Greetings everybody.

This is my first post on here, and until recently I don't think I would have predicted I would be visiting these forums.

The transgender community is one I have been aware of for many years but have known so very little about. I am a curious being, and it is that curiosity that has exposed me to transgenders. For a long time I knew very little of how much science could do to lead one person to transition completely from one gender to the next, truly fascinating.

However, as fascinating as it is it has created questions for me, questions that until recently I didn't really think needed to be asked. I am talking about my own gender identity. I will spare you the long, drawn out life story, so I shall simply provide you with the facts. And the facts are this:

- I am a 23 year old male (physically and let us assume for now, mentally)
- I was raised by a single mother, with an elder sister for a sibling.
- I had no male role model in my life.
- I have never taken to typical masculine stereotypes and have detested them (cars, football, beer, womanizing, sexism etc)
- During secondary school the majority of my friends were female, as I found boys to be immature, and I could not relate to them, with the exception of a select few.
- During my teens I began to relate more to female characters rather than male ones.
- Also during my teens I came to the conclusion that I genuinely believe women to be the better gender.
- When I play video games I always end up playing women, and it is goes beyond the heterosexual male answers of "they look hot" etc. I feel comfortable playing them, as if it is more natural, almost like an instinct.
- I fantasize about being a female, and find it appealing.
- I am attracted to women, but It goes beyond attraction and mere lust, it is like a desire to be like them rather to have them and it is an adoration of their gender, rather than a shallow objectification.
- I have not, and do not desire to cross dress.
- I do not find overly "feminine" things appealing (lots of makeup, pretty dresses, shoes etc)
- I have been told I am feminine on numerous occasions due to my tastes (such as preference of alcoholic drink, my like of typically girly dramas etc)


I'm sure I could continue on, but this is the core data.

So I suppose where I am going with this is given the information I have provided, does it sound like I may be TG? I had read something somebody said once that anybody who even questions their gender extensively is TG. However, I question many things my friends may never even think about, I simply like to know things. But this is different, this is desire rather than curiosity for information. Normally I can research issues myself and come to my own conclusion, but this is simply too big to decide on my own. I need the opinions of people who live with being transgender.

If you are willing, I would be incredibly grateful for your insights.

Welcome Dreams,

Susan's Place is a great site for personal exploration and support.  You can entertain hundreds of perspectives on issues and concerns of all kinds.  The BIG question of "am I transgender?" is a reoccurring topic here as it is a basic component of our identity.  You will hear that accepting oneself as transgender is frequently a difficult process as some people, like me, can repress that reality for decades.  I have read that the hardest person to "come out" to is ourselves.  Many of us would not be here without a professional transgender therapists assistance.
No one can tell you who you are; there is not definitive "test."  Still many of us have experienced a lifetime of "fascinating" questions and clues about gender that may include dysphoria or not.  Some very stereotypically masculine or feminine characters come out self identified as transgender so our "science" and appearance may not always help.  You likely heard about a Navy Seal coming out as MTF?
Now being just months into my transition, I can say that my experience is amazing and wonderful and 180 degrees from what I had feared.  The dysphoria and self loathing are gone and the journey for me without a definite or binary goal is incredibly revealing.  I love who I am and what I now experience from a very different inside view.  Good luck with your questions and answers.

Tessa James

Quote from: Tessa James on July 20, 2013, 01:23:15 PM
Welcome Dreams,

Susan's Place is a great site for personal exploration and support.  You can entertain hundreds of perspectives on issues and concerns of all kinds.  The BIG question of "am I transgender?" is a reoccurring topic here as it is a basic component of our identity.  You will hear that accepting oneself as transgender is frequently a difficult process as some people, like me, can repress that reality for decades.  I have read that the hardest person to "come out" to is ourselves.  Many of us would not be here without a professional transgender therapists assistance.
No one can tell you who you are; there is not definitive "test."  Still many of us have experienced a lifetime of "fascinating" questions and clues about gender that may include dysphoria or not.  Some very stereotypically masculine or feminine characters come out self identified as transgender so our "science" and appearance may not always help.  You likely heard about a Navy Seal coming out as MTF?
Now being just months into my transition, I can say that my experience is amazing and wonderful and 180 degrees from what I had feared.  The dysphoria and self loathing are gone and the journey for me without a definite or binary goal is incredibly revealing.  I love who I am and what I now experience from a very different inside view.  Good luck with your questions and answers.

