I'm curious has anyone ever been so introverted most of their life that they find it harder and harder to break free of this void of emptiness ? I know for a fact that I myself seem to be in this rut at 22 now , no friends , no social existance , but longing to be able to find a group of people just right for me !
yup! Im there...I have horrible social anxiety...no real friends, dont go anywhere.
I am married and its great, and Im pretty happy staying home...
but Im a social misfit
Well I was socially isolated for a long time. I did not have friends in my teens or twenties, I did not hang out. oddly enough I am less isolated now by far and still progressing.
Beni
*Makes Tim Burton type faces*
Ugh...I'm so isolated, a padded room with a locked door in an empty corridor insane assylum would be more social activity than my daily life. I exaggerate, of course, but I don't have friends. I don't go places (unless forced, or persuaded by my own needs/wants.) I am really just one sorry person. I think I've wasted all 19 years of my life, and all 4 years of my high school experience. Oddly enough, I don't regret not going to those social events-I regret not going to those social events because of so many of my dysphoria/self-esteem related issues.
LOL, now I'm just a touch depressed. :D
Also, nice amount of tags there...think you got enough? ;)
I'm so ir-reversably introverted and anti-social. Sorry if that sounds negative, but it is so. It makes me sick sometimes. I can't be anywhere w/o getting so totally anxious that I leave. Malls, bars, the grocery store. 3 foot rule all the time, PLEASE!!
But, in the same light, I can't get my friends to visit me at my place, it seems there's trolls under the bridges waiting to chew them up if they travel more than 15 miles from their home.
I found it all to easy to stay in my room, or in the library till it closed and it seemed to me I was missing something in the whole college deal, so I began to force myself to do the social deal. It's not all that bad, and once you get used to it, it even has some good aspects, so I work to put myself into social settings still.
This was emailed to me. I thank the author. I don't have the right or anything to the copyright. I hope I am not breaking rules.
We start out early being ostracized by the other kids
because they know we are different. If our brain is female the boys
don't want to hang around a girl and the girls don't want to be with an
icky boy. If we have a male brain and a female body the girls don't want
to be with a pushy boy and the boys see just a girl. Occasionally there
may be a girl who sees the girl in us, or a boy who sees the boy in us
and becomes our friend.
As time goes by we get verbally and physically abused. This abuse comes
from "friends," peers, siblings and parents. It may occur from total
strangers and often goes a far as rape and murder.
We question ourselves with "What's wrong with me?", knowing, but still
not accepting the unthinkable cruelty of being in the "wrong body." We
are alone thinking that we are the only person alive who has this kind of
feelings.
We pray and ask God or another deity to change us or we try to use magic
so what is between our legs finally matches our mind. Disappointed and
frustrated, we are still in the wrong body.
We also get that "What's wrong with you?" "discussion" that is really a
speech, resulting in being coerced into playing football and learning how
to fight because dad wants to "make a man" out of us or mom makes us
learn how to cook, sew, clean house and other feminine things so we will
become good housewives. Sometimes trying to fit in, we do it to
ourselves, usually without success. But that doesn't mean we can fight
our way out of a paper bag or boil water without burning it.
Then our bodies betray us. We become that big hairy clod instead of the
pretty petite girl we see in our mind's eye. For a male in a female body
we are still 5' 2", 98 lbs. soaking wet after bodybuilding.
Many of us learn to hide our true selves by pretending to be the sex our
body says we are. Often we marry and have children. But we are not
honest. We are false witnesses. Internally, the male and female parts
of our bodies and minds are constantly fighting so we never get that
inner peace called contentment.
Some of us suppress our need so strongly that we tell the world that we
are not transgendered. Yet, we feel a need to crossdress. Some of us may
need to have someone else tell us, or even force us to crossdress.
We hide in other ways, too. Some hide with death. I am proud of those
who have kept their promise to me not to commit suicide. One recently
asked me to release her from that promise. I had to tell her only if she
had a medical condition that warrants "Do Not Resuscitate." We might
also do self harm, a "minor" form of suicide. I have heard of some of us
that cut off their testicles, or tried to. Some of us hide by having
unsafe sex resulting in gonorrhea, syphilis, or AIDS. In other words: a
slow form of suicide.
Or we hide behind drugs. Hopefully those of us that go that route end up
in Alcoholics Anonymous, other treatment centers before we
either end up in jail or die.
We often develop various forms of mental illness, as a product of the
extreme shame or bewilderment we have. We are admitted to psychiatric
treatment centers or at least, being driven by guilt or unable to accept
the unacceptable, we talk to psychologists or psychiatrists. Many of us
are depressed and end up on anti depressants.
We also don't know how to relate to others. We are alone so we don't
pick up the interrelationship clues that other teens learn because they
are with friends. As adults we don't know how to deal with people so
find ourselves alone or, because we are afraid of people gravitate
towards rural areas because there are less people to deal with or major
urban areas because there everyone is anonymous.
Many of us are "read" and caught out partially because we are fearful of
being read and caught out. We also might be read because there are few
genetic 6' 2" women. Even after transition we may be mentally looking
over our shoulders to see if anyone is outing us, either maliciously or
unintentionally. Either way we could be hurt and humiliated if it
happens.
We are also more likely to have heart attacks and other diseases caused
by stress due to the never ending battle between the male and female
within us. This stress, beginning in early age, can result in poor
education that leads to low paying jobs with low or no medical coverage.
This leads to our inability to get proper medical care, even for medical
issues not connected to transgender or age dysphoria, creating still more
stress. Our desperation to transition is so great and our finances so
small we may resort to self medication, sometimes through the internet.
Yet, the use of these drugs needs to be monitored or we run the risk of
hurting ourselves or dying.
