Quote from: Thundra on July 07, 2007, 12:38:50 AM

QuoteI can see your points Laura and Thundra, but while you and I are fortunate enough to afford our surgeries, many are not. The US is behind. Programs such as the NHS in the UK and whatever the system is called in Canada may have their faults, but having to wait a few years for treatment is far better than getting no treatment at all because you don't have the money.
HRT and SRS should not be elective, should not be a privilege like cosmetic surgery is, it should be a necessity. In many cases it has been life-saving. It's time the US got on the ball with this.

Whoa!  Hold on a minute here Cochese, before I blow my top. Let's go back a minute.

I totally agree with what YOU are saying. Laura and I have butted heads on this point more than once as I recall.

I stand corrected. 

i'm in the U.K and hoping to win the lottery or something similar in order to find the money for transition.

I'm long term TS but unforunitely didn't get any support pr help through the U.K NHS system and so it's up to me to find the financial funds as and when I can...

There's always doing your homework by researching the costs of the transition-related health care. Since I am now considered to be taking hormones, that took almost hundreds of dollars of research to find out what the best course of transition-related treatement.

Let's face it, it should not matter if you can afford transition-related medical expenses. It is simply a matter of finding the right price (and in many cases the lower price.) And what I think about the government is doing to the needs of transgendered men and women. What ain't right about transition related health care isn't right for transmen and transwomen (thus we live in a homophobic society here in America.) What ain't right about M2Fs and F2M's isn't right for health care. And what ain't right about health care isn't good for "Old Glory."

Peronally, since I am M2F, the only two transition related surgeries I would need to undergo are Facial Feminization Surgery and M2F Orchiectomy. Worst case scenario, they will cost me about $5,000 (or less) if I make the right decisions.

I was just E-mailed this from FFS-support website about the cost of revision Rhonplasty that by the statistics, a minimum of 10 percent of us will require.

Hi

Dr Denenberg quoted me for revision rhinoplasty $18 000 + anaesthesiologist fee, medication & hospital fee & lab tests & other expenses.

He was recommended by a friend ...

goodluck

----- Original Message ----
From: pirjokaasinen <pirjokaasinen@ yahoo.co. uk>
To: ffs-support@ yahoogroups. com
Sent: Saturday, July 7, 2007 12:45:59 PM
Subject: [ffs-support] Re: Rhinoplasty: Nose surgery questions

I must confess, I do not have this kind of money for only one of the many surgeries I have had and will need to have, and I am not poor, but fare from rich. This E-mail frightens me very much!!!

By the way, the proposed solution to paying for SRS by postponing the surgery until you get an education is, in my opinion, highly questionable. First, not all of us can to afford to go to college, or able to get into a decent school. Second, an unspoken truth about college in America is that a very large number of those that start college never graduate. Third, the real pay off for going to college has been declining for years, as measure by the real purchasing power of what you earn with a college degree. This goes doubly for funding the cost of plastic surgery. Fourth, most graduating from college will have major student loans to pay off for many years after graduating school. Fifth, the older you start your transition, the more expensive and complicated it is to achieve. Ideally, transitioning should be done as young as possible, before college age.

But, even for most college graduates in America, spending $18,000 for a second Rhonplasty would be unrealistic. As fare as America, being the land of economic opportunity, it generally is fare from that for the majority of transsexuals. They are more likely to experience unemployment and under employment related directly to prejudges and discrimination. Just in San Francisco alone transsexuals, on average earn a whopping $15,000 less a year than the general population and this is San Francisco!!! Yes, if American is the land of opportunity, one must ask, opportunity for who? Certainly America is not the land of justice and equality for all!!!!

Godiva

If someone's belief system tells her she is going to be poor than certainly that is what she is going to be. OTOH if one believes that she is going to do whatever it takes to get this thing done, that is what she is going to do. With all the advantages that young women have over those born in the baby boom generation, there is simply no excuse for not finding a pathway to transition. There is always a way, all one has to do is become focused on that goal and become determined that nothing is going to stand in her way.

It amazes me how so many of us on this site actually conform to the rules society as placed on us.
Although we break the rules or "the Norm" everyday by being ourselves

The title: If you are transsexual and poor in the United States you are doomed!!!!

I disagree with.

Being a Transexual who was born poor and I do mean poor as in housing project poor I seem to have made it through transitioning. All though a hard time time being without a lot of currency there are always "legal" ways around everything!

I have never been to a psychatrist..(except for employment screening) and still received HRT through a well respected MD.

My Drivers License clearly says Female although I never had any type of paper work to correct this
( a very nice woman at the DMV just looked at me and said let me correct this typo in the system!) true story

I know friends and ex-lovers who are Plastic surgeons who will "help out" my TS friends and bill on a "sliding scale"

I know (and have worked for) non-profit state and governemnt funded clincs that offer assistance to poor - low income Transgender individuals often with no charge to them.


