This topic in fact is broader than just dressing matters. It actually relates to a lot of situations, events and processors that anyone transitioning will encounter at some time in their journey.

I was talking to a clinical therapist today about the abhorrent fear most of us have been challenged with, or are still locked, frozen in fear and doing everything possible to avoid the particular situation.

Well apparently there is one very easy and simple way to over come our fears and in trepidations once and for all.

Fear itself, is not what we fear. It's our perceived outcome of the event that locks us in fear. What will people thing of me; I'll be totally embarrassed by this; I'm too shy; I can't face the public; I can't deliver this speech, everyone will laugh at me .......... and the list goes on. Pretty close to 100% of the perceived outcomes never happens.

So in order to set yourself up for success he suggested you try something outlandishly silly as putting yourself into a publicly embarrassing situation so you can over come your fear.

One of the many suggestions he made was to simple dress yourself in comfortable clothing so you look part of everyday society, then go down to the railway station or bus shelter and catch the train or bus. Throughout the journey, be seen reading the paper or a magazine and prior to the next stop, you, in a loud voice put down your paper and in a very loud voice announce the name of the stop. Before going back to your reading, look around and see what reaction,if any, you got to such silly nonsense.

Whatever response you do get, apart from the odd sideways look with the appropriate look of "oh just another 'nutter' " is considerable more than you will ever get from dressing in your preferred gender and going out in public.

Nobody is going to be interested in YOU. Everyone has their own problems to solve and they are not going to care about YOU. The only reason a few may cast you a glance is because you may be over dressed or under dressed for the occasion, and even these won't really care. They'll be back to their paper which is providing far greater interest than you.

This therapist tried an experiment on the London Underground.  After only announcing 4 stops on the Central line the novelty had worn off the passengers who just chose to ignore him although he continued announcing each and every stop. Not one comment was made to him throughout the exercise. He perceived there would have been substantial verbal abuse with some possible physical abuse apart from the profound embarrassment, none of which occurred. In fact he became bored with the experiment long before his stop appeared.

Just proves what FEAR stands for; False Evidence Appearing Real.

Your challenge now is to go out and do something as silly as that, then next day/week go out dressed in your preferred gender.

Have fun and enjoy. That's about as hard as it gets.

Be safe, well and happy.

Huggs
Catherine

Yes to all of this, and may I add that most other people aren't remotely interested in you or in what you're wearing or anything else about you because their lives are so full of their own business and busyness that they don't have the time or inclination to waste on you and your possibly odd appearance.

In principle I agree with what you say.

We have a guy always walks around here in fancy dress. Guess he's about 60 with a variety of outfits that do leave you thinking, eh? He will however always have a piece of card around his neck with an explanatory note such as "Ken courtesy of Kenco" when he has dressed up with a coffee theme. Everyone's interested but give him a wide berth and no trouble. People get it, well sort of, and like him.

With dressing I think that people get it and, generally accept/ ignore with one exception and that is andro. They don't understand why a guy would be wearing a women's jacket.

I'm not supporting their view I just think it takes more confidence to be andro than to dress fully.

People can feel threatened by something they don't understand

Quote from: sandrauk on March 05, 2013, 08:52:11 AM
In principle I agree with what you say.

We have a guy always walks around here in fancy dress. Guess he's about 60 with a variety of outfits that do leave you thinking, eh? He will however always have a piece of card around his neck with an explanatory note such as "Ken courtesy of Kenco" when he has dressed up with a coffee theme. Everyone's interested but give him a wide berth and no trouble. People get it, well sort of, and like him.

With dressing I think that people get it and, generally accept/ ignore with one exception and that is andro. They don't understand why a guy would be wearing a women's jacket.

I'm not supporting their view I just think it takes more confidence to be andro than to dress fully.

People can feel threatened by something they don't understand

I appreciate that, I dress andro all the time. It's the gatekeepers within the trans community that takes exception to that more than does the general populace and I think it's rather hypocritical as I can easily point out half a dozen reasons why they don't pass as well. Those who wish to be accepted need to apply that concept to the rest of the trans community spectrum and get their heads out of their own a**es!

