Quote from: Dahlia on March 04, 2014, 06:32:23 AM
Balding, beergut, pot bellied men don't get admired too...especially when they're looking middle aged before their time, say, early 30's...

The kind of 'admired' older men you're talking about is very, very rare, someone like George Clooney or Brad Pitt.

It's true we don't think every old man is hot, but there is an enormous disparity between the number of aging men that are considered attractive compared to women.

Quote from: Just Shelly on March 03, 2014, 08:05:41 PM
Oh don't even go there!!

I think I regret my age more because of what I missed than for the matter of just getting old.....even now I feel like time is running out before I can have GRS. I would like the ability to date with the correct anatomical equipment before I get too old. Especially now since I see men entirely different then before!!

I do think back to when I was 25 often...I was very close to starting my transition then. I don't look back as much in regret, mostly because I had the ability to have 3 wonderful children that completed me even more.....but I wonder who I would of been if I did transition then.

What ifs are tempting, but usually don't lead to good feelings.  And the fact that you have 3 children who you seem to love is likely is an amazing accomplishment. 

It's funny but there are so many older women that I look up to.  In fact, age doesn't always need to be a negative thing.  Sometimes age allows a certain level of wisdom and maturity that is more than valuable youth alone.  And I know plenty of youthful looking women that don't look their age, including the op of this post.   Don't let it get you down.  Sometimes I do and then I realize how silly it really is even though I'll always be a bit sad about what I've missed out on.

As for age determining attraction, it's not really a factor in my book.  I think there are plenty of handsome older men, though I wouldn't really consider dating someone too much outside my age group.  I'm sure there are men who feel the same way about "older" women. 

Quote from: learningtolive on March 04, 2014, 06:55:54 PM
What ifs are tempting, but usually don't lead to good feelings. 

This is wise.

I'm tempted often to wonder what my life would have been like if I'd transitioned as a teenager.

But being a woman is all the more rewarding and amazing for having been denied me for 50 years.

Quote from: suzifrommd on March 04, 2014, 07:00:37 PM

Quote from: learningtolive on March 04, 2014, 06:55:54 PM
What ifs are tempting, but usually don't lead to good feelings. 

This is wise.

I'm tempted often to wonder what my life would have been like if I'd transitioned as a teenager.

But being a woman is all the more rewarding and amazing for having been denied me for 50 years.

Good point. And mature women were revered at one point and in some places probably still are. It's really only now that there's only one 'age' of woman. Naomi Wolf puts it well - men have different acceptable stages according to today's society - boy and man. Women nowadays have only - girl. The other stages of a woman's life are no longer celebrated. Women today are told to try to look like girls forever. Most women in their 50s today are probably feeling like their best days are behind them. Maybe it takes a new woman emerging into herself as a mature woman of 50+ to recognize and feel the glory of what was once felt by the mature woman.

You know, there was a dear friend on here years ago that I still miss who identified herself as 'crone'. I don't know how old she was, but it wasn't important. She transitioned and adopted the term 'crone'. I think she said a woman's stages of life went something like - maiden, mother, crone. I thought that was fabulous.

Quote from: FA on March 04, 2014, 08:06:51 PM
This is wise.

I'm tempted often to wonder what my life would have been like if I'd transitioned as a teenager.

But being a woman is all the more rewarding and amazing for having been denied me for 50 years.


Good point. And mature women were revered at one point and in some places probably still are. It's really only now that there's only one 'age' of woman. Naomi Wolf puts it well - men have different acceptable stages according to today's society - boy and man. Women nowadays have only - girl. The other stages of a woman's life are no longer celebrated. Women today are told to try to look like girls forever. Most women in their 50s today are probably feeling like their best days are behind them. Maybe it takes a new woman emerging into herself as a mature woman of 50+ to recognize and feel the glory of what was once felt by the mature woman.

You know, there was a dear friend on here years ago that I still miss who identified herself as 'crone'. I don't know how old she was, but it wasn't important. She transitioned and adopted the term 'crone'. I think she said a woman's stages of life went something like - maiden, mother, crone. I thought that was fabulous.

