my deep set eyes and a nose that is a bit masculine is just enough to really hurt my passing.
I wonder if a rhinoplasty nosejob would be enough for me. I want to post pics so bad and ask for honest, objective feedback but I am really nervous on the internet. :-\
40 years of moving numbers around in a computer. You need to have a feel for numbers being wrong but unless you are doing scientific programming, algebra, addition, subtraction, multiplication and division will take care of most anything you will encounter. Strange enough, in the last 30 years or so, I hardly used multiplication and division.
As for medical transcription, it depends greatly on your typing speed and accuracy. If you are unable to touch type at over 60 words a minute, you should consider some other profession.
I am the exact same way...for me I still present male but have been on HRT for a while now and like you said sometimes I look at myself in the mirror and I am like wow this is really happening and I see glimpses of her in the mirror and love what I see. Other times I am like I just see male...its funny like that...When I go out in public in male presentation though I sometimes hear people saying "was that a girl or was that a man" so yeah I know there is some androgyny going on. I was at work the other day coming out the restroom and i was coming out and a guy was coming in he did a "double take", I was in male clothes no make up and that happened it makes me smile a bit...
Have a really random question for you all. Shocker, I have questions, lollol
I want to shoot this site a few dollars for a donation, but I am worried if I use paypal it will give my real name out. I am really worried about identifiable information being posted because there are some mean folks out there who like to "out" and otherwise harass transgender people through doxing and things like that.
I don't care if it says "Donator" by my name, but can I be assured my personal info will remain private if I use paypal?
From my point of view, I can see your email address and IP address. Moderators are forbidden to trace IP addresses other than with the permission of an administrator. We need the IP addresses for moderator activity however that can be accomplished without tracing the IP address. To release any of this information means we not only lose our staff job but will be barred from the site. This is why we warn people not to post personal information on the site because that is the only source of personal information.
Quote from: Dena on December 30, 2017, 11:03:02 AM
From my point of view, I can see your email address and IP address. Moderators are forbidden to trace IP addresses other than with the permission of an administrator. We need the IP addresses for moderator activity however that can be accomplished without tracing the IP address. To release any of this information means we not only lose our staff job but will be barred from the site. This is why we warn people not to post personal information on the site because that is the only source of personal information.
Thanks, Dena.
I am going to go ahead and give a little donation to the site because I appreciate the help given to others and myself.
That said, I feel a lot better now than when I started this thread being all irate. Although I've been on HRT for just over a year I am new to injections and toward the end of the week I start feeling bad and get hard on myself, and sometimes even others. Hope that's something I eventually get used to. It's like coming off a caffeine or sugar high and I am just all like :embarrassed: :'( :-\ :(
I dont know what i can add so much has already been covered but i know fear well ,at the beginning i was petrified but some how i learned that on a primal level that humans still operate on that principle if you excude fear you will be attacked ....but i found that fear for myself was self generated i was over thinking every thing i was creating my own reality i too was in a vast amount of trouble i had to get a job to spin out my courtcase
and to do this i had to get a job in the goldfields in a.rough 98% male.workforce in a camp out in the bush ....i thought i was gay and was so ashamed this was back in 1989 i wore it like a badge people would pick up on it and i got such a hard time , my supervisor gave me two weeks before i cracked but but 30 yrs later i im still going
respected and now a legend but even though i am transtitioning im still respected and i think its because of i just be me ,but then again i am a rough neck
My first outing as me i dressed outrageously goth style a kilt bandana , big kick ass boots
I really was loud , but you know no one hassled me the reactions varied from admiration from females to fear from males i only had one young guy smirk and look away
But what im trying to say is your front depicts how you will be treated
Fear is shadows you are young im 20 years older and transitioning i wish i had started at your age
Think about imigrating to australia we are color blind here and social security is good
But most of all people respect courage ....like barbie says just do it
Hopefully this makes sense ...one life one chance go for gold sis
Quote from: markie on January 01, 2018, 12:00:09 AM
I dont know what i can add so much has already been covered but i know fear well ,at the beginning i was petrified but some how i learned that on a primal level that humans still operate on that principle if you excude fear you will be attacked ....but i found that fear for myself was self generated i was over thinking every thing i was creating my own reality i too was in a vast amount of trouble i had to get a job to spin out my courtcase
and to do this i had to get a job in the goldfields in a.rough 98% male.workforce in a camp out in the bush ....i thought i was gay and was so ashamed this was back in 1989 i wore it like a badge people would pick up on it and i got such a hard time , my supervisor gave me two weeks before i cracked but but 30 yrs later i im still going
respected and now a legend but even though i am transtitioning im still respected and i think its because of i just be me ,but then again i am a rough neck
My first outing as me i dressed outrageously goth style a kilt bandana , big kick ass boots
I really was loud , but you know no one hassled me the reactions varied from admiration from females to fear from males i only had one young guy smirk and look away
But what im trying to say is your front depicts how you will be treated
Fear is shadows you are young im 20 years older and transitioning i wish i had started at your age
Think about imigrating to australia we are color blind here and social security is good
But most of all people respect courage ....like barbie says just do it
Hopefully this makes sense ...one life one chance go for gold sis
Thanks for that response. I know it sounds a bit cheesy, but what you wrote about fear was pretty deep. I am really trying to get rid of it, but it's hard. Fear is almost like an addiction.