In the end some of us decide to transition, trying to make our bodies
match our minds, even though it is like building a house starting on the
second floor. Others decide not to. That is O. K., too. As noted
before many of us cannot afford the many expensive procedures that are
necessary to truly transition. We often transition with great
difficulty. The woman trapped in a male body has to somehow hide her
beard. A female to male still has breasts to deal with.
Yet at this time we begin to choose life, and most of us gain that inner
peace because we can be our true selves. It is strange that this is the
time others tell us we are going to Hell when, in reality, we have just
gotten out of it. The hate they give us is sometimes greater than the
contempt that should be reserved for murderers. But they forget that "we
have not come into being to hate and destroy, (but instead) to praise, to
labor and to love." The hate goes so far that some religious institutions
have barred us from even entering their houses of worship or require us
to wear "gender neutral" clothing.
Sometimes there is the issue of how we are addressed. For example, some
of us have been asked, "What does your son or daughter call you?" One
child of a male to female woman stated that she is his father. Both are
proud of that statement. The daughter of another referred to her now
female father as mom and both were happy with the reference. The pronoun
used by the child, parent or sibling may give pride, as in these
examples, or it may hurt the transgendered individual.
In public the male or female reference to us may be at times different.
To the same individual sometimes the "sir" or "madam" may not be
important other times it is. It could even hurt, especially when it
comes from "friends" and family.
. I AM asking
you to follow the words that are almost in the center of the Torah: to
love your neighbor as you love yourself. It is a hallmark of the Western
religions and many of the others. The rest is just commentary.
Notes: References
Biblical quotes paragraphing and references: Haphtarah reading: Isaiah:
51:12-52:12, specifically: 51:21-22 and Mona Vu 52:7
Others: Exodus 20:13 Leviticus 19:18 Numbers 6:25 Deuteronomy 30:
15-19
"The rest is just commentary" is from a quote in the Talmud from Hillel
the Great who lived about 2300 years ago. A man went to Hillel as
challenged, "If you can tell me the whole of the Torah while standing on
one foot I will become a Jew." Hillel responded, "What is hateful to
thee do not do to another. That is the whole of the torah. The rest is
just commentary. Now go study."
"To hate and destroy ..." is a slightly rephrasing of part of the prayer
for peace by Rabbi Nachman of Breslov as told by Rabbi Nathan.
"Building a house ...": a comment by Kaitlin Thompson, an author of
transgender fiction and a member of the "Family"
True Selves: is a book by Mildred L Brown and Chloe Ann Rounsley. I have
been told it is one of the best of many books on the transgendered
condition. I have not read it.
Accepting the unacceptable/Enduring the unendurable: is part of and
paraphrasing a quote by Hirohito in his message of surrender ending WWII:
"We have resolved to endure the unendurable and suffer what is
insufferable."
I thank Holly Hart, Allysson de Merel, Nori Herras, Angela Rasch, Donna
Riley and Heather Rose Brown for their comments, suggestions, editing and
proofing.
I would love to acknowledge the author but the message stands
Cindy James
I am very socially isolated here. Work is where I mostly interact with other people in real life. When I'm around other guys at work and they start talking about women in degrading ways, I feel uncomfortable and sad. When the guys go out, I know they kind of expect me to join them but I never do because I know I just won't enjoy doing the stereotypical guys night out stuff. I'm afraid they'll suspect something about me so I do my best to pretend I'm just one of the boys at work. But it is all a big act ,and everyday is holloween as I don my male costume.
I have no social life outside of work. The last relationship I had was with a girl when I was 16 and it lasted only two weeks. Beyond wearing the shirt, pants, and putting on the mediocre act that I do at work; I have a hard time pretending to be a man. In public I'm introverted, have a difficult time trusting, and I'm constantly holding back the woman inside me that wants to express herself. I enjoy interacting with women but not neccessarily the way expected of a man. I yearn to have that sisterly relationship with other women.
Cindy James, thank you for posting that. That was a great read. Loved it hun.
Mika
I'm sort of borderline Aspergers, so I really don't relate to other people and other people don't relate to me.
This applies equally to guys and girls. It's just *people*...
I don't mind being fairly isolated though. I'm not like that due to anxiety, I just find that conucting socialisation appropriately is tiring (it does not come naturally, I have to think about everything), and finding the majority of people bland and uninteresting means that I avoid socialisation much of the time.
I do have friends though. I like going for nights out, and that would be no fun (and rather dangerous) by myself. That is basically the purpose of my friends.
I do have fun and intersting conversations with them too, sometimes. That's nice.
:-\ I guess I'm the outlier here. I'm not socially isolated. I've plenty of friends, and I make more quite easily with random people I meet. Get along well with adults as well, despite being on the younger end of that spectrum.
I've been socially isolated for as long as I can remember, becoming more and more extreme over time. I was divorced in 2000. Since that time I have stayed in my room in my parents house in front of this computer leaving only once a month for groceries. I did live on my own in an apt. for about 5 months leaving that only rarely for groceries. I was with my ex-wife before and during marriage for about 5 years. I rarely left the house then also. She had friends who would come over and I would tolerate them for a short while. Previous to that I was with a girlfriend for 5 years with the same sort of arrangement. Previous to that I was completely isolated in my room for a full year save a brief job at a no-kill animal shelter where I could again, be isolated from humans. All in all I haven't had a "friend" since the mid 1990's. As I sit here now I have been isolated in my room for nearly 9 years. I have/had? a pretty severe social anxiety ..."thing". I've been diagnosed with all sorts of things spending brief periods of time in-patient at "hospitals". A few of the things I had difficulty with were situational completely...experiencing abuse vicariously through partners, and emotionally and physically abused by a partner. It is however *very* clear to me now what the true problem was and is. And since my revelation...since I released the repression I caged myself with I find that I fear people and social situations less and less. I am in the wrong body and I have manufactured a fake, thin coating of masculinity out of fear...to keep from getting beaten up more than I was and to draw as little attention to myself as possible. That I have decided to change this gives me joy beyond measure :0).
