Susan's Place Transgender Resources

One of the reasons I joined the Army many many years ago was to make a man out of myself. Obviously this plan failed. LOL I was ruthlessly tormented by the other soldiers until I blew up one day. They ussed this blow up to chapter me out of the military.

I was wondering how many of the mid life and late in lifers joined the military to avoid or cover up the inner truth that they were a woman. How did it turn out for you?

Actually, I did rather the opposite - I left the military as soon as I could, and still hate them.

Back when I was really dumb and naive, I join the Army to man up and because my country was at war.  Viet Nam was going on and I wanted to do my part.  Maybe I was secretly hoping I would get killed over there.

But they found the birth defect in my back and I was discharged 1F, unfit for medical reasons.  A few years later, I got that changed to 1A and joined the Navy.  This time it was to man up and get the benefits.  Try as hard as I could I never made it.  Birth defect again and this time I was classified 4F, unfit for military service period.

Yep sure did! As already said by Dee I too maned up on the outside but was left even more confused on the inside. I think it caused a much wider gap between my true self and the percieved self that other people saw.

I junked most of that social expectation stuff at an early age and as the saying went then "Turned on, tuned in and dropped out."  I loved the hippies and the hippies loved me back, girls clothing and all.  The closest I came to going into the service was Anti-war protests.  And be a cop?  Your kidding.  I went to the university, buried myself in the library and settled for that.

For me it was more about growing up, 24 years passed from the time I left the service until the first time I crossdressed. @ Janet, trying to get in twice counts as serving as far as I'm concerned! Big hugs, Tracey

To me, it was a blanket denial. I didn't join the Navy to 'Man-up'. There was the Vietnam war going and I joined to serve my country. I served on an aircraft carrier away from the Vietnam war area doing Cold War thingies. When I got out, the Vietnam war was over and the TG anxiety came back in spades! I wouldn't trade my Navy experience for anything.
Joelene, Honorably Discharged Veteran.

Being only 19, I didn't and haven't and don't intend to! I think the people that want to should and if they think they will be productive there it is for them! I personally have never wanted to "man up" the closest things I could compare that too was the few times I did an activity with my dad to make him happy. But even then I was afraid of "bulking up" (there was typically a lot of lifting lol) and becoming MORE masculine externally... :/ that is still an ever present fear! :(

I used to want to join the military but not to "man up" or anything, because I'm a warrior at heart and want to do something meaningful. I still would if I didn't know I'd be immediately rejected.

I joined the Air Training Corps when I was a teenager because I wanted to fly planes, but I left because it was really not for me, I'm way too lefty pinko and lazy for all that stuff and besides it turned out I didn't like flying all that much anyway.

They put me into the army in 1972, there was no way to escape.
In that time boys had to go in the army for 18 months.
After three days they kicked me out of the military service, they didn't think that there was a possibility that I would become a soldier.

So, yeah, I joined the army for 3 days.

A veteranhug
annette

I voted no as I could never man up. as a male i'm a sissy.
Which means I'm effeminate.

Effeminate means:
1. I'm like a woman (feel like a woman on the inside)
2. Unmanly
3. Homosexual
I meet all 3 conditions

Even if I did the most dangerous tasks if I had been in Viet Nam . Was 1-Y in draft status.
all I would have to do is walk in front of a dress store and wish I was wearing it
Lied about wearing women's clothes but told the truth about not having sex with men. If they had asked about do I want to have sex with men I would have lied.

I wasn't trying to man up , just serve my country.
Wearing women's clothes and sex with men were questions that where asked of all draftees

I knew I'd sign up (USAF), it was just a matter of when. And yes, the main reason was to prove to myself that I could do it...to "man up".

Timing was decided by economic necessity, and a step-dad who kept reminding me that I'd never actually sign up.

I lasted 6 years before getting kicked out for not fitting in. Just could not adapt to the World of Men.

I guess people always thought I was a little "soft", so I guess I wanted to prove to myself I wasn't. 

It's funny though, how much you learn to put on a show in the Marines.  The iconic look of a Marine, the demeanor, the everything, they smash it into "your brain housing group".  It was like having a guide book to how to fit into social scenarios and life.

After the Marine Corps though (5years in almost 6 years since), I still hate the "You're a Marine you should be able.....( enter assinine male action here)".  The "manning up" makes me want to "dress up" that much more.  To be female inside and expected to be male is terrible, but add what some people hold up as step above man and have that be your bar to be expected to be at is worse.  I try not to even tell many people about my time any more.

Soooorry! Didn't mean to spill out a giant derailing rant...  It just had to come out!

I got rejected from the New Zealand Army due to a history of mild asthma.  I think we might have higher standards than other countries, but i am not sure?  Anyway it worked out well, i hate armies, violence, and authority, it would have been hell for me.

