Poll
Question:
Did you serve with your countries armed forces as a uniformed member?
Option 1: Yes
Option 2: No
As mentioned in other topics, many here here seemed to have served in their countries armed forces or reserves I was wondering just how mny there were?
Steph
I was in the army less than a month. I realized I made a mistake joining soon after and was able to get out on a medical discharge.
Melissa
No, I was turned away. I wish. This is one of many buried in the vast cemetery of my broken, dead, and decaying dreams. :'(
Nero
US Navy four years. Saw 21 countries and all the states except Alaska.
I wouldn't do it again, nor would I trade it for anything.
LOL I can just see that.
I have a real problem with authority.
And ya gotta love the whole movie-land drill sgt:
'GOOD Morning Ladies!"
I did visit the reserves recruitment office once in a real bad time of no money and no prospects.
They made promises like they'd put me in as a sergeant straight away, and of course the guy kept calling me, when am I going to report for duty or whatever.
I don't think so, dude...
Quote from: jan c on June 14, 2006, 12:52:18 AM
LOL I can just see that.
I have a real problem with authority.
And ya gotta love the whole movie-land drill sgt:
'GOOD Morning Ladies!"
I did visit the reserves recruitment office once in a real bad time of no money and no prospects.
They made promises like they'd put me in as a sergeant straight away, and of course the guy kept calling me, when am I going to report for duty or whatever.
I don't think so, dude...
Geeze Jan, why doesn't that surprise me LOL. But think of the movie it would have made. :)
Steph
I was fortunate in that I missed the draft - and I was damned if I was going to volunteer as the Vietnam War had a stink about it.
Nevertheless always believed that you have responsibilities as well as rights - so I joined the reserves instead - was called the Citizens Military Forces way back then.
Rana
Posted at: June 14, 2006, 08:31:28 AM
LOL Steph,
I think there was a "Carry ON" movie about that very subject :)
Rana
It was not an option, I was drafted (during Viet Nam). I had qualified to work in a hospital, but as usual, the military goofed up and lost the papers.
It was a horrible situation and quite humiliating, being put in with all those men. I did everything I could to be alone when I used the restroom or showered. Luckily I became a company clerk so I lived off post, did not stand formations or participate in most company functions.
Sarah L.
Same as Rana. I didn't join the
reserves instead. But I joined a Christian version of Visa volunteer service and served two years in the USA.
:)
Jillieann
No I did not due to epilepsy, at least one good thing about that :) .
* :icon_hug:*
Michelle
all:
USAF 4 years.
sh.
No! I'd have liked to though. That'd have been interesting... a woman in the middle of those handsome studs, sharing the toilets, the showers, the locker rooms, the beds (oh! wait, do they share beds, too? :icon_evil_laugh:).... a dream come true in other words...ha..ha..ha..ha.. :-*
tinkerbell :icon_chick:
tinkerbel:
yep girl, watching my roomate undress...playing chess naked in the summer time...idillic romance that leads to denial, so so cherished people should try it once in a while
sheila
I just missed the draft. Up until then, my parents and I were talking about my taking my Canadian citizenship and heading North. I even went so far as to apply to universities. None accepted me. At the time, my father held the rank of captain in the US Army Reserves.
Presently, I hold the rank of captain in the USAF Auxiliary - the Civil Air Patrol.
Yes, I have made contact in regards to being a transgendered member. The comments from the national JAG commander were a) he has lost count on how many members have asked about this and b) call to find out the policy. It should not be a problem.
Chaunte
Yupper, I stayed 23 years in the Navy. Went around the world twice and now my spouse wonders why I don't want to travel much. :D
JAimee
I didn't serve. The Draft was way before my time, and from what I'd seen on television it looked like a lot of hard work, getting all sweaty and dirty and then there's that whole potential of going off to war and maybe not coming back. Plus, drill sergeants as they're popularly depicted reminded me too much of a certain authority figure in my own life, and no way was I going to voluntarily subject myself to that.
I've seen something on television once (was it Futurama? I can place Leela in the scene) where a drill sergeant was using the "ladies" bit - and all of the soldiers were women. :D (Which is not to say that they didn't copy that from another show or a movie.)
Hi Julie, your pic looks really good :)
I think how Drill sergeants are/were depicted in movies bears little resemblence to real life. "Full metal Jacket" is supposed to & is often held up as an example of how things were supposed to be - but I truely think its anti American B/s
Futurama is cool, but I preferred The Simpsons, when Homer joined the Naval Reserves, the US's 17th line of defense :)
I am a vet and have many vet friends and we have not found a movie that portrays a war realistically just the same I have not seen a movie that portrays transexualism relistically. I don' know of a movie that portrays transexualism among military situations or do does anyone?
sheila
Quote from: Rana on July 10, 2006, 06:14:07 AM
Hi Julie, your pic looks really good :)
Thank you. :)
QuoteI think how Drill sergeants are/were depicted in movies bears little resemblence to real life. "Full metal Jacket" is supposed to & is often held up as an example of how things were supposed to be
My Dad was drafted way back when, and he says they yell at you as soon as you get off the bus. I haven't seen the movie though. Still, it doesn't surprise me that things would be different. I've heard people who are knowledgeable about the legal profession say that courtroom drama type shows are all wrong too. In either case, I can understand using a little creative license to make a work more entertaining.
QuoteFuturama is cool, but I preferred The Simpsons, when Homer joined the Naval Reserves, the US's 17th line of defense :)
Oh yeah, the one where they shaved off the 3 hairs that grow out of the top of his head. The other guys are holding their formerly plentiful hair in their hands and Homer is sitting there sobbing. :D
My father was 30 years Navy with short stints in the Marines and Coasties. Told us stories about Attu & Kiska and the invasion of Okinawa in WWII. Served on the Pusan Perimeter in Korea. A short time in Vietnam. and to top it off he was a DI. After listening to his stories and seeing how screwed up he was by his experiences, I decided there was no way in hell I was going to join the service. I missed the draft by one year. Thank what ever odd gods there be in the Universe for that.
