Susan's Place Transgender Resources

Okay first of all, yes I know it was stoooo-pid. A girl has to learn some time I guess, but I was lucky. The other night (Friday) I was with another female friend and we were out downtown. Now downtown Nashville in certain areas is fine, generally on the weekends it's one big block party down on the strip near Broadway and 2nd Ave. Other areas are okay too, as long as you stay on the main streets.

Anyway, we were walking on one of the main streets near a popular nightclub and I stopped at an outdoor teller machine to get some cash. As soon as I did I knew it was a mistake but the machine already had my card and I had to finish the transaction. It suddenly occurred to me that here are two women alone on a city street at night and it was definitely NOT safe to be standing there with cash in hand at a teller machine. We were dressed to the nines and a van full of rowdy boys drove by and hollered at us. I got totally and completely freaked out and we hurriedly got my card back and headed for the nearest club about a block away where there was a nice big security guard standing outside.

Yeah, it was stupid. I hate to even admit it happened, but it might help some girls to think twice. Of course back when I was presenting as a man, I never would have given such activities a second thought. But as a woman, I was considerably frightened by the experience. Most girls grow up learning this stuff and already know better. I come from a different background where it was never a problem before. Even though I should have known better anyway, believe me it won't ever happen again. It was a scary lesson that I can promise I won't soon forget.

Yup, it's just part of being a woman (not even necessarily trans).

A car full of men will be brave enough to yell (usually incoherent) things to any woman who is walking alone.

I know what you mean, Chloe.  I grew up in inner-city America and learned some street smarts early, some of which were literally beaten into me on the street.  But I didn't learn what every woman seems to know.  I'm learning fast - I hope fast enough.  Even though I was kind of a small man and now am a rather large woman, I feel much more vulnerable as Kate than I did as *him*. :(

(BTW, when we lived in Iceland my wife said it was the first time in her life she felt perfectly safe.)

I'm glad you were able to learn a few lessons with no damage. :)

- Kate

Always carry pepper spray. And a Stinger missile, if you can afford it.

that seems like such a foreign feeling to me. Maybe it's just having been so big all my life. I mean, I have been afraid of getting pounded because I have bead eyes but the fear of...what women fear from drunken rowdy guys is...hmmm...don't have words for it.

If I'm ever in that spot it will definitely be a new experience.

FairyGirl, that is very scary!  I'm glad that van of boys didn't stop and that you and your friend are ok.  Yes, walking up to an ATM at night is sooo not a good idea.  Daylight is fine.  A drive-up ATM is better.

At least you weren't alone.  Always travel in well-lit areas in a group, and pepper spray is a definite.  I'm a country girl and tend to stay in at night, but when I do go out I'm very aware of what's going on around me.  You should always maintain a situational awareness too.  ;)

yes it was a definite wake up call. And yes, I feel dumb for not realizing ahead of time that the same situation is quite different for women than for men. :embarrassed: My car was parked a couple blocks away, but it was a fine summer night for walking outside. I am used to being in the country at night, but the big city is something different altogether... eek. I will get pepper spray but next time I think I'll just use the atm inside the club lol

Quote from: Kara on July 06, 2009, 08:15:54 PM
Always carry pepper spray. And a Stinger missile, if you can afford it.

I know there was a good reason for big handbags, Over the shoulder missile loader.

Glad you are OK fairy girl.

Cindy

The typical and cheap pepper spray is great for steak and sucks for self defense. Check with local and state laws and then check out OC-10. I have never found anyone that can stand up against it and carried it for years next to my sidearm.

And sounds like nothing that serious happened. I have had rowdy guys whistle and cat call me while I was doing things like pumping gas, in the country, in the middle of the day. It is something that young guys (and some older ones who never grew up) tend to do. At least you were not alone and fortunately they did not stop.

What a shock it must be to live with male privilege all one's life and suddenly find it stripped away. Sort of analogous to the film Watermelon Man, in which a white guy suddenly turns black overnight and then faces racist treatment he'd never imagined he'd ever have to go through.

