Such as when they say they really do care? I don't know if it's my own insecurities, general trust issues or what. Maybe it has to do with not accepting myself. I feel like it's my own self that has kept me alone all these years. Like there are people I could turn to, I just fear they have evil motives. I can't even muster the courage to have a deep conversation with my Mom. I always feel like she will reject me or tell me my opinions are wrong. Even though she seems to be pretty cool with everything.

Yes I do Lizzie. Unless I know them on a personal level, the care for the most part is to make themselves look good or feel good about themselves. Show me, don't tell me and then I may think you care. Talk is cheap.

It's true that actions speak louder than words. You should judge people by their actions. There's also the idea that the proof is in the pudding. That is, you judge the quality of something by the results.

In the meantime, here on an Internet forum, we kinda only have words to judge people by. I guess people sometimes share things that are happening in their lives though.

Quote from: dalebert on February 24, 2014, 03:31:29 PM
It's true that actions speak louder than words. You should judge people by their actions. There's also the idea that the proof is in the pudding. That is, you judge the quality of something by the results.

In the meantime, here on an Internet forum, we kinda only have words to judge people by. I guess people sometimes share things that are happening in their lives though.

Yeah dalebert, but here, at least at susan's we are all pretty much in the same boat or others that sincerely do care. So when someone here says they care I can believe that. Now if I was on Youtube talking about the same things then I would believe more like I said earlier.

I find it really hard to trust.

In some ways that's a good thing, because I keep my expectations low so they are less likely to be stepped on. It's also helped me hone my instincts (which still have been wrong on occasion).

But it makes it hard truly to settle into close friendships.

Quote from: suzifrommd on February 24, 2014, 05:32:23 PM
I find it really hard to trust.

In some ways that's a good thing, because I keep my expectations low so they are less likely to be stepped on. ....

But it makes it hard truly to settle into close friendships.

Are you sure you aren't really me?  (Oh, , in case it wasn't obvious. )

This pretty much describes me.

My life seems to be an endless cycle of finding a group I think I belong in, staying a while, then eventually realizing there's a mismatch between me and the culture of the group that's basically destroying me, and then leaving to save myself.  Family, first school, then high school and my home town, then ....  Most recently, a marriage and the religious group I was deeply involved in for ~25 years.  (I'd have added "male culture/masculinity" to the list, except the whole male / masculinity thing has always been so alien to me that when I finally formally rejected it (in my mind, at least), it hasn't felt like anything changed.)

I don't know if I seek out places where I can't survive in the long run, or if I'm just so much the wrong shape I can't fit in anywhere.

I've gotten to the point that I carefully stay on the fringes of any group I'm with and never stick my neck out or show myself any further than I've determined, after careful observation and calculation, won't get me into trouble.  (I can't help thinking of Hans Biberkopf, at the end of Berlin Alexanderplatz.)


Maybe that's why I'm reluctant to say I'm transgender, or to seriously consider transitioning, because I'm afraid I wouldn't be any better able to be a woman than I have been able to be a man.  (Or maybe it's that I wouldn't feel any more at home with myself trying to be a woman than I do now being nominally a man.)

Quote from: Asche on February 24, 2014, 06:56:57 PM
Are you sure you aren't really me? 

Actually, I'm not so sure after reading this:

Quote from: Asche on February 24, 2014, 06:56:57 PM
My life seems to be an endless cycle of finding a group I think I belong in, staying a while, then eventually realizing there's a mismatch between me and the culture of the group

These words totally describe how I am just about everywhere I go. I have so much trouble allowing myself fully to be present in any community I find myself in. Sometimes because I see people as so different from me, but also sometimes because people there reject me as a perpetual outsider because that's how I see myself. In the end, I leave, feeling rejected and disconnected.

Quote from: suzifrommd on February 25, 2014, 10:45:41 AM

These words totally describe how I am just about everywhere I go. I have so much trouble allowing myself fully to be present in any community I find myself in. Sometimes because I see people as so different from me, but also sometimes because people there reject me as a perpetual outsider because that's how I see myself. In the end, I leave, feeling rejected and disconnected.

That's how I feel right now, right here, all the time. My therapist says it's because I "mind read" too much.

I find it hard to believe that people are honest with me when many of them aren't even honest with themselves.

Quote from: Lizzie on February 25, 2014, 10:50:47 AM
My therapist says it's because I "mind read" too much.

I think that's common for a lot of folks. We think for people because we're too afraid to get to the bottom of what's really going on in case that turns out to be worse than we feared. And that eventuality is something we're not prepared for. So we look for things which fit what we already believe ourselves. Things which fit the pattern. It's not so much someone else's mind which gets read, but our own. And projected onto whoever we are with. People become mirrors for our own insecurities.

It's hard to feel comfortable with someone else when you don't feel comfortable with yourself. Because there's always that nagging voice in the back of your mind. "I wonder if they've picked up on the way I'm feeling." or "God, I'm hopeless at this, how could they possibly see anything in me to get along with?" or "How can they care? They don't know me. They don't know who I am. Hell, I don't even know who I am, so how can someone else?"

It becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy, in a way, since I think belief in others largely stems from a belief in oneself, and vice versa... being able to go into relationships free of preconceptions and predictions based on negative self-talk. It's hard to hear someone else's voice when our own critical one is constantly shouting in our ears. So telling that one to shut up is one way to maybe gain a more objective world view and a view of those we're with and surrounded by.

Those are my thoughts, anyway.

Yes i do not trust other people much ,and every year passing less !
Most are just fancy talkers 

I have severe trust issues. It stems all the way back to having a narcissistic mother as a kid (yes, that's a real term - google it). Then being trans and getting all of the abuse that came along with that as a pre-teen/teenager just sealed the deal. I learned to live in my head and to only trust myself, and I built a wall around myself, locked the door, and threw away the key.

For years i took whatever people told me with a lot of skepticism, and I searched for hidden meanings and intents in their words.

That wall is slowly coming down as I learn that generally people will not take advantage of me or the way I am or how I feel.