Quote from: Oriah on January 31, 2014, 10:30:29 PMBut I did "RLE" for well over a year before hormones....without a doctor or therapist's recommendation, and without knowing there was a word for it......I just got fed up, and started living as a woman one day......eventually I just realized that getting on hormones made sense and was more financially feasible and worthwhile.....

It's all a matter if you can pull it off or not, pre anything (HRT, FFS, etc).

I can't, at least not in a way I would be comfortable with or find acceptable. When I'm ready, I will.

Quote from: Ahn A. Sabbatical on February 01, 2014, 12:45:12 AMRLE prior to passing is like having people walk in public naked to determine if they really need that new suit or dress. It can be humiliating.

Exactly!   

I really struggle with this one, I have fought for 50 years to be perceived as a boy and lost, and finally realized that it is ok for me to feel and acknowledge that I am female, well me and some guy at a gate that i was not ready to go through.. I do believe that the process will give people a chance to explore how the impacts of transitioning will impact their lives. I do believe that not everyone waits until st peter sends them back to decide that they need to change. so it stands to reason that given time to explore makes since so that people do not make changes that can not be undone. I do have an issue with fixed time type markers i hate to give up another year of my life but in the same breath would give it all before turning back so no sweat. not like part of this process is fast anyways lol
xoxoxo
Jerri 

I have always wondered about this. I was treated as a guy most of the time, until I actually did something about the female body.

I haven't read through all the replies in the thread (It's long!). But, throwing out my pair of pennies.

My understanding of how things work, is that someone, presenting totally as a man, could walk into a surgeons office, and get FFS, BA, and VFS, without having gone through any form of gatekeeping whatsoever. No shrinks. No RLE. Nothing. All it requires is money.

Now, it seems to me, that those things, being publically presentable, are waaaaay more likely to cause psychological issues and/or regret for someone who is "not really sure about changing gender."

It also seems to me, that most guys wont get their penis lopped off on a whim. Sure, perhaps there are a handful of people that regret GRS. But, given ANY choice there will ALWAYS be a handful of people who regret making the choice they made. And given that, again, most guys want nothing more than to keep their penis above all else, I can't see getting rid of the RLE increasing the number of people who regret GRS.

And also, because what's in my pants is private, and only I chose who gets to see it, if I should regret GRS then only I have to deal with it. Whereas all the other surgeries, being very prominently public, effect not only me but everyone else around me should I regret it. So, I don't get it. Why is getting a boob job and having my voice surgically feminized without RLE perfectly okay, but I have to wait a very dysphoric year to get a vagina?

Granted in my case it's a pointless argument. For me finances dictate when I can get it done, not the SoC - it'll be waaaaaay longer than a year for me to save up that kind of money. Unless I can rob a bank and somehow evade getting caught until after surgery 

Quote from: missadventure on February 01, 2014, 09:43:27 PM
I haven't read through all the replies in the thread (It's long!). But, throwing out my pair of pennies.

My understanding of how things work, is that someone, presenting totally as a man, could walk into a surgeons office, and get FFS, BA, and VFS, without having gone through any form of gatekeeping whatsoever. No shrinks. No RLE. Nothing. All it requires is money.

Now, it seems to me, that those things, being publicly presentable, are waaaaay more likely to cause psychological issues and/or regret for someone who is "not really sure about changing gender."

I think it is about the regret part, and maybe also so the doctors don't get sued?

But making someone go full time without electrolysis, FFS, BA, etc., can be cruel and humiliating! Tell a male doctor or therapist to dress up as a woman for a week and then see how they feel about it. 

QuoteUnless I can rob a bank and somehow evade getting caught until after surgery 

There's a movie from 1975 about robbing a bank to fund a sex change staring Al Pacino.

I think the worst thing about being forced into RLE before passing is how those that haven't ever looked into all of this have no hope of understanding why. Its just almost certainly going to make us suffer even more, which is just plain cruel and wrong.

I've always thought RLE or RLT would be pretty hard to define. Women and Men present themselves in many different kinds of ways. Not everyone's a Marilyn Monroe and John Wayne... Before I started transitioning there were plenty of women that were more masculine than me. Personally I'm a bit of a barbie now and more feminine than many women, but I'm not sure for others how RLE might be defined. Does that mean they have to wear makeup? Have long hair? Wear skirts? What about the millions of women who don't do any of those things? If anything letters of recommendation confirming the validity of the patient's need and mental health to have the correct genetalia should trump whatever RLE means.

I read some of the posts and with most I agree. But why do we need to have this conversation and others like it? Because we live in a cruel world? No, because the idiots prevail! Yes yes! The gender police are on the move constantly scrutinizing us and our every move. it is nerve wrecking, annoying, frustrating and it makes us anxious, depressed, unsure of ourselves.

Some Japanese wisdom from my grandfather....

Hatori: "Listen my child, when you face opposition and great adversity for nothing more than who you are, you are on the right path. Going against the grain, out of the norm, is true courage, and is what a leader does. A follower goes with the grain and eventually falls down the waterfall into failure."

I think all of us do exceptionally well in spite of what is going on around us and in our lives. We are beautiful because we say we are. I don't go by the world standards of beauty because I look nothing like them! (Them ref. to sstandard black women or Japanese women or any other kind of woman some ding bat wants to compare me to) I look like me!I like me! I love me! The hell with anyone who has a problem with me!

Remember this my brothers and sisters" You are you, this will not change, how you choose to present yourself to the world can change on a whim! Therefore, live without fear, be you, be proud, have indomitable spirit, self integrity, respect, and loyalty!


Peace and love!