While I really do struggle with the concept of aging, I've always had a lot of respect for my elders.  One person in particular was my college mentor.  Not only was she one of the most intelligent people I've ever met, but she was accomplished in so many ways in her life and seemed to be enjoying her life to the fullest.  To see her life reduced to only her age or looks would be a tragedy to me because it ignores all that she stood for as a human.  This can apply to many other women out there.  Sadly, people do put too much stock on beauty and as I transition it's really taking it's toll on me.  In the past, I enjoyed vanity, but I didn't feel like it must overtake me the way I'm starting to feel pressured to.  Not once did I use to feel my looks defined me the way they do now.  It's a bit sad because now I really feel it rather than see it happening around me to other girls.  A woman is so much more than her looks, but all of us want to have our looks as well because we feel pressure.   

Quote from: learningtolive on March 04, 2014, 08:20:34 PM

While I really do struggle with the concept of aging, I've always had a lot of respect for my elders.  One person in particular was my college mentor.  Not only was she one of the most intelligent people I've ever met, but she was accomplished in so many ways in her life and seemed to be enjoying her life to the fullest.  To see her life reduced to only her age or looks would be a tragedy to me because it ignores all that she stood for as a human.  This can apply to many other women out there.  Sadly, people do put too much stock on beauty and as I transition it's really taking it's toll on me.  In the past, I enjoyed vanity, but I didn't feel like it must overtake me the way I'm starting to feel pressured to.  Not once did I use to feel my looks defined me the way they do now.  It's a bit sad because now I really feel it rather than see it happening around me to other girls.  A woman is so much more than her looks, but all of us want to have our looks as well because we feel pressure.

yep. Welcome to womanhood. Sorry that sounded snarky. But it's true. At least in the US.

I remember at 18 getting the strong message that the bloom was off the rose. Or would soon be. The message is everywhere - women are 'worth' the most in their teens and early 20s. And the younger the better. Now I'm not claiming every woman out there feels as strongly about this. But I think it's an element in most women's lives and self esteem profiles whether they realize or not. The youth and beauty thing. And that it particularly affects women deemed attractive by society. I mean, let's be honest, women who know they can't compete in the game can't afford to care that much (though they are probably affected by it from the other side).

And it's not just theory or the media. This looks thing has real implications for women in their everyday lives. Both relationships and career wise. So while I think age is a worry for everyone, women get this sort of 'I'm a depreciating asset' programming way more than men. Now I know I'm putting this in a blunt way. And at first blush, people may be like 'what!' but that's because it's so normalized.

So yeah, as a 'beautiful girl' at 18, I was getting the message of doom. That I needed to preserve myself, look into different treatments, start worrying about plastic surgery, etc, etc. I ordered hair pills and learned facial exercises. I've had bouts of anorexia eating like 200 calories a day that probably permanently destroyed my body as have most cis women. (now part of this was dysphoria but part was also about being a girl) Because it's always about the body. Always.

Societal wise, men are in a behavioral strait jacket and women are in a body strait jacket.

Quote from: FA on March 04, 2014, 08:35:18 PM
Societal wise, men are in a behavioral strait jacket and women are in a body strait jacket.

I couldn't agree with this more.  The more I transition the more "free" I feel and the more self conscious I appear about my body and overall appearance. 

Quote from: learningtolive on March 04, 2014, 09:31:34 PM

Quote from: FA on March 04, 2014, 08:35:18 PM
Societal wise, men are in a behavioral strait jacket and women are in a body strait jacket.

I couldn't agree with this more.  The more I transition the more "free" I feel and the more self conscious I appear about my body and overall appearance.

Yeah, it's almost immediate, isn't it? You really do pick up the expectations quick. I mean, I didn't get the socialization as a boy, but just walking in the world as a man, you feel the restrictions. You just automatically know how to act. Or should I say how not to act. Entering a woman's role may or may not be more subtle, but still it's picked up sooner or later. Most people just take this stuff for granted. Maybe it takes a trans person to really recognize it. Gender roles suck.

"To men a man is but a mind. Who cares what face he carries or what he wears? But a woman's body is the woman." Ambrose Bierce

Quote from: FA on March 04, 2014, 11:43:37 PM
I couldn't agree with this more.  The more I transition the more "free" I feel and the more self conscious I appear about my body and overall appearance.


Yeah, it's almost immediate, isn't it? You really do pick up the expectations quick. I mean, I didn't get the socialization as a boy, but just walking in the world as a man, you feel the restrictions. You just automatically know how to act. Or should I say how not to act. Entering a woman's role may or may not be more subtle, but still it's picked up sooner or later. Most people just take this stuff for granted. Maybe it takes a trans person to really recognize it. Gender roles suck.

