I have some hormone issues.  An endocrinologist I have seen for a year or so offered to inject me with a drug (can't remember name) that would in effect, do a chemical orchiectomy. Has anyone ever done this?

(Weird questions tonight....)

Hugs,

Jen 

I'm familiar with Esterilsol.  (Used as an alternative for castrating dogs.)  But I'm not aware of a similar injection for humans.
I'd be interested to know what drug they were thinking of using since Esterilsol only shuts down sperm production but leaves T production intact.

Sounds a bit odd, why? AA and E usually kill the testes anyway.

My GIC has said that is their standard practice too. I don't know the drug but I will ask when I see them again in a few days.

Akira x

Quote from: SunKat on December 13, 2013, 02:57:38 AM
I'm familiar with Esterilsol.  (Used as an alternative for castrating dogs.)  But I'm not aware of a similar injection for humans.
I'd be interested to know what drug they were thinking of using since Esterilsol only shuts down sperm production but leaves T production intact.

SunKAT: I don't recall the name of the drug.  I'll find out when I go back in to see that endo.

Quote from: Cindy on December 13, 2013, 03:11:49 AM
Sounds a bit odd, why? AA and E usually kill the testes anyway.

For the short version, blood levels taken for the first three months of HRT showed that everything was working as hoped.  Then, T started climbing and the levels started fluctuating or possibly cycling.  I could not get enough E or spiro to shut things down.  Then, when they took me off E for a surgery 9 months after starting HRT, my T-makers fully recovered by day 4 off E.  My system is too resilient or too adaptable.  So, it's either off with the T makers or do the injection.  I don't want to go off E again so the injection is just preferable. 

Akira: Thank you.  They have been doing this with Depo here in the US with informed consent.  However, this was the first time I heard of the drug they were talking about.  A follow-up would be nice. 

Thank you all.

Hugs,

Jen
   

Quote from: JLT1 on December 12, 2013, 10:31:40 PM. . .  inject me with a drug (can't remember name) that would in effect, do a chemical orchiectomy. Has anyone ever done this?

Non-standard Casodex in effect permanently does this but never heard of it being 'injectable'? After a two year hiatus of being off everything am amazed how little re-masculination has occurred. Aside from putting on a 'lil weight continue to be functionally dry & sterile with no body hair re-growth AT ALL ?

Have either built up a complete IMMUNITY to T or production has ceased entirely?

Plan to restart Progynon Depot ONLY while letting hair grow back once more miss the mistaken "ma'ams" playing 'guy mode' has been sooo droll!

Please, If you don't like medroxyprogesterone simply don't respond - ignore this post. 

Could you be thinking of Medroxyprogesterone? It is used for chemical castration among child sex molesters by court order.  I had a great deal of trouble with spiro and now inject medroxy every two months and my t levels are virtually non-existent. The drug seems to provoke an almost hysterical response from some people who don't use it but spout on about it's horrors.  It has been used for decades and is relatively benign.  It's slightly higher level of breast cancer potential needs to be weighed against the need it is being used for.  Certainly estrogen itself is a powerful cancer, dementia producing drug.  Our needs often vastly over weighs the dangers. Every drug has some problems.  Spiro is dangerous to me.  It is relatively cheap, long lasting, and if you aren't injecting it yourself, you only go to the docs every three months.  Easy Peasy.  Hope this helps.

Wow,

Thank you all!  I've been worried about this.  I just have to do something and this is an option. I'll let everyone know how it goes.

Hugs,

Jen

These are the drugs to look up... http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Goserelin
And
http://m.netdoctor.co.uk/cancer/medicines/decapeptyl-sr.html

They are considered superior to spiro and androcur apparently.

I am in the UK and under the care of a GIC. I receive Decapatyl injections every three  months as these are considered superior to Androcur and Spiro. The reasoning is that rather allow T to be produced and then blocked, it is better to not produce it at all. It also allows the person transitioning to experience post-op levels of T immediately and a lower dose of E to be proscribed.

The risk of depression is less than that associated with Androcur and it lack the water-rentention problems of spiro (not to mention hyperkalemia).

My T levels dropped to female levels in a matter of weeks and immediate changes became noticeable, the primary one being tiredness. Within a few weeks body hair, when epilated, did not grow back as DHT was also reduced.