Welcome to what women go through all the time. I knew to expect this even before I transitioned, I had been studying and practicing feminism for years already and had consciousness of what women's lives are like in a male chauvinist world. I knew full well what I was getting in for when I transitioned.

I get catcalls from guys practically every time I walk on the city streets alone. I've been groped, I've been followed and harassed. Recently, walking to work and crossing a wide street only two blocks from my house, I had to walk in front of a car of rowdy young guys stopped at the red light. The whole way they were whooping and shouting "Shake that ass!"

The days when I first walked on the street female, I discovered powerful adrenaline rushes of fear. I trained myself to consciously transform fear into better energy. When I began to walk on the street as a woman, I trained myself to detach my rushes of adrenaline energy from a fear mentality, and feed that energy into my female power. I realized I can take this free energy and use it however I will, it doesn't have to be fear. I learned how to ride that wave of energy and use it to sharpen me up, make me stronger, instead of succumbing to it and going under.

I will not fear. Fear is the mind-killer...

Also, I took a class in women's self-defense (http://www.defendyourself.org/). That helped a lot.

it is part of being female and I accept that without any hesitation whatsoever, because that is who I am and there is unequivocably no other option for me. The thing is, I already knew about it intellectually because I have read plenty of cautionary tales concerning this very thing. But sometimes knowing something in your head and experiencing it personally are quite different animals. As I said, I have learned my lesson well, and I will certainly be aware of it at all times now.

Hypatia, what you said about fear is so true. I will also try to learn to channel fear into better outlets, because fear definitely is a mind-killer and it can come from anywhere at any time. Learning to use that energy constructively seems a very good way to deal with it.

It's so true. Growing up, I was always aware of the need to be careful. It's drilled into girls' heads from an early age to always practice the "buddy system" (having at least one friend with you at all times). I always felt better if one of the "buddies" was a guy. In college a male professor said he was shocked to learn that women are constantly aware of potential violence. I never thought of it as being strange. Frankly, I was amazed that guys didn't really ever think about it. I just took it for granted to do so.

Quote from: Hypatia on July 07, 2009, 10:00:22 AM
Welcome to what women go through all the time. I knew to expect this even before I transitioned, I had been studying and practicing feminism for years already and had consciousness of what women's lives are like in a male chauvinist world. I knew full well what I was getting in for when I transitioned.

The same was for me Hypathia, even before I began studying feminism in college.  For some reason, growing up, because my mind was female I was always aware that danger existed for women all the time in a patriarchal society.  Most men (not all, but a large majority) view us as objects to be used and controlled, and it's very sad but unfortunately the way things are right now.

Quote from: FairyGirl on July 07, 2009, 10:32:33 AM
The thing is, I already knew about it intellectually because I have read plenty of cautionary tales concerning this very thing. But sometimes knowing something in your head and experiencing it personally are quite different animals.

Definitely FG, knowing it and experiencing it are two different things.  I went through the same thing.  But the important thing is now you know, and you're better prepared to avoid such situations in the future. 

I drove a friend to his job as a bartender one time.  He already had a ride home scheduled so I could have just left but he bought me a drink so I stayed for a bit.  Since he opened, the place was empty.  Later a guy walked in and began eying me.  I asked the bartender to act like my boyfriend.  That didn't have any effect.

The guy walked up to me and started talking.  I tried to brush him off and the bartender told him to leave me alone.  When I went to the jukebox the guy followed me over and brushed his hand over mine.  I figured it was time to go.  It was probably about 10PM. 

I hopped in my car and drove off.  When I was about a mile away I stopped at a light.  I happened to turn to my right and saw the guy in the lane next to me and he waved.  Now it was time to get serious!  I stayed in the center lane after the light turned green and he stayed right next to me.  When I came to an intersection I quickly made a left turn and sped up to over 80MPH to get away from him.  I couldn't see him following me. I thought I lost him.

As I came to the next stop light I stopped and there, right next to me, was this guy again, smiling.  I freaked and took off speeding down streets and making fast turns, all the while this guy was on my tail. 

