I dont see how taking one hormone can possibly take 30-40 years off your life. That just sounds ridiculous to me. I am in the science field myself and have never heard of such a thing. Maybe slightly due to indirect effects related to men over women (as mentioned men tend to have more cardiovascular problems than women and in general may have a shorter lifespan) but issues like this can be overcome by living a healthier lifestyle. I dont see why you couldnt live to the same age as a cis male. Maybe taking too high a dose of T could be a factor. If so it should be decreased to the point you still get the desired effects but no more than that. Think about it from the other perspective too of women over men, by transitioning using the surgical methods you completely remove the possibility of getting at least 5 different types of cancers which could have resulted in death as a woman, who knows if this isnt actually even saving some lives? There are benefits and risks to everything, but really just do whats right for you. If you dont feel a need to transition, or even take hormones, then dont. Its all very personal. To me there is no other way for me to live than to go through with all of this, I cant take any more of it. If its less of a problem for you then do whatever you need to do to be happy. Ultimately its your happiness that matters the most. If you can live with who you are now then think if you really need to do anything at all. I dont know whats going on inside anyone else's head so the only one that can answer that question is you. People die from things all the time, even when they seem to be completely healthy so unless there is real scientific proof of this massive difference in lifespan I honestly wouldnt read too much into it.  Im willing to take the risks to live the life I was supposed to but that might not be for everyone

Quote from: Liminal Stranger on March 31, 2013, 09:07:40 AM

Happy Easter, LH and others! You'll have to show us pictures of said torture, or even a video 

Quote from: Leo. on March 31, 2013, 09:12:46 AM
I dont see how taking one hormone can possibly take 30-40 years off your life. That just sounds ridiculous to me. I am in the science field myself and have never heard of such a thing.

I never said it would lower your lifespan, it came up in a different post where everyone agreed it was ridiculous. I thought I explained that in the OP, and then again in a subsequent post on this thread. I only brought it up because quite a number of the people on that post said "even if it did lower your lifespan, I'd still do it anyways" while I know I wouldn't.

Somebody put a dog mask on your rabbit!

I think it's probably pretty divided in that a lot of transfolks are suicidal because they're trans, and then a lot are simply not. My boyfriend (who is also trans) has said he was never suicidal, but describes a lot of self-hatred and some kind of soul-sucking sadness that he couldn't overcome until he admitted to himself that he was trans and started transitioning. On the other hand, I have been suicidal off and on since I was thirteen, and it's never had anything to do with being trans.

Something that bothers me is when people tell me they hated themselves, or that they still do. That they hate their bodies and the way they look... it's understandable in this subgroup of people, and I know the feeling, but I've evolved over the years and now I think it's silly.

And I wish I could say that without sounding dismissive, because that's the last thing I want to do, but I just think that people everywhere, in all walks of life, trans or not, take themselves far too seriously. I know it sucks to be in a place where you're uncomfortable with your body, and I used to think that I hated myself -- but I think, in reality, I just hate everyone else. Why should I feel bad about myself because of what they think?

Quote from: LearnedHand on March 31, 2013, 05:13:54 PM

UFH. THAT'S SO CUTE.

Quote from: Devlyn Marie on March 31, 2013, 05:22:31 PM
Somebody put a dog mask on your rabbit!

Oh, my sides   
Beautiful, beautiful torture. I should go get my puppy, pretty sure we have bunny ears around here somewhere. Too bad I don't know where.

Quote from: LearnedHand on March 31, 2013, 05:13:54 PM




I never said it would lower your lifespan, it came up in a different post where everyone agreed it was ridiculous. I thought I explained that in the OP, and then again in a subsequent post on this thread. I only brought it up because quite a number of the people on that post said "even if it did lower your lifespan, I'd still do it anyways" while I know I wouldn't.

The huge staring eyes of that dog just top the picture off.

"HI IMABUNNEH!!" lol!

Quote from: LearnedHand on March 31, 2013, 09:03:19 AM
Thanks for all the nice responses. I know not 100% of all trans people are suicidal or depressed, and I've haven't seen any surveys/studies that give a percentage. But just from the casual viewing of Susan's or other places, it does seem like quite a number are and that's a powerful fueling force in people's decision to transition.

I heard studies from some political meeting in my country of it but I can't give you the provement (mostly because you wouldnt understand the languarge), neither do I think you would want to see the study from 1 country but you would prefern a more worldwide paper right? I dont have that =/ but I bet some sites like TGEU tranrespect vesus transphobia worldwide might have something even when they manly deal with murders im sure they also has something on suicide.

to make it short I belive its true that many transfolks are suicide and get depression as well as other problems, and that the study show that we are more likely to get it than cis folks. But for me it seams logical cause many transpeople are dealing with hard problems because of being trans, things like being banned from your famely,ex can be very though and alot of transpeople experience that. sadly

yet suicide or depression isnt a provement on being trans, theres also people who is depressed and have suicide thought who has nothing to deal with being trans. there are also trans people without. I think what heather says is very true that you just need to focus on being happy, your gender is in your heart so whatever you are to do with it to make you feel happy if for you.

