Does anybody else suffer from bad jealousy issues? I know we all probably experience dysphoria and can be triggered by certain things, but for me it's like the dumbest and most irrational things set me off really badly. For example, I don't really want to get into the details of the story but I basically saw my girlfriend was talking to another guy. There was no flirting, nothing bad at all, and I recognize this, but I got angry to the point that my body went cold, my face went hot and I was shaking and simply couldn't think rationally anymore. I also have fear of abandonment issues when it comes to dating so it doesn't help, and it really doesn't help that I don't tell my girlfriend these things because I know it pushes people away. I don't want that.

I'm pretty much entirely sure this roots in my insecurities about my birth gender and my body in general, because I see pretty much any other guy as being better than me and more attractive and interesting and so on. I was just wondering if anybody else experiences something like this? I've never read about any other trans individuals being jealous to such an extreme but it still doesn't hurt to ask. Hopefully, I can get some advice on how to control it or even get rid of it, and of course, you can discuss your experiences with jealousy here as well.

I have similar issues, mate.  I used to be much worse pre-T, but it still niggles me.  I was so insanely jealous of my girlfriend's past relationship with her ex (high school boyfriend, mind you - and it had ended four years before she even met me).  All I could think about was things like "she would do [this] or [that] with him (sexually) and won't do it with me, he must have been sexier", etc.  I hated him with a purple passion.  Although my girlfriend and I are now married, I still think about her past relationships with guys.  I think of the guys around me sometimes and how all the girls are so much more interested in them than me (although I'm in a relationship, it still stings to not even feel attractive). 

I know that I look 100% male now, but seeing the way girls interact with "biological" guys makes me feel pretty crap.  I still think that they think I look weird or something - then again, I'm my own worst critic and they may even flirt with me and I'd not realise it because I'm too focused on the idea that no one notices me.

But it's all self-destructive behaviour, mate.  Are you pre-T?  I have to say that it does get better with time and self-confidence.  I am obviously still working on my own self-confidence issues, and that's where a good therapist can come in handy.  I have a psychiatrist and she's very supportive and willing to listen to whatever issues I may have.  Also, doing things like working out or even simple things like buying new clothes that make you look good can help you to improve your self-confidence.  I noticed that the more I got depressed about it, the more I let myself go - and the "uglier" I looked and felt inside. 

Thanks a lot for your reply, it's oddly comforting to know I'm not the only one, even if it is a not so good situation.

I'm definitely the same though, I guess I lucked out in the way that my girlfriend has only ever shared a tiny kiss with another guy when she was super young, otherwise she hasn't done anything. So it's like instead of focusing on what she's done with guys in the past, it's more so like I'm just freaking out over really stupid things with her male friends. And like you said, the guy I have in mind, I hate him with a purple passion, but rationally, like, I know it's so so stupid and I want desperately to get over it, there's really no good reason for me to dislike him.

I am pre-T, I hope to start by next year at the latest. I have a gut feeling that when I'm on T, my jealousy issues will die down to a great extent but I just wanted to get somebody else's advice because I hate to think of T as some miracle cure-all (although it's hard not to see it that way for a lot of my own issues). I did recently start working out consistently and it really does do wonders for my self esteem. I've been applying for jobs as well and if I get one and can afford new clothes I know that will help, and then from there it's off to therapy and hopefully hormones.

Thank you again for your reply, you have no idea how much it puts my mind at ease. I hope things go better with your self esteem and jealousy as well, just remember like you said, it's self destructive behavior and we're always our own worst critics.

I've recently made a friend who's gay and has exposed me to a few other gay men (mostly couples). I can't say I feel extreme jealousy, but I am jealous over their apparent ease at being themselves. I still look very female and feel extremely awkward surrounded by men that I want to emulate. It's even worse that my husband and I appear to be a heterosexual couple. I feel uncomfortable touching him much when I'm around the other guys because I look female.

