Quote from: lavini557 on March 11, 2014, 08:26:44 PM
Also, if I do get to see someone for my depression, should I mention it's because I'm trans? Because I think that if they know nothing about gender dysphoria, they'll be like, "Oh, it's not...whatever you called it. It's [insert some other psychological problem here], now take these pills and you'll feel better." Just a thought.

Honestly the first psych I went to for gender dysphoria basically told me that I have social anxiety and that she couldn't diagnose gender dysphoria since she wasn't experienced with it. So she tried to give me some resources that didn't really help and sent me off.

If they don't know much about GD they could very well just diagnose you with something that is a symptom of GD like social anxiety or depression...your best bet is to find a psych that specifically works with trans people. Even if a psych has had some experience (as in only 10 clients) diagnosing GD, it is no guarantee that they won't just say "nope you don't have it" and send you off with another diagnosis and possibly some pills if you consent to taking them.

Some psychs will do skype sessions even if they are local or a few hours away. My psych was in Vancouver and we skyped. Maybe ask and find out if there are any psychs locally who deal with trans clients and gender dysphoria, I found my psych through a trans friend.

Lavini,

Hey.  I've been on here every day, sometimes twice a day, reading and re-reading your posts, trying to think of something that I could say that would help. I can tell you what I came up with.  It may help.  Please keep posting one way or another.  I'll keep thinking.  I can tell by the way you write that you're smart.  There are a number of smart people here.  With everyone working on this, we can get around the problems, somehow.

When I needed both a doctor and a psychologist, I called the LGBT National Suicide Hotline.  I wasn't particularly suicidal but was a little on edge, and lost.  They gave me the numbers for a couple psychologists and a medical doctor.  Here it is, two years later and I'm still seeing one of the psychs and the medical doctor.  Give them a call; tell them about suicidal ideation, depression and what is going on with your life.  They are trained and they may know something we don't.  Close psychologists?  Someone on-line who would help for free?  I don't know.  But it's worth a call.  Let us know.

As far as getting rid of the blackness (my slang for depression), I've generally found that it is caused by something else, by some problem that one can't deal with and somehow, the inability to deal with it eats us from the inside.  The easy answer is to deal with the problem.  In your case, you have something to deal with – GID.  And you can't deal with it because of your age and your family.  That begins to eat people from the inside.  So....

The advice on dealing with dysphoria was good and some of that you can do.  I suggested that you look forward to the time when you will be able to deal with it.  Take the time now to plan.  Take the time now to work on things.  Make some money so that when the time comes, you have some because this is expensive.  Keep your mind on other things.  Dream about that time when you can be what you want to be.  Dream about the person you will be.  Plan for that time when what you will be meets what you are.  This sounds somewhat crazy but it can help. The plan and dreams are in your mind but so is the depression.  The cause is external, the GID being because of what you are, and the family problem being because that is your family.  Yet both problems are external.  For a while here, battle the things in the mind, well, in the mind.  On the external things, fight them when you are ready.

I'm sorry that your parents are in this stage of their faith.  If they really believe, people who are new to the faith can be a pain.  Unfortunately, they probably won't work through things and see the error of their current thoughts until long after you are gone.  My heart hurts for you because of that.  I wish they were willing to listen.  I would take the time to help with arguments that could help them understand.  Unfortunately, we cannot make them listen.

I'm Jennifer and I'm a transgendered woman.  I'm not a psychologist; I'm a real life scientist – environmental chemistry, molecular toxicology and endocrine system studies and I work for a large multinational corporation.  I'm also a Christian, which is why I know the arguments that could help. Science, transgendered and Christian - it's not a conflict.  There is no shame in any of that.

I'm here, I'll listen and I'll try to help.  I'll keep thinking and I won't give up. If I can do nothing more than listen and encourage, I'll do that. I'll also keep thinking.

Big Hugs,

Jen

Hey...

So I can't say anything along the lines of "I know what you are dealing with" or "I went through a similar situation" because everybody is different, and their experiences are just as endlessly varied. Your situation feels very much like you have people who dominate your life, give you no freedom and strictly repress you...that sounds pretty horrible to me.

What I can do, is try to offer you some advice from somebody who recently had a failed suicide attempt just last month. It's a long story, I won't go into here, but it involved a bridge, some friends who are far more intelligent that anticipated, the police, and an extended period of recovery in and out of a mental hospital...