Michaela, I felt the same way. Still do, it became my defense mechanism. I still hide behind all of that, no emotions allowed stone exterior. But it's finally gotten to the point where I can't fight against who I want to be anymore. But to answer the question I enlisted to either be "cured" of my feelings or die in combat because that would've been easier.

Its missing an answer: No wasy in hell

;)

I joined the Sheriff's Department hoping to get shot so I would not have to deal with being trans. I am glad I didn't though as I really love my life now. Isn't acceptance great!  :)

Not me.  I needed weed too badly and loved having long hair.

I do know someone who told herself that if she survived three tours in Iraq, she would transition after coming home.

Survive Iraq, get a rack.

Quote from: Jill F on August 12, 2014, 09:46:48 PM
Not me.  I needed weed too badly and loved having long hair.

:D :D

Well, if I had it to do it all over again, I would rather have the long hair (at age 15) than the weed.

I wanted to join the marines out if high school. I was hoping that it would help to "man up" but my dad talked me out it saying that I couldn't make it.
I ended up listening to him.

Hey Jessica:

I wouldn't have joined the police dept in hopes I would be shot because I couldn't deal with being trans.

I would have done it so that a criminal would shoot me in the genitalia area.
And the doctors ask me if I want to live and the only way I could live was be a woman.

I would have said go ahead as I want to live.

Possibly, but I don't really see much point in talking about it - It' nothing to brag about  :P 

Sorry, just my opinion

Kind of a sour subject for me, one of the reasons I hate going to Dr. appointments is they always want to know where all the scares came from  :P

I was 17 yo, had few prospects and no place to live.  I also naively believed the ridiculous notion that it is a rite of passage into manhood.  Too many WWll movies and romantic notions of freeing people from oppressive dictators and communism.  What a load of crap.  A tour in Vietnam turned my world around.  The first casualty of war is the truth.  War is a gigantic and brutal waste of all we love, resolves no disputes and makes no one a hero or a man in my opinion.  I did meet my first adult boyfriend and shared the mayhem with people and cultures I would never have been exposed to without being in the US Army.  I came home knowing I was not a man but it took decades to fit the rest of the identity puzzle together.

Joined the military and took on almost every macho sport or hobby that I could find.  It didn't work - I still felt like I was a fraud and just acting the part of a binary male.

I did, and I cannot describe how badly it turned out.

In the end, all I got were things like "Man, I thought you were hard until I saw those tears." Actually, my squad's opinion of me were what broke me more than any combat. I'm not sure if I'm sad enough that they will never know that.

Jera

I felt like I was forced to change into someone that I barely recognised.  I survived and did vey well, but I didn't and still don't like the person who I became.  I often wonder where I would be if I hadn't signed up.

Aisla

I tried joining the Marine Corps in 2000, the year I graduated high school. It didn't work out for me. I got down to Parris Island and started crying and begging to go home. I can generally subsist in a male environment, but USMC was macho overload. I only made it a week into basic.

Petti

Being completely honest, I resigned after a week.  In fact, due to bastardization,  38 of our 42 person class also resigned.  My brother, who was 3 years ahead at the Academy, told me not to take it seriously, to treat it like a joke and not to take it personally.  So I did.  It worked and I stayed for 10 years.  The trouble is that I still observe rather than participate and I still joke and use humour as a shield.  Not good.  Means that my relationship skills  were underdeveloped and I didn't know what it meant to be authentic.

Quote from: Petti on August 13, 2014, 02:26:59 AM
I tried joining the Marine Corps in 2000, the year I graduated high school. It didn't work out for me. I got down to Parris Island and started crying and begging to go home. I can generally subsist in a male environment, but USMC was macho overload. I only made it a week into basic.

I actually thrived somehow in basic and AIT. I can't generate machismo on my own, but I can reflect it, so I think that's why, being surrounded by it when I so desperately wanted to have it for myself. But I wasn't able to maintain the facade for too much longer than that.

I guess I couldn't have reflected so well though, because I can't count how many times throughout the experience people cited DADT at me, just for saying things nobody else did. I guess you can only hide so much from people when you live, work, and breathe with people all day, every day.

They saw through my facade, in the end, even when I still denied it.

It was one reason, but not one of the biggest reasons. I mainly joined the military for job security. I was discharged 2 years in anyways for disability. So much for job security, but at least they're still paying me and letting me keep the GI Bill benefits. I also joined so I could travel places I haven't been to before. They stationed me in Spokane, Washington (I'm from Oregon originally) and I was never deployed. Wee!

Quote from: Jera on August 13, 2014, 03:04:11 AM
I actually thrived somehow in basic and AIT. I can't generate machismo on my own, but I can reflect it, so I think that's why, being surrounded by it when I so desperately wanted to have it for myself. But I wasn't able to maintain the facade for too much longer than that.