For those of you in the USA the big drawback of these drugs is the price, but they are routinely prescribed in the UK. The big advantage for someone like me, awaiting GRS, is that I can stay on this up to the operation as it is a depot injection.

Quote from: temporary on December 27, 2013, 11:55:03 AM
I am in the UK and under the care of a GIC. I receive Decapatyl injections every three  months as these are considered superior to Androcur and Spiro. The reasoning is that rather allow T to be produced and then blocked, it is better to not produce it at all. It also allows the person transitioning to experience post-op levels of T immediately and a lower dose of E to be proscribed.

The risk of depression is less than that associated with Androcur and it lack the water-rentention problems of spiro (not to mention hyperkalemia).

My T levels dropped to female levels in a matter of weeks and immediate changes became noticeable, the primary one being tiredness. Within a few weeks body hair, when epilated, did not grow back as DHT was also reduced.

For those of you in the USA the big drawback of these drugs is the price, but they are routinely prescribed in the UK. The big advantage for someone like me, awaiting GRS, is that I can stay on this up to the operation as it is a depot injection.

How much do they cost? Are they generic? Spiro does not want to work on me and I'm wondering if the injections would be cheaper than an orchi

Quote from: Hideyoshi on December 27, 2013, 12:27:54 PM
How much do they cost? Are they generic? Spiro does not want to work on me and I'm wondering if the injections would be cheaper than an orchi

They come under the group name of GnRH analogues and the two common ones in the UK are Decapeptyl, which I receive, and Zoladex which several of my friends are on. My understanding is that the costs are somewhere in the range £150 - £225 per 3 month shot. That would be around $300 USD. Decapeptyl is the cheaper of the two and goes under the generic name of Triptorelin Acetate. Zoladex is IIRC, Goserelin Acetate. Both require intra-muscular injection by a nurse/doctor.

They work by overloading a gland in the brain which, once saturated, can no longer produce the hormones to instruct the gonads to produce sex hormones so your external supply of estrogen can work unopposed. My level of T dropped to around 1 nmol/L after the first injection.

The downside is that the first injection causes an initial overload T for about 2 weeks and a blocker like androcur or spiro is usually prescribed to counter this. After this first injection is it important to stay in the cycle to prevent normal hormone production from restarting otherwise the next injection will cause another flare-up of T. The injections are supposed to last 12 weeks so I make my appointments 11 weeks apart. That way I get overlap and if an appointment is cancelled I have time to re-arrange it and keep my male hormones suppressed and stay in cycle.

Quote from: temporary on December 27, 2013, 02:09:46 PM
They come under the group name of GnRH analogues and the two common ones in the UK are Decapeptyl, which I receive, and Zoladex which several of my friends are on. My understanding is that the costs are somewhere in the range £150 - £225 per 3 month shot. That would be around $300 USD. Decapeptyl is the cheaper of the two and goes under the generic name of Triptorelin Acetate. Zoladex is IIRC, Goserelin Acetate. Both require intra-muscular injection by a nurse/doctor.

They work by overloading a gland in the brain which, once saturated, can no longer produce the hormones to instruct the gonads to produce sex hormones so your external supply of estrogen can work unopposed. My level of T dropped to around 1 nmol/L after the first injection.

The downside is that the first injection causes an initial overload T for about 2 weeks and a blocker like androcur or spiro is usually prescribed to counter this. After this first injection is it important to stay in the cycle to prevent normal hormone production from restarting otherwise the next injection will cause another flare-up of T. The injections are supposed to last 12 weeks so I make my appointments 11 weeks apart. That way I get overlap and if an appointment is cancelled I have time to re-arrange it and keep my male hormones suppressed and stay in cycle.

Interesting

Only scary thing is that you need to keep doing it or risk a flareup, and I'm not sure if I could afford 100 USD/month for a shot.. at least not right now.  Wondering if the generic is cheaper or maybe covered by insurance.

I'm wondering if one shot to clear the T from my system would be enough, even though spiro doesn't block the production of T, to then maintain the low levels through spiro. UGH I wanna go to the doctor but I need to wait till the 19th ):<

edit: I found online that it costs 100 per shot for the generic.  Hoping that's accurate, will for sure talk to endo when I go on the 19th

This is very interesting, i never knew of such a thing. ill have to ask my doc.

