One thing that I've always hated about my face is my nose, which if you've seen the pictures I probably don't need to explain why. Here's what I'm not understanding. I have looked at at least hundreds of before and after pictures to study what changes happen in order to try and figure out whether or not hormones can bring me into being passable.

In this page, everyone says, quite confidently, that the nose will be completely unaffected by hormones. But in almost every before and after case, I've seen a complete change in people's noses. My hypothesis is two things:

1. The muscles in the nose are disappearing. I looked into the anatomy of the nose, and found that there are two muscle groups in the nose: one between the bottom edge of the nose bridge and the nostrils, and another that runs parallel to the cartilage in the nostrils. On this basis I can conclude that HRT can result in a loss of volume in the nostrils.

2. The skin get smoother and therefore causes greater specular reflection of light, which makes it appear less flat when viewed from the front, and de-emphasizes the full width of the nose bridge (the only way we can determine the depth and shape of the nose is by shading, after all).

I haven't been able to confirm this, and it seems most people are pretty insistent that there is no change to the nose after HRT. But I'm clearly seeing a change in people's noses when I view before and after pictures, even before they have had FFS (I have asked a few times). So is this just my imagination? Also, does anyone feel that there are any merits to my hypotheses?

I have done some mild research into this and it appears the nose might be able to shrink some what because it is made out of cartilage and not bone. However I am not a doctor nor do I have a deep understanding of biology besides a few college courses. I do know hormones do change the fat distribution of the face however which might contribute to the nose looking smaller over all. One thing you might considered however is contouring your nose with make up to make it look narrower and smaller. I do that once in awhile and I think it is having some effect, but I am not the best at make up admittedly.

One last thing, I got your private message, but cannot reply until I get 15 posts. So don't think I am ignoring you.

Quote from: HoneyBunny on April 10, 2014, 09:10:56 PM
I have done some mild research into this and it appears the nose might be able to shrink some what because it is made out of cartilage and not bone. However I am not a doctor nor do I have a deep understanding of biology besides a few college courses. I do know hormones do change the fat distribution of the face however which might contribute to the nose looking smaller over all. One thing you might considered however is contouring your nose with make up to make it look narrower and smaller. I do that once in awhile and I think it is having some effect, but I am not the best at make up admittedly.

One last thing, I got your private message, but cannot reply until I get 15 posts. So don't think I am ignoring you.

Yea, I thought that was the case. I've also noticed that my face is extremely shallow, there's no fat in my face at all. So that probably makes my nose look even wider. It's so hard having to guess and research what to expect from hormones, but I feel like I'm getting much more knowledgeable, and it is interesting to learn about. Just seems like there's a lot of misinformation, and I think people tend to exaggerate or default to the assumption that "hormones can't change it".

And I know you weren't ignoring me, I remember that rule

Quote from: riversong on April 10, 2014, 09:23:31 PM
Yea, I thought that was the case. I've also noticed that my face is extremely shallow, there's no fat in my face at all. So that probably makes my nose look even wider. It's so hard having to guess and research what to expect from hormones, but I feel like I'm getting much more knowledgeable, and it is interesting to learn about. Just seems like there's a lot of misinformation, and I think people tend to exaggerate or default to the assumption that "hormones can't change it".

And I know you weren't ignoring me, I remember that rule

I was a lot fatter in the picture when I was sixteen verse the new one where I am twenty two which is most likely the reason why my face changed so much. That said, I think hormones do change lots, just not enough in my opinion. Although that is coming from the prospective from someone who has been on hormones for over three years. Thinking back to how my body was before makes me sick. The biggest benefit of hormones for me however was preventing myself from becoming more masculine. When I started at nineteen I was still at the tail end of puberty since I was kind of a late bloomer. Who knows how more masculine I could have gotten if I had waited just a few more years.

Quote from: HoneyBunny on April 10, 2014, 09:37:08 PM
I was a lot fatter in the picture when I was sixteen verse the new one where I am twenty two which is most likely the reason why my face changed so much. That said, I think hormones do change lots, just not enough in my opinion. Although that is coming from the prospective from someone who has been on hormones for over three years. Thinking back to how my body was before makes me sick. The biggest benefit of hormones for me however was preventing myself from becoming more masculine. When I started at nineteen I was still at the tail end of puberty since I was kind of a late bloomer. Who knows how more masculine I could have gotten if I had waited just a few more years.

But more fat in the face is more feminine, I thought?

I agree that from what I saw, hormones can definitely make a big difference. I think people intentionally downplay the potential of hormones in order to keep people from getting their hopes up too much. Hopefully I'll get some good results myself

My nose has shrunk considerably.

A lot of the nose is held together by connective tissue which shrinks in the absence of T.

Quote from: suzifrommd on April 11, 2014, 06:33:35 AM
My nose has shrunk considerably.

A lot of the nose is held together by connective tissue which shrinks in the absence of T.

Oh that gives me some hope ^_^

I think it's due to oil, or more specifically, less oil under the skin.  Females hormones cause less oil to be produced which shrinks pores and associated swelling.

I wrote this in regards to my nose in Surprising HRT Effects
https://www.susans.org/forums/index.php/topic,163256.msg1404465.html#msg1404465

I'd guess (caution bro science) pore shrinkage w/corresponding shrinking of oil glands + minor nasal muscle atrophy would contribute to a slightly smaller nose. I wouldn't count on seeing anything more than like 3% - 5% shrinkage. Don't forget your cheeks are also likely filling out giving a cursory illusion that the nose is narrower.