"To men a man is but a mind. Who cares what face he carries or what he wears? But a woman's body is the woman." Ambrose Bierce

That quote makes me mad..

Quote from: Jen on March 05, 2014, 12:41:22 AM

Quote from: FA on March 04, 2014, 11:43:37 PM
I couldn't agree with this more.  The more I transition the more "free" I feel and the more self conscious I appear about my body and overall appearance.


Yeah, it's almost immediate, isn't it? You really do pick up the expectations quick. I mean, I didn't get the socialization as a boy, but just walking in the world as a man, you feel the restrictions. You just automatically know how to act. Or should I say how not to act. Entering a woman's role may or may not be more subtle, but still it's picked up sooner or later. Most people just take this stuff for granted. Maybe it takes a trans person to really recognize it. Gender roles suck.

"To men a man is but a mind. Who cares what face he carries or what he wears? But a woman's body is the woman." Ambrose Bierce

That quote makes me mad..

Well, I think it kinda sums it up, unfortunately. I don't think anyone would be caught dead saying that today.

Yeah, it makes me mad cause I think people still think that way.

I think the Eskimos had it right.  When the old could no longer contribute, drop them off on the ice floe.



Hopefully the cold would take care of them before the polar bears or the orcas.  Get the kayak, I'm ready.

   I would much rather be a comfortable old woman than an old man even if I can stop a timex !

I think HRT slows down aging.I'm 56 and people often tell me I don't look it despite not dyeing my hair or hardly ever wearing make up.

Quote from: FA on March 04, 2014, 08:35:18 PM
Societal wise, men are in a behavioral strait jacket and women are in a body strait jacket.

Yes, especially in dating interactions.

However in other parts of society, I haven't found being an aging woman restrictive. Younger women seem to be under much more stringent expectations as far as fashion and behavior. The older we get, it seems, the more society condones being our own women (which, face it, it the BEST part of being female).

Quote from: suzifrommd on March 05, 2014, 06:39:43 AM

Quote from: FA on March 04, 2014, 08:35:18 PM
Societal wise, men are in a behavioral strait jacket and women are in a body strait jacket.

Yes, especially in dating interactions.

However in other parts of society, I haven't found being an aging woman restrictive. Younger women seem to be under much more stringent expectations as far as fashion and behavior. The older we get, it seems, the more society condones being our own women (which, face it, it the BEST part of being female).

I imagine that's true. I've only ever been a young woman so most of my comments on female stuff come from that perspective. Older women do seem to be less scrutinized. I mean, I doubt older women get much flak for putting on 20lbs or something. Maybe in certain women's circles. As a young woman, no one ever shuts up about your body, especially other females. I imagine it's kind of similar to the way guys police other's masculinity or lack thereof.

Quote from: big kim on March 05, 2014, 02:58:45 AM
I think HRT slows down aging.I'm 56 and people often tell me I don't look it despite not dyeing my hair or hardly ever wearing make up.

New proof testosterone reason women outlive men: study

https://www.susans.org/forums/index.php/topic,127233.msg1003211.html#msg1003211

barbie~~

I'm 25 and I wish I would age a little lol. It can be bad to be thought of as a teenager when you're really a mature adult! Adults dont take me seriously at all and it drives me nuts.

Quote from: HelloKitty on March 05, 2014, 12:08:41 PM
I'm 25 and I wish I would age a little lol. It can be bad to be thought of as a teenager when you're really a mature adult! Adults dont take me seriously at all and it drives me nuts.

I don't mind it so much. I went to Dairy Queen last week and the guy behind the counter referred to me as "a young lady" and I'm 36. So, I thought that was pretty cool.

Quote from: HelloKitty on March 05, 2014, 12:08:41 PM
I'm 25 and I wish I would age a little lol. It can be bad to be thought of as a teenager when you're really a mature adult! Adults dont take me seriously at all and it drives me nuts.

It's funny because people always used to take me seriously as a "guy" even when I was younger.  I was the sort that somehow got some of my elders to respect me. Now that I'm in the process of transitioning I feel like that's diminishing with time.  Not to say I don't get any respect, but more that I feel like I'm treated more like a kid in some ways.