I tried to describe this once, the way you worded it makes so much sense.

Well I joined not to "man up" but to just see if I could make it. It was the most miserable 4 years of my life but I wouldn't change it though because it just reinforced that I wasn't a real guy.

I joined up for a steady job, but with the requirements of appearance and behavior, it gave me the time to reflect and try to actually understand how I feel on the inside- and put me on the path towards the opposite of what I want.

I enlisted pretty much for the same reasons. I wanted to man up and show that I was really the man I know I am. Halfway through I shattered my entire leg, but I waited and healed and finished my training. Now looking back I wish I never would have finished. I was chaptered out right after a deployment that I missed due to problems from the break I got in training.

It was a kick to the guy for me. I wasn't doing it for me but for the betterment of everything ya know. Yea I was a part of it but it wasn't just about me. Thats when I seen our military as it is. They claim to be a family, but when a soldier needs their help they abandon them. I support our troops oh ya I do... But not the way the system treats you when you need them.

As far as I'm concerned, I'm never going to join the military in the future. The thought of it simply scares me, and I cannot bring myself to shoot a gun or anything like that.

Also, in a way, aren't soldiers basically mindless drones? A lot of them just fight in order to protect their country, but on the flip side, the enemy troops are doing the same exact thing.  It's like they don't care how many innocent people on both sides will die in the process.. And as soon as they kill a person, they aren't innocent anymore. They're a murderer. The human race just loves to do whatever it takes, even kill each other for power. The US no longer cares about anything the country was founded on as soon as it comes to war. It's all about power for most people. We're such a corrupted species.

That's just how I see it. Thanks.

~A

Quote from: iiMTF on August 29, 2014, 04:05:27 PM
As far as I'm concerned, I'm never going to join the military in the future. The thought of it simply scares me, and I cannot bring myself to shoot a gun or anything like that.

Also, in a way, aren't soldiers basically mindless drones? A lot of them just fight in order to protect their country, but on the flip side, the enemy troops are doing the same exact thing.  It's like they don't care how many innocent people on both sides will die in the process.. And as soon as they kill a person, they aren't innocent anymore. They're a murderer. The human race just loves to do whatever it takes, even kill other for power. The US no longer cares about anything the country was founded on as soon as it comes to war. It's all about power for most people. We're such a corrupted species.

That's just how I see it. Thanks.

~A

No, soldiers just aren't mindless drones. Yes you have to follow lawful orders but unlawful orders you have duty to do the right thing. And no when soldiers are fighting a war and are engaging the enemy they are not murderers, unless a unit goes in and kills a village full of innocent civilians. Some times there are things that you have to fight for. There are a lot of unjustices in the world. The Holocaust, Genocide and the list goes on. Sometimes the strong have to protect the weak and innocent against Tyrannical mad maniacs. Or in a perfect world that is the way it should be.

Never say never. I never thought I would and I did.

Quote from: Jess42 on August 29, 2014, 04:13:43 PM
Or in a perfect world that is the way it should be.

I would say in the perfect world there would be no need for anyone to need violent protection... there would be no maniacal tyrants.

[/nitpicking]

Quote from: Jess42 on August 29, 2014, 04:13:43 PM
No, soldiers just aren't mindless drones. Yes you have to follow lawful orders but unlawful orders you have duty to do the right thing. And no when soldiers are fighting a war and are engaging the enemy they are not murderers, unless a unit goes in and kills a village full of innocent civilians. Some times there are things that you have to fight for. There are a lot of unjustices in the world. The Holocaust, Genocide and the list goes on. Sometimes the strong have to protect the weak and innocent against Tyrannical mad maniacs. Or in a perfect world that is the way it should be.

Never say never. I never thought I would and I did.

The US threatened to go to war with whoever let Snowden (the guy who committed treason) land in their country. Russia was the only country that let him land. The US was basically like "never mind... We're good!" When they heard Russia let him land, and never went to war. If the US fought in the way you say they did, they would've gone to war. (Tho I'm glad they didn't, as we'd probably be screwed and we'd be living in a war right now)

Even tho it was a good choice to not go to war with Russia, this disproves your statement.

Also, I didn't say they were mindless drones... I said "in a way" :p

Also - America not going to war with Russia was basically like saying "We make empty threats, because we're like those child bullies who are weak and can't fulfill our threats... So we just try to sound strong!"

Tho I do not believe this last sentence is true, it's what they did so.

~A

I joined the Marine Corps in 2002 for three reasons.

1: I was unemployed, and not having any luck finding work. It was join the military or be homeless according to the people I was living with at the time.

2: This was the summer after 9/11, and even in me patriotism was pretty high.

3: I'm a military brat to begin with. Three of my grandparents (Grandma and Grandpa on my mom's side, Grandpa on my dad's side) were Army and served in WW2. My parents are both retired Coast Guard and most of my life was spent living on or near Coast Guard bases. My uncle is a retired Marine.

