Don't want to seem like a hater, but does anyone else feel like she's making trans people seem radical and so out there? I understand the concepts she's trying to shed light on, but a lot of people who aren't aware or in the lgbt community just react negatively to her.

Discuss.

No, I feel the same way. I wouldn't say that I dislike her, but I feel like she definitely rubs me in the wrong way, so I can't imagine how she must come across to cisgender people with no knowledge of transgender issues. I appreciate what she's trying to do and I think the trans community is better off on the whole as a result of her efforts, but she doesn't give me the same warm fuzzies that I get from Laverne Cox.

That said I will probably still buy her book to see where she's coming from a bit better.

I have no problem with Janet.  Well, except for the fact that she's much younger than I am, and her experiences differ greatly from what I've gone through. 

I lament the fact that the last prominently accepted, and older American spokeswoman for trans issues was also the first American spokeswoman.  In her later years Christine Jorgenson spoke so eloquently about trans rights, public perceptions, and our responsibility to be true to ourselves first.  I realize the changing generations have left me behind, but that doesn't mean I can't respect the views of those who now stand on the soap box.  The girls now days don't dictate a specific representation for me in their words, but I also don't speak for them.

Peace

Until I saw her on Colbert recently I'd never heard of her. Sometimes you need people to rock the boat a bit otherwise the status quo remains. Same could be said of certain women's rights activists in the early 1970s or the suffragettes before them. It's hard to gauge how good she is or isn't from her Colbert appearance, his 'interview' style frequently wrong foots his guests, but she handled herself well enough.

What I'd like to know is if she's had vocal surgery because her voice was great!

I agree with Grace, Being "nice" doesn't exactly get the job done.

I think frustration got the better of her after the Piers Morgan interview. It kinda left a sour taste with some. In my opinion the same thing happened with the Carmen Carrea & Laverne Cox interview with Katie Couric. These journalists tend to ask the same typical questions surrounding surgeries or they can't seem to get past "So you were born a boy" angle. So I understand where they all were coming from.

I love Janet I think she's amazing and so is her story. I read her new book cover to cover and I enjoyed it. I also love the fact that her story is one that I can relate to in a lot of ways. We need more experiences and stories to be told. A lot of times the media only highlights certain types of trans experiences that I and girls I know can't relate to. For example, Janet is 29, I'm 30, and were both African American. Her's is really the only real lived experience that mirrors my own.  I don't know what it's like to be married with kids while transitioning later in life . I also don't know what it's like to transition as a child or tween, something the media has been focusing on a lot lately. In reality most trans people fall in between both those scenarios, yet you rarely if ever hear those kinds of stories.

I thought her appearance on the Colbert Report was fun and light hearted, way better than the uncomfortable and typical one done by Piers Morgan.

Quote from: Ave on February 20, 2014, 09:30:59 PM
Don't want to seem like a hater, but does anyone else feel like she's making trans people seem radical and so out there? I understand the concepts she's trying to shed light on, but a lot of people who aren't aware or in the lgbt community just react negatively to her.

Discuss.

Like Kathy said, she is young.

I do not think she knew the power of her tweets when she retaliated against Piers Morgan, and they both looked pretty bad in their second interview.

That was a missed opportunity for a teachable moment.

So, I have mixed feelings, I just wouldn't hang on every single word that comes out of any 29 year opd's mouth.

I like her.

Haven't read her book yet but I thought she did pretty good during her interviews with Piers Morgan. The whole twitterstorm after was a bit much though. I agree that there was a missed opportunity there and things could have been handled better. The Colbert appearance was funny, I just wish it had been longer and they could have discussed more issues.

I do think she is very beautiful. Her hair is amazing and I'm tempted to draw or paint a portrait of her just so I can get creative with that hair. But, I digress...

I think Janet has been more an influence of good for the community. She sometimes makes mistakes... welp, go figure, she's human. And not all her opinions are shared by everyone in the trans* community. But you know what, at least she's putting her best foot forward and trying to make a positive difference.

I liked her but she looked bad in the piers Morgan interview and yes,  it  agree,  people do then think that we are all radical.

I think Janet is exactly where she needs to be right now.

She has brought the issues of trans people everywhere into the mainstream discussion.  She has declared that talking about our genitals is off limits (I would have loved her to ask: "Tell me Piers, how did your vasectomy go?  Have you healed from your hemorrhoid operation?").  She has shown the spotlight on the tragedy of trans youth.

We need some radicalism in order for others to take notice.

People, we are a minority within a minority.  The ONLY way we will make progress for equality as a group will be with the assistance of our allies.  The only way we can get allies is to make others notice us.

I have not read her book yet (but now I think I will) because I have read so many other books about trans persons transition and lived my own.  In many ways they are all similar because we follow much the same path on our journey.  However, I hope it becomes a best seller.  Because it would mean that other people are finally beginning to take notice. 

Both straight and LGB folks have the same misunderstanding of what being trans is.  It is NOT drag and outrageous outfits, but so many think it is.  And Janet is letting everyone know what it really is.