This comment will be on the border line, and most likely should be moved to the political site, but please do not take it as a personal attack but do consider that it is a comment on my view of the thoughts of a much younger generation.
First, few of those of us that have served in the various militaries did it for the fun, excitement, or pleasure that we got from serving, but instead many of us did it because it was something that we believed in.
Those of you that have traveled around the US and or the world, and have lived with and or worked with people from different cultures may better understand my belief that while I did not especially like the military, I did and do consider it an honor to serve and or to have served my country. While I may not agree with every thing that it does, please show me one that is doing a better job of being a world leader, but please also document your ideas with factual references as to why it is better.
I have lived in former communist countries and have seen first hand the bankrupt government and social systems that were left over; I pray nightly that something like that never happens here. I spent the month of September in a foreign country when 9-11 took place and felt the apprehension of wondering if and how I would ever get back to the US, but I also experienced the pleasure of watching people in that country rally around us and they often went well out of their way to show their support for us as Americans and especially for the US.
I am proud to have served my country and I did not consider boot camp to be any more than a mild discomfort and no DI was ever that much of a problem. I found them to be Men doing their jobs in a well thought out program, to stay out of trouble all that was necessary was to use your head and think.
A response to this message will not reach me as I will be off line for some time traveling to Australia for a vacation and maybe hopefully some skiing.
We have freedom of speech here, right? :P
I would honestly rather die then fight for this country. I have many reasons to that.
First of all I have trouble following orders like you do in the army. Do not ask me how I can do marching band, because I don't know. Perhaps it's that I don't really care about fighting!
Secondly I do not like fighting or killing, both are no good and there's no logical reason for either. If I ever killed someone I couldn't live with myself anymore, I can barely live with myself as it is, but I'd HATE killing others, and I mean it. It is one of the worst things you could ever do.
Also I do not like what's going on in this country, and why were fighting. There may NEVER be a logical reason for fighting.. however this is one of the stupidest. I would not fight for an idiot like Bush, EVER.
Lastly, but definately not least... Gender discrimination. I don't know how I could do it... I don't know how I could take being called a "sir" and being forced to use a male's bathroom... and so many other things... I just couldn't do it. I would probably end up killing myself if I was drafted. (it's true.)
Okay I'm sorry, this probably had nothing to do with the topic, but I was bored and needed somewhere to post. :icon_razz:
Quote from: Victoria on July 18, 2006, 11:26:55 PM
We have freedom of speech here, right? :P
Yup, as long as you don't break the "Rules" :)
Steph
Quote from: Steph on July 18, 2006, 11:30:05 PM
Yup, as long as you don't break the "Rules" :)
Steph
:icon_evil_laugh:
tinkerbell :icon_chick:
Naval Academy graduate. (1960)
20 years in the Navy as an Engineering Duty Officer.
26 years as a Navy contractor.
Transitioned to female over 6 years ago and currently working full time on my Navy project.
Robyn
Canadian Armed Forces for 6 1/2 years >:D
Quote from: Kim on July 19, 2006, 07:31:05 AM
Canadian Armed Forces for 6 1/2 years >:D
Hey there Kim, I didn't realise you where in New Brunswick, you sneaky devil :) I'm in Ontario.
Steph
Quote from: Victoria on July 18, 2006, 11:26:55 PM
We have freedom of speech here, right? :P
First of all I have trouble following orders
Secondly I do not like fighting
... There may NEVER be a logical reason for fighting..
Lastly, but definitely not least... Gender discrimination.
Okay I'm sorry, this probably had nothing to do with the topic, but I was bored and needed somewhere to post. :icon_razz:
USAF 4 years.
As a TS and especially if we will get SRS, we shall break every single one of these points. You already have done so with a couple.
As a decent human being and especially as a TS I respect the anonymity of some of my sisters that are not ready to come out so am not free to speak what's in my mind if that will hurt my sister unnecessarily
I have to follow instructions from a doctor to have a successful transition
I am constantly fighting for me as a person and my identity as TS
My transsexualism is the most illogical issue there is yet here I am, am not waiting for Descartes to show me the way of reason.
Lastly I respect people so that i do not go into the ladies room when am dressed as a boy and do not go to the mens room when am passing as a female. I do discriminate besed on gender. In my case I follow orders very well when I drive, am guessing that you are a very good driver also, Is not that big deal when you really think of it.
Love, no matter what, sheila
Hiya Steph. I'm sorry, I only put that in my intro, maybe I should add it to my avatar so it's better seen by everyone.
I served for 5 years as a Corpsman, 3 years were served with the USMC.
I did my time (4 years + 1 Year Extension for good measure) and got an honorable discharge.
QuoteFirst, few of those of us that have served in the various militaries did it for the fun, excitement, or pleasure that we got from serving, but instead many of us did it because it was something that we believed in.
I did it to prove to myself that I was a man, that all of the men in my family did it, and I would do it too, because I have a penis, and therefore I am a man and I will act like it and do all the things that the men in my family have done. That's the way it is, feelings be damned. Real Heroic and Patriotic, huh?
It's the same reason I went away to Military School for my 9th and 10th grade year in high school. My dad made a flippant comment one day that I would make somebody a great little wife one day because I cleaned up the living room and kitchen before he came home from work. It wasn't his fault, he had no idea. I went in my room and cried because he was WAY too close to the mark, I decided I needed to either run away from home or die.
It's the same reason I played football in high school. To try and prove that I was male and could do it.