Ultimately I was discharged two months into basic, and that was after being dropped to MRP (Medical Rehabilitation Platoon) about 3-4 weeks in. "Manning up" was the last thing on my mind when I signed up, but then again I had locked away all thoughts of me being female for years before that point.

Quote from: iiMTF on August 29, 2014, 04:05:27 PM
As far as I'm concerned, I'm never going to join the military in the future. The thought of it simply scares me, and I cannot bring myself to shoot a gun or anything like that.

Also, in a way, aren't soldiers basically mindless drones? A lot of them just fight in order to protect their country, but on the flip side, the enemy troops are doing the same exact thing.  It's like they don't care how many innocent people on both sides will die in the process.. And as soon as they kill a person, they aren't innocent anymore. They're a murderer. The human race just loves to do whatever it takes, even kill each other for power. The US no longer cares about anything the country was founded on as soon as it comes to war. It's all about power for most people. We're such a corrupted species.

That's just how I see it. Thanks.

~A

I have been to a lot of places and met all kinds of people.  New or different ideas, opinions, world views, the way people see themselves, origins of perceptions I never thought of, the perceptions themselves, facts, history- and how that history is told based on the borders in which it is told, are all things that I have vehemently tried to collect in my mind and understand and accept.

With this, you're more than welcome to have your opinion and to voice that opinion. I do not agree your opinion, but I think that a world without people that have that same opinion would be a world without balance.

I am bothered pretty deeply by how and where you voiced the opinion though.  This thread was pretty obviously aimed at veterans so it is mostly veterans who have posted to it. 

It would be considered an aggressive act to walk into a church full of people and shout that god is a farce,  it would be aggressive to go to a pride parade just to yell obscenities, and it is aggressive to post into a thread with a steep lean towards veterans and call those veterans names like murderers, mindless drones, and eluding to a pursuit of malicious domination (you used the word power, power is a much broader and deeper thing). 

You also took the actions and decisions of politicians and world leaders directing the militaries of the world and lumped them in with and generalized the personal integrity and moral code of the military members.  The opinions of the leaders don't always match those of the military member.

I hope that you do not take this post as a vengeful negative attack.  I hope that it helps you realize that people's military background is something that is often held very close in their hearts.  I do not want you to think that I am trying to argue pro or anti war or pro or anti government, guns etc. This is not the thread for those discussions.  5 years in the Marine Corps successfully destroyed a lot of my sensitivities, but for myself and probably all veterans, we don't appreciate such strong words against us and especially not in a place that should be safe and understanding like Susan's.

Quote from: Michaela Whimsy on August 29, 2014, 09:56:04 PM
I have been to a lot of places and met all kinds of people.  New or different ideas, opinions, world views, the way people see themselves, origins of perceptions I never thought of, the perceptions themselves, facts, history- and how that history is told based on the borders in which it is told, are all things that I have vehemently tried to collect in my mind and understand and accept.

With this, you're more than welcome to have your opinion and to voice that opinion. I do not agree your opinion, but I think that a world without people that have that same opinion would be a world without balance.

I am bothered pretty deeply by how and where you voiced the opinion though.  This thread was pretty obviously aimed at veterans so it is mostly veterans who have posted to it. 

It would be considered an aggressive act to walk into a church full of people and shout that god is a farce,  it would be aggressive to go to a pride parade just to yell obscenities, and it is aggressive to post into a thread with a steep lean towards veterans and call those veterans names like murderers, mindless drones, and eluding to a pursuit of malicious domination (you used the word power, power is a much broader and deeper thing). 

You also took the actions and decisions of politicians and world leaders directing the militaries of the world and lumped them in with and generalized the personal integrity and moral code of the military members.  The opinions of the leaders don't always match those of the military member.

I hope that you do not take this post as a vengeful negative attack.  I hope that it helps you realize that people's military background is something that is often held very close in their hearts.  I do not want you to think that I am trying to argue pro or anti war or pro or anti government, guns etc. This is not the thread for those discussions.  5 years in the Marine Corps successfully destroyed a lot of my sensitivities, but for myself and probably all veterans, we don't appreciate such strong words against us and especially not in a place that should be safe and understanding like Susan's.

I'm sorry this offended some of you, however I feel you interpreted it the wrong way. I NEVER wanted to or meant to insult a member of the military. My comment was aimed at political leaders and political leaders only, because of how controlling they are when it comes to this situation. I respect people in the military, and am very thankful of them.

Offending someone was not my intention, so sorry if it came off this way.

~A

Quote from: iiMTF on August 29, 2014, 04:05:27 PM
As far as I'm concerned, I'm never going to join the military in the future. The thought of it simply scares me, and I cannot bring myself to shoot a gun or anything like that.