This is something i fear about coming out, i have a good group of friends, we have been on holiday together and are good friends. But if i came out to them as being a MTF then i would be shunned socially and i know it. They wouldnt want to know me.
Yeah, definitely socially isolated. I have a hard time communicating socially. I realized that I was going to work just to meet people. I've tried to do what Tekla was talking about, putting myself out there, but sometimes the panicky wanting to hide feeling overtakes me.
You know, not so much. During high school I didn't have a lot of friends, but I had a couple close friends that I hung out with a lot and I had the social friends in class and during lunch. During college I started becoming more outgoing and moved in with a couple friends (whom I still live with) and we threw house parties and went out a lot to the local clubs, I went/go to raves with my old friends from high school still. Nobody has shunned me yet, everyone's been awesome about my transition, so I haven't had to give up any friends or anything. However, I have noticed a decline in the amount I go out these days since going full time due to the fact that I'm still a bit uncomfortable with my looks, but even that hasn't taken away my social life, just cut it down a bit. I'm expecting that it'll increase again though once I'm comfortable with my looks again, but I've been noticing more and more lately that I don't really care what people think anymore, or at least not nearly as much as I used to.
I have to agree with what others have said here about it all being about attitude. I don't think attitude is 100% of it, but it's a major enough factor that you need to take it into consideration and try and get over any self-consciousness you may feel about yourself. Once you do you'll feel a huge weight come off your shoulders and life will start falling into place.
Yeah. I mean, I had some friends at highschool and during university, but I was never outgoing or anything along those lines. I had a pretty low opinion of myself so I avoided social settings 'cause they were of course only going to confirm those low opinions ... that's what I thought anyway. Later though I really started making an effort to interact with people, so I started mimicking my dad in how he easily he interacts with strangers, and I started forcing myself to make conversation with checkout people and taxi drivers and whatever else have you. That gradually moved on to going out to clubs and parties and stuff, and yeah, the rest is history. It's still not easy for me, but I find I can fake it pretty well. ^_^
Mina.
at one point I got so bad that I didn't leave my house for over a year
at all
I wouldn't even answer the phone
everything and everyone made me panic
at the beginning of this year when I started to accept who I really was it started to get better and I made some friends, but I was really forcing myself to be sociable and still really wanted to be safe at home alone
since coming out and having everyone accept me, the social anxiety has pretty much gone. I'm barely in the house any more, I just come home to change clothes most the time. Life is much better like this ;D
wow, a lot of people like me :)
I use to get horrible social anxiety. I'd have to work up nerve to walk out the door and go to work. And there I'd just stay at my desk and do my job. Phones would also cause a lot of anxiety (not good when my job involves answering phones).
I've gotten much better about it but I still don't have any friends. When I was younger I use to have a bunch of online buddies, but that number has dwindled down.
I'm pretty sure this comes from my anti-social tendencies. I'll be fine with hanging out and stuff, but then I hit a period where I can't stand to be around people, even thru online chats. I'm hoping as I work through my gender issues I won't go through so many periods like this.
Totally, but really, that's how I usually want it. I'd like to have more friends, but considering I'm a compulsive introvert and erstwhile misanthropist, it's a bit difficult. I like to meet people online, because they talk. I hate small talk. I enjoy actually having real talks with people, and the vast majority of folks aren't into that.
I had quite a few friends in high school, a lot at the first college I went to, but I quickly learned that the best way to get the alone time I need is to keep people at a distance. It may not be for the best, but for the most part, I'm fine with it. I have my wife, who is usually good for conversation, and I have many friends I keep in touch with via the internet. If I could meet those people in reality, I'd have a plethora of friends. I'm good.
SD
Quote from: Osiris on December 28, 2008, 11:40:40 PMPhones would also cause a lot of anxiety (not good when my job involves answering phones).
OMG yes. I still can't make a phonecall without MAKING myself do it, and I will try to palm that pohone off on ANYBODY else so I don't have to answer it.
Mina.
Quote from: mina.m->-bleeped-<-ie link=topic=52538.msg324802#msg324802 date=1230532508
Quote from: Osiris on December 28, 2008, 11:40:40 PMPhones would also cause a lot of anxiety (not good when my job involves answering phones).
OMG yes. I still can't make a phonecall without MAKING myself do it, and I will try to palm that pohone off on ANYBODY else so I don't have to answer it.
Mina.
Yeah, the sound of a phone ringing still gives me a jolt of panic.
I am still introverted, but that is more from a lack of money to go anywhere. But soon that will change I hope.
Janet
i'm not socially isolated, i have a fair number of friends that i hang out with often, go to parties most weekends, i'm usually out doing random things. but i'm also an introvert, i enjoy spending time by myself, i usually wake up in the morning and just chill for a couple hours by myself before i start my day and enjoy it quite a bit. it also takes me a really long time to feel comfortable around people, when i go to clubs or parties i'm always with at least one other person i know, otherwise i would hardly talk
Right now, yes. I go through periods of extreme extroversion and extreme introversion. These periods typically last from a few months to a few years. when in the extroversion stage, I surround myself with both friends and strangers 24/7.
Right now, I'm in the isolation stage. The last time I was social was several months back when I dated a girl for a while. Girls come with all sorts of obligations, like going out, meeting her friends, etc. Now that it's over, it's back to happy isolation.