I hid by overcompensation. Obviously, none of that worked, because I'm still here.
Jessica
34 years
USMC, long enough to go to the first persain gulf war (shield and storm), then be discharged upon my return for "homosexuality", before don't ask don't tell. Didn't seem to bother them when I was sleeping in a bunker with missles flying over my head. Only when I came back to the states.
No, but I taught ROTC in a real big ROTC school for ten years, did DoD contract work, and was employed in a DoE National Lab doing - well I can't say, but I also did 8 years with the Bechtel Corporation, and lots of that was defense work also.
Twice actually. Two months in the Army, during Viet Nam. Enlisted of my own free will. They found a birth defect in my back. Classified 1F.
Two years later had the classification to 1A. Served One month in the Navy, till they found the damn birth defect again. Classified 4F this time. Honorable with Medical Condition.
Janet
Yes, 4 years, but can't talk about it; it's still classified.
Nichole
no. really wish i had.
It was 4 years and it really IS still classified.
Nikki
So is a lot of the stuff I did at Bechtel, and almost all the DoE stuff. Once it gets classified, you have to move heaven and earth to get that stamp off of it.
Me either, and while some of it is stupid (lots of stuff gets classified to cover up mistakes) a lot of it is stuff that I would not want other people to know. Hell, a lot of it is stuff that I wish I didn't know. But what is seen can not be unseen.
Time heals a lot of stuff, and all that is over the hills and far away now. Like another time and place, because, well, it was.
But, at the time, I spent way too many nights staring in the dark for hours laying in bed thinking "I wish I had not learned that."
Never have. Never will.
The last person the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland wants defending it's shores is me.
I served proudly.
I'll die to maintain the freedoms my family and friends enjoy.
Post Merge: February 15, 2009, 11:34:37 PM
Quote from: caitlyn on July 11, 2006, 11:43:40 PM
This comment will be on the border line, and most likely should be moved to the political site, but please do not take it as a personal attack but do consider that it is a comment on my view of the thoughts of a much younger generation.
First, few of those of us that have served in the various militaries did it for the fun, excitement, or pleasure that we got from serving, but instead many of us did it because it was something that we believed in.
Those of you that have traveled around the US and or the world, and have lived with and or worked with people from different cultures may better understand my belief that while I did not especially like the military, I did and do consider it an honor to serve and or to have served my country. While I may not agree with every thing that it does, please show me one that is doing a better job of being a world leader, but please also document your ideas with factual references as to why it is better.
I have lived in former communist countries and have seen first hand the bankrupt government and social systems that were left over; I pray nightly that something like that never happens here. I spent the month of September in a foreign country when 9-11 took place and felt the apprehension of wondering if and how I would ever get back to the US, but I also experienced the pleasure of watching people in that country rally around us and they often went well out of their way to show their support for us as Americans and especially for the US.
I am proud to have served my country and I did not consider boot camp to be any more than a mild discomfort and no DI was ever that much of a problem. I found them to be Men doing their jobs in a well thought out program, to stay out of trouble all that was necessary was to use your head and think.
A response to this message will not reach me as I will be off line for some time traveling to Australia for a vacation and maybe hopefully some skiing.
QFT
Tried to join the Army when I was 16, I was in recruiting for a week in Toronto when they kicked me out just saying I was to small. Well just as well because I don't think I would have lasted long especially in combat conditions.
Quite agree with Emily's post;
QuoteWe have freedom of speech here, right?
I would honestly rather die then fight for this country. I have many reasons to that.
First of all I have trouble following orders like you do in the army. Do not ask me how I can do marching band, because I don't know. Perhaps it's that I don't really care about fighting!
Secondly I do not like fighting or killing, both are no good and there's no logical reason for either. If I ever killed someone I couldn't live with myself anymore, I can barely live with myself as it is, but I'd HATE killing others, and I mean it. It is one of the worst things you could ever do.
Also I do not like what's going on in this country, and why were fighting. There may NEVER be a logical reason for fighting.. however this is one of the stupidest. I would not fight for an idiot like Bush, EVER.
Lastly, but definately not least... Gender discrimination. I don't know how I could do it... I don't know how I could take being called a "sir" and being forced to use a male's bathroom... and so many other things... I just couldn't do it. I would probably end up killing myself if I was drafted. (it's true.)
Okay I'm sorry, this probably had nothing to do with the topic, but I was bored and needed somewhere to post.
Cindy
I have thought about that and how have I thought about it. I think the worst thing that could happen to a troop is one of their men loosing it and then jepordizing their live s in order to save your sorry butt. I still suffer from what they call shell shock from the environment where I worked in in a dynamite factory 34 years ago, and abusive situations in later years as well. I believe that some of us would do much better helping the war effort from the homeland.
Cindy
No. I had a clear feeling of female identity when I was 18 years old. The hole idea seemed to extremely unnatural for me. I had even serious difficulties to be with guys in P.E. classes. And now they are going to put me prison for that. :(
Yeah, I did serve. In the Navy. :)
Quote from: SomeMTF on February 16, 2009, 12:22:58 PM
The dela has beem canceled.
Regardless of whether I complite surgery or not I will be charged in the first week of 2010.
SMTF, try to recall that the thread is not about your personal situation at the present time. It's about people who have served in the armed forces of their countries.
I'm sorry for your struggle, but that is not on-topic and should be placed in a different thread about not serving in the armed forces, please.
Nichole
Wow I' started this thread in 2006 - kinda neat that it's been re-activated.
Steph
Funny how these old threads get revived, What is interesting as well is to read about peoples thoughts and feeling on different things two and three years ago. Some that I knew that have left the forums which makes me feel sad some.
