This story seems vaguely familiar from a country going under.

http://www.cbn.com/tv/3255110732001

Thank you for posting this.  All the more reason for the US to get its debt under control.

I think North America and Europe are going to be fine; I don't think we are going to see an migration of all our wealthy and youthful to China or India so I am not worried.

CBN

Lol.

Oh, if I was making millions of euros a year, and the government decided to tax me 75% for two years (which is when the tax will expire) and will only affect 5% of my company's revenue (which the video I think skipped over that little detail) in order to help people who are far less fortunate than me, build bridges, repair roads, and fund schools, you are DAMNED RIGHT I would be okay with it.  Oh no, some athletes complain about it? Not a damn given.

BTW, CBN is worse than FOX as far as unbiased reporting goes.  They still think abortion causes breast cancer.

Quote from: Hikari on March 09, 2014, 01:39:48 PM
I think North America and Europe are going to be fine; I don't think we are going to see an migration of all our wealthy and youthful to China or India so I am not worried.

But you may see/are seeing investment capital headed that way.

What was it that Ross Perot said back in 1992?  He could hear a "giant sucking sound" from jobs and money leaving the country.  When will kill off our entrepreneurial class we will have devolved into a third-world hell hole.

There's a fine line between capital wealth and sacrificing basic human rights.

The French have a mandatory five weeks of paid vacation, a 35-hour work week, FREE college education, free child care, virtually free health care, and the 4th highest minimum-wage in the world.

America? No mandantory vacation time, the highest college costs in the entire world, and the highest healthcare costs in the entire world, plus none of those extra government services for family-planning and whatnot.

Complain about excess government spending all you want, it's certainly not actually being spent on helping the people in this country. It's disproportionately (66%) going to medicare and medicaid, defense, and social security. And these costs aren't skyrocketing because of government excess... they're skyrocketing because our country's biggest employers are all cutting out health insurance, pensions, and a livable wage, for the sake of profits. We didn't have this problem back when decent-paying full-time jobs with benefits weren't such a rarity. People didn't have to depend on food stamps, medicaid, and social security back then.

Again, I know economic prosperity is important, but there comes a time where a quest for profits above all else robs people of a livable wage for the sake of keeping profits going up. And I believe America has crossed that line. Economic inequality between the top 10% and the bottom 90% at this point is now officially at the highest levels it's ever been... even higher than during the Great Depression.





I'm not saying that we should go the France route... clearly they've gone too far in the other direction. But we're getting to the point where we're losing the middle class because decent-paying jobs and benefits are completely being eliminated for the sake of corporate profits. There's got to be a reasonable middle ground somewhere, where there's still incentive to start businesses and build wealth, but this business doesn't come at the expense of workers' basic human right to a livable wage.

Right and I'm sure that the French people they were interviewing were just lying through their teeth! I am surprised at how abysmally closed minded some are to facts being presented by indigenous French citizens. How is it that some people think that have the corner on the truth without considering the testimony of those who are living there and dealing with out of control hyperinflation? Why not move there if it's so much better than what you have here?

^And what about the testimonies of all of the people that OUR system is failing? All of the people who had their skilled labor positions eliminated, their benefits slashed, who had to give up decent-paying jobs to take part-time minimum-wage jobs at places like Walmart just to stay employed, and are now being driven into poverty? All of the college graduates who are $50,000 in debt due to education costs and yet still can't find a job?

It's a different complaint, admittedly. In France, people are having issues with entitlement, excessive government programs, and therefore no incentive to become wealthy. Here, we have the opposite problem.

Again, surely there's a good middle ground somewhere? Where the government makes sure that working people can at least afford the basic human needs of shelter, food, health, and a family, but economic incentive and ambition are still rewarded?

I'm not saying France is better. Their system is also unhealthy. I just believe that we're so far in the other direction that it's not healthy either.

Quote from: Carrie Liz on March 09, 2014, 04:01:07 PM

I'm not saying France is better. I'm just saying that I believe we're so far in the other direction that it's not healthy either.

I couldn't agree with you more and it is a travesty, because once big business started shipping all the middle income level manufacturing jobs overseas, President Clinton and his predominantly Republican congress waived the full speed ahead flag by joining hands across the aisle signing on to the Nafta and Pacific Rim agreements at warp speed which in retrospect was a huge mistake. Between that and the strangle hold the banking cabal known as "The Fed" has on us, we will be soon experiencing hyperinflation and what goes on in European countries is certainly a reflection of what we can expect will happen here.

Amerika is upon us.

QuoteComplain about excess government spending all you want, it's certainly not actually being spent on helping the people in this country.

Excessive government spending in the form of deficit spending is harming everyone, especially future generations who are having this burden placed on them with no say in the matter.

Balanced Budget and Congressional Term Limits amendments NOW!

According to Bloomberg, "20 countries with the highest proportion of millionaires"

1. Singapore
2. Switzerland (1)
3. Qatar
4. Hong Kong
5. Kuwait
6. United Arab Emirates
7. United States (2)
8. Taiwan (3)
9. Israel (4)
10. Belgium (5)
11. Japan (6)
12. Bahrain
13. Ireland (7)
14. Netherlands (8.)
15. United Kingdom (9)
16. Oman
17. Saudi Arabia
18. Denmark (10)
19. Australia (11)
20. Canada (12)

If you remove the two city-states, and the Arab sheikdoms in which the oil wealth is distributed among the extended royal families, you get the listing shown in parentheses.

Quote from: Jamie D on March 09, 2014, 11:08:45 PM
Balanced Budget and Congressional Term Limits amendments NOW!

Absolutely... 

