I recently saw the Disney movie Mulan on ABC. It aired a few nights ago where I lived. The movie is actually quite a wonderful expression of gender issues and societal stigmas tied to the binary gender system. One of the main songs, "Reflections," sounded like I could have sung it about my life. I thought I would share this with all of you as you might find it uplifting and interesting to watch:

Mulan - Reflection (lyrics)

Look at me,
I will never pass for a perfect bride,
or a perfect daughter,
can it be,
I'm not meant to play this part,
Now I see,
that if I were truly to be myself,
I would break my family's heart (this line speaks the most to me)
Who is that girl I see,
staring straight,
back at me,
why is my reflection someone I don't know,
somehow I cannot hide,
who i am,
though i've tried,
When will my reflection show,
who I am inside,

when will my reflection show,
who I am inside

And at the end of the video a quote from Mulan's father is shown: "The greatest gift and honor is having you for a daughter." I really wish my dad would and could say something like that to me. But I know he never will.

Nice.  Looks like I'm going to have to watch that movie.

It has the potential to be about an FTM, if they'd change these things:

1. The Emperor asks Mulan "Why did you violate my law (only males may have weapons)?" To which Mulan replies, "My body is a woman, but my spirit is a man. *I* am a man where it counts."
2. The Emperor then says, "And so you are a man, as of now. I decree it."
3. When she gets home, her father says, "The greatest gift and honor is having you for a son."

Without these changes, Mulan is more of a feminist/liberal film that suggests fat, poorly trained men and women are the equal to strong men who fight as a way of life. In the days of swords and horses (and to a slightly lesser extent today), brute strength and numbers always prevail.

^ Yes, it does have potential.

I for myself have always wondered why Mulan did have to get back into girl mode after being so awesome as a dude. Or whether she would switch her style afterwards according to how she was feeling.

But yes, it's great movie, I do recommend it. It was my favorite when I was a kid.

Quote from: Phoeniks on December 30, 2012, 02:00:01 PM
^ Yes, it does have potential.

I for myself have always wondered why Mulan did have to get back into girl mode after being so awesome as a dude. Or whether she would switch her style afterwards according to how she was feeling.

But yes, it's great movie, I do recommend it. It was my favorite when I was a kid.

yes, the changes would only be at the end...up to that point it could easily be seen as a movie about an FTM. Also, I never thought about that...coming home after defeating the Huns (?), would she then be happy being a quiet, submissive wife?

If I were the Emperor, I'd keep her in the Palace, lest she challenge my right to be Emperor (and she could--his army was defeated by the Huns, and SHE defeated THEM!)

I'm thinking the movie is not about MTF or FTM but just gender issues and roles in general. It speaks to any person who feels oppressed because of societal gender norms.

This movie does not speak to the internal conflict a person may have between his/her gender and the body: gender body image issues.

Mulan is one of my favourite movies and I love the song reflections. It never occurred to me that MTF's might be able to relate to it too.

Quote from: Beth Andrea on December 30, 2012, 11:22:06 AM
It has the potential to be about an FTM, if they'd change these things:

1. The Emperor asks Mulan "Why did you violate my law (only males may have weapons)?" To which Mulan replies, "My body is a woman, but my spirit is a man. *I* am a man where it counts."
2. The Emperor then says, "And so you are a man, as of now. I decree it."
3. When she gets home, her father says, "The greatest gift and honor is having you for a son."

Without these changes, Mulan is more of a feminist/liberal film that suggests fat, poorly trained men and women are the equal to strong men who fight as a way of life. In the days of swords and horses (and to a slightly lesser extent today), brute strength and numbers always prevail.

But mulan was a woman. And in contrast to the disney movie she went on to have a successful military career.

Mulan was always my favorite Disney character as a kid.  Some of the stuff in it can definitely apply to trans people, but I see it as having more of a feminist/equality message.  She only poses as a man because no one will take her seriously otherwise.

Quote from: Carbon on January 01, 2013, 03:16:43 PM
But mulan was a woman. And in contrast to the disney movie she went on to have a successful military career.

I know.  But we were talking about "Mulan" being a movie about a transsexual man (FTM)...to make it a movie about an FTM, and not merely another feminist movie, certain changes would have to be made...

But it is a good movie, all on its own, just a good, fun, mildly dramatic movie for kids, and kids-at-heart. 

Quote from: Beth Andrea on January 01, 2013, 08:56:03 PM
I know.  But we were talking about "Mulan" being a movie about a transsexual man (FTM)...to make it a movie about an FTM, and not merely another feminist movie, certain changes would have to be made...

But it is a good movie, all on its own, just a good, fun, mildly dramatic movie for kids, and kids-at-heart. 

I've been thinking about this and I might have misunderstood your post. I think you were talking about what with have to be changed to make it be about a transgender man in order to illustrate how it wasn't about one. It's kind of offensive to me to talk about rewriting a story about a quasi-historical woman to be about a man instead of the gender she presumably identified with, but your actual point is probably more in line with how I think about things.