As I have said, I don't believe there is any reasons for any wars or violence and suffering if it can be avoided in any way possible. But if there must be a war like in defending the homeland I would not hesitate to serve the cause from the home front, or if I was younger even as a medic in the neutral zones.
Cindy
Sorry Steph, missed it. Yes, 4 years active and a Viet Nam Vet, 2 years active reserves, all US Army. It was a struggle, and while I liked the jobs I had, the internal conflicts did cause a measure of trouble.
Wendy
I won't say never, but not in a very, very, very long time.
Mina.
Wanted to join the RAF when I was younger and nearly got signed at 18. However chickened out as I fell in love.. wish I done it now. However couldn't go in as "female". Would have really enjoyed the experience.
I did four and a half years in the Air Force.
It's certainly not for everyone.
It's certainly not for everyone.
No, perhaps not, oddly though you will meet just about everyone while your in, its one of the better parts of it in a way, you meet and have to work with such a wide range of people with skills ranging from none to the smartest people from the best schools ever (west point to mit) day in and day out. Its one of the best things that the military does, and people who have not done that, there is a difference.
Quote from: tekla on February 18, 2009, 09:36:21 PM
It's certainly not for everyone.
No, perhaps not, oddly though you will meet just about everyone while your in, its one of the better parts of it in a way, you meet and have to work with such a wide range of people with skills ranging from none to the smartest people from the best schools ever (west point to mit) day in and day out. Its one of the best things that the military does, and people who have not done that, there is a difference.
Actually the people, are the best part of serving.
I don't regret doing it, I just would not do it again.
I think so too, its the learning to work with a wide range of people that is a pretty good thing to know.
HELL no, I didn't go.
A long time ago I was in the Canadian Reserves for about 3 months. Many times I wish I could go back and join up again. It was a great experience for me.
I'm Icelandic. We do not have any military of any kind what so ever.
that's good, wouldn't have much money to pay for one at the moment anyway.
Money was actually one of the only reasons why I decided to join. In Switzerland, you're paid fairly well. so after I finished I was able to do some travelling. :)
i meant Iceland wouldn't have much money to pay for an army
QuoteIceland (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iceland) has some of the world's highest levels of economic and civil freedoms. In 2007, Iceland was ranked as the most (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_Human_Development_Index) developed country (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_Development_Index) in the world by the United Nations' Human Development Index (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_Development_Index). It was also the fourth (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_GDP_(nominal)) most productive country (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gross_domestic_product) per capita, and one of the most egalitarian (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Egalitarian), as rated by the Gini coefficient (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_income_equality).
Wow--how cool can you get? The awesomeness of not having a military. While the USA economy has been idiotically run into the ground by that insane war in Iraq.
Plus they have the first lesbian head of government in history. Maximum coolness. :eusa_clap:
No, never have and never will. For me an environment of blind obedience and unquestioned loyalty has never been something to desire.
Quote from: Hypatia on February 26, 2009, 12:03:31 PM
Wow--how cool can you get?
-4°F or -20°c.
(Yes I know what you mean, I was being witty.)
Quote from: soldierjane on February 26, 2009, 12:06:07 PM
No, never have and never will. For me an environment of blind obedience and unquestioned loyalty has never been something to desire.
The irony of this statement and username juxtaposed is delightful.
Me I'm a follower, I can get more accomplished behind the lines anyway. I love and trust my love to make the right decisions with only a few suggestions from me. I would have never made a good soldier, a good mule maybe, I'm used to doing the menial stuff.
Cindy
In the Navy for four years. Stationed at a secure comminications site in the jungle. After I was discharged I went back to work for them as a contractor. I have worked for the Navy,Army and Air Force. In Panama, Honduras, Virginia, Utah and southern California. Honduras is a great country and Panama is paradise.
Post Merge: February 27, 2009, 06:55:50 AM
Acronyms: NAVY: Never Again Volunteer Youself USMC: Uncle Sam's Misguided Children
Sigh, sometimes I wonder if anyone (well except for Pica in this case) reads any real news?
While Hypatia decries the US economy, its Iceland that is running an almost third-world debt/GNP load balance, and in the group of 'major free democratic nations with open markets' is in the worst financial shape any such nation as ever got itself into.
For Iceland, and this is just last weeks figures: External debt (as reported by Danske Bank) is now 300% of GDP, while short-term external debt is c55% of GDP, or 133% of Icelandic export revenues.
That is beyond broke. And, that they did all that without military spending - well that kinda puts old tekla in a state of awe. Furthermore, they are going to be hard pressed to do much about it, as their is extremely limited opportunity for economic expansion. Iceland is facing an economic meltdown on an almost epic scale. By contrast, the US debt, huge though it is, is a much smaller % of the GDP.
And Cindy, Armys are nothing but followers, with one leader more or less. Everyone is following someone further up the Chain of Command.
tekla hun, we're Icelandic, we shrug and keep on working, same as the last time something "absolutely horrible" happened.
Nothing's helped by panicking about it.
Within the military may you resent authoritity if you want. Don't have to respect. DEMONSTRATE respect, yes. Don't have to carry a weapon. Someone else will do that. I was in during the cold war. Mutually agreed destruction. USSR vs USA. HaHa. What BS! Her is a great quote:
Owners of capitol will stimulate the working class to buy more and more of expensive goods, houses, and technology, then to take more and more expensive credit, until the debt becomes unbearable. The unpaid debt will lead to bankruptcy of banks, which will have to be nationalized, and state will have to take over , which will eventually take the road leading to communism. Karl Marx 1867
Quote from: Genevieve Swann on February 27, 2009, 01:40:50 PM
Within the military may you resent authoritity if you want. Don't have to respect. DEMONSTRATE respect, yes. Don't have to carry a weapon. Someone else will do that. I was in during the cold war. Mutually agreed destruction. USSR vs USA. HaHa. What BS! Her is a great quote:
Owners of capitol will stimulate the working class to buy more and more of expensive goods, houses, and technology, then to take more and more expensive credit, until the debt becomes unbearable. The unpaid debt will lead to bankruptcy of banks, which will have to be nationalized, and state will have to take over , which will eventually take the road leading to communism. Karl Marx 1867
Excellent quote and thank you for kindly posting it.