I think your spiritual view is interesting and beutifull, but I dont belive homone or surgery transition shorten the life by 30-40 years..
maybe homones has some effect, pretty much all mediciation has but I belive the 30-40 years manly is because of other issues such as hatecrime,
the suicide rate, or because many trans people get addiction problems or other things.
these things can leave to early death, in guatamala ex it said to be rare to be over 35, as a trans person, for the fact of hatecrime. in my country a transman was once refused medical threatment because he was trans, he was almost about to die cause he was refused it but got it in the end, if he didnt he would had been death. this is also an exemple of transpeople who seams to get shorter life for being trans.

Parts of this post read like the fall out from an Onion article where people just assume something is real (I'm referring to the bit about hormones taking 30-40 years off your life and the edit from the OP).

I've gotten a lot of flack over the years from "the community" because I'm not transitioning. I've even been told by so-called professional therapists that if I don't want to transition, therefore I am not trans and should just get over it and accept being "female". It's also a bit funny to me that some people are so vocal about other people's feelings and how horrible it is to say something but then find it perfectly fine to bash someone for their choices that go against the grain. That's been my personal experience and observation, not saying it's some universal truth. I think most do agree that trans* has a lot of variables and actually transitioning is an optional one. Not everyone is suicidal, not everyone hates their body parts, and even dysphoria has a ton of variables.

I think I've brought up the thought before that if gender wasn't an issue, would transition be an issue? By that I mean if society didn't try to force gender on an individual, would someone who didn't have massive dysphoria still want to transition? Makes me wonder if some day in the distance future that could be reality.

Here's another wacky hypothetical thing I thought of the other day while watching a show on the science channel that had some gene splicing. What if scientists found a way to basically "turn on" male characteristics without the use of hormones, but with genes? We could all see some pretty interesting things happening in the future.

Quote from: insideontheoutside on March 31, 2013, 10:41:16 PM
Parts of this post read like the fall out from an Onion article where people just assume something is real (I'm referring to the bit about hormones taking 30-40 years off your life and the edit from the OP).

I've gotten a lot of flack over the years from "the community" because I'm not transitioning. I've even been told by so-called professional therapists that if I don't want to transition, therefore I am not trans and should just get over it and accept being "female". It's also a bit funny to me that some people are so vocal about other people's feelings and how horrible it is to say something but then find it perfectly fine to bash someone for their choices that go against the grain. That's been my personal experience and observation, not saying it's some universal truth. I think most do agree that trans* has a lot of variables and actually transitioning is an optional one. Not everyone is suicidal, not everyone hates their body parts, and even dysphoria has a ton of variables.

I think I've brought up the thought before that if gender wasn't an issue, would transition be an issue? By that I mean if society didn't try to force gender on an individual, would someone who didn't have massive dysphoria still want to transition? Makes me wonder if some day in the distance future that could be reality.

Here's another wacky hypothetical thing I thought of the other day while watching a show on the science channel that had some gene splicing. What if scientists found a way to basically "turn on" male characteristics without the use of hormones, but with genes? We could all see some pretty interesting things happening in the future.

what do you put into the word transition?

do you mean surgery, taking homones or expressing oneself as a boy/girl?

I don't belive surgery or homones is nessesarry parts of transition, transition for me seams to be more wide. you can still have a male/female body and name without any surgery or homones yet live and being accepted as female/male, it might be difficult in cisnormative sociatys but its not imposible.

like in the fafafini sociaty where people dont take homones or surgery but simple being accepted by the way they live by expressing themself of a gender with doing "women or men work".

Quote from: Natkat on April 01, 2013, 12:34:44 PM
what do you put into the word transition?

do you mean surgery, taking homones or expressing oneself as a boy/girl?

To me, it doesn't have to include hormones or surgery if you can pull off just living as the opposite gender full time. I think for a lot of people though, transition means medical intervention (especially since a lot of states/countries won't fully accept you as the opposite gender of your birth unless you physically go through hormones or surgeries).

Quote from: insideontheoutside on March 31, 2013, 10:41:16 PM
I've gotten a lot of flack over the years from "the community" because I'm not transitioning. I've even been told by so-called professional therapists that if I don't want to transition, therefore I am not trans and should just get over it and accept being "female". It's also a bit funny to me that some people are so vocal about other people's feelings and how horrible it is to say something but then find it perfectly fine to bash someone for their choices that go against the grain. That's been my personal experience and observation, not saying it's some universal truth. I think most do agree that trans* has a lot of variables and actually transitioning is an optional one. Not everyone is suicidal, not everyone hates their body parts, and even dysphoria has a ton of variables.