Tessa James

Thank you for the warm welcome and advice Tessa.

So really, it is an issue that cannot be definitively defined? So it is up to the individual? That sounds interesting.

To be honest I'm not one to deny the facts that lie before me, so If I did decide that I needed to persue the long road of transition, then I would do so if I believed it was logical. My biggest concern would be fear of ridicule from friends and family, which I am certain many here can relate to.

So you have not found your transition to be daunting?

Oh yes, daunting to be sure.  For me, each step I took confirmed the strength and depth of my transgender identification.  I started out just wanting to cope with my troublesome lifelong secret.  Getting through the denial, repression, fear and self loathing was not easy but who needs all that?  It seems that this is truly a very subjective process; we are talking about basic identity.  I have seen little scorecard kinds of tests but I consider them a bit like astrology--great as a springboard for discussion and discourse about ourselves.
Many of us, however, seem to experience less linear transitions and some will chose to make very tentative steps or resolve to stop at some point.  There are so many variables but you have the advantage of youth and freely available resources for self discovery.  They had not even invented the term transgender when I was a kid and like so many I had no vocabulary or role models for what troubled me.  In those days it was like "too bad, get over it and make the best of what you got"  Who knew we had choices to consider about this?
My experience is that those with the greatest time and investment with us, family etc, are the ones who also are making this challenging transition with us.  Be patient, thoughtful and inclusive if you can.   I could care less about the masses who, for the most part, have their own big deals to worry about and do not impact my personal journey.

Enjoy the ride dear dreamer

One idea I want to respond to is this:

Quote- Also during my teens I came to the conclusion that I genuinely believe women to be the better gender.

If you take a snapshot of the position of men and women at any given time, men on average get more than they deserve.  Societal expectations generally require women to do more to achieve the same reputable status, and they're often squeezed by double standards (for example, expected to be at least as competent at their job but to also put in much more effort into "looking good" and more into taking care of family than men).  Men are also encouraged, by certain forces anyway, to be entitled in matters of sexuality, and to look down on women (or the more effeminate man if/when applicable in a same-sex relationship).  This structure can make someone sympathetic to women and unsympathetic to men.  One roots for the underdog (women shut out of the political power structures), and people may feel like they're supposed to be on that team, to belong on it.

But at the same time, these are societal stereotypes and generalizations, and there is in fact much more at play.  There are men of conscience who navigate beyond the debasing of women (popular in certain cliques / movies / shows) and paternalism (that calls on men to "protect" women, as if they were not fully-capable adults -- popular in fairy tales), but to instead see them as grown-ups with their own hopes and dreams.  Men, like women, are also represented in other underrepresented groups, such as immigrants, GLBTs, racial minorities, and religious minorities, and men in those groups can face just as much discrimination but show just as much integrity (using the United States as an example) as sixth-generation white straight Christian women for the discrimination they face.  But no matter how much one may be sympathetic to underrepresented minorities, one simply cannot become a half-Black half-American Indian immigrant pansexual half-Muslim half-Atheist transwoman (and for kicks, let's say single with four kids, working three part-time jobs, and taking care of her elderly parents) to be the ultimate underappreciated and underrespected person.  It's not our job to bear every burden of discrimination and avoid having the faintest connection to the oppressive the groups -- our job is to fight it as whoever we are, with whatever "oppressive" and "discriminated against" combination of banners we have and are stuck with.

You may in fact be a woman, but you don't have to be a woman to be deserving of respect (Kurt Vonnegut, Albert Einstein, Mahatma Gandhi).  All people of immutable demographics (self-determined gender included) deserve such an opportunity, no matter how much society may oppress them or compel them to be oppressive.  It is rather how they respond (and the context of their response) that is indicative of their character.  Put that way, you can be a good cisman, transwoman, genderfluid, androgyne, genderqueer, whoever, but the main thing is that regardless of the identity, your goal is to be a good person.  Allow your gender identity (and expression) reflect who you are, not who you feel you need to be in order to be a good person, and I think your path will become more clear.

Anyway, good luck with your search.