Never served in the Armed Forces and would have been exempted anyway if there had been conscription thank God.
I did try to join the army when I was 16 but never made it past recruiting, I was to small. What I meant by I wouldn't make a good soldier is I was never good at being ordered to do stuff and I probably would have panicked and been of no use to anyone in a war situation.
I am a follower, in the sense that I am good at doing stuff I am *asked* to do, I once *was* a good pack mule. I wasn't scared of hard heavy work, just can not do as heavy type of work as I use to. Otherwise I don't shy away from a good days work, sweat and dirt washes off at the end of the day.
Cindy
imaz, The truth is after living,eating, showering,wearing the same uniform,etc. All together as enlisted folks and knowing that no one else is going to cover your ass, a person finds that those people are much closer emotionally than biological family and most outside friends. It is not a matter of chain of command or following orders. Break the rules and make sure you all have the same story. ->-bleeped-<-, The day I made E-5 I was caught with a quarter pound of marijuana and two hours later a JAG officer told me illegal search and seizure, go back to work. E-5 is a Petty Officer 2nd. In the army and air force it's some kind of seargent.
Quote from: Genevieve Swann on February 27, 2009, 01:40:50 PMOwners of capitol will stimulate the working class to buy more and more of expensive goods, houses, and technology, then to take more and more expensive credit, until the debt becomes unbearable. The unpaid debt will lead to bankruptcy of banks, which will have to be nationalized, and state will have to take over , which will eventually take the road leading to communism. Karl Marx 1867
Just because Ol' Karl said it, does not mean it will happen.
Here's a true story: I was going to therapy last year for PTSD related bull**. My major malfunction is that I was deployed for over 24 years. All voluntary except four. I did not reintegrate into north american culture easily. MY feelings "Damn Gringos!" There was a person in our group, Ralph/Raquel who is intersex. Ralph was drafted and went to Vietnam. The army was in a hurry and overlooked something very important. Now the Veterans Affairs gets to pay for the remaining surgery and therapy for the remainder of Raquel's life. P.S. Forgot to mention my shrinks work for the Veterans Affairs Medical Center. They're good to me and understand. Also the therapy started in 2003 and is ongoing.
Not wishing to offend anyone but why did you all serve in the Armed Forces? Can't believe that it's nearly 50% according to the attached poll.
Back when I was young it was considered socially unacceptable except in the case of conscription and even then most managed to get out of it with the excuse of being druggies, Gay, "insufficient thoracic measurement" (Italian Army!) and so on.... In all my life I've only ever met one person who volunteered and he was my dentist back in Italy.
Edit! I forgot one important one, my father in law! He was a Colonel (different ranking system in that country) in Naval intelligence. He's lovely.
i only know two people in the army not during world wars - one was my grandad, a psycho - and the other was a loser from school who thought himself action man.
Quote from: imaz on February 28, 2009, 12:46:37 PM
Not wishing to offend anyone but why did you all serve in the Armed Forces?
In my case it was initially to escape the people and events that had happened in my life up to that point... particularly school and the misery that went on there. There was nothing particularly noble about it; I just thought that out in the middle of an ocean was probably the farthest away I could get.
Quote from: imaz on February 28, 2009, 12:46:37 PM
Not wishing to offend anyone but why did you all serve in the Armed Forces? Can't believe that it's nearly 50% according to the attached poll.
People never do it, seem to have a hard time with that question.
For me, I needed a job, I was laid off 3 times in short order, and things in my area were not getting any better. I also hoped it might straighten me out but it only made things worse actually.
Many LGBT have trouble with jobs, hope to be straightened out by it or need money for school and/or surgery. Some do it to leave a dead end town. Some of those apply to non LGBT people as well.
Depending on the branch you may or may not find the gung ho fighters people imagine the military to be. Air Force enlisted tend to be for the reasons I mentioned above. Officers typically go in for schooling, or to fly. Those that like excitement go for fighters, but its not really about going up and shooting someone.
The only branch that is seriously gung ho is the Marines, with the Army not far behind.
Most people do not actually join to kill someone. In fact some branches will try to weed those people out.
Most of the people I encountered just wanted a leg up in life.
Ok, I appreciate there may be social economic reasons for joining the Armed Forces in some cases. My own father in law grew up in extreme poverty and joined to help his family survive.
However there is one thing that bothers me. That's killing people...
"Whoever kills a person...it is as though he has killed all mankind. And whoever saves a life, it is as though he had saved all mankind."
(Qur'an, 5:32)
Myself as well believe me :)
Quote from: imaz on March 01, 2009, 04:46:51 AM
Ok, I appreciate there may be social economic reasons for joining the Armed Forces in some cases. My own father in law grew up in extreme poverty and joined to help his family survive.
However there is one thing that bothers me. That's killing people...
"Whoever kills a person...it is as though he has killed all mankind. And whoever saves a life, it is as though he had saved all mankind."
(Qur'an, 5:32)
Military service does not equal killing people.
There is a huge medical staff, who 99.999% of the time do not deal with combat wounds. They work in more or less a normal hospital.
I tore apart jets and put them back together again. Others repair vehicles strictly used to service those aircraft.
