On Dominant Narratives and Why Trans People Lie
Posted by helenboyd – October 8, 2012

http://www.myhusbandbetty.com/2012/10/08/on-dominant-narratives-and-why-trans-people-lie/ 🔗

This is a really fascinating article written by a trans person and sent to me by one too, and it echoes a lot of the thought and sentiment of the MHB Boards over the years.

    But it's true that, before I said it, I carefully mined my personal history for examples of how I was never really a girl. And when I presented my decision to transition to my friends and family, it was with the "always knew" narrative well rehearsed. In that, I'm like almost every other trans* person I've ever talked to about the coming out process.

    Why is "I always knew" the common narrative? Why do so many of us tell some version of that story even if it isn't true?

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Transgender Narratives: Why We Lie

October 1, 2012 in Zach McCallum by Zach

http://www.owldolatrous.com/?p=838 🔗

I really couldn't tell you why trans* people have become so much more interesting to the media and acceptable to governments than they once were, but I welcome the change, since I'm one of them.

But as the cultural narrative expands to include 'transgender person' as a stock character, it does so in a way that's, well, just a stock character. The trans* person in the public eye is almost always some variant on the woman who was born with a penis and just "always knew" she was female, or the boy born with a vagina who refused to wear a single dress and never touched a Barbie Doll.

It's a nice, easily packaged, easily understood story, and sometimes it's even true. Some of us do know (and as those recent news articles reported, some are even lucky enough to begin transition) before puberty. But others live entire lifetimes as one sex, and then at the age of seventy or eighty or ninety, make the change. Many, like me, transition in early-to-mid adulthood after months or years of soul-searching and introspection. And there are people who identify as something other than male or female, who don't jump across the line from boy to girl or girl to boy, but take up residence in the broad middle plain known as genderqueer.

Very interesting - I've left a comment on how this pressure to conform to the Standard Revised Version comes from deep inside the trans community itself, too, sometimes.

Good article!

I always used to smirk at people who would say I've known since I was three or "I always knew," because I myself didn't always know and I'm smart enough to realize that is simply the patent comment one makes to his/her therapist to be able to proceed ahead down the road to HRT and eventually SRS. That's what they look for! On another level, it has everything in the world to do with self justification and validation. Then there are some who have always known as opposed to those who were just bored stiff being stuck in their assigned role and subconsciously took a change in direction which eventually manifested itself after a long struggle as a reality. I can attest to being one of the latter types, no BS from this sister!

I think some people have always known what they were - and some of us have known what we weren't, but not what we were, for a long time.

Even I find what I just wrote hard to read .

I told my therapist that I always knew something was different, when I was about 8 I realised that I enjoyed playing with girls toys but at that age I thought the desire to be a girl meant I was gay, at that age in the 80's we had no internet so I had no clue that transpeople existed.

It wasn't until I was in my teens that I learnt that there was such thing as a transperson & I instantly knew that was me.
It's very difficult not to project my adult perspective on my childhood memories, maybe some people aren't lying & it's just that it's very confusing trying to sort out these feelings & emotions

I think if I'd heard less of the "I've always known" narrative (or the "trapped in a man's body" narrative), I might have been in touch with my true gender earlier. But I always WISHED I was one of those transsexuals who knew they were women because then I'd get to have a women's body. Didn't occur to me that it might be the same thing.

I've known since I was 4. I am not making that up to please anyone. I don't even have a therapist to tell lies to. I'm not concerned in the slightest that someone might not believe me. Is it a basis to believe someone is "more trans" than another person? I honestly don't know or care.

No, that's not what this is about, I don't think.

It's just saying that only some trans folk knew they were trans right from the start, but that the ones who didn't can feel under pressure to say they did anyway.

I can relate to that, since within the trans community you do get some trans 'elitism' that implies that 'late onset' trans folk are less of the real deal (fortunately, most people don't buy into that crap) - and outside the trans community, you also get people, especially in the medical profession, who don't take you seriously unless you "knew right from the start". It makes it tempting to have that story handy.

Quote from: Padma on October 09, 2012, 06:50:59 PM
I can relate to that, since within the trans community you do get some trans 'elitism' that implies that 'late onset' trans folk are less of the real deal (fortunately, most people don't buy into that crap) - and outside the trans community, you also get people, especially in the medical profession, who don't take you seriously unless you "knew right from the start". It makes it tempting to have that story handy.

