Quote from: Jack_M on May 31, 2013, 06:59:50 AM
Just another one to throw in the idea of just using the men's.  Get the first time outta the way and you'll be fine.

I get the feeling this is correct. While I haven't used the men's room for real yet, I stormed in there the other day when the women's room soap dispenser didn't work (I'm very OCD about being clean). There was no one in there, but I still got the feeling no one's really going to care either way (which is why I wasn't too worried about barging in there). Sure, if you go in there in women's attire while there's a guy standing at the urinals, that might be a different situation. But if you're passing enough for a girl to call you a perv for using the women's room, I'm sure you'll do fine in the men's.

I think I'm gonna wait til I pass more to use the men's, but I think once I get that first time out of the way, I'll be fine.

I started out using the men's room in my local grocery store.  It has one urinal and one stall, and pretty much is empty most of the time.  I purposely used it every time I went into the store to get my confidence up.  This after I took a trip at 3 months on T, and used the busy airport bathrooms and a busy truckstop men's room.  I was terrified but did it.  Stuck to the grocery store when I got home.  Now it is a no brainer coming up on 5 years on T.

I'm not passing all the time, not sure how much.  Even when I get misgendered, if I correct people they are likely to apologize. But I started using the men's room and male dressing rooms. I am in New Mexico, which in the US.   I started with places like the coffee shop, a restaurant run by liberals, etc etc. I don't ever look at anyone and I don't think anybody would give me a sideways glance. The more often you do it, the easier this gets, til you really don't think about it anymore. This guy from my trans group showed me where the bathrooms were for something yesterday at the LBGT center. He said the unisex were downstairs. Funny thing I went in the men's room and this place is so trans friendly they actually had a tampax machine in the men's room.

Men often have gynecomastia--it's very common actually.
I dont' think you'll have any more problems than I do. Men wouldn't have problems with women in the men's room as much as women have a problem with men in there. Makes sense I guess.

BTW, I am 3 months on T, and started on quite a low dose.



--Jay

Quote from: Jack_M on May 31, 2013, 10:00:34 AM
Other benefit: no line ups! Lol.

Seriously, what is the deal with women and bathrooms? 1) even going number 2 doesn't take as long as half the women take in stalls and 2) talking in a bathroom? REALLY?!  No...just, NO!

Haha, yeah, for real! I mean, sure, some people can be slower than others and sometimes special circumstances can occur, but that doesn't account for everyone and for the long lines that sometimes go out of the door to the women's restroom. Movie theater restrooms are one of the worst offenders of this, haha.

A few years ago, someone who just wanted to use the restroom went to the men's room at a stadium. This was a ciswoman. She actually got arrested. I think they dismissed the case but she got on national TV.


--Jay

I do want to thank everyone for commenting and all the advice offered I will take in to consider. I'm not sure what I'll at this time but I'll probably start avoiding the women's restrooms and try to use the unisex/family/handicap restrooms if they are available. I want to try to start T for awhile before using the men's room regularly since I'd worry some trans-phobic a-hole might try to start a fight over my using the "wrong" restroom.

Again, I just want to say I appreciate all the advice and help you've guys have given me. Keep being awesome guys!

A landlord of a pub I was in last January tried to physically drag me out of the female toilets by my collar because he read me as male.  I've had a couple of other incidents of getting asked if I was in the wrong bathroom, or people walking out and checking the door, but that was my worst experience. Unfortunately because where I live is a pretty small area, and many more people know me than I know them, I don't feel safe going into male bathrooms because the chances of someone knowing me in there without me realising they do are too high for my comfort.  They might not look because men are funny about that, but they might do, people around here don't seem to know bathroom etiquette, at least two people in my local pub regularly think its okay to use the middle urinal out of three...

If it's safest for you not to use the men's then don't feel pressurised into starting.  Chances are it'll be okay, but there's no point risking your safety when all you want to do is use the toilet.  Unfortunately the only other option is to either sneak around hoping you can dash in and out while they're empty, find a disabled/or otherwise unisex one (around here to access most of them you seem to have to ask the owner for a key so they're not ideal), or not bother.  If you're going to use the female bathrooms and have female ID you might feel safer having that in your hand in your pocket or something, just so you can "justify" your being there if someone calls you out on it again, it's the only way I dare use them in public these days.

The day I'm in a position where I can freely use the men's can't come soon enough, I hate rationing the amount of liquid I allow myself to drink while I'm at college all day.

I agree with Alex, there are places you might not be safe. I feel safe mostly around here.

--Jay

I actually had the same fear when I was pre-T and early on T.

While I never had anyone say anything to me (then again, I almost never used public restrooms pre-T), I figured it wouldn't be that hard to deal with it. I'd say, deal with it the same way a butch looking woman would deal. If someone is giving you trouble, I'd suggest showing an ID card that has a gender marker, like a driver's license. Or even just a picture ID, if you have a feminine name. Most people, once they've been confronted like that, shouldn't press it.

Honestly, I found using the men's restroom -terrifying- at first. But it was still preferable over the women's. I kind of just decided one day that it was time to "be a man" about it, so to speak. So at first its kind of weird and scary and nerve-wracking, but after a while it just becomes natural.

It sucks to hear how you were treated, but my advice is to just go for it in the men's room. Its really an in and out kinda thing and there's no socializing (unless your buddy just happens to have to pee too, then its kind of funny-awkward  ).