Very little of our Air Force is involved in combat, the majority is there to assist that small minority who do. Same with every other branch of service. You have cooks, mechanics, doctors, medical staff, administration, and much more. I fired a weapon two times in the service, both were just to say I was qualified to handle one. Yes for a short time I launches jets capable of carrying bombs, and a few that did for practice, but most of the time I was strictly repairing the jet or launching out aircraft for research.
I was more likely to be killed than to even have a chance at shooting a gun pointed at someone.
Quote from: Leslie Ann on March 01, 2009, 06:01:38 PM
Military service does not equal killing people.
There is a huge medical staff, who 99.999% of the time do not deal with combat wounds. They work in more or less a normal hospital.
I tore apart jets and put them back together again. Others repair vehicles strictly used to service those aircraft.
Very little of our Air Force is involved in combat, the majority is there to assist that small minority who do. Same with every other branch of service. You have cooks, mechanics, doctors, medical staff, administration, and much more. I fired a weapon two times in the service, both were just to say I was qualified to handle one. Yes for a short time I launches jets capable of carrying bombs, and a few that did for practice, but most of the time I was strictly repairing the jet or launching out aircraft for research.
I was more likely to be killed than to even have a chance at shooting a gun pointed at someone.
No offence my friend but without that support 654,000 Iraqis might be alive today...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lancet_surveys_of_Iraq_War_casualties (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lancet_surveys_of_Iraq_War_casualties)
Edit: Removed.
First off, "no offense" does not absolve you, especially when you are wrong. I was in the gulf during peacetime operations.
Second, next time you ask a question, try not to rub it in someones face when you don't get an answer you like. You may never get another answer.
I was drafted in 1959. On my birthday, with one hundred days to go, was extended indefinitely. Ended up serving 2 years, 3 months, 2 days and 10 hours. On the bright side, the 3+ months kept me out of the active reserves and gave me a total of 3 years GI benefits. Was able to complete all 4 years of college on Uncle Sam's dime.
The 1st part of "Full Metal Jacket" was a perfect mirror of basic training in the Army at Fort Leonard Wood. (Sgt Dimwiddy, Sgt Fladd, (better known as Fladdy Daddy from the rice paddy. He drank the alcohol from the cans of sterno heaters.) Those were the days.
Wars do not solve anything they just destroy lives, many lives on both sides. Creating suffering, mental and physical pain, anguish, personal and civil property destruction, environmental destruction, Maybe insignificant to most but wars destroy much of nature and the denezins that dwell within.
Kill one man and it is a tragedy, Kill a million and it is a statistic.
Morals and value for a fellow human is lost upon the insanity of exploding bombs, "SHOOT TO KILL!!" is the order contained in the rules of engagement, and in the insanity of the moment anything that moves is a target. Never been at war outside of in nightmares.
Suddenly there there was a flash of bright light followed by a
loud explosive sound that rented the air. Once the flash faded out I noticed it was no longer as dark as before, I could see some orange flickering lights not far in front of me. As I walked closer I could could discern this flickering orange light as flames from smoldering fire.
I could hear this little girl screaming somewhere ahead of me, she
just kept screaming and screaming. As I got closer I knew that where ever this child was, that her screams were those of desperation. I went around this obstacle which I believe was a large chunk of concrete and there was a space that appeared to be the remains of a doorway and there sat this little girl. She had long black hair, I believe her to be about 7 or 8 years old. She suddenly stopped screaming and commenced to bang her head against the concrete door way.
Knowing no one was coming to her rescue, she was attempting to end her suffering by banging her head on the concrete doorway. I heard another scream, this time it was me screaming at the top of my voice for the little girl to stop. I walked around and over the rubble and came up toward the front and I saw this large square beam lying across her legs and there was blood everywhere, so much blood. All I could do is to kneel and pray for her, I was not able to touch her physically.
Cindy
Wars do not solve anything they just destroy lives
You prefer to be speaking German today? Think a Third Reich Canada would be more liberal than the one that is there now? True lots of wars are dumb, all are violent, but there are times when only war will solve the problem.
And, for those that would doubt, or disparage, remember, as Churchill (I think) once said, that We sleep soundly in our beds because rough men stand ready in the night to visit violence on those who would do us harm.
Your ability to abhor violence only comes about because others are willing to do it for you. Another case of people eating the meal, but passing the bill off to others.
I am only speaking of my feelings on it. I had a very close friend who came back from the Vietnam war who was messed up and practically died in my arms from cirrhosis of the liver, drank himself to death. I just wish there were other ways for people to settle their differences without war is all.
Violence only begets more violence. What happened during the first and second world war happened during the first and second world war, does it have to be repeated over and over again? What does all this throat cutting solve? I know that this is the way of the world but I don't have to like it. Ever heard of the twelve native grandmothers who were thrown in jail for demonstrating against war? I know one of them and I was there when they held the demonstration.
I was there along with those long haired trouble making hippies in New York in 62 during the demonstrations against the Vietnam war as well.Gettin a little old now but If the opportunity arose I would still demonstrate against wars. No offence intended to any one who fought valiantly in any of those wars, you have my deepest respects, but I can only pray that some day we will not have to fight such wars any longer.
Cindy
I too know Vietnam Vets who came home and were never the same, I do know others who were not destroyed by it too. I could say the same thing about what I do, the access to excess that we have has taken a large human toll, but other have walked through it and done OK. Hell, I know people who were all messed up by college. So it goes.
no, but i want to if it was only possible :(
Quote from: tekla on April 17, 2009, 11:24:11 AM
Wars do not solve anything they just destroy lives
You prefer to be speaking German today? Think a Third Reich Canada would be more liberal than the one that is there now? True lots of wars are dumb, all are violent, but there are times when only war will solve the problem.
And, for those that would doubt, or disparage, remember, as Churchill (I think) once said, that We sleep soundly in our beds because rough men stand ready in the night to visit violence on those who would do us harm.