My bottom line is
where there is a will...there definitly is a way
regardless of the system we live in and the rules society sets into play for us by the so called normal people of society.
YES, I was poor, a hood rat, ghetto, whatever the case or class but was I DOOMED?
only if I let myself be doomed.
But a sista wasn't trying to go out like that. Niether was I about to lay my life down and conform to what the rules and society said that a person like me and in my "Social Status" was capable of
You just have to decide in your mind how important Actually Living your life is to you!

DOOMED I THINK NOT

Only if you believe and always yourself to be doomed!

QuoteBy the way, the proposed solution to paying for SRS by postponing the surgery until you get an education is, in my opinion, highly questionable. First, not all of us can to afford to go to college, or able to get into a decent school. Second, an unspoken truth about college in America is that a very large number of those that start college never graduate. Third, the real pay off for going to college has been declining for years, as measure by the real purchasing power of what you earn with a college degree. This goes doubly for funding the cost of plastic surgery. Fourth, most graduating from college will have major student loans to pay off for many years after graduating school. Fifth, the older you start your transition, the more expensive and complicated it is to achieve. Ideally, transitioning should be done as young as possible, before college age.

But, even for most college graduates in America, spending $18,000 for a second Rhonplasty would be unrealistic. As fare as America, being the land of economic opportunity, it generally is fare from that for the majority of transsexuals. They are more likely to experience unemployment and under employment related directly to prejudges and discrimination. Just in San Francisco alone transsexuals, on average earn a whopping $15,000 less a year than the general population and this is San Francisco!!! Yes, if American is the land of opportunity, one must ask, opportunity for who? Certainly America is not the land of justice and equality for all!!!!

All very true!  Especially for young people that never have established a financial stake as the wrong gender. They operate in a different world than people that educate themselves and become successful living as the wrong gender, and then use that $$$ to change genders.

QuoteIf someone's belief system tells her she is going to be poor than certainly that is what she is going to be. OTOH if one believes that she is going to do whatever it takes to get this thing done, that is what she is going to do. With all the advantages that young women have over those born in the baby boom generation, there is simply no excuse for not finding a pathway to transition. There is always a way, all one has to do is become focused on that goal and become determined that nothing is going to stand in her way.

Also very true!  You absolutely must take full advantage of the few opportunities that might present themselves to you.

Look. This is not an either/or situation. That should be the point -- the focus. Fantasizing about getting out of a bad situation will leave you older and no closer to where you need to be. Only hard work and determination will get you there. You have to take baby steps to get started with anything. Work the system, and work your ass off to make $$$. And in your "spare time," educate yourself. That is the reality of the modern world.

When I lived in the states (Vegas) for a year in 1999, I couldn't believe what it was like. It made me really appreciate Canada. Although Canada isn't perfect, nor is the health care system, it has a good start.

I feel pretty bad for my US friends who have a difficult time affording SRS, as well as other things like Laser and FFS.

SRS isn't universally covered in Canada. Most provinces do not cover it, or do not provide any actual funding or a means to get SRS in a real time frame. Several provinces have "de-listed" SRS from Health Care funding. So, there are plenty of Canadians who do not get funding, or wait for years and years going no where. Canada is also home to the Clarke Centre (Ontario), which, from what I hear, wasn't a great place to go to get funding in Ontario. Ontario, btw, is one of the provinces who has de-listed coverage.

The only province that I'm aware of that fully covers SRS is Alberta. They only cover SRS in Montreal (Bassard/Manard) except for certain medical cases. I have a friend, for example, who has diabetes, and Montreal will not take her -- so she is going to Arizona to see Meltzer. They also cover the cost of travel. They don't cover, however, Laser, FFS, breast augmentations, and so on.

The process here has a waiting list. It can be a long process, but the average is about two years from the time you start living full-time. A lot of it depends on how well adjusted you are and luck. Some people get things done quickly, while others wait for years. I've heard of people waiting much more than two years. The other option, of course, is to pay for your own surgery.

I'm already in the process and hopefully my funding application will get in this Summer, and approved by the end of this year. I'm very lucky that laser has worked for me, and lucky that I don't need FFS or an adam's apple shave, etc. I just need a new hair cut... my hair is all fried and full of split ends.

I couldn't imagine how hopeless I'd feel if I had to pay for everything from my own pocket, including SRS.

I know I'm going to step on some feet here but I'll post anyways.