Well I socialise at work, and I socialise at college and I meet up with a few different groups of friends every week, and me and my landlady chat - so I am pleased to dive back into my room by myself for a bit.
I must say that it's quite nice that this forum topic has allowed alot of us to fully open up about our fears of being social or actually being able to find a social group that we can fit neatly into . For me , It's not that I don't want to find friends it's more like what I enjoy isn't most people's interests . I am very simple love to shop , go to a coffee shop and talk or go for a walk or watch horror movies but im not the type that's really into partying or bars or clubs as I don't drink really , don't smoke , don't do any drugs and definatley can't dance lol . Im making a vow to figure out what it is about me that seems to lack for me not to be able to make the transition of having friends from online into a face to face meeting . It's very nerve wracking indeed . But it's also rewarding . Who knows maybe some toronto people will get to know me and hang out , I can only hope that this year will be better ! fingers crossed . Thanks to all who posted as well it's really great to see im not alone we're all in this together !
Quote from: Karma86 on December 27, 2008, 09:04:13 PM
I'm curious has anyone ever been so introverted most of their life that they find it harder and harder to break free of this void of emptiness?
You're assuming being alone is bad and causes feelings of emptiness? Maybe for some people, but some people are comfortable being alone most of the time and only need social contact as they go through life or a group of close friends. I'm one of those. I only very rarely feel lonely or "emptiness" with my life and situation. I have far too many things to do than feel that way. And I have the support I need for my transistion and trust my intuition.
This is describe in Anneli Rufus' book "Party of One (http://www.annelirufus.com/about.html)". So, while the feelings you describe are fair, don't assume it's universal.
As for telephones, why not use an answering machine or voice mail, and remember you can always turn the ringer off. I do both and tell folks to leave a message and I'll call you back. I hate phones but know they're a requirement of life, but it's my choice how I use it.
As a youngster I had severe anxiety about social situations. I always felt like I stuck out in any situation, and found myself with nothing interesting to say when introduced to people, or I would say something stupid. I hated parties and any other social situations. So I engaged in solitary activities like reading and hiking in the woods and had few friends. I was always amazed when people would try to befriend me.
Now that i'm (much) older i've overcome the anxiety for the most part. I often travel to new places for my work, a thought that in the past would send me into an anxious panic but now I just get it done. Also, i've found out that people don't automatically recoil from me in social situations. I try to be well read so that I have conversation starters at the ready. I still have few friends and prefer to hang out at the house rather than go out to clubs, etc. I can usually navigate most any social situation, but it's still uncomfortable.
There's another good book about it called Solitude by Anthony Storr
Some people (like me) genuinely prefer being alone.
Alone =/= lonely.
"Being social" still exhausts me. I greatly prefer one-on-one interactions to groups and end up needing my "alone time" after things like holidays.
My childhood was spent among books, documentaries, movies and cartoons; adults loved me. Well, the ones that didn't want me to have girlfriends or play soccer at least.
I can fake being social (since I'm quite fearless and I've taught myself to be so) for a while, but eventually the overpowering feeling is that most people bore me to death. Not a super genius or anything though, just strange.
I don't find people boring, i find online people can be very dull, but there is so often other stories playing under the eyes of real people, can be quite interesting.
I don't feel like I'm introverted as I am not a shy person. I do not have any friends only aquaintences at work. I don't get invited anywhere. I am married and she is my only friend. We are only friends now. I don't know how to act in social situations, I do my best to fake it. When my partner is at work and I have the day off, I have no one to go and have social time with. I go to movies, coffee and anyother place, by my self. I don't know what I have done wrong but I know it doesn't have to do with my past as being transexual.
Quote from: Pica Pica on December 29, 2008, 11:48:24 AM
I don't find people boring, i find online people can be very dull, but there is so often other stories playing under the eyes of real people, can be quite interesting.
Oh it's not an online/RL deal for me, it's generalized.
Ive always been pretty introvert.
seems to be a common theme with all of you's too and beyond work i also spend alot ot time alone. I'd rather be spending it inside with a girlfriend anyday but all in good time.
Sometimes you just have to be patient or really push yourself out of the door to make the effort i guess.
Quote from: soldierjane on December 29, 2008, 11:41:42 AM
I can fake being social (since I'm quite fearless and I've taught myself to be so) for a while
I guess I can fake being social too as none of my family seems to realize the overwhelming anxiety i feel in social situations. I fake being fearless as well. For me its my stubborness that lets me do things socially. If I say I 'm going to do something, I have to do it. I can't go backwards so I have to go forwards.
Quote from: Pica Pica on December 29, 2008, 11:48:24 AM
I don't find people boring, i find online people can be very dull, but there is so often other stories playing under the eyes of real people, can be quite interesting.
That only happens when the observer inhabits their own little world and romanticizes everything.
I used to be extremely introverted and still am in some ways. I still like to be introverted and alone from time to time but also because of my interests(especially in college) I find it easier to be social because I'd miss out on a lot more fun than I already do.
Yes I am, and have been.
Very hard etc.
But now I have a group of friends like me(Not the CD Part etc.)who dont judge, hold grudges, or go with the crowd and feel right in. So theres a place for everyone.
I'm very socially isolated. In my life people have not been too nice to me and it hurt so I just isolate myself from people. The only people I talk to are my parents and brother and they irritate the hell out of me. I yearn to interact with people but since I can't live as the gender I want to be I can't socialize well. I can't introduce myself with my chosen name because I'm too afraid that I'm going to get weird looks like "You're not a boy" or something. I'm thinking of picking the name Mola just because it sounds Androgynous and I at least look a little androgynous. Sorry I trailed off...but yeah I'm really socially introverted
yeah I don't have any friends my age in real life :/
No, not really. I have tons of friends, and while there are days when I sit in my dorm rather than running off to hang out with friends, it's only because I want to sit around, not because I don't have stuff to do.
