I have no clear sense of self. 

I go through conflicting thoughts on a daily basis. Sometimes I am okay with myself and think ''I'm just a guy with a fantasy and that's it'' and then later on I strongly wished I wasn't. Sometimes I think I am just a man who likes femininity. With that I mean what I feel inside, not really my manners or interests. I watched a documentary about transgender kids and how some of these boys who started so early look so feminine and totally like a girl.. I think that kid is so lucky. And I feel jealous. And I think 'If I could turn back time I would do it. If only I was like a 15 year old girl telling such a story. But I don't even know if that would make me happy.. I guess it would, but I grew up but there wasn't a sense of 'boy' or 'girl'. Yeah I did boy things. And I liked it. But I was also different from the other boys. I am totally lost.. I wake up and I can't stop thinking about it and analyse it. I want to know what I am or whatever it is that I want to be. I don't want to think on my old day ''If only I did things differently back in my 20s''. Honestly, I could just be a guy who's more feminine inside but longs for a relationship, or maybe it would be better to have a female body. Maybe some will say ''well you're just androgynous'' but that thought doesn't feel right to me.

Did anyone else go through this? That you don't even know whether your fantasies and desires about being the other gender are genuine or just a fantasy you have overromanticized? I know many are totally sure about it all and convinced they are this or that. But I'm not. I'm in a nobody's land.

Quote from: Feather on April 11, 2013, 07:01:01 AM
I have no clear sense of self. 
Did anyone else go through this? That you don't even know whether your fantasies and desires about being the other gender are genuine or just a fantasy you have overromanticized? I know many are totally sure about it all and convinced they are this or that. But I'm not. I'm in a nobody's land.

I spent some time in nobody's land.

I finally got out by asking myself how I would feel if I could never again show my male side. The answer was that I would be ok with it. Then I asked myself how I would feel if I could never again show my female side. The answer was that I would feel like a piece of me had been cut away.

That helped me find my true gender.

Hope this helps.

I thought I had a male and female in my head right till I realized the guy was imaginary.

It happens. Only you know who you are though.

Quote from: Feather on April 11, 2013, 07:01:01 AM
I have no clear sense of self. 

I go through conflicting thoughts on a daily basis. Sometimes I am okay with myself and think ''I'm just a guy with a fantasy and that's it'' and then later on I strongly wished I wasn't. Sometimes I think I am just a man who likes femininity. With that I mean what I feel inside, not really my manners or interests. I watched a documentary about transgender kids and how some of these boys who started so early look so feminine and totally like a girl.. I think that kid is so lucky. And I feel jealous. And I think 'If I could turn back time I would do it. If only I was like a 15 year old girl telling such a story. But I don't even know if that would make me happy.. I guess it would, but I grew up but there wasn't a sense of 'boy' or 'girl'. Yeah I did boy things. And I liked it. But I was also different from the other boys. I am totally lost.. I wake up and I can't stop thinking about it and analyse it. I want to know what I am or whatever it is that I want to be. I don't want to think on my old day ''If only I did things differently back in my 20s''. Honestly, I could just be a guy who's more feminine inside but longs for a relationship, or maybe it would be better to have a female body. Maybe some will say ''well you're just androgynous'' but that thought doesn't feel right to me.

Did anyone else go through this? That you don't even know whether your fantasies and desires about being the other gender are genuine or just a fantasy you have overromanticized? I know many are totally sure about it all and convinced they are this or that. But I'm not. I'm in a nobody's land.

I think most of us go through some sort of doubt about who we are or if we should transition. The biggest warning flag is if you had absolutely zero doubts about who you are. The doubt does eventually go away as you figure yourself out. Just keep searching, and the answers will eventually emerge.

Even though I have a facial structure that some people might envy...I have other physical problems that I have to deal with as well. Being pretty and feminine is not the answer to self-acceptance. I have problems with self acceptance, the most passable trans person has problems with image and self acceptance. The way we think we look can be distorted and not actually reflect reality. If you feel comfortable enough you could post some pictures and ask others what they think.

Even cis girls have a ton of self esteem problems created by how they look. You just have to make the best with what you have, and if you don't like it and can't accept it, change it.

Ask yourself one question..."Would I feel happier living/being treated as female?"

