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Evidence for God, Holy Spirit (Ghost), and Jesus

Started by Kendall, September 27, 2013, 06:30:07 PM

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Kendall

Reading one of the last few posts got me thinking about what evidence do we have that supports our beliefs as Christians.

There are many types of evidence. Some might be:
Prayer, Meditation- god given inspiration and illumination, feelings, gained knowledge, realizations.
Bible- Old and New Testament - something we have read impacted our lives for the better. We may have prayed about certain things, or received inspiration from some passage. The writings of Jesus may have impacted our lives in some way.
Personal Experience- Some story where something changed in our lives. ex. healing, visitation, community service, recovery.
Secondary Reading, Speech, Lecture, Video- we read, listened to, or watched something that impacted our lives.
Authority- Someone said something, which whom we admire, with direct impact on our lives.
Tradition- We were born into it. It is just part of our families' lives.
Reason- With logic and reason, we have discovered the existence of God.
Art, Song, Poetry, Fiction- Something in these forms of expressions impacts our lives deeply.
Revelation, Dream, Vision, Visitation, Near Death Experience- Something directly or to someone near to use experienced something supernatural.
Archaeology- modern excavations are discovering ancient biblical sites, relics, and documents lost for a long period of time.

Most of my evidence for God comes from prayer and the results of communicating with God. Nothing gives me greater peace than prayer and meditation, speaking to God.

Next I would say that reading the Bible would be the most influential, mostly the New Testament Gospels. These events written in the new testament help me several times a week. I enjoy reading mostly chronologically, using The Reese Chronological Bible (KJV), or Interlinear English-Greek (ESV). Chronologically it gives me a little picture into the possible order of events and writings. Interlinear helps me to know more in the original language, what was written. The evidence for Jesus as being the Messiah, comes from the Jewish Bible (Old Testament) fulfillment of Messianic prophecy: Isaiah, Zechariah, Psalms, Danial, Genesis, Micah.

Third for me is Reasoning (Apologetic) and Archaeology, I am amazed, though sometimes critical of some of histories arguments for and against Christianity. Some apologetic things the support my evidence is the World Views analysis comparing Deism to the others, Ontological argument, Cosmological argument, Teleological argument, and Anthropological (Moral) argument. Also the Problem (Views) of Evil.

Archaeology keeps discovering great things such as the Dead Sea Scrolls for the Old Testament, and Rylands Library Papyrus P52 (125AD) (John written 85-100AD, within one lifetime), for the New Testament to supplement authenticity of Codex Vaticanus (325AD), Sinaiticus (350AD), Alexandrinus (5th AD), Bezae (5th -6th AD) , and Latin Vulgate-Amiatinus(750AD). (also considering the oldest known copies of Plato (900AD) and Aristotle (1100AD), Homer (500AD), Julius Caesar (900AD) Also ossuaries, Pilate inscription, Erastus inscription, Yohanian Crucifixion, Pools of Siloam and Bethesda excavations.

Fourth Comparison of different religions, creations stories, attributes of God, and similar morality rules, leads me to believe God reveals to everyone in some way. Similarities of Near Death Experiences.
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Danielle Emmalee

For me "evidence" can never be enough to make me believe something.  It is far too easy for the human mind to create "evidence" towards the belief of anything.  To me it doesn't matter how likely or unlikely it is for God not to exist.  As long as it is more likely than impossible and less likely than a certainty (both of which are not true for any "fact" besides purely logical statements) belief is rooted in faith and not evidence.
Discord, I'm howlin' at the moon
And sleepin' in the middle of a summer afternoon
Discord, whatever did we do
To make you take our world away?

Discord, are we your prey alone,
Or are we just a stepping stone for taking back the throne?
Discord, we won't take it anymore
So take your tyranny away!
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Jamie D

I don't think that the historicity of Jesus of Nazareth is seriously doubted.  There are non-christian accounts of the man.
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Jessica Merriman

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Kia

I don't see how any of that qualifies as evidence. As Jamie said the fact that there was a man named Jesus and he did some preaching, got popular, and was executed isn't largely contested. But this and books/scrolls found after his death are not evidence of his divinity or of a greater Divine. Meditation and visions and such cannot be proven to be divine in origin either. Of course in the context of Christian practice and theology they are but if you ask a Buddhist about the divine origins of their stillness/emptiness they'll disagree with you. These things could be just strange brain functions we don't understand yet, but since there is a question mark god could be the answer. Then art and things we are told; I think it's a bit offensive to humans to say that all beautiful art that evokes great emotion or contains a spark of the divine is the work of god. God gave humanity freewill and the means and power to create. This doesn't mean that great beauty and great wisdom cannot be divinely influenced or guided just that humans are able to create such things without god holding their hand the whole way. And being capable of experiencing them again is not a quality of god. By Christian doctrine all human life holds some part of god in their souls and if it is this part of the soul that resonates with these amazing things isn't that merely proof that humans are capable of experiencing great emotional and sacred space?

I think there is a strange fascination we have with trying to prove whether or not god is "real", as if we were capable of truly objective experience. The matter is a personal choice and truth is different for everyone; that's what makes life so amazing in being confronted with these eternal questions every human being can come to a different conclusion and we'll never know who's right. If an individual feels the presence of god, gods, nature sprites, advanced UFO beings, or whatever in their lives and they derive comfort, support, and joy from that presence it's real enough even if only for them.

