...Scooter Libby's prison sentence?  Was it simply morally wrong and Bush doesn't care or was it an abuse of Presidential power?

Personally I think it was both but I believe it was done because Libby threatened to spill the beans on a lot of other stuff.  Sort of a, "If I got to jail, a lot of people are going with me," type of thing.

Beverly

I thought the whole lot was above the law, now, anyways.

Bush's entire career is a 'whole lotta' morally wrong; yes they're criminals and your guess on the specifics of how this one case works is as good as any, I suppose.

I called Nancy Pelosi's office and said it's time for impeachment to be put back on the table...

I said in a post somewhere that he would never do time and that bush would pardon him...

Everybody so excited that he was convicted....I'm not phased at all. That administration is lawless.

Of all the laws broken, of all the people murdered or maimed, this was the only legal action taken against the administration.

Par for the course.

I'm wondering when we as a people are going to finally stand up to save the constitution?  I suppose it will have to wait until we have another economic depression and the draft has been reinstitued.

Cindi

On second thought, no I don't want to work undercover for the C.I.A.

It reeks of................don't get me started........

I would not at all be surprised if your supposition was indeed the truth.

And I will reiterate: It is my belief that we are well into the incipient stages of the self-destruction of this country and nation.

It is also my belief that the Bush Administration has greatly accelerated and facilitated this process.

Quote from: Cindi Jones on July 03, 2007, 03:32:21 PM
Of all the laws broken, of all the people murdered or maimed, this was the only legal action taken against the administration.

Par for the course.

I'm wondering when we as a people are going to finally stand up to save the constitution?  I suppose it will have to wait until we have another economic depression and the draft has been reinstitued.

Cindi

say ya wanna revolution, we-ell
don't ya know that you can count me out/
IN

and I hate to tell y'all but impeachment of Bush-Cheney was never on Nancy's table. She fails to rep her district which is around 70% for, possibly higher.

ya say ya wanna et cetera...

It will only be a decade or two before China takes its place as the world's superpower.  Perhaps we will become another England or Canada as a peaceful subordinate to another superpower.  However, I truly believe that we would rather self destruct.  It's going to be a very interesting few years.

Cindi

In his time in office, Bush has commuted exactly 4 sentences including Libby's.  He has denied over 1000 petitions and there are over 2000 petitions to commute pending.  Scooter got to go to the head of the line.

Beverly

It's the least that Bush could do for him for taking the fall.  We all knew that Scootie pie wouldn't serve any time didn't we?

Cindi

Well, I think that he should commute.

I mean like, it would save energy.

[ahem]

OK OK, I'm going now.....

i think it's just. granted the Iraq war is horrible. granted there may have even been a conspiracy between dick cheney, libby, and others to distort intelligence of weapons of mass destruction. however, that is not what libby was charged with. he was charged and convicted of perjury, obstruction of justice. 30 months for a first time offender for obstruction of justice? seems excessive to say the least. perhaps the judge was trying to make an example of libby, thats not justice. if they want to punish him for being a part of a conspiracy, then charge him for it. point being the sentence was excessive, overly excessive! president bush didnt overturn his conviction. he simply commuted him from going to jail. i think he did the right thing.

Quote from: Katia on July 05, 2007, 03:34:18 AM
i think it's just. granted the Iraq war is horrible. granted there may have even been a conspiracy between dick cheney, libby, and others to distort intelligence of weapons of mass destruction. however, that is not what libby was charged with. he was charged and convicted of perjury, obstruction of justice. 30 months for a first time offender for obstruction of justice? seems excessive to say the least. perhaps the judge was trying to make an example of libby, thats not justice. if they want to punish him for being a part of a conspiracy, then charge him for it. point being the sentence was excessive, overly excessive! president bush didnt overturn his conviction. he simply commuted him from going to jail. i think he did the right thing.

Well, on this side of the pond, Jonathan Aitken, a former cabinet minister, got three years for perjury. Without honesty and truthfulness government simply cant be held accountable. I don't think thirty months was excessive and I find Bush's interference to be totally corrupt.

Whether you agree with it or not, most of us figured it would be coming.

Before we look to the other guys to save us...where was all the uproar when Bill pardoned Hillary's brother?  I mean, come on.

I say vote for "none of the above"!!  Throw ALL the turkeys out!!

........Laurry

It's nothing new. Every president has done it whether Democrat or Republican.