Keep in mind that it isn't all sunshine and rainbows...but regardless, to me it solves a lot of my mental and physical issues if I could live as female.

-Sky

Thanks for your posts, suzifrommd and Lesley Roberta 

Quote from: suzifrommd on April 11, 2013, 07:52:21 AM
I spent some time in nobody's land.

I finally got out by asking myself how I would feel if I could never again show my male side. The answer was that I would be ok with it. Then I asked myself how I would feel if I could never again show my female side. The answer was that I would feel like a piece of me had been cut away.

That helped me find my true gender.

Hope this helps.

My hobbies and interests are mostly associated with masculinity. I guess I could live as a male as long as I don't have to act like some typical masculine man. At the same time I don't even know what would make me male besides the body. But it's not like I'm acting like a girl all the time. I guess I need a relationship to really find that out. Can I live with a woman or would I still daydream? Would I like the sex role of a male? I honestly don't know.. I never liked cars, until I started driving lessons and I loved it. So I never know until I try.

Strangely I do associate almost all things positive with femininity (ie. not women), I know it's irrational but I can't remove the concept. I can relate to what you're saying. 

I spent awhile being confused and all over the place too. I started recording how I felt each day, so I could go back and look it over. It turned out to be a big help.
I don't know if it's the same for you, but the longing for a relationship was one of the ways my gender dysphoria was presenting itself. I confused wanting a male with wanting to be a male and jealousy because I want a body like theirs as my own.
I also found that, the more I moved towards transitioning (buying a binder, cutting my hair, choosing a male name, etc), the happier and more comfortable with myself (mentally) I got.

I agree with Edge ^

For me I had the "longing for a relationship" since I was a child...and it stayed the same even in high school. It's easy to confuse certain feelings, but easier to understand those feelings in hindsight. I actually spent a great deal of time insulting this one girl in my class in high school...it's ironic that it turns out that I wanted to BE her; I still feel bad about it though...

Thanks for the replies Edge and Sky-Blue   

I am utterly confused. Just an hour ago my mind went quite deep with the daydreams of being a girl. Just a while later I think very rationally and am like ''You awake again? Who you're trying to fool..?'' and I laugh at myself. At this point I have no idea what I will think like tomorrow, or next week, or the next month. It makes no sense. But it's good to be aware of it, it's a great improvement from all these years where I thought it was just sexual and there was always shame.

I remember some years back when I was 21 I went quite far with crossdressing, it shocked me and I threw away stuff. I told myself and knew that I shouldn't ever go to far with that. I would lose myself. Well I think I'll just give it another try and see what it brings. But I'll have to buy some first because I only have stuff to wear under my 'normal clothes' and that isn't enough. 

I've spent much of my 56 years on this planet with no clear sense of self. Those years also include two periods of transitioning experiments in my early and late 20's. That was followed by a long period of being as "normal" as I could muster. While trying to convince myself I was just a CD, perhaps a bit further towards the TS end of the spectrum.

Thanks to my 3Ds, Diversions, Distractions, and a little denial I managed to sort of get by. All that also led to becomming a lifeless, joyless automaton that wakes up, goes to work, repeat. Throw in the ocassional WTF just happened to my life disaster just to keep things interesting. Disasters I now see were caused by all my denials of my true self and all the countermeasures I adopted to hide it from me, and especially the rest of the known universe.

To make my life even more complicated the change from male to female is dramatic. So I have to go out of my way to see the real me. Actually, I should say HAD to go out.... These days without a lot of the shame, guilt, sub-zero self-esteem I can almost always see and about about always feel that real me. Even though I need to live a dual life

It sounds like you spend a lot of time thinking about this.  My guess from my and others' experiences is that if you feel like this, you have to do something about it, if you want to get it off your mind and be able to relax and focus on the rest of life.  "Something" might be a full gender transition, but it might be crossdressing in private or in public, or a shift towards androgyny.  The only way to know is to try different things and see what clicks.

For me, I've found that if I go out in "boy mode" a couple times a week, dressing male and using male pronouns, it gets rid of that nagging feeling and I end up thinking about gender less.  (I'm female by birth, so I'm on the opposite side of things.)  I think it's important to find the balance that makes you most comfortable in the longterm.