Not really, I love my friends.
I guess I'm just one of those magical social ->-bleeped-<-s... :\
I feel like most people avoid me, and I try to entertain people.. To be happy near them.
Apparently I'm not good enough to anyone geographically near me. I hate all of this crap...
I'm extremely introverted and anxiety-ridden and it gets worse the more i isolate myself. i used to have friends but in my depression i lost them..
All the time i just focus on what people are thinking of me even if i dont want to, even if i wanna break free. i work myself up so bad, i get so extremely nervous that i slip up and just go blank when i speak.
it seems like a lot of TS/TG people are like this, i dunno maybe there's a corelation either genetically or with how we grew up feeling repressed.. im not sure i can blame all of this on my gender problems tho but its certainly played a part in this whole mess. even back as a kid, when my brain was on 'autopilot', i was still really shy and just kind of a weird kid, but i still made friends.
like you guys i wanna get out and meet people but its hard to get the courage, or to even know where to go or what to do or say. and yes its exhausting to socialize as well - especially being depressed, it just wears me out even imagining trying to keep friends..
i love having alone time but i think to a certain point it becomes unhealthy when you stay locked in your room all day and lose all your friends and have no relationship with your family members.. and then you do things like go on yahoo answers or youtube all day and just go bored out of your mind like i am now lol.. im pathetic..
Quote from: Rene' aka candygirl on December 30, 2008, 09:14:41 PM
I was socially isolated ( rejected by school mates ) not only because I was a very different little kid, but, also because my parents insisted and got a lawyer to back them, that I was to be isolated from the main body of the school...Therefore I began my early life with my parents, siblings and special educators. I was in a forced isolation. It wasn't until I became a teenager of 14ish and 15, that I was taken out into the larger more complex world. It took nearly 20 years of therapy, to acclimate me enough to be able to venture around without total supervision...I am still edgy today. I am a split of extroverted/and introverted. Depends on the situation.
It does not surprise me at all, that many or most MtF's/ FtM's grew up more or less isolated and friendless. Trans-gendered people have a vibe that we send off, that others pick upon, that we are not who we seem to be...it hurts us socially, very terribly I know. Enough sometimes, that it pushes TS's to the brink of ending their lives. Knowing your not that different from the rest of us, young and old, and have a place to share some of the same mental pains and internalized loneliness...should be of some comfort to you. We are all here for the same reasons...to share our experiences, and learn within an environment of love and openness. Nobody should be here that wants to just create anarchy in the forums and posts. Hugs and Love...
Too true.
eh... a little Have 3 really good friends in a bit of a slump
I live with my best friend so I always have her...
My neighbor from my parents house lives 10 mins away still and we normally hang out quite a bit but with the intense load of school and varying work schedules not so much
My third lives a good bit away[30+ mins] so that is an issue
I don't have issues with being social once I start meeting people, but I am very slow at getting comfortable with new groups and people. I hate large groups and would rather havea a couple really good friends than a lot of friends. I had no trouble with social situations until I moved across the country and became a sort of hermit for almost a year. I became comfortable at that school and then graduated. I went to a school quite near my high school and as most of my friends were younger than me and still around I didn't bother getting myself out there to meet new people. Now I'm finally bothering to get myself out there and hang out with my peers.
Approaching new people makes me extremely nervous and uncomfortable... If I'm only going to meet you once I'm absolutely insane but if I'm going to see you regularly I can never think of anything to say and just wish I could sink into the ground... I think that stems more from my ADHD and middle school friends calling me annoying due to my over enthusiasm and hyperactivity. I don't really fear people rejecting me for the gender issues at least not the people I'm sort of starting to hang out with now... Theatre majors are generally very open minded...
I've told a couple about my top surgery and may be rooming with one of them next year...
I've always been introverted, although I can be outgoing in my work. I have a few close friends and my partner, otherwise I tend to spend a lot of time alone by choice. Some of it is my nature, some of it is needing quiet time to compose and write, and some of it is hating to have to go out in the world being perceived as someone I'm not.
Z
I have friends; I've a great group of guys who include me in most of their activities, even though they know nothing of my desire to transition male. I worked hard to gain their approval, to get invited to the events that other girls don't go to; but I still feel lonely. It's said that any type of isolation is enough to drive men mad; leadership, or a secret that you can share with no one.
I'm surrounded by friends often, but I still feel isolated, because at the moment people see me as neither male nor female; they have a hard time relating with me, and I know somehow I'm missing out on so much.
Quote from: Karma86 on December 27, 2008, 09:04:13 PM
I'm curious has anyone ever been so introverted most of their life that they find it harder and harder to break free of this void of emptiness ? I know for a fact that I myself seem to be in this rut at 22 now , no friends , no social existance , but longing to be able to find a group of people just right for me !
I have a gang of 54 cows i hang with every day and 13 chickens and 7 goats and 2 cats and of course my horse buddy so am i aloneeeeee yesssssssssssssssssss helppppppppppppppp i need a paaaaarrrrrtttttnnnneeeerrrrrr
Quote from: postoplesbian on January 01, 2009, 06:00:20 PM
Quote from: Karma86 on December 27, 2008, 09:04:13 PM
I'm curious has anyone ever been so introverted most of their life that they find it harder and harder to break free of this void of emptiness ? I know for a fact that I myself seem to be in this rut at 22 now , no friends , no social existance , but longing to be able to find a group of people just right for me !
I have a gang of 54 cows i hang with every day and 13 chickens and 7 goats and 2 cats and of course my horse buddy so am i aloneeeeee yesssssssssssssssssss helppppppppppppppp i need a paaaaarrrrrtttttnnnneeeerrrrrr
What? No sheep? I'm sorry, I can't be your friend. Sheep are required for my friendship. :icon_lol:
Quote from: Karma86 on December 27, 2008, 09:04:13 PM
I'm curious has anyone ever been so introverted most of their life that they find it harder and harder to break free of this void of emptiness ? I know for a fact that I myself seem to be in this rut at 22 now , no friends , no social existance , but longing to be able to find a group of people just right for me !
I had to check your username just in case i posted this one and didnt remember!
Its a little different for me, i have friends, infact i have alot of friends and i know a hell of alot of people however from the age of about 13 i have hidden myself from all of them including family, i created a different me for people to see and to be friends with as i couldnt risk them finding out about the REAL me plus i dont even know who or what that is!
The place i have found my self in now is i have no one! i have people around me but i cant talk to any of them about why im so depressed, why i dont enjoy life and these crazy feelings i have. im completly alone even tho i have poeple around me. i cry myself to sleep almost every night and on the rare occasion that i dont i wake up in the middle of the night with tears in my eyes.
If god came to me and said i will give you any one thing that you want, most people would choose, money, love, house etc. All i want is...... someone to hold me, tell me everything is going to be alright and help me find out why i hate my life. someone to rest my head on watching tv, this isnt a sexual need, i need someone that i can show the real me to even if it will be incredibly hard and scary.
Just want you to know that you aint the only one, i have a void inside of me that i dont understand, want, or have a clue how to fill. it actually phyiscally hurts on occasion.
Anyway i've talked too much, i always do that!
WHAT WE NEED IS A PLACE OF OUR OWN where we can all be together and help one another.. I am thinking of traveling this spring thru the mounains of the west and living off the land. I would love to have a gang of us traveling with horses and animals and such planting foods in the summer and then traveling south for the winter but staying out of towns and cities and just being a nomadic TS group.. anyone want to join me ???
WHAT WE NEED IS A PLACE OF OUR OWN where we can all be together and help one another.. I am thinking of traveling this spring thru the mounains of the west and living off the land. I would love to have a gang of us traveling with horses and animals and such planting foods in the summer and then traveling south for the winter but staying out of towns and cities and just being a nomadic TS group
One - 'Nomadic' vs. 'a place of our own' seem to be in conflict with each other.
Two - Most of the land in the US is owned. Just 'planting stuff' from time to time is going to be seen as trespassing.
Three - The harder times get, the more people will welcome you with a gun.
Four - You need real skills, and I don't see many people in here with those. I'll take Steph, a mechanic, a few others seem to have some real skills, but the bulk of people who get out of the house long enough to get a job, are doing 'art' or 'IT' or similar worthless things in a survival setting.
Quote from: tekla on January 02, 2009, 10:06:11 AM
WHAT WE NEED IS A PLACE OF OUR OWN where we can all be together and help one another.. I am thinking of traveling this spring thru the mounains of the west and living off the land. I would love to have a gang of us traveling with horses and animals and such planting foods in the summer and then traveling south for the winter but staying out of towns and cities and just being a nomadic TS group
One - 'Nomadic' vs. 'a place of our own' seem to be in conflict with each other.
Two - Most of the land in the US is owned. Just 'planting stuff' from time to time is going to be seen as trespassing.
Three - The harder times get, the more people will welcome you with a gun.
Four - You need real skills, and I don't see many people in here with those. I'll take Steph, a mechanic, a few others seem to have some real skills, but the bulk of people who get out of the house long enough to get a job, are doing 'art' or 'IT' or similar worthless things in a survival setting.
1 a place of our own is with each other each day and night
2 there is lots of federal land we can use all over the USA in national forest etc
3 we will kill the people we meet with loveee
4 i have skills to make a sauna with hides and using rocks and herbs splashed on the rocks to provide a way to clean oneself and there are lots of wild foods like wild onions and lettuces and animals for the meat eaters and we can sleep in a teepee and move as a nomdaic unit doing some farm work to earn some etra funds well for those who don't have an income and we can use my buggy as a chuck wagon to carry lots of food and supplies its been done many times and there is right now a guy named lee the logger who is traveling the USA with his 3 horses across many roads and has his hay stored underneath his gypsy wagon http://www.leehorselogger.com/ (http://www.leehorselogger.com/)
Ye Haw! From Brook, Wyoming, 30 miles south of Douglas.
I am currently in winter quarters. The horses are settling down for a long
winter of work; we are going to spend the winter logging.
I got to Caspar, Wyoming, when I realized it was time to stop for the
winter. Two winters of traveling while sick was more than enough. So,
here we are.
Besides being exhausted, health issues have gotten to a point where I
have to deal with them. At this time, things are of a critical but minor
nature.
I had planned to go on to Salt Lake City, but because of the weather,
health issues, distance and economics, I decided to stay in Wyoming. I
have met many incredible people in this area and I feel as if I am home.
That having been said, next March I will begin to travel again. In the
meantime I will be taking pictures of my logging projects.
I hope everyone will keep coming back to this website and follow my trip
next Spring.
My sincere thanks to everyone for your kind words and help.
Ye Haw!
Lee the Horselogger
(https://www.susans.org/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.leehorselogger.com%2Fsitebuilder%2Fimages%2FLeeJune2008-640x337.jpg&hash=96059d75b854d56949f769bc7276e7ebd79dac49)
Quote from: postoplesbian on January 02, 2009, 09:56:27 AM
WHAT WE NEED IS A PLACE OF OUR OWN where we can all be together and help one another.. I am thinking of traveling this spring thru the mounains of the west and living off the land. I would love to have a gang of us traveling with horses and animals and such planting foods in the summer and then traveling south for the winter but staying out of towns and cities and just being a nomadic TS group.. anyone want to join me ???
