Does it make you angry when gender problems are called disorders?

It helps in a way. By calling them disorders some insurances will pick up the tab for hormones and right now the courts are fighting the IRS for deductions for surgery. It helps in the pocketbook. I agree, we aren't a disorder.
Sheila

Quote from: Jonie on July 28, 2007, 11:19:01 AM
Does it make you angry when gender problems are called disorders?

Yes, because we're part of the normal diversity of people. But to "normalize" it by the medical community would remove it from any possibility of health coverage, loss the tax deduction (recent IRS case), and perhaps some legal protections - this is debateable as homosexuality is protected without being a medical condition. The reality, to me, is that it will never be removed as a condition as the medical community wants some control over the process and the liability protection for surgeons and physicians, and they like the excercise of the definition of normal.

All that said, it doesn't personally bother me as it's really a fabrication of the medical community. I don't explain my situation as a medical disorder or condition, but simply being me. It is a wonder to me why some in the tg/ts community like it as a disorder or condition. Some people seem to like the perceived clarity of being something with a name. This, however, plays into the very people who think it's abnormal and can call it that when it's in the DSM.

Just my thoughts.

--Susan--

The difference in the sexual orientation is that they don't have to have the medical establishment for their meds. We do. I would like to be able to have my insurance pay for the meds and the surgery. Of course I'm done with it but there are thousands out there that are just starting and/or in the middle of transition. It is expensive with all the meds that you have to have. Even if you don't have to have a doctors note for any of it, the meds you have to pay for and the surgery too. You might even get a deduction for electrolysis too.
Sheila

im just starting, but i hope i can deduct some of it.and i try not to care what people call it but i think they have to call it something and if it make them fell better then what ever.


                                                                  gween

not really.  should it?   what is it called when someone keeps a loaded gun in their mouth for hours but [decides] not to press the trigger?   is that insanity or pure desperation? does it matter how it's called?  will i benefit from a different diagnosis that doesn't involve the word "disorder"?
i'm mad, very mad.!  who cares!  i don't as long as it is treatable.

I started off just being very confused, my early years where a struggle to understand how a little "boy" could want to be like and feel like a little girl.

It wasn't until my late teens that I found out about transsexuals , Gender Identity Disorder, Gender Dysphoria (call it what you want).

What I will say is that whatever it it is called unless you have gone through this, no professional medical person can understand the deep, depression, hurt, anguish and pain you live with on a daily basis.

As a Scientist, disorder to me means chaos, so I guess that does fit the description of what I went through in the early years of my life.

Buffy

Quote from: SusanK on July 28, 2007, 04:55:53 PM

Quote from: Jonie on July 28, 2007, 11:19:01 AM
Does it make you angry when gender problems are called disorders?

Yes, because we're part of the normal diversity of people. But to "normalize" it by the medical community would remove it from any possibility of health coverage, loss the tax deduction (recent IRS case), and perhaps some legal protections - this is debateable as homosexuality is protected without being a medical condition. The reality, to me, is that it will never be removed as a condition as the medical community wants some control over the process and the liability protection for surgeons and physicians, and they like the excercise of the definition of normal.

All that said, it doesn't personally bother me as it's really a fabrication of the medical community. I don't explain my situation as a medical disorder or condition, but simply being me. It is a wonder to me why some in the tg/ts community like it as a disorder or condition. Some people seem to like the perceived clarity of being something with a name. This, however, plays into the very people who think it's abnormal and can call it that when it's in the DSM.

Just my thoughts.

--Susan--

Actually Susan, it being called a disorder is a problem for health coverage, and actually removing the "disorder" aspect and the current DSM language would improve things significantly.
This does not mean removing it from the DSM, it means reclassifying the it from a disorder to something less offensive and more appropriate.
This is a myth commonly perpetuated by those who believe that removing the disorder would effect health coverage, the truth is it was a SYNDROME before, which actually made the possibility of coverage more likely, it was the status of a disorder and Blanchard that messed things up significantly.

I could go on, but there are major issues with medical coverage because it is named a disorder, we are not mentally ill. 

I also know there is a push by the medical community to change this to be something that is more appropriate.  Gender Identity Distress is being bandied about as the new DSM classification.  It is actually a bit more accurate because it suggests its not a mental illness, but a state of stress that causes mental problems as a result of being closeted (I could go on, but it basically states the Gender Identity thing does not make one mentally ill, and the symptoms of mental illness like depression come from the societal and personal aspects of having to deal with this in a culture unaccepting of gender variance).  I could go on with how awfully written the DSM is and how THAT has caused the insurance problems, not the fact its not listed. 

Transsexuality though is a medical condition.  It needs a significant amount of medical intervention.  The ICD-10, which is used internationally (the DSM IS NOT), has it listed as a medical condition in which there is intervention. 