I think I've brought up the thought before that if gender wasn't an issue, would transition be an issue? By that I mean if society didn't try to force gender on an individual, would someone who didn't have massive dysphoria still want to transition? Makes me wonder if some day in the distance future that could be reality.

Here's another wacky hypothetical thing I thought of the other day while watching a show on the science channel that had some gene splicing. What if scientists found a way to basically "turn on" male characteristics without the use of hormones, but with genes? We could all see some pretty interesting things happening in the future.

For what I put in bold: Yes, I def notice that with at least 2 members of the board lol. I do think if there was less or no gender in society, then there'd probably not be as many people physically transitioning, for me it's a combo of physical dysphoria and not really fitting in all that well with females and the expectations put upon females. 

For me I do want to transition, but there's just so much more that I want to do and focus on that I think is more important. I've been talking with our Auntie Shan here and I am thinking of trying more of an androgynous thing for now and seeing how that works out. I've always wanted to go work in developing nations (when I was a kid I wanted to be a missionary doctor), and I think if I transition part of my ability to do development work would be cut off to me, since if I am out in the middle of nowhere I wouldn't have easily available access to T or anything else I might need (not to mention, it could be really dangerous in some places). For the past few years I've been looking at various jobs I could possibly try to get, and for some of the positions, you can't be hired in you're in need of medications because you might not always be able to get it. I've been really into the whole Sikh thing, and part of what's important to me is performing seva (which is basically serving others selflessly; probably relates back to me wanting to be a missionary as a kid) and getting beyond the physical plane of things, so when I think hard about being trans, sometimes it just seems pretty selfish and self-absorbed to me if I was to spend so much time, money, and energy actually transitioning just to be perceived as male in society, when I could be spending that time, money, and energy just being kind of andro and breaking barriers and helping other people of both genders by helping to carve out a more acceptable alternative to the "male" and "female" we currently have.

While genes are a controversial topic, I think if they could find a way to safely change the genes, it'd be a better alternative to taking hormones for those set on physically transitioning.

Quote from: insideontheoutside on March 31, 2013, 10:41:16 PM
Parts of this post read like the fall out from an Onion article where people just assume something is real (I'm referring to the bit about hormones taking 30-40 years off your life and the edit from the OP).

Haha yeah, I've learned to expect that people don't actually read once you post something longer than 3-5 sentences, either that or I am a really crappy writer. Though to be fair, I could've made it more clear in the OP, I could see how it could possibly be confusing...

Quote from: LearnedHand on April 02, 2013, 07:47:59 PM
so when I think hard about being trans, sometimes it just seems pretty selfish and self-absorbed to me if I was to spend so much time, money, and energy actually transitioning just to be perceived as male in society, when I could be spending that time, money, and energy just being kind of andro and breaking barriers and helping other people of both genders by helping to carve out a more acceptable alternative to the "male" and "female" we currently have.

People who transition do it to be happy and feel confortable with themself,
happyness should never be underrestimated, no matter if you transition or not don't think of your options for yourself to be selfish if they makes you feel better. in fact if its alot more easy being helpfull for others if your in a good mental health yourself, insteed of putting others need before you and getting tired down.

this is just a general advice, not nessesarry transrelated.

Quote from: Natkat on April 02, 2013, 08:03:28 PM
People who transition do it to be happy and feel confortable with themself,
happyness should never be underrestimated, no matter if you transition or not don't think of your options for yourself to be selfish if they makes you feel better. in fact if its alot more easy being helpfull for others if your in a good mental health yourself, insteed of putting others need before you and getting tired down.

this is just a general advice, not nessesarry transrelated.

I wasn't implying that it's selfish for everyone to do it, and I know I need to make myself happy as well. There's just a lot of things to think about when deciding to transition, and I don't want to rush into things just because it seems to make other people on here happy. I am still young so unless something drastic occurs with my health or I get in an accident, I should have decades to make a decision.

I'll edit to add: doing stuff for others makes me happy. I kinda see myself as just a small speck in the universe and I believe in reincarnation, etc. so overall I don't feel too concerned about this one lifetime and this one physical body when there's so much more going on.

Quote from: LearnedHand on April 02, 2013, 08:20:09 PM
I wasn't implying that it's selfish for everyone to do it, and I know I need to make myself happy as well. There's just a lot of things to think about when deciding to transition, and I don't want to rush into things just because it seems to make other people on here happy. I am still young so unless something drastic occurs with my health or I get in an accident, I should have decades to make a decision.

I'll edit to add: doing stuff for others makes me happy. I kinda see myself as just a small speck in the universe and I believe in reincarnation, etc. so overall I don't feel too concerned about this one lifetime and this one physical body when there's so much more going on.

Yeah I understand that, I just say it because its a general thing to put other above you, but your own needs should be first before helping others. I see it alot in activism that people work very hard on others and get ill because they forget themself and there own needs.