Then I became furious!  There was no way this was going to happen to me.  I slammed on my brakes and got out of the car in a rage.  The guy pulled up and I bellowed out in my best male voice "Get the F*** out of here!!! You mother F***er I'll f**king kill you!!!" 

The guy took off.

My heart was pounding.  But the adrenaline had me so worked up my hands were shaking.  I then drove home.

Yes, I know that was risky.  And if it happened today I would react differently.  But I was pretty new to the world then and acting purely on emotion.

Julie

Quote from: Starr on July 07, 2009, 11:31:07 AM
It's so true. Growing up, I was always aware of the need to be careful. It's drilled into girls' heads from an early age to always practice the "buddy system" (having at least one friend with you at all times). I always felt better if one of the "buddies" was a guy. In college a male professor said he was shocked to learn that women are constantly aware of potential violence. I never thought of it as being strange. Frankly, I was amazed that guys didn't really ever think about it. I just took it for granted to do so.

I don't think it's a clear cut gender thing.  I was constantly aware of this kind of thing when I went to public high school, and even now walking around my city neighborhood as a 'guy'.  'Male privilege' doesn't extend to every male, only the ones who fit into the role.  I may not identify as male anymore, but there are plenty of males who do identify as male who have to be just as conscious about potential violence as women are.

Wow Julie that does sound scary! I'm glad it turned out okay for you.

I was also aware of course that there is an innate danger in those kinds of late-nite situations for anyone, but my point was that I had not experienced that very real danger as a woman before which was quite different. I suddenly felt extremely vulnerable and helpless and it was not a feeling I care to repeat. Now that I have experienced it, I certainly won't forget it. I'm just glad we are all still here to relate our own stories.

Quote from: Ketsy on July 07, 2009, 01:30:51 PM
I don't think it's a clear cut gender thing.  I was constantly aware of this kind of thing when I went to public high school, and even now walking around my city neighborhood as a 'guy'.  'Male privilege' doesn't extend to every male, only the ones who fit into the role.  I may not identify as male anymore, but there are plenty of males who do identify as male who have to be just as conscious about potential violence as women are.

Definitely. I imagine many people who are perceived as "different" (whatever that means) somehow learn to be more cautious at an early age. Kids who are bullied, for instance, are probably much more aware of their safety than a "popular" kid would be. I was just totally shocked when my professor said that, and I realized that not everyone was always aware of such things. Up to that time, I had always thought it was an equal concern, at least to some extent.

Knowing it is good.  Experiencing it is much more vivid.

If you're ever in a situation like Julie Marie's, head for a police station if possible.

My daughter was in a very scary situation where at first she couldn't think because she was too scared, but finally thought to herself: If a friend of mine was in this situation and asked for my advice, what would I tell her?  Then she did that.  (I've got a daughter who is much smarter than I am.)

Keep yourself safe.

- Kate

Walking back to my car after leaving a club in San Diego, alone, late at night.....is that guy following me?  How far to get to the car?  The heart starts trying to pound it's way out your chest.....

As a guy, I was well versed in the martial arts, full of confidence against any opponent.  As me, that confidence vaporizes (even though I think I could still handle myself if I had to).  That, and it's a lot different when wearing a skirt....

Pepper spray may work for some, but when I've seen it used, the cloud went pretty much everwhere, and even the one using the spray was caught up in the gasping/coughing/fight for air.  All in all, for me, anyway, the simple things are the safest: go with at least one friend, stay in very public areas, don't drink too much, etc.

It's also a good excuse for two girls to go to the ladies room together :)

Quote from: K8 on July 08, 2009, 07:37:37 AMIf you're ever in a situation like Julie Marie's, head for a police station if possible.

Except-- What do you do when, as a trans woman, you're in even more danger from the police themselves?
E.g. http://questioningtransphobia.wordpress.com/2009/03/24/police-and-trans-women-of-color/ (http://questioningtransphobia.wordpress.com/2009/03/24/police-and-trans-women-of-color/)

QuotePolice violence against us is real. No crime need be committed, either, as I described here, when I was beaten by the San Antonio cops many many years ago.
http://dmj618.livejournal.com/1297.html?thread=2577#t2577 (http://dmj618.livejournal.com/1297.html?thread=2577#t2577)

I was laying injured in the road, and someone called the popo, thinking it would make it all better.

popo isn't ur friend if ur a twoc.