Quote from: randomroads on July 11, 2013, 12:43:21 AM
I've recently made a friend who's gay and has exposed me to a few other gay men (mostly couples). I can't say I feel extreme jealousy, but I am jealous over their apparent ease at being themselves. I still look very female and feel extremely awkward surrounded by men that I want to emulate. It's even worse that my husband and I appear to be a heterosexual couple. I feel uncomfortable touching him much when I'm around the other guys because I look female.

I know exactly where you're coming from. I can be having the most confident day of my life but as soon as I'm in the same building with guys my confidence just goes right down the drain and I feel pretty small and stupid. Are you pre-T or planning to go on T at all?

I've never really had issues with jealousy. I do envy other people, mainly cis guys, from time to time.

I sometimes envy other gay men their life experiences. And then I think of how many of them aren't actually around anymore. I turned eighteen in 1980, and I experimented sexually from 1981 on--multiple partners, parties, men and women both. If I'd been born "right," I'd probably be dead by now. I remind myself of this from time to time.

But I haven't found any way to make myself feel better about how easy these men are in their bodies...

just wanted to throw in another "youre not the only one" . Before starting testosterone i had alotof jelousy issues. Now i do still get jelous but its ot as bad and i can even laugh at it sometimes. I have found that trying to make friends with the people that make me envious is actually very helpful. Everyone has something that makes them jelous and seeing the people that i am jelous of as "friends' insteadof enemies has helped. When you get to know people, you will ultimately see their flaws and those flaws will even out whatever things they have over you.

QuoteAre you pre-T or planning to go on T at all?

I've been on T for two months.

I agree that making friends with the people you're jealous or envious of is a great way to combat it. I'm thankful for being exposed to the people I have, and I'm working to make friendships where I can. It's not always easy, but it does help.

Here's another one who can get quite jealous too. Especially of cis guys.
I am very jealous of my brother. I love the guy (in a brotherly way, of course) but he seems to have it all. A good body, guys who want him and as a result of that: a happy dating life, a rocking career, an awesome social life, a good house, car. He's got it all. So it's not only dysphoria issues. But at times I look at him and I am like "I should have been like him. Why did he get it all, including a normal body, and I got nothing?" Life can be so unfair at times. The good thing is that he's a great guy, and really deserves all of that. I guess I pissed off some gods in a previous life or something.

I definitely deal with jealousy when it comes to other people being further along in a seemingly happy life. Depression and denial and anxiety and all the negative mental stuff I've dealt with means I don't have much to show for the 10 years I've been out on my own. It's embarrassing to not only go through a second puberty while transitioning and dealing with emotional stuff and having to hide it all because 'adults don't act that way', but to also finally have to make decisions on what kind of man I want to be and what I want to do with my male life when most men my age that I admire have finished college or have some kind of steady career and seem to (superficially) have their shiz together.

These are things I don't talk about except online. Even my husband doesn't know how embarrassed of myself I am. I've got the 'men don't talk about their feelings' stereotype down pat! I constantly remind myself that on the surface, I've always looked like I'm happy and doing alright for myself, and that it's completely reasonable to think that others are happy even if they're hiding the truth. It helps me feel better to know that everyone's got embarrassing stuff they don't talk about.

I'm coming up on seven months on T. For the first time in my life I feel really confident about myself. I do get a bit jealous when I look at the chests of cis men or transguys who were small enough to get top without the huge tell tale double DI scars. I'm not going to be small enough to be able to get that done myself. I'm coming to terms with it slowly but surely before my surgery. Better to think it through now then be depressed about it when it happens.

Oh, and I used to get a bit jealous when my gf would talk to cis guys or have cis male friends. Now we're almost a decade into our relationship and I've relaxed about all of it. She has cis guy friends from school who she texts and I could care less. I figured out a long time ago if she wants to be with me she will. If she doesn't then she's going to leave. You can't force someone to love you. By being jealous or controlling it just pushes them away. Just have to trust that everything is kosher and feel confident that they love you or they wouldn't be with ya.

I know this feeling. The longer I am on T, the less I feel bothered by what other guys do or other guys have. I do my own thing and they mainly just blend into the background at this point.