I think, dreams, if we are going to answer you fundamental question, we have to filter out gender roles and gender expectations (which are largely sociological) from gender identity (which is largely innate).

That is not an easy thing to do, because the society that you grew up in overprints everything.

Welcome Dreams

Honestly, to me You look like You might have serious issues with regard to Your gender - perhaps serious enough to qualify You as transgender. I could subscribe to a lot of points which You made in Your list about You becoming what You are now - with some exceptions, of course, because every person is a unique being (to raise a few, without taking up much space - single child, raised by mother, had no male role model - compiled a lot fictional role models just to get the idea how I should be dealing with different types of situations from male perspective, absolutely no interest in cars/sports/beer etc, picked female characters for computer games, had only a few male friends, minimal cross-dressing experience with no aim for gratification , I still think that overly feminine mannerisms are not natural - just be Yourself and people will perceive You as female....
The only thing which sort of makes me wonder is that You still assuming that You are mentally a male. From Your short "CV" I did not get an impression that You went into deep denial and essentially closeted Your feelings, so this kinda does not stick together. For example, as soon as I realised that my only option was to accept myself for what I am, my male "persona" shattered like a glass and since then I am mentally female. Before that - I was in deep denial and afraid even to remember my biggest childhood and teenage secret - so I would not even seek out this board, not speaking about posting about my issues here (what issues??? I have no issues!).
Unfortunately, I have to stick with others as there is no ultimate test and even a therapist wont give You 100% exact answer. Your therapist would listen to Your story and then try to advise You about Your inner feelings - and as I said - You sound quite confused now and You are posting here... .

P.S. Still, You are definitely a woman, because You are seeking opinions of others about whether You are TG .

To define is to limit. If you have a problem with your gender you're under the trans* umbrella. I wouldn't try too hard to figure out exactly what you are just yet.

I wouldn't say i'm a woman trapped in a man's body. Or anything like that, I just know that if I had a choice I would have been born female.

Whatever your motivation is, just do whatever makes you happy. There isn't a list of specific things you need to have to be trans, the word trans is an incredibly diverse word. It can mean a number of different things.

There's a number of different trans* identities, i'd take a look at them and see if you connect with them at all.

Are you trans?

Hmm You might be more neutral gender than male or female. That's actually one of the possibles though. Some people are ok being neither male or female.

You seem to like being with females, and you seem to sympathize with females, but that alone doesn't make you female.

You seem to not need a lot of female attributes, clothing etc, so it is possible, you might not need to be distinctly female. Nothing wrong with that.

Your body is what you were given at birth, but, it doesn't need to define you. And you don't necessarily need to alter it, if there is nothing in the alteration that does anything for you.

Transitioning from the male form to the female form though is a substantial journey, and you need to really need it to make it worth it to yourself. "Fantasizing' about being female, might just not be enough reason for the effort you would require to go through.

In my case, I am for instance 100% female, but stuck in a 100% male form. Which I think sucks 100%
No iffy aspect for me there. There's nothing about being male looking that appeals to me, and I would much rather be 100% female, even if I had to settle for an ugly version

 Hey, buddy.   I had a really similar experience, but opposite your gender.  I totally get where you're coming from, and I just want you to know that being trans isn't something you will just know, you will feel it, too.  I would recommend some soul searching. Try cross dressing, hang out with some drag queens.   And you know what? maybe you're just a straight gay guy.  That is totally okay, too.

Whether you're trans, gay, straight or bright green, you are a beautiful being with a purpose.  I send my best regards. 

Hi Dreams,
I'd like to share something i found on t-vox.org that I found very useful.

sex
male-----intersex-----female

gender identity
masculine-----androgynous-----feminine

gender expression
man-----neutral-----woman

sexuality
fancy women-----fancy both/neither-----fancy men

so each of us fit somewhere on each of those lines.
using this I figured out that it's actually ok to not be a cross dresser but also feel like my personality is of a more feminine persuasion. or for somebody else it's ok to be a man who likes makeup and jewellery but also feels very comfortable as a man.

I think what each of us need to think about is what specifically is important to us. for me, what I feel is important is helping my body to relocate fat deposits to the right places, reducing the hair growth and reducing my muscles so I can be more 'weak' and needing of cooperation/helping/sharing. that is what I feel will make me feel special and lovely. so that is good for me. and I don't really need to wear dresses or wear makeup or any of that.