Also, in a way, aren't soldiers basically mindless drones? A lot of them just fight in order to protect their country, but on the flip side, the enemy troops are doing the same exact thing.  It's like they don't care how many innocent people on both sides will die in the process.. And as soon as they kill a person, they aren't innocent anymore. They're a murderer. The human race just loves to do whatever it takes, even kill each other for power. The US no longer cares about anything the country was founded on as soon as it comes to war. It's all about power for most people. We're such a corrupted species.

That's just how I see it. Thanks.

~A

I am curious, what part of these comments do you believe to not be insulting? I am very surprised that you have not received several neg. points, then to blow it off as just being rude comments About political leaders is even more insulting to everyone's intelligence

Just in case you haven't noticed, the US military is one one the most tech. advanced militarys in the the world and takes great strides to protect civilians and avoid unnecessary casualties

Have you ever considered that without military technology you probably would not have many modern conveniences including the computer you are typing on?

Who do you think caused most tech. to develop and had it first then eventually allowed it to the general public?

Please put a little more thought in when replying

Thank you

V M

Quote from: V M on August 30, 2014, 01:21:02 AM
I am curious, what part of these comments do you believe to not be insulting? I am very surprised that you have not received several neg. points, then to blow it off as just being rude comments About political leaders is even more insulting to everyone's intelligence

Just in case you haven't noticed, the US military is one one the most tech. advanced militarys in the the world and takes great strides to protect civilians and avoid unnecessary casualties

Have you ever considered that without military technology you probably would not have many modern conveniences including the computer you are typing on?

Who do you think caused most tech. to develop and had it first then eventually allowed it to the general public?

Please put a little more thought in when replying

Thank you

V M

Ugh!! Just like everyone else, you're interpreting it wrong. I'm not saying that I dislike what they do in that sense, I am all for them taking these drastic measures to protect us.

What I'm saying is I don't see the point in war. Not just in the US, but in the ENTIRE WORLD. We have much more important things to worry about than killing each other off, mainly for land and power. Sure, a lot of countries don't get a long, but we were taught how to deal with that in grade school! Just deal with each other and get along. The world would be much more advanced if we worked together. Plus, we'd be able to get better protection from things in the solar system, like black holes and meteors.

I am VERY thankful to all the troops and political leaders for protecting us and keeping us safe, the ONLY thing I dislike is war itself. I do not see the point in starting a war.

I'm one of dem world peace freaks :p

About the smiting part- Since I'm not trying to insult anyone (though it may of came off that way, and I already apologized for that) AND I have the right to speak my opinion, I don't see why I should be smitten.

Now, PLEASE do not interpret this wrong. I'll put some key points down to make sure nobody misinterprets it:
-I am not trying to insult anyone
-I am very thankful for military men and woman, as well as political leaders.
-All I'm trying to say is I support world peace.
-Again, I am VERY sorry if I offended anyone. This was NOT my intention. I am not trying to be rude, I am just trying to state my opinion. Obviously, I am bad at that.

Ah, great. Now I feel like a b.

~A

Quote from: iiMTF on August 30, 2014, 09:58:20 AM
Ugh!! Just like everyone else, you're interpreting it wrong.

If you're really struggling to understand why your comments have been taken so harshly, please take a step back for a second. Look at this thread, and at your comments. Can you at at least see how they might be perceived as off-topic? If you can do that, it might give some insight about the context your comments are being taken in, and why they're so insulting. "In a way" doesn't really help very much.

I can believe that you don't mean to be malicious, but that doesn't change that what you've said hurts anyway. Why not be more mindful of others? Doing so can help avoid this in the future.

Quote from: Jera on August 30, 2014, 12:54:05 PM
"In a way" doesn't really help very much.

Yes it does.

There's a huge different between "In a way, aren't they just mindless drones" and "Aren't they just mindless drones". By "In a way", I meant the tiniest little SLIVER, less than 1%. Without in a way, it's all out 100%. And extremely rude.

To the rest of your reply; I'm learning. I'm fairly new to this world, and being that I've lived around rude people for a long time doesn't exactly help. I try, but please... bare with me. Feel free to correct me, but no need to be harsh. I took some of these replies just as hard as a few of you took my first comment.

~A

Quote from: iiMTF on August 30, 2014, 09:58:20 AM
Ugh!! Just like everyone else, you're interpreting it wrong. I'm not saying that I dislike what they do in that sense, I am all for them taking these drastic measures to protect us.

What I'm saying is I don't see the point in war. Not just in the US, but in the ENTIRE WORLD. We have much more important things to worry about than killing each other off, mainly for land and power. Sure, a lot of countries don't get a long, but we were taught how to deal with that in grade school! Just deal with each other and get along. The world would be much more advanced if we worked together. Plus, we'd be able to get better protection from things in the solar system, like black holes and meteors.