If it was'nt for my wife, daughter, four grandchildren, her two dogs and cat that I'm helping to support n my home right now, I'd consider it. I've considered it, when do we leave, lol.
Oh, excuse me, sorry, the thread topic, yes. I have felt like a loner my intire life, have no one I ever knew to be a close friend other than my wife, which is all she will be now anyway. I never felt right in my own skin to be comfortable with other people. The last couple of years I attended Church, I tried to involve myself in the mens club and Church offices but I always felt like a duck out of water and still never made close friends.
Since I have gotten to point where I am FT except for my job and will be FT there next month I find myself coming out of my shell. I no longer hide myself, my feelings or my trans if the subject comes up. It is a freedom that is still new to me and I suspect it will be that way for awhile. Sixty-one years is a long time to be lonely which is why I rejoice with the young women and men here. Hugs
Wendy
Quote from: tekla on January 02, 2009, 10:06:11 AM
Four - You need real skills, and I don't see many people in here with those. I'll take Steph, a mechanic, a few others seem to have some real skills, but the bulk of people who get out of the house long enough to get a job, are doing 'art' or 'IT' or similar worthless things in a survival setting.
When i was young about 10-14yrs all i ever did was play in my local woods with a few friends building dens etc. my dad (the only usefull thing he has ever done for me) hired a survival guy to come and show us a thing or two, the only good day i spent with my dad. Because of that i have basic survival skills....
Shelter construction (seems easy, tis not lol)
Fire building from man made ignitions (matches, lighter)
I can also make fire by 'playing the fiddle' is hard tho
i can also hunt both with a firearm or snaring & traps
I know that silver birch can be used as bandage and the sap if filtered is an antiseptic.
If i lived in the US id come along, i love the countryside. there aint a feeling in the world that can beat setting of in a morning with a small tent, a parang, flint kit and a knife and by night having a fire with food cooking and a camp organised.
I organise an event once a year for my friends where we go onto the Bronte Moors in Yorkshire with a few supplies, stop of at a trout farm on the way and pick up a couple then cook it in a coal and moss fire pit, i dont like fish but cooked that way its gorgues (i really cant spell!)
anyway i talk too much
If you dealt with the Art world and it's clientele, then you wouldn't be calling it useless work
I have, I do, and I am. Art is a luxury in a survival environment. And I've worked with lots of 'smart' people, and I'm often just as amazed as to how little they really understand about doing things.
And the military goes to excessive lengths to test people and develop skills that they have within them. I've had people who have no mechanical experience who caught on real quick, others, never get it. You can't take the chance on having half the people do 95% of the work. As often happens.
Quote from: Rene' aka candygirl on January 02, 2009, 03:11:16 PM
[ quote ] Four - "You need real skills, and I don't see many people in here with those. I'll take Steph, a mechanic, a few others seem to have some real skills, but the bulk of people who get out of the house long enough to get a job, are doing 'art' or 'IT' or similar worthless things in a survival setting" . [quote unquote]
I'm sorry; but this remark I have to respond to...In a survival situation; you'd be very surprised at how quickly someone will who has no experience can pick-up/learn in short order, the crucial knowledge that will help them and their group survive. The military does it all the time, with raw recruits.
If you dealt with the Art world and it's clientele, then you wouldn't be calling it useless work. I have painted murals that were 12' x 24', that earned me $38,000 for the one. I have sold other paintings and sculptures for many thousands of dollars a piece. The people with the money to contract and purchase such things, are not worried about an underground bunker out in the woods someplace...the wealthy will always survive no matter what.
The world needs ditch diggers, and it also wants Artisans...
Is "art" not defined by its uselessness?
Art has no other purpose than
being art.
A watercolour of a cat is not going to sow a field of corn.
A watercolour of a cat is not going to sow a field of corn.
Not to mention, "waiting for the inspiration" to sow that field of corn.
Put your hubby on then, and you can get back to your real work.
But the issue was brought up of forming some sort of gypsy caravan of TG persons in the Intermountain West of the US, and farming on federal land (without people watching it, we'll all just happy a gypsy until the crop comes in an then we all eat plenty off the fat of the land) by someone who so obviously don't know much about this region. ->-bleeped-<-s in Utah. Yeah. Pick me a winner there. And farming without care taking is a fantasy. Farming with great care is a break even proposition at best, and backbreaking work without tractors at an even bet. And I doubt if people can do it if they are not used to doing manual labor for 12 hours a day, day in and day out for months at a time.
I'm not talking about survival, I'm only thinking this through the point of a basic industrial collapse. Not beyond that.
Though you got the AK right. Ultimate survival tool that one. Everywhere but here. Opps. Well, half right.
Quote from: Rene' aka candygirl on January 02, 2009, 08:36:14 PM
[Art is a luxury in a survival environment.]
What does any of this have to do with the Trans-Gendered on this forum? this subject posting here is beyond dumb...just another idiotic post that has nothing to do with anything...
Go to these sites if you want to argue survival garbage....http://survivalacres.com/wordpress/ (http://survivalacres.com/wordpress/)
or here....http://www.backwoodshome.com/index.html (http://www.backwoodshome.com/index.html)
or here....http://hillbillyhousewife.com/index.htm (http://hillbillyhousewife.com/index.htm)
as well as these:http://www.awrm.org/nms.htm
http://www.permacultureactivist.net/ (http://www.permacultureactivist.net/)
http://www.wildwoodsurvival.com/index.html (http://www.wildwoodsurvival.com/index.html)
I'm not just a dizzy blonde dame who is clueless on this stuff...I could give you one hundred such listings...my husband is very knowledgeable about all this weird stuff...I just don't care about it...( I took some of these listings out of his bookmark listings )
THIS IT IS NOT THE STUFF FOR TOPIC'S OF DISCUSSIONS HERE!
