Hi everyone

Does anyone have personal experience of transitioning M2F from a senior position in a large multinational?  I'm reasonably senior in a fairly liberal European multinational engineering company, 45 years old,  and recently was told that they want to put me onto a future leaders career path.  But I'm just about to start hormone treatment, so within 6-12 months my transition may not be so easy to conceal.  I'm not scared  by the idea of telling people that I'm trans (they know me as gay), but at the same time we don't seem to have any published policy on LGBT employee rights.

If anyone can share relevant experience I would be so very grateful!

Thanx!
J

I work for a large multinational in Europe, though in a junior management position. I have been full time for 2 month and have had absolutely no problems what so ever. The company has been amazingly supportive of me and my transition in fact. If you are in the EU, the EC publishes articles on LGBT rights by country. It may not even be possible in your country to fire you based on your trans status, I don't know. You could also speak to your local HR rep, if you trust them to keep your request for information secret.   

There is a member called JennX who transitioned as a highly placed executive. I don't know how often she's on, so a PM might be better. Also Cindy (who's offline this week but will be back soon) transitioned from a prominent leadership position.

Hey, thanks so very much for the feedback!! 

I have indeed found that colleagues are quite slow to notice changes, such as longer hair and stuff.  Hell, most haven't even noticed that I fixed my nose!  As far as the legislation goes, I need to see how much support I really get, if that is needed.  I would hope that we do have a company LGBT policy, I mean we're over 100,000 people and our country of origin is very liberal.

I guess my main issue is how to deal with colleagues (isn't it always?  )  once they actually do start to notice changes.  Until that time I'm happy to say nothing....

Thanks again!!

Some people can be pretty slow on the uptake. I told two colleagues last week after seven months on HRT, and they were genuinely surprised at the news. Not "I wondered" or anything, genuinely surprised. Then they start to put two and two together. Even though there are more trans people transitioning than ever before the general population just haven't had much experience with it, most times they take you as the gender you present as. But good luck all the same. I'm transitioning at work and am just over three months from going full time - we're a small community organisation with a big reputation and good LGBTIQ policy, my position is middle-ish in that it has enough prominence for me to be known by many people outside the organisation which will be more difficult to deal with than the internal stuff.

Hi Ms Grace

If you're lucky enough to present credibly in your chosen gender this is obviously a great help.  I'm verrrrrry far away from that point, and I think it's more likely that I'll end up becoming a feminine boy rather than a passable girl.  That's what I am telling my psychologist - better to be realistic  than totally deluded    Perhaps that's a bit of a cop-out, but as Emily noted, if people just think I'm gay it would allow me to find a halfway point that people would just see as a bit eccentric, rather than totally weirding out my colleagues.  The first thing that both my endocrinologist and psychologist asked was whether I worked in a public-facing job and were already proposing that I should move into a more invisible role, which I frankly refuse to consider at this point. 

How have you all found the reactions of your colleagues?  Are they more malleable than you were expecting, in that they don't really care what your gender is, or have you found that some are just freaked out that you were once a guy and are no longer one?

Hugs
J

He he - Emily, you anticipated my question perfectly - our posts must have crossed each other in cyberspace!

Ha ha ha... Emily, I'm not sure how great my mind is, but in an hour it's going to be in the hands of my psychologist as I explain yet again why I want to be a girl...  I mean, she is a GIRL - she should understand the attraction of being one! 

Actually, here's one you might be able to comment on:  how did going onto HRT affect your mind?  I'm guessing it made a difference to your emotions, but what about the way you think??  (Are you on androgen blockers - I guess that would make a difference?)

Quote from: Julia-Madrid on February 19, 2014, 08:32:23 AM
I mean, she is a GIRL - she should understand the attraction of being one! 

Actually not. Most women are critical of my transition ("If you knew what it was really like..."). It's troubling that your therapist doesn't understand that gender identity doesn't mean we're attracted to being one, it means we already are girls.
[/quote]

Quote from: suzifrommd on February 19, 2014, 10:17:52 AM
"If you knew what it was really like..."

I heard that same thing from my ex-wife. She painted a pretty horrible picture of what living as a girl is like.

The thing she totally missed is it is worse to be forced to live as a boy with a female mind; living as a girl would actually be a great improvement because I am actually a girl.

Quote from: Julia-Madrid on February 18, 2014, 07:48:36 AM
Hi everyone

Does anyone have personal experience of transitioning M2F from a senior position in a large multinational?  I'm reasonably senior in a fairly liberal European multinational engineering company, 45 years old,  and recently was told that they want to put me onto a future leaders career path.  But I'm just about to start hormone treatment, so within 6-12 months my transition may not be so easy to conceal.  I'm not scared  by the idea of telling people that I'm trans (they know me as gay), but at the same time we don't seem to have any published policy on LGBT employee rights.

If anyone can share relevant experience I would be so very grateful!

Thanx!
J

Hi when I transitioned I worked for a fairly large company as a director, and this is a company with a 100% HRC rating as well. Here are my thoughts and this is just me thinking out loud. Some people say that a transition is a career killer but I don't think so. It's more like a career setback. When I was working there I was put on a 10 million dollar project as the senior leader and sponsor, if that helps put things in perspective. That's the level of trust they had in me. When I announced my transition I was fired the next day. I could have taken my chances and rolled the lawsuit lottery dice from a wrongful termination suit, but I didn't want my name all over the papers or be on the nightly news or who knows what. So I took it on the chin and moved on.

My view is that companies and honestly people in general are generally frightened of the sex changing process, especially in that little tiny world upstairs and lets face reality men still rule the roost in executive positions and the boardroom. It's different up there as I'm sure you know. Some of your peers or those directly above you obviously have a very good opinion of you and your abilities to be a leader otherwise they wouldn't recommend you. However, when you mention that sex change stuff, everything changes. You become an unknown again. Essentially you go from the top of the pile to the bottom.

If you stay at that job, my feeling is your career will be over irregardless of how you think people will feel about you. Plus you will always have to deal with the fact that everyone knows.

It's not all glum though. After the transition part is done, I can only tell you about this aspect of myself. People can say whatever they want about Srs surgery and whether or not it's important, but in my case it gave me a razor sharp determination to succeed as a woman. I was not prepared for the profound psychological effect that this surgery would have on my psyche. It literally cured my gender dysphoria dead. It was quite amazing. Without experiencing gender dysphoria anymore, I got back 10% of my brain and put it to good use. It took a few job jumps from the end of my transition but I managed to make a very good good career comeback. Nowadays I earn far more than I ever did as a guy and actually am quite happy. But it came at a cost. I had to move down the ladder to move back up the ladder. If I had not changed at all, who knows I might even be a VP today, but it was not meant to be.

I hope that helps. If you want to talk more then please PM or email me and wi old be glad to tell you about my situation. It's not something it want to air out completely in public

Thank you Zumbagirl... I think you have managed to put this into perspective for me exceptionally well, and it totally fits with what I assumed would be a common case.   I'd totally agree with you about the difficulty of getting to the executive suite, but I did this in my previous company (a small one) and I'm not sure I'd want to go back there.   It's too testosterone-driven for me, and since I am more of a dialogue and consensus type of person it's not the kind of forum that worked for me as a man.  As a woman it would absolutely be more difficult, but again, I don't think I really want to get back to that place - it robs you of your life outside of your work and makes you aggressive, which I dislike.   Anyhow, these are all things which I will have to deal with as I go, but I think that at least I have some job protection where they just can't fire me for wanting to change gender.  Still, it will be challenging....

Hi y'all...getting back to some previous posts now:

Emily - thanks for your insight there.  I guess that since my social interactions are quite female already, my experience might be similar to yours...  I'll post this in a few months once I am fully and deeply into HRT.

Suzi and Eva Marie - my therapist is actually very supportive, but she wants to force me to be sure of what I want, and I think in that sense she's actually quite good - certainly she hasn't put obstacles in my way, but she is challenging me to think about it and to consider what I really need.   

With regards to being a girl as seen from a genetic girl's point of view ("If you knew what it was really like"), most of the women in my world, including my ex-wife, have been exceptionally strong-willed and were mostly able to have things on their terms.  OK, yes, some women moan about their period and its effects, understandably,  and my ex did complain about people not always treating her totally as she wished in a professional setting (this is Spain after all - it's still rather patriarchal), but those are circumstantial things that changed with a change in employer.  I'm sure we could all think of at least 10 good reasons why NOT to want to be a girl, but equally I can think of 20 good reasons why I don't want to be a boy.  And a positive attitude helps, no doubt, as well, as er, a ballsy attitude. 

I work in senior level management level of are large company. I have approx. 300 people working for me. I just prepare my outing and I want to switch My appearence end of March after having my FFS mid of March.

I started with speaking with HR. They will support my outing and I speak with a psychologist from HR about the nect steps. Next weeks I will have my outing at my direct boss. The week after I will tell it my employees which are directly reporting to me. I will give them some background informations and a information guideline for potential customer questions. After my break I will send an email with some background information to all people with I work with and on the first day I will work around to give the opportunity to the people to speak with me.

That is the plan :-) I am on hormones only three months but my breasts are not important. For me speech training and the FFS are extremly important. Gair extensions will help as well as the beard epilation helps. My gender change of the hirth certificate is on the way and I hope to have it finished in three months.

Lara

Can you check with COGAM in Madrid? They may have info on similar cases.

Quote from: Lara1969 on February 19, 2014, 01:57:44 PM
I work in senior level management level of are large company. I have approx. 300 people working for me. I just prepare my outing and I want to switch My appearence end of March after having my FFS mid of March.



Lara

Well you certainly seem to have your head screwed on straight. I wanted to add something I forgot to say from before that if it's possible to transition at a job and actually "finish" the transition at the job, them I would suggest doing it. My feeling though is that once it was all done for me, I didn't want to wear the transgender thing on my sleeves anymore. I just wanted to be somewhere new where nobody knew me and see if I could still make it with the talent I had, if that makes any sense.

In my humble opinion, and only mine, once it gets out, a career will stall out at that point. The more successful one becomes the more important stealth is. For me, just for my own sanity, because I just be another plain old woman in the conference room contributing to a topic. Hope that makes sense and best of luck in what you hope to do 

Hiya!

Lara, yours is a wonderful and optimistic story, and I think I will be speaking for all of us in wishing you a brilliant and successful professional transition.  Totally agree with you on the voice training and FFS - I'm still rather far from the point of wanting to consider those, but they'd be totally vital for me!!

@AppleJack - COGAM's trans group appears to have gone into hibernation and its relevance is not so clear.  There is a better group called AET Transexualia and I do interact with them.  Official information is not so easy to obtain, but I think there is strong legal protection for all LGBT people in the workplace (see en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LGBT_rights_in_Spain), but I'm guessing that the best way to ensure the most trouble-free transition at work is to get official support from HR, then from senior managers, close work colleagues and then the rest.

Appreciate your great insight - thanks!!!

All this talk about being taken less serious and limiting opportunities when your gender is changed is true! It just means you have to have thicker skin and work a little harder to get the same position but not pay as a man.

I work in retail and often I am ignored or treated as I do not know the simplest thing. Everyday there is story....today I asked a man if he needed help finding something...he said no. He than turned around and asked a male coworker where something was. Geez, I didn't ask him if he needed help fixing his car!! I simply asked if he needed help finding something....apparently I'm not qualified to know! This happens so much...I have become accustomed to it and it doesn't bother me as much....but certain days!

I have found out that even older women that have had to deal with this type of mentality all their lives have come to the point of accepting it...but it still bothers them at times also. I still will take the extra perks I do get to enjoy from being a women.

It does go hand in hand though....some women expect to be treated more delicately or different. Something like holding the door open for the person behind you. Some young girls will rudely walk in and not even care....most people women or men will keep it open for the next person. Men will generally wait and hold a door open for women....most women won't do the same. I have become accustomed to also not doing this...its just really weird to hold open a door for a man unless he was walking in behind me.

I did have something odd happen the other day. I had to go to the local court house to pay taxes....as I was about to walk in an elderly gentleman with a cane was behind me....rather than just keep the door open and let him walk in behind me I held it open...the look on his face was a shock of embarrassment and he quickly walked in and made sure he held the second set of doors open for me. I said thank you and just giggled!!

Quote from: Just Shelly on February 19, 2014, 06:01:57 PM. I did have something odd happen the other day. I had to go to the local court house to pay taxes....as I was about to walk in an elderly gentleman with a cane was behind me....rather than just keep the door open and let him walk in behind me I held it open...the look on his face was a shock of embarrassment and he quickly walked in and made sure he held the second set of doors open for me. I said thank you and just giggled!!

Well Shelly, I think the lack of courtesy in terms of opening doors etc. is just a general loss of good manners almost everywhere :-(   Here in Spain I am waging a one-person war on such things - totally futile I know - but when I open a door for someone and don't get thanked I let them have it with both barrels.  There is no excuse of rudeness, or baseball caps worn backwards 

My apologies coming in late.
Been at WPATH.

Me coming out? OK I'm a Prof of Medicine and I have had a few snide comments from juniors more than anyone. Relatively easy to deal with.

I did an analysis of pros and cons that included all variables as far as I could envisage, I worked on my perceived weaknesses.

I am a far stronger person than he was, I'm more effective and I'm more dominant. Woman often are. We just play the cards differently. I'm egocentric, which allowed me to ride the hurt but I made damn sure I could deliver.

So the company ended up with a woman who could do her job better than he could. In practice that was the key. Companies, and business want positive outcomes. I made sure I delivered.

Being me was then irrelevant.