Quote from: Feather on April 11, 2013, 07:01:01 AM
Sometimes I am okay with myself and think ''I'm just a guy with a fantasy and that's it'' and then later on I strongly wished I wasn't. Sometimes I think I am just a man who likes femininity. With that I mean what I feel inside, not really my manners or interests. I watched a documentary about transgender kids and how some of these boys who started so early look so feminine and totally like a girl.. I think that kid is so lucky. And I feel jealous. And I think 'If I could turn back time I would do it. If only I was like a 15 year old girl telling such a story. But I don't even know if that would make me happy....

...I don't want to think on my old day ''If only I did things differently back in my 20s''. Honestly, I could just be a guy who's more feminine inside but longs for a relationship, or maybe it would be better to have a female body. Maybe some will say ''well you're just androgynous'' but that thought doesn't feel right to me.

Did anyone else go through this? That you don't even know whether your fantasies and desires about being the other gender are genuine or just a fantasy you have overromanticized? I know many are totally sure about it all and convinced they are this or that. But I'm not. I'm in a nobody's land.

I went like this for awhile. And I was never happy. Ever. If I could immerse myself in something, like school, it would go away. But never for long. Then, when I was 21, I was diagnosed with an illness that I needed to take care of or else. So I did. About six months into chemo with five months left even thought the medication worked like magic, I had an epiphany: I realized how short life is and how short mine is in particular. And then I decided I wouldn't waster one more second acting all manly and stopping myself mid-sentence before I said something to femme or stop myself from being too enthusiastic, because I get very girly I guess when I get enthusiastic.

So then I met this girl and I had been sexual before with both men and women but the relationship lasted years and she was very encouraging about acting like myself and she loved it. It was the best years of my life...so far. But then she changed and the things she loved about me before she didn't like so much anymore and would say it. Ironically, at the time I was researching how to transition and was going to do it. But we broke up. Not cause of that because I never told her that. I knew if it did it would be the end. So yeah a relationship might help you but then again you may end up in a very deep state of denial and the thing that you didn't want to wake up to one day thinking about your 20s will have come true. So it could be dangerous.

So for the last five years I told myself this was all just a sexual fantasy and that's all. I became more masculine. Started working out. And then I started popping pills. I really messed up my life. So, your question is really hard to answer but your certainly not alone. And I'm no therapist so I couldn't say for sure whether your trans. Not that it is a requirement, but I have been thinking of this and wanted to be a girl since I was five. Not everyone is like this and I imagine transition is much harder for people who haven't known forever.

I guess what you have to ask yourself is if you had the choice between having one million dollars or becoming a pretty woman (or just a woman period) what would you choose? And if you choose the money, you forfeit and possibility ever of transition. Would you take the money or would you become a woman? I only speak for myself, but I would bet a lot of us here that are 100 percent sure about being TS and that transition is the right choice, would become a woman and not take the money.

It doesn't seem like your quite ready for transition but I don't think a relationship will solve this. You should probably see a gender therapist as soon as possible. They will help you work thru these issues and get to the bottom of it.

This thread is particularly good because it emphasises that that confusion, ambiguity and notions of what if, are so normal.

I have to say, I especially understand and identify with sky-blue in #6

Quote from: Sky-Blue on April 11, 2013, 02:32:37 PM
I agree with Edge ^

For me I had the "longing for a relationship" since I was a child...and it stayed the same even in high school. It's easy to confuse certain feelings, but easier to understand those feelings in hindsight. I actually spent a great deal of time insulting this one girl in my class in high school...it's ironic that it turns out that I wanted to BE her; I still feel bad about it though...

It may be a common response to turn our longings into negativity.

Very sad really, Such positive feelings, which we are often made to feel so ashamed and fearful of, we turn into something so much worse.

Quote from: Feather on April 11, 2013, 09:56:45 AM
Thanks for your posts, suzifrommd and Lesley Roberta 
My hobbies and interests are mostly associated with masculinity. I guess I could live as a male as long as I don't have to act like some typical masculine man. At the same time I don't even know what would make me male besides the body. But it's not like I'm acting like a girl all the time. I guess I need a relationship to really find that out. Can I live with a woman or would I still daydream? Would I like the sex role of a male? I honestly don't know.. I never liked cars, until I started driving lessons and I loved it. So I never know until I try.