As one of the late onset people, I definitely feel this, Padma.

Even from myself.

After all, I've known since I was a teenager that I "wished" I had a female body. But I didn't feel bad enough to *do* anything about it. So maybe I was "less trans" than the person who, at that age, just had to transition so badly that she snuck daily into her sister's room to romp around in her Mary Jane's (among other things).

Of course that doesn't make me less trans now that, for some reason, I can't stand the idea of living another day without the world seeing me as a woman.

I am surprised Helen miss the explanation. If you always knew, since you can remember, well then everything is honky dory, but if the discovery was later on, then there is a perception that people may question this sudden change, and to avoid this questioning, some of us lie.

As a woman of science I am more interested in knowing why in some it manifest so early, and why in others it takes a life long.

I known several people who started CD late in their teens, and remain CD for decades, just to start transitioning and recognizing themselves as TS late in their 40's or 50's.

I think this is a developmental, and I mean a neuro-developmental one. Earlier, I wanted to believe that gender identity was ascribed to single center in the brain, but the preponderance of the emerging biological evidence indicates that gender identity like other complex brain personae (e.g sexual orientation) is holographic in nature, that is, the product of the interaction of many centers.

So, developmentally, the events that make your brain female happen in many areas of the brain with different degrees of penetrance, and thus leading to a syndrome. If I am correct, its effects are not only a temporal expression (e.g. when I discovered my true gender) but also in terms of the skewness of your identity (e.g. how much female I am in the gender continuum).

I would even argue that a similar case could be made for sexual orientation, albeit with different brain centers participating on it.

We will see if future data proves me right or wrong.

Dr. Peky
 

One could wonder if they are lying but that person should wonder what makes them so special in the eyes of who the "liar" that they should give a rat's patoot over whether they believe them or not. I for one don't care what others believe. Their thoughts on my life are roughly the same as whether that speck of dirt in the corner of the room is bothering me. I don't even notice it.

Frankly mine began around puberty. It's hard to pinpoint really. However i was trying on clothes and my confusing sexual feelings began around that time too. May have been further back because I had other thoughts then on being "different" but there are only a few people here I will delve into such a conversation with.

Quote from: Jayne on October 09, 2012, 12:47:02 PM
I told my therapist that I always knew something was different, when I was about 8 I realised that I enjoyed playing with girls toys but at that age I thought the desire to be a girl meant I was gay, at that age in the 80's we had no internet so I had no clue that transpeople existed.

It wasn't until I was in my teens that I learnt that there was such thing as a transperson & I instantly knew that was me.
It's very difficult not to project my adult perspective on my childhood memories, maybe some people aren't lying & it's just that it's very confusing trying to sort out these feelings & emotions

"I always felt different, but never talked about it" is what I put on my therapy registration when it asked about orientation. Sadly, there was no check box or question asked about gender, so I had to put it there. As I said in a thread elsewhere on this forum...I knew from the time I was 7 or 8. Like you, I didn't know that there was a word or category for what I was feeling and what I recognized.

I come from a LGBT home, and was exposed to the reality of people living their own lives in the LGBT spectrum at about age 10. I saw what I thought I recognized as men dressed like women, but was told they were entertainers. My dysphoria REALLY creeped back on me while watching the movie, "Casper" after it came out for private home viewing. The scene where the teen age girl said to her father that she wanted to look "date nice" took me for a such a spin that I KNEW once again that I was a female. WHY? Because I identified and felt with her deeply about wanting to look "date nice".

I always looked at my female role models and had very clear thoughts that I liked what they were wearing, that I wanted to look that nice and well put together. I liked their make-up and wanted to look as beautiful as they did. The dysphoria was REALLY bad when I was 15, but I used other issues that were actually happening with me at the time to cover it up for fear that no one would understand, and I would be diagnosed as certifiably crazy.

Honestly, I am one of those who always knew.

Quote from: peky on October 09, 2012, 07:41:20 PM
I am surprised Helen miss the explanation. If you always knew, since you can remember, well then everything is honky dory, but if the discovery was later on, then there is a perception that people may question this sudden change, and to avoid this questioning, some of us lie.