Sometime the weak and helpless need to be protected. I never give smites. But think of this, how many innocent people were murdered by Hitler before WW2 and even then the US did nothing until the Japanese bombed Pearl Harbor. ??? IMHO We should have been in it long before then to try to save the innocents from a genocide before we did. Truth be known, I would still sacrifice myself if need be to save someone innocent from suffering an unjust death. But that is just me though.

You are just young, when you get a little older you may understand. Or I really hope so. there are a lot of members her that are actually putting themselves in harm's way and actually suffering more because they are in the military and my heart really bleeds for them because I know how hard the four years I was in was for me. :(

Quote from: Jess42 on August 30, 2014, 08:25:39 PM
Sometime the weak and helpless need to be protected. I never give smites. But think of this, how many innocent people were murdered by Hitler before WW2 and even then the US did nothing until the Japanese bombed Pearl Harbor. ??? IMHO We should have been in it long before then to try to save the innocents from a genocide before we did. Truth be known, I would still sacrifice myself if need be to save someone innocent from suffering an unjust death. But that is just me though.

You are just young, when you get a little older you may understand. Or I really hope so. there are a lot of members her that are actually putting themselves in harm's way and actually suffering more because they are in the military and my heart really bleeds for them because I know how hard the four years I was in was for me. :(

I didn't say I didn't want the US to protect, I do want the US to protect. I don't see the point in STARTING a war. I only see the point in protecting people from a war.

Quote from: cynthialee on February 16, 2011, 05:56:21 PM
One of the reasons I joined the Army many many years ago was to make a man out of myself. Obviously this plan failed. LOL I was ruthlessly tormented by the other soldiers until I blew up one day. They ussed this blow up to chapter me out of the military.

I was wondering how many of the mid life and late in lifers joined the military to avoid or cover up the inner truth that they were a woman. How did it turn out for you?

Yep Army for me.........although it was the best experience of my life........it also solidified who I always knew who I was.

Quote from: iiMTF on August 30, 2014, 10:15:04 PM
I didn't say I didn't want the US to protect, I do want the US to protect. I don't see the point in STARTING a war. I only see the point in protecting people from a war.

Yeah, but sometimes it don't work that way though. Sometimes we have to declare a war in order to protect those that can't or won't protect themselves for some reason. Sometimes we have to declare war or a police action in order to protect the innocent. It is not pretty and any kind of fighting is never pretty. Even between tow people in an open field. :(

After Pearl Harbor we declared war on Japan and the Axis of "Evil" which was Italy, Germany and Japan.

Peace is Patriotic and real comfortable for men or women but especially children.  Police and Armies that protect and serve us best never fire a shot.....  and now back to living as one big happy human family ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D

Okay folks

This topic asks a particular question, time to get back on topic

Thank you

V M

Quote from: V M on August 30, 2014, 11:17:56 PM
Okay folks

This topic asks a particular question, time to get back on topic

Thank you

V M

I still say what I said the first time. It just proved to me that I wasn't a real man or guy. I always got my butt kicked in hand to hand training and the Pungie  sticks and so on. I mean I always lost. Does that make me a wussy, female or what? Or just uncompetitive? This kind of got me thinking. I really didnlt even hve the "cajones" to repel without someone talking me through it, another freakin' female at that.

Well, it was more of trying to find myself and really having no direction and no way out of my small town in Texas and poverty, and yea, trying to man up, I knew I was transsexual/transgender as young as 5 or 7 years old. The military as a whole, in the USMC, sorta sucked in the SUCK, and was ok. I learned skills that have gotten me out of the toughest of situations of life and death, just by the brutality of what the USMC was. I learned never to crack in the face of the enemy, but only after the deed is done. With the current state of society now, I'm starting to see the worth of it sadly :(, trying to reconcile my transgenderness with my military service, not to be ashamed of it, unless I'm stealth, and then who needs to know, except myself. I'm just private that's all and wish to lead a peaceful, happy life.  :)

I did not join the military or police. Although I was in the Boy Scouts. Even though my main reason for doing so was that I got to go camping all the time I now question my youthfull motivations. In the Scouts I quickly escalated my image and bragged nearly the whole time that I was going to enlist in some branch of the services to which my peers responded with doubt and derision. So I spent the time at home begging my folks, ex hippies, to send me to military school. They of course refused. They knew I would not survive the uber maleness. So by my late teens, out of scouting for years my younger brother, cultural circumstances and mtv led me to the counterculture version through punk music. By my senior year I had learned about the S.H.A.R.P.  movement (skinheads against racial predjudice) and began telling people I was a skinhead. They were the manliest part of the punk world. They even wore military surplus clothing as part of their look. I kept myself as separate from real skins as I could but my brother, who is very masculine, made himself comfortable in that realm. The pose worked and up until five years ago when my world began to collapse at my feet I continued to maintain this so called image. I was kind of happy to find out that the reality of who I am kept people from listening to my bs. Very few of my acquaintances and friends knew about it. Only my close friends wondered how the big tough Boston skin coukd be a woman on the inside.