Wow,

There are options and it isn't so nearly as "singular" as I thought.

Hugs,

Jen

Quote from: Hideyoshi on December 27, 2013, 03:19:00 PMOnly scary thing is that you need to keep doing it or risk a flareup, and I'm not sure if I could afford 100 USD/month for a shot.. at least not right now. 

Hideyoshi 'Calutide (Bicalutamide)', which is best available in preventing reaction to T flareups when initially prescribed Decapeptyl SR, is . . .  "a testosterone analogue similar in structure to testosterone that binds to the same receptor in cells without activating any normal testosterone actions" at all.

The added benefit here is your body, in building up a T immunity and increasing 'free available' over time causes the pituitary gland to cut back on male luteinising (LH) and follicle-stimulating hormones (FSH) naturally will little or no undesired long term side-effects.

QuoteSince bicalutamide will block the effect of testosterone on all tissues, there will be no response by the body to the increased androgen levels, but the rising sex hormone production will increase the estrogen levels in the man to be much higher than they would be in a man who has not been taking bicalutamide

Bottom line? Rather than shut the pituitary gland down entirely trick it into producing excess oestrogen instead?

By no means 'cheep' I have found a maintenance regimen of Casodex to run about $50/month. And with a half-life of '9 days' once full T immunity is achieved one can cut dosage frequency back even more. Currently I take NONE with no 're-masculation' occurring period !

LOL A far cry from "gee gonna miss my doc shot appoint"!

Quote from: Kiera on December 28, 2013, 11:38:58 AM
Hideyoshi 'Calutide (Bicalutamide)', which is best available in preventing reaction to T flareups when initially prescribed Decapeptyl SR, is . . .  "a testosterone analogue similar in structure to testosterone that binds to the same receptor in cells without activating any normal testosterone actions" at all.

The added benefit here is your body, in building up a T immunity and increasing 'free available' over time causes the pituitary gland to cut back on male luteinising (LH) and follicle-stimulating hormones (FSH) naturally will little or no undesired long term side-effects.

Bottom line? Rather than shut the pituitary gland down entirely trick it into producing excess oestrogen instead?

By no means 'cheep' I have found a maintenance regimen of Casodex to run about $50/month. And with a half-life of '9 days' once full T immunity is achieved one can cut dosage frequency back even more. Currently I take NONE with no 're-masculation' occurring period !

LOL A far cry from "gee gonna miss my doc shot appoint"!

So instead of the Decapeptyl, I should do the Bicalutamide?  Or Decapeptyl then bicalutamide for maintenance? Or just talk to my doctor about both of those options?

Quote from: Cindy Stephens on December 17, 2013, 12:45:46 PM
Please, If you don't like medroxyprogesterone simply don't respond - ignore this post. 

Could you be thinking of Medroxyprogesterone? It is used for chemical castration among child sex molesters by court order.  I had a great deal of trouble with spiro and now inject medroxy every two months and my t levels are virtually non-existent. The drug seems to provoke an almost hysterical response from some people who don't use it but spout on about it's horrors.  It has been used for decades and is relatively benign.  It's slightly higher level of breast cancer potential needs to be weighed against the need it is being used for.  Certainly estrogen itself is a powerful cancer, dementia producing drug.  Our needs often vastly over weighs the dangers. Every drug has some problems.  Spiro is dangerous to me.  It is relatively cheap, long lasting, and if you aren't injecting it yourself, you only go to the docs every three months.  Easy Peasy.  Hope this helps.

Is associated with clotting?

Quote from: Kiera on December 14, 2013, 08:47:26 AM
Non-standard Casodex in effect permanently does this but never heard of it being 'injectable'? After a two year hiatus of being off everything am amazed how little re-masculination has occurred. Aside from putting on a 'lil weight continue to be functionally dry & sterile with no body hair re-growth AT ALL ?

Have either built up a complete IMMUNITY to T or production has ceased entirely?

Plan to restart Progynon Depot ONLY while letting hair grow back once more miss the mistaken "ma'ams" playing 'guy mode' has been sooo droll!

Is the effects of Casodex permanent or do you have to keep taking it?