So, having gone through it, came so close to the end, and somehow come out the other side, what can I say?

Well...I know intimately, that the worst feeling in the world is the feeling of powerlessness, that unshakable feeling like you have lost complete control of your life, that life is just some ->-bleeped-<-ty thing that is "happening to you", rather than something you steer or dictate. You think to yourself that there is nothing you can do to change your situation, nothing you can do to make your life better, and in fact that the only remaining options you have left, are to suffer endlessly, or bring a stop to it yourself. Sometimes it even feels..."right" like "I am making this one choice that nobody can stop, and that is something positive".

In times of extreme depression, your mind can execute feats of amazing mental athletics to justify suicide. I remember driving to the bridge and saying to myself "This will just be like Hiroshima...sure the remaining friends and family who love me will be devastated in the short term, but they will mourn and move on...and in the long term it will save numerous lives from decades of pain and suffering that would happen otherwise..."

Yeah your brain can be pretty dramatic and stupid in these times as well >.>

But don't do it. Don't throw your life away because of other people.

No matter how bad things are, they can always change, sometimes it's an over night change, sometimes it is a gradual change that takes time. But their is ALWAYS something you can do to make things better for yourself, you just need to find it.

If your parents are really pushing you to the edge of suicide and are not willing to help, maybe a drastic action is in order. I live in the UK, so it's possibly different in the states, so I can't give specific advice, but contact child services or something, put up a fight and show them that you are serious, it might just snap them out of it.

Even if it doesn't "fix" them or force them to come to terms with it, it is still something you have done, an action you can own. If it doesn't work, start thinking on something else that might help things.

Maybe it does not need to be something so drastic, like I say, I don't really know your situation intimately, but there is ALWAYS something you can do to improve your situation, you just need to think outside the box and look for solutions to your problems, rather than dwelling on how insurmountable they feel.

You need to find that survival instinct that all humans have inside of them, that urge to see another day, because you never know, it might just be better than this one, find it and don't let it go. There are kids in the third world who cling to underground sewage pipes at night for warmth, and eat from trash cans during the day.

If they can do that, then you can survive gender dysphoria and oppressive family. Better than that, you can survive, grow strong and build a happy life for yourself too.

I know it does not feel like it, and most days will be a struggle from the moment you wake, until you can get some professional help, but you can do it.

I firmly believe that every human being has the potential in themselves to fight through the most horrific things imaginable, to endure physical and mental pain that would cripple or send other creatures running. We can survive and learn from it, grow stronger and overcome our problems. Adapt and survive. You just need to find that drive.

You can do it.

...

Anyway I have ranted on for a while now...

I hate to tell you this but depression if not treated, will get worst. I know because I have suffered through it and still suffer from it. Please call someone. You really need to see someone about this regardless of what your parents think. I would also think that you having depression and your parents withholding treatment is borderline if not outright abuse. Like I said it all depends upon your age and the area you live in and so on. Do like Jen said and call the LGBT National Suicide Hotline, explain your situation and they may be able to find someone that will talk to you pro bono either on the internet or telephone. Thoughts of suicide is a severe symptom of depression and depression effects people differently. Withdrawing from day to day life, productivity suffering, loss of interest, some eat, some have no appetite, some people sleep more than usual, some people can't sleep, some suffer from mania, some show aggression, some show agitation, some are lethargic, some just don't give a flying crap about anything and the list goes on. It just depends on the person as to how it effects them and many show different symptoms at different times. All of these symptoms I have experienced at one time or another and sometimes multiple symptoms simultaneously, so what your mom and dad think about the symptoms of depression isn't the only symptoms there are. I can tell you that if you mention suicidal thoughts, you will be taken seriously by a doctor of any kind. The very first question I was asked by a psychiatrist is if I am suicidal, the second if I feel homicidal. Yes, your mom and dad are right about therapists and psychiatrists wanting to get paid, it is their job and how they make their living but the ones that I have experience with really do care and in my opinion therapists and psychiatrists are not really expensive compared to other medical fields.

All I know is that if you are depressed and your parents are withholding treatment, in my opinion that is abuse and you really need to try to get help. Because Hon, if not it will keep getting worst. With me it is anxiety on top of the depression. Both untreated and I am in the darkest places mentally a person could ever be. I finally got the anxiety under control but the depression is still there but without the anxiety the depression is easier to handle. So you may have a mixture of the two but you really need to see a therapist and spill your guts and then let them refer you to a psychiatrist for the proper meds to get a handle on things.

Something really weird happened today with my parents.

So we were just eating lunch and stuff, and my parents were talking about the SATs. They were talking and talking, and then my dad randomly asked me to show my hand. I showed him, and then he goes, "You're a genius!"

I was confused until my dad said it was because my index and ring finger were the same length. Now, I've heard of the finger-digit ratio thing, but I thought that had to do with masculinity/femininity or something like that. Not about whether someone is a genius.

I mean, I admit that I seem to understand math concepts faster than my peers...but I don't think my fingers prove anything, really.

Going back on topic, I haven't called anyone yet. I need to find a bracket of time when my family is out except for me and I can comfortably call someone without worrying about interruptions or eavesdropping. (My parents' English isn't as good as people who grew up in America...but I'm not taking any chances. There's also my brother, who's just as good as English as I am).

Also, I was just thinking...maybe I should work really hard on my voice and then make videos on Youtube. I could just use a microphone and maybe use drawings for the visual part. Or something. I don't really know yet. I think if I had somewhere where I wasn't constantly bashed with things telling me that society sees me as a guy, I might feel a little better about myself. Just a thought.

Well you can be a girl on the online world /gaming world
havent you tried it?

it does make you feel better

Nothing is worth considering that action. Nothing. Chill, regroup, rest some but nothing that ever happens to you is worth considering such action.

I know how you feel about that, but suicide isn't the answer take it from me, im an alcoholic and transgendered myself and it wasn't easy for me. my parents still don't understand why I am like this, but if you don't see someone for your depression it will worsen, I had depression for years and I turned to alcohol because of it. I would try to relax and see if you can find someone that will help you with your depression.

I don't think the ring and index finger ratio is a real indicator or being trans or not or even being genius or not. Supposedly females have a more 1:1 ratio and males the ring finger is supposed to be longer than the index finger I think or its the other way around, someone correct me if I'm wrong. Mine is really close to 1:1 and I ain't no genius for sure. I sucked at math in school and as a matter of fact was always in the lowest math classes, but when it came to Literature and composition I was always in the highest classes for that. I believe that was all about interests instead of genius though because I loved to read and write, although I forgot about all the proper ways to write which is fairly evident. Numbers though really messed me up. Same for history, if what we were studying interested me I aced the tests. If it bored me I didn't do so well.

It does sound like you are feeling a little better lavini. Do you?

thanks, I feel much better, but I think its mostly since I did open up to my parents and friends and they all accept me and im going for therapy now, actually im going back to the doctor this Thursday because I got drunk on Friday really bad and hes kind of worried about it. my depression is gone but it went away since I started therapy and understanding that there are ways to better myself and change into the woman I want to be.

@FalsePrincess - I have tried being a girl in gaming, like in MMOs, but the thing is that...it kind of gets boring without someone to play with. And lonely. The rest of my "friends" all either play LoL (League of Legends, which is a fun game...with lots of not-very-fun people:( But still pretty fun, nonetheless) or Minecraft (an okay game, but I never really got into it). Even if I try to talk to a stranger in an MMO, they tend to ignore me. Maybe just say hi and go off on their way. *shrug*

@Jess42 - Yeah, I thought that "theory" sounded pretty stupid in the first place. I think my parents were somehow using it to convince me to be a doctor or something and go to Ivy League *eyeroll*. Am I feeling better? I don't know. I guess you could say that. I still feel like crap these days though. I still haven't called...haven't found the right opportunity yet.

Oh, and just wondering...but how long does the "OMG Christianity is AWESOME!" phase last for new converts? Just wondering because my dad bought these two angel statues to put on top of the shelf above the fireplace. I thought it looked fine before, but my dad goes all, "Oh, I think it would look wonderful, especially since we're Christians!" It looks really cluttered now (he put some flowers there along with the angels...). Oh well. I think I might get used to it.

