I have been feeling this way for a couple weeks now but this limbo period is really starting to get me down. Its the physical, mental, emotional and social inbetween.

Physically speaking, my boobs are not being very responsive to HRT. Fat distribution is not really happening, excluding my face. I have a decent wardrobe but putting together a flattering outfit is difficult. There are some key pieces of my wardrob that I am realising I need to get. I have been trying to give my body some fat to work with and it is just all going to my tummy. So I am planning on starting to excercise again real soon. Body hair is still a huge problem, but I just had my 2nd laser session.

Mentally and emotionally speaking,  I feel like I have grown a lot since I have started dealing with everything. But I have been a little emotionally stunted from holding everything in for decades. I have and feel the emotion but I just can't seem to express anything but sobbing and sadness. Transition wise I am making great strides I think, but I am still at war with anxiety and emberassment. Figuratively speaking, being "in the process of" on everything is torture.

Socially speaking, I only have a select group of people that know about me. I am trying to branch out and make some new friends. I have some standing dinner plans with a couple new ones that I made a couple weeks ago. But for the most part I am still just really bored and home with no one to really talk to about anything. When I do actually get together with people that know, it seems like the only topic for discussion is me being a transwoman and how I am dealing with everything. Don't get me wronge, it is nice to have support and get to talk about it, but, I am more than my trans status.

I guess I am kind of having a moment here. I dont know what I am trying to accomplish with this post but,  there it is. I think I am going to open a bottle of wine and drink alone or something...

<3 Liv

I was in that limbo stage for far too long and I feel your pain.   I think pretty much everything you said I dealt with, to a tee.  It is totally normal to feel how you do.   It sounds like you are doing the right things to build up a social circle and that will be so helpful.

Funny that you have friends that want to keep talking about your trans status, though.  I never really did.  I almost think I wish I did, just cause I could have turned them all into little therapists lol, but I can totally see how that could get annoying.

Oh PS I'll break out a bottle and drink some luscious wine with ya

Thanks Jen, I am trying to do the right things, with advice from my therapist. I am just starting to get impatient with my long transition. I've been working towards FT for about 3 years now, and I do mean working... Oh! If your in the Bakersfield area just come on over! I would love to share a glass with someone! 

<3 Liv

Just two states away! 

Quote from: Jen on June 29, 2013, 10:25:07 PM
Just two states away! 

Darned it!  Oh well, guess Liv is getting drunk by herself...   If your ever in the neighborhood...

<3 Liv

I can also relate and hope that things turn out well for you.  I know when I made the plans to go fulltime once I finished my education, it was the longest year/year and a half of my life.  Not only being scared of the consequences of my decisions and how my relationships with people might change, but also the anxiety leading up to it. 

I can't imaging spending three years of that pressure building up, so I give you tons of credit.  I've read several of your posts and you seems to have everything put together, so I'm sure once you go fulltime, you won't be feeling this way anymore.  I know I've never felt better about myself and what the future holds for me than I do now.  The depression I carried for all those years has vanished. 

I know the saying "it's a marathon, not a sprint" has been said and is kind of cliché.  But HRT takes years for the full effects to show, so good things will probably happen if you give it time. 

As for your friends, I'm sure always talking about your trans status will eventually get old.  I had a few deeply serious conversations with my close friends after coming out, but now it hardly ever comes up anymore.  It usually happens when a subject is talked to death. 

I hope things work out in the end for you.

I'm sorry about how your feeling Liv

I also took things very slow...I think you are doing the right thing. I remember the in-between stage...I probably stayed at that stage longer than needed but I wanted most of my face lasered first. I was being gendered female a year before coming out...in fact I still wasn't out even after legal name change...UGH!! did I hate that time!! Though I have some very interesting stories to tell...I can chuckle about them now.