Benen, my sense is that Dreams prefers to "play it straight" with clothes.  With "drag queen" in particular, someone in acting out an exaggerated (stereotypical) female role, and while that can be fun for some, it is probably artificial to someone who says "I do not find overly 'feminine' things appealing."  As a mostly-male (and male-bodied bodied) person who does like a certain segment of feminine clothes (think fancy dress, like going to homecoming or being slightly bold at a wedding) but who was turned off by the idea of wearing makeup, lipstick, and lots of jewelry, trying to go (more or less) all-out once felt wrong, and I've stuck with a good dress, shoes, and occasional jewelry ever since.

I recommend trying or entertain ideas that come naturally, without regard to whether they run against social norms.  Allow yourself to be "masculine" and "feminine" (and neither) without concerning yourself with the role you think you are supposed to play.  That said, if one is concerned about not liking "cars, football, beer, womanizing, sexism," I wouldn't look at that as a sign that someone is a woman.  Heaps of men are into none of those things, and many others only go for one of the mostly harmless items (cars, watching football).  Womanizing is basically a form of sexism, and sexism is basically a specific genre of rude behavior, and it doesn't belong in society any more than racism, classism, or anything else of the sort.  It is a type of treatment to be opposed by people of conscience, and while such men and even such women are often reluctant to identify as feminists (it's got a bad rap because of some bad apples and misunderstandings), there are nevertheless women and men who believe in feminism.  On the flip side, I have known women who were into cars (no problem), beer (dicey), and/or sexism (sometimes against men, sometimes against women, and sometimes against both -- seriously).

Hi Dreams ,

Welcome to our little family. Over 12130 . That would be one heck of a family reunion.

Feel free to post your successes/failures, Hopes/dreams.  Ask questions and seek answers. Give and receive advice.

But remember we are family here, your family now. And it is always nice to have another member.

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We are what we believe we are.  Finding a gender therapist would be a good start.  Liking feminine things does not make one female.  It is more about how we think.


Janet  )O(

Thank you everyone for your great replies. You've certainly done a good job of giving me a lot to think about! I think I will begin to persue the possibility of therapy, I will need it to shed further light on things. 

The point has already been made more than once, but can be repeated:  If you are doubting your gender identity you come under the broad umbrella of "trans".  That doesn't mean you are going to transition - that is one of the more extreme outcomes.

When I was young there was no such thing as TG so I came to this late in life.  I'm now an emotionally stable woman and active in society in several ways.  Just to show we are all different, I always wear skirts or dresses, I take care of my jewellery selection to look my best, and if I'm going out for the evening I spend time on my makeup.  I just like to look like a smart mature woman because that's what feels right to me.

Only you can decide where on the many scales you find yourself and a therapist is probably the best route to helping your self discovery.  Be careful choosing one, most don't have a clue and some are violently opposed to the idea.  In the mean time try out your thoughts here and I'm sure people will give you several contradictory opinions!

Quote from: MaryXYX on July 21, 2013, 08:37:06 AM
The point has already been made more than once, but can be repeated:  If you are doubting your gender identity you come under the broad umbrella of "trans".  That doesn't mean you are going to transition - that is one of the more extreme outcomes.

When I was young there was no such thing as TG so I came to this late in life.  I'm now an emotionally stable woman and active in society in several ways.  Just to show we are all different, I always wear skirts or dresses, I take care of my jewellery selection to look my best, and if I'm going out for the evening I spend time on my makeup.  I just like to look like a smart mature woman because that's what feels right to me.

Only you can decide where on the many scales you find yourself and a therapist is probably the best route to helping your self discovery.  Be careful choosing one, most don't have a clue and some are violently opposed to the idea.  In the mean time try out your thoughts here and I'm sure people will give you several contradictory opinions!

Haha well I've often been called extreme! Honestly when I give it a great deal of thought, I see transition as the result of this journey of mine. I may be wrong, but yes I think a therapist is my next stop.

"I see transition as the result of this journey of mine."

That's sounding more and more likely.  I'm just saying talk to a therapist without deciding the outcome in advance.  When I was seeing a therapist I was "confused" and she helped me sort myself out and decide I really was going to transition.