As a woman of science I am more interested in knowing why in some it manifest so early, and why in others it takes a life long.

I known several people who started CD late in their teens, and remain CD for decades, just to start transitioning and recognizing themselves as TS late in their 40's or 50's.

I think this is a developmental, and I mean a neuro-developmental one. Earlier, I wanted to believe that gender identity was ascribed to single center in the brain, but the preponderance of the emerging biological evidence indicates that gender identity like other complex brain personae (e.g sexual orientation) is holographic in nature, that is, the product of the interaction of many centers.

So, developmentally, the events that make your brain female happen in many areas of the brain with different degrees of penetrance, and thus leading to a syndrome. If I am correct, its effects are not only a temporal expression (e.g. when I discovered my true gender) but also in terms of the skewness of your identity (e.g. how much female I am in the gender continuum).

I would even argue that a similar case could be made for sexual orientation, albeit with different brain centers participating on it.

We will see if future data proves me right or wrong.

Dr. Peky

OK Dr. Peky, You might have something there! Having sex with a few other boys when I was a kid didn't make me gay, it was normal curiosity that a lot of kids have and so they experiment a bit. Trying on my mothers clothes on the sly during puberty didn't turn me into a cross dresser or MtF overnight either, once again it was fantasy coupled with curiosity. But when I was twenty years old in a war zone and looked at a playboy centerfold something snapped. Perhaps it had to do with being 7000 miles away from home, covered with mud and leeches at times, people trying to kill me, and the whole idea that men are born to war and to kill one another, I don't know for certain. But the girl on the page was beautiful, clean, dry safe and adored by everyone that laid eyes on her. I wanted to be like her instead of like me. I wrestled with it off and on for years before I made it happen albeit way late in life. Woulda, coulda, shoulda and if only as no doubt so many of us here have often said.

If I understand correctly, for me the "always knew" was more of a retrospective thing.  I put a lot of effort into trying to fit into my assigned gender.  When I eventually got to a point of accepting myself as I am, then I could acknowledge the dreams and fantasies where I was female, thinking I was born female and "grew out of it" when I was very young....understanding why I might have been mistaken for gay as a teenager.....and so on...

All of that really was happening for as long as I can remember, but it wasn't until I stopped denying it that I was able to acknowledge it.

.....having a hard time writing this without it seeming awkward 

I think I get that. I technically didn't really question my gender until I was 23, but several things make a lot more sense now. Like why I thought I'd end up physically at least part boy when I was a preteen and a few other things that make me wonder why it took me so long.

For me though, the fact that it did take me so long and that it doesn't fit with the "trans narrative" ended up causing me to doubt myself.

I dunno, I think we are all individuals. I knew I felt like a freak since 1974 and "felt like a girl." I don't think that makes many any more or less of anything else. I never played with dolls, I never wore make up or played in my Mom's clothes. I didn't get ma'amd, I wasn't effeminate. I played soccer and lacrosse in high school. I find myself kind of playing up my boy side before I transitioned when I talk to people I tell. "Oh, yeah, you wouldn't have recognized me or anything about me before, you would think I was a duuuude!" Then we laugh about it and move on. In reality, the only real trans narrative is the one each person tells, themselves. To a therapist, the media, speaking groups, friends, lovers, families, etc. My narrative is mine and I emphasize and de-emphasize (um, is that a word?) different parts of it depending on who I'm talking to. If I'm on a radio station, I speak a very basic language the listeners will understand. If I'm talking to the parents of a young trans kid and trying to help them, it's different. An older transitioner, maybe something different. It's all true, it's just different parts for different people. Transpeople ask me much different questions than non trans but I try to make sure the language I use and the narrative I tell makes sense to them and has them understanding a bit better whatever I'm trying to help them understand, if that makes any sense?