Sigh... this is going to be a big issue for me, especially since I spent pretty much my entire early teens being made fun of for wearing clothes that didn't "fit in." I got teased for wearing short shorts, and teased for shaving my arms and legs, and teased for singing in a soprano voice, and teased for having a girl as a best friend for my entire childhood, and a bunch of other things. So I guess I'm still kind of stuck in that mindset, of feeling embarrassed about being myself, and mortified of those same judgmental glances.

So is it really true? Do people really stop caring after a certain age? Am I now worrying about nothing?

I guess I'm also worried because I know my huge back and arms are a big giveaway that I'm really a guy, not to mention the fact that I'm over six feet tall. I don't know... I just don't know. I want to, but I'll admit that I'm petrified of judgment.

When I go out the thought of adults does not normally bother me.

Its them damn pesky kids. 

Hi Cheetaking,

Quote from: cheetaking243 on March 05, 2013, 01:31:07 PM
So is it really true? Do people really stop caring after a certain age? Am I now worrying about nothing?

I guess I'm also worried because I know my huge back and arms are a big giveaway that I'm really a guy, not to mention the fact that I'm over six feet tall. I don't know... I just don't know. I want to, but I'll admit that I'm petrified of judgment.

In response to your question, Yes, generally from teens years people begin to stop caring what others look like, as they start to realise other more competeing priorities take prominence. Career, cars, relationship etc.

A possible suggestion to minimise your larger figure is to seek clothing suggestions from a clothing store or stylist. Womens fashion stores are only too happy to make suggestions in that regard. 

To help you go out in public dressed in your preferred gender, find a compassionate friend or a local TG organisation that can accompany you for the first few occasions which will build your confidence beyond belief. Face your fear and become a winner. You're stonger than your fear.

Be safe, well and happy
Lotsa huggs
Catherine

I think Catherine's post is very true and it also strikes at the heart of the question many people ask, 'When do I come out? When I pass or .............

Without wishing to curse everyone to tears, most of us MtF will never pass. Never until we accept ourselves as us. Do I pass? I have no idea and no great interest. I'm treated as female in every public situation I'm in, from picking up a $500 dress in a top shop and the attendant looking at me and saying, Oh try that on, you have the height and body and it's a gorgeous dress - to boys carrying my groceries for me - to waiting in the loo line with 20 others and all chatting away. My voice passes for a guys voice. That's it. There are half a dozen people on this site who can confirm that, I speak to them!

When do we accept ourselves? When we face the fear. When the fear doesn't matter. When people can longer smell fear.

When should I come out? When you are ready to accept yourself as you, because no one else will until you do.

When you face your fear.

Sorry Sis for interrupting your thread, the socks made me do it

Hugs

C

Catherine has the goods on this..

And Cindy is also quite right - oh and Cindy, your voice? the slight accent you still have I think helps - not that I think you sound like a guy at all..

But as Cindy was saying, self acceptance is key. And as for passing? I assume I do, given my day to day life.. but I really don't care all that much, I live my life me for me and I like who I am.

Quote from: Kelly the Trans-Rebel on March 06, 2013, 02:05:59 AM
Catherine has the goods on this..

And Cindy is also quite right - oh and Cindy, your voice? the slight accent you still have I think helps - not that I think you sound like a guy at all..

But as Cindy was saying, self acceptance is key. And as for passing? I assume I do, given my day to day life.. but I really don't care all that much, I live my life me for me and I like who I am.

Thanks Sis, my voice is OK when people see me, it is over the phone etc that it fails. I had to call the RAA a couple of weeks back and after the details the receptionist asked if 'she' was still with the car. I said yes she is! I was than asked if she was safe and did she need an alert to police that she was stranded and alone.  I said yes I'm OK thank you, but I'm happy for a police drive by, if the RAA patrol is going to take a long time, and that I've locked myself in the car and I have my phone. I got a quick apology (Hee Heee)

Cute RAA guy as well!

I did something like that in the past, but it didn't seem to translate to going out as myself for some reason. I went from dressing the way I was "supposed to" to going completely overboard gothic. I specifically did that to boost my self-confidence because when you're wearing all black with makeup on as a guy, EVERYBODY looks at you when you enter the room. They don't have to analyze you to see that there's something off. It's slapping them in the face. But all I got were a few glances, not the dead stares I expected. And the only people that ever said anything negative about it was my own family. I think the reason this didn't really help me though is that I was basically wearing a costume that even covered my face, so I was still hiding. I think I should have tried something more like what the first post stated where it's me they're seeing doing something out of the ordinary.