I can say life has gotten better....I'm working as myself (stealth), I've gone on dates with men, my children treat me more as  a woman then a man...but still their dad (I am, always will be) and I rarely feel insecure about blending...but very insecure like many other females about ...hair, weight, dress style, attractiveness.......

but because I isolated myself severely during my 3 years of pre-transition I am now even more introverted (if that could even happen) one reason I have turned back to this forum...though I can't say I'm all too happy with it. I need reality!! I have tried to meet new people and the last two years I have met a few...but either I or they just tend to drift away. I long for friendship almost as much as intimacy. I wish I could handle alcohol...I would be joining you!!

The belly thing...ugh!! I hear you...I never had a belly like this...sure its a feminine type but at times I look pregnant...it doesn't matter how much I weigh, its still their. I joined a gym 5 months ago...its still their. The thing is everyone says I'm so skinny...that doesn't help and then if I say.... well I have this belly...they look at me like I have some disorder. My doctor is probably 100# soak and wet...when she prescribed me some meds for migraines she said it may cause weight gain....she said "oh that's not a concern for you, your skinny, you could use a few" I said well...I really don't want to gain weight. Her and the nurse gave me a weird look...they don't know that every single pound would go to my belly. I do not see women my size with a belly like mine!!

Finding a correct wardrobe is very critical for self esteem as well as blending better....we will never have the natural curves some woman have....but their are many that have the same shape as me and you....I just seen Jessica Alba in a mag...not too many curves!! I have learned to accentuate my belly with correct wardrobe choices...my therapist has told me I have a very feminine figure because of how my belly shows at times. Many of the tops I wear have a princess cut and are not tight but snug enough to show some curvature!! I wish I was one to post pics...I recently wore a short black skirt with a very feminine cut top...that had black, purples and some pinks...my sister stopped by and was just shocked at how good I looked....first time she seen me in a skirt. It just went together well...wish I could look like that always...but don't have enough money!!

As for people that know and all they talk about is your transition...one reason I am as much stealth as I am. This is not what defines me!! At times though it is nice to have friends that you can turn too about things you and then can only relate with!!

Liv, you will get through this stage as difficult as that is to believe....then its on to all the other insecurities that come with womanhood and age

oh...also the nice thing about taking things slow is that I never really went full time...it just happened!! Even with your name change...doesn't mean you have to present as a woman all the time. You will know when its time or time will let you know hmmmm maybe its now 

Thanks for your reply ladies. I am a little tipsy now so if my words are a little off I apologize. I am more taking it slow because of circumstance ans opposed to wanting to. My old job was in the fabrication industry. Very masculine enviorment. Initially when I got the job i was still denying everything about myself. But as time went on I realised I had to progess beyond that job to have a more transitionable (is that a word?) job. It was about 3 years ago that I went back to school to get some electrical design classes and drafting courses under my belt. March 3 of this year i was finally able to start in my desired position of electrical designer. But I also have the added bonus of working with alot of family. SO, i have to balence coming out socially and professionaly at the same time. I just can't have them be seperate from each other. To make matters worse, my intolerant father was one of my employees of the division I used to oversee. If it wasn't for the akward working situation I think I would have been able to come otu socially along time ago. But that wasnt in the cards for me. I did read an article a while back that someone regarded transition as something to be relished and experienced. It wasn't something to just get done. But at this point I just want it to be done. Ughh I still have so much ahead of me to get done though. I still have the hardest people in my life to come out to. As well as coming out at work. I just wish society as a whole was alot more accepting. I am just tired of the non-sense that surrounds this whole trans thing. I dont know how all this stuff I have ahead of me is going to play out though. For all I know, my anxiety is for nothing and no one is going to caer. orr it is the opposite of that and they are all going to be jerks and then I lose my job and my house and have to start all over again. Not to mention that my field is pretty limited so i would probably have to move out of state if they really wanted to ruin my career. Recently i have been getting panik attacks thinking about all this stuff. My therapist says to just relaaax and everything will be ok. But I cant help but get super worked up over thing sometimes. Gah! Sorry for the rambles, but i have had uhmmm half a obottle wine and this is what comes from  that.