The medical industry in the USA is a business like any other. Prices are going up because of the jive-medical insurance industry and screwball doctors and screwy lawyers and dingbat politicians. I'd say about 50 - 70% of the 'medical industry" is nothing more than paper pushers and people who drive around in Hummers and F350s claiming to be "medical sales representatives". I know this because my mother works as middle management at a hospital and most hospitals are run like...garbage. These surgeons asking for 15k - 18k for surgery, they certainly will fight anyone offering it for 2k or 3k. They'll make up excuses from "they aren't certified" or "we have specialists on demand here" or some other hokey reason. I personally don't respect the medical establishment that much since much of it is quack fu medicine anyways. (Have you ever seen the malpractice rate of doctors?)

QuoteIf you are transsexual and poor in the United States you are doomed!!!!

Golly, I make exactly $13,450 annually, a fixed income on social security. Assuredly I qualify as poor, but I had no idea, no idea at all that I am doomed.

Here I thought that I was happy, what ever should I do?   

QuoteI know I'm going to step on some feet here but I'll post anyways.

Right on!  Some people need their feet stepped on.

Nice post too.

Quote from: Berliegh on July 07, 2007, 02:09:33 AM
i'm in the U.K and hoping to win the lottery or something similar in order to find the money for transition.

I'm long term TS but unforunitely didn't get any support pr help through the U.K NHS system and so it's up to me to find the financial funds as and when I can...

Care to go into more detail?

Quote from: Mawd on July 08, 2007, 01:59:12 PM

Quote from: Berliegh on July 07, 2007, 02:09:33 AM
i'm in the U.K and hoping to win the lottery or something similar in order to find the money for transition.

I'm long term TS but unforunitely didn't get any support or help through the U.K NHS system and so it's up to me to find the financial funds as and when I can...

Care to go into more detail?

Yes I can Mawd, I have done several times on this site. I spent 6 years attending a clinic in the NHS GIC system in the U.K (2001 - 2007) and wasn't able to access any treatment though the NHS. The NHS is a kind of tax we pay towards our own healthcare in the U.K and according to the medics there are facilities for treatment of gender dysphoria through the NHS.

After 2 years of begging the NHS GIC clinic for hormones I eventually went to see a private consultant to start on them. The same happened with my requests for 4 referrals, I was denied everything. The clinic aknowledged that I complied with the HBSOC and their own protocol, had been living RLT for over 4 years yet I was denied any form of treatment without explanation. My health authority (PCT) are now looking inro this case on my behalf as they have lost £1,000 a year on sending me to a clinic which did not facilitate treatment but instead chose to profit from my health authority and other health authorities.

I am now slowly working my way through private treatment which is very expensive. I have lost 6 years of my life and I am seeking legal advice. I reported the clinic to the Healthcare Commisssion, Department of health and various other legal bodies who are now looking into this case and many others like it.

Weird. Was this charring cross?

The NHS is not like that with everyone though.

Quote from: Mawd on July 16, 2007, 02:34:07 AM
Weird. Was this charring cross?

The NHS is not like that with everyone though.

It was indeed Charing Cross GIC....the NHS might not be like they have been with me with everyone but a petition with 800 signature's says otherwise..

weird, they must have just not liked you, I know a fair few people who went through them fine at that time.

I know they can be right pricks some time but they were not completely and utterly useless for everyone.

Quote from: melissa90299 on July 07, 2007, 10:16:17 AM
If someone's belief system tells her she is going to be poor than certainly that is what she is going to be. OTOH if one believes that she is going to do whatever it takes to get this thing done, that is what she is going to do. With all the advantages that young women have over those born in the baby boom generation, there is simply no excuse for not finding a pathway to transition. There is always a way, all one has to do is become focused on that goal and become determined that nothing is going to stand in her way.

Exactly.  "There is simply NO excuse for not finding a pathway to transition"

tink

P.S.  Cookie time again, Melissa!

Quote from: melissa90299 on July 07, 2007, 10:16:17 AM
If someone's belief system tells her she is going to be poor than certainly that is what she is going to be. OTOH if one believes that she is going to do whatever it takes to get this thing done, that is what she is going to do. With all the advantages that young women have over those born in the baby boom generation, there is simply no excuse for not finding a pathway to transition. There is always a way, all one has to do is become focused on that goal and become determined that nothing is going to stand in her way.

I agree Melissa and you are the prime example of someone who has been able to set her goals and achieve them.  I once met a young FTM who worked three menial jobs for three years and saved everything he made.  He paid for the complete surgery on his own.

There are of course exceptions and extenuating circumstances in many cases (like supporting your kids which should take a higher priority).

Still, we need to aim high and work towards those goals.  Don't plan to fail.  Plan to succeed!

Cindi

The main point is that younger transsexuals of today have more opportunities to transition than any other generation in all of human history. When I was young, transitioning was not an option. It is really hard for me to stomach any "woe is me" attitude from younger TSs.

thats why i live in Canada!!

Phoenyx