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Dreams2014

Tbh I've come across some seriously interesting information contesting his existence. Too in-depth to quickly disregard.
Farewell to my friends, farewell to the life I knew. I burn what once was, and in the ashes I am born anew.
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mowdan6

The Bible says, "Blessed are those that have not seen and yet believe."  Many that believe still live in anxiety and fear because even though they pray about a situation, they do not fully give it to God.  The Bible says, "Having believed you have received, then you will receive."  I know when I pray about hardships, I do find myself becoming anxious later, that is the time I have to pray again and give it back to God.  Jesus said He is our burden bearer.  If we pray, and then continue to be fearful, anxious, then it is time to pray again, and ask for faith, because God is faithful.  I have seen God over and over, do amazing things in my life.  Not because I am perfect.  Not because I have any strength at all.  Only because, I do my best to trust in Christ and proclaim that it is only because of Christ as my Lord and Savior, that I can do anything.  For without Him, I am nothing. 

Human pride prevents many from fully surrendering in that way.  I also battle the pride thing.  But I have seen God bless me in so many ways, when I surrender.  Too many times for it to be coincidence. 

I am far from perfect.  But Jesus never looked for the perfect person.  As the Bible says...He choses the foolish things of the world to confound the wise.  And if I am one of the foolish, I am truly blessed. 
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Kendall

#7
So far I know of no spontaneous creating of life in a lab, that wasn't unaided by man. A basic life form was said to be created with aid of man. So far they only proved that it takes an intelligence being to create life, a synthetic cell. And they made one little error that took 3 months to fix. In order to make the artificial man-made DNA work.   http://www.foxnews.com/scitech/2010/05/20/scientists-announce-produce-living-cell-using-manmade-dna/

And they have made an alternative to rna/dna they call xna, intelligently made. http://articles.latimes.com/2012/apr/20/science/la-sci-xna-20120421

One team is the closest to spontaneous creation theory, they had to follow an exact order to make precursors of RNA - ribonucleotides, which is still trying to find the building blocks of life. And they must only use processes only available in nature. Precursors are far from a functioning RNA, full DNA sequence, single cell, and complex organism. http://www.wired.com/wiredscience/2009/05/ribonucleotides/

This article shows how they made 2 of the 4 needed bases, and how exact the timing and order was needed. http://articles.latimes.com/2012/apr/20/science/la-sci-xna-20120421

This team emphasized the importance of RNA http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2010/02/100222162009.htm

A team recently made a polymer self replicating RNA which caused many questions
http://www.rsc.org/chemistryworld/2013/10/rna-mimic-destined-synthetic-genome-protocell

Another team made a self replicating RNA
http://www.dailygalaxy.com/my_weblog/2011/04/was-it-the-ultimate-origin-of-life-biologists-create-self-replicating-rna-molecule.html

So far scientists have proven they can only get to step 1 out of millions of steps to make a living complex organism, out of a amino acid soup, and a few possible in-between steps, with gaping giant holes. These giant holes and gaps would be labelled and called "magical" or "wishful" thinking, from a non-believing point of view, if it were some religious belief or process, such as prayer, inspiration, or forgiveness of sin. But believing that such spontaneous or evolutionary creation without aid of intelligence, into complex multisystem sentient beings, without aid of intelligent creator or "scientist", does contain what one can call "faith" or "hope". And believing that these things happen even without proof of seeing it happen might contain seeds to its own sort of religious belief, which can be respected in that sense.

So far, man has not created life from raw ingredients intentionally (not to mention by natural process accidentally) of carbon, Oxygen, water (hydrogen + Oxygen), sugar, nitrogen, calcium, phosporus, potassium, sulfur, sodium, chlorine, magnessium, iron, fluorine, zinc, silicon, and other trace minerals...

I don't know of any new organ or system in a animal that has evolved in the last 6000 years (modern written history) from any farm animals, zoo, or captured animal besides minor cosmetic changes such as color or genetic trait such as size genetically raised intentionally.

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Kendall

I found an article from a former christian, now atheist, who was experiencing inner turmoil in their life do to an early death in the family.
They had to figure our how to resolve their inner turmoil.
How To Pray If You're An Atheist
1. Find a good listener: problem other person interrupts or makes them the topic of the conversation. Or they can be only half-listening.
2. Be real: go in a closet and talk out loud without a facade or hiding.
3. Let go: let your emotions go.
4. Listen to your heart: get advice that can change your life

http://thoughtcatalog.com/jerry-dewitt/2013/07/how-to-pray-if-youre-an-atheist/
The writer recommends everyone "pray" often, despite religious views.
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Talitha Cumi

"...what evidence do we have that supports our beliefs as Christians" – Kendlall

I would like to propose the following in answer to your question.

A fundamental belief of the catholic faith is in the words St John records in his Gospel regarding eating the body and blood of Jesus. Catholics believe the scripture passages relating to what they call the true presence of Jesus in the Blessed Sacrament are intimately linked:

To be explicit catholic belief and teaching is : the elements of bread and wine become Jesus Christ truly present body, blood, soul and divinity in the Eucharistic

As a practicing catholic I believe and have experienced this to be true. However, I don't expect anyone to really believe my own experience of faith, but I would like you to view the film clip below, because the scientific investigation of the phenomenon appears to be rigorous. 



In the light of the above I would be interested in your thoughts. It is the closest example I can think of that might possibly answer the question you pose.

An interesting coincidence is the Cardinal Archbishop of the Archdiocese of Buenos Aires at the time was the present Pope Francis.
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Talitha Cumi

I would also like to draw your attention to a documentary film from the scientific community postulating the existence and action of a creator as to the origin of our universe as opposed to the notion of a multiverse.



It seems to me that if the phenomena discussed in the scientific investigation of a consecrated bloody communion host found in Buenos Aires is true (see above). Then, it would support the notion of a creator God as revealed in the Judaeo Christian scriptures as the creator of our universe.
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