<3 Liv

Hi Liv. I love reading your posts, you're in a similar place to me, and much of what you put down in words resonates with me too.

I might just share this though. I was getting some uncomfortable looks and chatter from some of the people at my work who I don't see very often. I know that I appear hugely different while HRT is working its magic, so I can kinda expect this. So after some thought on how to best handle this, I decided to just come out to everyone at work and end the speculation and chatter about what I may or may not have going on. HR already knew all about me, and my rough timeline for on-the-job transition, but none of the other management, and not all staff knew about it. So last week and continuing this week, I've been taking people aside, one by one and telling them what's happening. So far, every last person has been respectful and rather supportive. I know there will be chatter, but at least if it's not a secret, there's no guessing and no 'mystery weight' to the gossip. And I've invited them all to ask any questions they have, I'll be more than happy to answer.

Oh, also, with everyone aware of my transition, I can feel free to drop that horrible old persona from a past life and let the girl flow. That is only going to make this stage of the marathon the easier .

Quote from: Just Shelly on June 29, 2013, 11:21:31 PM
oh...also the nice thing about taking things slow is that I never really went full time...it just happened!! Even with your name change...doesn't mean you have to present as a woman all the time. You will know when its time or time will let you know hmmmm maybe its now 

I'm so glad you said that because that is exactly how I feel. Lets be honest, even naturally born females most of the time don't present as female. What makes a transsexual stand out in a group of women? She's one of the few dressed as a woman.

I will starting hrt soon (once the postman gets back from his gap year!) and sometimes I will present as female but other times I won't. Eventually It may just sort of happen but I'm not going to force the issue nor feel obliged to. I have no intention of swapping one set of constraints for another.

Quote from: Olivia-Anne on June 29, 2013, 09:45:56 PM
Socially speaking, I only have a select group of people that know about me. I am trying to branch out and make some new friends. I have some standing dinner plans with a couple new ones that I made a couple weeks ago. But for the most part I am still just really bored and home with no one to really talk to about anything. When I do actually get together with people that know, it seems like the only topic for discussion is me being a transwoman and how I am dealing with everything. Don't get me wronge, it is nice to have support and get to talk about it, but, I am more than my trans status.

I guess I am kind of having a moment here. I dont know what I am trying to accomplish with this post but,  there it is. I think I am going to open a bottle of wine and drink alone or something...

<3 Liv

With regards to the discussion; it's been hit or miss for me.  Some people have been that way and with others it really hasn't come up very much at all.  With some people I think it's just a natural curiosity, and will go away on its own over time.  With others it may not and at that point I suppose you have to make a decision to continue to discuss it or not.  I really, really don't ever like to be rude, or really even too blunt if I can help it (I did enough of that pre-transition); but with some people that may be what it takes.  Personally I don't mind answering any questions, but I also don't want to be the focal point of a lengthy discussion, so in those situations when it turns to that I will politely try and change the subject a couple of times (which usually seems to take 2-3 attempts); or if all else fails I'll be to the point that "I think we've discussed my gender situation enough, haven't we?".  Of course I try and do it as nicely as possible; but on occasion someone is offended; but if I've made a good faith effort then it "is what it is" at that point.

As far as not knowing what you are trying to accomplish, I have those moments more often than I'd like to admit.  For me, it's almost therapeutic for me to post something here (or sometimes Facebook where I have a small more personal audience).  Oftentimes for me, simply hearing from others that they have the same/similar situations really help me; or in the case of Facebook, it's more simply getting some support from those friends/family that I do know personally.

Just my two cents.  <3

Oh and for what it's worth, your avatar photo is beautiful...