Quote from: tgirljuliewilson on July 11, 2009, 02:33:21 AM
Walking back to my car after leaving a club in San Diego, alone, late at night.....is that guy following me?  How far to get to the car?  The heart starts trying to pound it's way out your chest.....

As a guy, I was well versed in the martial arts, full of confidence against any opponent.  As me, that confidence vaporizes (even though I think I could still handle myself if I had to).  That, and it's a lot different when wearing a skirt....

Pepper spray may work for some, but when I've seen it used, the cloud went pretty much everwhere, and even the one using the spray was caught up in the gasping/coughing/fight for air.  All in all, for me, anyway, the simple things are the safest: go with at least one friend, stay in very public areas, don't drink too much, etc.

It's also a good excuse for two girls to go to the ladies room together :)

lol you said it sister, on all points. This incident has greatly increased my situational awareness as a female but there are times, like when you have to walk to your car at night in a parking lot, when certain situations are unavoidable. I do think learning a little self-defense is a good idea, or at least some good groin kicking techniques. :laugh:

In many places it would not make a difference if you're male or female. It is good you were with someone else. It's a good idea to always travel in twos or more after dark. CindyJames is right about having a large purse or handbag to carry something for self defense. Maybe I'll get a long bag with a shoulder strap that says Nikon on it and instead of a tripod it will be a rocket propel grenade.

Quote from: Genevieve Swann on July 11, 2009, 05:28:02 AM
Maybe I'll get a long bag with a shoulder strap that says Nikon on it and instead of a tripod it will be a rocket propel grenade.

This reminds me of something I learned many years ago in a women's safety class. They say you shouldn't carry anything that would make it easy for someone to grab you. Keep your purse close to your body so they can't easily yank it to stop you (and to help keep someone from taking it). Ponytails are another thing someone could use to grab you. Not that you shouldn't carry a purse or not have a ponytail. Just things to be aware of.

Ponytails are another thing someone could use to grab you.

The time honored (since Rome at least) reason that the military loves short hair - also the reason that people in prison shave their heads.

I haven't had a short haircut in over 15 years so forget that lol :P I think Starr had a good idea with taking a women's safety class.

Bleeding-heart-liberal li'l ol' country girl me does actually own a big honkin' firearm but I'd be afraid it would just get taken away from me, and besides I would never carry it on me in any case. I wonder if they make those nice pumps I like with steel toes? hmmm...

I wonder if they make those nice pumps I like with steel toes? hmmm...

Not that I've found, no Mary-Janes either, or steel toed ballet shoes, but lots of sneakers.

Quote from: Hypatia on July 11, 2009, 04:34:35 AM
Except-- What do you do when, as a trans woman, you're in even more danger from the police themselves?
E.g. http://questioningtransphobia.wordpress.com/2009/03/24/police-and-trans-women-of-color/ (http://questioningtransphobia.wordpress.com/2009/03/24/police-and-trans-women-of-color/)

And that's a big reason I didn't transition 25 years ago.  Times are a little different now, at least in the parts of the world where I've been transitioning.  I'm still a bit wary, though.

Quote from: tgirljuliewilson on July 11, 2009, 02:33:21 AM
it's a lot different when wearing a skirt....

A GG friend told me that whenever alone in the very early morning or in the evening or night, never wear anything I can't run in.

Quote from: FairyGirl on July 11, 2009, 11:00:08 AM
Bleeding-heart-liberal li'l ol' country girl me does actually own a big honkin' firearm but I'd be afraid it would just get taken away from me, and besides I would never carry it on me in any case.

Other than being raised a city girl, I agree with all of this.  Except I am willing to use it if push comes to shove. :o  (My hunting/fishing/outdoorsy/politically-conservative big male friend, with whom I have almost nothing in common, has been very helpful. 8))

- Kate