Take your B.O.B and AK-47's and horses and go someplace else...leave us alone.
I'd rather die in the joy of art than merely
survive.
;)
Survival is an art form in and of its self, and few can survive on art alone. That I know. I've spent my life doing - or at least producing - art.
Quote from: Sophie90 on January 02, 2009, 05:05:19 PM
Art has no other purpose than being art.
Most cultures, primitive or modern, have art forms such as music, dance, visual art, masks, etc. It is a part of the human need to express ourselves in this way.
Z
Art is nice. But in the beginning, I sure don't need someone who could render me a nice watercolor of a mill, I need a millwright. I don't need people who can design a book cover, I need people who know how to make blueprints and technical drawings to scale. And so on. Carps, plumbers, steamfitters, mechanics, tool and die makers, and for the life of us we still can't find a cooper, which is a key craft, perhaps we raid a winery and get one. So its not like we will not have music, its just hard to carry a person who all they really do is play great lead guitar, we'll just have to get by with a bunch of us strumming chords and singing Kumbia or something like that.
Art, like music, like storytelling, like all other forms of creative expression used to be something we all did, communally. The idea of artists as specialists getting paid for what they do was fun while it lasted (for the people getting paid that is), but it turned culture into a commodity, which I think is very sad. Hopefully one of the positives that come out of all this unpleasantness we've stirred up for ourselves is a return to that older way of doing things.
Mina.
it turned culture into a commodity
Perfect.
To a certain degree i would say yes that i am isolated, i finished university a few years ago but kept contact with 0 friend.
i only have contact with my direct family but when it comes to the extended family i don't have any contact at all. my reasoning is that i don't want to be judged and the more people you know the harder it is to be yourself and come out.
I would think the more people you know, the greater the ability to find people who like you and who you like back.
Quote from: tekla on January 04, 2009, 04:37:31 PM
I would think the more people you know, the greater the ability to find people who like you and who you like back.
this is also true, my experience through university and school made happy of having finished with both of them. I was never out or told anyone but many people were so mean.
on the other side friends i came to know in gay clubs are more accepting and open minded.
I've been rather extroverted most of my life despite being picked on pretty badly when I was younger (5th grade), but even then I recovered. In high School though something changed I began having trouble with depression and then along came Social Anxiety Disorder.
It used to be far worse than it is now. I had trouble going to mall or even driving. I saw a counselor though and have largely rehabilitated myself. I still have trouble meeting new people, but I have a healthy network of friends and generally do well. It's really surprising how far a smile and direct eye contact can get you.
yes unfortunally because i live out in the country, and you have to go nearly an hour to get to the nearest town, that has any sort of Lgbt scene.
First yes, then no.
From childhood I grew up very socially isolated. I had few or no friends. After all, the world of boys made no sense to me and I found it repellent. I felt affinity with the girls and longed to participate in female society, but it was barred to me. That left solitude, pretty much. I came to feel comfortable in solitude and was socially awkward. During most of those years I had no friends at all, unless I got a chance to be friends with women, which was often problematic. This held true until I came out when I was 45.
At that time the social butterfly emerged from her chrysalis and all of a sudden I had an active social life and more friends at one time than I'd had in the rest of my previous life put together. I came out of my shell and reached out to other humans, and discovered how much I enjoyed human contact and how easy it was. The reasons for this dramatic transformation are easy to see: I found activities where I felt welcomed and fit in-- first the peace movement, then Paganism, and then the LGBT movement. Embracing Pagan faith not only proved liberating for my gender issues, it brought me into contact with many wonderful people who instantly became good friends. The same went for LGBT activism. The two went together because Paganism tends to be the most queer-friendly religion, while many queer people with a spiritual bent find Paganism beneficial to their lives.
But the main reason I suddenly became a social success was that I now accepted who I am-- for only by living on the basis of my true reality could I relate well to others. This allowed my inherent friendliness and charm to shine openly instead of being blocked as it was during those long grim years of gender inhibition.
I've always been introverted, and still am. But introversion does not mean you can't be outgoing and have a social life. I'm an introverted social butterfly who can't get enough of going to parties, throwing myself into activities, and making new friends. What introversion means is that I still need my solitude (several hours a day) to recharge my energy. But now I've found more of a balance, so that I can enjoy both social life and solitude. Coming out was the healthiest thing I've ever done, that is for sure.
I often feel isolated. But it is mostly because there isn't really anyone to relate to where I live. There isn't much of anywhere to go or anything to do. It is a very religious and conservative area. No-one to comfortably hang out with. I get very lonely
Quote from: Virginia Marie on January 12, 2009, 04:14:38 AM
I often feel isolated. But it is mostly because there isn't really anyone to relate to where I live. There isn't much of anywhere to go or anything to do. It is a very religious and conservative area. No-one to comfortably hang out with. I get very lonely
Same
You remind me how fortunate I am to live in a major metropolitan area (Washington, DC). I came from a provincial area but felt stifled there and needed to get out. If I were in a religious conservative region, I'd go crazy from the oppressiveness and think of nothing but moving out.
Quote from: Hypatia on January 12, 2009, 12:22:13 PM
You remind me how fortunate I am to live in a major metropolitan area (Washington, DC). I came from a provincial area but felt stifled there and needed to get out. If I were in a religious conservative region, I'd go crazy from the oppressiveness and think of nothing but moving out.
Same here.