Quote from: Cindy James on March 06, 2013, 01:58:32 AM


When do we accept ourselves? When we face the fear. When the fear doesn't matter. When people can longer smell fear.

When should I come out? When you are ready to accept yourself as you, because no one else will until you do.

When you face your fear.

Cindy hit on it, this is the key to lock out all self doubts!

Catherine, I did something along the lines of the therapist scenario, to put yourself among the masses in commuting only I didn't holler a stop location. Instead of a long drive to my Toronto city core, I went a shorter distance to the busy local Pearson International airport. I had a black skirt, black bolero jacket & white blouse, business appropriate. I walked through the busy open terminals, never got a odd look or stare, in fact an Air Canada flight attendant passed me going the opposite direction, we both locked and eyes and gave each other an appreciative smile. How is that for passing? About 10 years ago, when I first had a person do my makeup for the first time in a cd club & realized I could look pretty. I learned how to do makeup, feel comfortable in my skin, after my second time (at the club) out dressed in my preferred gender in Toronto was a positive experience that gave me the confidence to be out in public & I have never looked back. I have loved who I am since my late teens, happy, my own best friend, don't mind my alone time, hence the confidence to grow & change. Fear has never been with me after my first cd club visit.

Cindy, there used to be a top shop store near where I lived  and got a lot of clothing, it has been gone for about 5 years now & I miss the shop. Got my 1st strapless party dress there, I think I had a small avatar pic when I first joined here. Also I don't have a female voice, didn't expect to be in a situation to develop that, not sure I will alter my male voice as I have been told by one person that my natural voice reflects my personality, character and soul.

Sisters & brothers don't be afraid to step out the door & into the world, you need to be seen.
Hugs
Jamie

It feels great in the western society.
However, I once feard a lot with close interactions with the East Asians -- people from China, Taiwan, Hong Kong, Singapore, Japan, and Korea. Their culture tends to make them keep scanning for any 'abnormality'; some would even want to eliminate it. So TS folk in these places usually have to pay great attention to 'passability'. Sadly several of my friends had to go through cosmetic surgeries just to live a normal life. Two of them, one in mainland China and one in Hong Kong, still live as a man even after SRS... Because they do not pass, and would be rejected by work places, shops, and even restaurants if in female apparel.

Quote from: sylvannus on March 12, 2013, 05:57:37 PM
It feels great in the western society.
However, I once feard a lot with close interactions with the East Asians -- people from China, Taiwan, Hong Kong, Singapore, Japan, and Korea. Their culture tends to make them keep scanning for any 'abnormality'; some would even want to eliminate it. So TS folk in these places usually have to pay great attention to 'passability'. Sadly several of my friends had to go through cosmetic surgeries just to live a normal life. Two of them, one in mainland China and one in Hong Kong, still live as a man even after SRS... Because they do not pass, and would be rejected by work places, shops, and even restaurants if in female apparel.

That's interesting, so it is easier and more relaxed here in comparison to there. I had spent 2- 1/2 years in the Far East and noted that discrimination against women and lighter skin over darker types is just as rampant as anywhere else on the planet. Was in Okinawa, Taiwan, and Vietnam. There's nothing new under the sun! You look real cute and very passable Sylvannus!

Quote from: Jamiep on March 06, 2013, 01:18:34 PM
Sisters & brothers don't be afraid to step out the door & into the world, you need to be seen.
Hugs
Jamie

I agree, it's often not going to be as scary as people think it is going to be. I still look very very girly, even in my most manly clothing, but no one bats an eye when I walk into the men's room or looks at me twice at Starbucks when I tell the barrista my name's Henry in my high-pitched voice. I often just try to think "what would I do if I was working behind the counter and someone told me their name and it didn't match what I thought their gender was?" and I know that I (even if I wasn't trans) would never call anyone out on it because I wouldn't want to embarrass anyone or get in trouble with my boss for harassing customers or slow down the line; the same for the bathroom because I wouldn't want to embarass anyone who may have a hormone imbalance, etc. Unless you live in a place that's very intolerant and everyone wants to get into everyone else's business, most people either won't notice or would be too afraid of embarassing themselves or others. 