More power to her!

-Sandy

I cant help but like her. She was and is an inspiration to me and her activism has made the message clear for young trans* that its ok to be who you are. With Peirce Morgan she reacted to the tagline "Was a boy until 18", which she felt sensationalized her story. I think her message to Peirce was that she was always a girl and that the Cis*gender community is missing the point. 

Quote from: Ave on February 20, 2014, 09:30:59 PM
Don't want to seem like a hater, but does anyone else feel like she's making trans people seem radical and so out there? I understand the concepts she's trying to shed light on, but a lot of people who aren't aware or in the lgbt community just react negatively to her.

Discuss.

Yes. I had the same thoughts. IMO, using non-binary pronouns for until they correct her, comes off as nutty.

Quote from: suzifrommd on February 21, 2014, 06:53:58 AM
Yes. I had the same thoughts. IMO, using non-binary pronouns for until they correct her, comes off as nutty.

There's also a clip of her around the Internet talking about how there is no such thing as passing because to refer to "passing" implies that one is passing as something that one is not.  So (her example) a transwoman does not "pass" as a woman because that implies the transwoman is not a woman.  The transwoman is just a woman.  She (Janet Mock) seems to miss the point that if you are "passing" then you are taken as cisgender when you are not.  So there still is such a thing as passing.  But there are some trans* people to whom her view of the issue is very appealing.

I think she's young and a little half-baked at times.  She's obviously very inexperienced.  The thing about pronouns for children seemed like she got drawn into saying something that comes across as nutty because she just didn't know any better.  The Piers Morgan interviews likewise showed that she is being put into spotlights that she is not yet ready for.

I consider her (and Laverne Cox and Carmen Carerra) to be the trans* celebrities du jour.  They come and they go.  Hopefully we make some progress thanks to them before someone else comes along.  Time will tell if Janet Mock or any of the others become long lasting, serious voices for equality.  But they all need some maturation before I'll be very interested in them. 

Quote from: Ms Grace on February 21, 2014, 12:46:42 AM
What I'd like to know is if she's had vocal surgery because her voice was great!

Although I don't know the details, I do know she transitioned extremely young (SRS at 18, which suggests other things may have happened earlier).  She may have transitioned before her voice changed fully.

The problem is that rather than explaining why he had done something wrong, she attacked him after.  He was trying to be respectful but failed so education is what was needed not hate. 

Quote from: Akira21 ♡♡♡ on February 21, 2014, 08:14:28 AM
The problem is that rather than explaining why he had done something wrong, she attacked him after.  He was trying to be respectful but failed so education is what was needed not hate.

I think hate is way over stating what she actually said if you actually read the tweets.

Actually, I would say the Problem, (with a capital P) is that we allow our celebrities to speak for us rather than choosing and supporting intelligent, articulate leaders, the way many other marginalized minorities do.

Of course celebrities will get their share of talk show attention. But they are not experts and they only know their own situation.

I think their media presence needs to be balanced by transgender leaders who are knowledgeable about all our issues and have thought deeply about solutions.

Quote from: ThePhoenix on February 21, 2014, 08:37:36 AM
I think hate is way over stating what she actually said if you actually read the tweets.

You are right, I was using it in the more modern sense - hating on someone.

Still.... this does sound pretty harsh for someone who was all smiles and grins on the show:
"Was a boy until 18." @PiersMorganLive get it the f*k together."

All I am saying is she should have adopted the role of an educator, rather than adopting a confrontational stance. It will make people think that they shouldn't talk to us because they might get things wrong and we will do *that* to them.

Quote from: suzifrommd on February 21, 2014, 06:53:58 AM
Yes. I had the same thoughts. IMO, using non-binary pronouns for until they correct her, comes off as nutty.

Maybe, but then so did feminists when they said using "Man" to describe collective men and women was wrong, that titles like Chairman applying to both men an women, etc was part of language making women invisible.

Quote from: Ms Grace on February 21, 2014, 11:08:14 AM
Maybe, but then so did feminists when they said using "Man" to describe collective men and women was wrong, that titles like Chairman applying to both men an women, etc was part of language making women invisible.

I don't think that came off as nutty at all. Especially as women proliferating in the professional workforce. It was quite clear that chairman, fireman, policeman, etc. was very obviously not descriptive and contrary to reality.

Not so for using "they" for someone who gives no outward signs of being unhappy with a binary identity.

Quote from: suzifrommd on February 21, 2014, 11:12:51 AM
I don't think that came off as nutty at all. Especially as women proliferating in the professional workforce. It was quite clear that chairman, fireman, policeman, etc. was very obviously not descriptive and contrary to reality.

Not nutty to you perhaps, which is great, but it sure was for a lot of people (men and women) at the time and took well over fifteen years to shift the common parlance and official titles in many areas of daily life. And I can't believe "mankind" persists when "humanity" will do the job equally well.

I personally use they/their only if I'm unsure what gender a person is presenting/identifying as.