Gennee

Quote from: Katia on July 05, 2007, 03:34:18 AM
i think it's just. granted the Iraq war is horrible. granted there may have even been a conspiracy between dick cheney, libby, and others to distort intelligence of weapons of mass destruction. however, that is not what libby was charged with. he was charged and convicted of perjury, obstruction of justice. 30 months for a first time offender for obstruction of justice? seems excessive to say the least. perhaps the judge was trying to make an example of libby, thats not justice. if they want to punish him for being a part of a conspiracy, then charge him for it. point being the sentence was excessive, overly excessive! president bush didnt overturn his conviction. he simply commuted him from going to jail. i think he did the right thing.

   There are in fact cases of others who did the exact same thing and who received similar sentences. They've been showing them on sites like huffingtonpost.com

   Kieth Olberman had a fantastic commentary on July 3 msnbc where he very intelligently and forcefully asked the President and his whacky puppetmaster to resign.  It was very well done and without snide remarks.

   The government of this country has become a sewer. (in my opinion)

Posted on: July 06, 2007, 02:11:48 PM

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Quote from: Cindi Jones on July 04, 2007, 01:11:35 AM
It's the least that Bush could do for him for taking the fall.  We all knew that Scootie pie wouldn't serve any time didn't we?

Cindi

He's a pie, alright. [she said threw clenched teeth]

Posted on: July 06, 2007, 02:15:40 PM

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Quote from: Rhonda on July 04, 2007, 09:22:54 AM

Well, I think that he should commute.

I mean like, it would save energy.

[ahem]

OK OK, I'm going now.....

That's actually what I thought the topic of this thread was about. [I'm a chump]

Posted on: July 06, 2007, 02:16:55 PM

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Quote from: Laurry on July 05, 2007, 11:27:08 PM
Whether you agree with it or not, most of us figured it would be coming.

Before we look to the other guys to save us...where was all the uproar when Bill pardoned Hillary's brother?  I mean, come on.

I say vote for "none of the above"!!  Throw ALL the turkeys out!!

........Laurry

I second the nominate for "None".  Where are you NOTA. Raise yo hand!

Quote from: Katia on July 05, 2007, 03:34:18 AM
i think it's just. granted the Iraq war is horrible. granted there may have even been a conspiracy between dick cheney, libby, and others to distort intelligence of weapons of mass destruction. however, that is not what libby was charged with. he was charged and convicted of perjury, obstruction of justice. 30 months for a first time offender for obstruction of justice? seems excessive to say the least. perhaps the judge was trying to make an example of libby, thats not justice. if they want to punish him for being a part of a conspiracy, then charge him for it. point being the sentence was excessive, overly excessive! president bush didnt overturn his conviction. he simply commuted him from going to jail. i think he did the right thing.

Do you have any like crimes and sentencing to compare this to? Correct me if I'm wrong but obstruction of justice at this level is called a high crime. Heads have rolled in history for less.

Having one's secretary lie and perjure and distort and obfuscate and obstruct to support an action that is based on lies and distortion, etc, hello, this is all of a piece. If this is the cog in the wheel that has become actionable against, in this system, action should occur according to the jurisprudence that is in place. Iraq Wars don't happen without Scooter Libbys. Even if it's only symbolic, something's got to give.

But, as I said, they are all to be considered above this set of checks and balances, aren't they.

And also! considering what information I have regarding the penal system, I'd say that 30 mos in Federal is a light sentence considering the gravity of the crimes.

---

Quote from: Laurry on July 05, 2007, 11:27:08 PM

I say vote for "none of the above"!!  Throw ALL the turkeys out!!

Ya know considering the last place I voted was SF CA, and the Rep of that district is one Nancy Pelosi, and that the district is overwhelmingly in favor of impeachment of both Bush and Dick, and that that option is never gonna be on the table as they say in the trade, I think voting for anything other than None of the above is a joke.

At least here we got the Green Party (protest vote) as an option.

Beverly,

I believe Bush thinks he is righteous regarding all his actions.  He has already added justices to the supreme court to influence decisions in favor of "Bushgonomics" long after he leaves.

Hey Bush has a brother named Jeb and soon the Bush dynasty can rule for another 8 years and pardon other  cronies.
..........

The recent pardon by Bush stirs little emotion in me.  Bush is very powerful and he uses his power.

I am interested in the U.S. doing things to improve the health of the population by doing preventive health care.  If you change the oil regularly on your car the engine will last a long time.

Bush still has several more months to amaze the general population.

Well personally I think Bush is going to shoot himself in the foot by pardoning Libby. If the fine and the jail time are the punishment for the crime, then Bush needs to back off.