Quote from: spacerace on June 19, 2013, 06:51:26 PM
Unfortunately, this does not seem to always dissipate with age. The guys I live with and my other friends are in their late 20's and in professional careers. I know it can also happen in workplace environments of all types, especially with guys who are in jobs where an element of competition among peers is involved. I would say that includes women as well, but really this one of those issues that can silence female voices in many circumstances because gender roles don't encourage women to behave the same way.

It certainly does seem to center around those who feel like they have something to prove as was mentioned though, and people who are good at their jobs and secure in themselves may not succumb to it as easily, so that is something. Going forward I will totally use this as a reason not to worry about masculinity competitions.

Not in late twenties no, but I've never seen anyone doing good it in their thirties, going on forty.

alright ill chime in here. There is often competition among men about pretty much everything. I my opinion it is less obvious with quite a few things: age, intellect and comraderie. I can say that as a nearly thirty year old the whole competition thing gets a bit less intense. Yeah, it's there but we dont get as obsessed with it and it doesnt seem as important. I have also found that the more intellectual the setting, the less competition there is, although there can be some about who is the most intelligent but again it does not seem as agressive. Also among men who are good friends the competition of proving your masculinity is not as intense because  the order is already established. I think of the guys that i am good friends with and there are situations where they are top dog and situations where i am top dog. I try not to rub anything in there faces though because i am 29 and they are all in the 40's. we have better things to do than have pissing contests all day. 

My last piece of advice is to try to pick something and excell at it. So that no matter what, you will always have that area of sucess. Mine is probably my weightlifting. Among my friends it is clear that I have the biggest muscles. But my friends all excell at other things. The dude that i would consider my best bud is about 6 feet tall and while he doesnt always rub it in, he is quite proud of it and i think he sees it a way of being superior. So yeah, it is there but lots of guys dont get caught up in it. Apathy is also seen as a way of being an alpha male. Just not caring about another guy's behavior.

QuoteOn the flip side I always had problems hanging out with females. Never cared to hang out at the mall, gossip about whose dating who, discuss everybody's business, or watch "chick flicks". Yeah, I talk a lot on here...because it's kinda required to be involved but anyone who knows me in real life will tell you I'm a rather quiet guy. I kinda live in my own head. Females on the other hand talk too much, lol. No misogyny implied here, just telling the truth according to myself.

I have four close female friends, and -gladly- none of them are like that either. The only really feminine thing they, or we, do is chat a lot. Gladly not about fashion or stuff like that though, as I have NO interest in that whatsoever.
I don't like "guy-guys" who constantly are acting like idiots to prove themselves, but neither do I like "girl-girls" who only chat about fashion, etc. I prefer to company of either tomboyish girls or at least girls who can be feminine without making it bigger than it has to be, or just friendly guys who feel secure enough about themselves not to constantly have serious group battles going on (like I said, I do like competition for fun, as long as it's not too much and the loser isn't ridiculed till his death or something, lol)
Bit difficult to describe. But whether I can get along with someone is more determined by his/her characteristics, hobbies, interests, social interactions, etc. rather than his/her gender.

When I was young many guys felt I had to prove myself to be masuline enough and boyish enough for being a man.
people would comment on me like, boys do this or girls do that.. for small simpel things

I learned the hard way that its really a waste of energy.
guys prove themself because there cowards its like when guys have yap about getting laid all the time to prove themself there not virgins.

I have stopped proving myself because if people want me to get provements for who I am then there not accepting and enver gonna acept me fully.

before when I was younger other guys could pretty much play around say "oh yeah your a real boy, but then if I did something out of sudden it would be "no thats so girly"

if guys today they would go somewhere like that wanting me to prove myself I would simple say no I dont ask you to prove your gender why should I?

I'm pretty sure the only proof you can offer is to just be yourself and present as a man. I spent my whole life trying to act like the other guys did, but I always fell short. When you try to fake it, you come off as trying to fake it eventually and people stop seeing a man and start seeing someone that's trying to cover up some femininity that they feel ashamed of. I worked really hard to appear as this fearless dominant personality. I got fearless dead on because of all my extracurricular activities, but dominant did not shine through. I constantly had to correct people that told me I was submissive because it seemed like I was trying too hard to be dominant. Eventually I just gave in and let the cat out of the bag.

Hey guys, I hate to barge in on ya'll but may be able to help on the subject. Just be yourself, respect and cherish whoever you love, don't worry about stereotypical behaviour and way above all the other stuff be your own man and you'll do fine. If you define your own masculinity, you may catch crap but believe me other men will respect you for it it. As for catching crap from other guys, that just happens and it's all in good nature. I use to always catchcrap because I chose wine or girly drinks instead of beer, smelled more girly than guy, privey to girl's secrets more than they were (this actually made them a little jelous) but no one ever questioned my masculinity. Joking about it sure but I was joking about theirs too.

When it comes to stereotypical masculinity, its all for show and hardley ever really felt inside. Hope this helps a little.

I'd like to mention one more thing: we went through something very similar whilst growing up female-bodied. We were constantly pressurised to conform to female standards of appearance and behaviour. Any time someone picked on you because your hair is the 'wrong' style; or you're wearing the 'wrong' clothes; or you like the 'wrong' music; or you haven't got a boyfriend; or whatever - that's the female equivalent of exactly the same thing. Girls pressurise other girls prove their femininity. The tests and benchmarks may be different, but the social pressure is very similar.

I don't know about you, but I adopted whatever female behaviours etc. I needed to in order to stop them from picking on me, and I told them where to stick the rest. I've now discarded most of those learned female behaviours in favour of my own natural behaviours, but I've gained enough strength from telling girls where to stick it that I can now do the same to guys. Just like I did with my boss.

My post was actually an accident. I hadn't noticed this was the FtM forum when I did it and I normally try to refrain on those. But since I'm here again, Jess42 is right too. Men pick on each other a LOT. You just have to stand firm and not let it get to you. Easier said than done, I know.   

 Most of my friends are women, but not over top feminine and most of my male friends are all laid back. About the only competition is at parties. Who can drink or smoke the most and as tiny as I am I'm able to drink and smoke the most and people still think I'm not intoxicated enough because I always act sober. They did a wrestling match ONCE. I was afraid I'd be ridiculed for not wanting to particapate yet when I declined they were cool and a just said "yeah you're too chill for this" and left it at that. This is a group that doesn't know I'm FtM. They've never questioned me and even if we meet new people if the new person asks what I am when I leave they say I'm a guy.

Quote from: Simon on June 18, 2013, 07:37:12 PM
There are all types of men on this earth and you're not obligated to be like any man other than yourself.

I think that is the best way to put it. You are your own man, it doesn't matter how everyone else is or how anyone expects you to be. It just matters who you are.

In the great words of Dr. Seuss, "Be who you are and say what you feel, because those mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind."