Alrighty, I figured I"d be a bit more open since I"m new to both the forum (I'm more active in IRC) and TS in general. So, let me lay out my background: I was a bit feminine at a younger age, cried that I wasn't a girl really young, it left me along for an upwards of like 12 years for the most part. Not too many issues. I grew up as a nerd, hung out with girls, they made more sense until puberty, then I kept my distance due to my feelings (I'm attracted to women btw). As I grew up through HS, I became a serious computer geek, started learning programming, got into comp networking, and am going for a degree in CompSci (networking and programming are important as I'm not completely sure what to do). I got a gf, got jobs, was in comm college and gearing up to transfer to a uni...and....boom. I had read a bit about ->-bleeped-<- before and being the natural debater, I had a few nice debates in which I took an ignorant stance, the debates inwardly bothered me for some reason. Skip ahead a few months, I read across different material and I felt like I had been hit with a brick. I read descriptions and compared with my life...correlations between descriptions and my life popped up and multiplied in number.

At this point, I pretty much was freaking out in more of a, "No..nonononono, I've got WAY too much going for me...this was supposed to be gone a long time ago." I pretty much entered panic mode. It made way too much sense and I was just getting my life ironed out. I started researching transitioning and starting talking with people to confirm a few things. More things just kinda fell into place at that point. I have quite a few connections in the LGBT groups and I get along with them pretty well, I never really knew why, but they were easier to talk to. I researched transitioning, its effects, how society sees TS mtf in general...and I nearly lost it. I told myself I'd never transition, I could handle it, I had never had much of a problem up until now, No..I'll live as a well-off IT with a loving gf, a resume on its way before I"m even in a uni, play with robotics, study neuroscience, travel to a few countries, and enjoy my life. The week following me promising myself that was horrible. I hardly got sleep, my appetite decreased by about 20%, my normally high libido hit ground-0, and my stomach felt like it was always inhabited by butterflies. I didn't feel depressed, but something wasn't right. I could ignore it, right? I saw the signs, I had never been truly like this in my entire life.

The longer it went, the more I realized that I may not have a choice. I sat down, I introspected as far as I could possibly go (I have an active interest in psychology, it's a saving grace sometimes). Long story short, emotions were dead-set on this with my logical side holding twice its own weight in reasons that it'd completely ruin my life. I'm heavily sensitive to the opinion of others, so being judged by an entire society is quite a hefty order for someone like me. I ended up cutting a deal with my mind that I couldn't take action right now for various reasons and when I could, I'd reevaluate the situation to see if transition would be a viable option and worth it in the end. As it stands, I'm nearly finished with the week after cutting this deal. I can sleep again, my appetite is still down but hey, I don't have to worry about weight, and butterflies have subsided somewhat. I've been watching my own body language and I naturally have a bit of feminine ways of doing things. I've tried playing with it and increasing in classes and I'm getting a weird enjoyment out of it. My gf was mocking me and called something I did feminine, once again, I got a strange rush of pride. Funnily enough, I have found women to be very easy to socialize and make friends with when one has a dead libido.

I kinda have a basic direction at this point, but I'm still feeling a bit lost. On transition, my family and likely a large chunk of my friends would likely abandon me. I'm a little bit confused at this point, but I feel a little better. Since I have to play the waiting game for about a year and a half, recommendations? Am I making the right choice? Am I just completely delusional? I can still laugh and joke on a day-to-day basis, but I feel like this is stuck in the back of my mind to prod me if I haven't thought about it in a little bit.

Hi there Take a deep breath, and let me be the first to tell you that you are not alone.

I haven't posted here very often, and I certainly haven't ever told my 'story' to anyone so this might get a little long, please bear with me. But after reading your post (actually, I almost replied to your post in Chrystal's topic, but refrained not to derail the thread), I just had to post - because your words resonates with my own experiences so clearly, at times it feels as though you could be describing my own teenage years!

Let me just start by saying that while growing up, I had many of the same experiences that you describe. Though I don't recall my early years very well, I did later hang out with more of the 'nerd' crowd.. I didn't have many female friends, I was drawn to computers, roleplaying, etc... and I wasn't very feminine, which could mean that I was just good at pretending, more tomboyish, not trans at all or.. oh, this really isn't easy at all, is it?

I am currently 25 years old, and a good way through my degree in Data Engineering (I started on CompSci as well, but it was too boring for me haha), which is certainly a male dominated field. Looking back though, I mostly just followed what was expected of me.. I liked computers, I got a technical high school degree (we have a different system here) and started studying 'something to do with computers'.

I think I was 12 or 13 the first time I put 'gender change' into google and realized that it was actually possible.. so I cannot ever have been very comfortable with my gender. I have probably been drawn to trans resources online every few months since then, always guiltily pulling away, as the idea of transitioning seemed so impossible, so surreal, it was a dream and nothing more.

From lurking on this site for years, I know that for some of us the answers are very clear cut. Transition, or suicide. But for most of us, it's not that 'easy' (did I just use that word?).. and we will forever be haunted by doubts, no matter what we do. Can I live the rest of my life as male?.. at this point, I think probably.. but every year, every month, my dysphoria seems to get worse, which makes me think that maybe I shouldn't. I am also terrified of 'ignoring' it, 'macho' it up, perhaps even get married.. and realize in 20 years that I am at the 'transition or suicide' stage, with far more obligations, and having to 'look back' and wish I had done it 20 years ago.

My biggest fear with coming out is having to confront my parents, because I am sure they will protest 'We have known you your entire life, there is no way you can be trans! Your room was always a mess (^_^) and you are a geek, what girl does that?!' - okay maybe not exactly that, but you get the point. And I don't have any answers, because what if they are right? What if this is all in my head, and I am simply delusional?

Also, I don't really think our habits, interests, friends etc. determines whether our 'inner' personality matches that of a male or a female. Most of it likely comes from social expectations and I certainly don't believe that cis females are in any way less inclined or able to pursue technical fields, or be 'computer geeks' - only that expectations and interests elsewhere often makes it a less attractive option.

Sorry for all the rambling! I suppose the TL;DR version would be that you are not the only one searching, not the only one with doubts. I can still hardly believe that I am going as far as I am, and actually exploring my feelings to the degree that I am. Because let me be honest, this entire thing terrifies me. I think that is normal, but it also gives me great great respect for those further along in their transition because I am not sure if I have the courage.

Oh, and like you I have been called girlish jokingly before (I have somewhat long hair with a male cut and use a straightening iron every day - otherwise it curls like crazy ^^) and rather than make me uncomfortable, it just makes me smile inwardly with a warm feeling.. so I think perhaps that should be taken as a sign that we are on the right track?

I think the question you both have to ask yourself is not whether or not you are trans, that is really irrelevant as it is self-diagnosed and a non-trans person could certainly be feminized with hormones. If you are into forced femme erotica, you know the stories. So, how would you feel if you started changing into a female and everyone treated you like a girl. How would you feel if you were waiting for a trrain and guys come up to you and hit on you. Or random men say Hi to you or feel the need to tell you to smile, as if it is your job to make the world pretty. How would you feel losig all your male privilege. And every male has it. I didn't think I did but I am treated way differnt by people and men especially will dismiss me or treat me like i am stupid. if you get mad, you are a hytserical female. So it's a big change.

Plus what if you don't pass. Not everyone is that strong that they can transition and not pass. I have passing privilege and it's grreat but it's not all roses and butterflies. I wish I didn't have to do this but i am pretty young and 9 years out college and I simply could not go on and I have thought about this forever.

But i lovelovelove being female. But i imagine if you are not  dysphoric or not trans at all and you transition that would be a nightmare. I mean I have heard some guys tsalk about if they were goignto get revenge on someone they would force them to get a sex change. There is nothing worse to a male then being female and weak, frail and pretty.

Don't just think of the upsides like being pretty and wearing fun clothes. I imagine it must be really hard for trans lesbians as there must be a lot of cognitive dissonance going on being attracted to someone and being jealous too. Plus if you are repulsed by men and you are not used to being hit one, when a guy comes up and gets all handsy and clearly wants to have sex with you, that cant be fun. I love men and I don't like it when they get all handsy but it doesn't repulse me. Also, the treatment is pretty irreversible. Or can be. You could do this for a year an decide it was a mistake but you can't go back. I pretty much am stuck looking female unless I get surgery. Wow, I just got the weirdest de ja vu that I said this before and have done this before.

Noiro, you almost sound like a young version of me .

I would like to give you some advice though... While I'm sure you know that only you can figure out your own direction, perhaps there are many more paths in front of you than you may know. Certainly that's the reason you feel lost as you say. It's a normal reaction and good sign .

Just take your time! Go slow and learn all about yourself. There's no rush, and you seem to have a great attitude and are approaching this with calm and openness. That's so important, and means you'll end up at the right place regardless. So please relax and feel comfortable in just knowing that you will figure this out in time any which way. There's no deadline, and no short-cut. But there is a wealth of knowledge and support out there as you've found already.

On the feeling of abandonment, I had much the same fears. But I promise, people will surprise you! While we tend to fear the worst, it rarely happens. Of all the people in my life ( I'm out to everyone ), I've lost two... My former girlfriend, and one brother. All other family and friends are still in my life and support me fully. So please, try your best to keep this out of your thoughts for now. It's not a rational fear, and ultimately can't factor much in whatever you path you take.

Quote from: Joanna Dark on August 30, 2013, 02:09:08 PM
I think the question you both have to ask yourself is not whether or not you are trans, that is really irrelevant as it is self-diagnosed and a non-trans person could certainly be feminized with hormones. If you are into forced femme erotica, you know the stories. So, how would you feel if you started changing into a female and everyone treated you like a girl. How would you feel if you were waiting for a trrain and guys come up to you and hit on you. Or random men say Hi to you or feel the need to tell you to smile, as if it is your job to make the world pretty. How would you feel losig all your male privilege. And every male has it. I didn't think I did but I am treated way differnt by people and men especially will dismiss me or treat me like i am stupid. if you get mad, you are a hytserical female. So it's a big change.

Plus what if you don't pass. Not everyone is that strong that they can transition and not pass. I have passing privilege and it's grreat but it's not all roses and butterflies. I wish I didn't have to do this but i am pretty young and 9 years out college and I simply could not go on and I have thought about this forever.

But i lovelovelove being female. But i imagine if you are not  dysphoric or not trans at all and you transition that would be a nightmare. I mean I have heard some guys tsalk about if they were goignto get revenge on someone they would force them to get a sex change. There is nothing worse to a male then being female and weak, frail and pretty.

Don't just think of the upsides like being pretty and wearing fun clothes. I imagine it must be really hard for trans lesbians as there must be a lot of cognitive dissonance going on being attracted to someone and being jealous too. Plus if you are repulsed by men and you are not used to being hit one, when a guy comes up and gets all handsy and clearly wants to have sex with you, that cant be fun. I love men and I don't like it when they get all handsy but it doesn't repulse me. Also, the treatment is pretty irreversible. Or can be. You could do this for a year an decide it was a mistake but you can't go back. I pretty much am stuck looking female unless I get surgery. Wow, I just got the weirdest de ja vu that I said this before and have done this before.

Alrighty Joanna. Your opinion kind of agrees but sorta disagrees with mine. Because of this and your articulation of your thought processes, I'd like to see a bit more of your perspective. Firstly though, I'd like to clarify a few things and have a few things clarified to see if your opinion gets altered any and just so we're on the same page.

Firstly, I'll address your first questions.

I think the question you both have to ask yourself is not whether or not you are trans, that is really irrelevant as it is self-diagnosed and a non-trans person could certainly be feminized with hormones.
I agree. This is actually the very question I'm having trouble answering with absolute certainty. I meant for my post to come across as such, but if it didn't, I am saying it here. While I'm finding certain things such as getting random bursts of joy being called feminine doing something, to being completely capable of building a friend circle of 5 girls in a class when my libido is completely dead (it has been since I found out for some reason), I'm still unsure if all of this is temporary or if it will pass. What I will clarify on this point is that I have one and a half years left until I even have the option to see a therapist. That being said, I'm kinda of the impression that hopefully by that point, either all this will have faded into the backdrop to be a weird phase of my life, or dyspheria will have escalated to the point that I'll be absolutely certain. Curiously, where did you interpret my words to mean I did not think of the severity of transition? It's the very thought of transition and the consequences of it that have me incredibly afraid. I hate being negatively judged. If I transitioned, it would be emotional hell for me. But if what I"m feeling intensifies over time (which I'll find out), that will become an emotional hell unless I do something about it. Transition would just plague me until I could get to a point where I could pass, blend in, get SRS (it'd be a personal thing as half of this is because I wish I had female genitalia over my male), and at least try to level things out with changing legal papers, and awkward explanations to employers, etc.

How would you feel if you were waiting for a trrain and guys come up to you and hit on you?
Since I'm not entirely sure how my perspective will change over time, I can't guarantee perfect accuracy, but I will say that at least in the beginning after transition, I'd be completely flattered. Unless something changes, I still am attracted to women, so I'd likely make up a reason such as I'm taken or such, but I'd internally be fairly happy (and given that transition would eat my self-esteem, happy may well be an understatement).

Or random men say Hi to you or feel the need to tell you to smile, as if it is your job to make the world pretty.
Depends on how they do it. If it is done as a compliment, I'd feel great knowing I actually pass and that I'm attractive! If they are being jerkbags about it, I'd likely find a way to ignore or worst case, walk away. Considering the risks of transition, that wouldn't be anything.

How would you feel losig all your male privilege.
I'll be completely honest and say that I"m still not entirely sure what all includes male privilege, so there are likely some things I will miss. If you have a list compiled that you've experienced, I"ll take it. Understand I"m a natural introvert and transition won't take that away. Going out in public is going to be something I do with purpose and reason. It is for those purposes and reasons that I at least hope to minimize jerkbaggy guys.

Plus if you are repulsed by men and you are not used to being hit one, when a guy comes up and gets all handsy and clearly wants to have sex with you, that cant be fun.
Err...can you clarify where you got that vibe that I"m repulsed by men? I'm not sure I"m sexually attracted to them, but I can get along with them just fine. If a guy wants to get handsy in the places I'd be, society wouldn't be too happy about that, I tend to avoid bars and parties. I'm so ticklish someone would likely notice and he'd back off. Even cis women find that annoying.


But anyway Joanna, please don't take this as a personal attack by any means. I'm simply adding data to the points you provided, and I'd really like your opinion on what I gave. If you need more information, feel free to ask.

Quote from: Joanna Dark on August 30, 2013, 02:09:08 PM
There is nothing worse to a male then being female and weak, frail and pretty.

Just wanted to pop in again and say that while I really liked your post Joanna, I think ^ is juust a little stereotypical, and if it is really true, there wouldn't be anyone here with doubts. We should all transition right away!

That being said, I wish you the best of luck with figuring out your situation Noiro. I liked your well thought out response and identify with many of the same feelings - I think you are better than me at putting them into words without rambling. I do think it's a little ironic that most of the questions asked by Joanna have to do with guys, but I suppose it gets to the point ^^

Hope you don't mind if I follow the thread, as your situation seems very similar to mine. I would say though that from personal experience, with what you have said, I don't think it will fade. I think what you really need to figure out is if it is something you want, or something you need. If the former, you have the choice to suppress it... I mean, I am sure I am not the only one who goes to bed every night with the fervent wish to wake up cis-female (and I'm an atheist.. go figure). Unfortunately that's probably not going to happen, and you have already identified that transitioning is not without its share of problems (bit of an understatement).

Hi Noiro and everyone else!