Strangely I do associate almost all things positive with femininity (ie. not women), I know it's irrational but I can't remove the concept. I can relate to what you're saying.

I know this feeling.

I guess you have to ask yourself, is there a reason why you haven't had a sexual relationship with a woman yet? For me, whilst i am attracted to women, when i find myself in the bedroom i just can't bring myself to perform. My role feels wrong and i am not interested in the thought of penetrative sex.
I was incredibly confused and thought that perhaps i was a male lesbian. Maybe i would enjoy sex with a woman as a woman would.
It proved to be quite a sticking point for me, and still is to some degree, but you have to be honest with yourself about what you are attracted to and how you would like be treated in a relationship.

If i am completely honest with myself, whilst i am attracted to women, i see myself as a woman seeking a relationship with a man. I came to this realisation years ago, but suppressed it. It was too much for the male persona that i had created to admit to. I struggled on for years hoping that i could enter into a 'normal' relationship with a special woman and have a family, and every time i deviated from that plan and was seriously considering transition i would seem to meet a girl and the thought of not being able to be with her on the account of no longer being a man or even the masculine persona i had adopted, would tug at my heart. Cue purging of clothing, vigorous working out (which i admit i did enjoy - perhaps because of the endorphins) and generally doing my best to get back on track as a man.

It had to stop at some point. I couldn't let myself continue spinning through life, confused, distracted and most of all denying myself.
I am not saying it's plain sailing. I still have doubts every now and then, but they don't last and they are fleeting at best.

You have to be completely honest and open with yourself.

These fantasies tend to come when I am doing nothing, but when I'm actually around other people and have conversations I feel ok and just natural. If I have to be honest, it's that sometimes I feel feminine and I like that part of me and sometimes I feel masculine and that too feels okay. I have no desire to pretend to be masculine of feminine.

When I feel feminine I wonder ''where is that masculinity? This feminine side feels so dominant'' and when I feel masculine I think the other way around. During those times I can't even relate to the fantasies I have when I feel feminine and it feels alien. 

It just comes and goes. However I don't believe it is androgynity because I clearly feel one side is dominant at the time. And that can be very confusing, and those who read my posts will probably think I'm nutts. I guess the best I can do is just go with the flow and embrace whatever 'mode' is active at a time.

Hmmm...sounds like you could be bigender. Have you considered that you might be?

Hey Feather,

I think you are doing a good thing by going through self examination.  The truth is not everyone fits into neat categories and it can be difficult to find our own identity whilst understanding this fact.  I know some women who are very masculine in appearance and in their hobbies, but they see themselves as women.  The same is true for men.  Gender is something that is complex.  To be honest, your hobbies are not necessarily relevant to your identity. I remember I used to freak out about the fact that I liked video games as though that made me a guy,lol.  Nevermind the fact that my sisters were the ones who got me into gaming at an early age. 

As for longing for relationships, most people do.  I don't think that desire or your orientation is any indication of your identity.  As you will see there are many women and men on this board with diverse sexual orientations. 

I think Suzi nailed it earlier.  It really is who you see yourself as and how you want to portray yourself.   Don't let the external things interfere with how you feel internally.  If you can't figure that out still, that is okay.  It may take some time.  And fears and doubts ARE normal.  Even those of us who know about our identity have concerns.  It is a big change to make and it only makes sense that you know who you are and that you can do it.  I would recommend seeing a therapist because they may help you sort these things out. 

Quote from: Feather on April 11, 2013, 07:01:01 AM
I have no clear sense of self. 

I go through conflicting thoughts on a daily basis. Sometimes I am okay with myself and think ''I'm just a guy with a fantasy and that's it'' and then later on I strongly wished I wasn't. Sometimes I think I am just a man who likes femininity. With that I mean what I feel inside, not really my manners or interests. I watched a documentary about transgender kids and how some of these boys who started so early look so feminine and totally like a girl.. I think that kid is so lucky. And I feel jealous. And I think 'If I could turn back time I would do it. If only I was like a 15 year old girl telling such a story. But I don't even know if that would make me happy.. I guess it would, but I grew up but there wasn't a sense of 'boy' or 'girl'. Yeah I did boy things. And I liked it. But I was also different from the other boys. I am totally lost.. I wake up and I can't stop thinking about it and analyse it. I want to know what I am or whatever it is that I want to be. I don't want to think on my old day ''If only I did things differently back in my 20s''. Honestly, I could just be a guy who's more feminine inside but longs for a relationship, or maybe it would be better to have a female body. Maybe some will say ''well you're just androgynous'' but that thought doesn't feel right to me.