I have found, that in recent years with a growing frequency, that there are a LOT of songs out there, that can be listened to, and can provide incredible new meanings all by hearing them with different ears.

I doubt the authors ever had that intention, it just shows that great music is often great on many levels.

I have also known for some time, that listening to angry negative music, is often a bad idea on many levels.
I simply don't get the interest in a lot of people listening to music 'to make a stand' with no intent to actually ever do so.
The only time I will be speaking of politics, I will have a weapon in my hand, not a microphone.

I just watched Mulan last night. Mulan is my hero XD

Mulan is enjoyable enough, but as some of you have mentioned it's nowhere near as trans* friendly as some might think. In fact, I find it somewhat hostile.

It pained me to see another society very much like my own used to be, where to be born female meant that you were pretty much a servant of your father and then your husband. Did you see the way the other women treated her like a piece of meat at the beginning of the movie, when they're trying to beautify her? And the only way Mulan could escape her fate was by pretending to be a man. But did she actually escape it? Did she gain equal rights for herself, or better yet, for all Chinese women? No. She saved the emperor and he offered her emancipation, but instead she simply wanted to return home to domestic life with her father, and she gets married in the sequel. So the subtext was this: women have the skill and potential to be equal to men in theory, but really their highest aspiration is to become a wife & mother.

Did you also notice how dressing & behaving like a man is portrayed as 'just a phase' that she goes through out of necessity (because her father has no sons) before returning to her 'proper' role as a woman? That's not at all helpful to trans* people whose families insist that we're 'just going through a phase'. It delegitimises our experiences and makes it harder for our families to believe us.

In the original Chinese legend on which the movie was based, Mulan fights with the army for 12 years and her comrades-in-arms had no idea that she was female until she reveals herself at the end of the tale. And there's no mention of a love interest. This is how The Ballad of Mulan ends (according to Wikipedia):
The male rabbit is swifter of foot, The eyes of the female are somewhat smaller.
But when the two rabbits run side by side, How can you tell the female from the male?
That's a much better message than "OK little girl, you're lucky you got away with it for a while, but you really ought to get back home - the dishes need doing."

Still, at least it gives the general public the idea that gender boundaries are not concrete and can be crossed. That, at least, is something.

Don't think I've ever actually watched the full movie, but heard the song before and identified with it. This line speaks to me the most:

Quotewhy is my reflection someone I don't know

Quote from: FTMDiaries on January 04, 2013, 09:48:03 AM
Mulan is enjoyable enough, but as some of you have mentioned it's nowhere near as trans* friendly as some might think. In fact, I find it somewhat hostile.

It pained me to see another society very much like my own used to be, where to be born female meant that you were pretty much a servant of your father and then your husband. Did you see the way the other women treated her like a piece of meat at the beginning of the movie, when they're trying to beautify her? And the only way Mulan could escape her fate was by pretending to be a man. But did she actually escape it? Did she gain equal rights for herself, or better yet, for all Chinese women? No. She saved the emperor and he offered her emancipation, but instead she simply wanted to return home to domestic life with her father, and she gets married in the sequel. So the subtext was this: women have the skill and potential to be equal to men in theory, but really their highest aspiration is to become a wife & mother.

Did you also notice how dressing & behaving like a man is portrayed as 'just a phase' that she goes through out of necessity (because her father has no sons) before returning to her 'proper' role as a woman? That's not at all helpful to trans* people whose families insist that we're 'just going through a phase'. It delegitimises our experiences and makes it harder for our families to believe us.

In the original Chinese legend on which the movie was based, Mulan fights with the army for 12 years and her comrades-in-arms had no idea that she was female until she reveals herself at the end of the tale. And there's no mention of a love interest. This is how The Ballad of Mulan ends (according to Wikipedia):
The male rabbit is swifter of foot, The eyes of the female are somewhat smaller.
But when the two rabbits run side by side, How can you tell the female from the male?
That's a much better message than "OK little girl, you're lucky you got away with it for a while, but you really ought to get back home - the dishes need doing."

Still, at least it gives the general public the idea that gender boundaries are not concrete and can be crossed. That, at least, is something.

It's still a lot better than other disney movies of that time period and prior, though. Not that that's saying much.

It is a fun movie, it's just not trans friendly or even that feminist. But we're obviously still allowed to identify cisgender characters.

It was always my favorite Disney movie, many other ones i couldn't stand at all since all the women needed a man to save them. Mulan on the other hand helps lead the Chinese against the Huns and inevitably wins. She is a very strong character and is why she is one of my all time favorite characters. Shes a positive role model telling young kids that girls can be head strong, don't need to rely on a man to save them and that most importantly we are all equal regardless of our genders.

To me mulan is just another disney princess movie but this time one that gives tomboy little girls dreams for her prince... Dont get me wrong its by far one of my favourite disney films however I dont see its as ground breaking as you guys.