That said, I think it is a bit easier sometimes for trans people in the part of the country that I live in than it would be in some other places since there's a quite a bit of visible LGBT people around and other gender-variant people. I think once people get used to seeing others who don't fit the stereotypical male or female appearance, people just get used to it and don't give a ****.

Quote from: Cindy James on March 06, 2013, 01:58:32 AM
I think Catherine's post is very true and it also strikes at the heart of the question many people ask, 'When do I come out? When I pass or .............

Without wishing to curse everyone to tears, most of us MtF will never pass. Never until we accept ourselves as us. Do I pass? I have no idea and no great interest. I'm treated as female in every public situation I'm in, from picking up a $500 dress in a top shop and the attendant looking at me and saying, Oh try that on, you have the height and body and it's a gorgeous dress - to boys carrying my groceries for me - to waiting in the loo line with 20 others and all chatting away. My voice passes for a guys voice. That's it. There are half a dozen people on this site who can confirm that, I speak to them!

When do we accept ourselves? When we face the fear. When the fear doesn't matter. When people can longer smell fear.

When should I come out? When you are ready to accept yourself as you, because no one else will until you do.

When you face your fear.

Sorry Sis for interrupting your thread, the socks made me do it

Hugs

C

Well said Cindy... I pass and pass very well..that is until I open my mouth. Now, I could go for kathy perez or surgery or "what ever" and change my voice..but at this time I am to0 busy and too happy with my life "as is,".... I am just myself ...a pretty woman with a deep voice...

Quote from: Albina on March 13, 2013, 01:01:39 PM
To say it short, the passability is very important not just to cure your GD or GID, but to simply be safe and well, as well as happy that you are taken by anyone as your preferred gender.

What about people who wish to have androgynous expression? Does that mean that they will never pass? (because androgyny breaks the binary)

There is no cure for GID, simply because it is not a disorder but simply just the result of biological variation. GID is a problem because our society tries to ridicule us and demean us. We have an unhealthy preoccupation with "normalization", why do you think we have people with severe self image problems?

Unfortunately when we "blend in" there is no change in people's attitudes about trans people. In fact, we have our own stereotypes because in years past some were too afraid to say that they did not match "the official trans narrative" 100%. The unfortunate fact of life is that change requires suffering.

Quote from: Sky-Blue on March 13, 2013, 02:07:21 PM
What about people who wish to have androgynous expression? Does that mean that they will never pass? (because androgyny breaks the binary)

There is no cure for GID, simply because it is not a disorder but simply just the result of biological variation. GID is a problem because our society tries to ridicule us and demean us. We have an unhealthy preoccupation with "normalization", why do you think we have people with severe self image problems?

Unfortunately when we "blend in" there is no change in people's attitudes about trans people. In fact, we have our own stereotypes because in years past some were too afraid to say that they did not match "the official trans narrative" 100%. The unfortunate fact of life is that change requires suffering.

Androgynous expression is extremely dangerous in East Asia. Although it should be generally safe in major cities like Shanghai or Beijing, your might get yourself injured or even murdered in other places. And no one will be seriously blamed! Only 40 years ago, people killed (maybe) thousands of CD or TGs in public who exposed themselves by accident, and all the murders completely escaped the law -- instead, they were considered as heroes defending "normality". Sounds like Middle Centuries in Europe burning witches? Note it was only 40 years ago.

Quote from: Sky-Blue on March 13, 2013, 02:07:21 PM
The unfortunate fact of life is that change requires suffering.

While their needs to be some visibility to produce change, we need to allow those in other countries and cultures to determine the rate of their own change and to determine what steps need to be taken to make that change. Just going out and doing something that might get you killed isn't necessarily the answer to every situation; just being trans in certain places is a great first step to producing changes, because if someone passes 100% and no one would guess they are trans, it could produce changes in opinions to the few people who do know about their trans status. Starting with just a few people can eventually, over time, lead to the entire society.