Quote from: sad panda on April 12, 2014, 12:47:36 AM
Aww, yeah... I remember when you were having your experiences with gay guys... :c I was so worried lol okay but yeah, i know the gay community can be kinda awful and hypersexual, it's not about the community to me at all, which is funny cuz I'm so fussy about the trans community sometimes. But I guess as a gay boy I'd feel special so I don't need a community or stereotypes or being like other gay boys to validate me (I would get validity from just being cis?) Whereas being trans I feel the opposite of special, I just feel like a worse version of something really normal so I look to community and other people to help me feel valid. Does that make any sense? lol :s

Actually. i guess how i envision it is it being this super special relationship that is something deeper than what other people have. Again why i think I'm not realistic, idk what's wrong with me honestly, maybe there's just always greener grass somewhere :/ but then I just want to feel special for once. like my own person living my own life. Like you were saying, you know? Instead now I'm just constantly losing my individuality to my uhh.. identity? That is so tiring... I guess it really is the same old problem though. Just finding slightly new ways to have it. Good lord, how do people just decide who they are? Or live with leaving stuff like this open ended. Seriously lol. Ahhhhh well... I know you can make sense of whatever the heck I just said anyway.... <3

Man, but why does life always have to be crazy in only the unfun ways ;o;

I was being careful tho, but I remembered you worried which was sweet xD

That makes perfect sense actually. I guess the thing you don't need the community if you can find that one special person to love you as you are. Which just takes time really. The thing about being gay is that's what you ARE. People can judge but they can't take it from you. When you're trans you're a knock off of something else so you have to be perfect and beautiful to make up for that, and you stilll need constant valudation. It sucks dude so bad.

I'm glad I don't wish I was a boy at least anymore. I just wish I never started but that's impossible. I'm here if you need to talk, and dw I'm really out of it tonight too

k... I might want to actually. ugh I have to take my hormones but I'm too lazy to get up. lol HRT has become such a trigger for me though..

Quote from: sad panda on April 12, 2014, 02:55:43 AM
k... I might want to actually. ugh I have to take my hormones but I'm too lazy to get up. lol HRT has become such a trigger for me though..

Yeah text me or pm me if you wana skype or whatever. And it feels like all I do is take hormones these days lol xD I think my dose is too high tho but w/e

Quote from: sad panda on April 10, 2014, 12:52:00 AM
I still don't get this boys = short hair thing though, I have not had short hair more than briefly since I was like 10 and I never want to. I cried a lot of times when I had to get it short as a child, I just hated it. As a boy I still wanted really long hair and styled it and was always cycling thru a billion products. I definitely am not gonna give that up now. Short hair just is not me, i'm more sure of that than my own gender lol. (Nor is dirty or ratty or damaged hair)

Sorry, if you misunderstood me. i meant if you want to pass as a boy you might have to cut your hair really, really short and do that comb over things guys do. But, I have shortish hair (more like had now; I'm entering inverted bob territory) and sometimes wear a baseball cap, yet I get callled miss or young lady still, even dressed in andro clothes, though those clothes are women's and the flannel is purple so...yeah...but sorry, ill leave ya be on this topic...i wont lie its hard for me to understand wanting to be a boy...and that goes for anyone...why would anyone want to be a man? so ill shut up now lol

So I'm trying this again... I never know where to post asking about this but if I WERE willing to cut my hair do you think I could pass as a boy? I want to experiment with my presentation I just don't really even know how to present male, it's really weird.  and the most confusing part is I actually think i look like a boy but people don't seem to agree....

http://i.imgur.com/N3LgMue.jpg

btw joanna i don't even care about gender I just am not happy as trans.

Quote from: sad panda on April 15, 2014, 05:05:01 AM
So I'm trying this again... I never know where to post asking about this but if I WERE willing to cut my hair do you think I could pass as a boy? I want to experiment with my presentation I just don't really even know how to present male, it's really weird.  and the most confusing part is I actually think i look like a boy but people don't seem to agree....

http://i.imgur.com/N3LgMue.jpg

btw joanna i don't even care about gender I just am not happy as trans.

that's a tough one you look quite female

Really? Urgh, guess I became gender blind at some point, seems like lately I always think other girls look like guys too.... :/

Yeah, best of luck, but not seeing anything other than a pretty girl.

Well unfortunately I don't know if T made me look more male... I think just more freakish, cuz I had no fat on my face, but I was still living full time as a girl at my most physically masculine. I guess my skeletal proportions are the real problem. It was too hard to look like a boy past a certain age. It just sucks not even feeling like you really have the option of being cis. And I don't even apparently know what the genders look like now. I don't understand why it had to be like this.

Quote from: kate on April 15, 2014, 11:42:28 AM
Are you intersex?