  It is a warning.  The French has always snubbed those who innovate in their own country.  They were called "elitists" in the French schools if they get high scores regularly.  There has always been a brain drain there.  "ObamaCare" here in the US is one symptom of the problem here.  With ObamaCare, some medical treatments are no longer available because the insurance companies said so.  Some are outright banned or that treatment is not covered at all, it is fully out-of-pocket. 
  Out-sourcing and added responsibilities to current employees due to no new hires if a worker retires or gets fired with no pay raise does cause people to get disillusioned about their job.  Getting a degree does not help much anymore.  I see too many kids out there doing jobs that is not their degree description and these same kids are in debt in their student loans.  Student loan defaults are not forgivable if you file for bankruptcy.  It is the modern business model that all aspects of a business should make a profit.  When I worked for a large consumer electronics company in their service department in 1981, the service department was not making any money, but we were treated better and got paid more than the salespeople.  It was the slogan "We service what we sell" that brought customers in the store to buy something and something more later if the servicing of a defective product was satisfactory, even if it was out-of-warranty.  Most electronic items today are made in such a way that they are not serviceable when these fail. 
  The salespeople in my old company today are encouraged to approach the customer who walks in buy a certain item, that they are instructed to goad the customer to buy other things additional.  That company is closing 1100 stores because of poor sales and the customers are not coming in because of the high pressure salesmanship.  People cannot afford anything they do not want these days.  They go elsewhere. 

  Joelene

Quote from: Joelene9 on March 09, 2014, 11:48:55 PM
With ObamaCare, some medical treatments are no longer available because the insurance companies said so.  Some are outright banned or that treatment is not covered at all, it is fully out-of-pocket.

What treatments are no longer available/banned?

Quote from: Hideyoshi on March 10, 2014, 06:03:42 AM
What treatments are no longer available/banned?

We've seen for some time now, some of the best hospitals and doctors have been rejecting Obamacare for a number of reasons. On that basis alone I would conclude at least some services and treatments won't be available for some under Obamacare. I would also conclude the quality of service and treatments will be lower for many under Obamacare.

Everyone should know by now however that Obamacare was designed to fail, but it can't fail before it performs its designed duty... put private health insurance providers out of business.

Quote from: Nikko on March 10, 2014, 08:02:40 AM
We've seen for some time now, some of the best hospitals and doctors have been rejecting Obamacare for a number of reasons. On that basis alone I would conclude at least some services and treatments won't be available for some under Obamacare. I would also conclude the quality of service and treatments will be lower for many under Obamacare.

Everyone should know by now however that Obamacare was designed to fail, but it can't fail before it performs its designed duty... put private health insurance providers out of business.

Hmm.  How exactly does it hurt to have private health insurance companies get millions of new customers? Why exactly? Is it because they can't up and cancel your coverage if you get sick? I'm so sorry that they have to actually provide healthcare now.

And how are hospitals rejecting the aca? Are bcbs and coventry no longer accepted at major hospitals?

I would take any "news" story from The Christian Broadcasting Network with a large grain of salt.  Just sayin'.

Quote from: HelenW on March 10, 2014, 09:51:32 AM
I would take any "news" story from The Christian Broadcasting Network with a large grain of salt.  Just sayin'.

Can you identify any of the content as being incorrect?

Quote from: Hideyoshi on March 10, 2014, 09:22:45 AM
Hmm.  How exactly does it hurt to have private health insurance companies get millions of new customers? Why exactly? Is it because they can't up and cancel your coverage if you get sick? I'm so sorry that they have to actually provide healthcare now.

And how are hospitals rejecting the aca? Are bcbs and coventry no longer accepted at major hospitals?

Insurance companies don't provide healthcare, they provide insurance. Insurance covers exposure which hasn't occurred yet. You use to pay your expected costs (pre Obamacare), which once you've had an sickness and it's ongoing, the cost of the policy essentially becomes the cost of your future medical costs during the term, which is obviously for most people unaffordable. Actually, it's no longer insurance in these cases, the insurance company essentially becomes an administrator of your payments. Any insurance company who's policy is to write these customers will go bankrupt. We can't blame the insurance companies for avoiding bankruptcy.

What's needed is an assigned risk pool. These have been used for home and auto insurance for years. People who can't afford insurance buy from an assigned risk pool at a discounted rate, and either these insureds are assigned randomly to all insurers based on their premium volume or the losses and premiums are assigned proportionally to all insurers. The assigned risk pool is the most effective means to deal with this problem which arises when insurance becomes unaffordable.

What obamacare has done is left these people in the primary markets. Companies will begin to find ways to not underwrite people whose premium does not cover their expected costs, that's why you don't leave them in the primary marketplace.

My main point is, insurance companies shouldn't be demonized for basic rational behavior. There are many solutions to the private sector health insurance problems. It's my contention there are many in government that don't want to implement these simple fixes for political reasons. Namely they want to leave the system broken so as to make single-payer a reality. But that leads to very expensive costs, long waiting lines, and yes rationing (aka, death panels).

Besides the inefficiencies, there's a much greater problem most people don't consider. There's no recourse for patients under single-payer. Under private based insurance, you have remedies via the courts when you have a conflict with your insurance carrier. You can sue them if you have a case or believe a more expensive treatment is needed, etc. It happens obviously, no one should claim they're all angels. But you can't sue the government. There's no recourse if the bureaucrat on the other end of the phone call denies you coverage. End of story, the death panel has the final say.

I have a catastrophic insurance policy, which means I basically pay for all routine doctor visits and drugs. My relationship with my doctor has improved dramatically now that I pay. They explain options to me rather than just sending me to some place for a test because some third party is paying for it. It's a huge difference in quality and understanding of my medical care.