Quote from: Arch on July 11, 2013, 01:32:13 AM
I've never really had issues with jealousy. I do envy other people, mainly cis guys, from time to time.

I sometimes envy other gay men their life experiences. And then I think of how many of them aren't actually around anymore. I turned eighteen in 1980, and I experimented sexually from 1981 on--multiple partners, parties, men and women both. If I'd been born "right," I'd probably be dead by now. I remind myself of this from time to time.

But I haven't found any way to make myself feel better about how easy these men are in their bodies...

That's some really thoughtful insight and something I've certainly never taken note of before. I guess it's helpful in a way to remind ourselves we may not have been born the way we wanted, but there's still a lot we have that other's unfortunately don't.

Quote from: chuck on July 11, 2013, 08:07:05 AM
just wanted to throw in another "youre not the only one" . Before starting testosterone i had alotof jelousy issues. Now i do still get jelous but its ot as bad and i can even laugh at it sometimes. I have found that trying to make friends with the people that make me envious is actually very helpful. Everyone has something that makes them jelous and seeing the people that i am jelous of as "friends' insteadof enemies has helped. When you get to know people, you will ultimately see their flaws and those flaws will even out whatever things they have over you.

Thanks a lot for the advice. You couldn't be more right about going and making friends with those you're jealous of. It kind of puts a name to the face, for lack of a better term, instead of just seeing them as an enemy and not another human being with flaws, thoughts and feelings.

Quote from: randomroads on July 11, 2013, 09:19:37 AM
I've been on T for two months.

I agree that making friends with the people you're jealous or envious of is a great way to combat it. I'm thankful for being exposed to the people I have, and I'm working to make friendships where I can. It's not always easy, but it does help.

Has T alleviated any of your jealousy at all? And have you maybe considered opening up to your husband at all about it? You might feel reluctant to do so but I've learned that when I just open my mouth up to my girlfriend she kind of paints the things I'm sad about in a new light. She kind of makes me realize what a nice person I am and how silly my sadness can be.

Quote from: Simon on July 11, 2013, 11:50:12 AM
I'm coming up on seven months on T. For the first time in my life I feel really confident about myself. I do get a bit jealous when I look at the chests of cis men or transguys who were small enough to get top without the huge tell tale double DI scars. I'm not going to be small enough to be able to get that done myself. I'm coming to terms with it slowly but surely before my surgery. Better to think it through now then be depressed about it when it happens.

Oh, and I used to get a bit jealous when my gf would talk to cis guys or have cis male friends. Now we're almost a decade into our relationship and I've relaxed about all of it. She has cis guy friends from school who she texts and I could care less. I figured out a long time ago if she wants to be with me she will. If she doesn't then she's going to leave. You can't force someone to love you. By being jealous or controlling it just pushes them away. Just have to trust that everything is kosher and feel confident that they love you or they wouldn't be with ya.

This advice is priceless to me and something I don't remember often enough, so I have to thank you for that. 

Quote from: Ketchup Packet on July 11, 2013, 02:53:04 PM
I know this feeling. The longer I am on T, the less I feel bothered by what other guys do or other guys have. I do my own thing and they mainly just blend into the background at this point.

That's really good to hear! I hope I can get to this point some day.

I have thought about it, but while he's been super supportive of being trans and transitioning he's incapable of listening to me in a way that makes me feel he actually 'gets it'. He's always been that way.

My inner linguist just cannot be suppressed. Envy and jealousy typically refer to two distinct emotions. You can envy someone for having something you don't have--like a penis--but you get jealous when something or someone you have or think you have--such as a partner--is threatened by another person you think will take it away or replace you. People nowadays conflate the two feelings, but that creates all sorts of misunderstanding. For example, when I first read the title of this thread, I was expecting something else, perhaps about a girlfriend that some other guy was hitting on!

I've probably misused the word "jealous" from time to time myself, but I never used to. I've picked it up from the people around me over the years. (You should see what happens to my writing when I teach international students.) So I suppose that the two words will eventually come to mean the same thing.