I'm about to start my third month on HRT and I feel the same way. While my brain is different--thinking differently, I'm still waiting for my body to catch up. There have been some facial changes, skin changes, boobs are an A-cup, and some loss of upper body muscle. That said, I'm still presenting as male, so I'm the curiosity when I go out with friends. I'm trying to enjoy the journey, but to as point. Ahhhh!

The in-between double-life stage was finally what drove me to go full time ahead of "schedule." It got to the point where I just couldn't deal with being in-between and just starting coming all to all and sundry, including my bosses at work, and scheduled when my last workday as David would be and when my first at Constance (or Connie, or Cam as I'm also called) would happen.

Yeah, the limbo stage is really hard. For me, it was almost worse than just presenting as male all the time before I even tried to start transition.

HUGS

Hi Liv,

I'm 7 months into hrt, and I feel I'm in the netherzone too, I am right in the between zone, a soft male, and for me, I may just plan to stay male looking for sometime to come, until it gets obvious(ie.boobs protruding/more female shaped and face and most importantly get mammed), but I kinda doubt it, who knows.  Reason I may not transition whole hog, my work environment, even though its protected, I may just stay in this netherland. I'm pretty sure if I was in my early 20's I would have a much much  better chance, but at 45 years old, well, hmmm, I'll see what mothernature has in store for me(ie.I'm adopted, and don't know what my female blood relatives looked like).

Lucia,
In Los Angeles

Quote from: sam79 on June 30, 2013, 02:18:08 AM
Hi Liv. I love reading your posts, you're in a similar place to me, and much of what you put down in words resonates with me too.

I might just share this though. I was getting some uncomfortable looks and chatter from some of the people at my work who I don't see very often. I know that I appear hugely different while HRT is working its magic, so I can kinda expect this. So after some thought on how to best handle this, I decided to just come out to everyone at work and end the speculation and chatter about what I may or may not have going on. HR already knew all about me, and my rough timeline for on-the-job transition, but none of the other management, and not all staff knew about it. So last week and continuing this week, I've been taking people aside, one by one and telling them what's happening. So far, every last person has been respectful and rather supportive. I know there will be chatter, but at least if it's not a secret, there's no guessing and no 'mystery weight' to the gossip. And I've invited them all to ask any questions they have, I'll be more than happy to answer.

Oh, also, with everyone aware of my transition, I can feel free to drop that horrible old persona from a past life and let the girl flow. That is only going to make this stage of the marathon the easier .

I am at the stage just prior to that. I need to tell a couple more family members before I start filling in people at work. I work with alot of family, and I want to be the one to tell them before telling work. I will probably take a few people aside and tell them. But I interact with the majority of people in my nearly 200 employee company. I dont have the emotional stamina to take everyone aside. I know people are starting to talk though. But that is because of my own doing. I have stopped curbing my responses to apease other people. Especially on things related to the LGBT. Also, I am glad someone enjoys my ramblings. Thank you for that.

Quote from: Mollie on June 30, 2013, 02:31:54 AM
I'm so glad you said that because that is exactly how I feel. Lets be honest, even naturally born females most of the time don't present as female. What makes a transsexual stand out in a group of women? She's one of the few dressed as a woman.

I will starting hrt soon (once the postman gets back from his gap year!) and sometimes I will present as female but other times I won't. Eventually It may just sort of happen but I'm not going to force the issue nor feel obliged to. I have no intention of swapping one set of constraints for another.

Yea I have realised that dressing appropiately is a big clue sometimes. Early on I tended to dress like I was going for a night on the town, but instead i was at the grocery store. My wardrobe is becomming more well suited to everyday. But even when I present less femanine, it will still be distinctly femanine. But as far as letting it just happen, I am beginning to get a little impatient. There comes a time when the gap must be bridged. I don't think I will ever just be gendered female in male clothes. With some effort I am able to look ok. But I am always gendered as what I am presenting as. I know what you mean about swapping constraints. Although for me it seemed like it was more breaking free from some stereotypes and taking on a whole other set. Alot of what transitioning is, is learning to be free from those stereotypes (mentally speaking). I think knowing that is what is helping me come to terms that I will always have masculine traits. Instead of denying them, I am learning to love the my entire being not just one specific part.