Your ability to abhor violence only comes about because others are willing to do it for you. Another case of people eating the meal, but passing the bill off to others.
The Soviet Union would have crushed the Nazis on their own anyway, so by your logic the language would actually be Russian not German. Not of course that the Russians would have ever invaded Canada.
As for Churchill the British voters knew him well and kicked him out at their first opportunity to do so.
There appears to be a widening gulf between how North Americans and the rest of us see the World...
As a professional historian I just know that sometimes its a lot better to fight then to capitulate (as the Italians would have it).
Or as Jimmy Cliff puts it so well, But I'd rather be a free man in my grave, Than living as a puppet or a slave.
Also, as a 20th Century historian, with special emphasis on military history, I'm of the learned opinion that the Brits didn't deserve Churchill. In the same sense that the Americans didn't deserve Lincoln. He turned out to be better than the nation he saved. And he should have been listened to a lot more at the time he was really speaking.
And no doubt, Americans view military service very differently than most other nations and peoples do.
Quote from: tekla on April 22, 2009, 09:22:32 AM
As a professional historian I just know that sometimes its a lot better to fight then to capitulate (as the Italians would have it).
Really?
So you would have preferred Italy to remain a Fascist state under Benito Mussolini? To say I'm insulted is putting it mildly, if you really knew your history you would know that the Italian Army has fought to the death against overwhelming odds on numerous occasions. Adua, Amba Alagi, El Alamein to name but three.
If you insult Italians you insult me and my family personally.
Wash your big militaristic mouth out with soap.
I meant, that capitulate was an Italian word. I don't think that Italy would have been, or was, better under that creep, though I'm not exactly forgetting that the poor Ethiopians suffered more under him than the Italians did either.
And, you know - or perhaps not, we run into it a lot more here - you are not the Italian nation, or culture or anything of the like. To insult Italian culture, society, politics, art or anything else is not, nor will it ever, be a personal insult to you.
Arrendersi is the correct verb, Resa is the correct noun.
Quote from: tekla on April 22, 2009, 10:06:53 AM
I meant, that capitulate was an Italian word.
This is incorrect (unless you mean in the sense that the word derives from Latin, and Latin originated in ancient Italy). The term
capitulation (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capitulations_of_the_Ottoman_Empire) comes from the history of the Ottoman Empire in the 17th century. It referred to European powers taking hegemony over parts of the Ottoman lands, and originally meant a bilateral deal negotiated between the powers. "Capitulation" refers to the chapter headings in the treaties, because
capitulum (literally 'small head') is the Latin word for 'chapter'. In the 19th century it came to be synonymous with surrender, when the Ottoman state weakened and European powers took advantage of it.
Thank you Hypatia for clearing that up. :)
I wish there was more I could do but like I say I am getting a little to old for physical demonstrations, and just how affective thees demonstrations were anyway Great Spirit knows, but doing something is better then doing nothing.
I do believe that everything we do in life has some affect to a greater or lesser degree, even a negligible effect on another is a productive and positive act if it is in the effort of accomplishing something that will have positive results.
So write a letter to your Congressman, premier, the Pope, the Queen of Duchy of Grand Fenwick if need be, and pray. meanwhile take time do what you can to help the less fortunate, veteran's included, right here in your own home town/city. And again pray.
Cindy
If I may add to the topic...
While wars destroy lives and countries, IMO there are times when they are justified; the allied attacks on the Axis Nations during WWII, the invasion of Cambodia by Vietnam to oust Pol Pot and his gang in the 70's for example. And think how many lives would have been saved had the UN intervened in Rwanda, they may have saved 800,000 to 1,000,000 Tutsis lives. Instead the world stood by and watched approx 20% of the population massacred by the Hutus.
LH
Capitulate well it means, exactly, to surrender under conditions, which as it turns out, are not all that hot. Though, the Italians capitulated to the Allies advance, thus not risking what happened to Germany, where no building was left intact after the advance, be it from the West or from the East, they have yet to get a real government in power since that day. So it goes.
However, the only decision that Italy made quicker than attacking Ethiopia, was to surrender to the Allies, hence, about the only good choice it made in about a 30 year period. But, what it (Italy) did to Ethiopia was worthy of a hell a lot more Italians being hung for crimes against humanity then were actually put on the noose.
It's really beginning to piss me off all these slurs about Italians.
Try Wikipedia...
On 14 March, by the time the next assault on Keren commenced, Platt's force of about 13,000 men faced a re-inforced Italian defense of about 23,000 men. Once again, both sides fought with determination and both sides suffered heavy losses. It took until 27 March for Keren to fall.[48] In the account of the battle written in Eastern Epic, an official history of the British Indian Army in World War II, Compton Mackenzie wrote:
Keren was as hard a soldiers' battle as was ever fought, and let it be said that nowhere in the war did the Germans fight more stubbornly than those [Italian] Savoia battalions, Alpini, Bersaglieri and Grenadiers. In the [first] five days' fight the Italians suffered nearly 5,000 casualties - 1,135 of them killed. Lorenzini, the gallant young Italian general, had his head blown off by one of the British guns. He had been a great leader of Eritrean troops[49]
The unfortunate licence of wartime propaganda allowed the British Press to represent the Italians almost as comic warriors; but except for the German parachute division in Italy and the Japanese in Burma no enemy with whom the British and Indian troops were matched put up a finer fight than those Savoia battalions at Keren. Moreover, the Colonial troops, until they cracked at the very end, fought with valour and resolution, and their staunchness was a testimony to the excellence of the Italian administration and military training in Eritrea.