Your's is a similar situation to mine too, except that I didn't have female friends when I was young as I didn't identify with them, I just felt alienated from male friends, especially after puberty. Right now I'm thinking I'm crazy to even consider tweaking with my body, as it carries such stigma and risk. As for choice, there is still a choice - a choice between two undesirable decisions. Perhaps you may fee like more of an optimist than I, so there may only be one negative choice for you.

I'm trying to lock-down my thinking by continuing to respond to my dilly dallying around and confusion by issuing my only two options in their stark truth - Don't identify as feminine and take any hormones. Become ever more masculine and bald, and make it harder to look good in anything pretty, and also cease to ever have full emotions and body sensitivity agan.

OR

Identify, comes to terms with being a "failed man" in the eyes of society. Take some hormones, screw up my fertility and sex drive to whatever degree. Potentially become more of the person I feel inside, and potentially find it easier to be accepted as feminine due to increase in female attributes.

Those are the choices. Every time I wonder if there's another way, or whether I should ignore the problem, I always tell myself, "NO!" These are the choices, and the outcomes, and so this issue doesn't occur later down the line when Im married etc -  decide now whilst there's still time to address the issues with relatively little collatoral damage. This approach helps to prioritise and make me think ever more clearly and seriously about these options and their outcomes.

I don't know if that will help you, but its working for me. All the best! :-)

P.S - as for being dainty and delicate :-p LOL. I'm quite a petite guy, so right now I'm pretty delicate, and as a man that's a pretty rubbish thing to be. Had I been a girl, I'd be petite and delicate and reap the social rewards. I've never had much in the way of male privelege and as I'm viewed as inferior to other men. I love it when guys check me out from far away and think I'm a girl and I'd love it if they still thought I was when close up. Being attractive and pretty is a form of power, a quite intoxicating form of power. I'd welcome that.

See, I think a lot of people on these forums don't believe they have (had) male privilege but you do if you are presenting male. (I include myself in this statement. or did. I neither do nor can present male.). Just like females have female privilege. I think it is the term privilege that throws it off. All it really means is you are treated and expected to act in a certain way. I don't take it as the radfem colonizing and rpaing women's bodies defintion of it. That's ridonkulous.

Once you pass that changes. And all I am really saying is that that is a big part of transition. I tend to default and expect most posters here to like women as it seems the majority of trans women are lesbians, which is fine, I like women a little. But, and I really hope I don't come off as arrogant, my BF tends to tell me that I do sometimes, if you have passing privilege and are pretty having a man in a not so great part of town hit on you very aggressively, and this happens, quickly turns from flattering to frightening. I know this because it happened to me. And I can not defend myself at 5'5.5 (if I slouch 5'4) and 128 lbs.

I feel like I am making transtion sound bad and I certainly don't feel that way. My life is one million times better (it's been scientifically proven) since I started hormones. But I simply didn't expect to pass so fast and to have to deal with men in this manner. I just didn't. I mean a lot of the stuff on this board is from problems of not passing but I can assure you  my problems are very real and scary as sometimes I feel like I have been thrown into this world way too fast.

The other day I was in the bathroom, and this woman started talking to me and luckily I have always had close female friendships so speaking to women is as is easy as opening a door I simply don't have to think I just do it. But what if I didn't know how, what if I didn't pass so well and what if I still had this body? Most women can beat me up too. Remember that trans woman who was nearly beaten to death in Baltimore?

I'm really lucky and I know it and I'm grateful. But the reason I pass so well is also the same reason I landed in the hospital because I was the victim of assaults for being a ->-bleeped-<- five times in the last decade. Everything has a price.

Please remember I don't edit what I write I just write it like I'm talking. Also, the the OP, I really think you are trans and it's not going away. Most cis males do not like or get a thrill from being called feminine. But the question you have ask yourself is will transition make my life better? Will it? It's made my life a million times better. But then again I really like men and am pretty femme in personality so there is that. I feel like if this happened to someone who wasn't like me it would be the absolute worse thing imaginable. It would be like be becoming masculine and gaining muscles and losing my shape. ACK! *shivers down spine* Having facial hair is bad enough. Bleh. Oh and the penis. Bleh. Double bleh.