The choice to join wasn't to man up, but the choice of service was.

I joined the Army during peacetime, and I chose the infantry because they offered me an enlistment bonus of 5k; I also took advantage of the education benefits, and it was exciting to leave home, and set out on an adventure living in Germany. 

I voted no but I started to do police training and realized that was really just me trying to fit into a male role, and I quit. I realized living a more genuine life was more important then doing what society expects from me.

That plus I was a pothead at the time. :-P

I totally forgot that I took the tests to become a professional fire fighter but turned away at the last minute as I knew it wasn't for me. Spending all day in a firehouse with burly dudes and having to try to be one of them. There are four generations of fire fighting men in my family. It was an expected genetic obligation.

No I don't, plus my manly period didn't really last more than 2 weeks or so lol... It wasn't really for me, plus that's a huge extreme, I feel bad for everyone to had to do that.

I never wanted to join the military even though my Dad had been in the air force (RNZAF), but I did work on huge trucks for a living so I guess that was just another way for me to try and 'man-up'.

No.

I tried living like a man for periods of time on several occasions though. That also counts as fighting my gender.

It made the superficial life easier, but anything below the surface including relationships sucked. I am not fighting my gender anymore, I want to be happy with myself even if no long term partner comes to my life.

I just joined because I thought it was interesting. I knew I was gay when I went in and of course I thought all the guys were gorgeous which never prevented me from doing my job but being in the showers I would always check there bodies out when they were nude, that's what some gay guys do lol.

I joined up to serve. Period.
7 campaigns in 'Nam, US Navy

Never felt that I had to 'man-up' or to 'girl-up'.

I did my job well above decks, and was quite popular with the guys below decks (use your imagination).

Oh Yes unfortunately for me it was during one of my "Hyper masculine" phases...took up hunting and snorkelling/ Diving/ spearfishing as well...I was your all round Rambo...being a nurse kind of shattered that image in the early 80's though so what better way to fix it than to head off for 3 character building months with the NZ Territorial force.

Wished I hadn't about halfway up the first hill, on the first morning of boot camp!! Stuck it out and really enjoyed it...didn't make me any more of a man, in fact, it dehumanised me to some extent but I came out with a really valuable skill like being able to shoot you at 100 meters from the prone, kneeling and standing position!! :icon_2gun:

Liz

I wish I could have joined the military proper, but of course I could not.

Not to "man up" as such.

Three reasons. One, survival training. Something bothers me about how unprepared for life or death situations most people (civvies) are, and I don't like not knowing this stuff. I can hunt out most of the info myself but there's nothing like experience.

Two, friends. I know people can make good friends under these conditions. Kind of a necessity with the people you might have to rely on with your life.

Three - well, I've always feared the worst happening, like a war situation, and unfortunately for me the only way to alleviate these fears is to actually experience them/face them. I'm one of those who tends to keep their head in crazy situations, but the monotony and creeping guilt of a dull, safe day job type life is the thing that drives me crazy. Probably comes from my childhood, things weren't stable, and sometimes not safe either. Instability was normality for me.

I'm not a fan of all things military really, I'm not a fan of war, but I can see the benefits of the experience and it bothers me to be excluded from it.

That wasn't the only reason I joined but it was one of them.  The main reason at first was to get free college at one of the best schools in the country.  But once I was in the "manning up" thing did play a role in what I chose to do.  So I joined the Infantry, became a paratrooper, and then a Ranger. 

So, in a way I did man up since I proved myself.  It changed me in many ways.  But there was one thing it never did change, not even in the slightest.  I'll bet you can guess what that one thing is.  LOL.


It is better to be hated for what you are than to be loved for what you are not.
André Gide, Autumn Leaves

I was hoping for free college, but yeah, becoming a manly man doing manly things was definitely in there. Navy, volunteered for submarines, volunteered for nuclear power plant duty, volunteered for a Special  Operations boat where you'd often find me sitting on top of a 500 Kg TORPEX scuttling charge while I tutored trainees.

Not that I did anything dangerous...


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Does a 3 month trip to the Sahara in ex army trucks count? I did that. Along with 30 other people. At age 16.

I did it because it was a rare chance to get out of my cushy life and see some stuff. I was already so used to camping yearly that it was no sweat, really. (Well no, there was much sweat, and discomfort - but I don't remember being homesick at all). Some aspects were potentially pretty dangerous but that's the point, you go to challenge yourself.

I did my share of crazy things out there - exploring abandoned gold mine territory, nearly stepping on venomous snakes, nearly getting lost, experiencing heatstroke and dysentery, sleeping on ground with scorpions running around, etc.