As for Italy never having had a real (your words again) government since 1945 much of that can be blamed on US and specifically CIA manipulation of the Italian political scene. Everything possible was done to prevent the "sorpasso" of the PCI under Berlinguer including infiltration of tthe SISDE and SISMI, the establishment of Operazione Gladio, the P2 Lodge, support for far-right terrorism NAR etc, infiltration and manipulation of the Brigate Rosse and Prima Linea. All summed up in the definition - La Strategia della Tensione.
That together with the million deaths caused by CIA involvement in 60's Indonesia really sticks in my throat as I have family in both countries AND was there at the time AND was a Communist.
I have nothing against the American people but your country has brought untold misery to millions around the world.
Everyone was dumping ->-bleeped-<- on everyone's door step back then. It's a good "remember when" that shouldn't be repeated and we should all be learning a lesson from those errors and hang up the bayonets once and for all. These bayonets are unfortunate relics, reminders from a past civilisation of unrest and destruction.
The band-aid girl, Cindy
Yes.
US Army
2002-present
Iraq 2007-2008
Still in.
*shh*
I spent twenty years in the Army. Not too sure I would do it again. Everyone thinks I am rich from my retirement pay. It doesn't even cover the mortgage. I do believe that everyone should at least do a few years in the military as a character builder.
If you don't mind my asking, what MOS?
Myself, I began as a 94L Avionics Commo, but switched to the much more enjoyable 31B Military Police on 2005.
Quote from: stephanie_craxford on June 13, 2006, 08:19:27 PM
As mentioned in other topics, many here here seemed to have served in their countries armed forces or reserves I was wondering just how mny there were?
Steph
I served in the army for 15 yrs,then i quited for the same reason being with you all here! ;D
Currently trying very hard to get into the Naval Academy. But it's a battle, and prospects look dim. If not that, then ROTC. So I may soon. I want to serve my country, infamous though it may be, I have my reasons.
Yep, trying to be a real man, but those feeling never went away. Many of the Army guys who knew me, knew I was just not aggressive as a man shoulg be. I got picked on and was ostracised. I was investigated by CID for the possibility of homosexual tendencies.
I never had sex with a man. I just wanted to be a woman!
Dani
Quote from: Dani on October 05, 2009, 11:27:02 PM
I never had sex with a man.
I highly recommend it. ;)
Sorry, it's been a long time and it seems I'm getting boy crazy. Back on topic:
Although it's a slightly dusty discussion, something I noticed missing from this thread was the money aspect. Are the veterans here just not using the educational benefits? I'm working on a masters degree, and am funded up to my eyeballs with military and federal grants, and use student loans and such to pay for medical stuff. I occasionally get a job
when I'm bored but not out of necessity. Someone a while back started hrt through the VA, however we haven't heard from her in a while so maybe that wasn't the greatest idea. Anyway that's a heck of a deal for four years of time when most of us weren't going to be doing much else anyway.
I served in the Reserve of the Armed Forces in Aust well post-op. It earned me extra income whilst I was working for a Government Department.
Quote from: Becca on October 06, 2009, 01:39:19 AMit seems I'm getting boy crazy.
yeah, me too. Men in uniform... mmmmm >:-)
Quote from: Becca on October 06, 2009, 01:39:19 AM
Are the veterans here just not using the educational benefits? I'm working on a masters degree, and am funded up to my eyeballs with military and federal grants
I'm actually surprised to hear that. When the recruiters were pestering me when I was in high school they were trying to sell me on money for college with the stated amount being "up to $5,000." At the time in question $5k wasn't going to cover much college.
Quoteyeah, me too. Men in uniform... mmmmm
It's getting almost silly too. I was eyeballing the waiter at the pizza restaurant the other night and making up absurd fantasies in my head...I think I scared him but that red and black outfit was just mmmm.
No 5k wouldn't cover much college at all, just under 6 months worth here not counting books, lol. I don't know what to say about that, because the cap is closer to 60k. I'm not sure exactly how it breaks down, the 5k was probably from one of a few different sources. Anyway I don't mean to advocate for service, hardly, but just point out that it's not a total waste of time and you also learn things like bearing and discipline, which along with enough money can go a long way. There's always the college thing too, I just did it because I wasn't doing anything else really, and now four years in I kinda wish I'd gone to beauty school instead. If a traditional degree isn't what someone wanted i can see it not being worthwhile, because they'd never see the main benefit.
I can't speak to the source either; I just enjoyed how the recruiters seemed to think $5k a great benefit and couldn't understand why nobody bit. The two colleges I attended (first a junior college then another after graduating from that) both cost well over that.
I decided the military wasn't for me for a few reasons. The largest was probably that throughout my teens my father regularly insisted that how he treated me (strict and usually severe) was downright mild compared to what the Army was like. In retrospect, he was probably wrong in several ways, most not worth going into here.
I still owe thousands of $$ to the Aus Government in HECS fees.
HECS = Higher Education Contribution Scheme is what we have down here.
I still owe thousand of dollars from my Uni days. I took a B.S.Wk (4 year undergraduate)
i was active duty air force, than i went army national guard, finished up air force national guard(about 15yrs)
Wow! really surprised at that poll result; close to 50% served in the military!!
I served here in the UK and overseas, I spent 10 years in uniform, I'd rather not say in which service or when. What I will say it was a privelidge to serve, I had some incredible experiences, made some wonderful freindships, and I miss them dearly.
No, but I REALLY wanted to be a pilot in the Marines....sadly, medical reasons prevent me from joining any of the services. :'(
I'm not surprised at the percentage of ex-service(wo)men. It is apparently a standard route to proving masculinity to yourself.
I tried for the RAAF as aircrew, but didn't quite get in. I joined the Police instead, and was in for a week short of 30 years.
It would be interesting to see how many were in the Emergency Services as well as the armed forces.