Quote from: lavini557 on March 17, 2014, 09:42:56 PM
@FalsePrincess - I have tried being a girl in gaming, like in MMOs, but the thing is that...it kind of gets boring without someone to play with. And lonely. The rest of my "friends" all either play LoL (League of Legends, which is a fun game...with lots of not-very-fun people:( But still pretty fun, nonetheless) or Minecraft (an okay game, but I never really got into it). Even if I try to talk to a stranger in an MMO, they tend to ignore me. Maybe just say hi and go off on their way. *shrug*

@Jess42 - Yeah, I thought that "theory" sounded pretty stupid in the first place. I think my parents were somehow using it to convince me to be a doctor or something and go to Ivy League *eyeroll*. Am I feeling better? I don't know. I guess you could say that. I still feel like crap these days though. I still haven't called...haven't found the right opportunity yet.

Oh, and just wondering...but how long does the "OMG Christianity is AWESOME!" phase last for new converts? Just wondering because my dad bought these two angel statues to put on top of the shelf above the fireplace. I thought it looked fine before, but my dad goes all, "Oh, I think it would look wonderful, especially since we're Christians!" It looks really cluttered now (he put some flowers there along with the angels...). Oh well. I think I might get used to it.

6-12 months generally slows it down.

Hugs,

Jen

Quote from: lavini557 on March 17, 2014, 09:42:56 PM
@Jess42 - Yeah, I thought that "theory" sounded pretty stupid in the first place. I think my parents were somehow using it to convince me to be a doctor or something and go to Ivy League *eyeroll*. Am I feeling better? I don't know. I guess you could say that. I still feel like crap these days though. I still haven't called...haven't found the right opportunity yet.

Oh, and just wondering...but how long does the "OMG Christianity is AWESOME!" phase last for new converts? Just wondering because my dad bought these two angel statues to put on top of the shelf above the fireplace. I thought it looked fine before, but my dad goes all, "Oh, I think it would look wonderful, especially since we're Christians!" It looks really cluttered now (he put some flowers there along with the angels...). Oh well. I think I might get used to it.

Oh, I'm not saying that there is nothing to the finger ratio thing, I just don't think it's a really reliable indicator of being transgendered other than maybe being exposed to higher levels of certain hormones in the womb and may have a bearing on the tendency of a person to be transgendered. As for it being an indicator of intelligence, I just really have never heard of that.

As for the OMG Christianity part, I agree with JLT1, but sometimes it never goes away. It just depends upon coincidences, state of mind and about a thousand other things. But then again like I said I know people that it never wore off. If you don't mind me asking, what faith was your mom and dad before? This can have effect of how long it may last. From my experience people that were once atheists that found religion and or having no belief system at all, it tends to last longer.

actually the finger ratio I think has nothing to do with transgender. I think its how u feel inside and how you identify yourself. I cant say what causes it but I'm sure its probably that someone is born with a female brain and the body doesn't feel normal, but I could be wrong too. I play mmos also and always play a female character and its great for me since I identify as a female, ive never played LOL (league of legends) so cant really say how that game is like, I mostly play my ps3 or dc universe online.

@Jess42 - Well, we technically did go to church before coming to America...but my parents were more of atheists. I think we just went to church (if we even did - we rarely did before coming to America) because every other Korean family in the area was doing it. Honestly, I don't remember. I hope my dad can start thinking rationally about trans people first, because he's REALLY into church. Probably because of his childhood. My mother isn't as into it as my dad in my opinion, but she does like church.

I know this isn't in the religion section, but why do religious people go off of their interpretation of the will of a higher being? How do they know that they are following exactly what the higher being (such as a god) wants? There are many ways to interpret a piece of text (as my English teacher says, "The only wrong interpretations are ones that are not supported with the text."), yet the people think, "Ah! I think this part of the bible means this," and they go with it. The problem with that is that it's only what they THINK it means...*sigh*

Also, I seriously hate the "I'm older than you so I'm right" mentality with my parents. Even if that is right and just, rejecting doctors and other people who research about trans people (some even specializing in helping trans people) is just...I don't know what to say. It's like they want to live in this "perfect" box where they are always right. If they don't like something, they can take it out of their box and then use reasoning that came from information taken out of context.

I wish there was a way for my parents to actually listen so they can learn.

Quote from: lavini557 on March 21, 2014, 12:17:20 PM
@Jess42 - Well, we technically did go to church before coming to America...but my parents were more of atheists. I think we just went to church (if we even did - we rarely did before coming to America) because every other Korean family in the area was doing it. Honestly, I don't remember. I hope my dad can start thinking rationally about trans people first, because he's REALLY into church. Probably because of his childhood. My mother isn't as into it as my dad in my opinion, but she does like church.