Anyway, when I said that I didn't have jealousy issues, I meant both that I don't get jealous (mainly in relationships) and that I don't see how I can be jealous of someone who can't take away something I don't possess in the first place.

You may slap me now.

QuoteI definitely deal with jealousy when it comes to other people being further along in a seemingly happy life. Depression and denial and anxiety and all the negative mental stuff I've dealt with means I don't have much to show for the 10 years I've been out on my own. It's embarrassing to not only go through a second puberty while transitioning and dealing with emotional stuff and having to hide it all because 'adults don't act that way', but to also finally have to make decisions on what kind of man I want to be and what I want to do with my male life when most men my age that I admire have finished college or have some kind of steady career and seem to (superficially) have their shiz together.

^that's me! I've been through the wringer the past 5-6 years. I'm none too eager to go through a second puberty and right now isn't the time for that anyway. I'm in the process of getting a second degree and then I have to deal with other adult issues, like paying off some debts and saving up for top surgery. It seems unfair to a degree that I'm still dealing with the whole OMG WTF I am going to do with my life thing in my late 20s while everyone else around me has great jobs, serious relationships, money in the bank, etc. And I'm still going to school, working part time, and not anywhere near stable in my life. Hell, I'm not even living on my own at this point due to having made some shady financial decisions. So yeah....the idea of transitioning ->-bleeped-<-ing scares me ->-bleeped-<-less on top of all of that....

QuoteDoes anybody else suffer from bad jealousy issues? I know we all probably experience dysphoria and can be triggered by certain things, but for me it's like the dumbest and most irrational things set me off really badly. For example, I don't really want to get into the details of the story but I basically saw my girlfriend was talking to another guy. There was no flirting, nothing bad at all, and I recognize this, but I got angry to the point that my body went cold, my face went hot and I was shaking and simply couldn't think rationally anymore. I also have fear of abandonment issues when it comes to dating so it doesn't help, and it really doesn't help that I don't tell my girlfriend these things because I know it pushes people away. I don't want that.

I'm pretty much entirely sure this roots in my insecurities about my birth gender and my body in general, because I see pretty much any other guy as being better than me and more attractive and interesting and so on. I was just wondering if anybody else experiences something like this? I've never read about any other trans individuals being jealous to such an extreme but it still doesn't hurt to ask. Hopefully, I can get some advice on how to control it or even get rid of it, and of course, you can discuss your experiences with jealousy here as well.

To the OP...->-bleeped-<- yes I suffer from jealousy issues. I never really realized that was what was going on between me and my long time on-again-off-again, I-need-to-screw-this-guy-but-can-you-please-get-some-wine-for-when-i-get-home girlfriend until she got herself knocked up by this ->-bleeped-<- from work that she was supposedly "in love" with and we broke up. My ex and I tried to stay friends but seriously...I hate her boyfriend's guts. He's not a bad guy but she choose him over me for no other reason than he has a dick and I don't.

Every time I am around him (which is occasionally since my ex is still pretty close to my mom and gets invited to family functions), I just want to punch him in the back of the head. Or rack him in the balls. Something. Anything to get even. But really....I don't want to hurt him. I'm just pissed that things ended the way that they did and that I lost someone I really loved to a douchebag with the IQ of a cucumber.

I don't hate all bioguys, just those that give me a cause to hate them. I do feel inferior to them sometimes, because they have the body that I want...but that isn't jealousy, that's more like envy or lust or some weird combination of the both.

zombieinc,

Sorry to hear you ever had to be involved in that situation, I feel like jealousy would be inevitable there. Hopefully this isn't unwanted two cents but maybe in a way its almost a blessing she sorted herself out of your life. She doesn't sound like the type of person to stay tied down long and you seem like too good of a person to be dragged down by her. I think I'd be more angry towards her than the guy, regardless of the states of their junk haha.

Arch,
I quite enjoy your inner linguist! And its a good point, of course, but now I might be a little more conscious of my use of jealousy and envy. 