I wouldn't know, I mean I've been asked that a lot but I just prefer to say I didn't develop normally. All I know is my size and shape is nothing like my dad's and identical to my sister's. It's all in the legs though. His inseam is 5 inches longer than mine D:

Quote
Also i was looking at my cousin the other day and noticed that his moobs were bigger than my breasts, his hips were a little large as well. Everyone's body shape is different, but if you really wanted a guys body, working out will help a lot with that. I have a relatively small bone frame, but with adding muscle, back in the day i attained quite a strong V shape to my upper body. It can be done.

Well, I don't really want to be muscular, but my shoulders are at least a little wider than my hips when my body fat is low. I'm trying to lose back what I gained on HRT now Maybe it's just overall size though, I never got much experience presenting as a boy :x

Probably as a femme boy, but I don't like to think about aging at all. I am 22 and I still feel like I'm 12. Though living as a boy I would get more youth cuz I'd never look my age anyway! So there's that =o)

I'm not sure what aging would look like for me as a boy though, I'm sure I'd just try to stay pretty, if anything there's makeup for a bad skin texture, and my hair is super thick so thinning wouldn't be a problem.... And I don't think I have any balding genes at all.

Admittedly though, this issue scares me socially, because I don't exactly fit in with men and I don't know what you're supposed to do if you always look like a boy. Maybe nobody would want anything to do with me then :x

Yeah I'm sorry, I just... the word man just feels wrong, sorta like woman does too. I'm weird  I just prefer to say girl/boy. D:

I'm not sure about the hairline tho, it didn't really change on HRT, but I was only 20 when I started. Actually, I hear you get your hair genes from your mom's side, and I don't really know much about her family.

You feel similar, like you are considering detransitioning/changing presentation? I think androgynous people are awesome I just wish there was more acceptance of that. Honestly I kinda hate gender....

You could let your eyebrows get really bushy. Get a buzz cut just like the kind a boy would get. Wear a binder if you're willing to do that. In terms of what people would see, they'd probably would guess you to be either a reallly young boy and or andronougous or even FTM. OH and another thing you could do is to change how you walk and your should posture. Keep your shoulders forward like how most guys do. Guys take up a lot of space around them where as women often take up much less space when sitting. So yeah hope this helps!!

Quote from: Lady_Oracle on April 15, 2014, 03:10:34 PM
You could let your eyebrows get really bushy. Get a buzz cut just like the kind a boy would get. Wear a binder if you're willing to do that. In terms of what people would see, they'd probably would guess you to be either a reallly young boy and or andronougous or even FTM. OH and another thing you could do is to change how you walk and your should posture. Keep your shoulders forward like how most guys do. Guys take up a lot of space around them where as women often take up much less space when sitting. So yeah hope this helps!!

I guess this highlights what is frustrating to me about gender. It's so roped into these little ideas about how and what a person has to be. I mean I know in this case a lot of it is a physical issue... still, I'm just so frustrated at being stuck in this two way street that is so restrictive on either side. I would feel sort of ridiculous changing who I am like this just to pass... when did this stuff begin to matter? I wish I could just honestly tell people, I'm a boy. Medically. I didn't get to choose. I wish I didn't have to be so... assumed about by everyone. If I tell them that then i become openly trans without even identifying as it. And if I don't tell them I'm stuck in pretending to be a cis girl.

But, thanks guys, I at least got that I won't be passing if I try to present as a boy withiut serious changes to who I am. I mean I sort of figured, but i guess my body image is out of touch with reality... D:

I don't know anymore.

I do think you could pass as male, though it would require making some changes that you probably wouldn't like.  It sucks that gender norms are so rigid, but they are in some ways.  however, if you want to look like you and live as a boy, nothing is stopping you.  Sure, you will have issues "passing" and you will have to deal with some crap, but you could do it.  I know plenty of andro men and hell I'm sort of living as one at the moment.  It's possible.  Although, I realize you are probably uncomfortable about the propsect and not blending in and having to deal with societal drama.  Sorry.  I wish I could help.  I just want you to know it's not impossible to be you. 

completely agree with learningtolive!! not impossible!

I gave some details physically since you were asking about "passiblity" but it's like how learningtolive said it's not impossible! Gotta stop caring what other people think and just be you! Erase the concept of passing if you can. Don't worry about the labels so much.

Personally labels drive me crazy. I have like 7 I could use to describe myself. Way too much of a headache when I start thinking about it. And especially if I force myself to follow each one perfectly to how society defines them. Like being fem and a lesbian. A lot of people will automatically assume I'm straight. I refuse to dress like a "lesbian" whatever that means..

A lot of this rigid conditioning society has is very flawed when it comes to gender and sexuality. Eventually it'll get better and things like passing will no longer be a big issue.

Thanks guys. :]]]

I put it behind me for now. That's what I decided. This stuff is my fantasizing and not living my real life. I gotta make more of an effort to separate reality and what is realistic from my daydreaming. it can be hard though.