If Gender Identity Disorder and Transsexuality gets removed from the DSM, it is still a recognized medical condition in the ICD. As a result there would still be treatment for the condition.  The thing is it would quit being a "psychiatric" condition and be a general medical condition.  Which would be much better.  As it stands the DSM has a convoluted definition that needs to be thrown into the fire and the language should exactly mirror the ICD.  Also it needs to stop being a disorder, we are not mentally ill. 

QuoteGender Identity Distress is being bandied about as the new DSM classification.  It is actually a bit more accurate because it suggests its not a mental illness, but a state of stress that causes mental problems as a result of being closeted (I could go on, but it basically states the Gender Identity thing does not make one mentally ill, and the symptoms of mental illness like depression come from the societal and personal aspects of having to deal with this in a culture unaccepting of gender variance).

Amy,

This would be a significant improvement. I don't believe that I am mentally ill at all, my transgender nature might have been considered to be a spiritual gift in a different society. In my opinion, modern culture has a severe case of gender dysfunction, with its compulsory need to shoehorn everyone into binary gender boxes. I have experience great stress, my gender identity isn't the problem, dealing with not having a place in society is.

Zythyra

Quote from: Jonie on July 28, 2007, 11:19:01 AM
Does it make you angry when gender problems are called disorders?

Not really, it really depends on the context.

The fact that it is considered a disorder (in the sense of something needing to be fixed or treated) probably facilitates, for some of, being able to GET treatment.  But honestly, I don't really care enough to feel angry about it.  I've got too many other things going on in my life right now to put any energy into feeling angry about something like that.  For me, right now, I'd just consider it a waste of energy, because anger does take a lot of energy that can be put into other, more immediately useful things.

I agree, we have enough things in this world without being annoyed by semantics.

That being said, I can say with confidence that being transgendered is NOT a dissorder. I have a neurological disorder ont top of this, and I know thi difference. ->-bleeped-<- itself is one of the few things that doesn't cause me stress. It's dealing with the rest of life that does.

Believe it or not these annoying semantics have huge impacts on everything from insurance coverage to legal issues.  The disorder issue is huge, and transsexuality being considered a mental illness by in large has had negative effects.  Ask any progressive gender therapist about the disorder classification, and they will tell you how incorrect it is as a classification.  They will also flat out tell you how and why it has created problems. 

I don't want to get into the nitty gritty of the issues, but I will tell you from a legal position that the DSM-IV-TR and the classification and language used in the DSM-IV is very much at the source of the problems TS face with regards to insurance and medical access.  The muddled language and "disorder" classification actually kind of screws with medical access.  Treatment for mental disorders is usually not done with HRT and Surgical Procedures.  In fact the inclusion of TS (GID) into the DSM completely conflicts with the statement at the beginning of the DSM itself. 
People with IS conditions are covered because it is not considered a strictly psychiatric issue like TS is classified as.  It is one with known physical issues. 

Coverage and treatment is not going to be contingent on the existence of a DSM designation.  It needs a regular, non-psychiatric medical designation, which it already HAS (ICD-10).   It also needs CLEAR language, not convoluted language, with regards to treatment and diagnostics, and no more mention of sexual orientation or gender stereotypes. 

I could go on, but as a lawyer and policy analyst who works on health care issues as part of my job, as it stands the DSM designation is a problem, and changing the designation in the DSM and getting rid of the disorder status is not going to effect our ability to access care.  In fact clarity may improve the current situation significantly.

Amy, thank you for that information. I didn't know about all that. OK, now if we take it out of the mental part, which I agree that it isn't a mental problem, now where do we get letters or would there be a need for letters from a doctor. Since GID is not mental, then we don't have to see a psychologist for help, only if we needed help in our transition. Wouldn't that open it up for more people making a mistake and going through a surgery that wasn't needed because of what this person thinks at the moment. Just trying to figure out how all that would work with the HBSOC. I guess they would have to change that and bring it up to date.
Sheila

Quote from: Amy T. on August 10, 2007, 01:34:32 PM
Believe it or not these annoying semantics have huge impacts on everything from insurance coverage to legal issues.  The disorder issue is huge, and transsexuality being considered a mental illness by in large has had negative effects.  Ask any progressive gender therapist about the disorder classification, and they will tell you how incorrect it is as a classification.  They will also flat out tell you how and why it has created problems. 

The mental health issue is played on greatly in the U.K and it can be used against you. My original diagnosis clearly implied 'she has no mental health issues'......so where did they send me....a gender clinic called 'West London Mental Health'.....

It's total nonsense and many genetic women have the same cosmetic proceedure's such as facial surgery or breast aygmentation and are not seen as mentally ill....