Quote from: Madison Leigh on June 30, 2013, 03:10:06 AM
With regards to the discussion; it's been hit or miss for me.  Some people have been that way and with others it really hasn't come up very much at all.  With some people I think it's just a natural curiosity, and will go away on its own over time.  With others it may not and at that point I suppose you have to make a decision to continue to discuss it or not.  I really, really don't ever like to be rude, or really even too blunt if I can help it (I did enough of that pre-transition); but with some people that may be what it takes.  Personally I don't mind answering any questions, but I also don't want to be the focal point of a lengthy discussion, so in those situations when it turns to that I will politely try and change the subject a couple of times (which usually seems to take 2-3 attempts); or if all else fails I'll be to the point that "I think we've discussed my gender situation enough, haven't we?".  Of course I try and do it as nicely as possible; but on occasion someone is offended; but if I've made a good faith effort then it "is what it is" at that point.

As far as not knowing what you are trying to accomplish, I have those moments more often than I'd like to admit.  For me, it's almost therapeutic for me to post something here (or sometimes Facebook where I have a small more personal audience).  Oftentimes for me, simply hearing from others that they have the same/similar situations really help me; or in the case of Facebook, it's more simply getting some support from those friends/family that I do know personally.

Just my two cents.  <3

Oh and for what it's worth, your avatar photo is beautiful...

I will have to take that advice I think. I am not very skilled at the art of changing the topic of conversation. I normally just let it flow naturally. Which, these days, always seems to make a hard right turn into my trans status. It is okay most of the time though. The conversations are theraputic alot of the time. But sometimes they are just emotionally exhausting. I guess I should say that is only close friends who know me really well that I am having this issue with. They are not people I would ever disassociate with. But, I will have to politely say that enough is enough at somepoints I think. You are also right in that what I was trying to accomplish was just a good old vent. I needed to get some thoughts out of my head and vomit them into a thread apparently. I felt better after hearing advice and responses.  Oh and thanks for the compliment on my avatar!

Quote from: DrZoey on June 30, 2013, 11:05:19 AM
I'm about to start my third month on HRT and I feel the same way. While my brain is different--thinking differently, I'm still waiting for my body to catch up. There have been some facial changes, skin changes, boobs are an A-cup, and some loss of upper body muscle. That said, I'm still presenting as male, so I'm the curiosity when I go out with friends. I'm trying to enjoy the journey, but to as point. Ahhhh!

I feel your pain sistah! Don't worry it gets worse! But I have this sneaking feeling that it will be ok... eventually...   

Quote from: Constance on June 30, 2013, 05:48:12 PM
The in-between double-life stage was finally what drove me to go full time ahead of "schedule." It got to the point where I just couldn't deal with being in-between and just starting coming all to all and sundry, including my bosses at work, and scheduled when my last workday as David would be and when my first at Constance (or Connie, or Cam as I'm also called) would happen.

Yeah, the limbo stage is really hard. For me, it was almost worse than just presenting as male all the time before I even tried to start transition.

HUGS

It drove you to full time and it is the driving for behind me coming out and going full time as well. Even if FT is about 6 months away... ((HUGS))

Quote from: SonadoraXVX on July 01, 2013, 02:05:55 AM
Hi Liv,

I'm 7 months into hrt, and I feel I'm in the netherzone too, I am right in the between zone, a soft male, and for me, I may just plan to stay male looking for sometime to come, until it gets obvious(ie.boobs protruding/more female shaped and face and most importantly get mammed), but I kinda doubt it, who knows.  Reason I may not transition whole hog, my work environment, even though its protected, I may just stay in this netherland. I'm pretty sure if I was in my early 20's I would have a much much  better chance, but at 45 years old, well, hmmm, I'll see what mothernature has in store for me(ie.I'm adopted, and don't know what my female blood relatives looked like).