QuoteSorry to hear you ever had to be involved in that situation, I feel like jealousy would be inevitable there. Hopefully this isn't unwanted two cents but maybe in a way its almost a blessing she sorted herself out of your life. She doesn't sound like the type of person to stay tied down long and you seem like too good of a person to be dragged down by her. I think I'd be more angry towards her than the guy, regardless of the states of their junk haha.

Jealousy was inevitable; I was just too "in love" to notice it. Too bad it took me 7 years to see what was going on...oh well. Life is meant to be lived, no use living in the past. I'm getting used to her being gone, really. It's been almost 3 months since we stopping seeing each other. She's living with her baby daddy full time now, in another town about 30 min away, so I don't see her much anymore.

I was angry with her; still have flare ups from time to time. I don't like her bf/baby daddy much, never did even when her and I were open and she was bringing him around a lot...I would talk to him, but he didn't get me being whatever I was....trans, butch, gq, whatever the day may bring. He thought I was a weird dyke and didn't understand why a pretty femme girl would want to be with someone like me.

Live and learn, I suppose.

I think a big heart is more important than a big package anyway, so it's her loss that she passed up on someone who really cared about her to be with someone just because he had a bigger downstairs. 

Quote from: zombieinc on July 15, 2013, 11:26:10 PM
Jealousy was inevitable; I was just too "in love" to notice it. Too bad it took me 7 years to see what was going on...oh well. Life is meant to be lived, no use living in the past. I'm getting used to her being gone, really. It's been almost 3 months since we stopping seeing each other. She's living with her baby daddy full time now, in another town about 30 min away, so I don't see her much anymore.

I was angry with her; still have flare ups from time to time. I don't like her bf/baby daddy much, never did even when her and I were open and she was bringing him around a lot...I would talk to him, but he didn't get me being whatever I was....trans, butch, gq, whatever the day may bring. He thought I was a weird dyke and didn't understand why a pretty femme girl would want to be with someone like me.

Live and learn, I suppose.

I think a big heart is more important than a big package anyway, so it's her loss that she passed up on someone who really cared about her to be with someone just because he had a bigger downstairs. 

Well it's really great to see that you have such a good attitude about it. I'm still sorry you had to deal with that but you seem strong enough to handle it! And yeah, it's definitely her loss, that guy does sound like a massive jerk, to put it lightly. 

Quote from: ForWantOf on July 06, 2013, 09:41:12 PM
Does anybody else suffer from bad jealousy issues? I know we all probably experience dysphoria and can be triggered by certain things, but for me it's like the dumbest and most irrational things set me off really badly. For example, I don't really want to get into the details of the story but I basically saw my girlfriend was talking to another guy. There was no flirting, nothing bad at all, and I recognize this, but I got angry to the point that my body went cold, my face went hot and I was shaking and simply couldn't think rationally anymore. I also have fear of abandonment issues when it comes to dating so it doesn't help, and it really doesn't help that I don't tell my girlfriend these things because I know it pushes people away. I don't want that.

I'm pretty much entirely sure this roots in my insecurities about my birth gender and my body in general, because I see pretty much any other guy as being better than me and more attractive and interesting and so on. I was just wondering if anybody else experiences something like this? I've never read about any other trans individuals being jealous to such an extreme but it still doesn't hurt to ask. Hopefully, I can get some advice on how to control it or even get rid of it, and of course, you can discuss your experiences with jealousy here as well.

Hi there matey,

I have a looootttt to say about jealousy.  Rather than overdo post one, I'll start by saying, I came from being a very jealous young male in my early 20's where just seeing my ex in a car with people would trigger the jealousy.

I have done a *great* deal of jealousy work, and quelled near most of it, and have learned  a whole new language about how to *harness* internal states of jealousy and use them as a *propellant* to become my next best form, and the kind of partner that is emotionally safe to be around and really relationship-building about jealousy.

I'll start by saying that jealousy, ultimately, is not  'race' between you and any 'other'.  Ultimately, it's an internal 'race' or really 'struggle' and the first step I learned was that jealousy was some reflection of the way I saw myself, and not about any other.

I had to learn that first.......does that get you thinking about anything?

cheers
stav