General rule of thumb is, if you feel safe and confident, go for it. If not, then hold it or find a unisex restroom. But it all depends on how you feel. No one is going to question you.

I've always felt like if someone sees you in the men's room, they're gonna just assume you're a man so:p

Anyway, good luck!

Quote from: FTMDiaries on May 31, 2013, 04:44:25 AM
If some guy ever asks you whether you're in the right room, just say 'sure!' and carry on doing what you're doing. You don't have to engage anyone else in conversation.

If someone questions you if you're in the right bathroom, you should feel free to be insulted and fire back as you feel free. After all, if you asked a cisfemale or cismale are you in the correct bathroom and they are, they'd probably not answer a meek "sure" but more along the lines of 'mind your own business', or 'I think I know what's in my pants', or 'are you'?

Quote from: GendrKweer on June 23, 2013, 11:57:50 PM
If someone questions you if you're in the right bathroom, you should feel free to be insulted and fire back as you feel free. After all, if you asked a cisfemale or cismale are you in the correct bathroom and they are, they'd probably not answer a meek "sure" but more along the lines of 'mind your own business', or 'I think I know what's in my pants', or 'are you'?

This is something I brought up with my Gender Therapist a while back. I was all gung-ho to say 'Are you?' in response to that question... but she rightly pointed out that getting confrontational and insulting the other guy could possibly cause the situation to escalate. And considering the fact that most pre-T FtMs are smaller and weaker than most cisguys... yeah, probably not the safest route.

She's the one who recommended a confident (not meek) "Sure!" and carrying on with my business, and on reflection I agree with her.

 FTMDiaries, she is probably correct.  Don't cause any problems and say little and you should be fine. I just do my business and get out as do the guys as well.

My therapist basically told me that I could use  a men's room pre-T when I didn't begin to pass and told me the "don't look at anyone" thing. (He a trans guy.) I didn't do it. But I agree, that I could have. I wouldn't confront anybody. I'd say "yeah" confidently (not meekly) or something. I am really small. I think in this case my age works for me and no one is going to confront a guy who looks older. Using the men's room is a mental thing more than physical imo. You are mostly dealing with your head. There are exceptions. I have heard the most bad things happening in bars. Oddly the first men's room I used was in a bar, though it was kind of an upscale one, and I was at an event where more than a fourth of the people there were trans.

--Jay

As soon as I started presenting as masculine, not even male, I would get told i was in the wrong bathroom 9 out of 10 times, sometimes more. Women just loved to let me know, very loudly, that i was in the womens room, as if i was blind to all the females around me and lack of urinals. I had security screaming and pounding on my stall door mid stream at a bar once when i was with my friend from hs; I got free drinks afterwards though.. I think so i wouldn't sue. Road trips and airports were the worst. About a year after I started questioning being trans I had to switch to the men's, unisex, or endure severe bladder pains because I just couldn't go into a women's room without scaring the ladies inside. Now I strictly use the men's, unless there's a unisex one but that's just because I like the privacy in general and space. It sucks wih no STP but I got my new snee kees today, so hopefully that won't be an issue anymore. Guys don't pay attention to each other in the john. You go in, do ur business, wash up, and peace out. No words. No eye contact. No problem. Just keep the moobs hidden, your head down and be quick and most guys will either not notice you at all or assume you're a kid trying just trying to get on his way. Restrooms are often one of the scariest places during transition, but for guys you learn quickly that 90% of your worries were unnecessary.

I haven't had anyone ask me directly if I was in the wrong bathroom, but recently when I was at the dentist's and using the bathroom, there was an old guy in there at the same time. I could tell he was staring at me the whole time, but I just ignored it and didn't look at him directly. He didn't wash his hands (well, not with soap, so it doesn't count lol) so he left sooner than I did.

As I was finishing washing my hands I heard him ask my dentist if he was in the right bathroom (as if there's urinals in the ladies' restroom, or something...  ). She just laughed and said yes, he had been, and that was all there was to it--once I exited the restroom, the old guy had already left.

I was pissed off because I had thought I was passing at least somewhat that day (baggier shirt than usual, etc.) but other than that, no big deal.

Actually women can be vicious about saving their precious women's room. That's given me pause too, as male as my presentation is (100%) So there are safety concerns both ways. 

Funny thing, at Philly Trans Health all the bathrooms were gender neutral, they put up signs. For 3 days 3000 people used the bathroom for hours each day. NO incidents. I have never heard of an incident. It seems people just go in and relieve themselves and that's that.


--Jay

Happen to me before, pre-t, i keep getting screamed at saying this is the girls toilet, and i crigne and hated it and having to explane. So i stoped going to the woman loo after all the screaming as it really brings me down, so i try and find some single loos. My 1st time going into the male loo was when i was in an event a big expo so it was huge and it was packed! Women all had lines and disabled loo has a key so i had no choce but go into the gent, i was so scared but i just went in and it was over, and i felt so much better it gets easyer over time once you been into one and as long as you pass, if anyone ask just say so what. And i have a horrible girly squeaky voice so i try and not open my mouth when im in there.

I agree about why woman want to hang out in the loos taking up space. I mean it a loo not a hang out place.

Just take your time and you will get round to going into one.