I welcome the world when some girl can come on Susan's, say she just figured out she's trans, says she didn't always know, says no one "ever would have suspected anything at all," maybe crossdressed a ton or something and isn't sure transition is for her and seeing an entire thread with nothing but support and love for her and her situation. So many times we get way too caught up in using each other for some kind of measuring stick, validation, etc. Hugs to all of you, I don't care where you are on the gender spectrum, who you love, what you wear or what you identity is. You'll always have a place in my heart for being honest with yourself and saying "this is who I am"   🙂 Meghan

I realize I am probably out of touch with the community but The first thing I noticed after reading these boards were the number of MTF's who did not have the "woman trapped in a mans body" thing.   It's simply a lot easier to explain to outsiders than the varied and complex paths we follow. Not fitting the woman trapped in a mans body concept caused great confusion and anxiety. It was the source of my trouble. I thought I can't be a MTF TS because I didn't feel that way. That's why I gave up on labels. They don't work for me.

  I knew something was wrong from a very young age but my thought process was simple. Look below and what do you see? Male parts. Therefore I am male. But the thing is  I didn't feel male with certainty. I just felt like me.  As puberty approached I knew something was simply wrong inside. I just was not matching up with the other boys.  But I wanted more than anything to have a female body. 

I wish boards like this were around years ago. It would have made life allot easier. I must say it  feels nice to feel apart of a like minded community.   

Quote from: Christine on October 09, 2012, 10:41:11 PM
I realize I am probably out of touch with the community but The first thing I noticed after reading these boards were the number of MTF's who did not have the "woman trapped in a mans body" thing.

Lol, I always hated that phrase. It sounds like a bad episode of Star Trek or something, not to make light of people who really felt that, because it would stink to feel that way. Christine, I felt like I had the right body, it was the brain that was all messed up. Brains are easier to fix and be messed up than bodies, right? I felt more comfortable thinking to myself that my brain was just stupid and I was a freak. Then when I came out I just told people "yeah, I dunno, I'm just going to be a lot happier this way, it just makes a lot more sense to me if I lived female and not male. Be happy for me!" I think it sounds really simplistic, but it kinda was, I think. Problem = I think I'd feel more comfortable and happy living female based on how and feel and felt. Solution = Live as female. Outcome = 

Quote from: MeghanAndrews on October 09, 2012, 10:49:43 PM
Lol, I always hated that phrase. It sounds like a bad episode of Star Trek or something, not to make light of people who really felt that, because it would stink to feel that way. Christine, I felt like I had the right body, it was the brain that was all messed up. Brains are easier to fix and be messed up than bodies, right? I felt more comfortable thinking to myself that my brain was just stupid and I was a freak. Then when I came out I just told people "yeah, I dunno, I'm just going to be a lot happier this way, it just makes a lot more sense to me if I lived female and not male. Be happy for me!" I think it sounds really simplistic, but it kinda was, I think. Problem = I think I'd feel more comfortable and happy living female based on how and feel and felt. Solution = Live as female. Outcome = 

Yep.

It took me 25 years after first realising I was supposed to be female before I felt safe enough to do something about it. And then I questioned myself for a while after starting to visit trans forums, because my Story didn't fit the Standard Revised Version that I was seeing a lot, the "I knew since I was potty trained, played with dolls, wanted to be a princess" history that seemed dominant - until I got here and found more diversity - and watched She's A Boy I Knew.

My "Oh, *that's* what's always been going on!* has been retrospective, and my life only made sense to me after looking back 50 years. I never cross-dressed in the way people would normally understand this - but that's because the women I always wanted to be like were all trouser-wearing adventuresses . I've basically been a closet dyke all my life, so it didn't show very clearly...

My "looking-back" has been cautious, since I know it's easy to reinterpret memories, or even rewrite them (I repressed abuse for years before it was safe to remember). But an obsession since childhood with trans stories is not in question. I always knew I was female, and I always knew it wasn't safe to know that until later.

The whole "validity" thing can sting - I often get people who, when they hear that I was abused, ask "do you think this was the cause of your gender issues?" like they need to find a reason for it to be unreal. I have to explain patiently that it's more the other way round - I was abused partially as a consequence of being gender-ambiguous.

I don't know all the details of my past, it's been too long - but I know that as soon as I began taking estrogen, something in me that had never, ever relaxed was able to sit down for the first time ever in the seat of me. That's all I need to know.

And see, I've just written this in some way to justify myself - it's hard not to do that, having been brought up not to consider myself a valid person. A lot of trans people have difficult pasts to deal with alongside their present.