I would love to be able to move to somewhere like Australia or Canada or some other Western nation that is a bit more progressive than the USA, but I've no resources to do that.. unless, of course, you want to marry me. ::) :o ::)
All jokes aside, your post along with the others here have really helped to give me some insight. Transition and being trans, as I'm sure most of us are aware, is not easy and sometimes I just need some help with the difficulties of it all and I'm glad to get that here.
Your welcome my approach is simplistic .....in fact i went through hell to get where i am now and its not over
one thing i suggest though which every female should do is learn self defense krav maga would be useful
anyway i empathize on your fear ive been there i have my own fear of crowds which comes from being stuck in the middle of nowhere with a bunch of rednecks and being subjected to relentless humiliation 24/7 ... back then we used to stay out there for 6 weeks before a break of 6 days back in civilization , nowdays i know its just shadows , and i'm fairly thick skinned
that saying of " walk a mile in someones boots before you judge them " comes to mind
Sounds like the coding would be the go thats knowledge you can take anywhere with you and make aliviing
Oh i cannot pass and i doubt i ever will but im happy with my new mind set thats what means the most to me ....we're all different
Quote from: markie on January 01, 2018, 05:14:50 PM
Your welcome my approach is simplistic .....in fact i went through hell to get where i am now and its not over
one thing i suggest though which every female should do is learn self defense krav maga would be useful
anyway i empathize on your fear ive been there i have my own fear of crowds which comes from being stuck in the middle of nowhere with a bunch of rednecks and being subjected to relentless humiliation 24/7 ... back then we used to stay out there for 6 weeks before a break of 6 days back in civilization , nowdays i know its just shadows , and i'm fairly thick skinned
that saying of " walk a mile in someones boots before you judge them " comes to mind
Sounds like the coding would be the go thats knowledge you can take anywhere with you and make aliviing
Oh i cannot pass and i doubt i ever will but im happy with my new mind set thats what means the most to me ....we're all different
That's some tough really stuff for you to go through. It puts things into perspective. What you mention about walking that mile, I have told my dad before if he could be me for a day he would change his tune 100%.
One of the hardest things about being trans is people are like "just do this and that" then give some half-baked opinion on what should be done or "I understand 100% what being trans is" then proceeds to give me crap that the media, politicians and religious leaders feeds to the masses on trans issues. People act like they know what's up and are dead wrong and no amount of good counter evidence can make them change their beliefs, it makes me want to pull my hair out.
Sometimes, in addition to the fear I mention, a problem of not "passing" isn't just being physically assaulted, but dealing with other people's absolute ignorance and stupidity. It's tough when you have an "issue" that's so heavily politicized, and doubly worse when it's one that is so subject to nonsensical sensationalism that people just love eating up.
Here is another suggestion for a job. If you think about it, about 99% of the economy is buying and selling. So go out and find stuff to sell. Ebay, Amazon and Craigslist, Etsy, etc. are all great places to start selling things. Check out Youtube. There are lots of videos on people who are making a living buying and selling things or finding salvage items for free and turning around and selling them. Research youtube videos and the internet on where to find things to sell. And there is a ton of good information out there. And nobody gives a fig if you are a felon or not. We are lucky to live in the world's wealthiest and strongest economy. Anybody can make money buying and selling. It's just a matter of hard work.
Quote from: Janes Groove on January 01, 2018, 08:24:55 PM
Here is another suggestion for a job. If you think about it, about 99% of the economy is buying and selling. So go out and find stuff to sell. Ebay, Amazon and Craigslist, Etsy, etc. are all great places to start selling things. Check out Youtube. There are lots of videos on people who are making a living buying and selling things or finding salvage items for free and turning around and selling them. Research youtube videos and the internet on where to find things to sell. And there is a ton of good information out there. And nobody gives a fig if you are a felon or not. We are lucky to live in the world's wealthiest and strongest economy. Anybody can make money buying and selling. It's just a matter of hard work.
Thank You so much for the idea, it's one that I never even considered. I need to get me a skill and I need to do it fast. My living arrangement is a bit stressful. I want to be on my own so bad but it's really hard to get started so every bit of input helps.