I know this isn't in the religion section, but why do religious people go off of their interpretation of the will of a higher being? How do they know that they are following exactly what the higher being (such as a god) wants? There are many ways to interpret a piece of text (as my English teacher says, "The only wrong interpretations are ones that are not supported with the text."), yet the people think, "Ah! I think this part of the bible means this," and they go with it. The problem with that is that it's only what they THINK it means...*sigh*

Also, I seriously hate the "I'm older than you so I'm right" mentality with my parents. Even if that is right and just, rejecting doctors and other people who research about trans people (some even specializing in helping trans people) is just...I don't know what to say. It's like they want to live in this "perfect" box where they are always right. If they don't like something, they can take it out of their box and then use reasoning that came from information taken out of context.

I wish there was a way for my parents to actually listen so they can learn.

I take it you are Korean, lavini? I love Korea and spent two years there in the Army in Pusan or Busan. We always called it Pusan though. Most of the Korean Nationals that I worked closely with that wasn't Buddhist was Catholic. Can I dare to guess that is what religion your mom and dad are? If so, it is a pretty strict and cut and dry religion.

Hon, I hate to tell you but you said ya'll were going to church because, "every other Korean family was doing it." is not a good reason to go to a church or follow any spiritual path just because someone else does it. You should do it because there is a feeling inside that sparks something in you. Yes this isn't the spritual or religious section but that seems to be a part of your strife and struggle.

As for religious people going off of an interpretation, we are all a little scared, weary, skeptical and any other word you want to use to describe the greatest unknown that we will ever know. What happens when the body dies? I don't know, nobody does. There are a lot of people that are what I call "just in case folks" that follow some of the strictest religions. With the Bible, I say this countless times, it is early man trying to comprehend the uncomprehensible. It is a history of our Spiritual evolution just as the Thibetan Book of the Dead, the Egyptian Books of the Living and the Dead, the Koran, the Gnostic texts, the Dead Sea Scrolls or any other ancient texts. It's just that with the Bible and Koran, this is the era we are in. I also say this a lot and that is that religions all have a common message but too many time people fight over the little variations instead of the commonalities.

OK, Now the "I'm older than you so I'm right subject. With age is supposed to come wisdom but I have seen 18 and 19 year olds a lot wiser than 50, 60 or 70 year olds. It is life experince that gives you wisdom. And to an extent it is true that the older generations are right about a lot of things. But this whole Trans deal, if you aren't Transgendered you'll never know how we feel inside, the pain we feel with our minds and bodies being out of synche with one another or the hurt from not being accepted in a society that sees black and white in terms of gender. Society is an entity unto itself and it is changing but it takes time and some of the older generations may never accept the changes.

Lavini, all I can tell you is to talk to your parents. If it goes toward an argument, just drop it and go in your room or leave and take a walk. Other than that, it may take time for them to come to the realization that this isn't going to go away. Take it from me hon, being trans isn't a phase it is something that will be with you for the rest of your life. They may come around when they figure thay may actually lose thier child, not from killing yourself but reaching 18 years of age and being your own person and can leave and live your own life.

If ever you need to talk, you can always PM me. Mon. thru Fri. I'm here. Weekends I am usually either busy or with that someone special but I will get back with you. My parents were pentecostal so I know exactly what you are going through with the religion deal. If they can't have patience, have patience with them and be the bigger person and maybe things will get better with them.   

I'm not sure whether it was Catholic or not. And yeah...going to church just because everyone else is doing it is stupid...which is why my parents stopped going to church before coming to America. I think that's also why my dad likes church so much now because he found the "spark" here. I don't know how, but he did. *shrug*

Also, I can't argue with my parents about anything trans. Not even mention anything about it. Heck, I can't have anything trans-related or anything girl-related in my browser history (fortunately, they don't know about Incognito mode in Chrome ). If I do, they say that they will kick me out and other bad things (but they probably can't abandon me because of the law, so they will probably do everything they can to make my life as miserable as possible without crossing the line). *sigh* Guess I'll have to be patient and hope that (maybe) my parents will meet someone who will help them accept trans people and other people they consider "ungodly". Probably won't happen, but if it does, that would be nice. If it doesn't happen before I graduate from high school, I'll just never visit them when I go into college because I don't want to change into a "guy" just for them. I'll probably make some excuses or something. To be honest, I am pretty sick of them anyway, and I don't think I would have a reason to visit them.