Did anyone else go through this? That you don't even know whether your fantasies and desires about being the other gender are genuine or just a fantasy you have overromanticized? I know many are totally sure about it all and convinced they are this or that. But I'm not. I'm in a nobody's land.

You don't need to be one or the other. As you say you could be a man with a feminine side. If your happy with people perceiving you as male and treating you as such then perhaps it's not so much to do with your gender, but rather how you would like to present as a male. There is nothing wrong at all with being a feminine man attracted to women.

I read an interesting article the other day from a woman who talked about her brothers transition to a woman and at a later date reverting back to a male. She noted "After a while, he decided to make the journey back to living life as a male. Ultimately he told me that the prison of the female body is no different than the prison of the male body. Today, through his life and work as an artist he continues to search for ways to live life outside of this prison".

I would second the suggestion to journal your feelings...take a notebook with you at all times so you can jot things down (I used to text myself constantly, then transfer it to my journal later. Most times I had no memory of actually composing the text, so it was always a surprising eye-opener the things I sent myself...)

Thanks for the posts   

Bigender does sounds more right to me than androgynity from what I've read on Wikipedia.

When I feel feminine I really feel like, or imagine, I am giving up the masculine. It feels like willing surrender. And I want to be a girl completely. But during and after I exercise or work I feel so body conscious and just fine and there's no desire to be a girl. Yesterday was one of those days, and then I go home and I wanted to feel more feminine, it is so nice, peaceful, and cozy. But I couldn't really get it out. I fell asleep feeling just a man. And that felt kinda boring. 

I do wonder, if it would have been different if I had a female body. I don't think I would have trouble feeling a bit masculine sometimes as a girl. I would like to have the body of one. But how would that make me feel and how does that at all relate to my other thoughts? I don't know.

Some examples to illustrate how I can experience both..

I love watching or playing the fantasy genre. I can identify with heroic males, as long as they aren't a stereotypical macho man or plain dumb. I like intellignet man that operate behind the shadows, ones that I can identify with. In RPGs I like assassins and spellcasters. I can also play female characters and I absolutely enjoy the amount of time I can spend on the looks of my female characters in GW2 and other RPGs. My experiences with male and female characters are very different and I have noticed that I even act differently in chat based on the gender I play in the game. When I play a male character I find it very easy to be harsh and rude. When I play a female character I am extremely kind.

In my childhood I liked to play soldiers or knights with friends. I could spend hours playing sports with my brother and we were brothers.. not just me feeling like a little sister. And then in the evening that could be followed by watching soaps and girly films with my mom. There's one thing I now wished that should have happened to me as a child.. my sister should have dolled me up and turned me in a girl. But that never happened.

I'll keep a sharp eye at my thoughts. The next time I'm in a more 'masculine mode' I will try to write down my thoughts and question myself even though that side of me thinks it's all just innocent fun and nothing more.

Hey Feather,

I would try to separate your internal feelings from fantasy.  For example, I don't think the video game role playing is a big indicator.  I have played games as both male and female characters, but I never questioned my gender while doing so.  I can easily play as a male character and immerse myself into his world while still realizing that I am a women playing as him in a video game.  I have also identified with both male and female characters in fiction. After all, both men and women face similar issues throughout life.  Even "manly" or "feminine" interests don't define a persons gender (although they can provide some indicators). People are diverse and enjoy doing different things regardless of their identity. 

I think the bigger question you should ask yourself is "how do I see myself"?  A man or woman?  A man with a feminine side or a women with a masculine side? Or do you see yourself as more bigender? Only you can answer this.  It may take some deep self examination, but eventually you will be able to sort it out.  In the mean time, enjoy the ride and don't worry about the time it takes to get to the answer.