...that you didn't pass? I know it's kinda a touchy subject, but... I have a friend who is MtF, and she's been on hrt for a long while now, but she really doesn't pass well. And every time she asks me if she passes, I cringe. Because I feel like a horrible friend, because I lie every time. "Honey, you look great!" *thumbs up* I feel like such an a-hole, but it makes her happy, and I like making her happy, haha. But I'm looking for a way to politely tell her that, sometimes, she really looks very male. I don't know how to do it so I don't come off as a dick, but it's just that much harder because I've been lying for so long now. So, if someone needed to tell you, politely, that you look very masculine today, how would you want them to tell you? Or would you want them to just hush and keep it to themselves?

Is there anything specific that makes her not pass? Is it possible to correct? Is she dressing wrong? or is it her face?
I think I would want feedback on what makes me not pass. Like, if you just tell her that she doesn't pass, she'll have no idea what's wrong.

I'm not sure how you should bring it up, because you've been lying for so long. But try to be gentle and tell her where the issue is.
Yeah, I don't really know. I'd be really upset however I was told, but I'd at least want to know why I don't pass.

And hushing makes things worse, because you'll lose even more trust in others.

As far as I'm concerned, that's a good white lie that would boost her self-esteem, which is often very low in trans individuals. However, if she said, "Be honest and tell me if I pass," then you would have to sit her down and tell her. Don't say, "You look like a man" or something because that might make her cry profusely. You could say something like, "You could use a bit more time" or anything along those parameters. You can be honest and assure her that you at least will always see her as a lady, but try not to be too blunt about it. Only tell her if she asks. If you just tell her she doesn't pass out of nowhere, you'll look like a mean person. Be specific and tell her what the problem is.

I think it's really just her jaw structure. It isn't feminine at all. She just has a very masculine face. No hair or anything, just defined. She's had a surprising amount of chest growth from hormones alone, and the rest of her body structure is.. well, quite nice, but her face throws the whole thing off a bit. I'm not sure how I'd describe it. I was thinking it could just be that I've known her from before, and she still looks like my buddy from high school to me. Just, in a mini-skirt, haha! I just know if I didn't pass I'd want someone to say something, but I'm very blunt, and I don't ruffle, so I need a less... me way to say what I mean

It may likely just be that you knew her from before transition, so you're just picking off little details. I'm not saying that's bad; it's actually understandable (I know that my friend Luis, who I knew since 6th grade, won't be able to forget the male version of my face) since you're used to something different than she looks like now.

Don't say anything, because you might her feel bad for something that was never really a problem.

I'm flat out honest with people. I'd tell her "Well I'm not the right person to ask because I knew you before, but no... I don't think you do because ...."

I'd want someone to do the same for me... really. At least I'd know how people saw me.

Maybe get a third party impartial opinion?

Perhaps ask a friend you trust to take a look at a picture?

Find out if it's just your perspective, or if there really is an issue, before you say anything. If you can get 1 or 2 other people to notice it without any hint, then you should say something.

If it was me personally I would want someone to tell me. Actually I've heard a good tactic used by another trans girl I know, she goes on tinychat or omegle, and trys to see if people can clock her and then if they don't, she probes them further about her looks until eventually she comes out and tells them she is MTF. It's good because it also covers voice and mannerisms.

I've heard it has done amazing things for her confidence and self-esteem, but she is very passable, however it is not recommended for very sensitive people, since it's anonymous, people can be very harsh sometimes or even offended once they realise she is trans (for whatever reason).

I would prefer to be told, especially if they give some constructive observations.

I still don't think I would like to be upfront told, "Hey, you look like a man." (Excuse me, I'll be back in 2 hours after I've finished crying  ) Unless I ask you, I don't want to hear it. If you do choose to just tell her, at least ease into it gently.

Biscuit_Stix, in my opinion, you are doing your friend a disservice by telling her a lie.  You can give constructive advice and point out where you think improvements can be made.  Your friend probably already realizes she has "passing issues."  Or she would not be asking.

Tell her, as a friend, that you think sometimes she presents in ways that do not emphasize her inner femininity.

I've spent some time lately around MtFs who don't pass. None of them are any less a woman for not passing. From what I've observed and heard from them, they are treated by nearly everyone as the women they are.

MtFs who don't pass as well are every bit as feminine and beautiful as those who do, and are every bit as entitled to be treated and seen as a woman.

Is this a message that it might help your friend to hear?

It's possible to get so hung up on passing as to lose sight of the fact that transition is about being true to yourself.

I say don't tell her if she is confident in her mind that she is passing let her believe so. Confidence is beauty. I'm sure she knows she isn't passing too. I know I don't pass yet in public because I've been himed like two weeks ago.  Its just constructive criticism and a evaluation of where we are at in our current transitions. One must remember not to take it personal. If you must tell her though and feel that you must just give her some pointers on the areas of her body or face that need more time or a different direction taken with what she is wearing to help conceal her transition. Like wearing her make up different to highlight more femi features or simply wearing different tops to help change her body shape.

I have a rule that I don't comment on whether people pass or not and here's why: who knows? Who knows what goes through people's heads when they see and interact with other people? If you think someone doesn't pass, being trans* yourself, you are probably more a student of gender and gender differences than non trans* so you have an advantage there. I think a lot of people are looking for reassurance when they ask if they pass. Maybe focusing on things like "How important is that to you?" or "Let's say you find out you don't, how would that make you feel?" would be better.

I think one of the most important questions people should ask before they ever transition is how important passability is to them. [I feel like I always need to put a caveat out there about discussions about passability. Passability doesn't imply someone "is" or "is not" something, it's merely, to me, whether someone gets gendered the way they expect by strangers, that's it] So if someone's goal is that they must get correctly gendered 100% of the time in person and on the phone and maybe they get incorrectly gendered like 10% of the time, is that acceptable? Would they still transition? There are people who don't care about passing or where it doesn't affect their decision to transition. There are others who might not transition if they don't have that % to a certain number. People are different, I would maybe, even though it's kinda late, focus on how important that is to them and why. If they say 100%, maybe they need to come to terms with the current reality of their situation and work on the things they can to improve their passing %.

I would also shift the focus away from you. You are their friend. Does what you say really matter about passability? I would think the pronouns they get at the bank, grocery store, etc. would be more important than what a caring friend thinks, you know? If they are looking for reassurance that they look ok and are moving in the right direction, I think that's the kind of support friends should give. I hope this makes sense Meghan

The people who knew me before seemed to have totally different ideas about my passability than strangers did.. At some point I even asked myself if those who knew me before had problems with letting go of 'him'. In the end, I had to let THEM go.

Telling that she passes, and passes well, could become a security issue...cis-women don't have to think about trans-phobes who might attack them (verbally or physically).

Tell her the truth, but don't be harsh about it. Say it like, "Your jawline could use some help in looking more feminine..."

Quote from: JJ on November 17, 2012, 05:34:32 AM
Regarding unsolicited comments, I would prefer to be told things that I could actually do something about at the time. If I've asked their opinion then I would want the plain truth, nothing less. Anything else is useless to me. Don't tell me I look great if I look like the Queen with a Desperate Dan jaw and Britney Spears hair.

Unless that's what he/she likes.  You can never forget that beauty is in the eye of the beholder.