Lucia,
In Los Angeles

I actually debated going part time for ever because of work too. But What made me realise I didn't want to was my best friend. Basically she said "well look at it like this, you will be in this stupid quasi woman phase for 30 years OR you come out, transition and get the BS out of the way then just move on with your life and be normal." I don't know what your enviorement is. BUT, if I can do it in the oil industry in bakersfield, you can certainly do it in L.A. I think. According to JennyGirl being trans was GOOD for her career in L.A. Kinda makes me want to move over the hill! 

Thanks for all your responses ladies. I am sorry If I missed a reply to one of you. I was having a moment the other day. This thread genuinely made me feel better! 

<3 Liv

Quote from: Olivia-Anne on June 29, 2013, 09:45:56 PM
I dont know what I am trying to accomplish with this post but,  there it is. I think I am going to open a bottle of wine and drink alone or something...

I think you accomplished roll-call 

It's happenstance this thread was placed at the top of the "unread" posts tonight.  I've been in the same place for the last week-plus, and especially so over the weekend.  I was telling a friend tonight at dinner about how accurate it is to call this a second puberty, and how unfortunate the awkward stage is this time around.  It's that point where HRT is definitely doing a thing, but hasn't had time to complete the assembly.

And going back and forth from work-mode to home and around friends?  It's a total mind-f*@k!  In the state we're currently in, we're constantly shifting between genders, and really, between personalities.  I'm sure it's happened to you too, but just as it can be a bit rough switching to feminine mannerisms after a stint in boy-mode, it gets difficult to not use a feminine timbre when I speak at work.  It can catch the attention of people you aren't out to, and when around those who do know, we become fixated on our flaws.

Quote from: Olivia-Anne on July 01, 2013, 10:04:23 PM
I have realised that dressing appropiately is a big clue sometimes. Early on I tended to dress like I was going for a night on the town, but instead i was at the grocery store. My wardrobe is becomming more well suited to everyday. But even when I present less femanine, it will still be distinctly femanine.

Everything we coach ourselves through in transition is like a pendulum coming to a rest.  I'm not currently at this stage with clothes, but it reminds me of what I'm going through with my posture and body movement.  Some friends were taking pictures over the weekend, and I kept catching myself in these shots with unflattering slouches, grimacing...looking neither comfortable nor lady-like.  I mentioned this to my friend at dinner, too, and he pointed out it makes sense that "correcting" this would be to go too far the other way, and then settle where we're comfortable.  It makes sense!  We grow out our hair, so we can trim it and style; our vocal training takes us to comical pitches, and descends to a natural range.  It's just a matter of making our fixations productive, rather than self-destructive.

The middle ground.  It's the worst.


PS, when I first read this, I instantly checked your profile to see if you were in the Boston area, because I would have absolutely shared a bottle (or two?) of wine, haha.

The first 1-1 1/2 year after going FT(I say "1-1 1/2 year" because it's a bit hard to pinpoint going FT) was hell. I felt like the village idiot with feathers in hands, flapping my arms vigorously trying to achieve flight. It felt like an exercise in futility and I was constantly haunted by the thought of being stuck in limbo forever. Eventually though I made it through and things turned out okay. It gets better. It just takes time.

This month I've been on hrt for 10 years and FT for almost as long, but I'd say that it's only just recently the last piece of the puzzle fell into place. I finally feel all the way complete.

About the wardrobe, before transition I always pictured myself in cute little pink dresses, bow in hair and high heeled shoes. This is not how I turned out however. Mostly I would describe myself as a feminine tomboy. I can and do wear dresses sometimes but mostly it's raggedy saggy jeans, tank-tops, converse and a ponytail. I often wish a more feminine style would work better for me than it does, but I actually like my style now because it compliments my personality perfectly. I think clothing style should be the union intersect between personality and ability.