I suppose in a sense a part of me did that to man up, haha. Another to say I've been somewhere not many people have.

Like others, I joined the Air Force for several reasons, one of which was to "man up".  Mostly it was about getting my university education paid for, and about getting free flying lessons in jets instead of Cessnas.  But, although I was in deep denial at the time, and would remain so for many years after I got out, proving myself to be a man was one of them.  Apparently, it didn't work.  :D

I tried, I failed miserably.  I was only in for a few weeks, before I broke down, cried in front of everyone and the drill sergeant, telling them I could not handle it.  I spent the remaining time, in shoes with no shoe laces, being harassed by others.. a few people came up to me and told me they had wished they did the same, but most people were just disgusted with me.  Sleeping in the office, by the first sergeant on a cot, to make sure I did not go through with it was horrible, people would often come in and torment me.  I remember once, waking up and someone had drawn all over my face.. oh good times..  Having other people tell me they wish I did kill myself, yay!  Though, a few did say I was brave to put up with all of that, I don't know why.

I was young and naive, it really hit me when we were training for chemical agents, I just thought of being around death and it really scared me, and it scared me to think others would be relying on me to keep them alive.  I did not get really far at all, I barely remember it because it has been about 23 years since I left.  I don't even know what sort of discharge I got.

Yeah, I failed miserably.  I don't know what I was thinking at the time, off in lala land not really thinking about what the military was really like, having lived a sheltered life away from violence.  I would have rather died, than risk the lives of others, or kill anyone else.. I'm a pacifist, never have I been in a fight, I've always sought out peace, it was a horrible decision on my part.

Sort of.
my dad "encouraged" me to join the military, telling me it'll make a man out of me. I served for five years, was released, then went to university.
I think if I were face to face with my dad today (he passed away prior to me transitioning), I would say "boy, were you wrong!"

Lol

I never had any intention to man up. I had been put into a situation in which becoming a 24/7 Guardian Angel became my only hope. This was back when they were considered vigilantes. Even though I was one of the more "dangerous" when it came to fighting, it was obvious how feminine I was, before I ever took any HRT. In fact, they sent me to take care of issues in the gay neighborhoods of San Francisco, because they figured I fit the bill.

Just a few months after I had to quit, due to a hip injury, I started HRT ... and never stopped. It seems my service to the community helped.

Was going to join the Army but Dad refused to sign as i was 16. he said it's bad enough having to work without someone shooting at you! This was early 70s when there was trouble in Ireland on a daily basis.By the time I was old enough to join on my own I didn't want to

Odd this one would pop up again, I've been recently reflecting on the various good and bad experiences, victories won and injuries incurred - It's all good

I got a scholarship to join the Navy; all expenses paid electrical engineering degree. But my mother beat the crap out of me ( literally) when she found out and refused to sign the papers since I was only 16 at the time,  so I didn't take up the offer. My mother was an extreme pacifist. She later apologized profusely for beating me up for wanting to join the military, saying that my grandfather was disabled in the military and she didn't want the same happening to me.

But the attempt to join the military was a way of recognising myself as a male. I used to play tank commander as a kid sitting on a military camp bed on our balcony, commanding hundred tanks on my imaginary battlefield. My imagination ran wild and I won every battle  :D

Every Open Day at the nearby military base I would persuade my mother to go with me so I could get to sit in a tank and get all the free ice cream I could eat, watch Disney movies in the base cinema, and be covered by goosebumps listening to the band playing marching music. I felt at home there. But I never ended up joining the military.

No, I joined the U.S.Navy for several reasons

1. My best friend asked me to join under the buddy system when he could no longer avoid the draft.
2. It was time for this young man to leave home and start to find his own way in life.
3. I wanted the education in computer career which I loved as a career.
4. It was time to grow up and be a man.

  Well 3 out of 4 isn't a bad record.

Hugs,
   Laurie

I joined the USAF for two reasons.  To support my family, and to get an education.  However, not once did I ever consider what I was doing as "Manning up" because I knew who I was, and who I was not.  I did, however, put on a mask of manning up to get through Basic training.  Once I was in tech school I took off the man-mask and never put it back on.  Instead, I replaced it with a depression+social anxiety mask that has been stuck to my face for 10+ years.  I'm slowly peeling it off, but it's taking a lot out of me.  It's like, the more I peel away that mask the harder it clings to my face.

I joined the Army in 1967 because I had no other choice. The Viet Nam War was building up and if you did not go to college or Canada, you got drafted. I decided to beat the draft by volunteering for an electronics job assignment, a less hazardous duty. I got sent to Viet Nam anyway. I survived a least a dozen mortar attacks. There were so many of them, I really lost count.

So what if I got killed. At least I would not have to deal with my gender dysphoria anymore.